[Mailman-Developers] On-topic-ness for -users and -dev

[JC Dill]

Brad Knowles wrote:

> 	Unless you're talking about Python code you've developed to 
> implement this feature, or commenting on Python code that someone 
> else has developed to implement this feature, I'm pretty certain that 
> this discussion belongs on mailman-users and not here.
> 
> 	When we get down to the point where we're talking about going to 
> the archives of the list to see the previous discussion on this 
> topic, and to see the patch that was produced, etc... then we are 
> definitely into mailman-users territory and not mailman-developers.
> 
> 	If Barry or JC disagree, then I'm willing to bow to their greater 
> knowledge on this topic, since they've been moderators of this list 
> longer than I have.  If Tokio or Mark disagree, I'm willing to bow to 
> their greater knowledge because I know they've been hacking on the 
> code longer than I've been associated with the project.

IMHO, -users is for discussions about using mailman (installing it, 
using the features it has, integrating it with other software, etc.). 
The posts we are hoping to keep OFF of -dev and ON -users are the posts 
by users who are having what they believe are "complicated" use problems 
and they want "advanced support" and thus try to post a -users 
appropriate question to -dev to get an answer faster or from someone 
with more "knowledge" than those who answer posts on -users.  (This is 
almost always an inappropriate use of -dev and an intrusion on developer 
time.)

As long as the topic brought here is about *how* to develop a new 
feature, I believe it's on-topic for -dev.  It can often be a good idea 
to get feedback on the idea and the proposed implementation before 
spending time on writing the code.  This way one can avoid writing one's 
way into a rat-hole because of a lack of knowledge about why it is the 
way it is now, and learn the best way to incorporate the proposed fix 
into the existing design.  Then go code it!

I believe the discussion about a "this is spam" button is appropriate 
for -dev.  I agree that there are a lot of technical issues that need to 
be addressed about if or how to implement it.[1]  I believe that -dev IS 
the right list for that discussion.

When all is said and done though, I'm not a developer.  My role here is 
more of "product manager" - I help with input on priorities, user 
interface, and of course with the boring details of administering -users 
and -dev so that the developers can spend their time on actual code 
development.  So Barry (and Tokio and Mark, et al) really have the final 
say on what they want -dev to include or exclude.  Until one of the key 
developers opines that "this is off-topic" I encourage using -dev for 
further discussion on the "this is spam" button topic.

jc

[1]  Does it belong in the headers, the footer, the body?  Should it be 
a configuration option to place it in one or more of these locations? 
What happens when the button (or link) is clicked?  What if non-spam is 
reported?  What about RFCs?  Etc.