Python education survey

[Rick Johnson]

On Dec 26, 12:04 pm, Steven D'Aprano <steve
+comp.lang.pyt... at pearwood.info> wrote:

> If Guido would "just say something", this community would yawn. He's not
> the boss of us. Python development is an all-volunteer effort. "The
> community" works on projects that we find interesting, or that we need
> ourselves, not just because Guido "says something" about it

Believe it or not Steven, all communities need leadership. Just
because you are a rebel and don't like anyone trumping your opinions
does mean that the majority of people here don't need (or want for
that mater) some direction.Communities work best when leaders lead and
workers work. And "leader" does not always mean a single person. NO.

In the best communities leadership roles are dynamic. For example: In
such a diverse field as programming language design, no ONE person can
lead all the time! We need people to step forth who are competent in
the various areas of expertise. Someone who is really knowledgeable
writing code for Linux may not be as knowledgeable writing code for
windows. Some will be better at writing efficient algorithmic code and
others may be better at documentation. etc,etc...

HOWEVER

Even IF we adopt the intelligent paradigm of dynamic leadership, we
still need a small group (or at least) one very intelligent person to
bind the process together. Guido van Rossum IS that person. That is
why i call for him to get more involved. Of course i don't expect him
to write code. But at least he could be more involved in this
community. AND PYDEV IS NOT THE ONLY MAILING LIST IN THIS FREAKING
COMMUNITY!

He needs to step out from behind the coattails of his dev group and be
a real leader. He needs to make his opinion known about Tkinter, IDLE,
and also, the drastic changes that will need to be implemented in
Python 4000. How can HE expect a true FLOSS community to move forward
when SO many are just blatantly ignored? HOW?

> -- and
> certainly not projects that you demand we work on.

I am NOT demanding that people WORK on anything Steven. I am ASKING
for people to get more involved! Just open your mouth and state your
opinion (and not just troll all the time!). But as long as Guido and
the other members of pydev refuse to acknowledge the existence of
c.l.p, we will forever be a stagnate community.

> Instead of demanding that GvR order us to work on IDLE, put your money
> where your mouth is, Rick, and stop being a blow-hard. You've been
> nagging us about IDLE for long enough -- what is it now, two years?
> Three? I haven't been counting, but it feels like geological ages.
>
> Start a project to fix IDLE. There is plenty of free hosting on the
> Internet for open source projects, like GitHub and Google Code Hosting.
> Track some bugs. Plan some concrete enhancements. Write some actual code.
> Demonstrate actual effort, and you may attract others who care.
> Otherwise, you're wasting our time.

I will do this, as soon as the "leaders" start to lead. Only a fool
would invest time to make a module or package "stdlib ready" without
getting the input of his fellow brethren first. Sounds like a recipe
for disaster to me. Why has Guido not, at the very least, contacted me
privately? He could remain anonymous.