Choosing a programming language as a competitive tool

[Steven D. Majewski]

Personally, I find Lisp much easier than Perl (especially since 
I avoid it whenever possible, so I've never really mastered it --
just keep a nodding acquaintence so I can read the scripts I do
run into. )  I would agree with all you've said. 

I just meant: 

  I think Lisp IS easier to write than to read -- especially someone
 else's lisp code, because styles and idioms can vary a lot. ( The
 disparity isn't as great as with Perl, but some of the reasons are
 the same. ) 

  What easier for folks may vary depending on what they already know 
 and how similar what they are learning is to that previous knowledge. 
 ( So *SOME* folks might find Perl easier, even if *I* don't. ) 

  And I was arguing against Courageous' description of Lisp as 
 difficult: despite that personal-fudge-factor cited above, there's 
 NO WAY you can say that Lisp is an order of magnitude more difficult
 that other stuff -- Java, C++, Perl -- that are widely used, so the
 argument that Lisp doesn't get used because it's inherently difficult
 to learn doesn't hold water. ( And if it does seem difficult to some
 folks it probably, it's more likely a problem with how it's taught 
 than the language itself. ) 


I think except for the personal-fudge-factor effect, we're in agreement!

-- Steve Majewski
  

On 4 May 2001, Douglas Alan wrote:

> "Steven D. Majewski" <sdm7g at Virginia.EDU> writes:
> 
> > On Fri, 4 May 2001, Courageous wrote:
> 
> > > IMO, Lisp is "inherently difficult" the same way Perl is. Sitting down
> > > and reading Lisp code written by various programmers will often
> > > result in reading what appears to be almost another language each
> > > time.
> 
> > That's not a bad comparison: to Perl. But as a few others have said:
> > Writing Perl is easy -- it's going back and reading what you've
> > written 6 weeks later that's tough! ( Someone else (Tim?)  said: I
> > find it easier to read someone else Python code than to read my own
> > Perl code 6 months later. )  Lisp is definitely easier to write than
> > to read.  I still think Python is easier.  But Lisp is probably
> > easier, or at least not more difficult than most.
> 
> I just can't see this comparison of Lisp to Perl.  Lisp was the
> easiest language I ever learned, except for Python, which was about
> equivalently easy.  I can pick up Lisp programs I wrote 20 years ago
> and read them like I wrote them yesterday -- and I haven't programmed
> in Lisp in 16 years.  It is elegant, flexible, and powerful.  Some
> people don't like it because it has a funny syntax.  Everyone is
> entitled to their opinion, but I find that a bit superficial of a
> reason.  Once you get used to Lisp's syntax, it becomes very natural.
> 
> Perl, on the other hand, I find to be the most atrocious thing on the
> planet.  It's completely baroque and convoluted.  Programs I wrote
> yesterday seem like I wrote them 20 years ago.
> 
> |>oug
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