From list at qtrac.plus.com  Wed May  6 16:40:48 2009
From: list at qtrac.plus.com (Mark Summerfield)
Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 15:40:48 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon
Message-ID: <200905061540.48411.list@qtrac.plus.com>

Hi,

I've just noticed that amazon.co.uk are now charging just 15.94 GBP for
_Programming in Python 3_. I have no idea why or how long it will last,
but if you're interested maybe this would be a good time to get it:-)

See my website for the table of contents and for a PDF of one of the
chapters, and links to independent reviews. Both amazon.co.uk and have
"look inside", although amazon.com has more reviews.

:-)

-- 
Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
    C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
        "Programming in Python 3" - ISBN 0137129297


From connorsml at gmail.com  Wed May  6 17:20:33 2009
From: connorsml at gmail.com (Michael Connors)
Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 17:20:33 +0200
Subject: [python-uk] Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon
In-Reply-To: <200905061540.48411.list@qtrac.plus.com>
References: <200905061540.48411.list@qtrac.plus.com>
Message-ID: <d9e7db140905060820s378ed85bu3bd8561ce86bf520@mail.gmail.com>

Looks like a bargain.

What is the target audience? Any good for someone with a lot of Python
experience who is moving to Python 3?

2009/5/6 Mark Summerfield <list at qtrac.plus.com>

> Hi,
>
> I've just noticed that amazon.co.uk are now charging just 15.94 GBP for
> _Programming in Python 3_. I have no idea why or how long it will last,
> but if you're interested maybe this would be a good time to get it:-)
>
> See my website for the table of contents and for a PDF of one of the
> chapters, and links to independent reviews. Both amazon.co.uk and have
> "look inside", although amazon.com has more reviews.
>
> :-)
>
> --
> Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
>    C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
>        "Programming in Python 3" - ISBN 0137129297
>
> _______________________________________________
> python-uk mailing list
> python-uk at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
>



-- 
Michael Connors
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From list at qtrac.plus.com  Wed May  6 18:05:33 2009
From: list at qtrac.plus.com (Mark Summerfield)
Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 17:05:33 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon
In-Reply-To: <d9e7db140905060820s378ed85bu3bd8561ce86bf520@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200905061540.48411.list@qtrac.plus.com>
	<d9e7db140905060820s378ed85bu3bd8561ce86bf520@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200905061705.33832.list@qtrac.plus.com>

On 2009-05-06, Michael Connors wrote:
> Looks like a bargain.
>
> What is the target audience? Any good for someone with a lot of Python
> experience who is moving to Python 3?

Yes!

The book assumes prior programming experience in _something_ (which
includes Python:-)

With a good Python background the first chapter should be an easy skim.
Python 3-specific material starts in chapter 2, particularly the
coverage of Unicode and str.format(). Python 3 isn't a revolution, so an
awful lot will be familiar, but everything is done from a Python 3 point
of view, so there's no mixing of Python 2 and Python 3 styles. And from
chapter 6 onwards, particularly chapter 8, will surely have some things
you haven't tried or considered before...

And given the price, it has got to be worth a go;-)

>
> 2009/5/6 Mark Summerfield <list at qtrac.plus.com>
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > I've just noticed that amazon.co.uk are now charging just 15.94 GBP for
> > _Programming in Python 3_. I have no idea why or how long it will last,
> > but if you're interested maybe this would be a good time to get it:-)
> >
> > See my website for the table of contents and for a PDF of one of the
> > chapters, and links to independent reviews. Both amazon.co.uk and have
> > "look inside", although amazon.com has more reviews.
> >
> > :-)
> >
> > --
> > Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
> >    C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
> >        "Programming in Python 3" - ISBN 0137129297
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > python-uk mailing list
> > python-uk at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk


-- 
Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
    C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
        "Rapid GUI Programming with Python and Qt" - ISBN 0132354187


From jayeola at gmail.com  Thu May  7 12:13:52 2009
From: jayeola at gmail.com (john maclean)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 11:13:52 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
Message-ID: <4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>

2009/5/7  <python-uk-request at python.org>:
> Send python-uk mailing list submissions to
> ? ? ? ?python-uk at python.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> ? ? ? ?http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ? ? ? ?python-uk-request at python.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> ? ? ? ?python-uk-owner at python.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of python-uk digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> ? 1. Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon (Mark Summerfield)
> ? 2. Re: Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon (Michael Connors)
> ? 3. Re: Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon (Mark Summerfield)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 15:40:48 +0100
> From: Mark Summerfield <list at qtrac.plus.com>
> Subject: [python-uk] Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon
> To: python-uk at python.org
> Message-ID: <200905061540.48411.list at qtrac.plus.com>
> Content-Type: Text/Plain; ?charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hi,
>
> I've just noticed that amazon.co.uk are now charging just 15.94 GBP for
> _Programming in Python 3_. I have no idea why or how long it will last,
> but if you're interested maybe this would be a good time to get it:-)
>
> See my website for the table of contents and for a PDF of one of the
> chapters, and links to independent reviews. Both amazon.co.uk and have
> "look inside", although amazon.com has more reviews.
>
> :-)
>
> --
> Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
> ? ?C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
> ? ? ? ?"Programming in Python 3" - ISBN 0137129297
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 17:20:33 +0200
> From: Michael Connors <connorsml at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [python-uk] Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon
> To: Mark Summerfield <mark at qtrac.eu>, UK Python Users
> ? ? ? ?<python-uk at python.org>
> Message-ID:
> ? ? ? ?<d9e7db140905060820s378ed85bu3bd8561ce86bf520 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Looks like a bargain.
>
> What is the target audience? Any good for someone with a lot of Python
> experience who is moving to Python 3?
>
> 2009/5/6 Mark Summerfield <list at qtrac.plus.com>
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I've just noticed that amazon.co.uk are now charging just 15.94 GBP for
>> _Programming in Python 3_. I have no idea why or how long it will last,
>> but if you're interested maybe this would be a good time to get it:-)
>>
>> See my website for the table of contents and for a PDF of one of the
>> chapters, and links to independent reviews. Both amazon.co.uk and have
>> "look inside", although amazon.com has more reviews.
>>
>> :-)
>>
>> --
>> Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
>> ? ?C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
>> ? ? ? ?"Programming in Python 3" - ISBN 0137129297
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> python-uk mailing list
>> python-uk at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Michael Connors
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 17:05:33 +0100
> From: Mark Summerfield <list at qtrac.plus.com>
> Subject: Re: [python-uk] Python 3 book - 45% off at amazon
> To: Michael Connors <connorsml at gmail.com>
> Cc: UK Python Users <python-uk at python.org>
> Message-ID: <200905061705.33832.list at qtrac.plus.com>
> Content-Type: Text/Plain; ?charset="utf-8"
>
> On 2009-05-06, Michael Connors wrote:
>> Looks like a bargain.
>>
>> What is the target audience? Any good for someone with a lot of Python
>> experience who is moving to Python 3?
>
> Yes!
>
> The book assumes prior programming experience in _something_ (which
> includes Python:-)
>
> With a good Python background the first chapter should be an easy skim.
> Python 3-specific material starts in chapter 2, particularly the
> coverage of Unicode and str.format(). Python 3 isn't a revolution, so an
> awful lot will be familiar, but everything is done from a Python 3 point
> of view, so there's no mixing of Python 2 and Python 3 styles. And from
> chapter 6 onwards, particularly chapter 8, will surely have some things
> you haven't tried or considered before...
>
> And given the price, it has got to be worth a go;-)
>
>>
>> 2009/5/6 Mark Summerfield <list at qtrac.plus.com>
>>
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > I've just noticed that amazon.co.uk are now charging just 15.94 GBP for
>> > _Programming in Python 3_. I have no idea why or how long it will last,
>> > but if you're interested maybe this would be a good time to get it:-)
>> >
>> > See my website for the table of contents and for a PDF of one of the
>> > chapters, and links to independent reviews. Both amazon.co.uk and have
>> > "look inside", although amazon.com has more reviews.
>> >
>> > :-)
>> >
>> > --
>> > Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
>> > ? ?C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
>> > ? ? ? ?"Programming in Python 3" - ISBN 0137129297
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > python-uk mailing list
>> > python-uk at python.org
>> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
>
>
> --
> Mark Summerfield, Qtrac Ltd, www.qtrac.eu
> ? ?C++, Python, Qt, PyQt - training and consultancy
> ? ? ? ?"Rapid GUI Programming with Python and Qt" - ISBN 0132354187
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> python-uk mailing list
> python-uk at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
>
>
> End of python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
> ****************************************
>


Are many people actually using python 3?

-- 
John Maclean
07739 171 531
MSc (DIC)

Timezone: GMT

From funthyme at gmail.com  Thu May  7 22:43:11 2009
From: funthyme at gmail.com (John Pinner)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 21:43:11 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
	<4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

2009/5/7 john maclean <jayeola at gmail.com>:

<snips>

> Are many people actually using python 3?

Probably not - yet.

But if you are developing new software you should be using Python 3,
ready for when it becomes the default in Linux distributions (already
it is, in Ubuntu 9.04).

Python 3 offers several advantages over Python 2, notably consistent
string handling (always Unicode), as well as removal of cruft built up
since 1991, and most significantly that's where future language and
library development will take place.

At Clockwork we've started porting our codebase, which involves quite
a lot of work as we have masses of Python 2 stuff. and having finished
porting our C extensions I can report that Python 3 is indeed a big
improvement, but it's nothing to be frightened of, it's like meeting
an old friend who's had a makeover.

Best wishes,

John
--

From andy at reportlab.com  Thu May  7 23:02:24 2009
From: andy at reportlab.com (Andy Robinson)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 22:02:24 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
	<4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
	<ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <956003ae0905071402m56f0333fnee4a7283d2ef6b17@mail.gmail.com>

2009/5/7 John Pinner <funthyme at gmail.com>:
> But if you are developing new software you should be using Python 3,
> ready for when it becomes the default in Linux distributions (already
> it is, in Ubuntu 9.04).

I just did a clean install of Ubuntu desktop 9.04 2 days ago, and
typing 'python' brings up 2.6.2.    I have to type 'python3' to get
Python 3.0.   So I'm not sure what "the default" means.

Otherwise I fully agree (but still dread upgrading ten years worth of code...)

- Andy

From funthyme at gmail.com  Thu May  7 23:57:32 2009
From: funthyme at gmail.com (John Pinner)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 22:57:32 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <956003ae0905071402m56f0333fnee4a7283d2ef6b17@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
	<4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
	<ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>
	<956003ae0905071402m56f0333fnee4a7283d2ef6b17@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ff8a32f0905071457y71eb6d8u59ae9eda48798c4f@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

2009/5/7 Andy Robinson <andy at reportlab.com>:
> 2009/5/7 John Pinner <funthyme at gmail.com>:
>> But if you are developing new software you should be using Python 3,
>> ready for when it becomes the default in Linux distributions (already
>> it is, in Ubuntu 9.04).
>
> I just did a clean install of Ubuntu desktop 9.04 2 days ago, and
> typing 'python' brings up 2.6.2. ? ?I have to type 'python3' to get
> Python 3.0. ? So I'm not sure what "the default" means.

Sorry, my mistake. 2.6 is the default, Python 3 is installed, but is
not the default. Put this down to Dr Alzheimer...

>
> Otherwise I fully agree (but still dread upgrading ten years worth of code...)

Quite. We've decided to keep the old stuff as is, develop new stuff in
Python 3, and redevelop (rather than convert) old Python 2 systems
into Python 3, only we think they have a long term future.

Best wishes,

John
--

From shaun.laughey at googlemail.com  Thu May  7 23:59:26 2009
From: shaun.laughey at googlemail.com (Shaun Laughey)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 22:59:26 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <956003ae0905071402m56f0333fnee4a7283d2ef6b17@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
	<4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
	<ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>
	<956003ae0905071402m56f0333fnee4a7283d2ef6b17@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2e327e770905071459l6917ebd6w1776ad1e74983381@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Andy didn't you start a while ago?

I think the unicode strings alone will make life a lot easier for all
pythonistas not harder.

Plus with the xml parsing libraries that exist now no need to roll
your own - well apart from keeping other peoples bugs out...

Your codebase would become smaller and easier to maintain.

Shaun Laughey.
(a reportlab fan)

2009/5/7 Andy Robinson <andy at reportlab.com>:
> 2009/5/7 John Pinner <funthyme at gmail.com>:
>> But if you are developing new software you should be using Python 3,
>> ready for when it becomes the default in Linux distributions (already
>> it is, in Ubuntu 9.04).
>
> I just did a clean install of Ubuntu desktop 9.04 2 days ago, and
> typing 'python' brings up 2.6.2. ? ?I have to type 'python3' to get
> Python 3.0. ? So I'm not sure what "the default" means.
>
> Otherwise I fully agree (but still dread upgrading ten years worth of code...)
>
> - Andy
> _______________________________________________
> python-uk mailing list
> python-uk at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
>

From jjl at pobox.com  Thu May  7 23:06:12 2009
From: jjl at pobox.com (John J Lee)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 22:06:12 +0100 (BST)
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
	<4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
	<ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.0905072155420.4574@alice>

On Thu, 7 May 2009, John Pinner wrote:
[...]
> But if you are developing new software you should be using Python 3,
> ready for when it becomes the default in Linux distributions (already
> it is, in Ubuntu 9.04).

What does that mean?

$ lsb_release -a
No LSB modules are available.
Distributor ID:	Ubuntu
Description:	Ubuntu 9.04
Release:	9.04
Codename:	jaunty
$ python3
The program 'python3' is currently not installed.  You can install it by typing:
sudo apt-get install python3-minimal
bash: python3: command not found
$ python
Python 2.6.2 (release26-maint, Apr 19 2009, 01:56:41)
[GCC 4.3.3] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>>
john at alice:~$ dpkg -S $(which python)
python-minimal: /usr/bin/python
$ apt-cache depends python
python
   Depends: python2.6
   Depends: python-minimal
...


John


From funthyme at gmail.com  Fri May  8 00:47:10 2009
From: funthyme at gmail.com (John Pinner)
Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 23:47:10 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] EuroPython 2009 - in the UK
Message-ID: <ff8a32f0905071547o4fe574f0l8366741a58687347@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

As you all know (if not our publicity has gone awry!) EuroPython 2009
is being held in the UK, in Birmingham, in week beginning 29th June.

We are still reviewing talk submissions, but those already approved
have now been published on the website and the timetable will follow
soon.

see http://europython.eu

We have had a fantastic number of talk submissions, in both quantity
and quality - thanks to all the speakers for their proposals! - and we
have brilliant keynote speakers as well.

The Early Bird booking rate is available for another week - don't delay!

Best wishes,

John
--

From renesd at gmail.com  Fri May  8 05:43:15 2009
From: renesd at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Ren=E9_Dudfield?=)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 13:43:15 +1000
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
	<4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <64ddb72c0905072043v28f82c7bs5930d533e9ccc904@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, May 7, 2009 at 8:13 PM, john maclean <jayeola at gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> Are many people actually using python 3?
>
>
Not really... from what I can see.

There's about 47 python3 packages listed at pypi, and over 6400+ in total.
http://pypi.python.org/pypi?:action=browse&show=all&c=533

The growth rate of 2.x packages vs 3.x packages is still way ahead for the
2.x version of python.


Expect at least a couple of years before python3.x really takes off.
However 3.1(due in 2 months) should be a lot better than 3.



cu,
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From andy at reportlab.com  Fri May  8 10:05:57 2009
From: andy at reportlab.com (Andy Robinson)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 09:05:57 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] python-uk Digest, Vol 69, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <2e327e770905071459l6917ebd6w1776ad1e74983381@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.41.1241690421.28741.python-uk@python.org>
	<4170c1720905070313k641d6594tb03e26c043698e70@mail.gmail.com>
	<ff8a32f0905071343r1a32f993wd5371c6c2a67ccae@mail.gmail.com>
	<956003ae0905071402m56f0333fnee4a7283d2ef6b17@mail.gmail.com>
	<2e327e770905071459l6917ebd6w1776ad1e74983381@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <956003ae0905080105r2bc5adf9i41d5882f36033f7a@mail.gmail.com>

2009/5/7 Shaun Laughey <shaun.laughey at googlemail.com>:
> Hi Andy didn't you start a while ago?

We've dabbled and done a private port of the open source
toolkit using 2-to-3, which sort of works except that PIL
is not yet available for 3.0 and that's a major issue for
many users.   We also build a ton of solutions on
Django.  So we're kind of waiting for those two to get
ported.

Also we can't sanely do what Guido wants and
release/maintain a library with the same APIs
across 2.3,24,2.5,2.6,2.7,3.0,3.1 etc.  I just don't see
any "ROI".

I'm much more interested in doing a backwards-incompatible
"reportlab3" where we clear out our own decade of clutter
and make proper use of the distinction between text and
bytes; we have a clear design in our heads for this.  But
Guido didn't want people doing that a year ago.

> Your codebase would become smaller and easier to maintain.

The 3.x codebase, yes.  But the total codebase would only
shrink if all the users of all the solutions we have built on 2.x
dropped dead, and we'll get the usual stream of new requirements
for the old libraries indefinitely....  but that's the price of having
a software business rather than a free-time project.


- Andy

From alec.muffett at gmail.com  Fri May  8 13:32:04 2009
From: alec.muffett at gmail.com (Alec Muffett)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 12:32:04 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python project layout?
Message-ID: <F3FD1E1D-179D-4A43-8849-278462635FB0@gmail.com>

Hi folks,

I'm a old fart^H^H^H^H Perl hacker converting to Python, and am  
starting out on my first Python project.  I'm currently inhaling "Dive  
into Python" and the "Python Cookbook", and am lining up the Django  
book as my next read.  So far I've read heaps of syntax and code, and  
written a few test scripts.

Beyond some information on how "import" works, what I am not finding  
is anything about typical project layout - ie: the names of files and  
subdirectories laid out for class inheritance, loading etc; For  
instance, in http://bitbucket.org/jespern/django-piston/src/tip/examples/blogserver/ 
  there are actualy *files* called "__init__.py" and so forth.  I  
suspect that's a Django thing rather than python syntax, but am not  
sure.

So far I am putting all my classes and all their methods into a single  
file, which I am sure it not tenable.  I suspect I should really  
create a project directory "foo" and edit "foo/bar.py" and "foo/ 
baz.py" so that I can "import foo.bar" -- but is there any other magic  
I need to do? (cf: package templates in perl)

Is there anything on the web I can look at to find out about this stuff?

thanks in advance,

	- alec



From mail at timgolden.me.uk  Fri May  8 13:53:51 2009
From: mail at timgolden.me.uk (Tim Golden)
Date: Fri, 08 May 2009 12:53:51 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python project layout?
In-Reply-To: <F3FD1E1D-179D-4A43-8849-278462635FB0@gmail.com>
References: <F3FD1E1D-179D-4A43-8849-278462635FB0@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4A041D4F.9040801@timgolden.me.uk>

Alec Muffett wrote:
> Hi folks,

Hi, welcome to Python. Be aware that this list (python-uk)
is very low volume, and tends to be used for announcements
of UK Python meetups, conferences, jobs and the like. Nothing
wrong with posting technical questions here, but you might
be better off on the main Python list:

  http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

As to your actual question re project layout, I myself
don't have any strong feelings, and I haven't seen
anything very authoritative noised about, either. 

The __init__.py file *is* in fact a part of the "syntax",
so to speak, of Python: it indicates that the directory
containing it is to be treated as a Python package:

  http://docs.python.org/tutorial/modules.html#packages

TJG

From ross.lawley at gmail.com  Fri May  8 14:00:19 2009
From: ross.lawley at gmail.com (Ross Lawley)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 13:00:19 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python project layout?
In-Reply-To: <4A041D4F.9040801@timgolden.me.uk>
References: <F3FD1E1D-179D-4A43-8849-278462635FB0@gmail.com>
	<4A041D4F.9040801@timgolden.me.uk>
Message-ID: <305366200905080500i45b7efcfs927c9942f659d5a1@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Alec,

Welcome, sounds like you've got some good reading, as Alec says __init__.py
are core for packages and therefore namespacing - so read up on that.

Other than that the best advice I can give is get coding - I often find
doing a little project is a great way to focus my learning in a new
language.

Also, don't forget to do: "import this" in a python shell for the zen of
python!

Good luck and have fun!

Ross

On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 12:53 PM, Tim Golden <mail at timgolden.me.uk> wrote:

> Alec Muffett wrote:
>
>> Hi folks,
>>
>
> Hi, welcome to Python. Be aware that this list (python-uk)
> is very low volume, and tends to be used for announcements
> of UK Python meetups, conferences, jobs and the like. Nothing
> wrong with posting technical questions here, but you might
> be better off on the main Python list:
>
>  http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
>
> As to your actual question re project layout, I myself
> don't have any strong feelings, and I haven't seen
> anything very authoritative noised about, either.
> The __init__.py file *is* in fact a part of the "syntax",
> so to speak, of Python: it indicates that the directory
> containing it is to be treated as a Python package:
>
>  http://docs.python.org/tutorial/modules.html#packages
>
> TJG
>
> _______________________________________________
> python-uk mailing list
> python-uk at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
>
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From morton.thomas at googlemail.com  Fri May  8 14:01:43 2009
From: morton.thomas at googlemail.com (Thomas Morton)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 13:01:43 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python project layout?
In-Reply-To: <4A041D4F.9040801@timgolden.me.uk>
References: <F3FD1E1D-179D-4A43-8849-278462635FB0@gmail.com>
	<4A041D4F.9040801@timgolden.me.uk>
Message-ID: <8e02cf540905080501m490584d9h7a62f023d9a32262@mail.gmail.com>

Further to Tim's reply about project layout.

One of the tennats of Python is that it is a choice language. If you want to
put modules in a single file then do so. If it fits better in a directory
then that's fine too. Both work well and neither approach will make you a
leper to other Python devs. :)

I usually mix it up. Large modules go in directories. Simple small ones in a
single file :)

 --
Tom
++ No problem should ever have to be solved twice ++

?
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now<http://www.wisestamp.com>


2009/5/8 Tim Golden <mail at timgolden.me.uk>

> Alec Muffett wrote:
>
>> Hi folks,
>>
>
> Hi, welcome to Python. Be aware that this list (python-uk)
> is very low volume, and tends to be used for announcements
> of UK Python meetups, conferences, jobs and the like. Nothing
> wrong with posting technical questions here, but you might
> be better off on the main Python list:
>
>  http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
>
> As to your actual question re project layout, I myself
> don't have any strong feelings, and I haven't seen
> anything very authoritative noised about, either.
> The __init__.py file *is* in fact a part of the "syntax",
> so to speak, of Python: it indicates that the directory
> containing it is to be treated as a Python package:
>
>  http://docs.python.org/tutorial/modules.html#packages
>
> TJG
>
> _______________________________________________
> python-uk mailing list
> python-uk at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-uk
>
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From carles at pina.cat  Fri May  8 13:58:07 2009
From: carles at pina.cat (Carles Pina i Estany)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 13:58:07 +0200
Subject: [python-uk] Python project layout?
In-Reply-To: <4A041D4F.9040801@timgolden.me.uk>
References: <F3FD1E1D-179D-4A43-8849-278462635FB0@gmail.com>
	<4A041D4F.9040801@timgolden.me.uk>
Message-ID: <20090508115807.GA14084@pina.cat>


Hi,

On May/08/2009, Tim Golden wrote:
> Alec Muffett wrote:
>> Hi folks,
>
> Hi, welcome to Python. Be aware that this list (python-uk)
> is very low volume, and tends to be used for announcements
> of UK Python meetups, conferences, jobs and the like. Nothing

How often is there a Python meetup in London?

I checked in meetup.com (we are using it in the Barcelona Python group)
but London group is on hold.

In one month I'm moving to London so I was wondering where the Python
people meets :-)

Cheers,

-- 
Carles Pina i Estany
	http://pinux.info

From alec.muffett at gmail.com  Fri May  8 15:38:44 2009
From: alec.muffett at gmail.com (Alec Muffett)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 14:38:44 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python events upcoming in the south/southeast
In-Reply-To: <mailman.18647.1241784110.11745.python-uk@python.org>
References: <mailman.18647.1241784110.11745.python-uk@python.org>
Message-ID: <57AFD92B-EA4B-42DD-A040-855A1AC2C1B1@gmail.com>

> Hi, welcome to Python. Be aware that this list (python-uk)
> is very low volume, and tends to be used for announcements
> of UK Python meetups, conferences, jobs and the like. Nothing
> wrong with posting technical questions here, but you might
> be better off on the main Python list:
>
>  http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Oops - obliged, and thank you for the correction :-)

Having met up with Simon Willison recently out in the 'States, I am  
eagerly waiting for a DJUGL or similar event down in my area  
(Basingstoke/Guildford/Reading/London) and getting to meet some  
Pythonistas - beer and chat are great development aids... :-)

Thanks again!

	-a



From andy at reportlab.com  Fri May  8 16:09:37 2009
From: andy at reportlab.com (Andy Robinson)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 15:09:37 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python events upcoming in the south/southeast
In-Reply-To: <57AFD92B-EA4B-42DD-A040-855A1AC2C1B1@gmail.com>
References: <mailman.18647.1241784110.11745.python-uk@python.org>
	<57AFD92B-EA4B-42DD-A040-855A1AC2C1B1@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <956003ae0905080709h54964623qddac7814cf8eb2b9@mail.gmail.com>

2009/5/8 Alec Muffett <alec.muffett at gmail.com>:
> I am eagerly
> waiting for a DJUGL or similar event down in my area

The people who attend these things are probably going to be
in detox for a while after this week's EuroDjangoCon in Prague -
I dread to think how much beer went down there....

In fact if you can catch a flight now, the sprints might still be
going on ;-)

     http://euro.djangocon.org/

- Andy

From ntoll at ntoll.org  Fri May  8 16:23:45 2009
From: ntoll at ntoll.org (Nicholas Tollervey)
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 15:23:45 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Python events upcoming in the south/southeast
In-Reply-To: <956003ae0905080709h54964623qddac7814cf8eb2b9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.18647.1241784110.11745.python-uk@python.org>
	<57AFD92B-EA4B-42DD-A040-855A1AC2C1B1@gmail.com>
	<956003ae0905080709h54964623qddac7814cf8eb2b9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C3DC01F9-8F3D-4ED9-82BF-D41A3A10C152@ntoll.org>

On 8 May 2009, at 15:09, Andy Robinson wrote:

> 2009/5/8 Alec Muffett <alec.muffett at gmail.com>:
>> I am eagerly
>> waiting for a DJUGL or similar event down in my area
>
> The people who attend these things are probably going to be
> in detox for a while after this week's EuroDjangoCon in Prague -
> I dread to think how much beer went down there....
>
> In fact if you can catch a flight now, the sprints might still be
> going on ;-)
>
>     http://euro.djangocon.org/
>

Prague *was* a lot of fun. Monday night's party especially as every  
table had beer on tap and a leader-board to show which table had drunk  
the most.

Search for #eurodjangocon on Flickr for the shots.


From tibs at tibsnjoan.co.uk  Sun May 17 13:10:28 2009
From: tibs at tibsnjoan.co.uk (Tony Ibbs)
Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 12:10:28 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Next Cambridge & East Anglia Meetings: Tue 2nd June 2009
Message-ID: <57C90355-667C-40A0-B349-87C07C6C4318@tibsnjoan.co.uk>

Paraphrasing the message sent to the CamPUG Google Group:

Next meeting will be Tuesday 2nd June 2009, 8pm, at the Carlton Arms.  
It will be a "discussion" meeting, talking in general about testing  
(this didn't happen at the last "talks" meeting because the one talk  
we had expanded rather well).

This is an experiment, as our first "discussion" meeting, and the  
first pub meeting with a theme.

After that is EuroPython 2009, in Birmingham, with the main event  
being Tuesday 30th June through Thursday 2nd July. See http://www.europython.eu/ 
  for more details.

The following CamPUG meeting, on Tuesday 7th July, will also be a pub  
meeting (since I'm assuming we'll all still be recovering after  
EuroPython).

Tibs

From pythonjobs at googlemail.com  Mon May 18 23:13:41 2009
From: pythonjobs at googlemail.com (Python Recruiter)
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 22:13:41 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] Graduate / Junior Developer Wanted
Message-ID: <5b2198d10905181413m6cf6f8dcif6b2eaebbddd2101@mail.gmail.com>

Please find below a job vacancy that i have for a client in the South West
(UK).  This is a great opportunity for a 1st or 2nd jobber.

We are currently seeking a Software Engineers to work on technologies such
as Python and Linux, and modern Agile development processes encompassing
pair programming, unittests, and working with stories.



To qualify we expect all members of the software team to have a top tier
university degree and the following:-



A keen analytical mind, with a sound ability to judge when to focus on the
details and when to think laterally. Good interpersonal skills. This means
being able to work continuously with other developers and talk sensibly with
non-technical staff.



A strong desire to do things right, and not just to get it done. Obviously
this needs to be tempered by the need to accept the compromises such as
time-constraints that exist within a business.


Exposure to object oriented programming in more than one language either
through University or commercially. So long as there is some breadth,
previous experience of Python is almost irrelevant (although a desire to
program in Python would be essential).

If you are interested please send me your CV to either
rakesh at e-recruiter.co.uk or reply to this email address.
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From richardlewis at fastmail.co.uk  Wed May 20 11:52:03 2009
From: richardlewis at fastmail.co.uk (Richard Lewis)
Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 10:52:03 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] BCS Dynamic Languages Evening
Message-ID: <87eiukxfss.wl%richard.lewis@gold.ac.uk>

http://www.bcs.org/server.php?show=ConWebDoc.25940

Apparently Django is a dynamic language.
-- 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Richard Lewis
ISMS, Computing
Goldsmiths, University of London
Tel: +44 (0)20 7078 5134
Skype: richardjlewis
JID: ironchicken at jabber.earth.li
http://www.richard-lewis.me.uk/
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
+-------------------------------------------------------+
|Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments.|
|http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html |
+-------------------------------------------------------+

From howdahcafe at yahoo.com  Thu May 21 11:21:43 2009
From: howdahcafe at yahoo.com (Howadcafe Cafe)
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 02:21:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [python-uk] Invitation Letter Required
Message-ID: <149697.43526.qm@web111105.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

I am a Travel agent from Nigeria... I need agent that I can be ordering invitation letters from for my client.
Pls, only genuine and serious contact should contact us.
Thanks.




      
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From funthyme at gmail.com  Sat May 23 17:42:16 2009
From: funthyme at gmail.com (John Pinner)
Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 16:42:16 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] EuroPython Publicity Materials
Message-ID: <ff8a32f0905230842j19c852acie6e35e31040ed836@mail.gmail.com>

Hello European Pythonistas,

Now we have some more great publicity materials at
wiki.europython.eu/Publicity/ including banners and wallpaper.

* If you are a delegate, use 'I'm going to EuroPython'
* If you are a speaker, use 'I'm speaking at EuroPython'
* If you can't come this year :-( use 'I wish I was going to EuroPython'

put them on your website, blog or whatever, linked to http://europython.eu !

Intrigue your colleagues : use the EuroPython wallpaper on your Desktop !

Publicise EuroPython, come to EuroPython, enjoy yourself at EuroPython 2009 !

Thank you, Steve Hawkes, for these graphics, Thank you, Zachary Voase,
for the EuroPython logo !

See you there, 28th June to 4th July, Birmingham UK

Best wishes,

John
--

From funthyme at gmail.com  Tue May 26 02:18:09 2009
From: funthyme at gmail.com (John Pinner)
Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 01:18:09 +0100
Subject: [python-uk] EuroPython 2009 Talks Schedule
Message-ID: <ff8a32f0905251718t7d342ae2id8ccb9ea84a03307@mail.gmail.com>

The Talks Schedule has been published at http://europython.eu/talks/timetable/

Best wishes,

John
--