From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Sun Sep 11 19:36:55 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Holger Spill)
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2016 23:36:55 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue591] Unable to register on bugs.python.org
 if an homepage is specified
In-Reply-To: <1464754461.87.0.614181639598.issue591@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1473637015.44.0.924321091324.issue591@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Holger Spill added the comment:

Same issue for me as well. Worked when prefixing homepage URL with http://.

----------
nosy: +kiwisinspace
status: unread -> chatting

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From roundup-admin at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Tue Sep 13 14:48:42 2016
From: roundup-admin at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Python tracker)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2016 18:48:42 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] Failed issue tracker submission
Message-ID: <20160913184842.42EAC56A84@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>



The node specified by the designator in the subject of your message
("28188") does not exist.

Subject was: "[issue28188]"



Mail Gateway Help
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From: tracker-discuss at python.org
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Subject: [issue28188]

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Wed Sep 14 16:45:29 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2016 20:45:29 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
Message-ID: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


New submission from Guido van Rossum:

I've noticed we have a lot of "easy" issues on bugs.python.org that are only easy if you're fluent in C. We have (potentially) many new incoming contributors who aren't (yet) at that level but who would be happy to help out with other tasks that don't require C. They appear to be looking through the tracker for "easy" issues and are put off by the C requirement. Would it be possible to add another keyword that we can use to distinguish between the two? We could then also add a second search to the sidebar so newcomers can easily find the category they care about.

----------
messages: 3162
nosy: guido
priority: feature
status: unread
title: Python tracker needs two classes of "easy" issues -- requiring C or not

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Wed Sep 14 16:47:09 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2016 20:47:09 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue606] The sidebar "Search" is much superior
 to the top-right "Search"
Message-ID: <1473886029.59.0.281837264328.issue606@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


New submission from Guido van Rossum:

It was pointed out to me:

> Would you also please point out to everybody, and I really do mean
> everybody, at "Search" on the left hand side of the screen under "Issues".
> Better yet make it the default, as it's vastly superior to the default
> "Search" top right.

This would be great to fix! (And perhaps easy?)

----------
messages: 3163
nosy: guido
priority: bug
status: unread
title: The sidebar "Search" is much superior to the top-right "Search"

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Thu Sep 15 03:37:24 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Christian Heimes)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2016 07:37:24 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue607] Add 'ssl' components
Message-ID: <1473925044.0.0.402962879317.issue607@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


New submission from Christian Heimes:

I'd like to request a new component named 'ssl' for BPO. A component makes it easier for me to get an overview of all OpenSSL and ssl-related issues and feature requests on BPO.

----------
messages: 3164
nosy: christian.heimes
priority: wish
status: unread
title: Add 'ssl' components

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Thu Sep 15 03:48:51 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Ezio Melotti)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2016 07:48:51 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue607] Add 'ssl' components
In-Reply-To: <1473925044.0.0.402962879317.issue607@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1473925731.06.0.773337409454.issue607@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Ezio Melotti added the comment:

Done.

----------
assignedto:  -> ezio.melotti
nosy: +ezio.melotti
status: unread -> resolved

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Sun Sep 18 13:57:56 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Brett C.)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2016 17:57:56 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474221476.13.0.192383805867.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Brett C. added the comment:

Adding a new keyword isn't hard; it can be done from http://bugs.python.org/keyword with the right privileges.

What would you want the current keyword to become and the new one to be? "easy C issue" and "easy Python issue"?

----------
nosy: +brett.cannon
status: unread -> chatting

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<http://psf.upfronthosting.co.za/roundup/meta/issue605>
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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Sun Sep 18 16:56:54 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2016 20:56:54 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1474221476.13.0.192383805867.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJLSdtceWPkyeYoNcBkQDsp7uyUuXNh+fKZueVqbM3Ndow@mail.gmail.com>


Guido van Rossum added the comment:

Those two sounds great -- maybe also add "easy documentation issue"?

On Sun, Sep 18, 2016 at 10:57 AM, Brett C. <
metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za> wrote:

>
> Brett C. added the comment:
>
> Adding a new keyword isn't hard; it can be done from
> http://bugs.python.org/keyword with the right privileges.
>
> What would you want the current keyword to become and the new one to be?
> "easy C issue" and "easy Python issue"?
>
> ----------
> nosy: +brett.cannon
> status: unread -> chatting
>
> _______________________________________________________
> PSF Meta Tracker <metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
> <http://psf.upfronthosting.co.za/roundup/meta/issue605>
> _______________________________________________________
>

_______________________________________________________
PSF Meta Tracker <metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
<http://psf.upfronthosting.co.za/roundup/meta/issue605>
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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 13:25:20 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Brett C.)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 17:25:20 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474305920.06.0.981754770874.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Brett C. added the comment:

"easy doc issue" wouldn't be hard to add either.

Does anyone else have any feedback on this?

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 14:12:39 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Berker Peksag)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 18:12:39 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474308759.65.0.972144512145.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Berker Peksag added the comment:

I don't see a lot of C issues in the "easy issues" list. I agree that some of them (including a few pure Python ones) shouldn't be classified as "easy".

I'd say we should remove the following issues from the list:

* http://bugs.python.org/issue1100942 (requires knowledge on times, Python and C)
* http://bugs.python.org/issue25026
* http://bugs.python.org/issue18156
* http://bugs.python.org/issue20265
* http://bugs.python.org/issue10374 (requires Windows knowledge)
* http://bugs.python.org/issue11697 (needs careful review)
* http://bugs.python.org/issue17561
* http://bugs.python.org/issue17179

----------
nosy: +berker.peksag

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<http://psf.upfronthosting.co.za/roundup/meta/issue605>
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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 14:42:02 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 18:42:02 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1474308759.65.0.972144512145.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJKMs4637ZHd_6Do7KS4apSR2YQSiea87TUZrYfNz2J8dg@mail.gmail.com>


Guido van Rossum added the comment:

Go for that!

On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 11:12 AM, Berker Peksag <
metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za> wrote:

>
> Berker Peksag added the comment:
>
> I don't see a lot of C issues in the "easy issues" list. I agree that some
> of them (including a few pure Python ones) shouldn't be classified as
> "easy".
>
> I'd say we should remove the following issues from the list:
>
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue1100942 (requires knowledge on times,
> Python and C)
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue25026
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue18156
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue20265
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue10374 (requires Windows knowledge)
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue11697 (needs careful review)
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue17561
> * http://bugs.python.org/issue17179
>
> ----------
> nosy: +berker.peksag
>
> _______________________________________________________
> PSF Meta Tracker <metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
> <http://psf.upfronthosting.co.za/roundup/meta/issue605>
> _______________________________________________________
>

_______________________________________________________
PSF Meta Tracker <metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
<http://psf.upfronthosting.co.za/roundup/meta/issue605>
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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 17:44:04 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (R David Murray)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 21:44:04 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue593] Small improvements to issue.item.html
In-Reply-To: <1465451224.3.0.969789688095.issue593@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474321444.77.0.624936979992.issue593@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


R David Murray added the comment:

We have since had the occasion to add Developer to a couple of people specifically so they could be assigned issues (people Raymond is tutoring).  So IMO that field is working as desired at the current time.  There's no alternative to a thread on core-workflow if you want to suggest a change, I'm afraid.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 17:57:01 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (R David Murray)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 21:57:01 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474322221.45.0.293049192074.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


R David Murray added the comment:

So we change the current tag to 'easy (python)', and someone goes in and changes any easy C issues to 'easy (C)'?  I'm not sure how useful 'easy (doc)' will be in reality, but we might as well have it for symmetry :)

As you can see I've painted the bikeshed a slightly different color, but I'm fine with whatever.

----------
nosy: +r.david.murray

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 18:01:44 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (R David Murray)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 22:01:44 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue606] The sidebar "Search" is much superior
 to the top-right "Search"
In-Reply-To: <1473886029.59.0.281837264328.issue606@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474322504.94.0.14474824738.issue606@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


R David Murray added the comment:

Personally I rarely use 'search' (except for the canned searches I've made), and almost always use the upper right search box.  I would strongly object to losing the upper right search box as it currently functions.

The "usual" way this is done on other web sites is to have an 'advanced' link next to or under the prominent search box.  That should be easy enough for someone to tweak the template to provide.  Would that satisfy the request?

----------
nosy: +r.david.murray
status: unread -> chatting

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 18:04:30 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Brett C.)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 22:04:30 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474322670.64.0.560672868772.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Brett C. added the comment:

The other option is to be conservative and mark the current easy issues as "easy (C)" and then adjust accordingly.

And I'm totally happy w/ David's interpretation of the bikeshed's plans as it's shorter.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 18:06:55 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 22:06:55 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue606] The sidebar "Search" is much superior
 to the top-right "Search"
In-Reply-To: <1474322504.94.0.14474824738.issue606@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJJytpQgErQ-=McN40FCF51OHOij+a3pYEsKaiMJCUe0Ew@mail.gmail.com>


Guido van Rossum added the comment:

I'm totally open to better ideas! (I'm really more the messenger than the
originator of the suggestion.) Maybe the upper-right search box can be
tweaked to have a more useful search by default? (Personally I'm always
surprised that it finds closed issues by default, but maybe there's a
reason for that.) Assuming the default is fast enough, adding some extra
options to the search results pages to try with different tweaks is a great
idea. (I'm curious why the current output format tweaks are *below* the
results? I never realized that even existed because it requires scrolling
down, and usually I've lost interest by the time I reach that...)

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 18:07:40 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 22:07:40 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1474322670.64.0.560672868772.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJLPeGzMg53fxKHPtCHbLRmHs1UmxDUGYs0tgv0vTEi5KA@mail.gmail.com>


Guido van Rossum added the comment:

But Berker's research suggests that most current easy issues are not C, so
that should not be the default, IIUC.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 18:08:59 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (R David Murray)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 22:08:59 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474322939.6.0.104690221107.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


R David Murray added the comment:

I'm not sure what you mean by "be conservative".  Leave the current tag alone and add "easy (C)" and just apply it to the identified C issues?  That would actually make sense.  We could also add a *new* 'easy (python)', and retire the current 'easy' tag, which means it would live on in the issues it is already set on, but couldn't be set on new issues.  (At least, I think one can retire tags, I haven't actually checked).

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 18:20:04 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (R David Murray)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 22:20:04 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue606] The sidebar "Search" is much superior
 to the top-right "Search"
In-Reply-To: <1473886029.59.0.281837264328.issue606@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474323604.12.0.950234008201.issue606@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


R David Murray added the comment:

Yes, there is a reason :)  Someone comes to the tracker with a bug, and does a good search...and with an open-only search doesn't find an issue, because we've already fixed it but it isn't in the version of python they are running.  But the default searches closed issues also, they will see hits with 'closed' and hopefully will find their bug has already been fixed.

The default search is a shortcut for the 'all text' field with issue status set to "don't care".

The results page tweaks are part of default-roundup and no one has ever played with them as far as I know.  So that could be a good thing for someone to experiment with.  Moving them to the top would be easy.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Mon Sep 19 18:26:39 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Brett C.)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2016 22:26:39 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474323999.66.0.278691561586.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Brett C. added the comment:

If Berker is comfortable with his assessment then we can ignore my "conservative" suggestion and just rename the current label "easy (Python)" and reclassify as necessary.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Thu Sep 22 04:18:58 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Nick Coghlan)
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2016 08:18:58 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474532338.08.0.250199055814.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Nick Coghlan added the comment:

If we're tinkering with the "easy" tag, would it make sense to switch to a more objectively definable phrase like "well defined (Python)" and "well defined (C)"?

The reason I ask is that good starter issues for folks that just want to work on CPython in general rather than having a particular problem they want to tackle tend to be either:

- bugs with a clear reproducer and a relatively straightforward fix; or
- API addition/changes that already have in principle core dev approval 

Other open issues tend to be a bit more at risk of getting bogged down in design discussions that go in circles or attempts to find a core dev willing to sign off on the change, which can be a bit disheartening for folks that only have limited time to contribute.

The other reason I suggest this is that even a well defined issue may still be difficult for a true novice to tackle, but they will at least have a clear goal to aim for. For folks that are experienced devs and merely new to CPython specifically, the coding side may be easy for them, but they'll still get a chance to run through the the contribution workflow without having to invest too much time in seeking approval for the change itself.

----------
nosy: +ncoghlan

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Thu Sep 22 14:55:38 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2016 18:55:38 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1474532338.08.0.250199055814.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJLFt1rs+Tk07iNBpHk7G7YYXgz8Ehbwc_vFgbKuAQjTiw@mail.gmail.com>


Guido van Rossum added the comment:

The term "well defined" would not resonate with people looking for starter
bugs. Read this piece for an overview of how other projects (esp. Mozilla)
try to lure new contributors, and how that's seen by someone eager to
contribute:
https://medium.com/@shubheksha/finding-your-first-open-source-project-or-bug-to-work-on-1712f651e5ba#.i860som7g

On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 1:18 AM, Nick Coghlan <
metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za> wrote:

>
> Nick Coghlan added the comment:
>
> If we're tinkering with the "easy" tag, would it make sense to switch to a
> more objectively definable phrase like "well defined (Python)" and "well
> defined (C)"?
>
> The reason I ask is that good starter issues for folks that just want to
> work on CPython in general rather than having a particular problem they
> want to tackle tend to be either:
>
> - bugs with a clear reproducer and a relatively straightforward fix; or
> - API addition/changes that already have in principle core dev approval
>
> Other open issues tend to be a bit more at risk of getting bogged down in
> design discussions that go in circles or attempts to find a core dev
> willing to sign off on the change, which can be a bit disheartening for
> folks that only have limited time to contribute.
>
> The other reason I suggest this is that even a well defined issue may
> still be difficult for a true novice to tackle, but they will at least have
> a clear goal to aim for. For folks that are experienced devs and merely new
> to CPython specifically, the coding side may be easy for them, but they'll
> still get a chance to run through the the contribution workflow without
> having to invest too much time in seeking approval for the change itself.
>
> ----------
> nosy: +ncoghlan
>
> _______________________________________________________
> PSF Meta Tracker <metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
> <http://psf.upfronthosting.co.za/roundup/meta/issue605>
> _______________________________________________________
>

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Thu Sep 22 20:40:41 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Nick Coghlan)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2016 00:40:41 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474591241.04.0.645876188102.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Nick Coghlan added the comment:

Guido: good points, so I've instead filed https://github.com/python/devguide/issues/38 to discuss updating the Triaging section of the devguide with a bit more guidance on when it's a good idea to set these keywords.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Thu Sep 22 20:47:07 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Nick Coghlan)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2016 00:47:07 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474591627.15.0.920414295993.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Nick Coghlan added the comment:

OK, I've created the "easy (C)" keyword: http://bugs.python.org/keyword18

I've left the existing "easy" keyword alone for the time being, as the Python vs Documentation split is already implied by the component, but changing the keyword to "easy (Python)" would confuse that distinction.

So the next step would be to review the current "easy" list and switch any C issues over to "easy (C)"

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Fri Sep 23 06:10:12 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Berker Peksag)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2016 10:10:12 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474625412.09.0.688850882088.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Berker Peksag added the comment:

Adding new keywords will make triagers' and core developers' life harder in my opinion. There are already too much fields and keywords in the issue page.

We probably have 30-35 issues (there are 300+ issues marked as "easy") that requires C knowledge and most of them shouldn't be there so adding an "easy C" keyword doesn't actually solve the problem.

If a new contributor doesn't know C, they can still help writing tests and documentation if the issue is correctly classified as "easy" (I did this when I was a contributor.) The main problem with our list is that most of them are easy for a core developer, a domain expert, or a platform expert (see the issues I collected in msg3169 -- not all of them are C issues.)

The another problem is, there is no guidance in most of the easy issues. We should clarify what is the state of the issue, what's needed for next step and which files should be updated (as an ex-Mozilla contributor I can say that Mozilla does a very good job in this area.)

I'm planning to re-triage all issues marked as "easy" in the next weeks.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Fri Sep 23 06:15:23 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Berker Peksag)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2016 10:15:23 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue593] Small improvements to issue.item.html
In-Reply-To: <1465451224.3.0.969789688095.issue593@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474625723.02.0.409073716837.issue593@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Berker Peksag added the comment:

What do you think about the rest of the patch? Do you want me to remove the assigned-to part?

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From turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp  Tue Sep 20 01:10:50 2016
From: turnbull.stephen.fw at u.tsukuba.ac.jp (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2016 14:10:50 +0900
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1474322939.6.0.104690221107.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
References: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
 <1474322939.6.0.104690221107.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <22496.50394.692628.215581@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

R David Murray writes:

 > (At least, I think one can retire tags, I haven't actually
 > checked).

I've done it on the XEmacs tracker, so it used to work fine, but that
was a while ago.

Steve

From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Fri Sep 23 12:20:26 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2016 16:20:26 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1474625412.09.0.688850882088.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJJr_7r+5Y4aupZUxxov_D4vbxafdCfxozMv5-e-D7_Kfw@mail.gmail.com>


Guido van Rossum added the comment:

Thanks Berker! I agree the discussion shouldn't be narrowly about the
keywords and how to assign them -- we could also do a better job of guiding
new contributors. From Shubeksha's blog post it seems that we're doing
almost nothing in this area -- people scanning the easy issues are quickly
turned off.

FWIW in mypy we've got two separate keywords -- one for newbie issues and
one for easy issues. The newbie issues are meant to be easy enough to guide
people through their first contribution ever. The easy ones are easy once
you have mastered the pull request workflow etc.

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Fri Sep 23 12:32:29 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Ezio Melotti)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2016 16:32:29 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1473885929.19.0.0101452580973.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474648348.98.0.634611777661.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


Ezio Melotti added the comment:

> Adding new keywords will make triagers' and core developers' life harder in my opinion.

I agree with Berker on this -- adding new keywords and components makes the tracker harder to use.  With more fields it is more difficult to find/select/understand all the right options while triaging and reviewing issues.  This might also lead to incomplete/incorrect classification.
When adding new keywords/components we should always evaluate if the benefits (better classification/easier search) outweigh this cost (UI cluttering/worse UX).
We have discussed in the past ways to address the UI/UX problem, such as tags or separate "triaging" (with all the fields/options) and "read-only" (with only the selected fields/options) views.  Until these are implemented I would prefer to err on the conservative side while adding new components/keywords.

----------
nosy: +ezio.melotti

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Fri Sep 23 13:00:16 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2016 17:00:16 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue605] Python tracker needs two classes of
 "easy" issues -- requiring C or not
In-Reply-To: <1474648348.98.0.634611777661.issue605@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJJp9MhbBDS-MBGB0e9nDJP=TyGMinzqNqvzqaJm=iApzw@mail.gmail.com>


Guido van Rossum added the comment:

Honestly the schema used by our tracker is already too complex for me
(note: I'm not a frequent user of the tracker any more).

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From metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Sat Sep 24 13:19:04 2016
From: metatracker at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (R David Murray)
Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2016 17:19:04 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] [issue593] Small improvements to issue.item.html
In-Reply-To: <1465451224.3.0.969789688095.issue593@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>
Message-ID: <1474737544.81.0.0569530005367.issue593@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>


R David Murray added the comment:

I don't know what about the submit changes button you are suggesting changing, and I don't currently have a test instance set up to look at what the difference is.  It would be helpful if that change the triagers mark change were separate changesets; the latter should certainly go in.

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From roundup-admin at psf.upfronthosting.co.za  Fri Sep 30 15:39:47 2016
From: roundup-admin at psf.upfronthosting.co.za (Python tracker)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2016 19:39:47 +0000
Subject: [Tracker-discuss] Failed issue tracker submission
Message-ID: <20160930193947.CF7745666C@psf.upfronthosting.co.za>



The node specified by the designator in the subject of your message
("28815") does not exist.

Subject was: "[issue28815]"



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From: tracker-discuss at python.org
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