[Pythonedu-wg] The installation and deployment experience

[Stewart Watkiss]

Hi Caleb,

Welcome to the list.

We did have some discussions in September & October last year. The main 
discussion was about the editor which I understand is work in progress.

This is the contribution I added previously on the installation / 
deployment. I'm very happy to contribute to this discussion and towards 
any implementation plans. I am going to be very busy the first few 
months of 2016, although that won't stop me joining in the discussion.

-- Previous email from 28 Sept 2015 --

> Common feedback from people trying to use Python in education is that
> it can be difficult and confusing to get a system that includes all
> the dependencies they require.

Not many people have contributed to this discussion although arguably I 
think this is just as, if not more important than the editor discussion.

Working on my own projects is fairly straight forward as I usually 
develop on Linux (which is much easier platform for Python development 
than say Windows), my computer is not restricted in anyway and I always 
have an internet connection (at least during the development and setup).
However when I have worked with schools then it's not been possible to 
install additional packages as the machines are locked down, or because 
they are not allowed to connect to the network. So I think this is an 
important step forward in making it easier to learn programming in 
Python.

I have found on some of my own projects I have had to list a large 
number of steps required in installing the pre-requisites that an 
educational bundle will help with.

I think it's good to start with the requirements rather than solutions.
  From the "must have" list, and my understanding, I was expecting just a 
list of modules that could be pre-built and easy installed, but the 
highly desired list goes beyond that.  I think there could be a real 
benefit with those additional features, although I'm not sure how easily 
they can be implemented on computers that are "locked down". One thing I 
do think we need to consider is how updates to the education bundle can 
be managed as no doubt there will be additional modules that need to be 
added in future such as when the next super-dooper Raspberry Pi hat 
comes out :-)

I think it's worth highlighting some of the issues / difficulties on the 
different platforms, I've listed some of my experiences below.


**Windows**

It is harder to install python modules (and software in general) on
Windows as it may be necessary to install using different sources (eg.
binary install files as well as PIP). I think the biggest problem with
Windows is likely to be that they are locked down to prevent software
from being installed (including locking out the teachers in some cases).
I think that having a single installable package which includes the most
popular modules that are used in education would make it easier to give
that as a single install step that can be applied to existing Windows
systems. It could then be presented to the administrator as a single
install client that can be pushed out on the system.

**Linux (excluding Raspberry Pi)**

Although (excluding the Raspberry Pi) Linux is used less in schools than
the other platforms I think it's still useful to at least look at how
the education bundle can be implemented on Linux. I think this could be
useful for colleges and schools looking to re-use some older machines. I
think we are likely to see this considered more in future as teachers
become more adept with Linux based on experience with the Raspberry Pi.
The current PIP system is designed to make it easier to install
software, but it's not quite as straight forward as it should be. It can
be an issue where a computer is locked down to prevent additional
software being installed and support for all packages isn't as easy as
it could be. For example to install pygame for Python 3 on Ubuntu
requires compiling the package and if using PyUSB (to control a USB
device) then that includes dependencies upon Libusb and the package
needs to be manually downloaded and installed using setup.py.

**Raspbian on Raspberry Pi**

Raspbian is already further ahead than some other Linux distributions
with inclusion of pygame for Python 3, although it still has difficulty
with some other packages (such as PyUSB). In some schools the Raspberry
Pis are all being used off-network (due to school policy), so I think it
would be good to get additional packages installed in the NOOBS image so
they are available by default.

**Mac OSX**

Unfortunately I don't have any experience with Mac to be able to comment
on the particular issues, although I expect it will not be too different
from the other platforms in terms of issues.





 From: Pythonedu-wg 
[mailto:pythonedu-wg-bounces+swatkiss=emea.att.com at python.org] On Behalf 
Of Caleb Hattingh
Sent: 06 January 2016 03:57
To: pythonedu-wg at python.org
Subject: [Pythonedu-wg] The installation and deployment experience

Hi everyone

I joined this WG only yesterday. I'd like to help, if possible, with the 
installation and deployment experience.

- "Installation": whatever needs to happen for a learner to be able to 
write code on their device
- "Deployment": whatever needs to happen for a learner to give their 
creation to a friend so that the friend can use it on their device.

Is there any other prior, online discussion on these two points that I 
could use to catch up on what's already been discussed? I've already 
seen the google doc that Carrie Anne set up, for "Python Education 
Bundle", here:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XZS-piBFsoKbZwnoZZZbmypxMXhz4U0pa0NCZFphvvk/edit?usp=sharing

rgds
Caleb