[Python-Dev] http://bugs.python.org/issue231540

[Simon de Vlieger]

On 24 July 2010 01:39, Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> On 24/07/2010 00:09, Paul Moore wrote:
>>
>> On 23 July 2010 23:26, Mark Lawrence<breamoreboy at yahoo.co.uk>  wrote:
>>>
>>> Is there any money to pay for the forthcoming 10th birthday party for
>>> this
>>> issue?  Is the OP still alive?
>>
>> I'm not sure the sarcasm helps much. What do you suggest should be
>> done with the request? Nobody has provided a patch, so there's nothing
>> to commit. Closing it as "won't fix" seems unreasonable, as I imagine
>> that should a suitable patch be supplied, it would be accepted.
>>
>> There's no magical means by which such a patch would appear, though.
>> The OP clearly[1] is either not interested enough or doesn't have the
>> skills to provide a patch, and no-one else has stepped up to do so.
>>
>> Note that it's been classified as a feature request, not a bug. So
>> there's nothing wrong, as such, with it remaining unresolved.
>>
>> Paul.
>>
>> [1] I say "clearly" - it may be that he could provide a patch if
>> asked. Maybe it would be worth you contacting him to ask if the issue
>> is still a problem for him, and whether he can assist in resolving it.
>
> Paul,
>
> I'm on the verge of giving up my time because the whole system is a complete
> and utter waste of my time.  I feel quite happy that in my brief tenure I've
> closed 46 issues, but there's so many more that could have been closed, but
> yet again you don't even get the courtesy of a response when there's more in
> the pipeline that could be closed.  I'd quote the issue numbers here and
> now, but I'm just too flaming tired to do so, though a quick count indicates
> I've got 23 ongoing that I'm attempting to sort.
>
> As it happens, I have been having discussions offline in an attempt to shift
> the culture of Python development but I don't believe that anything will
> come out of it.  Let's face it, development is much more interesting than
> bug fixes. And once again, if some stupid idiot volunteer bothers to put in
> a patch to the code and/or the unit test, and it sits and rots for five
> years, is that person likely to come back to Python?  Strangely, some do.
>
> Sorry, I'm off to bed.
>
> Yours feeling most disillusioned with python-dev.
>
> Mark Lawrence.

Mark,

when I read your emails it seems to me as if you have the greatest
concern with improving Python, the language and improving the state of
the bug tracker.

This is a great thing, people like you are much needed. However, I do
seem to notice you try to take a business-like approach here on this
mailinglist. Most people on python-dev are volunteers who (like you)
spend their free time helping and working on Python.

People who work in their free time are less likely to feel obliged to
respond immediately to an issue. They are also less likely to keep
paying attention to the bugs they were assigned.

I think a person like you is needed, someone who weeds through the
rotting bug reports (not the feature requests) and tries to follow up
on them. Is the issue persistent for the user, has it been fixed as
collateral on another fix, etcetera.

However, I think you would get more done if you switched from a
business philosophy to accepting that most people here are volunteers,
don't try to pressure volunteers. Try to do the best *you* can within
the community and let that help the project further.

Oh, and with business philosophy I mean: mails like the one you start
this thread with are interpreted by me as being very pushy, overly
sarcastic and if my project manager at the office sends me an email
like that I know I have to do it right now. I would dislike to be
spoken to like this in an voluntary environment. Do note that I do
understand where your feelings come from.

Regards,

Simon de Vlieger

P.S. a feature day sounds like a great idea!