[Python-Dev] DRAFT: python-dev summary for 2006-08-16 to 2006-08-31
Steven Bethard
steven.bethard at gmail.com
Tue Oct 10 17:36:46 CEST 2006
Here's the draft summary for the second half of August. As always,
comments and corrections are greatly appreciated!
=============
Announcements
=============
---------------------------
Python communnity buildbots
---------------------------
Want to make sure your package works with the latest and greatest
development and release versions of Python? Thanks to Grig Gheorghiu,
you can add your test suite to the `Python community buildbots`_ and
the results of these tests will show up on the `Python buildbot
results page`_.
.. _Python community buildbots: http://www.pybots.org/
.. _Python buildbot results page: http://www.python.org/dev/buildbot/
Contributing thread:
- `link to community buildbot?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068552.html>`__
=========
Summaries
=========
---------------------
Fast subclass testing
---------------------
Neal Norwitz was playing around with a patch that would make subclass
testing for certain builtin types faster by stealing some bits from
tp_flags. Georg Brandl thought this could be useful for exception
handling in Python 3000 when all exceptions must be subclasses of
BaseException. Guido also liked the patch and suggested it be checked
into the `Python 3000 branch`_.
.. _Python 3000 branch: http://svn.python.org/view/python/branches/p3yk/
Contributing thread:
- `Type of range object members
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068267.html>`__
-----------------------------
gcc 4.2 and integer overflows
-----------------------------
Jack Howarth pointed out that intobject.c was using the test ``x < 0
&& x == -x`` to determine if the signed integer ``x`` was the most
negative integer on the platform. However, the C standard says
overflow is undefined, so despite this code actually working on pretty
much all known hardware, `gcc 4.2 assumes that overflow won't happen`_
and so optimizes away the entire clause. David Hopwood and Tim Peters
provided a patch that casts ``x`` to an unsigned long (the
"unnecessary" ``0`` is to make the Microsoft compilers happy)::
``x < 0 && (unsigned long)x == 0-(unsigned long)x``
.. _gcc 4.2 assumes that overflow won't happen: http://bugs.python.org/1545668
Contributing thread:
- `gcc 4.2 exposes signed integer overflows
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068481.html>`__
--------------------------
Python and 64-bit machines
--------------------------
Thomas Heller explained that the _ctypes extension module was still a
fair ways from building on Win64 and had to be removed from the
installer for that platform. There was some discussion about in
general how "experimental" the Win64 build of Python was, but Martin
v. Löwis explained that despite the compiler warnings, Python has been
running mostly fine on Win64 since version 2.4. In fact, Python has
been running in 64-bit machines since 1993 (when Tim Peters ported it
to 64-bit Crays) though of course not with the support that Python 2.5
brought through the Py_ssize_t changes.
Contributing thread:
- `ctypes and win64
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068362.html>`__
------------------------------------------
Guidelines for submitting bugs and patches
------------------------------------------
Brett Cannon put together a rewrite of the `bug and patch
guidelines`_. The bug guidelines now includes sections on how to:
* Get a SourceForge account
* Start a new bug
* Specify the Python version
* Specify special settings for your Python interpreter
* Give sample code to reproduce bug
* Submit!
* Respond to requests from developers
And the patch guidelines now includes sections on how to:
* Read the Developer Intro to understand the scope of your proposed change
* Add the appropriate unit tests
* Add the proper document changes
* Make your code follow the style guidelines
* Generate a patch
* Create a tracker item on SourceForge
* Reference the patch in proper bug reports
* Wait for a developer to contact you
At Chad Whitacre's suggestion, Brett also included a section on the
5-for-1 rule, where some python-devvers have agreed to review your one
patch if you post reviews of five others.
The updates had not been posted to python.org at the time of this summary.
.. _bug and patch guidelines: http://www.python.org/dev/patches/
Contributing threads:
- `draft for bug guidelines
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068462.html>`__
- `draft of patch guidelines
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068463.html>`__
---------------------------------
Corner cases for continue/finally
---------------------------------
Dino Viehland pointed out an odd corner case with ``continue`` in a
``finally`` clause that was causing Python to crash::
for abc in range(10):
try: pass
finally:
try:
continue
except:
pass
The bug was present at least all the way back to Python 2.3. People
tossed a few patches back and forth (and a few tests which broke
various versions of the patches) before `Neal Norwitz posted a patch`_
that people seemed to like.
.. _Neal Norwitz posted a patch: http://bugs.python.org/1542451
Contributing thread:
- `2.4 & 2.5 beta 3 crash
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068306.html>`__
---------------------------------------
PEP 343: decimal module context manager
---------------------------------------
Raymond Hettinger pointed out that the updates to the decimal module
to take advantage of the ``with``-statement differed dramatically from
`PEP 343`_ and were misdocumented in a number of places. Nick Coghlan
explained that the API was a result of the introduction and then later
removal of the ``__context__`` method. After some discussion, Raymond
convinced everyone to change the API from::
with decimal.getcontext().copy().get_manager() as ctx:
...
to the simpler API originally introduced in `PEP 343`::
with decimal.localcontext() as ctx:
...
As a result of the changes needed to fix this API, Anthony Baxter
decided that another release candidate was necessary before Python 2.5
final could be released.
.. _PEP 343: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0343/
Contributing thread:
- `Py2.5 issue: decimal context manager misimplemented, misdesigned,
and misdocumented
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068532.html>`__
----------------------------
Python 2.6 development goals
----------------------------
Guido suggested that since Python 3.0 is now being developed in
parallel with the 2.X trunk, the major work for Python 2.6 should be
in making the transition to Python 3.0 as smooth as possible. This
meant:
* Adding warnings (suppressed by default) for code incompatible with Python 3.0.
* Making all Python 2.X library code as Python 3.0-compatible as possible.
* Converting all unittests to unittest or doctest format.
Brett Cannon suggested adding to this list:
* Improving tests and classifying them better
* Updating and improving the documentation
In general, people seemed to think this was a pretty good approach,
particularly as it would address some of the complaints about the
speed of addition of new features to Python. The discussion then
moved off to the `python-3000 list`_.
.. _python-3000 list: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-3000
Contributing threads:
- `What should the focus for 2.6 be?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068400.html>`__
- `[Python-3000] What should the focus for 2.6 be?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068421.html>`__
-----------------------
Python 2.5, VC8 and PGO
-----------------------
Muguntharaj Subramanian asked about building Python 2.5 with the VC8
compiler. Christopher Baus had recently provided a few patches to get
the VC8 build working better and Kristján V. Jónsson said that he's
working on updating the PCBuild8 directory in the trunk in a number of
ways, including better support for profile-guided optimization (PGO)
builds. He said once he got everything working right, he'd backport to
Python 2.5.
Contributing threads:
- `Failed building 2.5rc1 pythoncore on VC8
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068365.html>`__
- `patch to add socket module project to vc8 solution
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068370.html>`__
- `Error while building 2.5rc1 pythoncore_pgo on VC8
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068545.html>`__
----------------------------------------------
PEP 342: using return instead of GeneratorExit
----------------------------------------------
Igor Bukanov suggested that the GeneratorExit exception introduced by
`PEP 342`_ could be eliminated by replacing it with the semantics of
the ``return`` statement. This would allow code like the following,
which under the GeneratorExit paradigm would execute the ``except``
clause, to only execute the ``finally`` clause::
def gen():
try:
yield 0
except Exception:
print "Unexpected exception!"
finally:
print "Finally"
for i in gen():
print i
break
Phillip J. Eby and others liked the approach, but suggested that it
was much too late in the release process to be making such a major
language change. Guido was open to making a change like this, perhaps
in Python 3.0, but wanted the new generator enhancements to have some
time in the field to see what was really needed here.
.. _PEP 342: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0342/
Contributing thread:
- `GeneratorExit is unintuitive and uneccessary
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068429.html>`__
------------------------------------------
String formatting, __str__ and __unicode__
------------------------------------------
John J Lee noticed that in Python 2.5, the ``%s`` format specifier
calls ``__unicode__`` on objects if their ``__str__`` method returns a
unicode object::
>>> class a(object):
... def __str__(self):
... print '__str__'
... return u'str'
... def __unicode__(self):
... print '__unicode__'
... return u'unicode'
...
>>> '%s%s' % (a(), a())
__str__
__unicode__
__unicode__
u'unicodeunicode'
Nick Coghlan explained that string formatting first tries to build and
return a str object, but starts over if any of the objects to be
formatted by the ``%s`` specifier are unicode. So if a ``__str__``
method is called during string formatting and it returns a unicode
object, Python will decide that the string formatting operation needs
to return a unicode object, and will therefore start over, calling the
``__unicode__`` methods. Nick promised to look into making the
documentation for this a bit clearer.
Contributing thread:
- `String formatting / unicode 2.5 bug?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068393.html>`__
-------------------------
Optimizing global lookups
-------------------------
K.S. Sreeram asked about replacing the current LOAD_GLOBAL dict lookup
with an array indexing along the lines of what is done for local
names. Brett Cannon explained that globals can be altered from the
outside, e.g. ``import mod; mod.name = value``, and thus globals
aren't necessarily known at compile time. Tim Peters pointed out that
a number of PEPs have been written in this area of optimization, with
`PEP 280`_ being a good place to start. Most people were not opposed
to the idea in general, but without an implementation to benchmark,
there wasn't really much to discuss.
.. _PEP 280: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0280/
Contributing thread:
- `Can LOAD_GLOBAL be optimized to a simple array lookup?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068437.html>`__
---------------------
ElementTree and PEP 8
---------------------
Greg Ewing asked about changing the ElementTree names to be more `PEP
8`_ compliant. Being that Python was already in the release candidate
stage for Python 2.5, this was not possible. Even had the issue been
raised earlier, such a change would have been unlikely, as it would
have discouraged people who needed some backward compatibility from
using the version in the stdlib.
.. _PEP 8: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/
Contributing thread:
- `Doc suggestion for Elementtree (for 2.5? a bit late, I know...)
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068503.html>`__
--------
rslice()
--------
Nick Coghlan suggested that since reversing slices could be somewhat
complicated, e.g. ``(stop - 1) % abs(step) : start - 1 : -step``, it
would be helpful to introduce a ``rslice()`` builtin so that this
could be written ``rslice(start, stop, step)``. Most people felt that
this was unnecessary and didn't gain much over using ``reversed()`` on
the sliced sequence.
Contributing thread:
- `Adding an rslice() builtin?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068512.html>`__
----------------------------------
PEP 362: Function Signature Object
----------------------------------
Brett Cannon spent his time at the Google sprint working on `PEP
362`_, which introduces a signature object for functions to describe
what arguments they take. He asked for some feedback on two points:
* Should the signature object be an attribute on all functions or
should it be requested through the inspect module?
* Should the dict returned by ``Signature.bind()`` key by name or by a
tuple of names for argument lists like ``def f((a, b)):``?
He didn't get much of a response.
.. _PEP 362: http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0362/
Contributing threads:
- `[Python-checkins] r51458 - peps/trunk/pep-0000.txt
peps/trunk/pep-0362.txt
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068422.html>`__
- `PEP 362 open issues
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068443.html>`__
----------------------------------------
Warn about mixing tabs and spaces in 2.6
----------------------------------------
Thomas Wouters suggested making the ``-t`` flag the default in Python
2.6. This would make Python always issue warnings if users mixed tabs
and spaces. People generally seemed in favor of the idea.
Contributing thread:
- `Making 'python -t' the default.
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068297.html>`__
---------------------
xrange() and non-ints
---------------------
Neal Norwitz was playing around with some patches that would allow
``xrange`` in Python 2.6 to accept longs or objects with an
``__index__`` method instead of just ints as it does now. He looked at
two Python implementations, a Python-C hybrid implementation and a C
implementation, and found that for his benchmark, the Python-C hybrid
was as good as the C implementation. People suggested that the
benchmark wasn't testing function call overhead well enough, and the
pure C implementation was probably still the way to go.
Contributing thread:
- `xrange accepting non-ints
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068455.html>`__
================
Deferred Threads
================
- `Interest in a Python 2.3.6?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068520.html>`__
- `That library reference, yet again
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068556.html>`__
==================
Previous Summaries
==================
- `no remaining issues blocking 2.5 release
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068269.html>`__
===============
Skipped Threads
===============
- `IDLE patches - bugfix or not?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068283.html>`__
- `TRUNK FREEZE for 2.5c1, 00:00 UTC, Thursday 17th August
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068284.html>`__
- `Weekly Python Patch/Bug Summary
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068296.html>`__
- `Benchmarking the int allocator (Was: Type of range object members)
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068307.html>`__
- `2.5: recently introduced sgmllib regexp bug hangs Python
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068324.html>`__
- `[wwwsearch-general] 2.5: recently introduced sgmllib regexp bug
hangs Python <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068325.html>`__
- `recently introduced sgmllib regexp bughangs Python
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068332.html>`__
- `RELEASED Python 2.5 (release candidate 1)
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068335.html>`__
- `TRUNK IS UNFROZEN, available for 2.6 work if you are so inclined
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068336.html>`__
- `[Python-checkins] TRUNK IS UNFROZEN, available for 2.6 work if you
are so inclined
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068337.html>`__
- `Fixing 2.5 windows buildbots
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068339.html>`__
- `uuid tests failing on Windows
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068341.html>`__
- `Sprints next week at Google
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068348.html>`__
- `__del__ unexpectedly being called twice
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068358.html>`__
- `How does this help? Re: [Python-checkins] r51366 -
python/trunk/Lib/idlelib/NEWS.txt python/trunk/Lib/idlelib/idlever.py
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068366.html>`__
- `One-line fix for urllib2 regression
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068372.html>`__
- `os.spawnlp() missing on Windows in 2.4?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068373.html>`__
- `Questions on unittest behaviour
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068378.html>`__
- `[Python-checkins] How does this help? Re: r51366 -
python/trunk/Lib/idlelib/NEWS.txt python/trunk/Lib/idlelib/idlever.py
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068387.html>`__
- `SSH Key Added
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068394.html>`__
- `uuid module - byte order issue
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068396.html>`__
- `A cast from Py_ssize_t to long
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068407.html>`__
- `Python + Java Integration
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068434.html>`__
- `[4suite] cDomlette deallocation bug?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068435.html>`__
- `[Python-checkins] r51525 - in python/trunk: Lib/test/test_float.py
Objects/floatobject.c
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068445.html>`__
- `for 2.5 issues
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068461.html>`__
- `Need help with test_mutants.py
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068464.html>`__
- `zip -> izip; is __length_hint__ required?
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068473.html>`__
- `Removing anachronisms from logging module
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068476.html>`__
- `distutils patch
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068505.html>`__
- `32-bit and 64-bit python on Solaris
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068528.html>`__
- `Small Py3k task: fix modulefinder.py
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068529.html>`__
- `Windows build slave downtime
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2006-August/068553.html>`__
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