From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Wed Apr  1 16:03:54 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 07:03:54 -0700
Subject: [portland] Here comes the FLUFL
Message-ID: <4c645a720904010703p1a2b1abetb56ca7e6219e1be5@mail.gmail.com>

For anyone who hasn't seen this already:

http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0401/
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From pacopablo at pacopablo.com  Wed Apr  1 16:16:43 2009
From: pacopablo at pacopablo.com (John Hampton)
Date: Wed, 01 Apr 2009 07:16:43 -0700
Subject: [portland] Here comes the FLUFL
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720904010703p1a2b1abetb56ca7e6219e1be5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4c645a720904010703p1a2b1abetb56ca7e6219e1be5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49D3774B.6060000@pacopablo.com>

Dylan Reinhardt wrote:
> For anyone who hasn't seen this already:
> 
> http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0401/

I for one welcome our new FLUFL.  You should have seen the BDFL running
around like a crazed lunatic with a pink pony at PyCon! ;)

-John

From freyley at gmail.com  Wed Apr  1 22:58:53 2009
From: freyley at gmail.com (Jeff Schwaber)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 13:58:53 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
Message-ID: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>

Pythonistas,

Open Source Bridge decided to honor procrastinators and extend the deadline
for proposals to April 10th.

http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2009/proposals/

And there really aren't enough Python proposals. What do you want to hear
talked about? Let's hear about it on the list and maybe it'll spark
somebody's interest.

Me, personally, I'd like to see a talk titled:

"Django: beyond the first blog" or similar, which would be a talk about
great things, terrible things, and general direction pointing for what you
do to your app after the initial 30 minutes, well covered in tutorials. I'd
be willing to help if somebody else wanted to do part of this, but I don't
want to take it on by myself.

What do you want to hear about?

Jeff
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From mde at micahelliott.com  Wed Apr  1 23:25:57 2009
From: mde at micahelliott.com (Micah Elliott)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 14:25:57 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1edb3c420904011425x18140933x62c859a3e15d730d@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Jeff Schwaber <freyley at gmail.com> wrote:

> What do you want to hear talked about? Let's hear about it on
> the list and maybe it'll spark somebody's interest.

Good idea.

I would find it useful for someone to talk generally about web
APIs.  They're everywhere, and have a lot of similarities.  Some
interesting things about APIs might be:

 * Why most sites need an API for sharing their data.

 * Walkthru of some mainstream APIs out there: twitter, flickr,
   netflix, facebook.  Use one as a case study for an API Done
   Right.

 * What makes a good API?  I've seen some pretty bad ones.

 * What languages to support?  Sometimes Python is not considered
   top-5 for some reason.

 * What are the underlying implementation similarities?

 * Tying a language API to a RESTful URL design.  (This might
   turn it into a REST talk though.)

 * API performance considerations.

 * How search is often not part of an API, but a separate need
   and maybe a separate API.

 * How to manage/host one so it doesn't stagnate and get forked.

 * Documentation practices (to make it work well in ipython).

I'm missing some points.  Feel free to expand.  The talk would be
geared towards Python, but other languages could benefit.

I could consider trying to write up my ideas on this, but not
sure I have time right now, and I'm probably not qualified to
give a best practices talk since I have not implemented my own
yet, and I'm not a REST expert.  So anyone is welcome to it.  I'd
probably co-present/-develop if someone wanted a partner.  (I do
actually have a need to write an API one of these days.)

-- 
@MicahElliott | mde at MicahElliott.com | http://MicahElliott.com
Sent from Beaverton, OR, United States

From pcurtain at gmail.com  Wed Apr  1 23:28:03 2009
From: pcurtain at gmail.com (Patrick Curtain)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 14:28:03 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e060a3930904011428w5be00e57x4f49f741970a4d2b@mail.gmail.com>

I'll throw my hat in there and say I'd be willing to talk about
anything I know... I just never know what anyone would want to sit and
listen to.  Throw out python topics (or agile development or ...) and
maybe something will spark.  :)

--p

On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Jeff Schwaber <freyley at gmail.com> wrote:
> Pythonistas,
>
> Open Source Bridge decided to honor procrastinators and extend the deadline
> for proposals to April 10th.
>
> http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2009/proposals/
>
> And there really aren't enough Python proposals. What do you want to hear
> talked about? Let's hear about it on the list and maybe it'll spark
> somebody's interest.
>
> Me, personally, I'd like to see a talk titled:
>
> "Django: beyond the first blog" or similar, which would be a talk about
> great things, terrible things, and general direction pointing for what you
> do to your app after the initial 30 minutes, well covered in tutorials. I'd
> be willing to help if somebody else wanted to do part of this, but I don't
> want to take it on by myself.
>
> What do you want to hear about?
>
> Jeff
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/63637345/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>



-- 
Patrick Curtain,  Husband & Father  ( i also write software )
http://www.patrickcurtain.com/                          360.521.9625

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr  2 01:59:52 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 16:59:52 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>

Django is driving me nuts I have to admit.  It's the static media bit.
 It's all on my Ubuntu laptop so if someone wants to show me where I'm
going wrong, the bagels are on me... (I had it working but then
decided to move directories around...).  Write me off list maybe.  I
live near the Bagdad.

Yeah, more Python talks would be good.  I'm not altogether clear what
the audience will be like but I think there's always room for "just
the basics" i.e. a good old fashioned tutorial that doesn't go too
fast.  I know we're into test driven development but I think doctest
is sufficient with noobs.  Indeed, Python pedagogy is effective
because interactive...

I could see PPUG offering a standard once month free class with
rotating presenter, then spin-off more advanced topic classes that fly
when they fill, sort of Saturday Academy still.  Having something like
a fixed schedule for the free ones, then scrambling amongst ourselves
to always have an instructor, would be a fun way to make PPUG a
stronger glue maybe.    Just a thought.

Kirby

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Thu Apr  2 02:12:32 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 17:12:32 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com>

This might help:

http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.0/howto/static-files/

HTH,

Dylan


On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:

> Django is driving me nuts I have to admit.  It's the static media bit.
>  It's all on my Ubuntu laptop so if someone wants to show me where I'm
> going wrong, the bagels are on me... (I had it working but then
> decided to move directories around...).  Write me off list maybe.  I
> live near the Bagdad.
>
> Yeah, more Python talks would be good.  I'm not altogether clear what
> the audience will be like but I think there's always room for "just
> the basics" i.e. a good old fashioned tutorial that doesn't go too
> fast.  I know we're into test driven development but I think doctest
> is sufficient with noobs.  Indeed, Python pedagogy is effective
> because interactive...
>
> I could see PPUG offering a standard once month free class with
> rotating presenter, then spin-off more advanced topic classes that fly
> when they fill, sort of Saturday Academy still.  Having something like
> a fixed schedule for the free ones, then scrambling amongst ourselves
> to always have an instructor, would be a fun way to make PPUG a
> stronger glue maybe.    Just a thought.
>
> Kirby
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
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From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Thu Apr  2 02:21:42 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 17:21:42 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904011721r7032b9d2l21eebee69e8737d5@mail.gmail.com>

If anyone else is looking for a good topic, I would love to see something
useful on developing a web service client in Python.

Not a Python client talking to a trivial Python server mind you... but a
non-trivial client talking to a real server where the only documentation is
for PHP and you have to roll your own class definitions from a WSDL file.
It seems that all the tools are out there, but it's really difficult to tell
because of how bad the docs are.

Just thinkin'...

Dylan




On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Jeff Schwaber <freyley at gmail.com> wrote:

> Pythonistas,
>
> Open Source Bridge decided to honor procrastinators and extend the deadline
> for proposals to April 10th.
>
> http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2009/proposals/
>
> And there really aren't enough Python proposals. What do you want to hear
> talked about? Let's hear about it on the list and maybe it'll spark
> somebody's interest.
>
> Me, personally, I'd like to see a talk titled:
>
> "Django: beyond the first blog" or similar, which would be a talk about
> great things, terrible things, and general direction pointing for what you
> do to your app after the initial 30 minutes, well covered in tutorials. I'd
> be willing to help if somebody else wanted to do part of this, but I don't
> want to take it on by myself.
>
> What do you want to hear about?
>
> Jeff
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/63637345/attachment.htm
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr  2 07:59:53 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 22:59:53 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904012259u9849a42qad769131597beeac@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Dylan, plus to those replying off list.

I'm trying to wrap an old static HTML website in Django such that I
don't have to change relative paths to images in subdirectories that
won't really be there anymore.  I'm wanting all URLs from the outside
world to stay the same as well i.e. all the old links will work as is.

http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/cp4e.html will now point to
http://www.4dsolutions.net/controlroom/ocn/old/archive/cp4e.html under
the hood, with the later containing <img src="graphics/pix.png"> tags
that need to be statically served from controlroom/media/ocn/graphics
-- that kind of thing.

Kind of a hack maybe, an exercise.  The idea is new content would take
advantage of the framework more, but this is a way of grandfathering
in what's at the site already, basically with no changes.

Kirby


On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 5:12 PM, Dylan Reinhardt
<python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:
> This might help:
>
> http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.0/howto/static-files/
>
> HTH,
>
> Dylan
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Django is driving me nuts I have to admit. ?It's the static media bit.
>> ?It's all on my Ubuntu laptop so if someone wants to show me where I'm
>> going wrong, the bagels are on me... (I had it working but then
>> decided to move directories around...). ?Write me off list maybe. ?I
>> live near the Bagdad.
>>
>> Yeah, more Python talks would be good. ?I'm not altogether clear what
>> the audience will be like but I think there's always room for "just
>> the basics" i.e. a good old fashioned tutorial that doesn't go too
>> fast. ?I know we're into test driven development but I think doctest
>> is sufficient with noobs. ?Indeed, Python pedagogy is effective
>> because interactive...
>>
>> I could see PPUG offering a standard once month free class with
>> rotating presenter, then spin-off more advanced topic classes that fly
>> when they fill, sort of Saturday Academy still. ?Having something like
>> a fixed schedule for the free ones, then scrambling amongst ourselves
>> to always have an instructor, would be a fun way to make PPUG a
>> stronger glue maybe. ? ?Just a thought.
>>
>> Kirby
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/a977a3dd/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Thu Apr  2 08:37:19 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 23:37:19 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0904012259u9849a42qad769131597beeac@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904012259u9849a42qad769131597beeac@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904012337w52c705e8m52095a3cb28714ba@mail.gmail.com>

If I understand your issue correctly, you want to mix new content created
and managed by Django with legacy content that exists in the form of static
html files.

This is actually easier than it sounds.  There are many possible solutions,
but here's one.  Whether it is the right one will depend on how much of what
type of stuff you have.

So let's say you have a model you're using for content.  And let's say you
want this model to represent a "page" whether that page is new (managed by
Django) or legacy (exists in file).  That way both types of "page" can be
managed by the same views at similar URLs.  If you want that content object
to do double duty, here's what you might do:

1. Add a FilePathField to your model.  Docs:
http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/models/fields/#filepathfield

2. Add a method to your model that returns the contents of the file at the
path specified in that field

3. In your template(s), check for the presence of a value in the
FilePathField.  If it's there, just dump out the contents of the file.  If
not, proceed to render your page as you normally would.

If you end up with images that use relative paths that are no longer valid,
you can probably fix those quickly with an entry in urls.py or an Apache
RewriteRule.  Shouldn't take much to map any legacy paths to the new static
directory.

Anyway... hope that's helpful.

Dylan


On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 10:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks Dylan, plus to those replying off list.
>
> I'm trying to wrap an old static HTML website in Django such that I
> don't have to change relative paths to images in subdirectories that
> won't really be there anymore.  I'm wanting all URLs from the outside
> world to stay the same as well i.e. all the old links will work as is.
>
> http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/cp4e.html will now point to
> http://www.4dsolutions.net/controlroom/ocn/old/archive/cp4e.html under
> the hood, with the later containing <img src="graphics/pix.png"> tags
> that need to be statically served from controlroom/media/ocn/graphics
> -- that kind of thing.
>
> Kind of a hack maybe, an exercise.  The idea is new content would take
> advantage of the framework more, but this is a way of grandfathering
> in what's at the site already, basically with no changes.
>
> Kirby
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 5:12 PM, Dylan Reinhardt
> <python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:
> > This might help:
> >
> > http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.0/howto/static-files/
> >
> > HTH,
> >
> > Dylan
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >> Django is driving me nuts I have to admit.  It's the static media bit.
> >>  It's all on my Ubuntu laptop so if someone wants to show me where I'm
> >> going wrong, the bagels are on me... (I had it working but then
> >> decided to move directories around...).  Write me off list maybe.  I
> >> live near the Bagdad.
> >>
> >> Yeah, more Python talks would be good.  I'm not altogether clear what
> >> the audience will be like but I think there's always room for "just
> >> the basics" i.e. a good old fashioned tutorial that doesn't go too
> >> fast.  I know we're into test driven development but I think doctest
> >> is sufficient with noobs.  Indeed, Python pedagogy is effective
> >> because interactive...
> >>
> >> I could see PPUG offering a standard once month free class with
> >> rotating presenter, then spin-off more advanced topic classes that fly
> >> when they fill, sort of Saturday Academy still.  Having something like
> >> a fixed schedule for the free ones, then scrambling amongst ourselves
> >> to always have an instructor, would be a fun way to make PPUG a
> >> stronger glue maybe.    Just a thought.
> >>
> >> Kirby
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Portland mailing list
> >> Portland at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> >>
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/a977a3dd/attachment.htm
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Portland mailing list
> > Portland at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
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From tim.j.welch at gmail.com  Thu Apr  2 17:04:00 2009
From: tim.j.welch at gmail.com (Tim Welch)
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 08:04:00 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720904012337w52c705e8m52095a3cb28714ba@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904012259u9849a42qad769131597beeac@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904012337w52c705e8m52095a3cb28714ba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3996251a0904020804p6aa62640pa045cb27c9ca4807@mail.gmail.com>

Hi folks, we've not met, I lurk a bit.  If only my Tuesday nights weren't
taken.

I'm considering a GeoDjango talk at OS Bridge.  Starting with
geodjango-basic-apps, covering ctypes bindings for the core GIS libraries
(GEOS/GDAL), spatial queries (GeoQueryset, etc.), mapping client integration
(OpenLayers).  Lots of other possibilities, GeoRSS/Atom feeds, KML,
integration with map engines, case studies.

Kirby, looks like you'll be presenting at the GIS in Action conference this
month.  See you there perhaps eh.  We should have an OSGeo booth setup.
I'll be moderating a marine planning session covering tools we've developed
with GeoDjango for web and PyQGIS for desktop.

Cheers, Tim


Tim Welch
Applications Developer
Ecotrust


On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 11:37 PM, Dylan Reinhardt
<python at dylanreinhardt.com>wrote:

> If I understand your issue correctly, you want to mix new content created
> and managed by Django with legacy content that exists in the form of static
> html files.
>
> This is actually easier than it sounds.  There are many possible solutions,
> but here's one.  Whether it is the right one will depend on how much of
> what
> type of stuff you have.
>
> So let's say you have a model you're using for content.  And let's say you
> want this model to represent a "page" whether that page is new (managed by
> Django) or legacy (exists in file).  That way both types of "page" can be
> managed by the same views at similar URLs.  If you want that content object
> to do double duty, here's what you might do:
>
> 1. Add a FilePathField to your model.  Docs:
> http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/models/fields/#filepathfield
>
> 2. Add a method to your model that returns the contents of the file at the
> path specified in that field
>
> 3. In your template(s), check for the presence of a value in the
> FilePathField.  If it's there, just dump out the contents of the file.  If
> not, proceed to render your page as you normally would.
>
> If you end up with images that use relative paths that are no longer valid,
> you can probably fix those quickly with an entry in urls.py or an Apache
> RewriteRule.  Shouldn't take much to map any legacy paths to the new static
> directory.
>
> Anyway... hope that's helpful.
>
> Dylan
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 10:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Thanks Dylan, plus to those replying off list.
> >
> > I'm trying to wrap an old static HTML website in Django such that I
> > don't have to change relative paths to images in subdirectories that
> > won't really be there anymore.  I'm wanting all URLs from the outside
> > world to stay the same as well i.e. all the old links will work as is.
> >
> > http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/cp4e.html will now point to
> > http://www.4dsolutions.net/controlroom/ocn/old/archive/cp4e.html under
> > the hood, with the later containing <img src="graphics/pix.png"> tags
> > that need to be statically served from controlroom/media/ocn/graphics
> > -- that kind of thing.
> >
> > Kind of a hack maybe, an exercise.  The idea is new content would take
> > advantage of the framework more, but this is a way of grandfathering
> > in what's at the site already, basically with no changes.
> >
> > Kirby
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 5:12 PM, Dylan Reinhardt
> > <python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:
> > > This might help:
> > >
> > > http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.0/howto/static-files/
> > >
> > > HTH,
> > >
> > > Dylan
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Django is driving me nuts I have to admit.  It's the static media bit.
> > >>  It's all on my Ubuntu laptop so if someone wants to show me where I'm
> > >> going wrong, the bagels are on me... (I had it working but then
> > >> decided to move directories around...).  Write me off list maybe.  I
> > >> live near the Bagdad.
> > >>
> > >> Yeah, more Python talks would be good.  I'm not altogether clear what
> > >> the audience will be like but I think there's always room for "just
> > >> the basics" i.e. a good old fashioned tutorial that doesn't go too
> > >> fast.  I know we're into test driven development but I think doctest
> > >> is sufficient with noobs.  Indeed, Python pedagogy is effective
> > >> because interactive...
> > >>
> > >> I could see PPUG offering a standard once month free class with
> > >> rotating presenter, then spin-off more advanced topic classes that fly
> > >> when they fill, sort of Saturday Academy still.  Having something like
> > >> a fixed schedule for the free ones, then scrambling amongst ourselves
> > >> to always have an instructor, would be a fun way to make PPUG a
> > >> stronger glue maybe.    Just a thought.
> > >>
> > >> Kirby
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Portland mailing list
> > >> Portland at python.org
> > >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> > >>
> > > -------------- next part --------------
> > > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > > URL: <
> >
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/a977a3dd/attachment.htm
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Portland mailing list
> > > Portland at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Portland mailing list
> > Portland at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> >
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/c9253473/attachment.htm
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
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From michael at susens-schurter.com  Thu Apr  2 17:33:15 2009
From: michael at susens-schurter.com (Michael Schurter)
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 08:33:15 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <3996251a0904020804p6aa62640pa045cb27c9ca4807@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com> 
	<f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com> 
	<4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com> 
	<f604188c0904012259u9849a42qad769131597beeac@mail.gmail.com> 
	<4c645a720904012337w52c705e8m52095a3cb28714ba@mail.gmail.com> 
	<3996251a0904020804p6aa62640pa045cb27c9ca4807@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <240b71640904020833n4b7a00d1rb19be5c77a697c23@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 8:04 AM, Tim Welch <tim.j.welch at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi folks, we've not met, I lurk a bit. ?If only my Tuesday nights weren't
> taken.
>
> I'm considering a GeoDjango talk at OS Bridge. ?Starting with
> geodjango-basic-apps, covering ctypes bindings for the core GIS libraries
> (GEOS/GDAL), spatial queries (GeoQueryset, etc.), mapping client integration
> (OpenLayers). ?Lots of other possibilities, GeoRSS/Atom feeds, KML,
> integration with map engines, case studies.
>
> Kirby, looks like you'll be presenting at the GIS in Action conference this
> month. ?See you there perhaps eh. ?We should have an OSGeo booth setup.
> I'll be moderating a marine planning session covering tools we've developed
> with GeoDjango for web and PyQGIS for desktop.
>
> Cheers, Tim
>
>
> Tim Welch
> Applications Developer
> Ecotrust

Hi Tim!

Just wanted to say I'd love to go to a talk on GeoDjango.  I would
think just about any GIS related talks would be popular.

Cheers,
Michael Schurter (@schmichael)

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr  2 19:20:41 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 10:20:41 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <3996251a0904020804p6aa62640pa045cb27c9ca4807@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904012259u9849a42qad769131597beeac@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904012337w52c705e8m52095a3cb28714ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<3996251a0904020804p6aa62640pa045cb27c9ca4807@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904021020j76e97a25yf68388012ed42f6c@mail.gmail.com>

I'm impressed Tim and would endorse the GeoDjango idea.  I've so far
compiled GEOS can import it in Python, but that's hardly more than
getting my feet wet.

I'm going to tell my GIS audience to make sure to visit your booth
(I'm doing this on the basis of teaching core Python to ESRI product
users in 2005 at a DoubleTree by Lloyds (might've been Red Lion back
then?) -- spent a lot of time showing how decorator syntax could be
used to take the derivative of a function, which was later decided
wasn't such a great idea on edu-sig, Guido contributing).

I was pushing Django heavily for that Ecotrust Foodhub proposal, which
obviously sank to Davy Jones with no trace, but I'd noticed the
PostGIS angle and was thinking here was room to grow -- didn't know
about GeoDjango back then, wondering if FoodHub went with something
like that (a long time ago, I contracted with Ecotrust to do
membership tracking in Foxpro, because it ran on both Windows and Mac
back then... sounds of dinosaurs stirring).

Anyway, GIS/GPS is very Portland, given our reputation for most
excellent planning.  I wonder if Metro uses much Python (just met with
Phyllis Cole yesterday but we didn't discuss it).  My dad was an urban
planner here in town before we moved overseas.  No one had computers
back then, or cell phones.  How did we do it?  I was learning New Math
(probably why I'm pushing Gnu Math today (because the Russians are
doing it?)).

Thanks again to all who helped with my stupid static serve problems
with Django.  It's hard on my ego to feel this retarded but that's
what we must go through w/r to anything new and unfamiliar (I've
managed to live this long with very little need for regular
expressions, whereas now they're the key to fame and glory -- found
that FireFox plugin that's lets me play with 'em).

Kirby

On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 8:04 AM, Tim Welch <tim.j.welch at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi folks, we've not met, I lurk a bit. ?If only my Tuesday nights weren't
> taken.
>
> I'm considering a GeoDjango talk at OS Bridge. ?Starting with
> geodjango-basic-apps, covering ctypes bindings for the core GIS libraries
> (GEOS/GDAL), spatial queries (GeoQueryset, etc.), mapping client integration
> (OpenLayers). ?Lots of other possibilities, GeoRSS/Atom feeds, KML,
> integration with map engines, case studies.
>
> Kirby, looks like you'll be presenting at the GIS in Action conference this
> month. ?See you there perhaps eh. ?We should have an OSGeo booth setup.
> I'll be moderating a marine planning session covering tools we've developed
> with GeoDjango for web and PyQGIS for desktop.
>
> Cheers, Tim
>
>
> Tim Welch
> Applications Developer
> Ecotrust
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 11:37 PM, Dylan Reinhardt
> <python at dylanreinhardt.com>wrote:
>
>> If I understand your issue correctly, you want to mix new content created
>> and managed by Django with legacy content that exists in the form of static
>> html files.
>>
>> This is actually easier than it sounds. ?There are many possible solutions,
>> but here's one. ?Whether it is the right one will depend on how much of
>> what
>> type of stuff you have.
>>
>> So let's say you have a model you're using for content. ?And let's say you
>> want this model to represent a "page" whether that page is new (managed by
>> Django) or legacy (exists in file). ?That way both types of "page" can be
>> managed by the same views at similar URLs. ?If you want that content object
>> to do double duty, here's what you might do:
>>
>> 1. Add a FilePathField to your model. ?Docs:
>> http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/models/fields/#filepathfield
>>
>> 2. Add a method to your model that returns the contents of the file at the
>> path specified in that field
>>
>> 3. In your template(s), check for the presence of a value in the
>> FilePathField. ?If it's there, just dump out the contents of the file. ?If
>> not, proceed to render your page as you normally would.
>>
>> If you end up with images that use relative paths that are no longer valid,
>> you can probably fix those quickly with an entry in urls.py or an Apache
>> RewriteRule. ?Shouldn't take much to map any legacy paths to the new static
>> directory.
>>
>> Anyway... hope that's helpful.
>>
>> Dylan
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 10:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Thanks Dylan, plus to those replying off list.
>> >
>> > I'm trying to wrap an old static HTML website in Django such that I
>> > don't have to change relative paths to images in subdirectories that
>> > won't really be there anymore. ?I'm wanting all URLs from the outside
>> > world to stay the same as well i.e. all the old links will work as is.
>> >
>> > http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/cp4e.html will now point to
>> > http://www.4dsolutions.net/controlroom/ocn/old/archive/cp4e.html under
>> > the hood, with the later containing <img src="graphics/pix.png"> tags
>> > that need to be statically served from controlroom/media/ocn/graphics
>> > -- that kind of thing.
>> >
>> > Kind of a hack maybe, an exercise. ?The idea is new content would take
>> > advantage of the framework more, but this is a way of grandfathering
>> > in what's at the site already, basically with no changes.
>> >
>> > Kirby
>> >
>> >
>> > On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 5:12 PM, Dylan Reinhardt
>> > <python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:
>> > > This might help:
>> > >
>> > > http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.0/howto/static-files/
>> > >
>> > > HTH,
>> > >
>> > > Dylan
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> Django is driving me nuts I have to admit. ?It's the static media bit.
>> > >> ?It's all on my Ubuntu laptop so if someone wants to show me where I'm
>> > >> going wrong, the bagels are on me... (I had it working but then
>> > >> decided to move directories around...). ?Write me off list maybe. ?I
>> > >> live near the Bagdad.
>> > >>
>> > >> Yeah, more Python talks would be good. ?I'm not altogether clear what
>> > >> the audience will be like but I think there's always room for "just
>> > >> the basics" i.e. a good old fashioned tutorial that doesn't go too
>> > >> fast. ?I know we're into test driven development but I think doctest
>> > >> is sufficient with noobs. ?Indeed, Python pedagogy is effective
>> > >> because interactive...
>> > >>
>> > >> I could see PPUG offering a standard once month free class with
>> > >> rotating presenter, then spin-off more advanced topic classes that fly
>> > >> when they fill, sort of Saturday Academy still. ?Having something like
>> > >> a fixed schedule for the free ones, then scrambling amongst ourselves
>> > >> to always have an instructor, would be a fun way to make PPUG a
>> > >> stronger glue maybe. ? ?Just a thought.
>> > >>
>> > >> Kirby
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> Portland mailing list
>> > >> Portland at python.org
>> > >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>> > >>
>> > > -------------- next part --------------
>> > > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> > > URL: <
>> >
>> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/a977a3dd/attachment.htm
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > Portland mailing list
>> > > Portland at python.org
>> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>> > >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Portland mailing list
>> > Portland at python.org
>> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>> >
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: <
>> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090401/c9253473/attachment.htm
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> -------------- next part --------------
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> _______________________________________________
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> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Fri Apr  3 00:50:58 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 15:50:58 -0700
Subject: [portland] OS Bridge proposal date extended
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0904021020j76e97a25yf68388012ed42f6c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8db4a1910904011358o73c0e7bfxda86d868ee48caf1@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904011659vd95c2bdk9bd126a788c6fb69@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904011712g1b837887m93d3636d9de1fe10@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904012259u9849a42qad769131597beeac@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904012337w52c705e8m52095a3cb28714ba@mail.gmail.com>
	<3996251a0904020804p6aa62640pa045cb27c9ca4807@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904021020j76e97a25yf68388012ed42f6c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904021550u10e4aaaav8ad43c3898f6e2d2@mail.gmail.com>

Speaking of Django and conferences more generally, I'm aware of the
September one coming to Portland.

Djangocon organizer:

> I'm in the process of talking to the Oregon Convention Center in
> Portland to put the conference on September 11th - 15th (14th and 15th
> being sprint days). That will make things slightly more pricey, but it's
> meant to be convenient and we won't need a huge amount of space
> (breakout rooms/open space, 2 conference rooms, food space etc). If you
> have any recommendations let me know.
>

Steve Holden and I were reminiscing about how the downtown Marriott
maybe had better access to more restaurants (Riverplace etc.), though
of course OCC offers catering.  OSCON just got too big to squeeze into
that smaller venue but Django isn't so huge yet.  OCC may be
configured for smaller events too of course, not claiming to be
expert.

Given we're locals and some of us know both venues, if you wanna file
some buzz about where'd *you* would put a conference of say 300 - 500
(around Portland that is), somewhere where out-of-towners will have a
good experience with our fair city, a FOSS Gotham, then I could point
to PPUG as a source of news and views on this topic.  I'm still on the
Chicago list for similar reasons (to tap in to the local jive).

I don't think they're looking for a college, though that's on my radar
for EduPycon.  Like Pacific University maybe?  Something Jeff Rush and
I were talking about (like a subclass of Pycon, but more specifically
for educators).  What do people think about that idea?  Does academia
give a rip about charming our snake these days?  MIT does, but who
else?

Per emails with Selena on the OS Bridge list I'm happy to volunteer as
a point person, for Python-related talks in particular, if you're
looking to schedule one, heads up I might be in touch if she throws me
some bones (candidate write-ups) they might have some questions about
(co-chair is Audrey).

And on the topic of Pycon, here are my Flickr slides FYI.  Hyatt is a
huge venue but we filled it out pretty well.  The conference was very
well organized this year and videos are already coming on-line at the
website.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/17157315 at N00/sets/72157616066135225/

See ya'll next meeting,

Kirby


PS: re migrating static 4dsolutions.net to Django:  I've been
persuaded this is ill-advised (too unDjangonic) unless maybe I go the
extra mile and stuff everything in PostgreSQL and serve out through
flatpages, per Dylan's suggestion.

When I *did* get my modified py2html thingy to work yesterday -- a cgi
script for colorizing Python source on the fly (same trick as on my
Google App Engine osgarden.appspot.com -- it was all cuzza mark_safe,
which keeps the rendering engine from turning every < into an &lt;,
evern & into and &amp; etc., good trick to know e.g.:

def color_source(request):
    filename = os.path.join("/home/kirby/djapps/ocn/old/archive/python/",
request.GET["script"].split("/")[-1])
    thecode = mark_safe(py2html.main(["","-format:rawhtml","-strhtml",
str(filename)]))
    t = get_template("color_source.html")
    html = t.render(Context({"thecode":thecode}))
    return HttpResponse(html)

where color_source.html is nothing more than:

{% extends "_base.html" %}

{% block title %}
   <title>Oregon Curriculum Network | Source Code</title>
{% endblock %}

{% block bodycontent %}
<body>
{{ thecode }}
</body>
{% endblock %}

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Sun Apr  5 18:40:52 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2009 09:40:52 -0700
Subject: [portland] sheepish primes on PPUG
Message-ID: <f604188c0904050940h7460d7ey8d52173ad63ad1e2@mail.gmail.com>

Yo, Pythonistas, Pythonoodlers et al --

here's one from over the cuckoo's nest (with some serious admiration
from my side, though I don't recommend doing it this way if you wanna
have friends read your Python, easier versions available):

>>> g = (lambda primes = []: \
      (n for n in count(2) if \
          (lambda n, primes: \
              (n in primes if (primes and n<=primes[-1]) \
                           else (primes.append(n) or True if all(n%p
for p in primes if p <= sqrt(n)) \
                                                          else False) \
              ) \
          )(n, primes) \
      ) \
  )()
>>> next(g)
2
>>> next(g)
3
>>> next(g)
5
>>> next(g)
7
>>> next(g)
11
>>> [next(g) for i in range(30)]
[13, 17, 19, 23, 29, 31, 37, 41, 43, 47, 53, 59, 61, 67, 71, 73, 79,
83, 89, 97, 101, 103, 107, 109, 113, 127, 131, 137, 139, 149]

OMG right?  This isn't by me BTW, it's a thread we're enjoying on
edu-sig, python.org's e-list for weirdo esoterica (OK OK, python-dev
is weirder).

My thanks to Kay Schluehr , John Posner, Ed Cherlin, Gregor Lingl and
others (it's a long thread about "must have" generators, including
Fibonacci's, Mandelbrot's, Pascal's and of course Primes).

Da link:

http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/2009-April/009222.html

I handed this page off to Andre Roberge at Pycon 2009, consensus
easily reached in our BOF:

http://www.python.org/community/sigs/current/edu-sig/  (I'd been
maintaining, then froze it for svn chapter -- anyone know if they
decided between hg and bzr yet, been navel gazing).

Andre is a university president and physics teacher, more relevantly
author of Crunchy, a client-side thing that eats VLAM (very little
additional markup) to give Python students both a shell and editor
right in the browser, where what it "eats" are doctest enabled code
snippets embedded in VLAM-enabled Wikis (there's a MoinMoin spin-off
that does this).  Not to be confused with PyWhip, a Google App Engine
out of New Mexico I think it is (or Arizona, one of those).

More about Crunchy:

http://mail.python.org/pipermail/edu-sig/2009-March/009187.html

More about the switch to Mercurial, by a Python developer, also re
http://ponysex.us/ (Django pony, caught in the act):

http://sayspy.blogspot.com/2009/04/pycon-2009-recap-best-pycon-ever.html

Kirby

From pcurtain at gmail.com  Wed Apr  8 19:29:34 2009
From: pcurtain at gmail.com (Patrick Curtain)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 10:29:34 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
Message-ID: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All!

I'm looking for someone in the Portland / Vancouver area that can pair
up with me on some hiccups I'm having.

Volunteers would be great, but willing to pay someone hourly to help out.

Long time python coder, new to django.  Also need to learn more about Pinax.

Anyone?  Beuhler?

--p

-- 
Patrick Curtain,  Husband & Father  ( i also write software )
http://www.patrickcurtain.com/                          360.521.9625

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Wed Apr  8 19:37:55 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 10:37:55 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>

There's a few of us here who work on Django.  If you have specific
questions, you could probably get several responses.  Some might even be
helpful.  :-)

FWTW,

Dylan



On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 10:29 AM, Patrick Curtain <pcurtain at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi All!
>
> I'm looking for someone in the Portland / Vancouver area that can pair
> up with me on some hiccups I'm having.
>
> Volunteers would be great, but willing to pay someone hourly to help out.
>
> Long time python coder, new to django.  Also need to learn more about
> Pinax.
>
> Anyone?  Beuhler?
>
> --p
>
> --
> Patrick Curtain,  Husband & Father  ( i also write software )
> http://www.patrickcurtain.com/                          360.521.9625
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
-------------- next part --------------
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From pcurtain at gmail.com  Wed Apr  8 20:08:09 2009
From: pcurtain at gmail.com (Patrick Curtain)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:08:09 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>

Hey!

> There's a few of us here who work on Django. ?If you have specific
> questions, you could probably get several responses. ?Some might even be
> helpful. ?:-)

I'll start here then, for now.  :)  Thanks!  Anyone else, feel free to
tell me it's too specific for the pdxpython list.

I've got a 'Recipe' model that needs to store the author.  From what I
could learn in other examples, this got added to my model:

    member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
blank=True, null=True)

When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that field
shows up as a select box of all users in the system.

My goal is to let some bulk data entry happen in advance of the full
app being completed.  Hence the push to make it work in admin and get
going.

Question:

How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class Admin'
magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
currently using the app?

Responses of "dumb idea, do this instead" -just- as welcome.  :)

And thanks, everyone!
--p

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Wed Apr  8 20:23:36 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:23:36 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
	<e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904081123x277b3fc8t95449eef66972af5@mail.gmail.com>

This is a common question for Django.  The challenge here is that
request.user is known to the view, but not to the model... so you can't just
make request.user the default value on the model.

Take a look at this and browse down to "The Holy Grail":
http://www.b-list.org/weblog/2006/nov/02/django-tips-auto-populated-fields/

HTH,

Dylan



On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:08 AM, Patrick Curtain <pcurtain at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey!
>
> > There's a few of us here who work on Django.  If you have specific
> > questions, you could probably get several responses.  Some might even be
> > helpful.  :-)
>
> I'll start here then, for now.  :)  Thanks!  Anyone else, feel free to
> tell me it's too specific for the pdxpython list.
>
> I've got a 'Recipe' model that needs to store the author.  From what I
> could learn in other examples, this got added to my model:
>
>    member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
> blank=True, null=True)
>
> When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that field
> shows up as a select box of all users in the system.
>
> My goal is to let some bulk data entry happen in advance of the full
> app being completed.  Hence the push to make it work in admin and get
> going.
>
> Question:
>
> How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class Admin'
> magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
> currently using the app?
>
> Responses of "dumb idea, do this instead" -just- as welcome.  :)
>
> And thanks, everyone!
> --p
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
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From rami at typethink.com  Wed Apr  8 20:23:44 2009
From: rami at typethink.com (Rami Kassab)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:23:44 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
	<e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <45B1AD41-9CE9-44A7-9D4D-D05C579278DC@typethink.com>

Patrick,
There's actually a very nice method you can overwrite in your  
ModelAdmin class for that model. It's called save_model. If I could  
copy and paste on this iPhone I'd get ya a link to the docs but you  
should be able to track it down. Essentially, that method has access  
to the request so you can auto select the currently logged in user by  
setting your foreign key to request.user.

If you know that it's always going to be the currently logged in user  
then you can just hide the field on the form end. Simply override the  
save_model method and you can set whatever defaults ya want.

Hope that helps :)

Rami Kassab
M 503.888.8605
W 503.626.6231
F 503.626.6233
6025 SW Jean Rd.
Lake Oswego, OR 97035

Sent from my iPhone.

On Apr 8, 2009, at 11:08 AM, Patrick Curtain <pcurtain at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey!
>
>> There's a few of us here who work on Django.  If you have specific
>> questions, you could probably get several responses.  Some might  
>> even be
>> helpful.  :-)
>
> I'll start here then, for now.  :)  Thanks!  Anyone else, feel free to
> tell me it's too specific for the pdxpython list.
>
> I've got a 'Recipe' model that needs to store the author.  From what I
> could learn in other examples, this got added to my model:
>
>    member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
> blank=True, null=True)
>
> When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that field
> shows up as a select box of all users in the system.
>
> My goal is to let some bulk data entry happen in advance of the full
> app being completed.  Hence the push to make it work in admin and get
> going.
>
> Question:
>
> How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class Admin'
> magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
> currently using the app?
>
> Responses of "dumb idea, do this instead" -just- as welcome.  :)
>
> And thanks, everyone!
> --p
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland

From rami at typethink.com  Wed Apr  8 20:26:08 2009
From: rami at typethink.com (Rami Kassab)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:26:08 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720904081123x277b3fc8t95449eef66972af5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
	<e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081123x277b3fc8t95449eef66972af5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7EC26EC2-EB4D-43F7-9F1F-91812EE2DC05@typethink.com>

Dylan, this is outdated info. The new Django does have access to the  
request via a method called save_model that can be overwritten on the  
ModalAdmin class for your model. It's a nice newforms admin feature :)

Rami Kassab
M 503.888.8605
W 503.626.6231
F 503.626.6233
6025 SW Jean Rd.
Lake Oswego, OR 97035

Sent from my iPhone.

On Apr 8, 2009, at 11:23 AM, Dylan Reinhardt  
<python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:

> This is a common question for Django.  The challenge here is that
> request.user is known to the view, but not to the model... so you  
> can't just
> make request.user the default value on the model.
>
> Take a look at this and browse down to "The Holy Grail":
> http://www.b-list.org/weblog/2006/nov/02/django-tips-auto-populated-fields/
>
> HTH,
>
> Dylan
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:08 AM, Patrick Curtain  
> <pcurtain at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hey!
>>
>>> There's a few of us here who work on Django.  If you have specific
>>> questions, you could probably get several responses.  Some might  
>>> even be
>>> helpful.  :-)
>>
>> I'll start here then, for now.  :)  Thanks!  Anyone else, feel free  
>> to
>> tell me it's too specific for the pdxpython list.
>>
>> I've got a 'Recipe' model that needs to store the author.  From  
>> what I
>> could learn in other examples, this got added to my model:
>>
>>   member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
>> blank=True, null=True)
>>
>> When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that field
>> shows up as a select box of all users in the system.
>>
>> My goal is to let some bulk data entry happen in advance of the full
>> app being completed.  Hence the push to make it work in admin and get
>> going.
>>
>> Question:
>>
>> How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class  
>> Admin'
>> magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
>> currently using the app?
>>
>> Responses of "dumb idea, do this instead" -just- as welcome.  :)
>>
>> And thanks, everyone!
>> --p
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090408/4abf61e3/attachment.htm 
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Wed Apr  8 20:27:12 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:27:12 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <45B1AD41-9CE9-44A7-9D4D-D05C579278DC@typethink.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
	<e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
	<45B1AD41-9CE9-44A7-9D4D-D05C579278DC@typethink.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904081127x3dbfa7e8y13ea53f6b645a6cf@mail.gmail.com>

Awesome... I missed that new feature.

Here's the doc:

http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/contrib/admin/#save-model-self-request-obj-form-change



On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:23 AM, Rami Kassab <rami at typethink.com> wrote:

> Patrick,
> There's actually a very nice method you can overwrite in your ModelAdmin
> class for that model. It's called save_model. If I could copy and paste on
> this iPhone I'd get ya a link to the docs but you should be able to track it
> down. Essentially, that method has access to the request so you can auto
> select the currently logged in user by setting your foreign key to
> request.user.
>
> If you know that it's always going to be the currently logged in user then
> you can just hide the field on the form end. Simply override the save_model
> method and you can set whatever defaults ya want.
>
> Hope that helps :)
>
> Rami Kassab
> M 503.888.8605
> W 503.626.6231
> F 503.626.6233
> 6025 SW Jean Rd.
> Lake Oswego, OR 97035
>
> Sent from my iPhone.
>
>
> On Apr 8, 2009, at 11:08 AM, Patrick Curtain <pcurtain at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>  Hey!
>>
>>  There's a few of us here who work on Django.  If you have specific
>>> questions, you could probably get several responses.  Some might even be
>>> helpful.  :-)
>>>
>>
>> I'll start here then, for now.  :)  Thanks!  Anyone else, feel free to
>> tell me it's too specific for the pdxpython list.
>>
>> I've got a 'Recipe' model that needs to store the author.  From what I
>> could learn in other examples, this got added to my model:
>>
>>   member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
>> blank=True, null=True)
>>
>> When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that field
>> shows up as a select box of all users in the system.
>>
>> My goal is to let some bulk data entry happen in advance of the full
>> app being completed.  Hence the push to make it work in admin and get
>> going.
>>
>> Question:
>>
>> How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class Admin'
>> magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
>> currently using the app?
>>
>> Responses of "dumb idea, do this instead" -just- as welcome.  :)
>>
>> And thanks, everyone!
>> --p
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
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From rami at typethink.com  Wed Apr  8 20:33:58 2009
From: rami at typethink.com (Rami Kassab)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:33:58 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720904081127x3dbfa7e8y13ea53f6b645a6cf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
	<e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
	<45B1AD41-9CE9-44A7-9D4D-D05C579278DC@typethink.com>
	<4c645a720904081127x3dbfa7e8y13ea53f6b645a6cf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <31049001-A8A5-4823-922F-2925D5F0CB08@typethink.com>

Yep that's the right doc. They've got some very helpful things in  
there. Read this doc and understand it well for the admin site.  
Save_formset is also a method you can override.

That's what makes Django so awesome. You can hook into and override  
almost anything. It's jus wonderful.

Now, if only apple could release copy and paste for my phone, I just  
might be able to be a bit more helpful when on the road. I know, I  
know, copy and paste is a very advanced feature and takes some time :)

Rami Kassab
M 503.888.8605
W 503.626.6231
F 503.626.6233
6025 SW Jean Rd.
Lake Oswego, OR 97035

Sent from my iPhone.

On Apr 8, 2009, at 11:27 AM, Dylan Reinhardt  
<python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:

> Awesome... I missed that new feature.
>
> Here's the doc:
>
> http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/contrib/admin/#save-model-self-request-obj-form-change
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:23 AM, Rami Kassab <rami at typethink.com>  
> wrote:
>
>> Patrick,
>> There's actually a very nice method you can overwrite in your  
>> ModelAdmin
>> class for that model. It's called save_model. If I could copy and  
>> paste on
>> this iPhone I'd get ya a link to the docs but you should be able to  
>> track it
>> down. Essentially, that method has access to the request so you can  
>> auto
>> select the currently logged in user by setting your foreign key to
>> request.user.
>>
>> If you know that it's always going to be the currently logged in  
>> user then
>> you can just hide the field on the form end. Simply override the  
>> save_model
>> method and you can set whatever defaults ya want.
>>
>> Hope that helps :)
>>
>> Rami Kassab
>> M 503.888.8605
>> W 503.626.6231
>> F 503.626.6233
>> 6025 SW Jean Rd.
>> Lake Oswego, OR 97035
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone.
>>
>>
>> On Apr 8, 2009, at 11:08 AM, Patrick Curtain <pcurtain at gmail.com>  
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hey!
>>>
>>> There's a few of us here who work on Django.  If you have specific
>>>> questions, you could probably get several responses.  Some might  
>>>> even be
>>>> helpful.  :-)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I'll start here then, for now.  :)  Thanks!  Anyone else, feel  
>>> free to
>>> tell me it's too specific for the pdxpython list.
>>>
>>> I've got a 'Recipe' model that needs to store the author.  From  
>>> what I
>>> could learn in other examples, this got added to my model:
>>>
>>>  member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
>>> blank=True, null=True)
>>>
>>> When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that  
>>> field
>>> shows up as a select box of all users in the system.
>>>
>>> My goal is to let some bulk data entry happen in advance of the full
>>> app being completed.  Hence the push to make it work in admin and  
>>> get
>>> going.
>>>
>>> Question:
>>>
>>> How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class  
>>> Admin'
>>> magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
>>> currently using the app?
>>>
>>> Responses of "dumb idea, do this instead" -just- as welcome.  :)
>>>
>>> And thanks, everyone!
>>> --p
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Portland mailing list
>>> Portland at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
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> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090408/4771211e/attachment.htm 
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland

From freyley at gmail.com  Wed Apr  8 20:38:21 2009
From: freyley at gmail.com (Jeff Schwaber)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:38:21 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
	<e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8db4a1910904081138x3fd35354m75975d5001e38467@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:08 AM, Patrick Curtain <pcurtain at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey!
>
>
>    member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
> blank=True, null=True)
>
> When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that field
> shows up as a select box of all users in the system.
>


> How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class Admin'
> magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
> currently using the app?
>

Most of what I've seen to try to do this isn't to set a default, it's to
make it happen invisibly. For example, this:

class ArticleAdmin(admin.ModelAdmin):
    exclude = ('member',)
    def save_model(self, request, obj, form, change):
        obj.member = request.user
        obj.save()

But looking at the doc, save_formset might do what you want:

http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.0//ref/contrib/admin/#ref-contrib-admin

Jeff
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From pcurtain at gmail.com  Wed Apr  8 20:41:01 2009
From: pcurtain at gmail.com (Patrick Curtain)
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:41:01 -0700
Subject: [portland] django helper
In-Reply-To: <8db4a1910904081138x3fd35354m75975d5001e38467@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e060a3930904081029m1a406c02g425b0abdae7d97c5@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904081037n3e92ee7fie9077d41e78fdd93@mail.gmail.com>
	<e060a3930904081108m66cb5d18v2e7b5138f6a3c384@mail.gmail.com>
	<8db4a1910904081138x3fd35354m75975d5001e38467@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e060a3930904081141g219550en5c447d24772fac33@mail.gmail.com>

Wow!  Everyone, thank you SOO much.  That certainly gives me plenty to
go on.  I'll hit everyone back with the solution that sticks in my
Admin case.

And good to see all the traffic and help available.  I'd been lurking
and it seemed quiet.  :)

Blessings!
--p


On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Jeff Schwaber <freyley at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 11:08 AM, Patrick Curtain <pcurtain at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hey!
>>
>>
>> ? ?member = models.ForeignKey(User, related_name="added_recipes",
>> blank=True, null=True)
>>
>> When I view the form in the admin interface, it works, but that field
>> shows up as a select box of all users in the system.
>>
>
>
>> How do I tell the admin interface form (via the internal 'class Admin'
>> magic ideally) that it should get the user from the 'request.user'
>> currently using the app?
>>
>
> Most of what I've seen to try to do this isn't to set a default, it's to
> make it happen invisibly. For example, this:
>
> class ArticleAdmin(admin.ModelAdmin):
> ? ?exclude = ('member',)
> ? ?def save_model(self, request, obj, form, change):
> ? ? ? ?obj.member = request.user
> ? ? ? ?obj.save()
>
> But looking at the doc, save_formset might do what you want:
>
> http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.0//ref/contrib/admin/#ref-contrib-admin
>
> Jeff
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090408/c41c41da/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>



-- 
Patrick Curtain,  Husband & Father  ( i also write software )
http://www.patrickcurtain.com/                          360.521.9625

From jek at discorporate.us  Mon Apr 13 21:49:56 2009
From: jek at discorporate.us (jason kirtland)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 2009 12:49:56 -0700
Subject: [portland] Tonight: Open Source Bridge Conference Admission Raffle!
 Sign up now!
Message-ID: <49E39764.8070509@discorporate.us>

The Open Source Bridge Conference organizers were kind enough to give 
our user group one free admission to raffle off to the group!  We'll 
raffle it off at tonight's meeting- to enter the raffle, just put your 
name down here:

https://spreadsheets.google.com/viewform?formkey=cHNJOUlRcXg1dHphcEdYZzdmSXluRXc6MA.. 


Open Source Bridge will be June 17, 18 and 19 at the Convention Center 
and it's shaping up to be *fantastic*.

http://opensourcebridge.org/

You don't need to be present to win but it'll be MUCH more fun if you are!!

http://www.meetup.com/pdxpython/calendar/9928813/

-j

From jek at discorporate.us  Mon Apr 13 21:52:27 2009
From: jek at discorporate.us (jason kirtland)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 2009 12:52:27 -0700
Subject: [portland] Tonight: Open Source Bridge Conference Admission
 Raffle! Sign up now!
In-Reply-To: <49E39764.8070509@discorporate.us>
References: <49E39764.8070509@discorporate.us>
Message-ID: <49E397FB.2020902@discorporate.us>

And by "Tonight" of course I meant "Tomorrow".  We'll be raffling at 
Tuesday night's meeting!

jason kirtland wrote:
> The Open Source Bridge Conference organizers were kind enough to give 
> our user group one free admission to raffle off to the group!  We'll 
> raffle it off at tonight's meeting- to enter the raffle, just put your 
> name down here:
> 
> https://spreadsheets.google.com/viewform?formkey=cHNJOUlRcXg1dHphcEdYZzdmSXluRXc6MA.. 
> 
> 
> Open Source Bridge will be June 17, 18 and 19 at the Convention Center 
> and it's shaping up to be *fantastic*.
> 
> http://opensourcebridge.org/
> 
> You don't need to be present to win but it'll be MUCH more fun if you are!!
> 
> http://www.meetup.com/pdxpython/calendar/9928813/
> 
> -j
> 


From michelle at pdxpython.org  Tue Apr 14 04:14:52 2009
From: michelle at pdxpython.org (michelle rowley)
Date: Mon, 13 Apr 2009 19:14:52 -0700
Subject: [portland] PDX Python meeting tomorrow - Tuesday 4/14 @ 7pm
Message-ID: <813046e40904131914h1167a99fl3decc2a86a9210a6@mail.gmail.com>

Hey PDX Pythoneers!

I'm excited to announce that we'll be doing that monthly meeting thing
tomorrow, same time, same place: CubeSpace, 7pm. Everyone's invited
(as always!), and I think it's going to be a fun meeting.

First, thanks to the organizers of the Open Source Bridge conference
(http://opensourcebridge.org/), we have an admission pass to raffle
off to a PDX Python group member! As Jason Kirtland mentioned in his
email earlier today, you don't have to be at tomorrow's meeting to
enter the raffle, but why would you want to miss the meeting, anyway??
(If you really can't make it, you can still enter here:
https://spreadsheets.google.com/viewform?formkey=cHNJOUlRcXg1dHphcEdYZzdmSXluRXc6MA
 :))

So, in addition to the raffling fun, we're going to hear from the
Portlanders who made it out to PyCon this year. If *you* went to
PyCon, please, put your photos and notes together, and bring it along
to the meeting to share with us! Come on... Ride the lightning. :)

Okay, so next there'll be a discussion about our very own PDX Python
website (http://www.pdxpython.org/). Currently, it points over to our
wiki page on python.org - and, while that has served us well, let's
put our brains together and figure out what else it can do... and then
start hacking on it.

And afterwards: beverage, of course. Yay, beverage!

See you there!!

michelle
-----
meetup: http://www.meetup.com/pdxpython/calendar/9928813/
twitter: http://www.twitter.com/pdxpython/
wiki: http://www.pdxpython.org/

cubespace info:
622 SE Grand Ave.
Portland, OR 97214
503-206-3500
http://cubespacepdx.com/

From omar at gnlnx.net  Tue Apr 14 21:41:39 2009
From: omar at gnlnx.net (Omar A Rodriguez)
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 12:41:39 -0700
Subject: [portland] Meeting stream
Message-ID: <89895848-4691-4773-831B-1398A7E6C5B8@gnlnx.net>

Hi all,

I was at last month's meeting and noticed someone had a stream set up.  
Are you planning to do it for tonight's meeting? If yes, can you send  
a link? I won't be able to attend in person but would like to follow  
along :-)

Thanks,
-Omar

From brett at rdnzl.net  Wed Apr 15 00:24:09 2009
From: brett at rdnzl.net (Brett Carter)
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 15:24:09 -0700
Subject: [portland] Meeting stream
In-Reply-To: <89895848-4691-4773-831B-1398A7E6C5B8@gnlnx.net>
References: <89895848-4691-4773-831B-1398A7E6C5B8@gnlnx.net>
Message-ID: <49E50D09.2070603@rdnzl.net>

Yes, I'll be streaming at:
http://www.stickam.com/pdxpython

I'll also be on irc #pdxpython on freenode, I'd appreciate any feedback.
-Brett

Omar A Rodriguez wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> I was at last month's meeting and noticed someone had a stream set up. 
> Are you planning to do it for tonight's meeting? If yes, can you send a 
> link? I won't be able to attend in person but would like to follow along 
> :-)
> 
> Thanks,
> -Omar
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland


From brian at dorseys.org  Wed Apr 15 01:06:19 2009
From: brian at dorseys.org (Brian Dorsey)
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 16:06:19 -0700
Subject: [portland] Meeting stream
In-Reply-To: <49E50D09.2070603@rdnzl.net>
References: <89895848-4691-4773-831B-1398A7E6C5B8@gnlnx.net>
	<49E50D09.2070603@rdnzl.net>
Message-ID: <66e877b70904141606o3cc2a425w638c6bb05447334c@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 3:24 PM, Brett Carter <brett at rdnzl.net> wrote:
> Yes, I'll be streaming at:
> http://www.stickam.com/pdxpython
>
> I'll also be on irc #pdxpython on freenode, I'd appreciate any feedback.
> -Brett

Fantastic! I was trying to come down this month, but it didn't work
out. I'll lurk in the back channel instead. ;)

Take care,
    -Brian

From omar at gnlnx.net  Wed Apr 15 01:46:00 2009
From: omar at gnlnx.net (Omar A Rodriguez)
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 16:46:00 -0700
Subject: [portland] Meeting stream
In-Reply-To: <66e877b70904141606o3cc2a425w638c6bb05447334c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <89895848-4691-4773-831B-1398A7E6C5B8@gnlnx.net>
	<49E50D09.2070603@rdnzl.net>
	<66e877b70904141606o3cc2a425w638c6bb05447334c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <357C8B37-A1B3-4036-A3C7-3426EA8A0A84@gnlnx.net>

On Apr 14, 2009, at 4:06 PM, Brian Dorsey <brian at dorseys.org> wrote:

> On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 3:24 PM, Brett Carter <brett at rdnzl.net> wrote:
>> Yes, I'll be streaming at:
>> http://www.stickam.com/pdxpython
>>
>> I'll also be on irc #pdxpython on freenode, I'd appreciate any  
>> feedback.
>> -Brett
>
> Fantastic! I was trying to come down this month, but it didn't work
> out. I'll lurk in the back channel instead. ;)
>
> Take care,
>    -Brian
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland

Thanks :-)

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr 16 02:25:41 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 2009 17:25:41 -0700
Subject: [portland] class decorators useful?
Message-ID: <f604188c0904151725s7528dc88lfdae3fcca727f35b@mail.gmail.com>

I'm thinking of Adam's comment that he never decorated a class and
didn't regret it, and, truth be told, I've not experimented with that
feature much.

So I wanted to give a use case, see if PPUGers think it flies.

Consider I have this Vector class that does the usual stuff around
xyz, don't even have dot or cross product, just add, subtract, negate
and scalar multiply.

Note that to __sub__(v) is simply to __add__(v.__neg__()) i.e. to
subtract v is to add the additive inverse of v.

To allow 3 * v as well as v * 3 (scale by a scalar), we need an
__rmul__ = __mul__:

class Vector:

    def __init__(self, xyz):
            self.xyz = tuple(xyz)

    def __add__(self, other):
            return Vector([i + j for i,j in zip(self.xyz, other.xyz)])

    def __neg__(self):
            return Vector([-i for i in self.xyz])

    def __sub__(self, other):
            return self + (-other)

    def __mul__(self, scalar):
            return Vector([scalar * i for i in self.xyz])

    __rmul__ = __mul__

    def __repr__(self):
            return "Vector (%s)" % (self.xyz,)
	

def test():
    oA = Vector((1,2,3))
    oB = Vector((2,0,2))
    print(oA)
    print(oA + oB)
    print(oA - oB)
    print(-oB)
    print(oA + (-oB))
    print(3 * oA)
    oA.draw()
    oA.erase()

The last two tests fail however, because these refer to Visual Python
methods that will actually put colored cylinders in an OpenGL "fish
tank" (= canvas with z-axis).

Say I don't want to mess with the Vector code, because I use it
elsewhere and consider VPython stuff somewhat extraneous.  I just want
to "tweak" my Vector class with some additional capabilities, for the
purposes of this module.

What I do instead of subclassing Vector and adding draw and erase
methods, is I write a class decorator function that *redefines* my
Vector in terms of itself with this added Mixin class, the latter
containing the stuff from VPython:

[ mixin.py module ]

import faux_visual as visual

def makeVisual(Theclass):

    class Mixin:

        radius = 0.1
        color = 'red'

        def draw(self):
            """define and render the cylinder"""
            v = visual.vector(*self.xyz)
            print("drawing vector (%s, %s, %s)"
                  % self.xyz )
            self.cyl = visual.cylinder(pos = (0,0,0),
                    axis = v, radius = self.radius, color = self.color)

        def erase(self):
            """toss the cylinder"""
            if self.cyl:
                print("erasing vector (%s, %s, %s)" % self.xyz)
                self.cyl.visible = 0
            self.cyl = None

    class Newclass(Theclass, Mixin):
        pass

    return Newclass

.... then same Vector as before, plus the tests.

Note that Python 3.x doesn't yet have VPython for a 3rd party option,
so I had to write a "stupid stub" to test my code:

[ saved separately as faux_visual.py, note lowercase vector, like in
visual (VPython) ]

class vector:

    def __init__(self, x, y, z):
        self.x = x; self.y = y; self.z = z

class cylinder:  # faux cylinder, takes named args

    def __init__(self, **kwargs):
        self.__dict__.update(kwargs)

Now all I have to do in my original module is:

@makeVisual
class Vector:

    def __init__(self, xyz):
            self.xyz = tuple(xyz)

    def __add__(self, other):
            return Vector([i + j for i,j in zip(self.xyz, other.xyz)])

    def __neg__(self):
            return Vector([-i for i in self.xyz])

    def __sub__(self, other):
            return self + (-other)

    def __mul__(self, scalar):
            return Vector([scalar * i for i in self.xyz])

    __rmul__ = __mul__

    def __repr__(self):
            return "Vector (%s)" % (self.xyz,)
	
i.e. by adding this decorator above my Vector class (which I didn't
change in any other way), I am, for the purposes of this module,
automatically enhancing its API with Vpython stuff.

I'm still able to use all my original tests, don't need a new name for
my class.  However, draw and erase now work:

Running the mixin.py module:

>>>
Vector ((1, 2, 3))
Vector ((3, 2, 5))
Vector ((-1, 2, 1))
Vector ((-2, 0, -2))
Vector ((-1, 2, 1))
Vector ((3, 6, 9))
drawing vector (1, 2, 3)
erasing vector (1, 2, 3)

Is this persuasive at all, as a possible design pattern?

Basically you're wanting to not mess with a namespace, yet want to
retrofit a class with some additional capabilities.  A decorator
returns the same name, so the code that didn't know about the
enhancements before, doesn't need to know now, and yet some new tests
are passed.

There are other ways to accomplish the above.

At least I'm showing how a decorator might accomplish something far
less ambitious than developing a metaclass.

Here's an excellent talk on class decorators, also talked to this guy
(Jack Diederick) at the CPP / Iceland party (lots of Twisted guys):

http://pycon.blip.tv/file/1957258/


Kirby

Note:  I see my stuff is starting to come thru, though I don't get how
a 3 hour talk fragments into a 6 minute anything.
http://pycon.blip.tv/#2008102 (yow! part 1 is 57 minutes, will my
mplayer plugin even work?).

This talk by Jeff Rush on namespaces vs. code objects was spectacular,
recommended!
http://pycon.blip.tv/file/1957258/

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr 16 17:31:53 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 08:31:53 -0700
Subject: [portland] followup re Red Cross
Message-ID: <f604188c0904160831j4e7eb13xe643fca4a96c39b7@mail.gmail.com>

Hey there geeks!

pursuant to my lightning talk this last time @ PPUG, which was
somewhat impromptu i.e. I only got the info that very day, here's more
of the deal on my Red Cross connection:

(a) read both blog posts if interested in an idea of the current
status quo (fucked up):

http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/ppug-2009414.html
http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/frustrated-with-red-cross.html

(b) I'm staying in touch with the Red Cross CTO plus have forwarded
more details including some emails to our combined PPUG & OS Bridge
leadership, namely Jason and Michelle, Selena and Audrey, though I'm
thinking they're all too crazy busy to do much about it, just wanted
to scattergun across skill set communities, with Michelle strong in
Django, Jason in everything Python, Selena in PostgreSQL and Audrey in
Rails.

Yes, I'm cluing the Rails community as I'm looking from over the
shoulder of Red Cross CTO towards Cubespace as this bevy of relevant
webapp developers, not differentiating much further than that, all
comers welcome (Perl Mongers, let's get on it).  I do favor Django
though, have been consistently suggesting it both around Ecotrust
(which already uses GeoDjango) and around Center for Outcomes Research
and Education (Providence, more into MUMPS, not atypical in
hospitals).

I also forwarded the data to Mosaic Consulting whom I contract with
for HR (human resources) consulting, in case this gets to the resume
stage or we actually want to offer Red Cross a coherent development
plan.  Fred Meyer Trust is a puzzle piece.

I'll be happy if we get that far, as I think the promise of open
source is it actually strengthens NGOs, nonprofits, those glue
organizations that serve community.  It's not just that the tools are
powerful, but that we think more the way they do, in terms of freely
sharing our liberal arts (cite R0ml Lefkowitz et al).

This has always been the hype, plus it's real on the ground in a great
many cases, however Portland, with a reputation as a FOSS capital
(CSM:2005) stands to improve its reputation as such if its signature
nonprofits aren't wallowing in licensing fee hell paying like double
for only half the result.

As an erstwhile consultant with Free Geek (CollabTech chapter) I know
that serving in the nonprofit community is difficult, frustrating,
often uphill work but is also potentially rewarding and great for your
resume if you wanna be a USA senator someday (OK, most of us don't).

I've played (and been paid) in this sandbox for years and have
treasured working with some really dedicated people doing obviously
important and interesting things.  If you've not worked with
nonprofits before, I suggest trying to find out more at OS Bridge.  Or
talk to me sometime (4dsolutions.net), maybe after a PPUG meeting, or
talk to Jason (idealist.org).

Kirby

PS:  and again with the Pycon slides, which went by kinda faced on the
remotely operated white screen:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/17157315 at N00/sets/72157616066135225/
re my workshop:  http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/03/urner-workshop.html

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Thu Apr 16 19:43:47 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 10:43:47 -0700
Subject: [portland] followup re Red Cross
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0904160831j4e7eb13xe643fca4a96c39b7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <f604188c0904160831j4e7eb13xe643fca4a96c39b7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904161043k5de55den6643774099509d21@mail.gmail.com>

Wow... there certainly is a lot of room for improvement here.

That said, when an organization maintains its web site this badly, it's not
typically because of an inability to find programmers.  It's because their
business processes don't include the web site and/or a lack of perceived
value toward having an up-to-date web site.

A new toolset might generate some heat, but it is not going to change
management priorities nor will it fix their broken business processes. I'd
be really shy about dragging an ad hoc band of geeks into a project with an
international organization without having a really good idea of what you're
actually up against.

FWIW,

Dylan



On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 8:31 AM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey there geeks!
>
> pursuant to my lightning talk this last time @ PPUG, which was
> somewhat impromptu i.e. I only got the info that very day, here's more
> of the deal on my Red Cross connection:
>
> (a) read both blog posts if interested in an idea of the current
> status quo (fucked up):
>
> http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/ppug-2009414.html
> http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/frustrated-with-red-cross.html
>
> (b) I'm staying in touch with the Red Cross CTO plus have forwarded
> more details including some emails to our combined PPUG & OS Bridge
> leadership, namely Jason and Michelle, Selena and Audrey, though I'm
> thinking they're all too crazy busy to do much about it, just wanted
> to scattergun across skill set communities, with Michelle strong in
> Django, Jason in everything Python, Selena in PostgreSQL and Audrey in
> Rails.
>
> Yes, I'm cluing the Rails community as I'm looking from over the
> shoulder of Red Cross CTO towards Cubespace as this bevy of relevant
> webapp developers, not differentiating much further than that, all
> comers welcome (Perl Mongers, let's get on it).  I do favor Django
> though, have been consistently suggesting it both around Ecotrust
> (which already uses GeoDjango) and around Center for Outcomes Research
> and Education (Providence, more into MUMPS, not atypical in
> hospitals).
>
> I also forwarded the data to Mosaic Consulting whom I contract with
> for HR (human resources) consulting, in case this gets to the resume
> stage or we actually want to offer Red Cross a coherent development
> plan.  Fred Meyer Trust is a puzzle piece.
>
> I'll be happy if we get that far, as I think the promise of open
> source is it actually strengthens NGOs, nonprofits, those glue
> organizations that serve community.  It's not just that the tools are
> powerful, but that we think more the way they do, in terms of freely
> sharing our liberal arts (cite R0ml Lefkowitz et al).
>
> This has always been the hype, plus it's real on the ground in a great
> many cases, however Portland, with a reputation as a FOSS capital
> (CSM:2005) stands to improve its reputation as such if its signature
> nonprofits aren't wallowing in licensing fee hell paying like double
> for only half the result.
>
> As an erstwhile consultant with Free Geek (CollabTech chapter) I know
> that serving in the nonprofit community is difficult, frustrating,
> often uphill work but is also potentially rewarding and great for your
> resume if you wanna be a USA senator someday (OK, most of us don't).
>
> I've played (and been paid) in this sandbox for years and have
> treasured working with some really dedicated people doing obviously
> important and interesting things.  If you've not worked with
> nonprofits before, I suggest trying to find out more at OS Bridge.  Or
> talk to me sometime (4dsolutions.net), maybe after a PPUG meeting, or
> talk to Jason (idealist.org).
>
> Kirby
>
> PS:  and again with the Pycon slides, which went by kinda faced on the
> remotely operated white screen:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/17157315 at N00/sets/72157616066135225/
> re my workshop:  http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/03/urner-workshop.html
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
-------------- next part --------------
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr 16 19:58:37 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 10:58:37 -0700
Subject: [portland] followup re Red Cross
In-Reply-To: <4c645a720904161043k5de55den6643774099509d21@mail.gmail.com>
References: <f604188c0904160831j4e7eb13xe643fca4a96c39b7@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904161043k5de55den6643774099509d21@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904161058i1b3a2a34u56b343fa132002b2@mail.gmail.com>

Yes, that's good advice Dylan, glad you appreciate this is a workflow
issue, not just about what happens to an HttpRequest once it gets in
the door (lots fall off the roller coaster in this case, plunge to
their deaths, but hey, it's only virtual, plus there's a whole other
website that'll swap in if we're nuked or Hood blows or whatever, hope
we don't have to use it, might be written in ASP/VB?).

However, I'm a good person to come forward with this as I've been
working in the non-profit sector for some years (Sisters of the Road,
Burnside Projects, Oregon Food Bank, Vision Northwest, Clackamas
County, Disability Determination Services, Aging Services of
Multnomah, and yes, Red Cross, though not any time recently -- been at
this since 1980s actually).  In other words, I'm good at managing
workflow, plus have help.

Kirby


On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Dylan Reinhardt
<python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:
> Wow... there certainly is a lot of room for improvement here.
>
> That said, when an organization maintains its web site this badly, it's not
> typically because of an inability to find programmers. ?It's because their
> business processes don't include the web site and/or a lack of perceived
> value toward having an up-to-date web site.
>
> A new toolset might generate some heat, but it is not going to change
> management priorities nor will it fix their broken business processes. I'd
> be really shy about dragging an ad hoc band of geeks into a project with an
> international organization without having a really good idea of what you're
> actually up against.
>
> FWIW,
>
> Dylan
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 8:31 AM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hey there geeks!
>>
>> pursuant to my lightning talk this last time @ PPUG, which was
>> somewhat impromptu i.e. I only got the info that very day, here's more
>> of the deal on my Red Cross connection:
>>
>> (a) read both blog posts if interested in an idea of the current
>> status quo (fucked up):
>>
>> http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/ppug-2009414.html
>> http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/frustrated-with-red-cross.html
>>
>> (b) I'm staying in touch with the Red Cross CTO plus have forwarded
>> more details including some emails to our combined PPUG & OS Bridge
>> leadership, namely Jason and Michelle, Selena and Audrey, though I'm
>> thinking they're all too crazy busy to do much about it, just wanted
>> to scattergun across skill set communities, with Michelle strong in
>> Django, Jason in everything Python, Selena in PostgreSQL and Audrey in
>> Rails.
>>
>> Yes, I'm cluing the Rails community as I'm looking from over the
>> shoulder of Red Cross CTO towards Cubespace as this bevy of relevant
>> webapp developers, not differentiating much further than that, all
>> comers welcome (Perl Mongers, let's get on it). ?I do favor Django
>> though, have been consistently suggesting it both around Ecotrust
>> (which already uses GeoDjango) and around Center for Outcomes Research
>> and Education (Providence, more into MUMPS, not atypical in
>> hospitals).
>>
>> I also forwarded the data to Mosaic Consulting whom I contract with
>> for HR (human resources) consulting, in case this gets to the resume
>> stage or we actually want to offer Red Cross a coherent development
>> plan. ?Fred Meyer Trust is a puzzle piece.
>>
>> I'll be happy if we get that far, as I think the promise of open
>> source is it actually strengthens NGOs, nonprofits, those glue
>> organizations that serve community. ?It's not just that the tools are
>> powerful, but that we think more the way they do, in terms of freely
>> sharing our liberal arts (cite R0ml Lefkowitz et al).
>>
>> This has always been the hype, plus it's real on the ground in a great
>> many cases, however Portland, with a reputation as a FOSS capital
>> (CSM:2005) stands to improve its reputation as such if its signature
>> nonprofits aren't wallowing in licensing fee hell paying like double
>> for only half the result.
>>
>> As an erstwhile consultant with Free Geek (CollabTech chapter) I know
>> that serving in the nonprofit community is difficult, frustrating,
>> often uphill work but is also potentially rewarding and great for your
>> resume if you wanna be a USA senator someday (OK, most of us don't).
>>
>> I've played (and been paid) in this sandbox for years and have
>> treasured working with some really dedicated people doing obviously
>> important and interesting things. ?If you've not worked with
>> nonprofits before, I suggest trying to find out more at OS Bridge. ?Or
>> talk to me sometime (4dsolutions.net), maybe after a PPUG meeting, or
>> talk to Jason (idealist.org).
>>
>> Kirby
>>
>> PS: ?and again with the Pycon slides, which went by kinda faced on the
>> remotely operated white screen:
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/17157315 at N00/sets/72157616066135225/
>> re my workshop: ?http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/03/urner-workshop.html
>> _______________________________________________
>> Portland mailing list
>> Portland at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090416/03ecd572/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From python at dylanreinhardt.com  Thu Apr 16 21:16:21 2009
From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt)
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 12:16:21 -0700
Subject: [portland] followup re Red Cross
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0904161058i1b3a2a34u56b343fa132002b2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <f604188c0904160831j4e7eb13xe643fca4a96c39b7@mail.gmail.com>
	<4c645a720904161043k5de55den6643774099509d21@mail.gmail.com>
	<f604188c0904161058i1b3a2a34u56b343fa132002b2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4c645a720904161216l34a23951l5766e40929ae6f8a@mail.gmail.com>

Awesome.  As long as you know what you might be getting into, it looks like
they could really use the help.  :-)


On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 10:58 AM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:

> Yes, that's good advice Dylan, glad you appreciate this is a workflow
> issue, not just about what happens to an HttpRequest once it gets in
> the door (lots fall off the roller coaster in this case, plunge to
> their deaths, but hey, it's only virtual, plus there's a whole other
> website that'll swap in if we're nuked or Hood blows or whatever, hope
> we don't have to use it, might be written in ASP/VB?).
>
> However, I'm a good person to come forward with this as I've been
> working in the non-profit sector for some years (Sisters of the Road,
> Burnside Projects, Oregon Food Bank, Vision Northwest, Clackamas
> County, Disability Determination Services, Aging Services of
> Multnomah, and yes, Red Cross, though not any time recently -- been at
> this since 1980s actually).  In other words, I'm good at managing
> workflow, plus have help.
>
> Kirby
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Dylan Reinhardt
> <python at dylanreinhardt.com> wrote:
> > Wow... there certainly is a lot of room for improvement here.
> >
> > That said, when an organization maintains its web site this badly, it's
> not
> > typically because of an inability to find programmers.  It's because
> their
> > business processes don't include the web site and/or a lack of perceived
> > value toward having an up-to-date web site.
> >
> > A new toolset might generate some heat, but it is not going to change
> > management priorities nor will it fix their broken business processes.
> I'd
> > be really shy about dragging an ad hoc band of geeks into a project with
> an
> > international organization without having a really good idea of what
> you're
> > actually up against.
> >
> > FWIW,
> >
> > Dylan
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 8:31 AM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >> Hey there geeks!
> >>
> >> pursuant to my lightning talk this last time @ PPUG, which was
> >> somewhat impromptu i.e. I only got the info that very day, here's more
> >> of the deal on my Red Cross connection:
> >>
> >> (a) read both blog posts if interested in an idea of the current
> >> status quo (fucked up):
> >>
> >> http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/ppug-2009414.html
> >> http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/frustrated-with-red-cross.html
> >>
> >> (b) I'm staying in touch with the Red Cross CTO plus have forwarded
> >> more details including some emails to our combined PPUG & OS Bridge
> >> leadership, namely Jason and Michelle, Selena and Audrey, though I'm
> >> thinking they're all too crazy busy to do much about it, just wanted
> >> to scattergun across skill set communities, with Michelle strong in
> >> Django, Jason in everything Python, Selena in PostgreSQL and Audrey in
> >> Rails.
> >>
> >> Yes, I'm cluing the Rails community as I'm looking from over the
> >> shoulder of Red Cross CTO towards Cubespace as this bevy of relevant
> >> webapp developers, not differentiating much further than that, all
> >> comers welcome (Perl Mongers, let's get on it).  I do favor Django
> >> though, have been consistently suggesting it both around Ecotrust
> >> (which already uses GeoDjango) and around Center for Outcomes Research
> >> and Education (Providence, more into MUMPS, not atypical in
> >> hospitals).
> >>
> >> I also forwarded the data to Mosaic Consulting whom I contract with
> >> for HR (human resources) consulting, in case this gets to the resume
> >> stage or we actually want to offer Red Cross a coherent development
> >> plan.  Fred Meyer Trust is a puzzle piece.
> >>
> >> I'll be happy if we get that far, as I think the promise of open
> >> source is it actually strengthens NGOs, nonprofits, those glue
> >> organizations that serve community.  It's not just that the tools are
> >> powerful, but that we think more the way they do, in terms of freely
> >> sharing our liberal arts (cite R0ml Lefkowitz et al).
> >>
> >> This has always been the hype, plus it's real on the ground in a great
> >> many cases, however Portland, with a reputation as a FOSS capital
> >> (CSM:2005) stands to improve its reputation as such if its signature
> >> nonprofits aren't wallowing in licensing fee hell paying like double
> >> for only half the result.
> >>
> >> As an erstwhile consultant with Free Geek (CollabTech chapter) I know
> >> that serving in the nonprofit community is difficult, frustrating,
> >> often uphill work but is also potentially rewarding and great for your
> >> resume if you wanna be a USA senator someday (OK, most of us don't).
> >>
> >> I've played (and been paid) in this sandbox for years and have
> >> treasured working with some really dedicated people doing obviously
> >> important and interesting things.  If you've not worked with
> >> nonprofits before, I suggest trying to find out more at OS Bridge.  Or
> >> talk to me sometime (4dsolutions.net), maybe after a PPUG meeting, or
> >> talk to Jason (idealist.org).
> >>
> >> Kirby
> >>
> >> PS:  and again with the Pycon slides, which went by kinda faced on the
> >> remotely operated white screen:
> >> http://www.flickr.com/photos/17157315 at N00/sets/72157616066135225/
> >> re my workshop:
> http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/03/urner-workshop.html
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Portland mailing list
> >> Portland at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> >>
> > -------------- next part --------------
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> > URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090416/03ecd572/attachment.htm
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Portland mailing list
> > Portland at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>
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From adam at therobots.org  Fri Apr 17 02:28:53 2009
From: adam at therobots.org (Adam Lowry)
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 17:28:53 -0700
Subject: [portland] class decorators useful?
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0904151725s7528dc88lfdae3fcca727f35b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <f604188c0904151725s7528dc88lfdae3fcca727f35b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <27B5041B-0580-4C21-94E4-DFFCC4A9E25E@therobots.org>

On Apr 15, 2009, at 5:25 PM, kirby urner wrote:
> I'm thinking of Adam's comment that he never decorated a class and
> didn't regret it, and, truth be told, I've not experimented with that
> feature much.
>
> So I wanted to give a use case, see if PPUGers think it flies.

At the Side Door after the meeting, John Melesky reminded me that  
decorators are often used in places where metaclasses are used, and  
ORMs are a case where metaclasses can be used well; a class you  
defined is instrumented as a bridge to a DB subsystem.

> Here's an excellent talk on class decorators, also talked to this guy
> (Jack Diederick) at the CPP / Iceland party (lots of Twisted guys):
>
> http://pycon.blip.tv/file/1957258/

This was the talk that I saw that prompted my outburst. Jack  
identified four ways decorators are used: registration, verification,  
augmentation, and fixups. This vector example would be a case of  
augmentation.

Registration was the only case I could think of that worked well in my  
mind. In the past I've got the augmentation route and felt that it  
made the code less readable and less understandable; I should have  
composed a helper object. In this example that method or a straight  
subclass (or even mixin) would be easier to read in my opinion.

But for pure library code like an ORM, where the user is not intended  
to need to dive into the guts, they can be useful.

Perhaps we can find some code in the wild that make good use of them?

Adam

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Fri Apr 17 02:38:38 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 17:38:38 -0700
Subject: [portland] class decorators useful?
In-Reply-To: <27B5041B-0580-4C21-94E4-DFFCC4A9E25E@therobots.org>
References: <f604188c0904151725s7528dc88lfdae3fcca727f35b@mail.gmail.com>
	<27B5041B-0580-4C21-94E4-DFFCC4A9E25E@therobots.org>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904161738s19309024l5125e7592c477c28@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 5:28 PM, Adam Lowry <adam at therobots.org> wrote:
> On Apr 15, 2009, at 5:25 PM, kirby urner wrote:

<< SNIP >>

> Registration was the only case I could think of that worked well in my mind.
> In the past I've got the augmentation route and felt that it made the code
> less readable and less understandable; I should have composed a helper
> object. In this example that method or a straight subclass (or even mixin)
> would be easier to read in my opinion.
>

Thank you.

I appreciated your outburst at the meeting, take your warnings about
reduced readability seriously (your Python scholarship has always
impressed me).

We went down a long road on edu-sig awhile back, using function
decorators to turn a function into its mathematical derivative.  I'd
even showcased this technique in a talk (GIS meeting in 2005, similar
to the one next week).

Later in the thread, in which Guido participated, we reached a
consensus that this was hurting more than helping, more a "false
trail" than a great way to go. **

So yeah, I'm happy to keep a retreat route and think your suggestion
to hunt class decorators in the wild is a good one.

Kirby

> But for pure library code like an ORM, where the user is not intended to
> need to dive into the guts, they can be useful.
>
> Perhaps we can find some code in the wild that make good use of them?
>
> Adam
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

** there's a running game expats play, involving "hares" laying a
trail ahead of time, others following, with a number of dead ends
deliberately included, just to confuse, make it more like a maze:
http://www.gthhh.com/  (my dad was super into it, in both Bangladesh
and Lesotho, mom too some, and me when I'd visit).

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Fri Apr 17 18:14:20 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Fri, 17 Apr 2009 09:14:20 -0700
Subject: [portland] more followup re Chicago
Message-ID: <f604188c0904170914p14f20f6dx26275f1e6e44336d@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings again so soon...

I won't usually cross-post such lengthy items but in the wake of Pycon
and lots going on, the shortest way I could thing of to do the right
filing was to simply FYI this from the Wanderers list.

We're on average an older group of engineers (similar xy : xx ratio),
still learning about open source and all the new flavors of geek out
there (multiple subcultures).  We meet in the boyhood home of Linus
Pauling on Hawthorne, the x2 Nobel guy, his and his partners papers
housed at OSU, with support from Doug Strain's estate (Doug founded
ESI, an early Silicon Forest startup, hqs formerly also on Hawthorne,
Doug have been Pauling's student at Caltech).

The organization behind Wanderers is called ISEPP (isepp.org) and I
represented this organization at Pycon this year (is what's on my
nametag in those slides).

Note below how I use Cubespace as a kind of shorthand for a FOSS hqs
or campus, even though we're from many walks of life, may live in
proprietary silos of various description (e.g. see below **).

This helps people tune in a set of overlapping tools (i.e. stacks), a
vocabulary, a namespace, that we somewhat share in our Barcamps,
OSCONs and so on.  I realize other types also get to use the building
e.g. VB#/ASP/Coldfusion could rent a booth.  However, as shorthand, I
think it stays true to the music.

I'm happy to take it off-list at this point, now that it's we've built
up a head of steam.  Mosaic (Suzanne Bader) reports nothing to add at
the moment.  I'm likewise thinking the ball is not in my court, though
I am curious what creaky old framework generates URLs this ugly:

http://www.oregonredcross.org/general.asp?SN=201&OP=2834&SUOP=2835&IDCapitulo=663B0ID44V
 (blech)

Reed College has an Open Source Developer office which I think maybe
I'll contact next, as Red Cross clearly could use some volunteer
assistance from CS trainees looking for academic credit for community
service type options (all the rage in academia these days).  The needs
assessments could be for free.  If they need more experienced
programmers, they know where to look (e.g. Cubespace).

See you on IRC or whatever,

Kirby Urner
4Dsolutions.net
"A pioneer in open source"

** http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2007/09/ballistic-news.html (scroll
down for goofy silos)

PS:  the allusion to 'Evil Cult' has to do with the author of 'SQL for
Dummies' is the dad of Taylor Twins:
http://www.taylortwinpictures.com/

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
Date: Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 11:44 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Reporting from Pycon 2009
To: kirby.urner at gmail.com


A little more rambling (enjoying recent threads, thx ya'll)...

So I met with a member of the SAO board this afternoon and it sounds
like Oregonians are willing to keep pioneering in this direction of a
more Silicon Forest friendly mathematics curriculum, one which
displaces calculators over time, in favor some more beefy hardware and
software.

A lot of this branches off earlier volunteer work with Willamette
University a planning hub.  I used to attend some of those meetings.

On a somewhat related front, the Cubespace engineers are now aware of
the Red Cross website being extremely lame (talking Oregon Trail
chapter), a fact which their inhouse team has long recognized, but it
sounds like they're trapped in a legacy bubble.

The PC revolution gave rise to a long list of solutions now considered
relics, with far better solutions coming as a result of the second
computer revolution, the FOSS revolution (free and open source tools).

What confuses folks about open source is they think it doesn't make
any money, whereas that's a somewhat meaningless belief.  In actual
fact, businesses helped themselves to the free tools and are running
all kinds of client-facing services that pay bills, and by license
agreement they're free to not disclose what they're doing.

Take ConocoPhillips for example.  Ekofisk had lots of Python going,
still has I surmise.  Or take Industrial Light and Magic.  They don't
have to tell us how they use Python, just sometimes mention that they
do.  I used Python to do marketing graphics, [showed] examples at this
meeting today, was in no way obliged to publish my tool kit, all based
on FOSS (Povray isn't GNU, stems from CompuServ culture, but is FOSS
nonetheless).

http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2007/07/python-in-control-room.html
(ConocoPhillips gives back)
http://www.povray.org/  (ray tracer I've used with Saturday Academy
classes quite a bit)

So most Linux, Python, Apache stacks never see the light of day, run
in deep silos, part of the guts of some company (IBM for example, or
Google, Amazon, Yahoo -- FOSS users all).  Facebook is starting to
share Cassandra.  These tools all have names, and there's a plethora.
Knowing which are the good ones is half the battle right there.

Speaking of Cubespace engineers, note to Don: I invited Selena to
maybe give a Wanderers presentations once the dust settles.  She's too
crazy busy with OS Bridge organizing, but could later discuss her day
job being a PostgreSQL jock.

I told her about Allen Taylor (and Evil Cult by his Twins).  She's
also in the loop on the stuff I presented to PPUG about (Red Cross),
at the same time Wanderers was hosting our guest physician discussing
the health care crisis.  I managed to make a big part of both meetings
(Joe, I understand I assumed your chair just minutes after you vacated
it).

Also, re Eddy and Marty Crouch, both were at the Meetinghouse last
night and there's clearly no problemo re all the earlier confusion.  I
didn't get if they're planning on joining us for that meeting.  Marty
was actually not in our meeting and our agenda was all other stuff,
really a lot of it.  Just got home, made some notes in my blog:
http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/m-2009416.html

I'll file another report about the education picture, sometime after
my GIS gig, for which I'm trying to do some homework.  I'm just
getting me feet wet in Python's senate, where BDFL is president, Steve
Holden (whom Glenn has met) our chairman.  If you don't know who Guido
is (our benevolent dictator), I invite you to watch some blip.tv:
http://pycon.blip.tv/file/1947431/

Ciao for now,

Kirby

PS:  Glenn confirming Sandy electric car bar is defunct, having
managed to inject only a modicum fleet of 3-wheelers (not "cars"
technically) into Portland's streets (you'll see 'em around, keeping
Portland weird).

On Fri, Apr 10, 2009 at 8:37 AM, Kirby Urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
> --- In wwwanderers at yahoogroups.com, "Kirby Urner" <kirby.urner at ...> wrote:
>
> Just following up on my long-winded thingy below, acknowledge I spelled Torvalds incorrectly...
>
> I had a long phone chat with Saturday Academy this afternoon, on the
> possibility of using PSU... OGI facilities (they're already booking
> them) for adult trainees wanting to upgrade on the job in our public
> school teaching pilots, newly authorized thanks to a discrete math
> track showing up on state radar, SAO the lobbying think tank here
> (ISEPP off the hook).  That's just me talking, running by an idea,
> not claiming any buy in.
>
> Not a foregone conclusion SA: cares to wade in, could use ExecuTrain
> or like that, but I think we'd use a lot of the same SA: trainers,
> so it makes some sense, not just talking about Python or even FOSS.
> Bill Sheppard electronics, Gordon Hoffman electronics... chemistry,
> biology... everything STEM.

<< SNIP >>

From jonb at onenw.org  Wed Apr 22 20:40:50 2009
From: jonb at onenw.org (Jon Baldivieso)
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 11:40:50 -0700
Subject: [portland] Portland World Plone Day tonight
Message-ID: <08E31128-FBAB-40FB-A883-22806FE30E8B@onenw.org>

Hey Pythonistas,

Join us tonight (Wednesday) for Portland's celebration of World Plone  
Day! The purpose of WPD is to introduce new users to Plone and show  
why it makes such a great choice for content management for  
businesses, education, government, and non-profits. (In case you  
weren't aware, Plone is based on the Zope web framework, which of  
course written in Python.)

We'll have exciting door prizes -- 3 Plone books and a pass to the  
upcoming Open Source Bridge conference; food and beverages; a light  
presentation on what a CMS is and why Plone is a great one; and a  
chance to ask some Plone experts questions and see demos.

Portland World Plone Day
Wednesday April 22, 2009
06:00 pm to 08:00 pm
1306 NW Hoyt Portland, OR 97209,
Conference Room, 2nd Floor

We hope to see you there!

Jon

___________________________
Jon Baldivieso
503.222.5064
ONE/Northwest Portland Office

New tools and strategies for engaging people in protecting the  
environment



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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr 23 01:28:07 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 16:28:07 -0700
Subject: [portland] Portland World Plone Day tonight
In-Reply-To: <08E31128-FBAB-40FB-A883-22806FE30E8B@onenw.org>
References: <08E31128-FBAB-40FB-A883-22806FE30E8B@onenw.org>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904221628p51f2ce13qbdb3a7ffce18418b@mail.gmail.com>

Hey, I think I'll check this out, enroute to the Admirers for
Javascript meeting.  Thanks for the heads up.

I met up with Alan Runyan again at Pycon.  He drove up for a Plone
sprint near Victoria BC many moons ago, along with Andy McKay and
others.  I don't consider myself a Plone guru, but I do like to track
its orbit and brush up on the lore.  For some clients, it's just the
ticket, also for students just wanting to serve outside of Facebook or
any of those, maybe build up a base for belonging to us someday.

Kirby

On Wed, Apr 22, 2009 at 11:40 AM, Jon Baldivieso <jonb at onenw.org> wrote:
> Hey Pythonistas,
>
> Join us tonight (Wednesday) for Portland's celebration of World Plone Day!
> The purpose of WPD is to introduce new users to Plone and show why it makes
> such a great choice for content management for businesses, education,
> government, and non-profits. (In case you weren't aware, Plone is based on
> the Zope web framework, which of course written in Python.)
>
> We'll have exciting door prizes -- 3 Plone books and a pass to the upcoming
> Open Source Bridge conference; food and beverages; a light presentation on
> what a CMS is and why Plone is a great one; and a chance to ask some Plone
> experts questions and see demos.
>
> Portland World Plone Day
> Wednesday April 22, 2009
> 06:00 pm to 08:00 pm
> 1306 NW Hoyt Portland, OR 97209,
> Conference Room, 2nd Floor
>
> We hope to see you there!
>
> Jon
>
> ___________________________
> Jon Baldivieso
> 503.222.5064
> ONE/Northwest Portland Office
>
> New tools and strategies for engaging people in protecting the environment
>
>
>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/portland/attachments/20090422/a4d487ab/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> Portland mailing list
> Portland at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland
>

From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Apr 23 01:47:37 2009
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 16:47:37 -0700
Subject: [portland] Portland World Plone Day tonight
In-Reply-To: <f604188c0904221628p51f2ce13qbdb3a7ffce18418b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <08E31128-FBAB-40FB-A883-22806FE30E8B@onenw.org>
	<f604188c0904221628p51f2ce13qbdb3a7ffce18418b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f604188c0904221647j71d3b222q85c3ccb339337b00@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Apr 22, 2009 at 4:28 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey, I think I'll check this out, enroute to the Admirers for
> Javascript meeting. ?Thanks for the heads up.
>
> I met up with Alan Runyan again at Pycon. ?He drove up for a Plone

Sorry, meant to say "I drove up..."

Alan mighta flown, I don't really know (he gets around, based in
Texas, hails from New Orleans originally).  Here's a link to his
company profile:

http://www.enfoldsystems.com/about/management.html

(Enfold, Enthought, both Texas... any more Texas Ens?  oh yeah, just
though of one, less successful, maybe not enough Python (grin)).

Also, meant to mention I was yakking about Python for a GIS conference
yesterday, the one I've been advertising via my motd @
osgarden.appspot.com (need a new motd -- switch focus back to OS
Bridge maybe).

You can read my write-up my GIS in Action talk (and take in some
Photostream) from this blog entry FYI:

http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/04/gis-2009.html

I was happy to finally meet up with Tim Welch of Ecotrust, and to get
patched in to OSGIS meeting times, not at Cubespace, but same idea.

http://www.ohloh.net/accounts/twelch  (hey, I do scuba too, NAUI
certified, though I'm rusty...)

I'm hoping to get more public school teachers interested in staffing
GIS shops inside the schools themselves, starting with Benson maybe?
They have that polytechnical reputation....

Here's a link I just learned about, probably old hat to some of ya:

http://gislounge.com/

This "geocaching for Bin Laden" game looks like a fun way to satisfy
our more hawkish parents (yes, we have some in Portland):

http://gislounge.com/pinpointing-bin-laden/

I'll see some of you tonight maybe,

Kirby

> sprint near Victoria BC many moons ago, along with Andy McKay and
> others. ?I don't consider myself a Plone guru, but I do like to track
> its orbit and brush up on the lore. ?For some clients, it's just the
> ticket, also for students just wanting to serve outside of Facebook or
> any of those, maybe build up a base for belonging to us someday.
>
> Kirby
>


> On Wed, Apr 22, 2009 at 11:40 AM, Jon Baldivieso <jonb at onenw.org> wrote:
>> Hey Pythonistas,
>>
>> Join us tonight (Wednesday) for Portland's celebration of World Plone Day!
>> The purpose of WPD is to introduce new users to Plone and show why it makes
>> such a great choice for content management for businesses, education,
>> government, and non-profits. (In case you weren't aware, Plone is based on
>> the Zope web framework, which of course written in Python.)
>>
>> We'll have exciting door prizes -- 3 Plone books and a pass to the upcoming
>> Open Source Bridge conference; food and beverages; a light presentation on
>> what a CMS is and why Plone is a great one; and a chance to ask some Plone
>> experts questions and see demos.
>>
>> Portland World Plone Day
>> Wednesday April 22, 2009
>> 06:00 pm to 08:00 pm
>> 1306 NW Hoyt Portland, OR 97209,
>> Conference Room, 2nd Floor
>>
>> We hope to see you there!
>>
>> Jon
>>
>> ___________________________
>> Jon Baldivieso
>> 503.222.5064
>> ONE/Northwest Portland Office
>>