A critic of Guido's blog on Python's lambda

[Ken Tilton]

Ben wrote:
> 
> Nothing you have described sounds that complicated, and you never come
> up with concrete objections to other peoples code (apart that it took
> 10 years to write in Lisp, so it must be really hard)

Oh, now I have to spend an hour dissecting any code you people toss-off 
that does no more than pick the low-hanging fruit? I do not spend enough 
time on Usenet already? :)

> 
> Why are you running a SoC project for PyCells...

You do not even know what Cells are and have not taken the trouble to 
understand, so i will save my breath. Pythonistas will love PyCells, I 
promise. Please recall that it is not just me, there is a ton of prior 
and current art.

> if you dislike the
> language so much.

There is a difference between disliking a language and thinking PyCells 
might end up persuading folks that macros and/or true lambda might be 
worth the trouble to extend the language.

Try to think a little more precisely, OK? Thx.

> People who do like Python can implement it if they
> need it (which I haven't seen any good examples that they do)
> 
> Please don't force a student to create a macro system just to port a
> system to Python,

You are getting hysterical, sit down, breathe. I asked a question, 
because (unlike you) I can see where this is going. But as you say...

> There are already plenty of ways to hide
> complicated functionality,

I know. And that is why the mentor is a Pythonista, not me. I made a 
simple inquiry as to the options available should Python have trouble 
hiding the wiring. just looking ahead a little (as are the student and 
mentor). Something wrong with thinking ahead a few moves?

You on the other hand have made up your mind about something you admit 
you do not understand, have now ascribed to me a half dozen sentiments I 
do not hold, and are feeling absolutely miserable because you think this 
is a flamewar.

No, we are just discussing language synatx and how it impacts language 
semantics, which has led inadvertently to a few of us starting an SoC 
project to put together a Python version of a very successful dataflow 
hack I did for Lisp.

I use it every day, and it just plain makes me smile. I wrote more code 
than you can imagine Before Cells, and have now used them intensively 
and in more ways than you can imagince since. Even if the wiring cannot 
be hidden, the productivity win will be trememndous. Note that this 
translates ineluctably to "programming will be more fun".

Even you will love them.

:)

kenny

-- 
Cells: http://common-lisp.net/project/cells/

"Have you ever been in a relationship?"
    Attorney for Mary Winkler, confessed killer of her
    minister husband, when asked if the couple had
    marital problems.