From jd at commandprompt.com  Mon Jan  5 21:29:21 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2009 12:29:21 -0800
Subject: [portland] PgDAY LFNW CFP
Message-ID: <1231187361.26750.10.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

Hello,


PostgreSQL Conference, U.S. is having a PgDay at LinuxFest Northwest in
Bellingham Washington on April 25th, 2009. The PgDay (and LinuxFest
Northwest) is a free event. We are holding the PgDAY on the first day of
the event (a Saturday) parallel with LFNW. There was over 700 attendees
to LFNW last year. LFNW is hoping for even more this year! In short, we
are looking for some PostgreSQL talks (45 minutes each) to fill out the
day. 

If you do anything with PostgreSQL, it would be great to have you speak!

http://www.postgresqlconference.org/2009/pgday/lfnw/

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake
-- 
PostgreSQL
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997


From jd at commandprompt.com  Wed Jan  7 01:04:41 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2009 16:04:41 -0800
Subject: [portland] [Fwd: [SEAPY] Northwest Python Day - date options]
Message-ID: <1231286681.12947.7.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

We probably don't want to let this go buy.

Joshua D. Drake

-- 
PostgreSQL
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997
-------------- next part --------------
An embedded message was scrubbed...
From: "Brian Dorsey" <brian at dorseys.org>
Subject: [SEAPY] Northwest Python Day - date options
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 12:51:32 -0800
Size: 2968
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090106/cbbe465f/attachment.eml>

From jek at discorporate.us  Thu Jan  8 00:16:51 2009
From: jek at discorporate.us (jason kirtland)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 15:16:51 -0800
Subject: [portland] Apress Seeks reviewers for new Pylons and Django books
Message-ID: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>

Hi all,

Got a ping from Apress today looking for reviewers for these new books:

"The Definitive Guide to Pylons"
by James Gardner | ISBN-13: 978-1-59059-934-1 | Published Dec 2008 | 568pp.

http://apress.com/book/view/1590599349


"Pro Django"
by Marty Alchin | ISBN-13: 978-1-4302-1047-4 | Published Dec 2008 | 320pp.

http://apress.com/book/view/1430210478

Apress is looking for anyone "[...] interested in posting a prompt, 
thorough review this book. We have a limited number of copies of the 
books above, so I will send on a first come first serve basis. My 
apologies in advance if you do not receive a book because of this."

If you are interested I'll put you in touch.

Cheers,
Jason

From michael at susens-schurter.com  Thu Jan  8 01:07:44 2009
From: michael at susens-schurter.com (Michael Schurter)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 16:07:44 -0800
Subject: [portland] Apress Seeks reviewers for new Pylons and Django
	books
In-Reply-To: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
References: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
Message-ID: <240b71640901071607h33c8d255mf3323a9e0fc5394e@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 3:16 PM, jason kirtland <jek at discorporate.us> wrote:
> "Pro Django"
> by Marty Alchin | ISBN-13: 978-1-4302-1047-4 | Published Dec 2008 | 320pp.
>
> http://apress.com/book/view/1430210478
>
> Apress is looking for anyone "[...] interested in posting a prompt, thorough
> review this book. We have a limited number of copies of the books above, so
> I will send on a first come first serve basis. My apologies in advance if
> you do not receive a book because of this."
>
> If you are interested I'll put you in touch.

Always interested in free books!  fwiw, I reviewed another Django book
before (albeit not that thoroughly):

http://www.amazon.com/review/RD97MG4OJR18V

Thanks!
Michael (schmichael)

From notbot at gmail.com  Thu Jan  8 01:08:45 2009
From: notbot at gmail.com (Michael Bunsen)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 16:08:45 -0800
Subject: [portland] Apress Seeks reviewers for new Pylons and Django
	books
In-Reply-To: <240b71640901071607h33c8d255mf3323a9e0fc5394e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
	<240b71640901071607h33c8d255mf3323a9e0fc5394e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1056a3050901071608x1fda6fe2n2558dabd83d57ac0@mail.gmail.com>

doh! I just ordered the Pylons book an hour ago!

michael


On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Michael Schurter
<michael at susens-schurter.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 3:16 PM, jason kirtland <jek at discorporate.us> wrote:
>> "Pro Django"
>> by Marty Alchin | ISBN-13: 978-1-4302-1047-4 | Published Dec 2008 | 320pp.
>>
>> http://apress.com/book/view/1430210478
>>
>> Apress is looking for anyone "[...] interested in posting a prompt, thorough
>> review this book. We have a limited number of copies of the books above, so
>> I will send on a first come first serve basis. My apologies in advance if
>> you do not receive a book because of this."
>>
>> If you are interested I'll put you in touch.
>
> Always interested in free books!  fwiw, I reviewed another Django book
> before (albeit not that thoroughly):
>
> http://www.amazon.com/review/RD97MG4OJR18V
>
> Thanks!
> Michael (schmichael)
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From michael at susens-schurter.com  Thu Jan  8 01:09:24 2009
From: michael at susens-schurter.com (Michael Schurter)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 16:09:24 -0800
Subject: [portland] Apress Seeks reviewers for new Pylons and Django
	books
In-Reply-To: <240b71640901071607h33c8d255mf3323a9e0fc5394e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
	<240b71640901071607h33c8d255mf3323a9e0fc5394e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <240b71640901071609i2dd23430s16e77a47f392e008@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Michael Schurter
<michael at susens-schurter.com> wrote:
> Always interested in free books!  fwiw, I reviewed another Django book

And I didn't mean to reply to the whole list...  sorry all.

From jek at discorporate.us  Thu Jan  8 01:41:25 2009
From: jek at discorporate.us (jason kirtland)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 16:41:25 -0800
Subject: [portland] Apress Seeks reviewers for new Pylons and Django
	books
In-Reply-To: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
References: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
Message-ID: <49654BB5.7040305@discorporate.us>

Wow big response!  I heard from a mess of folks and just sent in our 
request. (2 Pylons, 3 Django).  I don't think they have many copies to 
go around and as this was first-come, first-served, I sent in our list 
without further delay.  Sorry if anyone missed out!


jason kirtland wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> Got a ping from Apress today looking for reviewers for these new books:
> 
> "The Definitive Guide to Pylons"
> by James Gardner | ISBN-13: 978-1-59059-934-1 | Published Dec 2008 | 568pp.
> 
> http://apress.com/book/view/1590599349
> 
> 
> "Pro Django"
> by Marty Alchin | ISBN-13: 978-1-4302-1047-4 | Published Dec 2008 | 320pp.
> 
> http://apress.com/book/view/1430210478
> 
> Apress is looking for anyone "[...] interested in posting a prompt, 
> thorough review this book. We have a limited number of copies of the 
> books above, so I will send on a first come first serve basis. My 
> apologies in advance if you do not receive a book because of this."
> 
> If you are interested I'll put you in touch.
> 
> Cheers,
> Jason
> 


From michael at susens-schurter.com  Thu Jan  8 01:42:55 2009
From: michael at susens-schurter.com (Michael Schurter)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 16:42:55 -0800
Subject: [portland] Apress Seeks reviewers for new Pylons and Django
	books
In-Reply-To: <49654BB5.7040305@discorporate.us>
References: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
	<49654BB5.7040305@discorporate.us>
Message-ID: <240b71640901071642q51b7f258k75b496aff4af0116@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 4:41 PM, jason kirtland <jek at discorporate.us> wrote:
> Wow big response!  I heard from a mess of folks and just sent in our
> request. (2 Pylons, 3 Django).  I don't think they have many copies to go
> around and as this was first-come, first-served, I sent in our list without
> further delay.  Sorry if anyone missed out!

Given I've already admitted to the world that I've gotten a free
Django books before, I can be at the bottom of the list.  ;-)

Cheers,
Michael "Doesn't know how to use mailing lists" Schurter

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Jan  8 23:56:44 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 14:56:44 -0800
Subject: [portland] Apress Seeks reviewers for new Pylons and Django
	books
In-Reply-To: <240b71640901071642q51b7f258k75b496aff4af0116@mail.gmail.com>
References: <496537E3.3010600@discorporate.us>
	<49654BB5.7040305@discorporate.us>
	<240b71640901071642q51b7f258k75b496aff4af0116@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0901081456h767e2f0dled470767a9e15b4c@mail.gmail.com>

I have too many review commitments to try at another, though one of
those seems to have gone very back burner, should be cartoons anyway,
not a book (or at least both -- comic book?, but more cerebral than
Archie (for dummies)).

Django, on the other hand, I continue to be impressed with, like the
idea of those journalists, used to deadlines, finding a way to
streamline a web framework, just have regexps parse urls, trigger
views, serve templates.  Layer an SQL proxy language to cover the
different back ends, and voila, ready for action, just add Apache (and
the back end, static media etc.).

Where I work, you've got this vast cube farm of Microsoft Office
people, harvesting data sometimes.  But as soon as they go to share,
multi-user, there's nothing robust that they've been instructed in how
to use.  Serious databases are read-only (customized by others)
whereas local cube Access mdbs just aren't that serious.  So there's
this open gap, nation-wide, where people are looking for the car keys
to affordable DB work.  That's where open source has exploded with
LAMP (now ARM / AMP) in eCommerce, but the local office intranet is
still to see the benefits in many cases, still stuck in the 1980s and
thick client solutions.

Anyway, that's my read.  Wish they taught SQL and regexps in high
school, in the context of what they're used for, think we'd attract
more small time community gardeners, curators, stamp collectors, all
manner of hobbiest just wanting to get stuff out there, not having the
money to pay XYZ to do it all for her.  Teach Django at Cleveland and
Grant, why not?

Kirby


On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 4:42 PM, Michael Schurter
<michael at susens-schurter.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 4:41 PM, jason kirtland <jek at discorporate.us> wrote:
>> Wow big response!  I heard from a mess of folks and just sent in our
>> request. (2 Pylons, 3 Django).  I don't think they have many copies to go
>> around and as this was first-come, first-served, I sent in our list without
>> further delay.  Sorry if anyone missed out!
>
> Given I've already admitted to the world that I've gotten a free
> Django books before, I can be at the bottom of the list.  ;-)
>
> Cheers,
> Michael "Doesn't know how to use mailing lists" Schurter
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From gods_bud666 at hotmail.com  Fri Jan  9 06:22:56 2009
From: gods_bud666 at hotmail.com (Anthony Smith)
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 21:22:56 -0800
Subject: [portland] to Jason regarding the Apress review group
Message-ID: <BLU146-DAV77C0AAF648E495383644FCADD0@phx.gbl>

Hey.

Just read the 'press' about finding reviewers for the
Apress books.

What sort of person would fulfill a decent review of
those books listed?  I mean, would I qualify as a 
competant reviewer for one of them, or would I need
a decent knowledge or application of web design?

My competancy ranges from writing and debugging 
programs in BASIC, back in the early 80s.  To
reading about assembly language (for the 6502); learning how elementary ICs work together; then studying 
a whole range of cryptic and sophisticated websites
on the subject of just anything computer-related,

to actually downloading and working with python,
which I would have to be considered a 'newcomer'.

If my input would not be useful to the task,
what would then be a suitable direction to go in?
I have great ability and interest in the subject -
python just seemed to me to be the best place
to start...I suppose C or Javascript or HTML or
Unix or Linux or Qbasic or whatever would be
courses for action.

If all you need is an average person to give input,
count me in. . . 

 . . Any excuse to learn more about computers or the
web.

Will be reading all emails from Portland in future.

Thanks,

Tony.
  
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090108/27c333d9/attachment.htm>

From brian at dorseys.org  Fri Jan  9 09:33:33 2009
From: brian at dorseys.org (Brian Dorsey)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 00:33:33 -0800
Subject: [portland] Northwest Python Day - Seattle, WA - January 31st
Message-ID: <66e877b70901090033p12c96373je6b312fb420b99b9@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everyone,

On behalf of the Seattle Python Interest Group, I'd like to invite you
to join us for an informal day of Python talks & socializing.

When: Saturday, January, 31st 9am - 5pm
Where: University of Washington campus, Seattle, Washington
Price: Free!
Details and updated information: http://www.seapig.org/NorthwestPythonDay

The day will be mostly 30 minute talks and two sets of 5 minute
lightning talks. We'll also have plenty of time to chat over lunch and
dinner/drinks.

We still have room for a few more talks, please propose a talk!
(http://www.seapig.org/NorthwestPythonDay for details)

Please join us and forward this on to other Python people!

Take care,
  -Brian

From jek at discorporate.us  Fri Jan  9 22:20:36 2009
From: jek at discorporate.us (jason kirtland)
Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 13:20:36 -0800
Subject: [portland] to Jason regarding the Apress review group
In-Reply-To: <BLU146-DAV77C0AAF648E495383644FCADD0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU146-DAV77C0AAF648E495383644FCADD0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4967BFA4.4010907@discorporate.us>

Anthony Smith wrote:
> Hey.
> 
> Just read the 'press' about finding reviewers for the
> Apress books.
> 
> What sort of person would fulfill a decent review of
> those books listed?  I mean, would I qualify as a 
> competant reviewer for one of them, or would I need
> a decent knowledge or application of web design?
> 
> My competancy ranges from writing and debugging 
> programs in BASIC, back in the early 80s.  To
> reading about assembly language (for the 6502); learning how elementary ICs work together; then studying 
> a whole range of cryptic and sophisticated websites
> on the subject of just anything computer-related,
> 
> to actually downloading and working with python,
> which I would have to be considered a 'newcomer'.
> 
> If my input would not be useful to the task,
> what would then be a suitable direction to go in?
> I have great ability and interest in the subject -
> python just seemed to me to be the best place
> to start...I suppose C or Javascript or HTML or
> Unix or Linux or Qbasic or whatever would be
> courses for action.
> 
> If all you need is an average person to give input,
> count me in. . . 
> 
>  . . Any excuse to learn more about computers or the
> web.
> 
> Will be reading all emails from Portland in future.
> 

Hi Tony,

I believe Apress is usually on the lookout for reviewers for their new 
titles.  The have some info about what they're looking for at the URL 
below, and possibly more elsewhere on their site:

   http://apress.com/community/writeareview

I've never personally done a review for them so I don't have any first 
hand knowledge of their reviewer criteria.

Cheers,
Jason

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Sun Jan 11 06:46:34 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 21:46:34 -0800
Subject: [portland] Django question
Message-ID: <f604188c0901102146w131549e7ubc8541ba2d67104c@mail.gmail.com>

So what's the scoop on Django with Microsoft SQL server, anyone doing
that on the job currently?  My demo, good for projecting to
prospectives, is MySQL, shows off using Kanji (non-Latin-1 is
important to some), but that's old hat in database work, Unicode the
norm (though might not be the SQL engine's 'create table' default).

Patrick of buzz-bot fame (came to our meeting) was telling me over
bloody marys yesterday that Oracle is really better than MySQL but I
was saying a little known feature of MySQL is you can swap out its
back end, but IBM's DB2 if you want.  I'm sure I heard that from a
master, but know I should get some citations.

Anyway, the default settings.py is flavors of Postgres and Oracle, but
I don't see MSFT in my current Subversion version.  I realize I could
Google up a reply, but am hoping for juicy anecdotes or tidbits from
real world users.  Tell us a pitfall.  Mine would be:  remembering to
set it for Unicode and remind your clients we have lots of Laotians in
Portland (me to DemocracyLab, me to... whomever).  Actually Laotian
might not be the best example, doesn't matter -- internationalization
is a big theme in some circles.

Also, people say I'm too hard on Access, just because it's not build
for robust multi-user environments (or do we disagree?), isn't it
still an excellent client, via ODBC?  Indeed, our big project through
FreeGeek involved letting the client hold on to Access, even after all
our open source ranting (we had some real die hards) because the open
source world has utterly failed to make reporting so corporate and
button down looking as Crystal Reports.  I'd counter you can do
anything with ReportLab to PDF, and PDF is the way most customers want
their reports, if they think about it (an underused format, can embed
stuff, internal links -- really fancy if kept electronic, as it should
be).

But I think field (column) names with blanks, square brackets, all
that clutter in the SQL... count me a skeptic.  Then remember why I'm
biased:  years and years of being a FoxPro programmer, watching
Microsoft market the hell out of the VBA flagship, while keeping this
xBase competitor buried.  They only bought it to spite Borland, which
went with dBase V.  Visual FoxPro runs circles around Access, when it
comes to coding language sophistication, development environment, plus
has the same banded reports and visual tools if you need 'em.  Not
part of Visual Studio because, get this, *better* than Visual Studio.
OK, my cards on the table, I'm a FoxPro fan, what can I say, even if
it's more Python that's paying the bills these days.

Kirby

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Sun Jan 11 07:08:34 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 22:08:34 -0800
Subject: [portland] Django question
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0901102146w131549e7ubc8541ba2d67104c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <f604188c0901102146w131549e7ubc8541ba2d67104c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720901102208g1c66c78emb5861324e282ec40@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 9:46 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:

> I'd counter you can do
> anything with ReportLab to PDF, and PDF is the way most customers want
> their reports, if they think about it (an underused format, can embed
> stuff, internal links -- really fancy if kept electronic, as it should
> be).


Yeah... except that reports are (for better or worse) expected to do more
than just present snapshots of data.

PDF isn't conducive to interactive drill-downs, for example.

$.02
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090110/2924bd4a/attachment.htm>

From mrowley at gmail.com  Tue Jan 13 04:44:32 2009
From: mrowley at gmail.com (michelle rowley)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 19:44:32 -0800
Subject: [portland] next meeting: tomorrow night, 7:00pm @ cubespace!
Message-ID: <813046e40901121944w2fab1198l3f188ae3f7d755e0@mail.gmail.com>

happy new year, python peeps! the first meeting of 2009 is just around the
corner (tomorrow night at 7:00!), so if it's not already on your calendar,
get your pens out.

on the agenda tomorrow is a talk by John Melesky on metaclasses, and with a
little prodding we may get Jason Kirtland on dict tricks, and Michel
Pelletier on deque. we also want to start up a discussion about what
everyone would like to hear about (and/or talk about) this year.

so! no hemming & hawing, people! tomorrow, 7:00pm, cubespace - see you
there. :)


meetup link: http://python.meetup.com/183/calendar/9312544/

cubespace info:
622 SE Grand Ave.
Portland, OR 97214
503-206-3500
http://cubespacepdx.com/


michelle
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090112/4a09a069/attachment.htm>

From mrowley at gmail.com  Tue Jan 13 06:17:15 2009
From: mrowley at gmail.com (michelle rowley)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 21:17:15 -0800
Subject: [portland] tomorrow's meeting: another presentation added!
Message-ID: <813046e40901122117h24bad575s8df787ed4242c0e0@mail.gmail.com>

hey pythoneers,

we've just added a fabulous bonus talk for the meeting tomorrow: Monica Toth
will be presenting about natural language processing. as if you needed
another reason to join us! well... if you did, this is a good one. :)

see you tomorrow!
michelle
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090112/2e5ab982/attachment.htm>

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 09:22:17 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 00:22:17 -0800
Subject: [portland] Jan 13 write-up (biased)
Message-ID: <f604188c0901140022m1e80d193p344d213869ef8780@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for a very educational evening all.

I filed a blog post, missing lots of what happened as I was also doing
OS Bridge:

http://mybizmo.blogspot.com/2009/01/ppug-2009113.html

Note Guido's newest blog:

http://python-history.blogspot.com/

Until next time!

Kirby

From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Wed Jan 14 19:17:30 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:17:30 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland]  Upgrading from Python-2.4 to -2.5
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

Robin Dunn robin at alldunn.com wrote:

>>   import dbus_bindings
>> warning: python-dbus not installed.
>> warning: python-dbus not installed.
>> error: dbus failed to load (python-dbus ver. 0.80+ required). Exiting...

> The same thing. The message means that Python 2.5 is using a binary
> extension module (dbus_bindings) that was built with Python 2.4.

   In /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/ I have a dbus/ directory containing
__init__.py                   connection.pyc       gobject_service.pyo
__init__.pyc                  connection.pyo       lowlevel.py
__init__.pyo                  dbus_bindings.py     lowlevel.pyc
_dbus.py                      dbus_bindings.pyc    lowlevel.pyo
_dbus.pyc                     dbus_bindings.pyo    mainloop/
_dbus.pyo                     decorators.py        proxies.py
_expat_introspect_parser.py   decorators.pyc       proxies.pyc
_expat_introspect_parser.pyc  decorators.pyo       proxies.pyo
_expat_introspect_parser.pyo  exceptions.py        service.py
_version.py                   exceptions.pyc       service.pyc
_version.pyc                  exceptions.pyo       service.pyo
_version.pyo                  glib.py              types.py
bus.py                        glib.pyc             types.pyc
bus.pyc                       glib.pyo             types.pyo
bus.pyo                       gobject_service.py
connection.py                 gobject_service.pyc

   There is no install.py, setup.py, or build.py script. What do I do to
complete the installation so the system sees, and uses, the python-dbus for
2.5 rather than for 2.4?

Thank you,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From jd at commandprompt.com  Wed Jan 14 19:20:40 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:20:40 -0800
Subject: [portland] Upgrading from Python-2.4 to -2.5
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <1231957240.12600.106.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

On Wed, 2009-01-14 at 10:17 -0800, Rich Shepard wrote:
> Robin Dunn robin at alldunn.com wrote:

>    There is no install.py, setup.py, or build.py script. What do I do to
> complete the installation so the system sees, and uses, the python-dbus for
> 2.5 rather than for 2.4?
> 

what happens when you do:

jd at jd-laptop:~/repos/nwea/row_crypto_poc/scripts$ python2.5
Python 2.5.2 (r252:60911, Oct  5 2008, 19:29:17) 
[GCC 4.3.2] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> import dbus
>>> 


Joshua D. Drake

-- 
PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake at jabber.postgresql.org
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997


From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Wed Jan 14 19:24:34 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:24:34 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Upgrading from Python-2.4 to -2.5
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141022230.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:

>  In /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/ I have a dbus/ directory containing

  ... and in /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/ there are:

_dbus_bindings.la*
_dbus_bindings.so*
_dbus_glib_bindings.la*
_dbus_glib_bindings.so*
_gamin.la*
_gamin.so*
_pisock.so*

   Should I remove the underscore so they are seen by the applications
looking for these libraries?

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Wed Jan 14 19:26:44 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:26:44 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Upgrading from Python-2.4 to -2.5
In-Reply-To: <1231957240.12600.106.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<1231957240.12600.106.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141025300.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Joshua D. Drake wrote:

> what happens when you do:
>
> jd at jd-laptop:~/repos/nwea/row_crypto_poc/scripts$ python2.5
> Python 2.5.2 (r252:60911, Oct  5 2008, 19:29:17)
> [GCC 4.3.2] on linux2
> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>>> import dbus
>>>>

Joshua,

   It's unhappy:

[rshepard at salmo ~]$ python
Python 2.5.2 (r252:60911, Aug  3 2008, 15:34:23) 
[GCC 4.2.3] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> import dbus
/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/dbus/_dbus.py:45: RuntimeWarning: Python C
API version mismatch for module dbus_bindings: This Python has API version
1013, module dbus_bindings has version 1012.
   import dbus_bindings
Traceback (most recent call last):
   File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/dbus/__init__.py", line 1, in
<module>
     from _dbus import *
   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/dbus/_dbus.py", line 48, in
<module>
     from proxies import *
   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py", line 2, in
<module>
     import introspect_parser
   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/dbus/introspect_parser.py", line 1,
in <module>
     import libxml2
ImportError: Bad magic number in
/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/libxml2.pyc
>>>

   So I need to point python to the 2.5 site-packages rather than the 2.4
site-packages.

Rich


-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Wed Jan 14 22:12:49 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:12:49 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Curious Ipython Upgrade Result
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141310330.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

   I had Ipython-0.7.3 installed with python-2.4, so I just built and
installed ipython-0.8.4 with python-2.5. The only ipython (or Ipython) found
on the system is /usr/bin/ipython, with today's date. Yet, when I invoke
ipython on the command line it tells me that it's version 0.7.3.

   What might I have done incorrectly?

Thanks,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From robin at alldunn.com  Wed Jan 14 22:20:16 2009
From: robin at alldunn.com (Robin Dunn)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:20:16 -0800
Subject: [portland] Upgrading from Python-2.4 to -2.5
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <496E5710.2010003@alldunn.com>

Rich Shepard wrote:
> Robin Dunn robin at alldunn.com wrote:
> 
>>>   import dbus_bindings
>>> warning: python-dbus not installed.
>>> warning: python-dbus not installed.
>>> error: dbus failed to load (python-dbus ver. 0.80+ required). Exiting...
> 
>> The same thing. The message means that Python 2.5 is using a binary
>> extension module (dbus_bindings) that was built with Python 2.4.
> 
>   In /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/ I have a dbus/ directory containing
> __init__.py                   connection.pyc       gobject_service.pyo
> __init__.pyc                  connection.pyo       lowlevel.py
> __init__.pyo                  dbus_bindings.py     lowlevel.pyc
> _dbus.py                      dbus_bindings.pyc    lowlevel.pyo
> _dbus.pyc                     dbus_bindings.pyo    mainloop/
> _dbus.pyo                     decorators.py        proxies.py
> _expat_introspect_parser.py   decorators.pyc       proxies.pyc
> _expat_introspect_parser.pyc  decorators.pyo       proxies.pyo
> _expat_introspect_parser.pyo  exceptions.py        service.py
> _version.py                   exceptions.pyc       service.pyc
> _version.pyc                  exceptions.pyo       service.pyo
> _version.pyo                  glib.py              types.py
> bus.py                        glib.pyc             types.pyc
> bus.pyc                       glib.pyo             types.pyo
> bus.pyo                       gobject_service.py
> connection.py                 gobject_service.pyc
> 
>   There is no install.py, setup.py, or build.py script. What do I do to
> complete the installation so the system sees, and uses, the python-dbus for
> 2.5 rather than for 2.4?

Get the source from http://dbus.freedesktop.org/releases/dbus-python/, 
untar it, and run something like "python2.5 setup.py install" like any 
other package.  Or if it isn't using distutils then it will probably use 
the configure; make; make install kind of recipe.

-- 
Robin Dunn
Software Craftsman
http://wxPython.org  Java give you jitters?  Relax with wxPython!


From robin at alldunn.com  Wed Jan 14 22:22:48 2009
From: robin at alldunn.com (Robin Dunn)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:22:48 -0800
Subject: [portland] Upgrading from Python-2.4 to -2.5
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141022230.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141022230.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <496E57A8.7060607@alldunn.com>

Rich Shepard wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:
> 
>>  In /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/ I have a dbus/ directory containing
> 
>  ... and in /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/ there are:
> 
> _dbus_bindings.la*
> _dbus_bindings.so*
> _dbus_glib_bindings.la*
> _dbus_glib_bindings.so*
> _gamin.la*
> _gamin.so*
> _pisock.so*
> 
>   Should I remove the underscore so they are seen by the applications
> looking for these libraries?

If you just copied them from your 2.4 site-packages instead of building 
and installing new ones, then yes I would remove them, at least the 
*dbus*.* files.


-- 
Robin Dunn
Software Craftsman
http://wxPython.org  Java give you jitters?  Relax with wxPython!


From robin at alldunn.com  Wed Jan 14 22:24:47 2009
From: robin at alldunn.com (Robin Dunn)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:24:47 -0800
Subject: [portland] Upgrading from Python-2.4 to -2.5
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141025300.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141012150.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>	<1231957240.12600.106.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>
	<alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141025300.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <496E581F.4070308@alldunn.com>

Rich Shepard wrote:

>   It's unhappy:
> 
> [rshepard at salmo ~]$ python
> Python 2.5.2 (r252:60911, Aug  3 2008, 15:34:23) [GCC 4.2.3] on linux2
> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>>> import dbus
> /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/dbus/_dbus.py:45: RuntimeWarning: Python C
> API version mismatch for module dbus_bindings: This Python has API version
> 1013, module dbus_bindings has version 1012.
>   import dbus_bindings

> 
>   So I need to point python to the 2.5 site-packages rather than the 2.4
> site-packages.

Python 2.5 should not be looking at /usr/lib/python2.4 by itself.  Do 
you have that path specified in a PYTHONPATH setting or something?  If 
so, remove it.

-- 
Robin Dunn
Software Craftsman
http://wxPython.org  Java give you jitters?  Relax with wxPython!


From robin at alldunn.com  Wed Jan 14 22:26:24 2009
From: robin at alldunn.com (Robin Dunn)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:26:24 -0800
Subject: [portland] Curious Ipython Upgrade Result
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141310330.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141310330.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <496E5880.3000207@alldunn.com>

Rich Shepard wrote:
>   I had Ipython-0.7.3 installed with python-2.4, so I just built and
> installed ipython-0.8.4 with python-2.5. The only ipython (or Ipython) 
> found
> on the system is /usr/bin/ipython, with today's date. Yet, when I invoke
> ipython on the command line it tells me that it's version 0.7.3.
> 
>   What might I have done incorrectly?

This may be the same as my last email.  If your PYTHONPATH is set 
incorrectly then it can be finding the old ipython package in the 2.4 tree.

-- 
Robin Dunn
Software Craftsman
http://wxPython.org  Java give you jitters?  Relax with wxPython!


From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Wed Jan 14 22:38:22 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 13:38:22 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Curious Ipython Upgrade Result
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141310330.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141310330.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141336030.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:

>  What might I have done incorrectly?

   Robin's reply to the dbus issue caused me to look for a PYTHONPATH
statement. It is in ~/.bash_profile. I just commented it out and sourced
that file but it did not change the ipython version.

   Later I'll shut down X, log out, and log back it. Without the PYTHONPATH
specified it should clear up these issues.

   I'll post the results ... I'm out for a meeting now.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Thu Jan 15 00:52:38 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:52:38 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Curious Ipython Upgrade Result
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141336030.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141310330.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141336030.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141551490.9235@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:

>  I'll post the results ...

   That cleaned up the ipython issue. Now I need to see if the dbus issue is
also resolved.

Thanks, Robin,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Thu Jan 15 01:15:29 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:15:29 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Curious Ipython Upgrade Result
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141551490.9235@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141310330.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141336030.18248@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141551490.9235@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901141614570.9235@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

On Wed, 14 Jan 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:

>  That cleaned up the ipython issue. Now I need to see if the dbus issue is
> also resolved.

   Yup. dbus is running again.

   Again, thanks, Robin,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 05:28:43 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 20:28:43 -0800
Subject: [portland] confirming VPython presentation...
Message-ID: <f604188c0901142028s32be3afbx9aad7e37f6e7b931@mail.gmail.com>

Michelle (sp?), thanks for asking me to present on VPython next PPUG and I
plan to do so.

Some around that table have seen my VPython "hypertoons" before **, and
while I'll certainly include those, I'm also hankering to show a "point of
sale device" in a VPython format -- not necessarily the most practical
(Pyglet better?) but still a fun project, open to collaboration if anyone
wants to imagine the pipeworks (has to show money coming in for an item,
forking into separate "buckets" based on user input -- kind of like
switching trains around, aerial view of a switch yard...).

I'm hoping to use the new VPython (V5):  http://vpython.org/index5.html

Mac specific:  http://developer.apple.com/business/macmarket/checkout.html

Re: pyglet:
http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=476760

In general I'm interest in open source POS (point of sale) tools written in
Python, not wanting to reinvent every wheel I come to.  On the other hand,
some of these may morph into back office visualizations at the end of the
day, keeping the POS cash register simple. This is because I'm moving my
"game tokens" concept to the CSN booth LCD, the place where you actually
play the vendor-supplied game, winnings going to charities of your choice
(plus you get the scone or latte or whatever it was).^^

Keep in touch ya'll, see some of you @ CubeSpace (I've been haunting Korean
and Burmese, also Kermit so far).

Kirby

** http://www.grunch.net/synergetics/  (esoteric)

^^ https://wanderers.pbwiki.com/CoffeeShopsNetwork
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090114/d02478af/attachment.htm>

From master.sparkle at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 06:22:10 2009
From: master.sparkle at gmail.com (Charles Anderson)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:22:10 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
Message-ID: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>

Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college class
in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals, iteration,
methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.


thanks,
Charles.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm>

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 06:30:39 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:30:39 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0901152130y3d223373ycf9254d620921148@mail.gmail.com>

I just tell my students to subscribe to Safari, save money in the long
run.  But then I'm not required by my institution of higher learning
to assign printed materials, so that makes my job ridiculously easy.

Kirby

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson
<master.sparkle at gmail.com> wrote:
> Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
> Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college class
> in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
> should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals, iteration,
> methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
> Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
> introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
>
>
> thanks,
> Charles.
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From thomashamlin at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 06:46:12 2009
From: thomashamlin at gmail.com (Thomas Hamlin)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:46:12 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BE614129-7291-48B7-B418-07B40227E731@gmail.com>

Charles,

You might check out Toby Segaran's Programming Collective Intelligence  
(2007 O'Reilly).  It's chock full of practical Python code, and the  
students will be exposed to a broad range of algorithms (clustering,  
search/query/ranking, Bayesian classification, neural networks) and  
useful libraries for parsing and working with data.  While the topics  
sound quite advanced, the book remains accessible because of its focus  
on applied programming.  I can imagine lots of interesting assignments  
around the topics in the book.

However, you'll have to see whether he addresses the more  
"interesting" language constructs of Python, since the examples are  
fairly focused and rather scripty.  You could augment it with an  
exploration of the internals of one of the  interesting Python  
packages, say SQLAlchemy or one of the web app frameworks...

(I agree on Kirby's Safari online library suggestion, too).

Regards,
Thomas

On Jan 15, 2009, at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson wrote:

> Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for  
> teaching
> Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a  
> college class
> in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So,  
> they
> should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals,  
> iteration,
> methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits  
> of
> Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
> introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
>
>
> thanks,
> Charles.
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm 
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/98f76431/attachment.htm>

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Fri Jan 16 17:16:36 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 08:16:36 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720901160816o602675djcbd28607a7e9ca3a@mail.gmail.com>

O'Reilly's Learning Python is a classic... though it's gained a lot of
weight the last couple revisions.

It's not structured as a text, if that matters to you.

$.02

Dylan


On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson
<master.sparkle at gmail.com>wrote:

> Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
> Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college class
> in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
> should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals, iteration,
> methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
> Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
> introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
>
>
> thanks,
> Charles.
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/cc88bea7/attachment.htm>

From mrowley at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 18:17:03 2009
From: mrowley at gmail.com (michelle rowley)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 09:17:03 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720901160816o602675djcbd28607a7e9ca3a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720901160816o602675djcbd28607a7e9ca3a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <813046e40901160917x49c2e651x480299e3d255130a@mail.gmail.com>

what about dive into python (http://diveintopython.org/)? it's free, which
is good for students. i used it quite a bit when i was learning python, and
i liked it. just a thought...

michelle

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 8:16 AM, Dylan Reinhardt
<python at dylanreinhardt.com>wrote:

> O'Reilly's Learning Python is a classic... though it's gained a lot of
> weight the last couple revisions.
>
> It's not structured as a text, if that matters to you.
>
> $.02
>
> Dylan
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson
> <master.sparkle at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
> > Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college
> class
> > in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
> > should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals,
> iteration,
> > methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
> > Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
> > introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
> >
> >
> > thanks,
> > Charles.
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL: <
> >
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Portland mailing list
> > Portland at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> >
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/cc88bea7/attachment.htm
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/9e944236/attachment.htm>

From jd at commandprompt.com  Fri Jan 16 18:18:30 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 09:18:30 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <813046e40901160917x49c2e651x480299e3d255130a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720901160816o602675djcbd28607a7e9ca3a@mail.gmail.com>
	<813046e40901160917x49c2e651x480299e3d255130a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1232126310.16299.11.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

On Fri, 2009-01-16 at 09:17 -0800, michelle rowley wrote:
> what about dive into python (http://diveintopython.org/)? it's free, which
> is good for students. i used it quite a bit when i was learning python, and
> i liked it. just a thought...

There is also:

http://www.greenteapress.com/thinkpython/

Joshua D. Drake


> 
> michelle
> 
> On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 8:16 AM, Dylan Reinhardt
> <python at dylanreinhardt.com>wrote:
> 
> > O'Reilly's Learning Python is a classic... though it's gained a lot of
> > weight the last couple revisions.
> >
> > It's not structured as a text, if that matters to you.
> >
> > $.02
> >
> > Dylan
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson
> > <master.sparkle at gmail.com>wrote:
> >
> > > Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
> > > Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college
> > class
> > > in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
> > > should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals,
> > iteration,
> > > methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
> > > Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
> > > introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
> > >
> > >
> > > thanks,
> > > Charles.
> > > -------------- next part --------------
> > > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > > URL: <
> > >
> > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Portland mailing list
> > > Portland at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> > >
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL: <
> > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/cc88bea7/attachment.htm
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Portland mailing list
> > Portland at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> >
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/9e944236/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> 
-- 
PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake at jabber.postgresql.org
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997


From outofthenet at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 19:20:05 2009
From: outofthenet at gmail.com (Chris Foster)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 10:20:05 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6d642e220901161020j5e3618d9x5edd8d173e2122c2@mail.gmail.com>

It's not a textbook, but I'd highly recommend the Python Essential Reference
by Beazley *http://tinyurl.com/2ze3j6 * as an optional reference for kids
who really care to learn.  There is a new version coming out in March (v.3),
but the old ones (thru v.2.4) can be picked up for about $10 used.
Beazley's summaries are the clearest and most concise I've seen.  Java
sufferers will be blown away by the index of goodies and examples.  BTW, I
tried the Nutshell book.  Martelli is a fantastic speaker, but just not
quite as clear in my opinion.

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson
<master.sparkle at gmail.com>wrote:

> Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
> Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college class
> in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
> should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals, iteration,
> methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
> Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
> introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
>
>
> thanks,
> Charles.
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/c5df328d/attachment.htm>

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 19:33:33 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 10:33:33 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <6d642e220901161020j5e3618d9x5edd8d173e2122c2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
	<6d642e220901161020j5e3618d9x5edd8d173e2122c2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0901161033o30526278j4812da5678b9a7f3@mail.gmail.com>

Just browsing through O'Reilly's Safari this morning, looking for
stuff students could access if going with that service (what I
recommend to my corporate trainees -- for SatAcad we mostly read docs
on-line, don't assign homework except to keep working on their
projects with the same on-line docs):
	
Python Programming for the absolute beginner
By: MICHAEL DAWSON
Publisher: Premier Press
Pub. Date: 2003/01/01
Insert Date: 2004/08/19
	
Core Python Programming, Second Edition
By: Wesley J. Chun
Publisher: Prentice Hall
Pub. Date: 2006/09/18
Insert Date: 2006/10/11
	
Python Phrasebook: Essential Code and Commands
By: Brad Dayley
Publisher: Sams
Pub. Date: 2006/11/06
Insert Date: 2006/10/11
	
Python Power!: The Comprehensive Guide
By: Matt Telles
Publisher: Cengage Learning
Pub. Date: 2007/07/24
Insert Date: 2009/01/07

Python: Visual QuickStart Guide, Second Edition
By: Toby Donaldson
Publisher: Peachpit Press
Pub. Date: 2008/12/04
Insert Date: 2008/12/13

Plus 23 other titles I could cut and paste -- and take flak for doing.

Also, there's a lot of great stuff on ShowMeDo and/or YouTube and/or a
number of such video servers, so I at least make sure my students know
about 'em (this is where they'll find a lot of my own stuff as well).
For example here's Alex talking a lot about descriptors around the
time 2.3 came out, still quite relevant to engineering students
thinking to work for Google someday:

http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/01/oop-in-hour.html

In my corporate trainings, I encourage those stepping forward as
wannabe Pythonistas to get Safari as a job perk, as it's clearly a
good investment from an HR point of view (human resources).  This is
my approach with Sisters of Providence for example, where I ride herd
sometimes (not in medical records though as I don't have that kind of
liability insurance (I stay on the outcomes research side of things,
huge registries of valuable clinical data, ancient dead languages like
MUMPS still very much in the picture)).

Kirby
4D

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 10:20 AM, Chris Foster <outofthenet at gmail.com> wrote:
> It's not a textbook, but I'd highly recommend the Python Essential Reference
> by Beazley *http://tinyurl.com/2ze3j6 * as an optional reference for kids
> who really care to learn.  There is a new version coming out in March (v.3),
> but the old ones (thru v.2.4) can be picked up for about $10 used.
> Beazley's summaries are the clearest and most concise I've seen.  Java
> sufferers will be blown away by the index of goodies and examples.  BTW, I
> tried the Nutshell book.  Martelli is a fantastic speaker, but just not
> quite as clear in my opinion.
>
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson
> <master.sparkle at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
>> Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college class
>> in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
>> should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals, iteration,
>> methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
>> Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
>> introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
>>
>>
>> thanks,
>> Charles.
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: <
>> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/c5df328d/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From jek at discorporate.us  Fri Jan 16 19:47:26 2009
From: jek at discorporate.us (jason kirtland)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 10:47:26 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <6d642e220901161020j5e3618d9x5edd8d173e2122c2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
	<6d642e220901161020j5e3618d9x5edd8d173e2122c2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4970D63E.8070408@discorporate.us>

I second the Python Essential Reference recommendation.  It's a 
fantastic introduction and reference for people who already know how to 
program in another language.  It hits all of the interesting bits of 
what makes Python different with little or no fluff.

The book also has a big section covering the standard library in a 
format similar to Python's own docs, which combined with the great index 
may be a friendly way to introduce the Python documentation style to 
those more familiar with javadoc.


Chris Foster wrote:
> It's not a textbook, but I'd highly recommend the Python Essential Reference
> by Beazley *http://tinyurl.com/2ze3j6 * as an optional reference for kids
> who really care to learn.  There is a new version coming out in March (v.3),
> but the old ones (thru v.2.4) can be picked up for about $10 used.
> Beazley's summaries are the clearest and most concise I've seen.  Java
> sufferers will be blown away by the index of goodies and examples.  BTW, I
> tried the Nutshell book.  Martelli is a fantastic speaker, but just not
> quite as clear in my opinion.
> 
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Charles Anderson
> <master.sparkle at gmail.com>wrote:
> 
>> Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
>> Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college class
>> in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
>> should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals, iteration,
>> methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
>> Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
>> introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
>>
>>
>> thanks,
>> Charles.
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: <
>> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/c5df328d/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland


From pacopablo at pacopablo.com  Fri Jan 16 19:52:47 2009
From: pacopablo at pacopablo.com (John Hampton)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 10:52:47 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0901161033o30526278j4812da5678b9a7f3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>	<6d642e220901161020j5e3618d9x5edd8d173e2122c2@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0901161033o30526278j4812da5678b9a7f3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4970D77F.1080507@pacopablo.com>

kirby urner wrote:
<snip mucho books on Python>

> Also, there's a lot of great stuff on ShowMeDo and/or YouTube and/or a
> number of such video servers, so I at least make sure my students know
> about 'em (this is where they'll find a lot of my own stuff as well).

Along these lines, I think that the best resource is the internet 
itself.  There is a lot of info that can be found simply via google.

I find that the standard Python documentation is invaluable when it 
comes to simply find stuff that the standard library can already do.

Books, such as Dive into Python, are available on the web for free.

IRC, mailing lists, pastebins, etc. are all excellent sources of 
information also.

-John

From matt at youell.com  Fri Jan 16 21:13:44 2009
From: matt at youell.com (Matt Youell)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 12:13:44 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4970EA78.8020505@youell.com>

Is this just an Intro to Python class, or is there a special emphasis?


Charles Anderson wrote:
> Does anyone have a recommendation for a (text) book to use for teaching
> Python to students who already know Java?  I'll be teaching a college class
> in spring to students who have had at least 2 quarters of Java.  So, they
> should be hip to the basics of programming - e.g., conditionals, iteration,
> methods, classes, etc.  I'd like to focus on "more interesting" bits of
> Python that are difficult or impossible in straight Java - e.g.,
> introspection, duck-typing, possibly metaclasses.
>
>
> thanks,
> Charles.
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090115/129bc352/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
>
>   


-- 
-/matt/-
http://youell.com/matt



From master.sparkle at gmail.com  Sat Jan 17 01:27:59 2009
From: master.sparkle at gmail.com (Charles Anderson)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:27:59 -0800
Subject: [portland] Recommendation for book to use in classroom?
In-Reply-To: <4970EA78.8020505@youell.com>
References: <cbf43efb0901152122u44786ceh4722106f7fc5d5fd@mail.gmail.com>
	<4970EA78.8020505@youell.com>
Message-ID: <cbf43efb0901161627wb0ec3c7nc3bf8828e25a7b7e@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks everyone for all of the recommendations.  I like to recommend a
single, dead-tree book for students who need the comfort of that.  Between
Safari and various web sites, there are obviously plenty of online resources
for the other students.  Like many/most people on the list, I just use the
online docs plus a little Googling. (Somewhere along the way, I quit using
the printed version of the 1.0 docs I have in my office.)   So, if there was
one "killer book" for intermediate-to-advanced Python, I wouldn't even know
it.

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 12:13 PM, Matt Youell <matt at youell.com> wrote:

> Is this just an Intro to Python class, or is there a special emphasis?


It is a first class in Python, but not intro programming.  I have yet to
define any special emphasis (I just signed up to teach the class yesterday),
other than the desire to expand their Java-based minds.   I'm leaning
towards ending up with Django/GAE as a "practical" use of Python, beyond the
mind-expansion.

thanks,
Charles.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090116/d1ad240e/attachment.htm>

From hallettj at gmail.com  Mon Jan 19 23:52:15 2009
From: hallettj at gmail.com (Jesse Hallett)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 14:52:15 -0800
Subject: [portland] Portland JavaScript Admirers' first monthly meeting
Message-ID: <8a02878f0901191452y199224f3ye700bf2c732205b@mail.gmail.com>

Crosspost alert!

Portland JavaScript Admirers is a new group for discussing everything
related to JavaScript and ECMAscript. I know that a lot of Pythoneers
are into web programming and work with a fair amount of JavaScript as
a part of the package. If you would like a closer look at the
client-side of things, or if you are a JavaScript guru with wisdom to
share, I encourage you to attend the Portland JavaScript admirers'
first monthly meeting on January 28th from 7pm-9 at Cubespace
<http://calagator.org/venues/202389907>.

We will discuss topics ranging from client-side web frameworks, to
functional and prototypal programming theory. Topics slated for this
meeting include:

* Sproutcore - An overview of this new client-side web application framework
* JavaScript: The Good Parts - Tips on how to write beautifu
JavaScript from the book by Douglas Crockford
* jQuery 1.3 - New features in the web's most dynamic DOM library

More topics are welcome! If you would like to give a presentation, or
have a suggestion for a topic, please send a message to
pdxjs at googlegroups.com.

And feel free to join our mailing list at
http://groups.google.com/group/pdxjs if you too are a JavaScript
admirer.

Cheers,
Jesse Hallett
Portland JavaScript Admirer

From beau at open-source-staffing.com  Thu Jan 22 02:08:25 2009
From: beau at open-source-staffing.com (Beau Gould (OSS))
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 20:08:25 -0500
Subject: [portland] [JOB] Sr. Back-End Developer, Eugene or Portland | 60-90k
Message-ID: <19F41E52C4334F01BBCF99A6AED19793@EMACHINE>

Responsibilities: 
* Work in a team building scalable web applications 
* Use test-driven development practices to ensure code correctness 
* Document code, track and fix bugs, respond rapidly to emergencies in
production environment 
* Work with product group throughout development cycle to ensure quality
of end product 
* Networking protocols such as TCP, UDP, HTTP, DNS, NAT, etc 
* Clustering and load balancing solutions for redundancy, high
availability, scalability 
* Network programming (event-driven, asynchronous) 
* Experience analyzing large and complex systems for performance
bottlenecks 
* Python, AJAX, PHP, C/C++ 
* LAMP 
* Scalable MySQL schema designs 
* Jabber/XMPP 
* Twisted Python 
* Spread Toolkit 

Requirements for this position: 
* Bachelors in Computer Science or related work experience. Masters
degree is a plus 
* Ability to work on-site in Eugene, Oregon (preferred) or Portland,
Oregon 
* 5+ years experience developing large scale software systems (10K+
concurrent users) 

To be considered, please submit your resume along with your salary
requirements to bg @ capitalmarketsp.com 

Beau Gould 
Executive Advisor 
Capital Markets Placement 
www.cmp.jobs 
bg @ capitalmarketsp.com


From jd at commandprompt.com  Thu Jan 22 03:18:44 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 18:18:44 -0800
Subject: [portland] A simple DB mapper
Message-ID: <1232590724.1426.2.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

Hello,

I know there are a million different Python->DB mappers but I thought I
would share one that we have created and are actively developing. It is
called Simpycity.

You can read a recent blog about it here:

http://www.commandprompt.com/blogs/aurynn_shaw/

Or visit the project site here:

https://projects.commandprompt.com/public/simpycity

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake
-- 
PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake at jabber.postgresql.org
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997


From jd at commandprompt.com  Sat Jan 24 01:45:28 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 16:45:28 -0800
Subject: [portland] A simple DB mapper
In-Reply-To: <1232590724.1426.2.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>
References: <1232590724.1426.2.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>
Message-ID: <1232757928.10173.269.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

On Wed, 2009-01-21 at 18:18 -0800, Joshua D. Drake wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I know there are a million different Python->DB mappers but I thought I
> would share one that we have created and are actively developing. It is
> called Simpycity.
> 
> You can read a recent blog about it here:
> 
> http://www.commandprompt.com/blogs/aurynn_shaw/
> 
> Or visit the project site here:
> 
> https://projects.commandprompt.com/public/simpycity

Just noticed the svn was broke when I posted this, you can download it
via svn now.

> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Joshua D. Drake
-- 
PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake at jabber.postgresql.org
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997


From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Sun Jan 25 18:44:25 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 09:44:25 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Application Will Not Build on One Host
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901250942420.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

   Perhaps you folks can point me to a solution. I'm trying to build,
install, and use TinyERP. The server builds on both the notebook and
server/workstation, but the client will not build on the latter.

   Both machines use Slackware-12.2 with Python-2.5 and PyGTK-2.12 installed:

/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.py
/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pth
/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pyc
/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pyo

   But, when I try building the client on the server/workstation it fails:

Error: python module gtk (gtk python bindings) is required
Error: python module gtk.glade (glade python bindings) is required

   I'm puzzled why setup.py/tinyerp-client-installer.nsi cannot find pygtk on
this machine, but had no such trouble on the notebook.

   I've uploaded the tarball source to my web site and I'd like to learn why
it bails out so I can fix similar issues if they arise in the future. You
can use 'wget
http://www.appl-ecosys.com/temp-files/tinyerp-client-4.2.3.4.tar.gz' because
the directory is not visible.

TIA,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Sun Jan 25 20:54:19 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 11:54:19 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Application Will Not Build on One Host
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901250942420.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901250942420.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901251153170.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

On Sun, 25 Jan 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:

>  Both machines use Slackware-12.2 with Python-2.5 and PyGTK-2.12 installed:
>
> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.py
> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pth
> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pyc
> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pyo

   And, when I run python/ipython on the command line, I can import pygtk. So
python sees the library as available.

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From jeff at taupro.com  Mon Jan 26 18:11:33 2009
From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 11:11:33 -0600
Subject: [portland] Application Will Not Build on One Host
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901251153170.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901250942420.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<alpine.LNX.2.00.0901251153170.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
Message-ID: <497DEEC5.2020308@taupro.com>

Rich Shepard wrote:
> On Sun, 25 Jan 2009, Rich Shepard wrote:
> 
>>  Both machines use Slackware-12.2 with Python-2.5 and PyGTK-2.12
>> installed:
>>
>> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.py
>> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pth
>> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pyc
>> /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/pygtk.pyo
> 
>   And, when I run python/ipython on the command line, I can import
> pygtk. So
> python sees the library as available.

I don't have a complete answer but one of the odd things about the GTK
packages is that there is *both* a "pygtk" and a "gtk" module.  You may be
missing the latter.

Python 2.5.2 (r252:60911, Jan 15 2009, 03:57:43)
[GCC 4.1.2 (Gentoo 4.1.2 p1.0.2)] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> import pygtk
>>> import gtk
>>> import gtk.glade
>>>

Can do do all three of those?

-Jeff


From rshepard at appl-ecosys.com  Mon Jan 26 18:39:50 2009
From: rshepard at appl-ecosys.com (Rich Shepard)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 09:39:50 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [portland] Application Will Not Build on One Host
In-Reply-To: <497DEEC5.2020308@taupro.com>
References: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901250942420.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<alpine.LNX.2.00.0901251153170.29851@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>
	<497DEEC5.2020308@taupro.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LNX.2.00.0901260936160.23686@salmo.appl-ecosys.com>

On Mon, 26 Jan 2009, Jeff Rush wrote:

> Python 2.5.2 (r252:60911, Jan 15 2009, 03:57:43)
> [GCC 4.1.2 (Gentoo 4.1.2 p1.0.2)] on linux2
> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>>> import pygtk
>>>> import gtk
>>>> import gtk.glade
>>>>

> Can do do all three of those?

Jeff,

   Darn, you're good! NO!

Python 2.5.2 (r252:60911, Sep 11 2008, 13:43:31) 
[GCC 4.2.4] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> import pygtk
>>> import gtk
Traceback (most recent call last):
   File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
   File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/gtk-2.0/gtk/__init__.py", line 48,
in <module>
     from gtk import _gtk
ImportError: /usr/lib/libfontconfig.so.1: undefined symbol: FT_Select_Size
>>> import gtk.glade
Traceback (most recent call last):
   File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
   File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/gtk-2.0/gtk/__init__.py", line 48,
in <module>
     from gtk import _gtk
ImportError: /usr/lib/libfontconfig.so.1: undefined symbol: FT_Select_Size
>>>

   Yet, ...

[root at salmo /home/rshepard]# ls /var/log/packages/ | grep gtk
gtk+-1.2.10-i486-4
gtk+2-2.12.12-i486-1
gtk-doc-1.7-noarch-3dl
gtkam-0.1.15-i486-1_rbs
gtkspell-2.0.14-i486-1
libgtkhtml-2.11.1-i486-1
pygtk-2.12.1-i486-2

   So, gtk and pygtk are installed, but python's not seeing them. What do you
suggest will remedy this situation?

Many thanks,

Rich

-- 
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.               |  Integrity            Credibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.        |            Innovation
<http://www.appl-ecosys.com>     Voice: 503-667-4517      Fax: 503-667-8863

From jd at commandprompt.com  Tue Jan 27 20:32:11 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 11:32:11 -0800
Subject: [portland] [SEAPY] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <05734372-11C8-4076-8C02-7F8F5F8D2DE1@therobots.org>
References: <129508.19097.qm@web52110.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<05734372-11C8-4076-8C02-7F8F5F8D2DE1@therobots.org>
Message-ID: <1233084731.31822.18.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

On Tue, 2009-01-27 at 11:30 -0800, Adam Lowry wrote:
> On Jan 27, 2009, at 11:20 AM, David Goldsmith wrote:
> > Josh, Adam, Michelle (and anyone else attending NW Python Day from  
> > South of Oly):  If any of you are driving and planning on arriving  
> > in time for the beginning, any chance of me hitching a ride w/ you  
> > from Olympia?  Thanks!
> 
> David,
> 
> We're still figuring out who's going, in what cars, and when. I'm  
> cc'ing the pdxpython list so we can start getting it straightened out,  
> and we'll see if there are any free seats.
> 
> Looking forward to Saturday!

I haven't quite figured out what I am doing to get there. I am half
leaning toward taking the train. Its only 50 bucks. I just need to
figure out what it takes to get from the train to the uni.

Joshua D. Drake


> 
> Adam
> 
-- 
PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake at jabber.postgresql.org
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997


From adam at therobots.org  Tue Jan 27 20:30:00 2009
From: adam at therobots.org (Adam Lowry)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 11:30:00 -0800
Subject: [portland] [SEAPY] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <129508.19097.qm@web52110.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <129508.19097.qm@web52110.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <05734372-11C8-4076-8C02-7F8F5F8D2DE1@therobots.org>

On Jan 27, 2009, at 11:20 AM, David Goldsmith wrote:
> Josh, Adam, Michelle (and anyone else attending NW Python Day from  
> South of Oly):  If any of you are driving and planning on arriving  
> in time for the beginning, any chance of me hitching a ride w/ you  
> from Olympia?  Thanks!

David,

We're still figuring out who's going, in what cars, and when. I'm  
cc'ing the pdxpython list so we can start getting it straightened out,  
and we'll see if there are any free seats.

Looking forward to Saturday!

Adam

From freyley at gmail.com  Wed Jan 28 02:23:05 2009
From: freyley at gmail.com (Jeff Schwaber)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 17:23:05 -0800
Subject: [portland] Fwd: Last Chance to Submit a OSCON Proposal
In-Reply-To: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>

Last few days if you want to submit an OSCON proposal. Anybody
planning to talk about stuff in San Jose this year?

Jeff


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "O'Reilly Open Source Convention - OSCON" <elists-conferences at oreilly.com>
Date: Jan 27, 2009 11:31 AM
Subject: Last Chance to Submit a Proposal

O'Reilly Open Source Convention - OSCON
July 20-24, 2009
San Jose McEnery Convention Center
San Jose, CA
http://conferences.oreilly.com/oscon?CMP=EMC-conf_os09_int&ATT=EM2

There's Still Time To Be Part of the OSCON 2009 Program -- Submit Your
Proposal for Participation by February 3!

Open For Business -- Sustaining, Applying, and Expanding Open Source To
Change the World. That's the ambitious course we've set for O'Reilly's
OSCON 2009, coming to San Jose, California, July 20-24.

As ubiquitous computing, with smart phones at the leading edge, becomes a
reality, open source is driving the innovation engine, looking for
solutions to a range of challenges. Beginning OSCON's second decade, we
will address important questions, like "How can open source -- its tools
and its principles -- contribute to making a difference in the business of
computing? In creating a sustainable lifestyle? In an uncertain economy,
how can open source empower us?

These are just a few of the critical questions we want to tackle at OSCON
2009. So we're asking for your ideas, insight, and input. You have until
midnight PST, February 3 to submit your proposal. For guidelines, go to
http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2009/public/cfp/57?CMP=EMC-conf_os09_int&ATT=EM2

How can you participate?
We're seeking proposals for 45-minute sessions, 45-minute panel
discussions, and 3-hour in-depth tutorials. We want to hear about your
winning techniques, favorite life-savers, and the system you've made that
everyone will be using next year. Focus your proposal on hands-on
instruction and real-world examples to provide conference participants
with information they can put to use immediately and ideas that will
inspire their work for months to come.

We're planning 15 tracks for sessions and tutorials on Linux, PHP, Perl,
Python, Ruby, Java, Databases, Desktop Applications, Web Applications,
Mobile, Administration, Security, People, Business, and Emerging Topics.
Some of the topics we want to consider at OSCON 2009 include:
-Doing more with less--finding opportunities in a constrained economy
-Design and usability--tools, techniques, and success stories
-Open source in smart phones and mobile networked devices
-Cloud computing, openness in distributed services
-Parallelization, grid, and multicore technologies
-Open web, open standards, open data
-AI, machine learning, and other ways of making software smarter than the
people using it
-Open source in democracy, politics, government, and education
-Best practices for building a business model around open source
-Virtualization and appliances--their creation and deployment
This is by no means a definitive list of topics. We welcome your ideas,
your stories, your successes (and failures).

Plan now to attend OSCON 2009 in San Jose
Join us at the crossroads of all things open source, in this deeply
technical conference that brings community ideals face-to-face with
business practicality. Be among 3,000 of the best, brightest, and most
interesting people to explore what's new and to help define, maintain, and
extend the identity of what it means to be open source. OSCON is the place
to be inspired and challenged, renew bonds to community, make new
connections, and discover the most relevant projects and products to help
you do your best. Early registration opens in March.

Sign up for the conference newsletter now!
Get advance notification of early registration discounts and stay informed
on the program as it develops by signing up for the conference newsletter
at: http://elists.oreilly.com/

In moving the conference to San Jose, we look forward to engaging in new
activities and to welcoming the participation of new projects and local
open source communities that this new location will bring.

We hope to see you there in July,

The OSCON 2009 Conference Team

P.S. Don't wait! The deadline for submitting your proposal to participate
in OSCON 2009 is midnight PST, February 3! Do it at:
http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2009/public/cfp/57?CMP=EMC-conf_os09_int&ATT=EM2

From jd at commandprompt.com  Wed Jan 28 02:46:01 2009
From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 17:46:01 -0800
Subject: [portland] Fwd: Last Chance to Submit a OSCON Proposal
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1233107161.22329.0.camel@jd-laptop.pragmaticzealot.org>

On Tue, 2009-01-27 at 17:23 -0800, Jeff Schwaber wrote:
> Last few days if you want to submit an OSCON proposal. Anybody
> planning to talk about stuff in San Jose this year?

Not I. Once they moved from PDX I was done with them :)

Joshua D. Drake

-- 
PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake at jabber.postgresql.org
   Consulting, Development, Support, Training
   503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/
   The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997


From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Wed Jan 28 07:06:23 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 22:06:23 -0800
Subject: [portland] Fwd: Last Chance to Submit a OSCON Proposal
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0901272206u29e5cca6jfb8bb0b237bfeee2@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 5:23 PM, Jeff Schwaber <freyley at gmail.com> wrote:
> Last few days if you want to submit an OSCON proposal. Anybody
> planning to talk about stuff in San Jose this year?
>
> Jeff

You said a lot of nasty things about the San Jose convention center,
persuaded me not to go?

Kirby

From freyley at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 19:58:15 2009
From: freyley at gmail.com (Jeff Schwaber)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 10:58:15 -0800
Subject: [portland] Fwd: Last Chance to Submit a OSCON Proposal
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0901272206u29e5cca6jfb8bb0b237bfeee2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0901272206u29e5cca6jfb8bb0b237bfeee2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8db4a1910901291058q5519984bva48ca62273bbf67e@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:06 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
> You said a lot of nasty things about the San Jose convention center,
> persuaded me not to go?

Well, to be fair, however crappy a convention center is should
probably not be much of a factor about going to a convention, unless
you were already on the fence. If it was going to be an awesome
convention except, oh, the convention center's no fun, it should still
be a good convention, right?

Jeff

> Kirby
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 20:23:13 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 11:23:13 -0800
Subject: [portland] Fwd: Last Chance to Submit a OSCON Proposal
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910901291058q5519984bva48ca62273bbf67e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0901272206u29e5cca6jfb8bb0b237bfeee2@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901291058q5519984bva48ca62273bbf67e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0901291123q53b1d5eci4e2817984d7ddda2@mail.gmail.com>

Yeah fair enough.

I thought maybe you had some ax to grind with O'Reilly, whereas I
think it's high time they left us to try our own hand, no reason they
can't return or have multiple OSCONs in parallel someday, like Cirque
du Soleil does (Vegas, Cancun...  I have no idea...).

Anyway, truth is, I'm on the fence, but not because I don't want to be
there.  I'd like to be there, one way or another.  Always love OSCON,
can't get enough of R0ml, Ravencroft, Randall, Martelli... didn't see
Guido last time.

>From a presenter's point of view, it's always nice if you can fine
tune and rework a talk a few times, not make everything ride on the
one occasion, so I'm tempted to submit what I'm doing for Pycon 2009
(with Steve Holden) to both OS Bridge and OSCON with a "similar but
different" caveat -- because I know it'll morph in response to ongoing
feedback (already has a few times -- shed its skin so to speak).

I appreciate your prompting us with a reminder, as I've been known to
space out deadlines like this.

Speaking of Chicago, I'm planning to talk up Portland as a really
happening place when it comes to using open source in the schools,
always pointing back to my Winterhaven example (Python for 8th
graders), and the stuff I do with Saturday Academy (ongoing).  But
then LEP High uses Edubuntu c/o Open Sourcery right?  Lincoln has a
Linux Lab.  I just don't know all there is to know.  Riverdale's LTSP
is old hat... (joke).  http://www.k12ltsp.org/rhs_casestudy.html

In that regard, I was in a meeting with Lew Frederick yesterday, for
12 years with PPS, sampling my "all schools are charter schools"
rhetoric (the only difference is "when" i.e. "charter" just means you
have a public mandate of some kind, which all of them do or once did).

http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/01/wanderers-2008128.html

Hey, I enjoyed hanging with Javascript Admirers at Cubespace last
night, very well attended, here's my write-up:

http://mybizmo.blogspot.com/2009/01/admiring-javascript.html

Kirby


On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Jeff Schwaber <freyley at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:06 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
>> You said a lot of nasty things about the San Jose convention center,
>> persuaded me not to go?
>
> Well, to be fair, however crappy a convention center is should
> probably not be much of a factor about going to a convention, unless
> you were already on the fence. If it was going to be an awesome
> convention except, oh, the convention center's no fun, it should still
> be a good convention, right?
>
> Jeff
>
>> Kirby
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From freyley at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 20:30:59 2009
From: freyley at gmail.com (Jeff Schwaber)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 11:30:59 -0800
Subject: [portland] Fwd: Last Chance to Submit a OSCON Proposal
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0901291123q53b1d5eci4e2817984d7ddda2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0901272206u29e5cca6jfb8bb0b237bfeee2@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901291058q5519984bva48ca62273bbf67e@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0901291123q53b1d5eci4e2817984d7ddda2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8db4a1910901291130w7349eae4h9a81393078de1a96@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 11:23 AM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
> Yeah fair enough.
>
> I thought maybe you had some ax to grind with O'Reilly, whereas I
> think it's high time they left us to try our own hand, no reason they
> can't return or have multiple OSCONs in parallel someday, like Cirque
> du Soleil does (Vegas, Cancun...  I have no idea...).

Oh, you were talking about me? Maybe I did.  Or maybe I said whatever
I said badly, or it came across wrong. *shrug* I hope people who go to
OSCON tell us about it, and I'm sure it'll be a continuation of the
tradition of OSCON conferences, neither much better nor much worse
than last year.

Jeff

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 20:49:51 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 11:49:51 -0800
Subject: [portland] Fwd: Last Chance to Submit a OSCON Proposal
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910901291130w7349eae4h9a81393078de1a96@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d6120e160901271241w23c161a9y1a57676b893c1905@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901271723w36a3a564odf9b9d6d1222d4b3@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0901272206u29e5cca6jfb8bb0b237bfeee2@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901291058q5519984bva48ca62273bbf67e@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0901291123q53b1d5eci4e2817984d7ddda2@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910901291130w7349eae4h9a81393078de1a96@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0901291149i5ea87c89r3ce1f539ec38403f@mail.gmail.com>

Yeah no harm done and again I personally appreciate the reminders,
rely on lists such as this as externalized date books, sloppy as that
may sound.

I was the kid in high school of left my books all over the school,
like leave the math book in math class cuz then it'll be there when I
come back to it etc...  they called me "the Martian" FYI, here's a
post about it:

http://mybizmo.blogspot.com/2008/11/smiley-guy.html

See ya next PPUG, I'm supposed to be doing something with VPython,
which is good because that's in my Pycon workshop and I need the
practice...

Kirby
4d


On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Jeff Schwaber <freyley at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 11:23 AM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Yeah fair enough.
>>
>> I thought maybe you had some ax to grind with O'Reilly, whereas I
>> think it's high time they left us to try our own hand, no reason they
>> can't return or have multiple OSCONs in parallel someday, like Cirque
>> du Soleil does (Vegas, Cancun...  I have no idea...).
>
> Oh, you were talking about me? Maybe I did.  Or maybe I said whatever
> I said badly, or it came across wrong. *shrug* I hope people who go to
> OSCON tell us about it, and I'm sure it'll be a continuation of the
> tradition of OSCON conferences, neither much better nor much worse
> than last year.
>
> Jeff
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>