From holger at merlinux.eu  Thu May  1 11:30:34 2014
From: holger at merlinux.eu (holger krekel)
Date: Thu, 1 May 2014 09:30:34 +0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] bugs.pypy.org / end of may deadline
Message-ID: <20140501093033.GT1151@merlinux.eu>

Hi Alex, all,

any news on moving bugs.pypy.org somewhere else?
End of May i plan to move the underlying host
machinery to a new setup at which point it
would cease to work.

best,
holger

From alex.gaynor at gmail.com  Thu May  1 15:31:52 2014
From: alex.gaynor at gmail.com (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Thu, 1 May 2014 06:31:52 -0700
Subject: [pypy-dev] bugs.pypy.org / end of may deadline
In-Reply-To: <20140501093033.GT1151@merlinux.eu>
References: <20140501093033.GT1151@merlinux.eu>
Message-ID: <CAFRnB2U32sW_eR1u6Ejf7w6utmnowKq9Xd+rhLJwyDAwJ1H1ew@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Holger,

I think some people were talking about moving our bugs to use bitbucket
issues, I'm not sure what the status of that is.

Alex


On Thu, May 1, 2014 at 2:30 AM, holger krekel <holger at merlinux.eu> wrote:

> Hi Alex, all,
>
> any news on moving bugs.pypy.org somewhere else?
> End of May i plan to move the underlying host
> machinery to a new setup at which point it
> would cease to work.
>
> best,
> holger
>



-- 
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
"The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
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From matti.picus at gmail.com  Fri May  2 09:03:21 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (Matti Picus)
Date: Fri, 02 May 2014 10:03:21 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] release 2.3 and macos stdlib test failure
Message-ID: <53634339.4070302@gmail.com>

The macos buildbot, names xerses, has a consistent test failure. It
appears to be a configuration error of the buildbot. The owner of the
buldbot has not responded on IRC.

Could someone else build a macos version off the release branch
release-2.3.x that does not exhibit this failure and ships the same
OpenSSL as cpython on macos?
The failing test is in lib-python.2.7.test.test_ssl,
http://buildbot.pypy.org/summary/longrepr?testname=unmodified&builder=pypy-c-jit-macosx-x86-64&build=1396&mod=lib-python.2.7.test.test_ssl

Matti


From sebastian.pawlus at gmail.com  Fri May  2 12:26:45 2014
From: sebastian.pawlus at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Sebastian_Pawlu=C5=9B?=)
Date: Fri, 2 May 2014 12:26:45 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] bugs.pypy.org / end of may deadline
In-Reply-To: <CAFRnB2U32sW_eR1u6Ejf7w6utmnowKq9Xd+rhLJwyDAwJ1H1ew@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20140501093033.GT1151@merlinux.eu>
 <CAFRnB2U32sW_eR1u6Ejf7w6utmnowKq9Xd+rhLJwyDAwJ1H1ew@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAEvNYXKCE7eX5SJDzxR8A=y2dOQvoPgPz8p7hWm0DnLWDsk21A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

We've started some work on this and we have a working script that moves
issues to Bitbucket.
Currently for preview purposes here
https://bitbucket.org/xando/pypy-issues3/issues.

Problem that we had that kind of stopped the whole process of importing,
bitbucket has an option to update a mailing list when the new issue is
crated though it won't update mailing list when the issue is updated it's
annoying because it changes current habits.

Anyways, had a short conversation with Armin and we decided to move
forward. Soon, I will update issues on my account, and he will make a
review. then hit the import button (on bitbucket you can import issues
between accounts)

Thanks




On Thu, May 1, 2014 at 3:31 PM, Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Holger,
>
> I think some people were talking about moving our bugs to use bitbucket
> issues, I'm not sure what the status of that is.
>
> Alex
>
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2014 at 2:30 AM, holger krekel <holger at merlinux.eu> wrote:
>
>> Hi Alex, all,
>>
>> any news on moving bugs.pypy.org somewhere else?
>> End of May i plan to move the underlying host
>> machinery to a new setup at which point it
>> would cease to work.
>>
>> best,
>> holger
>>
>
>
>
> --
> "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right
> to say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
> "The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
> GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
>
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>
>
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From arigo at tunes.org  Fri May  2 12:47:02 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Fri, 2 May 2014 12:47:02 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] bugs.pypy.org / end of may deadline
In-Reply-To: <CAEvNYXKCE7eX5SJDzxR8A=y2dOQvoPgPz8p7hWm0DnLWDsk21A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20140501093033.GT1151@merlinux.eu>
 <CAFRnB2U32sW_eR1u6Ejf7w6utmnowKq9Xd+rhLJwyDAwJ1H1ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEvNYXKCE7eX5SJDzxR8A=y2dOQvoPgPz8p7hWm0DnLWDsk21A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X2xi6YxLeeedSgeQ_5URHdJ33cBSGgqdvqagy+inFhmWQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Xando,

On 2 May 2014 12:26, Sebastian Pawlu? <sebastian.pawlus at gmail.com> wrote:
> Problem that we had that kind of stopped the whole process of importing,
> bitbucket has an option to update a mailing list when the new issue is
> crated though it won't update mailing list when the issue is updated it's
> annoying because it changes current habits.

As I mentioned on IRC, it's possible to (later) hack a bot that,
whenever a new issue is created, goes and click on "watch this issue".
 It would do so with the account we'd use to propagate mails to the
pypy-issue mailing list.

> Anyways, had a short conversation with Armin and we decided to move forward.
> Soon, I will update issues on my account, and he will make a review. then
> hit the import button (on bitbucket you can import issues between accounts)

Thanks for all your work!


A bient?t,
Armin

From holger at merlinux.eu  Fri May  2 12:52:17 2014
From: holger at merlinux.eu (holger krekel)
Date: Fri, 2 May 2014 10:52:17 +0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] bugs.pypy.org / end of may deadline
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X2xi6YxLeeedSgeQ_5URHdJ33cBSGgqdvqagy+inFhmWQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20140501093033.GT1151@merlinux.eu>
 <CAFRnB2U32sW_eR1u6Ejf7w6utmnowKq9Xd+rhLJwyDAwJ1H1ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEvNYXKCE7eX5SJDzxR8A=y2dOQvoPgPz8p7hWm0DnLWDsk21A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMSv6X2xi6YxLeeedSgeQ_5URHdJ33cBSGgqdvqagy+inFhmWQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20140502105217.GG1151@merlinux.eu>

On Fri, May 02, 2014 at 12:47 +0200, Armin Rigo wrote:

> Hi Xando,
> 
> On 2 May 2014 12:26, Sebastian Pawlu? <sebastian.pawlus at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Problem that we had that kind of stopped the whole process of importing,
> > bitbucket has an option to update a mailing list when the new issue is
> > crated though it won't update mailing list when the issue is updated it's
> > annoying because it changes current habits.
> 
> As I mentioned on IRC, it's possible to (later) hack a bot that,
> whenever a new issue is created, goes and click on "watch this issue".
>  It would do so with the account we'd use to propagate mails to the
> pypy-issue mailing list.

that sounds like a generally useful tool.
My tries to get this implemented at bitbucket level did not yield 
results so far (needs more votes i guess):

https://bitbucket.org/site/master/issue/7949/subscribing-to-all-issue-updates-for-a

best,
holger

> > Anyways, had a short conversation with Armin and we decided to move forward.
> > Soon, I will update issues on my account, and he will make a review. then
> > hit the import button (on bitbucket you can import issues between accounts)
> 
> Thanks for all your work!
> 
> 
> A bient?t,
> Armin
> 

From arigo at tunes.org  Fri May  2 13:06:13 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Fri, 2 May 2014 13:06:13 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] bugs.pypy.org / end of may deadline
In-Reply-To: <20140502105217.GG1151@merlinux.eu>
References: <20140501093033.GT1151@merlinux.eu>
 <CAFRnB2U32sW_eR1u6Ejf7w6utmnowKq9Xd+rhLJwyDAwJ1H1ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEvNYXKCE7eX5SJDzxR8A=y2dOQvoPgPz8p7hWm0DnLWDsk21A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMSv6X2xi6YxLeeedSgeQ_5URHdJ33cBSGgqdvqagy+inFhmWQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20140502105217.GG1151@merlinux.eu>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X3mqh+6x2megcwyj3TtEZr9o6gSj53Y3X6_fTxvsq-Vjg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Holger,

On 2 May 2014 12:52, holger krekel <holger at merlinux.eu> wrote:
> that sounds like a generally useful tool.
> My tries to get this implemented at bitbucket level did not yield
> results so far (needs more votes i guess):

Ok, nice to know.  Thanks to the auto-clicking bot hack, it would not
turn out to be an unresolvable blocker, but it's better if we can get
bitbucket's team to acknowledge we'd like this more directly.


A bient?t,

Armin.

From matti.picus at gmail.com  Sun May  4 13:42:37 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (matti picus)
Date: Sun, 4 May 2014 14:42:37 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 alpha release
Message-ID: <CAO8bCgj+RQ_XeqgX=Ua8hUANvJCo9T6O2zQ=TnFMU+eUusGzTA@mail.gmail.com>

You have been chosen by an advanced algorithm to participate in the alpha
release of PyPy 2.3.
Well, not so advanced, but please try it out, I want to release over the
next few days.
The remaining issues are:
- rumors of the python 3.4 ensurepip module appearing in pypy
- the macos build has a test failure in the openssl app-level version test

Please let me know ASAP if your favorite feature is missing
http://buildbot.pypy.org/nightly/release-2.3.x
I would also appreciate help with the release notice, the name "Easier Than
Ever" is as lame as this email but that's the best I could do.
http://doc.pypy.org/en/latest/release-2.3.0.html

Matti
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From rymg19 at gmail.com  Mon May  5 00:00:23 2014
From: rymg19 at gmail.com (Ryan Gonzalez)
Date: Sun, 4 May 2014 17:00:23 -0500
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 alpha release
In-Reply-To: <CAO8bCgj+RQ_XeqgX=Ua8hUANvJCo9T6O2zQ=TnFMU+eUusGzTA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO8bCgj+RQ_XeqgX=Ua8hUANvJCo9T6O2zQ=TnFMU+eUusGzTA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO41-mM8e=hVHv=epSODu2e90B8t24Kr-OBOMw_hXvaE0cf8Gw@mail.gmail.com>

I can't help you with the motto, but I noticed some grammar issues(yeah,
I'm a grammar nerd):

- Under the section labeled "NumPy", there's inconsistent capitalization.
NumPy is written as both "NumPy" and "Numpy". The bullet point first words
are also inconsistent in capitalization.
- Again under NumPy, in the bullet point about `numpy.random`, the comma
should be a semicolon.
- Under Bug Fixes, in the bullet point about the loop-unrolling bug from
HippyVM, it should be "an rpython bug", not "a rpython bug".

On a side note, I though rpython was written as RPython?



On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 6:42 AM, matti picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:

> You have been chosen by an advanced algorithm to participate in the alpha
> release of PyPy 2.3.
> Well, not so advanced, but please try it out, I want to release over the
> next few days.
> The remaining issues are:
> - rumors of the python 3.4 ensurepip module appearing in pypy
> - the macos build has a test failure in the openssl app-level version test
>
> Please let me know ASAP if your favorite feature is missing
> http://buildbot.pypy.org/nightly/release-2.3.x
> I would also appreciate help with the release notice, the name "Easier
> Than Ever" is as lame as this email but that's the best I could do.
> http://doc.pypy.org/en/latest/release-2.3.0.html
>
> Matti
>
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>
>


-- 
Ryan
If anybody ever asks me why I prefer C++ to C, my answer will be simple:
"It's becauseslejfp23(@#Q*(E*EIdc-SEGFAULT. Wait, I don't think that was
nul-terminated."
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From arigo at tunes.org  Mon May  5 09:48:51 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2014 09:48:51 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 alpha release
In-Reply-To: <CAO8bCgj+RQ_XeqgX=Ua8hUANvJCo9T6O2zQ=TnFMU+eUusGzTA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO8bCgj+RQ_XeqgX=Ua8hUANvJCo9T6O2zQ=TnFMU+eUusGzTA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X0eswn16cUbeEGX--xa0Ov7_LsFCCv+R8mVXpF+xE+5hg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Matti,

On 4 May 2014 13:42, matti picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:
> I would also appreciate help with the release notice, the name "Easier Than
> Ever" is as lame as this email but that's the best I could do.

As this release contains mostly bugfixes and not a lot of new features
(outside Numpy), I would suggest the codename "Terrestrial arthropod
trap".


A bient?t,

Armin.

From matti.picus at gmail.com  Mon May  5 11:47:04 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (Matti Picus)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2014 12:47:04 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 alpha release
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X0eswn16cUbeEGX--xa0Ov7_LsFCCv+R8mVXpF+xE+5hg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO8bCgj+RQ_XeqgX=Ua8hUANvJCo9T6O2zQ=TnFMU+eUusGzTA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMSv6X0eswn16cUbeEGX--xa0Ov7_LsFCCv+R8mVXpF+xE+5hg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <53675E18.2070701@gmail.com>

luckily, it is only patented, not trademarked AFAIK
http://www.google.com/patents/US20110289822
Matti


On 05/05/2014 10:48 AM, Armin Rigo wrote:
> Hi Matti,
>
> On 4 May 2014 13:42, matti picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I would also appreciate help with the release notice, the name "Easier Than
>> Ever" is as lame as this email but that's the best I could do.
>
> As this release contains mostly bugfixes and not a lot of new features
> (outside Numpy), I would suggest the codename "Terrestrial arthropod
> trap".
>
>
> A bient?t,
>
> Armin.
>

From rymg19 at gmail.com  Mon May  5 21:08:35 2014
From: rymg19 at gmail.com (Ryan Gonzalez)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2014 14:08:35 -0500
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 alpha release
In-Reply-To: <CAO41-mM8e=hVHv=epSODu2e90B8t24Kr-OBOMw_hXvaE0cf8Gw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO8bCgj+RQ_XeqgX=Ua8hUANvJCo9T6O2zQ=TnFMU+eUusGzTA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO41-mM8e=hVHv=epSODu2e90B8t24Kr-OBOMw_hXvaE0cf8Gw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO41-mNYr1-9PjoafRdhp+h1pvCvVD++RWCZaQmcC3qOgda2EQ@mail.gmail.com>

*reply to self* I noticed you fixed most of the issues I mentioned, but you
forgot about bullet point 3 and the bullet point first word capitalization
under NumPy.


On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 5:00 PM, Ryan Gonzalez <rymg19 at gmail.com> wrote:

> I can't help you with the motto, but I noticed some grammar issues(yeah,
> I'm a grammar nerd):
>
> - Under the section labeled "NumPy", there's inconsistent capitalization.
> NumPy is written as both "NumPy" and "Numpy". The bullet point first words
> are also inconsistent in capitalization.
> - Again under NumPy, in the bullet point about `numpy.random`, the comma
> should be a semicolon.
> - Under Bug Fixes, in the bullet point about the loop-unrolling bug from
> HippyVM, it should be "an rpython bug", not "a rpython bug".
>
> On a side note, I though rpython was written as RPython?
>
>
>
> On Sun, May 4, 2014 at 6:42 AM, matti picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> You have been chosen by an advanced algorithm to participate in the alpha
>> release of PyPy 2.3.
>> Well, not so advanced, but please try it out, I want to release over the
>> next few days.
>> The remaining issues are:
>> - rumors of the python 3.4 ensurepip module appearing in pypy
>> - the macos build has a test failure in the openssl app-level version test
>>
>> Please let me know ASAP if your favorite feature is missing
>> http://buildbot.pypy.org/nightly/release-2.3.x
>> I would also appreciate help with the release notice, the name "Easier
>> Than Ever" is as lame as this email but that's the best I could do.
>> http://doc.pypy.org/en/latest/release-2.3.0.html
>>
>> Matti
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> pypy-dev mailing list
>> pypy-dev at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Ryan
> If anybody ever asks me why I prefer C++ to C, my answer will be simple:
> "It's becauseslejfp23(@#Q*(E*EIdc-SEGFAULT. Wait, I don't think that was
> nul-terminated."
>
>


-- 
Ryan
If anybody ever asks me why I prefer C++ to C, my answer will be simple:
"It's becauseslejfp23(@#Q*(E*EIdc-SEGFAULT. Wait, I don't think that was
nul-terminated."
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From yury at shurup.com  Tue May  6 10:03:28 2014
From: yury at shurup.com (Yury V. Zaytsev)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2014 10:03:28 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Depressing performance on a cross-correlation benchmark
Message-ID: <1399363408.2788.8.camel@newpride>

Hi folks,

Yesterday, I was able to make my simple cross-correlation script to work
with PyPy / NumPy at all with the valuable help of bdk, however, I ended
up being quite disappointed about the performance.

I stripped out everything I could and ended up with something like this:

Python 3:

$ time python corrbench.py 
0
1
2

real 0m2.225s
user 0m1.980s
sys 0m0.240s

PyPy from hg / NumPy from hg (3581f7a906c9+):

$ time python corrbench.py
0
1
2

real 1m2.928s
user 1m2.460s
sys 0m0.270s

What this script does, it basically generates two time series of ~5 000
elements and bins them into 3 000 000 buckets, which it then multiples
element-wise and sums up the result. I expected a huge performance
boost, of course :-)

I think I'll be running this with plain Python for now, but I hope
that's a valuable benchmark for you guys!

-- 
Sincerely yours,
Yury V. Zaytsev

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From info3 at sfew.zyoux.com  Wed May  7 08:51:00 2014
From: info3 at sfew.zyoux.com (GPS tracker with battery life of 1 year)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2014 06:51:00 +0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] =?gb2312?b?R1BTIHRyYWNrZXIgd2l0aCBiYXR0ZXJ5IGxpZmUg?=
	=?gb2312?b?b2YgMSB5ZWFy0+vE+rmyz+3By8/gsuGhow==?=
Message-ID: <089e0117648b8cab2704f8c9c9df@google.com>

GPS tracker with battery life of 1 year


Dear Sir


This is Anna, the sales manager of Redview GPS in China.
HE2000 is a GPS container tracker, with internal battery and low power  
consumption. The internal battery can keep the device working at least 1  
year when report each 1 day. What is more, with internal gyroscope, the  
device can get position even no GPS signal .HE2000 is IP68 waterproof,  
easily fixed by rope.


I would appreciate if you forward this letter to Technical Manager or to  
other expert responsible for technical integration of new products in your  
company, or provide me with his contact for we could discuss all the  
details of our future cooperation.


Your early reply is highly appreciated.


Best Regards


Anna

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/sredir?uname=116591465845358123247&target=ALBUM&id=5981251300947349729&authkey=Gv1sRgCJqGyr2NtZurtAE&invite=CLCg0dYJ&feat=email
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From jake at lwn.net  Thu May  8 02:50:18 2014
From: jake at lwn.net (Jake Edge)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2014 18:50:18 -0600
Subject: [pypy-dev] Heads up,
	remap_file_pages() possibly slated for removal from Linux
Message-ID: <20140507185018.6f8701bf@chukar.edge2.net>


Howdy folks,

I wrote an article a ways back about PyPy and STM
( https://lwn.net/Articles/587923/ ) that talked PyPy using the
remap_file_pages() system call on Linux.  So I thought of you folks
when I read an article in this week's LWN titled "The possible demise
of remap_file_pages()".  It is behind the subscription gate for the
next week, but this link should allow you to read it:

http://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/597632/6f444e69b9931d1a/

If you folks are still using remap_file_pages(), you may want to speak
up in the thread on linux-kernel ...

jake

-- 
Jake Edge - LWN - jake at lwn.net - http://lwn.net

From matti.picus at gmail.com  Thu May  8 13:23:25 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (matti picus)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 14:23:25 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 is ready to release today
Message-ID: <CAO8bCgh4m5-V+4=rAFrm+O4Ue7Labfv3fPRDH6dQ4S1PZxZXKw@mail.gmail.com>

I will try to upload the builds later today and complete the release,
unless someone asks me to delay now.

We still need a volunteer to build for macos since the buildbot has some
problem with the openssl versioning. If anyone can help, please translate
and make sure you can run the lib-python/2.7/test directory with no
failures.

Matti
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From kennylevinsen at gmail.com  Thu May  8 13:45:14 2014
From: kennylevinsen at gmail.com (Kenny Lasse Hoff Levinsen)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 13:45:14 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 is ready to release today
In-Reply-To: <CAO8bCgh4m5-V+4=rAFrm+O4Ue7Labfv3fPRDH6dQ4S1PZxZXKw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO8bCgh4m5-V+4=rAFrm+O4Ue7Labfv3fPRDH6dQ4S1PZxZXKw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8B78BC0C-C4DF-40A6-B256-E81530804EA1@gmail.com>

What version of OpenSSL is required?

Kenny // joushou

> On 08/05/2014, at 13.23, matti picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I will try to upload the builds later today and complete the release, unless someone asks me to delay now.
> 
> We still need a volunteer to build for macos since the buildbot has some problem with the openssl versioning. If anyone can help, please translate and make sure you can run the lib-python/2.7/test directory with no failures.
> 
> Matti
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev

From fijall at gmail.com  Thu May  8 14:01:59 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2014 14:01:59 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy 2.3 is ready to release today
In-Reply-To: <CAO8bCgh4m5-V+4=rAFrm+O4Ue7Labfv3fPRDH6dQ4S1PZxZXKw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO8bCgh4m5-V+4=rAFrm+O4Ue7Labfv3fPRDH6dQ4S1PZxZXKw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxRQyF=z+9=Qnp82KK3FPzUdGCYnnS=C7WM9vGtc5NO3Rw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Matti.

Did the asmgcc hippy issue get fixed?

On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 1:23 PM, matti picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:
> I will try to upload the builds later today and complete the release, unless
> someone asks me to delay now.
>
> We still need a volunteer to build for macos since the buildbot has some
> problem with the openssl versioning. If anyone can help, please translate
> and make sure you can run the lib-python/2.7/test directory with no
> failures.
>
> Matti
>
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>

From matti.picus at gmail.com  Fri May  9 00:30:59 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (Matti Picus)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2014 01:30:59 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] 2.3 release candidates available for download
Message-ID: <536C05A3.5010204@gmail.com>

https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/downloads
Please try them out, let me know if anything seems wrong.
Matti

From dripton at ripton.net  Fri May  9 04:55:20 2014
From: dripton at ripton.net (David Ripton)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2014 22:55:20 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] 2.3 release candidates available for download
In-Reply-To: <536C05A3.5010204@gmail.com>
References: <536C05A3.5010204@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <536C4398.7070103@ripton.net>

On 05/08/2014 06:30 PM, Matti Picus wrote:
> https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/downloads
> Please try them out, let me know if anything seems wrong.

I tried the linux64 version with a game server and a bunch of numeric 
code, and didn't find any bugs or significant performance regressions.

-- 
David Ripton    dripton at ripton.net

From arigo at tunes.org  Fri May  9 05:53:34 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 05:53:34 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] 2.3 release candidates available for download
In-Reply-To: <536C05A3.5010204@gmail.com>
References: <536C05A3.5010204@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X29Fo7qZ9Ld6Q-+SUdbVzGj6B3p=E1TqRCF_RRUXqXimA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Matti,

On 9 May 2014 00:30, Matti Picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:
> https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/downloads
> Please try them out, let me know if anything seems wrong.

Thanks again for doing this release!  Trying out now, but no problem
found so far.


A bient?t,

Armin.

From matti.picus at gmail.com  Fri May  9 07:32:31 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (Matti Picus)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2014 08:32:31 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] 2.3 release candidates available for download
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X29Fo7qZ9Ld6Q-+SUdbVzGj6B3p=E1TqRCF_RRUXqXimA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <536C05A3.5010204@gmail.com>
 <CAMSv6X29Fo7qZ9Ld6Q-+SUdbVzGj6B3p=E1TqRCF_RRUXqXimA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <536C686F.2040808@gmail.com>

Good. I am going to push changes to pypy.org and doc.pypy.org, but will 
need help with the blog, speed.pypy.org, and gettting the word out. Can 
we meet on IRC soon?
Matti

On 9/05/2014 6:53 AM, Armin Rigo wrote:
> Hi Matti,
>
> On 9 May 2014 00:30, Matti Picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:
>> https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/downloads
>> Please try them out, let me know if anything seems wrong.
>
> Thanks again for doing this release!  Trying out now, but no problem
> found so far.
>
>
> A bient?t,
>
> Armin.
>

From arigo at tunes.org  Fri May  9 12:31:38 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2014 12:31:38 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Heads up,
 remap_file_pages() possibly slated for removal from Linux
In-Reply-To: <20140507185018.6f8701bf@chukar.edge2.net>
References: <20140507185018.6f8701bf@chukar.edge2.net>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X0ytCznZ3UxL8XrCaJPsqVcR_JL19dj37RxMNiEP=yZnQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Jake,

On 8 May 2014 02:50, Jake Edge <jake at lwn.net> wrote:
> http://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/597632/6f444e69b9931d1a/
>
> If you folks are still using remap_file_pages(), you may want to speak
> up in the thread on linux-kernel ...

Thank you for the notice!  I've explained the PyPy situation, and it
looks now like they're going to replace remap_file_pages() with an
emulation based on mmap() and, I hope, take care of the issue that the
mmap() solution is limited to 65536 by default (i.e., increase the
default limit).  This would be good enough for PyPy, where the calls
to remap_file_pages() are themselves not highly performance-critical.


A bient?t,

Armin.

From xhaskx at gmail.com  Sat May 10 23:35:47 2014
From: xhaskx at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?0JDQu9C10LrRgdCw0L3QtNGAINCa0LjRgNCw0L3QvtCy?=)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 00:35:47 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] cppyy - garbage collecting of foreign objects
Message-ID: <CANG+hL3=DqTJq03n608FwNjKM1UUHmSFVrvhuBxALZUGMu3adg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all!

I have a large C++ application and I want to use functions/classes from it
in pypy.
I use cppyy.
My application has own memory managing policy (references counting).
That's why I need to *catch* moment when pypy is deleting foreign C++
objects - all of it should be "released" before pypy exits.

Can anybody advice a solution in my case? Some using of gc module or some
other?
Also I tried to change __del__ method of W_CPPInstance in
.../pypy/module/cppyy/interp_cppyy.py. Is it right way?

Sorry for my bad english, I hope you can understand me :)

---
Best regards,
Alexander
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From yeomanyaacov at gmail.com  Sun May 11 17:04:16 2014
From: yeomanyaacov at gmail.com (Yaacov Finkelman)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 11:04:16 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] pypy IDLE on windows
Message-ID: <CAGBU8t4FYWWWX9ya=aRkO16OxUYsxa3hh+M8mO=g_4Es08NHBw@mail.gmail.com>

Just installed pypy 2.3 on windows 7 32bit.

C:\pypy\pypy.exe -i C:\pypy\lib-python\2.7\idlelib\idle.py

reterns:

** IDLE can't import Tkinter.  Your Python may not be configured for Tk. **
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "app_main.py", line 661, in run_command_line
  File "app_main.py", line 89, in run_toplevel
  File "app_main.py", line 64, in handle_sys_exit
SystemExit: 1
>>>>

any advice?

From arigo at tunes.org  Sun May 11 19:07:53 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 19:07:53 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] pypy IDLE on windows
In-Reply-To: <CAGBU8t4FYWWWX9ya=aRkO16OxUYsxa3hh+M8mO=g_4Es08NHBw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGBU8t4FYWWWX9ya=aRkO16OxUYsxa3hh+M8mO=g_4Es08NHBw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X0fG_4TbUNXNzkQ1ZfBpkwmxSV_oHRujMFk4ir2SyCsnA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Yaacov,

On 11 May 2014 17:04, Yaacov Finkelman <yeomanyaacov at gmail.com> wrote:
> C:\pypy\pypy.exe -i C:\pypy\lib-python\2.7\idlelib\idle.py
> ** IDLE can't import Tkinter.  Your Python may not be configured for Tk. **

This is a regression in PyPy 2.3.  It's due to an unfortunate
combination of issues around the importing mechanism.  It will be
fixed in 2.3.1.  In the meantime, one way to fix it is to add "import
struct" as the first line of "idle.py" (duh!).


A bient?t,

Armin.

From matti.picus at gmail.com  Sun May 11 21:49:34 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (Matti Picus)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 22:49:34 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] 2.3.1 release schedule (was RE: pypy IDLE on windows)
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X0fG_4TbUNXNzkQ1ZfBpkwmxSV_oHRujMFk4ir2SyCsnA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGBU8t4FYWWWX9ya=aRkO16OxUYsxa3hh+M8mO=g_4Es08NHBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMSv6X0fG_4TbUNXNzkQ1ZfBpkwmxSV_oHRujMFk4ir2SyCsnA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <536FD44E.2060601@gmail.com>

When should we release 2.3.1?
Matti

On 11/05/2014 8:07 PM, Armin Rigo wrote:
> Hi Yaacov,
>
> On 11 May 2014 17:04, Yaacov Finkelman <yeomanyaacov at gmail.com> wrote:
>> C:\pypy\pypy.exe -i C:\pypy\lib-python\2.7\idlelib\idle.py
>> ** IDLE can't import Tkinter.  Your Python may not be configured for Tk. **
>
> This is a regression in PyPy 2.3.  It's due to an unfortunate
> combination of issues around the importing mechanism.  It will be
> fixed in 2.3.1.  In the meantime, one way to fix it is to add "import
> struct" as the first line of "idle.py" (duh!).
>
>
> A bient?t,
>
> Armin.
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>

From alex.gaynor at gmail.com  Sun May 11 21:51:05 2014
From: alex.gaynor at gmail.com (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 12:51:05 -0700
Subject: [pypy-dev] 2.3.1 release schedule (was RE: pypy IDLE on windows)
In-Reply-To: <536FD44E.2060601@gmail.com>
References: <CAGBU8t4FYWWWX9ya=aRkO16OxUYsxa3hh+M8mO=g_4Es08NHBw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMSv6X0fG_4TbUNXNzkQ1ZfBpkwmxSV_oHRujMFk4ir2SyCsnA@mail.gmail.com>
 <536FD44E.2060601@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFRnB2Wfe3v0CPXUkQ8wH7WBTzSOiuxPy73WdzSGkxZLsC3CxQ@mail.gmail.com>

We just had an issue report about a compilation error with GCC 4.9, I think
probably we want to include that in a 2.3.1 (since it'll be an issue for
downstream people like distros who want to upgrade us and gcc at the same
time).

Alex


On Sun, May 11, 2014 at 12:49 PM, Matti Picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:

> When should we release 2.3.1?
> Matti
>
> On 11/05/2014 8:07 PM, Armin Rigo wrote:
>
>> Hi Yaacov,
>>
>> On 11 May 2014 17:04, Yaacov Finkelman <yeomanyaacov at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> C:\pypy\pypy.exe -i C:\pypy\lib-python\2.7\idlelib\idle.py
>>> ** IDLE can't import Tkinter.  Your Python may not be configured for Tk.
>>> **
>>>
>>
>> This is a regression in PyPy 2.3.  It's due to an unfortunate
>> combination of issues around the importing mechanism.  It will be
>> fixed in 2.3.1.  In the meantime, one way to fix it is to add "import
>> struct" as the first line of "idle.py" (duh!).
>>
>>
>> A bient?t,
>>
>> Armin.
>> _______________________________________________
>> pypy-dev mailing list
>> pypy-dev at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>



-- 
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
"The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
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From memotype at gmail.com  Sun May 11 21:55:44 2014
From: memotype at gmail.com (Isaac Freeman)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 15:55:44 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] ZipImportError using setuptools?
Message-ID: <CAL6syXDd_VOs1ZNd1JJ-X=ebB83f4n8w+32Vz0AqG_O0JbcXmQ@mail.gmail.com>

I have run across a strange error that only happens with Pypy when
installing an egg as a zip package. The same does not happen with CPython.
Is this a bug? Can anyone help me troubleshoot this?

http://dpaste.com/1MYPK9D/

-- 
Isaac Freeman
memotype (at) gmail.com

"Few people are capable of expressing with
equanimity opinions that differ from the
prejudices of their social environment. Most
people are even incapable of forming such
opinions." -- Albert Einstein
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From arigo at tunes.org  Mon May 12 12:04:55 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 12:04:55 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Virtualenv
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

We talked about making pip and virtualenv available by default on
PyPy.  I think it's a good idea but we never did it.  If anyone feels
like doing it and proposing it as a pull request, it would be even
greater!


A bient?t,

Armin.

From yury at shurup.com  Mon May 12 12:14:46 2014
From: yury at shurup.com (Yury V. Zaytsev)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 12:14:46 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Virtualenv
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1399889686.2893.8.camel@newpride>

On Mon, 2014-05-12 at 12:04 +0200, Armin Rigo wrote:
> We talked about making pip and virtualenv available by default on
> PyPy.  I think it's a good idea but we never did it. 

That's a brilliant idea, would make our lives so much easier...

-- 
Sincerely yours,
Yury V. Zaytsev



From donald at stufft.io  Mon May 12 18:39:58 2014
From: donald at stufft.io (Donald Stufft)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 12:39:58 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] Virtualenv
In-Reply-To: <1399889686.2893.8.camel@newpride>
References: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>
 <1399889686.2893.8.camel@newpride>
Message-ID: <293496D9-675B-463B-BD52-7E771537674A@stufft.io>

I have a half written patch to backport ensurepip to PyPy, I just got confused
trying to test it and task switched to cover some other things.

As far as virtualenv goes, instead of virtualenv I?d much rather that you backport
the venv module. It does require some interpreter changes but I don?t think
they are particularly hard.

On May 12, 2014, at 6:14 AM, Yury V. Zaytsev <yury at shurup.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 2014-05-12 at 12:04 +0200, Armin Rigo wrote:
>> We talked about making pip and virtualenv available by default on
>> PyPy.  I think it's a good idea but we never did it. 
> 
> That's a brilliant idea, would make our lives so much easier...
> 
> -- 
> Sincerely yours,
> Yury V. Zaytsev
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev


-----------------
Donald Stufft
PGP: 0x6E3CBCE93372DCFA // 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA

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From wlavrijsen at lbl.gov  Mon May 12 20:55:39 2014
From: wlavrijsen at lbl.gov (wlavrijsen at lbl.gov)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 11:55:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [pypy-dev] cppyy - garbage collecting of foreign objects
In-Reply-To: <CANG+hL3=DqTJq03n608FwNjKM1UUHmSFVrvhuBxALZUGMu3adg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANG+hL3=DqTJq03n608FwNjKM1UUHmSFVrvhuBxALZUGMu3adg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.1405121143280.2514@pc3-wlav.lbl.gov>

Hi Alexander,

> My application has own memory managing policy (references counting).

are the reference counts applied to the objects directly or through smart
pointers? And if the latter, are the smart pointers what you expose through
cppyy?

> That's why I need to *catch* moment when pypy is deleting foreign C++
> objects - all of it should be "released" before pypy exits.

Exposing smart pointers would do that, so would a common base class. Does
either one apply?

> Can anybody advice a solution in my case? Some using of gc module or some
> other?
> Also I tried to change __del__ method of W_CPPInstance in
> .../pypy/module/cppyy/interp_cppyy.py. Is it right way?

Depends on what you are trying to achieve there. Do you want to call a
global function from __del__?

What is the life time of the objects? It is also possible, if you just
want to call a global function, to not manage the lifetimes on the python
side, and explicitly call a cleanup from time to time? (You can manage
life times with _python_owns and call __destruct__ explicitly (PyPy2.3)
to destroy the C++-side only).

Best regards,
            Wim
-- 
WLavrijsen at lbl.gov    --    +1 (510) 486 6411    --    www.lavrijsen.net

From arigo at tunes.org  Tue May 13 09:54:57 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 09:54:57 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Virtualenv
In-Reply-To: <293496D9-675B-463B-BD52-7E771537674A@stufft.io>
References: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>
 <1399889686.2893.8.camel@newpride>
 <293496D9-675B-463B-BD52-7E771537674A@stufft.io>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X0S_rbgum-0DZ-DNyZ7LgTGvfCmZ7Guzsh9T1mGbNxWfA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Donald,

On 12 May 2014 18:39, Donald Stufft <donald at stufft.io> wrote:
> I have a half written patch to backport ensurepip to PyPy, I just got confused
> trying to test it and task switched to cover some other things.
>
> As far as virtualenv goes, instead of virtualenv I?d much rather that you backport
> the venv module. It does require some interpreter changes but I don?t think
> they are particularly hard.

I am myself not following closely these various packaging schemes, but
I do know that with any Python or PyPy installation, I need a working
pip and often a virtualenv.  So from my own point of view, these two
are the most used pieces of software I need from a PyPy installation
--- the ones I have to worry about and reinstall every time, and every
time I need to google around for how this is done exactly.  Anything
else can be installed from there.  So that's why I'd suggest we
include these two exactly.  In particular, I don't see "ensurepip" as
intrinsically solving anything for PyPy (here talking about the 2.7
version only) --- most people just need "pip".  Same about virtualenv
--- sorry, it's the standard, and I don't see the point of adding a
different one (again, talking about the 2.7 version only.  If CPython
3.x decides to include ensurepip or whatever, we can follow suit on
PyPy3).


A bient?t,

Armin.

From donald at stufft.io  Tue May 13 13:18:03 2014
From: donald at stufft.io (Donald Stufft)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 07:18:03 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] Virtualenv
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X0S_rbgum-0DZ-DNyZ7LgTGvfCmZ7Guzsh9T1mGbNxWfA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>
 <1399889686.2893.8.camel@newpride>
 <293496D9-675B-463B-BD52-7E771537674A@stufft.io>
 <CAMSv6X0S_rbgum-0DZ-DNyZ7LgTGvfCmZ7Guzsh9T1mGbNxWfA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6C027109-48E8-4CE3-9429-B40B4D5CC376@stufft.io>


On May 13, 2014, at 3:54 AM, Armin Rigo <arigo at tunes.org> wrote:

> Hi Donald,
> 
> On 12 May 2014 18:39, Donald Stufft <donald at stufft.io> wrote:
>> I have a half written patch to backport ensurepip to PyPy, I just got confused
>> trying to test it and task switched to cover some other things.
>> 
>> As far as virtualenv goes, instead of virtualenv I?d much rather that you backport
>> the venv module. It does require some interpreter changes but I don?t think
>> they are particularly hard.
> 
> I am myself not following closely these various packaging schemes, but
> I do know that with any Python or PyPy installation, I need a working
> pip and often a virtualenv.  So from my own point of view, these two
> are the most used pieces of software I need from a PyPy installation
> --- the ones I have to worry about and reinstall every time, and every
> time I need to google around for how this is done exactly.  Anything
> else can be installed from there.  So that's why I'd suggest we
> include these two exactly.  In particular, I don't see "ensurepip" as
> intrinsically solving anything for PyPy (here talking about the 2.7
> version only) --- most people just need "pip".  Same about virtualenv
> --- sorry, it's the standard, and I don't see the point of adding a
> different one (again, talking about the 2.7 version only.  If CPython
> 3.x decides to include ensurepip or whatever, we can follow suit on
> PyPy3).

So FWIW CPython has already included ensurepip in 3.4.

So currently PyPy ships with a few preinstalled things (cffi, greenlet,
readline) which are shipped inside of lib_pypy. One of the key requirements of
PEP453 (which added the ensurepip module to 3.4) was that it remained possible
to independently upgrade pip. However if PyPy ships pip installed into lib_pypy
like the other things it ships with then pip will not be able to be
independently upgraded and people will be stuck with whatever version of pip
was available when PyPy shipped.

The idea behind ensurepip is that instead of shipping pip, you ship a bootstrap
which will install pip for you. This would mean that in order to install pip
into a PyPy site-packages all you would need to do is run ``pypy -m ensurepip``
and it would take care of the rest for you. CPython, by default, runs this
as part of ``make install`` and ``make altinstall`` and also as part of the
Windows and OSX installers. I'm not sure if PyPy has a similar place that
executes during the "install" phase as I generally use pyenv or homebrew or
a package manager to install PyPy. I would not be opposed to including pip
directly preinstalled into PyPy but it *must* preserve the ability to
independently upgrade pip however I think you still want ensurepip for the
venv module.

The reason I'm asking for a backport of the venv module instead of virtualenv
itself is simple. The venv module works way better and without massive platform
specific hacks. This is because it includes support within the intepreter for
a virtual environment and doesn't rely on monkeypatching and obscure Python
startup semantics in order to make it function. I've currently got a branch of
virtualenv that I'm working on where virtualenv itself will utilize the
isolation provided by the standardlib venv module (when it's available) and
only fall back to the hacks which work on the earlier versions. 

In Python 3.3 the venv module did not include pip inside of a freshly created
environment which limited it's usefulness to end users however if PyPy chooses
to ship pip (and virtualenv) directly then it doesn't specifically need
ensurepip and it's venv module could function similarly to Python 3.3's because
that is all the virtualenv code will need in order to support a much cleaner
isolation.

Part of the way that the virtualenv module works is that you don't need to have
it installed into a particular python in order to create an environment for it.
So if you have virtualenv installed with CPython 2.x or 3.x and you also have
PyPy installed on your system you can create a PyPy environment without
installing anything into it by running ``virtualenv -p pypy myenv``. However
in order to get the support for the more stable isolation provided by the venv
module, that will need to be part of PyPy.

I don't really feel strongly one way or the other if PyPy should or shouldn't
ship with virtualenv (given that it doesn't generally need installed) however
if it does it should also be independently upgradeable such as pip should be
and ideally PyPy will still have the venv module backported so that future
versions of virtualenv can utilize it for better isolation techniques.

-----------------
Donald Stufft
PGP: 0x6E3CBCE93372DCFA // 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA

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From alex.gaynor at gmail.com  Tue May 13 14:29:19 2014
From: alex.gaynor at gmail.com (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 08:29:19 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
Message-ID: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

Right now PyPy binaries for releases are hosted on bitbucket.
Unfortunately, recently bitbucket started rate limiting downloads of files,
and I've seen many issues in downloading them, both myself, and from user
bug reports.

I'd like to move these to be hosted somewhere else, I figured the easiest
would be to reuse the PSF infrastructure (hence the CC of that list). What
do folks think? PyPy folks, does this work for everyone? Infra folks, any
problems with this?

Cheers,
Alex

-- 
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
"The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
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From fijall at gmail.com  Tue May 13 17:05:45 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 17:05:45 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxRTbkTiPwkqSZ+jGj6YHKOxKQjv-+68Rxp-XXoQuO=JUg@mail.gmail.com>

PSF infrastructure is a hit and miss. Sometimes it works, sometimes it
doesn't and it takes forever to sort the stuff out. We're still
waiting for a VM for codespeed2 for example. I would rather host it
somewhere we have more control.

On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Right now PyPy binaries for releases are hosted on bitbucket. Unfortunately,
> recently bitbucket started rate limiting downloads of files, and I've seen
> many issues in downloading them, both myself, and from user bug reports.
>
> I'd like to move these to be hosted somewhere else, I figured the easiest
> would be to reuse the PSF infrastructure (hence the CC of that list). What
> do folks think? PyPy folks, does this work for everyone? Infra folks, any
> problems with this?
>
> Cheers,
> Alex
>
> --
> "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
> say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
> "The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
> GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
>
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>

From yury at shurup.com  Tue May 13 17:17:08 2014
From: yury at shurup.com (Yury V. Zaytsev)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 17:17:08 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <CAK5idxRTbkTiPwkqSZ+jGj6YHKOxKQjv-+68Rxp-XXoQuO=JUg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxRTbkTiPwkqSZ+jGj6YHKOxKQjv-+68Rxp-XXoQuO=JUg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1399994228.2811.85.camel@newpride>

On Tue, 2014-05-13 at 17:05 +0200, Maciej Fijalkowski wrote:
> I would rather host it somewhere we have more control. 

If it's all about downloads, can't you just get an account on the OSU
OSL FTP CDN directly (i.e. not going through PSF infra)?

We're using it for Midnight Commander at the moment, and not only their
service is very excellent, but also getting an account was a rather
unbureaucratic procedure...

-- 
Sincerely yours,
Yury V. Zaytsev



From memotype at gmail.com  Tue May 13 17:25:47 2014
From: memotype at gmail.com (Isaac Freeman)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 11:25:47 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] ZipImportError using setuptools?
In-Reply-To: <CAL6syXDd_VOs1ZNd1JJ-X=ebB83f4n8w+32Vz0AqG_O0JbcXmQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAL6syXDd_VOs1ZNd1JJ-X=ebB83f4n8w+32Vz0AqG_O0JbcXmQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAL6syXBz02edG2HhFeoAbQQZtKo41Rp=KYv3_ofrYYPZP29_tA@mail.gmail.com>

Looks like it might just be this (very old) bug.

https://bugs.pypy.org/issue725
On May 11, 2014 3:55 PM, "Isaac Freeman" <memotype at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> I have run across a strange error that only happens with Pypy when
> installing an egg as a zip package. The same does not happen with CPython.
> Is this a bug? Can anyone help me troubleshoot this?
>
> http://dpaste.com/1MYPK9D/
>
> --
> Isaac Freeman
> memotype (at) gmail.com
>
> "Few people are capable of expressing with
> equanimity opinions that differ from the
> prejudices of their social environment. Most
> people are even incapable of forming such
> opinions." -- Albert Einstein
>
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From fijall at gmail.com  Tue May 13 17:33:04 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 17:33:04 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <1399994228.2811.85.camel@newpride>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxRTbkTiPwkqSZ+jGj6YHKOxKQjv-+68Rxp-XXoQuO=JUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <1399994228.2811.85.camel@newpride>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxTNGjhLr7D-NZ7dZn0cfahQ+hWDbniq8jYDDS-bZ91GBw@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 5:17 PM, Yury V. Zaytsev <yury at shurup.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 2014-05-13 at 17:05 +0200, Maciej Fijalkowski wrote:
>> I would rather host it somewhere we have more control.
>
> If it's all about downloads, can't you just get an account on the OSU
> OSL FTP CDN directly (i.e. not going through PSF infra)?
>
> We're using it for Midnight Commander at the moment, and not only their
> service is very excellent, but also getting an account was a rather
> unbureaucratic procedure...

is it really FTP though? I would rather like to avoid that.

From yury at shurup.com  Tue May 13 17:37:21 2014
From: yury at shurup.com (Yury V. Zaytsev)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 17:37:21 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <CAK5idxTNGjhLr7D-NZ7dZn0cfahQ+hWDbniq8jYDDS-bZ91GBw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxRTbkTiPwkqSZ+jGj6YHKOxKQjv-+68Rxp-XXoQuO=JUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <1399994228.2811.85.camel@newpride>
 <CAK5idxTNGjhLr7D-NZ7dZn0cfahQ+hWDbniq8jYDDS-bZ91GBw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1399995441.2811.88.camel@newpride>

On Tue, 2014-05-13 at 17:33 +0200, Maciej Fijalkowski wrote:
> 
> 
> is it really FTP though? I would rather like to avoid that. 

The uploading of files is done via shell, the distribution is via FTP
and HTTP. It's called an "FTP cluster", but from what I understand, they
mean by that "FTP and HTTP":

http://osuosl.org/services/hosting/details

Is this what you were asking?

-- 
Sincerely yours,
Yury V. Zaytsev



From donald at stufft.io  Tue May 13 17:39:12 2014
From: donald at stufft.io (Donald Stufft)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 11:39:12 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <CAK5idxRTbkTiPwkqSZ+jGj6YHKOxKQjv-+68Rxp-XXoQuO=JUg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxRTbkTiPwkqSZ+jGj6YHKOxKQjv-+68Rxp-XXoQuO=JUg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1A630268-DEB3-4375-9455-10B90E237E08@stufft.io>

FWIW the new infra stuff is on Rackspace so a lot of the OSUOSL problems
shouldn't exist anymore. The existing stuff is still on OUSOSL.

I don't have anything in my email about codespeed2 so I have no idea about
that.

On May 13, 2014, at 11:05 AM, Maciej Fijalkowski <fijall at gmail.com> wrote:

> PSF infrastructure is a hit and miss. Sometimes it works, sometimes it
> doesn't and it takes forever to sort the stuff out. We're still
> waiting for a VM for codespeed2 for example. I would rather host it
> somewhere we have more control.
> 
> On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Right now PyPy binaries for releases are hosted on bitbucket. Unfortunately,
>> recently bitbucket started rate limiting downloads of files, and I've seen
>> many issues in downloading them, both myself, and from user bug reports.
>> 
>> I'd like to move these to be hosted somewhere else, I figured the easiest
>> would be to reuse the PSF infrastructure (hence the CC of that list). What
>> do folks think? PyPy folks, does this work for everyone? Infra folks, any
>> problems with this?
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Alex
>> 
>> --
>> "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
>> say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
>> "The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
>> GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> pypy-dev mailing list
>> pypy-dev at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev


-----------------
Donald Stufft
PGP: 0x6E3CBCE93372DCFA // 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA

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From rymg19 at gmail.com  Tue May 13 20:13:27 2014
From: rymg19 at gmail.com (Ryan Gonzalez)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 13:13:27 -0500
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO41-mO4ZOwm=Qy-GM42KhfahdY=u-5fVfBLx4AgGR20w8C=Vg@mail.gmail.com>

Just out of curiosity, what about SourceForge? I know that several major
projects such as MinGW use them. Their download hosting is great; I've used
them before.


On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 7:29 AM, Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Right now PyPy binaries for releases are hosted on bitbucket.
> Unfortunately, recently bitbucket started rate limiting downloads of files,
> and I've seen many issues in downloading them, both myself, and from user
> bug reports.
>
> I'd like to move these to be hosted somewhere else, I figured the easiest
> would be to reuse the PSF infrastructure (hence the CC of that list). What
> do folks think? PyPy folks, does this work for everyone? Infra folks, any
> problems with this?
>
> Cheers,
> Alex
>
> --
> "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right
> to say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
> "The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
> GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
>
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>
>


-- 
Ryan
If anybody ever asks me why I prefer C++ to C, my answer will be simple:
"It's becauseslejfp23(@#Q*(E*EIdc-SEGFAULT. Wait, I don't think that was
nul-terminated."
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From arigo at tunes.org  Tue May 13 20:47:10 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 20:47:10 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] ZipImportError using setuptools?
In-Reply-To: <CAL6syXBz02edG2HhFeoAbQQZtKo41Rp=KYv3_ofrYYPZP29_tA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAL6syXDd_VOs1ZNd1JJ-X=ebB83f4n8w+32Vz0AqG_O0JbcXmQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAL6syXBz02edG2HhFeoAbQQZtKo41Rp=KYv3_ofrYYPZP29_tA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X0YEdsgBTwr5iJYVcYsvHvru_nE6HsAcrx5UcxpMEa_fA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Isaac,

On 13 May 2014 17:25, Isaac Freeman <memotype at gmail.com> wrote:
> Looks like it might just be this (very old) bug.
>
> https://bugs.pypy.org/issue725

Reading my comment from three years ago, it seems to be a known use
case with a failing test, easy to fix.  It looks like a worrying trend
if, in three years, no-one could be bothered to provide a fix for it.
I guess it just shows general disinterest from Windows hackers in
PyPy, similar to the fact that we try for years to raise interest for
Win64 in each and every release announcement, with a null success rate
so far.  Sorry, we don't know how to change that fact.


A bient?t,

Armin.

From arigo at tunes.org  Tue May 13 20:58:34 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 20:58:34 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Virtualenv
In-Reply-To: <6C027109-48E8-4CE3-9429-B40B4D5CC376@stufft.io>
References: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>
 <1399889686.2893.8.camel@newpride>
 <293496D9-675B-463B-BD52-7E771537674A@stufft.io>
 <CAMSv6X0S_rbgum-0DZ-DNyZ7LgTGvfCmZ7Guzsh9T1mGbNxWfA@mail.gmail.com>
 <6C027109-48E8-4CE3-9429-B40B4D5CC376@stufft.io>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X3zvK-VXWqnnoGBQ3fbEmmCgzo83Q9prSimHzUQkAcV_Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Donald,

On 13 May 2014 13:18, Donald Stufft <donald at stufft.io> wrote:
> The idea behind ensurepip is that instead of shipping pip, you ship a bootstrap
> which will install pip for you.

I see why you'd want this in CPython 3.x, but the reasons for
supporting this are much less clear to me with PyPy2.  I doubt that
pip would suddenly require an urgent upgrade of its installed version,
which cannot wait until the next official PyPy release.  But I don't
see the drawback of having ensurepip available as well, so I guess we
can have both that and a pre-installed pip.

About virtualenv, if it's as simple as providing one standard script
in our binaries for the user that doesn't have it already installed
for CPython from his Linux distribution (Windows users, looking at
you)... then I really don't see why we shouldn't.


A bient?t,

Armin.

From donald at stufft.io  Tue May 13 21:30:00 2014
From: donald at stufft.io (Donald Stufft)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 15:30:00 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] Virtualenv
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X3zvK-VXWqnnoGBQ3fbEmmCgzo83Q9prSimHzUQkAcV_Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMSv6X1Psk-sp4K80dS1TKbxY3xjtA3dbFfDj2kAm2Ht7W_dwg@mail.gmail.com>
 <1399889686.2893.8.camel@newpride>
 <293496D9-675B-463B-BD52-7E771537674A@stufft.io>
 <CAMSv6X0S_rbgum-0DZ-DNyZ7LgTGvfCmZ7Guzsh9T1mGbNxWfA@mail.gmail.com>
 <6C027109-48E8-4CE3-9429-B40B4D5CC376@stufft.io>
 <CAMSv6X3zvK-VXWqnnoGBQ3fbEmmCgzo83Q9prSimHzUQkAcV_Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <F4167B86-8C57-4865-B6D1-ED7A0919BEAE@stufft.io>


On May 13, 2014, at 2:58 PM, Armin Rigo <arigo at tunes.org> wrote:

> Hi Donald,
> 
> On 13 May 2014 13:18, Donald Stufft <donald at stufft.io> wrote:
>> The idea behind ensurepip is that instead of shipping pip, you ship a bootstrap
>> which will install pip for you.
> 
> I see why you'd want this in CPython 3.x, but the reasons for
> supporting this are much less clear to me with PyPy2.  I doubt that
> pip would suddenly require an urgent upgrade of its installed version,
> which cannot wait until the next official PyPy release.  But I don't
> see the drawback of having ensurepip available as well, so I guess we
> can have both that and a pre-installed pip.

Because released versions stick around for a long time. 2.2.1 ships with
Ubuntu 14.04, people are going to use that version for a long time.

And actually If you don?t keep it independently upgradeable then testing
pip on PyPy will become a lot more difficult. 

> 
> About virtualenv, if it's as simple as providing one standard script
> in our binaries for the user that doesn't have it already installed
> for CPython from his Linux distribution (Windows users, looking at
> you)... then I really don't see why we shouldn't.
> 
> 
> A bient?t,
> 
> Armin.


-----------------
Donald Stufft
PGP: 0x6E3CBCE93372DCFA // 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA

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From memotype at gmail.com  Wed May 14 00:16:04 2014
From: memotype at gmail.com (Isaac Freeman)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 18:16:04 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] ZipImportError using setuptools?
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X0YEdsgBTwr5iJYVcYsvHvru_nE6HsAcrx5UcxpMEa_fA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAL6syXDd_VOs1ZNd1JJ-X=ebB83f4n8w+32Vz0AqG_O0JbcXmQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAL6syXBz02edG2HhFeoAbQQZtKo41Rp=KYv3_ofrYYPZP29_tA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMSv6X0YEdsgBTwr5iJYVcYsvHvru_nE6HsAcrx5UcxpMEa_fA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAL6syXDTnGx8VOTxhJoXnxUX_ivqBoW3QyNYmtHWNfJnV8qnug@mail.gmail.com>

I guess the difference is I'm getting this issue on Linux. I didn't notice
all the reports on that thread are for Windows.
On May 13, 2014 2:47 PM, "Armin Rigo" <arigo at tunes.org> wrote:

> Hi Isaac,
>
> On 13 May 2014 17:25, Isaac Freeman <memotype at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Looks like it might just be this (very old) bug.
> >
> > https://bugs.pypy.org/issue725
>
> Reading my comment from three years ago, it seems to be a known use
> case with a failing test, easy to fix.  It looks like a worrying trend
> if, in three years, no-one could be bothered to provide a fix for it.
> I guess it just shows general disinterest from Windows hackers in
> PyPy, similar to the fact that we try for years to raise interest for
> Win64 in each and every release announcement, with a null success rate
> so far.  Sorry, we don't know how to change that fact.
>
>
> A bient?t,
>
> Armin.
>
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From matti.picus at gmail.com  Wed May 14 21:16:35 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (Matti Picus)
Date: Wed, 14 May 2014 22:16:35 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5373C113.1010401@gmail.com>

I contacted the bitbucket support center, and this is the reply I recieved:
"We are looking into fixing the rate limit for PyPy. We need it (the 
limit) for other users who are abusing the service, but it is obvious we 
need some exceptions. It will be a couple of days, but we will get PyPy 
excepted as soon as possible. I'm sorry about that!"

Matti

On 13/05/2014 3:29 PM, Alex Gaynor wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Right now PyPy binaries for releases are hosted on bitbucket.
> Unfortunately, recently bitbucket started rate limiting downloads of
> files, and I've seen many issues in downloading them, both myself, and
> from user bug reports.
>
> I'd like to move these to be hosted somewhere else, I figured the
> easiest would be to reuse the PSF infrastructure (hence the CC of that
> list). What do folks think? PyPy folks, does this work for everyone?
> Infra folks, any problems with this?
>
> Cheers,
> Alex
>
> --
> "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right
> to say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
> "The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
> GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>

From alex.gaynor at gmail.com  Wed May 14 21:20:57 2014
From: alex.gaynor at gmail.com (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Wed, 14 May 2014 15:20:57 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy download hosting
In-Reply-To: <5373C113.1010401@gmail.com>
References: <CAFRnB2XBj4P1wKr39t82pek++KLHOKerZ3hfipZ8nrSGNByFrg@mail.gmail.com>
 <5373C113.1010401@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFRnB2XgLg6R7NQ=QJTA9Fh2mcwwsNVVbTEeis9Oz=wXgjvAbA@mail.gmail.com>

That's great! That simplifies everything, thanks for doing that.

Alex


On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Matti Picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:

> I contacted the bitbucket support center, and this is the reply I recieved:
> "We are looking into fixing the rate limit for PyPy. We need it (the
> limit) for other users who are abusing the service, but it is obvious we
> need some exceptions. It will be a couple of days, but we will get PyPy
> excepted as soon as possible. I'm sorry about that!"
>
> Matti
>
>
> On 13/05/2014 3:29 PM, Alex Gaynor wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Right now PyPy binaries for releases are hosted on bitbucket.
>> Unfortunately, recently bitbucket started rate limiting downloads of
>> files, and I've seen many issues in downloading them, both myself, and
>> from user bug reports.
>>
>> I'd like to move these to be hosted somewhere else, I figured the
>> easiest would be to reuse the PSF infrastructure (hence the CC of that
>> list). What do folks think? PyPy folks, does this work for everyone?
>> Infra folks, any problems with this?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Alex
>>
>> --
>> "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right
>> to say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
>> "The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
>> GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> pypy-dev mailing list
>> pypy-dev at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
>



-- 
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
"The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
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From dje.gcc at gmail.com  Thu May 15 02:55:04 2014
From: dje.gcc at gmail.com (David Edelsohn)
Date: Wed, 14 May 2014 20:55:04 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] remove-globals-in-jit for ppc backend
Message-ID: <CAGWvnyktZi-Ro3CodYbPz-CRWe7q+UVT=v9kDMVOjnftM_6WDQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi, David

Ivan and Andre from Unicamp and I are trying to update the ppc backend
to the current RPython internals API.

We're trying to understand the removal of fail_boxes_int, etc. from
the backends. It looks like this was done on the remove-globals-in-jit
branch. I guess we need to adapt all of that branch and all of
jitframe-in-heap branch to PPC.

Can you help explain a little more about this patch?

https://mail.python.org/pipermail/pypy-commit/2013-January/069022.html

Thanks, David

From fijall at gmail.com  Thu May 15 10:49:40 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 10:49:40 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] remove-globals-in-jit for ppc backend
In-Reply-To: <CAGWvnyktZi-Ro3CodYbPz-CRWe7q+UVT=v9kDMVOjnftM_6WDQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGWvnyktZi-Ro3CodYbPz-CRWe7q+UVT=v9kDMVOjnftM_6WDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxTUPg4HF99jeQttz8=uOjx9ydzqkGSs6FKoD+rh=GgwBQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi David.

Why are you tracking the history one by one? The fail_boxes_int etc.
is now living on a jitframe. There are direct tests for all of that, I
would suggest looking at those instead of history (so it's now called
get_int_value and accepts a jitframe)

On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 2:55 AM, David Edelsohn <dje.gcc at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, David
>
> Ivan and Andre from Unicamp and I are trying to update the ppc backend
> to the current RPython internals API.
>
> We're trying to understand the removal of fail_boxes_int, etc. from
> the backends. It looks like this was done on the remove-globals-in-jit
> branch. I guess we need to adapt all of that branch and all of
> jitframe-in-heap branch to PPC.
>
> Can you help explain a little more about this patch?
>
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/pypy-commit/2013-January/069022.html
>
> Thanks, David
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev

From dje.gcc at gmail.com  Thu May 15 13:36:21 2014
From: dje.gcc at gmail.com (David Edelsohn)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 07:36:21 -0400
Subject: [pypy-dev] remove-globals-in-jit for ppc backend
In-Reply-To: <CAK5idxTUPg4HF99jeQttz8=uOjx9ydzqkGSs6FKoD+rh=GgwBQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGWvnyktZi-Ro3CodYbPz-CRWe7q+UVT=v9kDMVOjnftM_6WDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxTUPg4HF99jeQttz8=uOjx9ydzqkGSs6FKoD+rh=GgwBQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAGWvnynEPNEg19rqYHSok22k7Y5fgKLxQc8DgpfofUpv0CosOw@mail.gmail.com>

Maciej,

We are not tracking history one by one. We are trying to fix test
runner failures. And the current failure is a missing reference to
fail_boxes_int. It is not obvious what replaced it by looking at the
current sources, so we are trying to investigate back to the source of
the change.

Thanks, David

On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 4:49 AM, Maciej Fijalkowski <fijall at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi David.
>
> Why are you tracking the history one by one? The fail_boxes_int etc.
> is now living on a jitframe. There are direct tests for all of that, I
> would suggest looking at those instead of history (so it's now called
> get_int_value and accepts a jitframe)
>
> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 2:55 AM, David Edelsohn <dje.gcc at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi, David
>>
>> Ivan and Andre from Unicamp and I are trying to update the ppc backend
>> to the current RPython internals API.
>>
>> We're trying to understand the removal of fail_boxes_int, etc. from
>> the backends. It looks like this was done on the remove-globals-in-jit
>> branch. I guess we need to adapt all of that branch and all of
>> jitframe-in-heap branch to PPC.
>>
>> Can you help explain a little more about this patch?
>>
>> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/pypy-commit/2013-January/069022.html
>>
>> Thanks, David
>> _______________________________________________
>> pypy-dev mailing list
>> pypy-dev at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev

From fijall at gmail.com  Thu May 15 13:40:52 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 13:40:52 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] remove-globals-in-jit for ppc backend
In-Reply-To: <CAGWvnynEPNEg19rqYHSok22k7Y5fgKLxQc8DgpfofUpv0CosOw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGWvnyktZi-Ro3CodYbPz-CRWe7q+UVT=v9kDMVOjnftM_6WDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxTUPg4HF99jeQttz8=uOjx9ydzqkGSs6FKoD+rh=GgwBQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGWvnynEPNEg19rqYHSok22k7Y5fgKLxQc8DgpfofUpv0CosOw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxT3R7Sva_4-QB9D-yQ88Wy-paqe1RnkKqOv2nx9kH7yaw@mail.gmail.com>

cool, just ask me then :-) as I said it's get_int_value and a jitframe

On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 1:36 PM, David Edelsohn <dje.gcc at gmail.com> wrote:
> Maciej,
>
> We are not tracking history one by one. We are trying to fix test
> runner failures. And the current failure is a missing reference to
> fail_boxes_int. It is not obvious what replaced it by looking at the
> current sources, so we are trying to investigate back to the source of
> the change.
>
> Thanks, David
>
> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 4:49 AM, Maciej Fijalkowski <fijall at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi David.
>>
>> Why are you tracking the history one by one? The fail_boxes_int etc.
>> is now living on a jitframe. There are direct tests for all of that, I
>> would suggest looking at those instead of history (so it's now called
>> get_int_value and accepts a jitframe)
>>
>> On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 2:55 AM, David Edelsohn <dje.gcc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hi, David
>>>
>>> Ivan and Andre from Unicamp and I are trying to update the ppc backend
>>> to the current RPython internals API.
>>>
>>> We're trying to understand the removal of fail_boxes_int, etc. from
>>> the backends. It looks like this was done on the remove-globals-in-jit
>>> branch. I guess we need to adapt all of that branch and all of
>>> jitframe-in-heap branch to PPC.
>>>
>>> Can you help explain a little more about this patch?
>>>
>>> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/pypy-commit/2013-January/069022.html
>>>
>>> Thanks, David
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> pypy-dev mailing list
>>> pypy-dev at python.org
>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev

From matti.picus at gmail.com  Thu May 15 19:56:46 2014
From: matti.picus at gmail.com (Matti Picus)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 20:56:46 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] pypy buildbot hook overall design
Message-ID: <5374FFDE.7060104@gmail.com>

Hi. I am looking at adding the ability to monitor a bitbucket-hosted git 
repo to the bbhook module in pypy's buildbot. The current design 
requires a repo copy to monitor. Couldn't we just use the payload from 
bitbucket instead of requiring a repo copy?
Matti

From sebastian.pawlus at gmail.com  Thu May 15 19:59:01 2014
From: sebastian.pawlus at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Sebastian_Pawlu=C5=9B?=)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 19:59:01 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issues moved to Bitbucket
Message-ID: <CAEvNYXJWa_B5DxrgNQuinLAx=BqtvsDgh-ZFug4znXnwpWjWDQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi

Small announcement. The new location for PyPy's issues/bugs from now on is
on Bitbucket

https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issues

The old location (bugs.pypy.org) should be working, but only as a redirect
to Bitbucket issues page. Fija? is working on it :)

Special thanks to Marcus Bertrand (Bitbucket guy) for help.

regards,
sebastian pawlu?
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From anto.cuni at gmail.com  Fri May 16 10:21:31 2014
From: anto.cuni at gmail.com (Antonio Cuni)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 10:21:31 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] pypy buildbot hook overall design
In-Reply-To: <5374FFDE.7060104@gmail.com>
References: <5374FFDE.7060104@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHPg78xOmh+Qdfd+Mobiy3uGJ7dWfrWBhGBChk3ZM2oq8mgUTA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Matti,

IIRC, the repo copy is needed to compute the diff, since the payload only
contains the hash of the relevant revisions


On Thu, May 15, 2014 at 7:56 PM, Matti Picus <matti.picus at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi. I am looking at adding the ability to monitor a bitbucket-hosted git
> repo to the bbhook module in pypy's buildbot. The current design requires a
> repo copy to monitor. Couldn't we just use the payload from bitbucket
> instead of requiring a repo copy?
> Matti
>
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From arigo at tunes.org  Fri May 16 11:40:18 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 11:40:18 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issues moved to Bitbucket
In-Reply-To: <CAEvNYXJWa_B5DxrgNQuinLAx=BqtvsDgh-ZFug4znXnwpWjWDQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAEvNYXJWa_B5DxrgNQuinLAx=BqtvsDgh-ZFug4znXnwpWjWDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X0NxrwmdX0ozcttTncKBBYk4p_m+O4ebxe=V77fqZikhw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Sebastian (a.k.a. Xando),

On 15 May 2014 19:59, Sebastian Pawlu? <sebastian.pawlus at gmail.com> wrote:
> Small announcement. The new location for PyPy's issues/bugs from now on is
> on Bitbucket

Thank you for all the work in doing this!


A bient?t,

Armin.

From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Fri May 16 12:40:34 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (Yichao Yu)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 10:40:34 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1772: Complex dtype unhashable. (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140516104034.13515.10168@app06.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1772: Complex dtype unhashable.
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1772/complex-dtype-unhashable

Yichao Yu:

In pypy,
```
pypy -c 'import numpy as np; t = np.dtype([("s1", np.int8), ("s2", np.int8)]); print(hash(t))'             
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "app_main.py", line 75, in run_toplevel
  File "app_main.py", line 581, in run_it
  File "<string>", line 1, in <module>
TypeError: 'dict' objects are unhashable
```

In CPython
```
python2 -c 'import numpy as np; t = np.dtype([("s1", np.int8), ("s2", np.int8)]); print(hash(t))'
-5634517127405799957
```




From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Fri May 16 22:11:23 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (Philip Jenvey)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 20:11:23 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1773: py3k: continuation.test_zpickle
 test_pickle_continulet_real_subclass triggers a CPython crash (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140516201123.25919.34965@app11.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1773: py3k: continuation.test_zpickle test_pickle_continulet_real_subclass triggers a CPython crash
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1773/py3k-continuationtest_zpickle

Philip Jenvey:

test_pickle_continulet_real_subclass has been disabled on the py3k branch for now as it  can trigger a seg fault when running under CPython.

It'll crash with a "Fatal Python error: GC object already tracked", or at least on OSX: "malloc: *** error for object 0x109620af0: pointer being realloc'd was not allocated"

continulets do some potentially 'evil' low level things but AFAICT nothing pypy's doing is at at fault here. The crash doesn't seem to occur on default even though the continulet implementations/tests are basically identical



From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Sat May 17 17:27:54 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (Aidan Epstein)
Date: Sat, 17 May 2014 15:27:54 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1774: Pypy not translating with gcc 4.9 on Arch
 Linux x86_64 (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140517152754.12731.49971@app09.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1774: Pypy not translating with gcc 4.9 on Arch Linux x86_64
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1774/pypy-not-translating-with-gcc-49-on-arch

Aidan Epstein:

I am trying to translate the latest version of pypy from the mercurial repositories using the copy of pypy included in the Arch Linux repos. The arch linux version fails after a short amount of time with the attached stack trace. The official version from pypy.org (or rather the portable binaries from https://github.com/squeaky-pl/portable-pypy) works without a hiccup, however, when trying to use the resulting binary to translate, it fails with the same error.  I reported it to the Arch Linux bug tracker, and they said that it was probably a gcc 4.9 issue and to report it here.



From lac at openend.se  Tue May 20 15:09:11 2014
From: lac at openend.se (Laura Creighton)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 15:09:11 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Where is pypy.org?
Message-ID: <201405201309.s4KD9BX5010038@fido.openend.se>

I am getting a ton of spam as 'contracts at pypy.org'.  Somewhere that is a
mail alias for me.  I'd like to remove that alias, or have it removed if
it isn't something I can do.  This brings up the larger question as to
whether that whole address is needed at all, or if it should just bounce.

Laura

From estama at gmail.com  Tue May 20 19:41:40 2014
From: estama at gmail.com (Eleytherios Stamatogiannakis)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 20:41:40 +0300
Subject: [pypy-dev] Example where PyPy is more than 4x slower than CPython
In-Reply-To: <201405201309.s4KD9BX5010038@fido.openend.se>
References: <201405201309.s4KD9BX5010038@fido.openend.se>
Message-ID: <537B93D4.1040000@gmail.com>

Hi,

I've found a small example where PyPy is a *lot* slower (more than 4x) 
than CPython. The example calculates all the possible groupings of a 
list of values:

---/---
def allgroup(expansions, n=0, groups = []):
     expgroup = [expansions[n]]
     if n == len(expansions) - 1:
         yield groups + [expgroup]
         for i in xrange(len(groups)):
             tmp = groups[i]
             groups[i] = tmp + expgroup
             yield groups
             groups[i] = tmp
     else:
         for g in allgroup(expansions, n+1, groups + [expgroup]):
             yield g
         for i in xrange(len(groups)):
             tmp = groups[i]
             groups[i] = tmp + expgroup
             for g in allgroup(expansions, n + 1, groups):
                 yield g
             groups[i] = tmp

count = 0
for i in allgroup(range(13)):
     count += 1
print count
---/---

time python allgroups.py
	20.75s user 0.04s system 99% cpu 20.820 total

time pypy allgroups.py
	97.31s user 1.07s system 99% cpu 1:38.55 total

Regards,

l.

From anto.cuni at gmail.com  Wed May 21 01:56:39 2014
From: anto.cuni at gmail.com (Antonio Cuni)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 01:56:39 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
Message-ID: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I am preparing the usual "PyPy status talk" which I'll give to the upcoming
Pycon Italy, which is going to cover what happened in the last two years of
PyPy.

If you are interested, the draft slides are here:
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/extradoc/src/tip/talk/pycon-italy-2014/talk.rst?at=extradoc

In the talk, I will to give an overview of the current status of the
various subprojects, so I'd be glad if you could help because you surely
know better than me the status of the area of your competence :)

David: what is the current status of PyPy on ARM? Should I say "it just
works" or there is something more to add? What about performance?

Matti, Brian: what about numpy? Since people like numbers, what percentage
of numpy we can consider completed?

Philip: same question for py3k. Is it still considered beta quality or we
can say it's stable?

Alex, Maciej: I'll also briefly talk about other frontends, so Topaz and
Hippy. How much complete are they? What are the performance? I know that
hippy is still actively developed, but what about Topaz?

Other than what I asked, I'll also highlight CFFI and STM. If anyone has
ideas for other cool things which happened in PyPy since 2012, suggestions
are welcome :)

thank you very much!
Anto
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From alex.gaynor at gmail.com  Wed May 21 01:58:11 2014
From: alex.gaynor at gmail.com (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 16:58:11 -0700
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFRnB2X1JkaAnPLFDnQwr6JJpdxGjrcCB9DYJ63_k+QFJ2smQw@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 4:56 PM, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I am preparing the usual "PyPy status talk" which I'll give to the
> upcoming Pycon Italy, which is going to cover what happened in the last two
> years of PyPy.
>
> If you are interested, the draft slides are here:
>
> https://bitbucket.org/pypy/extradoc/src/tip/talk/pycon-italy-2014/talk.rst?at=extradoc
>
> In the talk, I will to give an overview of the current status of the
> various subprojects, so I'd be glad if you could help because you surely
> know better than me the status of the area of your competence :)
>
> David: what is the current status of PyPy on ARM? Should I say "it just
> works" or there is something more to add? What about performance?
>
> Matti, Brian: what about numpy? Since people like numbers, what percentage
> of numpy we can consider completed?
>
> Philip: same question for py3k. Is it still considered beta quality or we
> can say it's stable?
>
> Alex, Maciej: I'll also briefly talk about other frontends, so Topaz and
> Hippy. How much complete are they? What are the performance? I know that
> hippy is still actively developed, but what about Topaz?
>
>
Topaz has almost all Ruby syntax implemented, and many methods/builtin
types, but very little of the Ruby stdlib.

I'm no longer actively working on it (at some point I'll write a blog post
about that).


> Other than what I asked, I'll also highlight CFFI and STM. If anyone has
> ideas for other cool things which happened in PyPy since 2012, suggestions
> are welcome :)
>
> thank you very much!
> Anto
>

Alex

-- 
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
"The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
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From alex.gaynor at gmail.com  Wed May 21 01:58:59 2014
From: alex.gaynor at gmail.com (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2014 16:58:59 -0700
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAFRnB2X1JkaAnPLFDnQwr6JJpdxGjrcCB9DYJ63_k+QFJ2smQw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFRnB2X1JkaAnPLFDnQwr6JJpdxGjrcCB9DYJ63_k+QFJ2smQw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFRnB2WPPVwiDDMqWik=iorNr=KUqSc-EN+jJFrWPdsiN4U+rw@mail.gmail.com>

Oh, performance, the only Ruby implementation that's competitive with it is
the Oracle Ruby VM with Truffle, I think they've started merging that into
JRuby by now, so I'm not sure how that compares. Definitely faster than MRI
though :-)

Alex


On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 4:58 PM, Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor at gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
>
> On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 4:56 PM, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I am preparing the usual "PyPy status talk" which I'll give to the
>> upcoming Pycon Italy, which is going to cover what happened in the last two
>> years of PyPy.
>>
>> If you are interested, the draft slides are here:
>>
>> https://bitbucket.org/pypy/extradoc/src/tip/talk/pycon-italy-2014/talk.rst?at=extradoc
>>
>> In the talk, I will to give an overview of the current status of the
>> various subprojects, so I'd be glad if you could help because you surely
>> know better than me the status of the area of your competence :)
>>
>> David: what is the current status of PyPy on ARM? Should I say "it just
>> works" or there is something more to add? What about performance?
>>
>> Matti, Brian: what about numpy? Since people like numbers, what
>> percentage of numpy we can consider completed?
>>
>> Philip: same question for py3k. Is it still considered beta quality or we
>> can say it's stable?
>>
>> Alex, Maciej: I'll also briefly talk about other frontends, so Topaz and
>> Hippy. How much complete are they? What are the performance? I know that
>> hippy is still actively developed, but what about Topaz?
>>
>>
> Topaz has almost all Ruby syntax implemented, and many methods/builtin
> types, but very little of the Ruby stdlib.
>
> I'm no longer actively working on it (at some point I'll write a blog post
> about that).
>
>
>> Other than what I asked, I'll also highlight CFFI and STM. If anyone has
>> ideas for other cool things which happened in PyPy since 2012, suggestions
>> are welcome :)
>>
>> thank you very much!
>> Anto
>>
>
> Alex
>
> --
> "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right
> to say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
> "The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
> GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
>



-- 
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
"The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
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From fijall at gmail.com  Wed May 21 09:35:01 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 09:35:01 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Where is pypy.org?
In-Reply-To: <201405201309.s4KD9BX5010038@fido.openend.se>
References: <201405201309.s4KD9BX5010038@fido.openend.se>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxSDC1j9AK4APoOM2c52O8q9RA-SPizqcWfpj_o6PK9HgQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Laura

There is no mail contracts at pypy.org as far as I know, you're probably
getting spam from different sources.

On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 3:09 PM, Laura Creighton <lac at openend.se> wrote:
> I am getting a ton of spam as 'contracts at pypy.org'.  Somewhere that is a
> mail alias for me.  I'd like to remove that alias, or have it removed if
> it isn't something I can do.  This brings up the larger question as to
> whether that whole address is needed at all, or if it should just bounce.
>
> Laura
> _______________________________________________
> pypy-dev mailing list
> pypy-dev at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev

From anto.cuni at gmail.com  Wed May 21 10:32:34 2014
From: anto.cuni at gmail.com (Antonio Cuni)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 10:32:34 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAFRnB2WPPVwiDDMqWik=iorNr=KUqSc-EN+jJFrWPdsiN4U+rw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFRnB2X1JkaAnPLFDnQwr6JJpdxGjrcCB9DYJ63_k+QFJ2smQw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFRnB2WPPVwiDDMqWik=iorNr=KUqSc-EN+jJFrWPdsiN4U+rw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHPg78wOVYasGekYPBk4K5kEHXrezgQLTefj5HaKh3yhb+Eh=g@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Alex,

On Wed, May 21, 2014 at 1:58 AM, Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor at gmail.com> wrote:

> Oh, performance, the only Ruby implementation that's competitive with it
> is the Oracle Ruby VM with Truffle, I think they've started merging that
> into JRuby by now, so I'm not sure how that compares. Definitely faster
> than MRI though :-)
>
>
?do you have a number to put on the slides?? People like hearing "N times
faster than X" better than "faster than X" :)

thanks!
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From david.schneider at bivab.de  Wed May 21 14:31:13 2014
From: david.schneider at bivab.de (David Schneider)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 14:31:13 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <92B79ED0-4F98-4935-92B7-CD6FCF5F13C2@bivab.de>

Hi all,

On 21.05.2014, at 01:56, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:

> David: what is the current status of PyPy on ARM? Should I say "it just works" or there is something more to add? What about performance?
> 

Regarding ARM, the status is indeed "it just works" (although the JIT lacks a few features compared to x86). For performance the best overview is this blogpost http://morepypy.blogspot.de/2013/05/pypy-20-alpha-for-arm.html from last year, which should still be mostly accurate.

It might be worth pointing out that PyPy is being distributed as part of the Raspbian OS images for the Raspberry-Pi

Cheers

David

From alex.gaynor at gmail.com  Wed May 21 16:29:48 2014
From: alex.gaynor at gmail.com (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 07:29:48 -0700
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78wOVYasGekYPBk4K5kEHXrezgQLTefj5HaKh3yhb+Eh=g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFRnB2X1JkaAnPLFDnQwr6JJpdxGjrcCB9DYJ63_k+QFJ2smQw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFRnB2WPPVwiDDMqWik=iorNr=KUqSc-EN+jJFrWPdsiN4U+rw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAHPg78wOVYasGekYPBk4K5kEHXrezgQLTefj5HaKh3yhb+Eh=g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFRnB2ULQpPiSv=CdhcfF2ffZSXZ7YmVunQmT=mbDyARNmX-0Q@mail.gmail.com>

I don't have any good numbers, sorry.


On Wed, May 21, 2014 at 1:32 AM, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Alex,
>
> On Wed, May 21, 2014 at 1:58 AM, Alex Gaynor <alex.gaynor at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Oh, performance, the only Ruby implementation that's competitive with it
>> is the Oracle Ruby VM with Truffle, I think they've started merging that
>> into JRuby by now, so I'm not sure how that compares. Definitely faster
>> than MRI though :-)
>>
>>
> ?do you have a number to put on the slides?? People like hearing "N times
> faster than X" better than "faster than X" :)
>
> thanks!
>



-- 
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to
say it." -- Evelyn Beatrice Hall (summarizing Voltaire)
"The people's good is the highest law." -- Cicero
GPG Key fingerprint: 125F 5C67 DFE9 4084
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From fijall at gmail.com  Wed May 21 16:57:13 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 16:57:13 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxQ6o2XMOBvWoAt2DMmvyo5H7JpveTr1Z0yZ1ghRpwqaxw@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, May 21, 2014 at 1:56 AM, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am preparing the usual "PyPy status talk" which I'll give to the upcoming
> Pycon Italy, which is going to cover what happened in the last two years of
> PyPy.
>
> If you are interested, the draft slides are here:
> https://bitbucket.org/pypy/extradoc/src/tip/talk/pycon-italy-2014/talk.rst?at=extradoc
>
> In the talk, I will to give an overview of the current status of the various
> subprojects, so I'd be glad if you could help because you surely know better
> than me the status of the area of your competence :)
>
> David: what is the current status of PyPy on ARM? Should I say "it just
> works" or there is something more to add? What about performance?
>
> Matti, Brian: what about numpy? Since people like numbers, what percentage
> of numpy we can consider completed?
>
> Philip: same question for py3k. Is it still considered beta quality or we
> can say it's stable?
>
> Alex, Maciej: I'll also briefly talk about other frontends, so Topaz and
> Hippy. How much complete are they? What are the performance? I know that
> hippy is still actively developed, but what about Topaz?

What do you exactly want to know about hippy performance?

From anto.cuni at gmail.com  Wed May 21 17:23:58 2014
From: anto.cuni at gmail.com (Antonio Cuni)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 17:23:58 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAK5idxQ6o2XMOBvWoAt2DMmvyo5H7JpveTr1Z0yZ1ghRpwqaxw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxQ6o2XMOBvWoAt2DMmvyo5H7JpveTr1Z0yZ1ghRpwqaxw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHPg78zsfB4nVcsiMVwBtKPD1EsUwVR=++trtk34Pzpg_gdfew@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,


> What do you exactly want to know about hippy performance?
>

?I simply want to put in a slide "hippy is N times faster than standard
PHP", for some reasonable value of N. Nothing more :)?
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From fijall at gmail.com  Wed May 21 17:41:37 2014
From: fijall at gmail.com (Maciej Fijalkowski)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 17:41:37 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78zsfB4nVcsiMVwBtKPD1EsUwVR=++trtk34Pzpg_gdfew@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAK5idxQ6o2XMOBvWoAt2DMmvyo5H7JpveTr1Z0yZ1ghRpwqaxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAHPg78zsfB4nVcsiMVwBtKPD1EsUwVR=++trtk34Pzpg_gdfew@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK5idxSM4o2DrJgd-r37847ZRQxc7tRLsLsLYkiQ5tCpfsSTKA@mail.gmail.com>

7? check out our blog post ;-)

On Wed, May 21, 2014 at 5:23 PM, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
>>
>> What do you exactly want to know about hippy performance?
>
>
> I simply want to put in a slide "hippy is N times faster than standard PHP",
> for some reasonable value of N. Nothing more :)

From pjenvey at underboss.org  Wed May 21 23:30:46 2014
From: pjenvey at underboss.org (Philip Jenvey)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 14:30:46 -0700
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <06E847DE-9C6E-4F76-B4CA-ED6031C15D1E@underboss.org>


On May 20, 2014, at 4:56 PM, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi all,

> Philip: same question for py3k. Is it still considered beta quality or we can say it's stable?


We?ll have a release out with 3.2 compatibility that we can consider ?stable? shortly. This will include one additional feature from 3.3: support for the u?? prefix.

Additionally, a 3.3 branch was created last month by Amaury and he's started some of the initial work there.

--
Philip Jenvey


From anto.cuni at gmail.com  Thu May 22 09:49:52 2014
From: anto.cuni at gmail.com (Antonio Cuni)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 09:49:52 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <92B79ED0-4F98-4935-92B7-CD6FCF5F13C2@bivab.de>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
 <92B79ED0-4F98-4935-92B7-CD6FCF5F13C2@bivab.de>
Message-ID: <CAHPg78zeV+oXXDoYfj=-8PjyPdUpeTCGZEcEaDdBFreuFoi9hA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi David,

thank you for the prompt answer. One more question, since I am sure that
people will ask me :). Does PyPy work on android? I suppose the answer is
"yes, but of course without integration with the UI", but better to check.

I'll also point that the Rasperry-Pi foundation founded part of the ARM
development. It founded also pygame_cffi, right?


On Wed, May 21, 2014 at 2:31 PM, David Schneider
<david.schneider at bivab.de>wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> On 21.05.2014, at 01:56, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > David: what is the current status of PyPy on ARM? Should I say "it just
> works" or there is something more to add? What about performance?
> >
>
> Regarding ARM, the status is indeed "it just works" (although the JIT
> lacks a few features compared to x86). For performance the best overview is
> this blogpost
> http://morepypy.blogspot.de/2013/05/pypy-20-alpha-for-arm.html from last
> year, which should still be mostly accurate.
>
> It might be worth pointing out that PyPy is being distributed as part of
> the Raspbian OS images for the Raspberry-Pi
>
> Cheers
>
> David
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From david.schneider at bivab.de  Thu May 22 10:41:44 2014
From: david.schneider at bivab.de (David Schneider)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 10:41:44 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78zeV+oXXDoYfj=-8PjyPdUpeTCGZEcEaDdBFreuFoi9hA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
 <92B79ED0-4F98-4935-92B7-CD6FCF5F13C2@bivab.de>
 <CAHPg78zeV+oXXDoYfj=-8PjyPdUpeTCGZEcEaDdBFreuFoi9hA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AE242377-A976-40F5-9DC2-CC64F17FB35C@bivab.de>

Hi Anto,


On 22.05.2014, at 09:49, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> thank you for the prompt answer. One more question, since I am sure that people will ask me :). Does PyPy work on android? I suppose the answer is "yes, but of course without integration with the UI", but better to check.
The answer is more of a "in theory yes", but besides some small experiments I did at some point, we haven't really tried to build PyPy for android.

> 
> I'll also point that the Rasperry-Pi foundation founded part of the ARM development. It founded also pygame_cffi, right?

Yes, they funded the a part of the ARM development (ARMv6 and finishing the JIT), the incremental GC and pygame_cffi AFAIK.

Cheers

David

From nhw at me.com  Thu May 22 11:23:36 2014
From: nhw at me.com (Nick Williams)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 14:53:36 +0530
Subject: [pypy-dev] Deadlock in cpyext callback
Message-ID: <4EB1B211-13DB-459E-B240-FF8B615D5E74@me.com>

We have an extension module which works fine with CPython but deadlocks every time in PyPy. 

The problem is induced when the C++ code in the module (having been invoked from a Python thread) prepares to call back into Python again by calling PyGILState_Ensure. It seems at this point we try to acquire the GIL mutex while already (presumably) holding it - any other threads at this point are also waiting on the mutex so it isn't held elsewhere. 

This seems to occur from a call to rffi.aroundstate.after() - I assume that the invariant here is that the before() has already executed but that seems not to be the case here. What is supposed to trigger that?

Thanks for any assistance in advance. 

Nick


From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Thu May 22 23:01:54 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (eevee)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 21:01:54 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1775: imp.lock_held isn't quite right (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140522210154.25693.4251@app10.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1775: imp.lock_held isn't quite right
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1775/implock_held-isnt-quite-right

eevee:

PyPy's `lock_held()` returns whether the lock is held by the current thread: https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/src/6e9376d22e0ecc83bfcdda81d0e37e695b435dd7/pypy/module/imp/importing.py?at=default#cl-753

But CPython returns whether the lock is held _at all_: http://hg.python.org/cpython/file/3a1db0d2747e/Python/import.c#l348



From bdkearns at gmail.com  Fri May 23 04:51:28 2014
From: bdkearns at gmail.com (Brian Kearns)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2014 19:51:28 -0700
Subject: [pypy-dev] PyPy current status
In-Reply-To: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHPg78z2+1YMVZRc3KrcPb+EZCbXk1DfLBxQSEHFu5M7=0P+rg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACw2m-affCYXsiCj=GPvi-sDaWdkcM2VCQu6CWYKXO1jFKBTuw@mail.gmail.com>

As far as numpy, the last few blog status posts are probably give the best
idea:

http://morepypy.blogspot.com/2014/04/numpy-on-pypy-status-update.html
http://morepypy.blogspot.com/2014/03/numpy-status-update-february.html

Somewhere in there I mention count of tests passing out of tests total --
that's probably the best, albeit approximate indicator of functionality.
You could pull an updated count from the nightly tests:

http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/numpy-compatability-linux-x86-64


On Tue, May 20, 2014 at 4:56 PM, Antonio Cuni <anto.cuni at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I am preparing the usual "PyPy status talk" which I'll give to the
> upcoming Pycon Italy, which is going to cover what happened in the last two
> years of PyPy.
>
> If you are interested, the draft slides are here:
>
> https://bitbucket.org/pypy/extradoc/src/tip/talk/pycon-italy-2014/talk.rst?at=extradoc
>
> In the talk, I will to give an overview of the current status of the
> various subprojects, so I'd be glad if you could help because you surely
> know better than me the status of the area of your competence :)
>
> David: what is the current status of PyPy on ARM? Should I say "it just
> works" or there is something more to add? What about performance?
>
> Matti, Brian: what about numpy? Since people like numbers, what percentage
> of numpy we can consider completed?
>
> Philip: same question for py3k. Is it still considered beta quality or we
> can say it's stable?
>
> Alex, Maciej: I'll also briefly talk about other frontends, so Topaz and
> Hippy. How much complete are they? What are the performance? I know that
> hippy is still actively developed, but what about Topaz?
>
> Other than what I asked, I'll also highlight CFFI and STM. If anyone has
> ideas for other cool things which happened in PyPy since 2012, suggestions
> are welcome :)
>
> thank you very much!
> Anto
>
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From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Fri May 23 07:49:51 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (Alex Gaynor)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2014 05:49:51 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1776: Creating instances of a namedtuple is
 inexplicably very slow (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140523054951.31268.19128@app05.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1776: Creating instances of a namedtuple is inexplicably very slow
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1776/creating-instances-of-a-namedtuple-is

Alex Gaynor:

Compare:

```
$ pypy -mtimeit -s "from collections import namedtuple; pos = namedtuple('pos', ['x', 'y'])" "p = (1, 2)"
1000000000 loops, best of 3: 0.000867 usec per loop
$ pypy -mtimeit -s "from collections import namedtuple; pos = namedtuple('pos', ['x', 'y'])" "p = (1, 2)"
1000000000 loops, best of 3: 0.000867 usec per loop
$ pypy -mtimeit -s "from collections import namedtuple; pos = namedtuple('pos', ['x', 'y'])" "p = (1, 2)"
1000000000 loops, best of 3: 0.00087 usec per loop
$
$
$ pypy -mtimeit -s "from collections import namedtuple; pos = namedtuple('pos', ['x', 'y'])" "p = pos(1, 2)"
100000000 loops, best of 3: 0.026 usec per loop
$ pypy -mtimeit -s "from collections import namedtuple; pos = namedtuple('pos', ['x', 'y'])" "p = pos(1, 2)"
100000000 loops, best of 3: 0.0264 usec per loop
$ pypy -mtimeit -s "from collections import namedtuple; pos = namedtuple('pos', ['x', 'y'])" "p = pos(1, 2)"
100000000 loops, best of 3: 0.0268 usec per loop
```

Looking at the traces, I don't see anything that explains the difference in the `jit-log-opt-loop` section, however looking at `jit-summary`, I see that the namedtuple version compiles many many more bridges, we should figure out why.



From arigo at tunes.org  Sun May 25 21:38:27 2014
From: arigo at tunes.org (Armin Rigo)
Date: Sun, 25 May 2014 21:38:27 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] Deadlock in cpyext callback
In-Reply-To: <4EB1B211-13DB-459E-B240-FF8B615D5E74@me.com>
References: <4EB1B211-13DB-459E-B240-FF8B615D5E74@me.com>
Message-ID: <CAMSv6X2ySQQUnN5iBx9JuGss1_35hVkZc9wi92VSqMpCzF=Wyg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Nick,

On 22 May 2014 11:23, Nick Williams <nhw at me.com> wrote:
> The problem is induced when the C++ code in the module (having been invoked from a Python thread) prepares to call back into Python again by calling PyGILState_Ensure.

The documentation of PyGILState_Ensure() says, indeed, that it's ok to
call this function even if the current thread already owns the GIL.
If PyPy's version deadlocks in this case, then it's a bug of PyPy.
Please file it as a bug (https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issues; also
look a bit in case a similar bug would be already reported and waiting
there).  You can also try to look in the implementation of
PyGILState_Ensure() to make sure.

(Sorry for the delay in answering, this is part of "cpyext", a part of
PyPy that is missing a more dedicated person that would improve it.
We still try to fix bugs if they come with a detailed step-by-step
guide on how to reproduce them or a test case.)


A bient?t,

Armin.

From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Mon May 26 01:42:15 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (Yichao Yu)
Date: Sun, 25 May 2014 23:42:15 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1777: Unable to create proper numpy array from
 cffi buffer (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140525234215.12252.49118@app10.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1777: Unable to create proper numpy array from cffi buffer
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1777/unable-to-create-proper-numpy-array-from

Yichao Yu:

I am writing something that need to convert a c buffer from cffi to a numpy array with arbitrary shape and strides. Besides the fact that [`as_strided`](https://bitbucket.org/pypy/numpy/issue/9/numpylibstride_tricksas_strided-is-not) is not really working, another problem is that the c buffer is maintained by the underlaying c/c++ library (OpenCL in this case). Therefore it is necessary to let the numpy ndarray hold a reference of the object which manage the memory.

In CPython, this is done by [setting the base on the ndarray](https://github.com/pyopencl/pyopencl/blob/master/src/wrapper/wrap_cl.hpp#L2718). However, there doesn't seem to be a way to do the same in (num)pypy.

In pypy, although I can pass the buffer to `np.frombuffer` and call `reshape` to get an array roughly correct, the array is only holding a reference to the buffer returned by cffi but not the (c++) object (or the python delegate of it) which manages the memory. Furthermore, the base property of the result array cannot be used to access the underlying object (which is currently a PyOpenCL API that I would love not to break.)

(The problem can probably be solved along with the [`as_strided` support bug](https://bitbucket.org/pypy/numpy/issue/9/numpylibstride_tricksas_strided-is-not) by allowing creating arrays from object with a proper array interface)




From nhw at me.com  Mon May 26 06:12:01 2014
From: nhw at me.com (Nick Williams)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2014 09:42:01 +0530
Subject: [pypy-dev] Deadlock in cpyext callback
In-Reply-To: <CAMSv6X2ySQQUnN5iBx9JuGss1_35hVkZc9wi92VSqMpCzF=Wyg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4EB1B211-13DB-459E-B240-FF8B615D5E74@me.com>
 <CAMSv6X2ySQQUnN5iBx9JuGss1_35hVkZc9wi92VSqMpCzF=Wyg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <22D8CE8A-E83F-4708-8248-8DD88864C825@me.com>

Armin,

> The documentation of PyGILState_Ensure() says, indeed, that it's ok to
> call this function even if the current thread already owns the GIL.
> If PyPy's version deadlocks in this case, then it's a bug of PyPy.
> Please file it as a bug (https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issues; also
> look a bit in case a similar bug would be already reported and waiting
> there).  You can also try to look in the implementation of
> PyGILState_Ensure() to make sure.

Thanks for the response. We found that by adding a 'with nogil' to our Cython we were able to resolve the problem. However, it's a bit error prone. The callback is for logging and the implication is that we have to release the GIL at any point where we call into C++ and log may be output. Since the same callback may also be called from a non Python thread we do need to ensure the GIL from there, so we can't just drop it. 

>From my point of view, it does seem like a PyPy bug; will check the tracker and open a bug if there's not already one. 

Thanks again

Nick


From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Mon May 26 06:19:47 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (Nick Williams)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2014 04:19:47 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1778: PyGILState_Ensure should not deadlock if
 GIL already held (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140526041947.7834.99129@app05.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1778: PyGILState_Ensure should not deadlock if GIL already held
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1778/pygilstate_ensure-should-not-deadlock-if

Nick Williams:

PyGILState_Ensure is documented as "(ensuring) that the current thread is ready to call the Python C API regardless of the current state of Python, or of the global interpreter lock". 

However, in PyPy, code which calls PyGILState_Ensure while already holding the GIL will deadlock. This does not happen in CPython and does not seem consistent with the Python documentation. 



From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Wed May 28 10:14:16 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (hugovk)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 08:14:16 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1779: im.point() 4000x slower than CPython
	(pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140528081416.12338.94850@app13.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1779: im.point() 4000x slower than CPython
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1779/impoint-4000x-slower-than-cpython

hugovk:

The following code takes nearly 4000 times longer on PyPy 2.2.1 compared with CPython. It takes less than a second with CPython compared with over 5 minutes on PyPy:

```
#!/usr/bin/env python

from PIL import Image

im = Image.open("lena.ppm")

im.point(list(range(256))*3)
im.point(lambda x: x)

im = im.convert("I")
im.point(lambda x: x*1)
im.point(lambda x: x+1)
im.point(lambda x: x*1+1)

im.point(list(range(256))*256, 'L')
```
Test code:
https://github.com/hugovk/test/tree/484

```
2.6     0m0.098s
2.7     0m0.042s
3.2     0m0.106s
3.3     0m0.094s
3.4     0m0.069s
PyPy    5m16.867s
```
PyPy time / average CPython time = 3873.6797066

Timings from:
https://travis-ci.org/hugovk/test/builds/26190010

The code is a simplified form of a Pillow test. At the moment it is skipped for PyPy as it takes too long. No coverage is involved.

I've not tested on PyPy 2.3.



From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Wed May 28 10:24:08 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (jackychaowang)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 08:24:08 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1780: pip install gevent doesn't work on pypy
	(pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140528082408.24448.68076@app07.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1780: pip install gevent doesn't work on pypy
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1780/pip-install-gevent-doesnt-work-on-pypy

jackychaowang:

Build error: 
* gevent/callbacks.c: 8:18: error: ?PyThreadState? has no member named ?curexc_type?
* gevent/callbacks.c:11:19: error: ?PyThreadState? has no member named ?curexc_value?
* gevent/callbacks.c:12:23: error: ?PyThreadState? has no member named ?curexc_traceback?

```
#!bash

In file included from gevent/gevent.core.c:47210:0:

gevent/callbacks.c: In function ?gevent_handle_error?:

gevent/callbacks.c:8:18: error: ?PyThreadState? has no member named ?curexc_type?

     type = tstate->curexc_type;

                  ^

gevent/callbacks.c:11:19: error: ?PyThreadState? has no member named ?curexc_value?

     value = tstate->curexc_value;

                   ^

gevent/callbacks.c:12:23: error: ?PyThreadState? has no member named ?curexc_traceback?

     traceback = tstate->curexc_traceback;

                       ^
```



From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Wed May 28 10:28:54 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (jackychaowang)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 08:28:54 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1781: pip install cython interferes pip install
 wheezy.web (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140528082854.4742.18018@app17.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1781: pip install cython interferes pip install wheezy.web
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1781/pip-install-cython-interferes-pip-install

jackychaowang:

This works:

```
#!bash

pip install wheezy.web
pip install cython
```

But once we change the order, it stop working:

```
#!bash

pip install cython
pip install wheezy.web

src/wheezy/web/middleware/errors.c: In function ?__Pyx_PyBytes_Join?:

src/wheezy/web/middleware/errors.c:2955:1: error: expected ?;? before ?}? token

 }
```



From numerodix at gmail.com  Wed May 28 19:15:54 2014
From: numerodix at gmail.com (Martin Matusiak)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 19:15:54 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] europython sprints?
Message-ID: <CAH88djX31ERdmg=J_hEydHwg+_jxez7g1VHpH2gLueWJJ5vr=A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I'm wondering if there will be pypy sprints at Europython this year
(?) And if so, which are the principal topics (I assume stm is one of
them..)?


Thanks,
Martin

From travis.jensen at oracle.com  Wed May 28 20:18:18 2014
From: travis.jensen at oracle.com (Travis Jensen)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2014 12:18:18 -0600
Subject: [pypy-dev] Getting involved
Message-ID: <5386286A.9010300@oracle.com>

Hi,

I've been following pypy for a while and have thought it would be fun to 
get involved.  Recently, I've been wondering what python with tail call 
optimization would look like (I'm disgruntled by GVR's decision :), and 
realized this might be a good way for me to get involved in pypy.

So a few questions: First, is this within the realms of (reasonable) 
possibility? I don't want to dive into something that is not 
realistically possible. Given I'm a noob in the pypy world, where would 
be a good place to start getting my feet wet on this?

Thanks.

tj

From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Thu May 29 15:07:44 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (estama)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2014 13:07:44 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1782: Test case where pypy is more than 4x slower
 than CPython (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140529130744.5276.16243@app03.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1782: Test case where pypy is more than 4x slower than CPython
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1782/test-case-where-pypy-is-more-than-4x

estama:

I've found a small example where PyPy is slower (more than 4x) than CPython. The example calculates all the possible groupings of a list of values. I've attached the example's code.

Timings:

time python allgroups.py
    20.75s user 0.04s system 99% cpu 20.820 total

time pypy allgroups.py
    97.31s user 1.07s system 99% cpu 1:38.55 total 



From gregor.wegberg at gmail.com  Thu May 29 17:28:43 2014
From: gregor.wegberg at gmail.com (Gregor Wegberg)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2014 17:28:43 +0200
Subject: [pypy-dev] hunting for reason of a failing test
	(rpython/memory/test/)
Message-ID: <5387522B.8090306@gmail.com>

Hi,

I'm working on an object pinning feature for incminimark right now. 
There is always one failing test (depending on the platform) 
in rpython/memory/test/test_incminimark_gc.py which I just can't solve. 
I'd appreciate any form of help. Even if it is just a "I may imagine 
that it is connected to X and Y" :-)

Basic resources:
- all my changes are in the following fork & branch: 
https://bitbucket.org/groggi/pypy/branch/gc-incminimark-pinning
- my `gc-incminimark-pinning` branch is based on PyPy's `release-2.3.x` 
branch
- pinning should work for "simple" objects, i.e. basically RPython 
strings. GC cards are not supported. More tests are needed of course.
- I am "gregor_w" in #pypy, so feel free to ping me

The following test results I get on the three major platforms running 
pytest on /rpython/memory/test:
- Windows (Visual Studio 2013 native tools): 
http://paste.pound-python.org/show/LPw4eCHE1EsfFTykQkWA/
   => failing test: test_print_leak

- OS X (clang): http://paste.pound-python.org/show/l85sUl56UCMDVxu1vrSS/
   => failing test: test_tagged_id

- Ubuntu (gcc): http://paste.pound-python.org/show/oAYctWSzF3OpqLtlBlUX/
   => failing tests: test_tagged_id

I have no idea why on Windows I get an other test to fail and 
test_tagged_id passes. However, maybe this gives you a hint.

I imagine that one of the following three reasons are responsible for 
the failing tests:
1.) I did some address calculations wrong inside incminimark. However, 
I'd expect to see way more failing tests in this case.
2.) My changes to get the GC transformation working with pin()/unpin() 
or the translation for the same two functions is wrong, so there is some 
error in
   rpython/memory/gctransform/framework.py,
   rpython/memory/gctransform/transform.py,
   rpython/rtyper/llinterp.py or
   rpython/rtyper/lltypesystem/lloperation.py.
   On the other hand I can translate PyPy with a PyPy binary containing 
my changes -- so this seems also somehow impossible?!
3.) It is some side effect as a result of the following changeset 
(llarena and lltype modification): 
https://bitbucket.org/groggi/pypy/commits/84898085a09814d1ec4f6b2b0d4202c7a985c0f9

I tried my best to check all three explanations and some more. However, 
I just can't see what is going wrong.

What I observed (only on OS X right now):
- changing `taggedpointers` to False solves the problem, i.e. test passes
- splitting both `print` statements inside the `fn` function into six 
prints with only one parameter (`print a, b, c` -> `print a\n print b\n 
print c`) leads to an error while executing the `print x`
- splitting the `print` statements again as before *and* setting 
`taggedpointers` to False leads to the same error as the original 
version of the test without modifications.

After 13-15 work hours trying to solve the bug I'm just lost. I have the 
feeling that it is something stupid and/or simple but my lack of PyPy 
knowledge stops me from seeing it. Any help is very much appreciated.

Cheers and thank you in advance,
Gregor

From issues-reply at bitbucket.org  Sat May 31 17:48:21 2014
From: issues-reply at bitbucket.org (Konstantin Lopuhin)
Date: Sat, 31 May 2014 15:48:21 -0000
Subject: [pypy-dev] Issue #1783: 50x higher memory usage with array.array
 (compared to CPython) (pypy/pypy)
Message-ID: <20140531154821.22294.49428@app05.ash-private.bitbucket.org>

New issue 1783: 50x higher memory usage with array.array (compared to CPython)
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/issue/1783/50x-higher-memory-usage-with-arrayarray

Konstantin Lopuhin:

I am trying to initialize a large array with an iterator (for example, where all values are zero initially), and PyPy consumes much more memory than CPython:


```
#!bash

$ python
Python 2.7.6 (v2.7.6:3a1db0d2747e, Nov 10 2013, 00:42:54) 
[GCC 4.2.1 (Apple Inc. build 5666) (dot 3)] on darwin

$ /usr/bin/time -l python -c "from array import array; array('b', (0 for _ in xrange(10000000)))"
        1.52 real         1.50 user         0.01 sys
  14954496  maximum resident set size
         0  average shared memory size
         0  average unshared data size
         0  average unshared stack size
      4131  page reclaims
         0  page faults
         0  swaps
         0  block input operations
         0  block output operations
         0  messages sent
         0  messages received
         0  signals received
         0  voluntary context switches
         7  involuntary context switches

$ pypy
Python 2.7.6 (394146e9bb67, May 08 2014, 16:45:59)
[PyPy 2.3.0 with GCC 4.2.1 Compatible Apple LLVM 5.0 (clang-500.2.79)] on darwin

$ /usr/bin/time -l pypy -c "from array import array; array('b', (0 for _ in xrange(10000000)))"
        1.47 real         1.13 user         0.32 sys
 736083968  maximum resident set size
         0  average shared memory size
         0  average unshared data size
         0  average unshared stack size
    223518  page reclaims
         1  page faults
         0  swaps
         0  block input operations
        20  block output operations
         0  messages sent
         0  messages received
         0  signals received
         0  voluntary context switches
         4  involuntary context switches
```