From ranpra at gmail.com Tue Mar 1 20:10:57 2011 From: ranpra at gmail.com (Pradeep Kumar) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2011 23:10:57 +0400 Subject: [Inpycon] suggestions for PyCon India In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: be frankly, I get a bitter experience last pycon at Bangalore first day only I feel it, that's why I dropped the second day may be I am normal guy.most of the people are student I expect a lot of coding and rebate. better than this I can discuss my thoughts with my old sir or read a book of my choice or read a blog. every presentation give some half knowledge and it is not worthy also. I am a old guy my time is gone.... do something good for the new generation in stead of living in jeopardize... http://www.skorks.com/2011/02/algorithms-a-dropbox-challenge-and-dynamic-programming/ how simply he wrote it. sorry if I wrote something wrong.... Pradeep Kumar. On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 2:16 AM, David Goodger wrote: > [I found this in my email drafts folder; thought I'd sent it long ago. > Hopefully it isn't stale ;-) ] > > Hi all, > > I had a great time in Bangalore, and I was impressed by the size & scope of > PyCon India in only its second year. I have some suggestions based on my > experience organizing the US PyCon over the years. Some have already been > mentioned here (I know I heard some discussed). > > * You should add time between talks, 5 or 10 minutes. Attendees need time > for moving between rooms, and the next speakers need time to set up their > laptops. > > * At PyCon US, we have "time remaining" signs: 10 minutes, 5 minutes, STOP. > These are very useful for the session chair (MC), who can be sitting in or > near the front row and watching a clock. > > * Speakers should be encouraged (required) to repeat any questions they are > asked. Often the people on the other side of the room cannot hear the > questions. The recordings rarely pick up the questions. > > * Speakers and MC's should feel free to defer questions to the end of a > talk, especially if the questioner is insistent. > > * Speakers should not run off immediately after a talk, but move swiftly to > the hallway and answer any after-talk questions. > > * As you grow, you may choose to add parallel features (e.g. open space) > and secondary events (e.g. development sprints, tutorials). You already had > the FOSSEE sessions for beginners, a great idea! But take it slowly, and > don't add anything before you're ready. > > * I noticed some audio feedback when people were speaking. This can be > reduced by placing the microphone closer to the speaker's mouth. The further > away, the higher the gain must be, and the more likely feedback becomes. > Something to tell your speakers. > > * These kinds of instructions for speakers can be printed up ahead of time, > and given to speakers and MCs. If you're interested, I can get the > instruction sheet from US PyCon. > > * A "green room" is very useful: a room for speakers with a spare projector > (to test laptop connections), wired network connections, a printer, water, > etc. This can double as a conference office. > > * WiFi at conferences is always an issue. 802.11 was not designed for such > high user densities. In a nutshell, at PyCon US we deploy lots of real APs > (not laptops!), at low power (important!) on alternating channels, to reduce > interference. We are lucky to have Sean Reifschneider, a sysadmin and > networking guru who has effectively deployed wireless for many years. Sean > has written reports about PyCon's wireless here: > http://www.tummy.com/Community/Articles/pycon2010-network/ (with links to > earlier years). > > * Pre-printed badges with icons for speakers (and anything else you want to > track) are a good way to see at a glance who is missing. > > * It's best to avoid staggered starting times. Sometimes it's unavoidable, > but try hard! > > * One way to handle the lunch/break rush is to stagger the *ends* of talks > just before lunch/breaks. For example, some talks can end 15 minutes later > than others. > > * Lightning talks are particularly popular at US PyCon, to the point where > it was unfair to schedule other talks against them, so we made them plenary. > > * For North American conferences, as you grow in attendance, costs go up > per-person (you have to move from free space to hotels or conference > centers). If this is true in India as well, you may consider holding > multiple regional conferences instead of one national conference. It's not > ideal, but it's one way to keep costs down. > > * I noticed a large drop-off in attendance between Saturday and Sunday. It > seems to have happened last year as well. Why is that? > > Most importantly: notwithstanding any of the above, please don't imitate > any other conference too closely. It would be a shame to lose the unique > character of PyCon India. > > -- > David Goodger > > _______________________________________________ > Inpycon mailing list > Inpycon at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From noufal at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 05:30:29 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2011 10:00:29 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] suggestions for PyCon India In-Reply-To: (Pradeep Kumar's message of "Tue, 1 Mar 2011 23:10:57 +0400") References:

Message-ID: <87oc5u2lga.fsf@gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 02 2011, Pradeep Kumar wrote: > be frankly, I get a bitter experience last pycon at Bangalore first day > only I feel it, > that's why I dropped the second day may be I am normal guy.most of the > people are student > I expect a lot of coding and rebate. better than this I can discuss my > thoughts with my > old sir or read a book of my choice or read a blog. every presentation give > some half knowledge > and it is not worthy also. > > I am a old guy my time is gone.... do something good for the new generation > in stead of > living in jeopardize... > > > > http://www.skorks.com/2011/02/algorithms-a-dropbox-challenge-and-dynamic-programming/ > how simply he wrote it. [...] Point taken. WE should really think of ways to attract the experienced folk rather than just students and newbies. -- ~noufal http://nibrahim.net.in From lawgon at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 05:50:28 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2011 10:20:28 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] suggestions for PyCon India In-Reply-To: <87oc5u2lga.fsf@gmail.com> References:

<87oc5u2lga.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1299041428.2347.201.camel@localhost> On Wed, 2011-03-02 at 10:00 +0530, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > > Point taken. WE should really think of ways to attract the experienced > folk rather than just students and newbies. were the talks all that bad? I only attended a few, and they seemed up to the mark (except for one where the speakers seemed to have mugged up the topic without really understanding it) -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From abpillai at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 07:25:28 2011 From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 11:55:28 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] CFP draft Message-ID: Here is a very early CFP draft proposal. http://wiki.python.org/moin/PyConIndia2011/CFP This is much the same as last year. I would like feedback on, 1. Dates 2. Format 3. Topics - Should we highlight some topics or add more topics (remove some also ?) Please send this to me by end of the week (Friday) or discuss in the list. Plan to work on the CFP on the website during the week-end. I have given Mar 7 as a tentative date. However I would like the CFP to go live no later than March 10. -- --Anand -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From abpillai at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 07:36:55 2011 From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 12:06:55 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] CFP draft In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Some more questions related to the CFP.... 1. Should the CFP should also make a call for tutorial tracks or we handle them separately ? 2. Do we want to highlight certain themes for this year's conference - while not "tracks" per se, these could be some themes we highlight in the topics. Examples could be NoSQL with Python or Cloud computing using Python, the rather "hot" topics of late. 3. Talk lengths - Do we keep 30 min slots or have 45 min and 1 hour talks ? Suggestions ? --Anand On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:55 AM, Anand Balachandran Pillai < abpillai at gmail.com> wrote: > Here is a very early CFP draft proposal. > > http://wiki.python.org/moin/PyConIndia2011/CFP > > This is much the same as last year. I would like > feedback on, > > 1. Dates > 2. Format > 3. Topics - Should we highlight some topics > or add more topics (remove some also ?) > > Please send this to me by end of the week (Friday) > or discuss in the list. Plan to work on the CFP > on the website during the week-end. > > I have given Mar 7 as a tentative date. However > I would like the CFP to go live no later than > March 10. > > -- > --Anand > > > > -- --Anand -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From b.ghose at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 08:37:09 2011 From: b.ghose at gmail.com (Baishampayan Ghose) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 13:07:09 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] CFP draft In-Reply-To: References:

Message-ID: Hello, > Some more questions related to the CFP.... > > 1. Should the CFP should also make a call for tutorial tracks or > we handle them separately ? Let's keep them together, but state the requirements clearly for each of them. We can have two different types of talks - "talk" & "workshop". Both have different duration & material related differences. > 2. Do we want to highlight certain themes for this year's > ?? conference - while not "tracks" per se, these could be > ?? some themes we highlight in the topics. Examples > ?? could be NoSQL with Python or Cloud computing using Python, > ?? the rather "hot" topics of late. We could. As a matter of fact, we were thinking about having three tracks, "newbie", "advanced" & "theme". IMHO it's a good idea to have a general theme. As far as themes like "NoSQL with Python", don't you think that those talks will turn out to be general evangelism about the NoSQL DB and some tips about using the related client library? It's not bad per se, but can turn out to be monotonous if we have many talks along the same lines. > 3. Talk lengths - Do we keep 30 min slots or have 45 min > and 1 hour talks ? I would recommend 45 mins (+/- 5 mins) with a solid 10 minutes for Q&A and a break of 5 mins between every talk. Regards, BG -- Baishampayan Ghose b.ghose at gmail.com From noufal at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 09:23:12 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2011 13:53:12 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] suggestions for PyCon India In-Reply-To: <1299041428.2347.201.camel@localhost> (Kenneth Gonsalves's message of "Wed, 02 Mar 2011 10:20:28 +0530") References:

<87oc5u2lga.fsf@gmail.com> <1299041428.2347.201.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <8762s22aof.fsf@gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 02 2011, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Wed, 2011-03-02 at 10:00 +0530, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: >> >> Point taken. WE should really think of ways to attract the experienced >> folk rather than just students and newbies. > > were the talks all that bad? I only attended a few, and they seemed up > to the mark (except for one where the speakers seemed to have mugged > up the topic without really understanding it) Not the talks really as much as the atmosphere that a large number of first timers, newbies creates. -- ~noufal http://nibrahim.net.in From noufal at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 09:29:54 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2011 13:59:54 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] CFP draft In-Reply-To: (Anand Balachandran Pillai's message of "Wed, 2 Mar 2011 12:06:55 +0530") References:

Message-ID: <87zkpd2ad9.fsf@gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 02 2011, Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote: > Some more questions related to the CFP.... > > 1. Should the CFP should also make a call for tutorial tracks or > we handle them separately ? I think it'd be simpler if the tutorial was a kind of talk but of a longer duration and only on a specific day. At the very least, the UI would be simpler. > 2. Do we want to highlight certain themes for this year's conference - > while not "tracks" per se, these could be some themes we highlight in > the topics. Examples could be NoSQL with Python or Cloud computing > using Python, the rather "hot" topics of late. I don't think so. I'm sure things trends will emerge automatically. > 3. Talk lengths - Do we keep 30 min slots or have 45 min and 1 hour > talks ? I think we should a single length for talks. Say 40 minutes. IT's annoying when people request a 45 minute slot to be "safe" and then have just 30 minutes of content to deliver. Pack it in that much time. Keep it short and to the point. Tutorial are different. I'm not sure if it's been discussed here but usually, they're 3 hour things with a day devoted to them. Students pay for them separately and receive printed notes etc. Is that the way we're planning to go? [...] -- ~noufal http://nibrahim.net.in From noufal at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 09:37:03 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2011 14:07:03 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] CFP draft In-Reply-To: (Baishampayan Ghose's message of "Wed, 2 Mar 2011 13:07:09 +0530") References:

Message-ID: <87vd012a1c.fsf@gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 02 2011, Baishampayan Ghose wrote: [...] > We could. As a matter of fact, we were thinking about having three > tracks, "newbie", "advanced" & "theme". IMHO it's a good idea to have > a general theme. As far as themes like "NoSQL with Python", don't you > think that those talks will turn out to be general evangelism about > the NoSQL DB and some tips about using the related client library? > It's not bad per se, but can turn out to be monotonous if we have many > talks along the same lines. I don't think this is a good idea. Tracks should be made using a single criterion if they're to be sensible. Either we choose 'theme' as the criterion in which case, the tracks would be like "testing", "web", "core python" etc. The "level" of the talk (novice, intermediate etc.) would be something extra. Or We choose 'level' as the criterion and let the tracks become 'novice', 'intermediate', 'advanced' but with a mix of subjects. Also, I agree about staying away from tracks like "cloud" and "noSQL". Like you said, we'll get a lot of talks from n00bs who've read the man pages and it'll get boring. I heard a lot of negative feedback about the mongodb talk last year. [...] -- ~noufal http://nibrahim.net.in From abpillai at gmail.com Thu Mar 3 06:46:30 2011 From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 11:16:30 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] CFP draft In-Reply-To: <87vd012a1c.fsf@gmail.com> References:

<87vd012a1c.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: All right, I will put up a revised draft with some of these ideas by Friday. Please take a look at it, if it is fine, I will work with Anand C to create the CFP on the site and get it live by March 10. Meanwhile, can someone take a look at the topic list and suggest anything to be removed or added specifically or a change in order ? --Anand On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 2:07 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > On Wed, Mar 02 2011, Baishampayan Ghose wrote: > > > [...] > > > We could. As a matter of fact, we were thinking about having three > > tracks, "newbie", "advanced" & "theme". IMHO it's a good idea to have > > a general theme. As far as themes like "NoSQL with Python", don't you > > think that those talks will turn out to be general evangelism about > > the NoSQL DB and some tips about using the related client library? > > It's not bad per se, but can turn out to be monotonous if we have many > > talks along the same lines. > > > I don't think this is a good idea. Tracks should be made using a single > criterion if they're to be sensible. > > Either we choose 'theme' as the criterion in which case, the tracks > would be like "testing", "web", "core python" etc. The "level" of the > talk (novice, intermediate etc.) would be something extra. > > Or > > We choose 'level' as the criterion and let the tracks become 'novice', > 'intermediate', 'advanced' but with a mix of subjects. > > Also, I agree about staying away from tracks like "cloud" and > "noSQL". Like you said, we'll get a lot of talks from n00bs who've read > the man pages and it'll get boring. I heard a lot of negative feedback > about the mongodb talk last year. > > > [...] > > > -- > ~noufal > http://nibrahim.net.in > _______________________________________________ > Inpycon mailing list > Inpycon at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon > -- --Anand -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ideamonk at gmail.com Thu Mar 3 12:11:10 2011 From: ideamonk at gmail.com (Abhishek Mishra) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 16:41:10 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] suggestions for PyCon India In-Reply-To: References:

Message-ID: On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 12:40 AM, Pradeep Kumar wrote: > be frankly, I get a bitter experience last pycon at Bangalore first day > only I feel it, > that's why I dropped the second day may be I am normal guy.most of the > people are student > I expect a lot of coding and rebate. better than this I can discuss my > thoughts with my > old sir or read a book of my choice or read a blog. every presentation give > some half knowledge > and it is not worthy also. > > I am a old guy my time is gone.... do something good for the new generation > in stead of > living in jeopardize... > > > > > http://www.skorks.com/2011/02/algorithms-a-dropbox-challenge-and-dynamic-programming/ > how simply he wrote it. > > > sorry if I wrote something wrong.... > > Pradeep Kumar. > I believe some talks are also meant to get the audience interested in a subdomain (related to Python). In that case a speaker may choose to expose a few basics, a few possibilities and discuss related issues in 45 minutes. The talk might not go in-depth so as to cover all aspects of this subdomain, but this is good enough to make people go back home and explore deeper on their own. Or in other words, set the audience in motion. In that sense, I wouldn't consider the half-knowledge as half-knowledge in real sense. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From admin.nitjece at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 19:48:00 2011 From: admin.nitjece at gmail.com (Diptanu Choudhury) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 00:18:00 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] suggestions for PyCon India In-Reply-To: <8762s22aof.fsf@gmail.com> References:

<87oc5u2lga.fsf@gmail.com> <1299041428.2347.201.camel@localhost> <8762s22aof.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: Noufal, The conference was just two year old last year, and probably our community has a long way to go. So I guess if we have the patience to see through the next three-four years we will have much more experienced crowd coming. On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 1:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > On Wed, Mar 02 2011, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > > > On Wed, 2011-03-02 at 10:00 +0530, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > >> > >> Point taken. WE should really think of ways to attract the experienced > >> folk rather than just students and newbies. > > > > were the talks all that bad? I only attended a few, and they seemed up > > to the mark (except for one where the speakers seemed to have mugged > > up the topic without really understanding it) > > Not the talks really as much as the atmosphere that a large number of > first timers, newbies creates. > > -- > ~noufal > http://nibrahim.net.in > _______________________________________________ > Inpycon mailing list > Inpycon at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon > -- Thanks, Diptanu Choudhury Mobile - +919686602153 Web - www.linkedin.com/in/diptanu Twitter - @diptanu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From admin.nitjece at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 19:50:02 2011 From: admin.nitjece at gmail.com (Diptanu Choudhury) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 00:20:02 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Foreign delegates In-Reply-To: <871v2wm7fu.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87vd0lojzu.fsf@gmail.com> <87r5awha5k.fsf@gmail.com> <871v2wm7fu.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: Noufal, Did he reply yet? :-) On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 9:29 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > On Fri, Feb 25 2011, Dhananjay Nene wrote: > > > On Fri, Feb 25, 2011 at 12:29 PM, Noufal Ibrahim > wrote: > >> > >> So, > >> > >> Option 1. Zed Shaw > >> Option 2. Steve Holden > >> > >> The plan is to call Zed and if he's unavailable call Steve. > >> > >> If Zed agrees to come and we raise an extra 1L, we'll call Steve > >> *also*. > >> > >> Any objections? > > > > Given that we are linking it to funding, no issues whether its 2 or > > even more speakers. > > [...] > > I'll mail him then with a initial intro etc. > -- > ~noufal > http://nibrahim.net.in > _______________________________________________ > Inpycon mailing list > Inpycon at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon > -- Thanks, Diptanu Choudhury Mobile - +919686602153 Web - www.linkedin.com/in/diptanu Twitter - @diptanu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From noufal at gmail.com Sun Mar 6 06:18:59 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2011 10:48:59 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Foreign delegates In-Reply-To: (Diptanu Choudhury's message of "Sun, 6 Mar 2011 00:20:02 +0530") References: <87vd0lojzu.fsf@gmail.com> <87r5awha5k.fsf@gmail.com> <871v2wm7fu.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <871v2khlmk.fsf@gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 06 2011, Diptanu Choudhury wrote: > Noufal, > > Did he reply yet? :-) [...] None yet but that has happened before. I'll try to speak with him directly. -- ~noufal http://nibrahim.net.in From noufal at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 15:24:31 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 09:24:31 -0500 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors Message-ID: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> Hello everyone, Greetings from PyCon Atlanta. I've spoken to a couple of people here who are interested in sponsoring our conference this year. They're companies based outside India and I'm not sure what we have to do to to receive funds from abroad. I'd hate to start serious discussions with them without being sure of the details. Can someone who's knowledgeable about this post details? Thanks. -- From satyaakam at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 15:35:59 2011 From: satyaakam at gmail.com (satyaakam goswami) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 20:05:59 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: > > > Can someone who's knowledgeable about this post details? > a quick web search led me to http://www.fcraforngos.org/receive-funds.htm http://www.ngosindia.com/ -Satya -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From noufal at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 16:01:09 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 10:01:09 -0500 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: (satyaakam goswami's message of "Sat, 12 Mar 2011 20:05:59 +0530") References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> On Sat, Mar 12 2011, satyaakam goswami wrote: >> >> >> Can someone who's knowledgeable about this post details? >> > > a quick web search led me to > http://www.fcraforngos.org/receive-funds.htm > http://www.ngosindia.com/ > [...] Thanks but I think we should get someone with first hand experience regarding this kind of thing rather than web links. It can be a thorny issue. -- From satyaakam at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 18:14:31 2011 From: satyaakam at gmail.com (satyaakam goswami) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 22:44:31 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: > > Thanks but I think we should get someone with first hand experience > regarding this kind of thing rather than web links. It can be a thorny > issue. by tomorrow i should be getting first hand info, also CA's can be persons to ask about this kind of cases. -Satya -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From noufal at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 22:19:23 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2011 16:19:23 -0500 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: (satyaakam goswami's message of "Sat, 12 Mar 2011 22:44:31 +0530") References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com> On Sat, Mar 12 2011, satyaakam goswami wrote: >> >> Thanks but I think we should get someone with first hand experience >> regarding this kind of thing rather than web links. It can be a thorny >> issue. > > by tomorrow i should be getting first hand info, also CA's can be persons to > ask about this kind of cases. [...] That'd be really useful. Thanks! -- From ramdaz at gmail.com Sun Mar 13 04:17:50 2011 From: ramdaz at gmail.com (Ramdas S) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 08:47:50 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 2:49 AM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > On Sat, Mar 12 2011, satyaakam goswami wrote: > > >> > >> Thanks but I think we should get someone with first hand experience > >> regarding this kind of thing rather than web links. It can be a thorny > >> issue. > > > > by tomorrow i should be getting first hand info, also CA's can be persons > to > > ask about this kind of cases. > > [...] > > That'd be really useful. Thanks! > Noufal. I dont think this is an issue at all. You must go ahead and close things. Getting funds into India is the least of the problems you'll have, since our government is very friendly when it comes to receiving funds, and you'll have to explain a lot when you want to send even 500 USD out. It's a very normal banking function, and they can wire funds or even send a banker's cheque. > -- > _______________________________________________ > Inpycon mailing list > Inpycon at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon > -- Ramdas S +91 9342 583 065 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dhananjay.nene at gmail.com Sun Mar 13 05:49:25 2011 From: dhananjay.nene at gmail.com (Dhananjay Nene) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2011 10:19:25 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Ramdas S wrote: > > > On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 2:49 AM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: >> >> On Sat, Mar 12 2011, satyaakam goswami wrote: >> >> >> >> >> Thanks but I think we should get someone with first hand experience >> >> regarding this kind of thing rather than web links. It can be a thorny >> >> issue. >> > >> > by tomorrow i should be getting first hand info, also CA's can be persons to >> > ask about this kind of cases. >> >> [...] >> >> That'd be really useful. Thanks! > > Noufal. I dont think this is an issue at all. You must go ahead and close things. Getting funds into India is the least of the problems you'll have, since our government is very friendly when it comes to receiving funds, and you'll have to explain a lot when you want to send even 500 USD out. It's a very normal banking function, and they can wire funds or even send a banker's cheque. I've generally found the receipt of funds to be very hassle free. What you do need is a good relatiionship with your bankers to get a good exchange rate. However if the funds need some different treatment than a simple income, I've run into some farily onerous documentation processes with the bank. Since IPSS is a non-profit society, I am not sure how much these documentation requirements will be or if at all they will be required, but it is best resolved by a communication between IPSS office bearers and the bank where the account is held and money will be received. Sometimes a foreign currency remittance certificate will need to be issued by the bank and they will not issue it until every small document is accounted for. While the guidelines are issued by RBI, each bank may choose to enforce it in its own way - so best to get in touch with the bank. To repeat: Receiving funds should not be a problem. Treating them as tax exempt is a question mark. The CA may well request that a certificate of the reason and nature of the remittance is required from the bank. If not (since IPSS is a non-profit body), that should not be an issue. If required, there's substantial documentation necessary. This is best discussed with the bank itself. Dhananjay -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://blog.dhananjaynene.com twitter: @dnene From sree at mahiti.org Mon Mar 14 05:15:23 2011 From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 09:45:23 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear All, The IPSS CANNOT receive foreign money. We do not have a specific permission under FCRA. It would be best if we get them to pay either the organizers (Pune team in this case, through any of their registered commercial entities) directly or we get them to pay vendors. If these options ( or something similar) are not possible, please drop the idea. Regards, - sree On 13 March 2011 08:47, Ramdas S wrote: > > > On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 2:49 AM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > >> On Sat, Mar 12 2011, satyaakam goswami wrote: >> >> >> >> >> Thanks but I think we should get someone with first hand experience >> >> regarding this kind of thing rather than web links. It can be a thorny >> >> issue. >> > >> > by tomorrow i should be getting first hand info, also CA's can be >> persons to >> > ask about this kind of cases. >> >> [...] >> >> That'd be really useful. Thanks! >> > > Noufal. I dont think this is an issue at all. You must go ahead and close > things. Getting funds into India is the least of the problems you'll have, > since our government is very friendly when it comes to receiving funds, and > you'll have to explain a lot when you want to send even 500 USD out. It's a > very normal banking function, and they can wire funds or even send a > banker's cheque. > >> -- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Inpycon mailing list >> Inpycon at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon >> > > > > -- > Ramdas S > +91 9342 583 065 > > > _______________________________________________ > Inpycon mailing list > Inpycon at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon > > -- Sreekanth S Rameshaiah Executive Director Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd. "OpenSpace", #583, Vyalikaval HBCS Layout, Nagawara, Veerannapalya, Bangalore, India - 560043 Phone: +91 80 4343 7373 Mobile: +91 98455 12611 www.mahiti.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From satyaakam at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 05:32:13 2011 From: satyaakam at gmail.com (satyaakam goswami) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:02:13 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 9:45 AM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > Dear All, > The IPSS CANNOT receive foreign money. We do not have a specific permission > under FCRA. It would be best if we get them to pay either the organizers > (Pune team in this case, through any of their registered commercial > entities) directly or we get them to pay vendors. If these options ( or > something similar) are not possible, please drop the idea. > why do you think we should drop the idea ? , the conversations i had here in Delhi were also on same lines but looks like there is a provision to receive with a temporary certificate , i think we should pursue this since this will bite us again and again every year. yes i am aware it takes three years to the FCRA certificate etc... i will be digging more info by Thursday also i need to know more info about the amount and the company to have a context . send the info as convenient in pvt or public . -Satya -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vid at svaksha.com Mon Mar 14 05:39:22 2011 From: vid at svaksha.com (=?UTF-8?B?4KWlIOCkuOCljeCkteCkleCljeCktyDgpaUg?=) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 04:39:22 +0000 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 04:15, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > under FCRA. It would be best if we get them to pay either the?organizers > (Pune team in this case, through any of their registered commercial > entities)?directly IIUC, those organizers (companies/commercial entity) are liable to pay tax for any/all amounts thus received by them, unless they have a good explanation for the fund transfer. I am not aware if a commercial entity can explain it away with "....was just holding the money for IPSS". Your accountant is the best guide in this case. Fwiw, donations to IPSS would be exempt from tax under section 80G of the Income Tax Act only if the society is granted or applies for the same: . That said, the Indian tax exemption is not useful for foreign nationals as it may not be valid in their country. -- vid ? http://svaksha.com ? From sree at mahiti.org Mon Mar 14 05:46:43 2011 From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:16:43 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: On 14 March 2011 10:02, satyaakam goswami wrote: > On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 9:45 AM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > >> Dear All, >> The IPSS CANNOT receive foreign money. We do not have a specific >> permission under FCRA. It would be best if we get them to pay either >> the organizers (Pune team in this case, through any of their registered >> commercial entities) directly or we get them to pay vendors. If these >> options ( or something similar) are not possible, please drop the idea. >> > > why do you think we should drop the idea ? , the conversations i had here > in Delhi were also on same lines but looks like there is a provision to > receive with a temporary certificate , i think we should pursue this since > this will bite us again and again every year. > > Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. Its not easy to get the the temporary license easily for organisations that do not have other income tax exemptions (with out using any short cut route). Also, you need this approval for every unique foreign currency donor contribution. As you have already taken the lead in speaking to your auditor/ subject experts proceed with it. If community finds it worth it, then definitely proceed. We will wait for your feedback. Regards, - sree -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 05:55:05 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:25:05 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1300078505.2368.300.camel@localhost> On Sun, 2011-03-13 at 10:19 +0530, Dhananjay Nene wrote: > Receiving funds should not be a problem. > Treating them as tax exempt is a question mark. The CA may well > request that a certificate of the reason and nature of the remittance > is required from the bank. If not (since IPSS is a non-profit body), > that should not be an issue. If required, there's substantial > documentation necessary. This is best discussed with the bank itself. will check with our CA and revert -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From satyaakam at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 06:00:54 2011 From: satyaakam at gmail.com (satyaakam goswami) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:30:54 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 10:16 AM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > > > On 14 March 2011 10:02, satyaakam goswami wrote: > >> On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 9:45 AM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: >> >>> Dear All, >>> The IPSS CANNOT receive foreign money. We do not have a specific >>> permission under FCRA. It would be best if we get them to pay either >>> the organizers (Pune team in this case, through any of their registered >>> commercial entities) directly or we get them to pay vendors. If these >>> options ( or something similar) are not possible, please drop the idea. >>> >> >> why do you think we should drop the idea ? , the conversations i had here >> in Delhi were also on same lines but looks like there is a provision to >> receive with a temporary certificate , i think we should pursue this since >> this will bite us again and again every year. >> >> > Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. > :-) > Its not easy to get the the temporary license easily for organisations that > do not have other income tax exemptions (with out using any short cut > route). > so you agree that it is possible , i still do not know and definitely do have 13 years in FCRA :-) , so will dig more for info . > Also, you need this approval for every unique foreign currency donor > contribution. > did not understand this part. > As you have already taken the lead in speaking to your auditor/ subject > experts proceed with it. If community finds it worth it, then definitely > proceed. We will wait for your feedback. > its not about lead its about my personal interest in knowing and learning about the system, yes ultimately it will benefit someone i do not know who or how yet but this is something i wanted to know and learn , looks like a good opportunity and cause. i have not spoken to any auditor so far , lets involve the auditor who handles IPSS accounts lets see what he has to say . -Satya -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dhananjay.nene at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 06:03:46 2011 From: dhananjay.nene at gmail.com (Dhananjay Nene) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:33:46 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 10:16 AM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > > > On 14 March 2011 10:02, satyaakam goswami wrote: >> >> On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 9:45 AM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah >> wrote: >>> >>> Dear All, >>> The IPSS CANNOT receive foreign money. We do not have a specific >>> permission under FCRA. It would be best if we get them to pay either >>> the?organizers (Pune team in this case, through any of their registered >>> commercial entities)?directly or we get them to pay vendors. If these >>> options ( or something similar) are not possible, please drop the idea. Speaking for self, I wouldn't touch the idea of routing a foreign currency remittance awkwardly with a 100 foot pole. imho the destination of the funds must be IPSS and the decision must rest with the treasurer or equivalent of IPSS. >> >> why do you think we should drop the idea ? , the?conversations?i had here >> in Delhi were also on same lines but looks like there is a provision to >> receive with a?temporary?certificate , i think we should pursue this since >> this will bite us again and again every year. >> > > Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. > Its not easy to get the the?temporary?license easily for organisations that > do not have other income tax exemptions (with out using any short cut > route). Also, you need this approval for every unique foreign currency donor > contribution. > As you have already taken the lead in speaking to your auditor/ subject > experts proceed with it. If community finds it worth it, then definitely > proceed. We will wait for your feedback. I think this matter really needs to move specifically into the domain of whoever is the treasurer for IPSS. I am not aware of the specific office bearers of the society, but in this case this particular position carries some fiduciary responsibilities along with it. I think we are all agreed that such funds might be useful so there is no doubt into that. What remains is the matter of deciding (sorry if I reopen otherwise answered questions - I am attempting to place it in a perspective) : a) Can IPSS receive foreign funds at all ? b) Can IPSS receive foreign funds and subject them to tax without risking the non profit character ? (which clearly means there will be tax payable on the same) c) Is the non-profit character of IPSS sufficient enough to allow tax-exemption to sponsors d) What are the documentation requirements for FCRA especially with IPSS being a non profit organisation (needs to be checked with the bank) e) Can the IPSS conduct these transactions and the necessary documentation steps. Mind you it can be time consuming if an FCRA certificate is required (which right now is an assumption until one talks to the bank) End of the day this decision rests with the treasurer or equivalent of IPSS. Dhananjay > Regards, > - sree > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Inpycon mailing list > Inpycon at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon > > -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://blog.dhananjaynene.com twitter: @dnene From dhananjay.nene at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 06:20:19 2011 From: dhananjay.nene at gmail.com (Dhananjay Nene) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:50:19 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 10:33 AM, Dhananjay Nene wrote: > e) Can the IPSS conduct these transactions and the necessary > documentation steps. Mind you it can be time consuming if an FCRA > certificate is required (which right now is an assumption until one > talks to the bank) > > End of the day this decision rests with the treasurer or equivalent of IPSS. Minor correction: a. Whether a certificate required is a matter for the CA to opine b. If a certificate is required, the specifics of all the documentation rests with the bank who will be processing the transaction (the one where IPSS has an account). Dhananjay -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://blog.dhananjaynene.com twitter: @dnene From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 06:26:47 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:56:47 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: <1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 10:16 +0530, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. and on my 25 years of experience in these things says the same thing. That is why we are working on this for the society, but it will take some years. -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 06:27:52 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:57:52 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: <1300080472.2368.319.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 10:33 +0530, Dhananjay Nene wrote: > I think this matter really needs to move specifically into the domain > of whoever is the treasurer for IPSS. guess who is the treasurer -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From noufal at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 12:11:35 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 04:11:35 -0700 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> (Kenneth Gonsalves's message of "Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:56:47 +0530") References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

<1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 13 2011, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 10:16 +0530, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: >> Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. > > and on my 25 years of experience in these things says the same thing. > That is why we are working on this for the society, but it will take > some years. Well then, alternatives. - HAve the foreign sponsors directly pay for the tickets of a foreign delegate. - Anything else people can think of? -- From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 12:16:23 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 16:46:23 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

<1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1300101383.2368.339.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 04:11 -0700, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > > and on my 25 years of experience in these things says the same > thing. > > That is why we are working on this for the society, but it will take > > some years. > > Well then, alternatives. > - HAve the foreign sponsors directly pay for the tickets of a > foreign delegate. that is a good one - if they give the money for tickets and accomodation to the foreign delegates it will be a huge help. -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From sree at mahiti.org Mon Mar 14 12:18:29 2011 From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 16:48:29 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

<1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 14 March 2011 16:41, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > On Sun, Mar 13 2011, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > > > On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 10:16 +0530, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > >> Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. > > > > and on my 25 years of experience in these things says the same thing. > > That is why we are working on this for the society, but it will take > > some years. > > Well then, alternatives. > - HAve the foreign sponsors directly pay for the tickets of a > foreign delegate. > - Anything else people can think of? > > If they can directly pay for any expenses related to the event, such as travel bill, foot the food bill or pay to supplier for goodies, that will be great. - sree -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From anandology at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 12:29:11 2011 From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 07:29:11 -0400 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

<1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: 2011/3/14 Sreekanth S Rameshaiah : > > > On 14 March 2011 16:41, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: >> >> On Sun, Mar 13 2011, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: >> >> > On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 10:16 +0530, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: >> >> Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. >> > >> > and on my 25 years of experience in these things says the same thing. >> > That is why we are working on this for the society, but it will take >> > some years. >> >> Well then, alternatives. >> ? ? ? ?- HAve the foreign sponsors directly pay for the tickets of a >> ? ? ? ? ?foreign delegate. >> ? ? ? ?- Anything else people can think of? >> > If they can directly pay for any expenses related to the event, such as > travel bill, foot the food bill or pay to supplier for goodies, that will be > great. I don't think that is possible. The suppliers should be in a position to accept foreign currency, even if does and if there any enquiry, it comes back to us. Anand From satyaakam at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 12:33:39 2011 From: satyaakam at gmail.com (satyaakam goswami) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:03:39 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

Message-ID: > > >> Its based on my 13 years of experience in FCRA. >> > > :-) > > >> Its not easy to get the the temporary license easily for organisations >> that do not have other income tax exemptions (with out using any short cut >> route). >> > > so you agree that it is possible , i still do not know and definitely do > have 13 years in FCRA :-) , so will dig more for info . > oops i meant :/s/do/do not . -Satya -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sree at mahiti.org Mon Mar 14 12:36:15 2011 From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:06:15 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

<1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 14 March 2011 16:59, Anand Chitipothu wrote: > 2011/3/14 Sreekanth S Rameshaiah : > > >> > > If they can directly pay for any expenses related to the event, such as > > travel bill, foot the food bill or pay to supplier for goodies, that will > be > > great. > > I don't think that is possible. The suppliers should be in a position > to accept foreign currency, even if does and if there any enquiry, it > comes back to us. > > Any commercial entity/ agency should be able to accept foreign inward remittance. Law restricts non-profits from doing foreign currency transactions. Regards, - sree -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ramdaz at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 12:55:30 2011 From: ramdaz at gmail.com (Ramdas S) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:25:30 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 5:06 PM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote: > > > On 14 March 2011 16:59, Anand Chitipothu wrote: > >> 2011/3/14 Sreekanth S Rameshaiah : >> >> >> >> >> > If they can directly pay for any expenses related to the event, such as >> > travel bill, foot the food bill or pay to supplier for goodies, that >> will be >> > great. >> >> I don't think that is possible. The suppliers should be in a position >> to accept foreign currency, even if does and if there any enquiry, it >> comes back to us. >> >> Any commercial entity/ agency should be able to accept foreign > inward remittance. Law restricts non-profits from doing foreign currency > transactions. > Regards, > > I have spoken to my CA, and he has provided couple of loopholes, all we need to do is show, the foreign entity as a collaborator, and take the bill in name of a local company, and then raise an invoice back to the foreign entity from the company. There would be the small element of 10.3% of service tax involved, which can be waived off under some clause, which has to be shown through some paper work. I think this should not be a problem. -- Ramdas S +91 9342 583 065 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 12:59:14 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:29:14 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

<1300080407.2368.318.camel@localhost> <87fwqqyn14.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1300103954.2368.340.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 07:29 -0400, Anand Chitipothu wrote: > > If they can directly pay for any expenses related to the event, such > as > > travel bill, foot the food bill or pay to supplier for goodies, that > will be > > great. > > I don't think that is possible. The suppliers should be in a position > to accept foreign currency, even if does and if there any enquiry, it > comes back to us. anything they pay should be paid outside India - like PSF paid David -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 13:02:45 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:32:45 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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Message-ID: <1300104165.2368.342.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 17:25 +0530, Ramdas S wrote: > I have spoken to my CA, and he has provided couple of loopholes, all > we > need to do is show, the foreign entity as a collaborator, and take the > bill > in name of a local company, and then raise an invoice back to the > foreign > entity from the company. > There would be the small element of 10.3% of service tax involved, > which > can be waived off under some clause, which has to be shown through > some > paper work. I think this should not be a problem. there is a word for this - hawala. As our only big expense is going to be for foreign delegates, this should solve the problem. We have local money for everything else (I personally am not very keen on visiting our country's jails - although they seem to be a popular location now a days) -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 13:12:18 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:42:18 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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<1300104165.2368.342.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1300104738.2368.347.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 17:36 +0530, Ramdas S wrote: > No this is not hawala. Hawala involves no billing and the money comes > as > black (in cash). Here the entire transaction will be clean. Worst come > case, > we can pay 10.3% for service tax. hawala basically means this: I have to pay Y in delhi. I pay X in Ooty X pays Y in Delhi. perfectly legal and very common in the older days when banks were not all that reliable. (there is also the black type of hawala). But the point here is that the courts may take it as us trying to get foreign contributions through the back door. Or are we going to do this without any record? It is just not worth it. And authorities are very very sticky when it comes to non profits. And the office bearers will get it in the neck. -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From lawgon at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 13:19:51 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:49:51 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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<1300104165.2368.342.camel@localhost> <1300104738.2368.347.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1300105191.2368.348.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 17:46 +0530, Ramdas S wrote: > > perfectly legal and very common in the older days when banks were > not > > all that reliable. (there is also the black type of hawala). But the > > point here is that the courts may take it as us trying to get > foreign > > contributions through the back door. Or are we going to do this > without > > any record? It is just not worth it. And authorities are very very > > sticky when it comes to non profits. And the office bearers will get > it > > in the neck. > > > > > X bills Y > > Y bills Z > > Z pays Y, Y pays service tax on the amount and pays X which's > non-profit > entity. Z becomes the sponsor. Bills are clean. Govt gets its money, > they > will be happy. CAs would sign on this and so would auditors. At least > mine > would. who is X here? IPSS? -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From dhananjay.nene at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 13:24:24 2011 From: dhananjay.nene at gmail.com (Dhananjay Nene) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:54:24 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 5:25 PM, Ramdas S wrote: > > > On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 5:06 PM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah > wrote: >> >> >> On 14 March 2011 16:59, Anand Chitipothu wrote: >>> >>> 2011/3/14 Sreekanth S Rameshaiah : >>> >>> >> >>> > If they can directly pay for any expenses related to the event, such as >>> > travel bill, foot the food bill or pay to supplier for goodies, that >>> > will be >>> > great. >>> >>> I don't think that is possible. The suppliers should be in a position >>> to accept foreign currency, even if does and if there any enquiry, it >>> comes back to us. >>> >> Any commercial entity/ agency should be able to accept foreign >> inward?remittance. Law restricts non-profits from doing foreign currency >> transactions. >> Regards, > > ?I have spoken to my CA, and he has provided couple of loopholes, all we > need to do is show, the foreign entity as a collaborator, and take the bill > in name of a local company, and then raise an invoice back to the foreign > entity from the company. > ?There would be the small element of 10.3% of service tax involved,? which > can be waived off under some clause, which has to be shown through some > paper work. I think this should not be a problem. > Can we stick to solutions that work in letter and spirit please ? Dhananjay -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://blog.dhananjaynene.com twitter: @dnene From satyaakam at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 13:24:50 2011 From: satyaakam at gmail.com (satyaakam goswami) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:54:50 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <1300104165.2368.342.camel@localhost> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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<1300104165.2368.342.camel@localhost> Message-ID: > > there is a word for this - hawala. As our only big expense is going to > be for foreign delegates, this should solve the problem. We have local > money for everything else (I personally am not very keen on visiting our > country's jails - although they seem to be a popular location now a > days) > with news like these http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2011-02-25/delhi/28633449_1_placement-drive-jail-inmates-prisoners-in-tihar-jail, it does not look like a bad place :-) -Satya -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From noufal at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 13:35:26 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 05:35:26 -0700 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: (Ramdas S.'s message of "Mon, 14 Mar 2011 17:25:30 +0530") References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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Message-ID: <874o75op69.fsf@gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 14 2011, Ramdas S wrote: [...] > I have spoken to my CA, and he has provided couple of loopholes, all > we need to do is show, the foreign entity as a collaborator, and take > the bill in name of a local company, and then raise an invoice back to > the foreign entity from the company. There would be the small element > of 10.3% of service tax involved, which can be waived off under some > clause, which has to be shown through some paper work. I think this > should not be a problem. Loopholes are not something I'd like to step into and I think I speak for the majority of the people here. -- From sree at mahiti.org Mon Mar 14 13:43:22 2011 From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 18:13:22 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <874o75op69.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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<874o75op69.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear all, This list is public and archived. Please exercise restraint/ caution when dwelling on legal/ statutory matters. Regards, - sree On 14 March 2011 18:05, Noufal Ibrahim wrote: > On Mon, Mar 14 2011, Ramdas S wrote: > > > [...] > > > I have spoken to my CA, and he has provided couple of loopholes, all > > we need to do is show, the foreign entity as a collaborator, and take > > the bill in name of a local company, and then raise an invoice back to > > the foreign entity from the company. There would be the small element > > of 10.3% of service tax involved, which can be waived off under some > > clause, which has to be shown through some paper work. I think this > > should not be a problem. > > Loopholes are not something I'd like to step into and I think I speak > for the majority of the people here. > > -- > -- Sreekanth S Rameshaiah Executive Director Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd. "OpenSpace", #583, Vyalikaval HBCS Layout, Nagawara, Veerannapalya, Bangalore, India - 560043 Phone: +91 80 4343 7373 Mobile: +91 98455 12611 www.mahiti.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From satyaakam at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 13:37:30 2011 From: satyaakam at gmail.com (satyaakam goswami) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 18:07:30 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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Message-ID: > > Can we stick to solutions that work in letter and spirit please ? > Dhananjay > yes we are need some time , but over all good info we should reach some closure lets say by 21st . -Satya -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lawgon at gmail.com Tue Mar 15 02:45:14 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 07:15:14 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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Message-ID: <1300153514.2368.354.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 17:54 +0530, Dhananjay Nene wrote: > > I have spoken to my CA, and he has provided couple of loopholes, > all we > > need to do is show, the foreign entity as a collaborator, and take > the bill > > in name of a local company, and then raise an invoice back to the > foreign > > entity from the company. > > There would be the small element of 10.3% of service tax involved, > which > > can be waived off under some clause, which has to be shown through > some > > paper work. I think this should not be a problem. > > > > Can we stick to solutions that work in letter and spirit please ? that is my view. -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From lawgon at gmail.com Tue Mar 15 02:46:40 2011 From: lawgon at gmail.com (Kenneth Gonsalves) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 07:16:40 +0530 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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<1300104165.2368.342.camel@localhost> <1300104738.2368.347.camel@localhost> <1300105191.2368.348.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1300153600.2368.356.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 18:05 +0530, Ramdas S wrote: > > X is IPSS, Y is an Indian company, Z is foreign sponsor. Please note > that > I'm suggesting is 100% legal, to my best of knowledge. Y is > facilitating a > foreign collaborator to sponsor an Indian event, and for which Y will > pay > service tax, and since the service does not belong to any of the > illegal > services, and is accounted for, I do not see any issues. > > it is violating the law in spirit if not in the letter. -- regards Kenneth Gonsalves http://lawgon.livejournal.com/ From vid at svaksha.com Tue Mar 15 07:34:43 2011 From: vid at svaksha.com (=?UTF-8?B?4KWlIOCkuOCljeCkteCkleCljeCktyDgpaUg?=) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 06:34:43 +0000 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: <1300153600.2368.356.camel@localhost> References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87y64kmlhm.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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<1300104165.2368.342.camel@localhost> <1300104738.2368.347.camel@localhost> <1300105191.2368.348.camel@localhost> <1300153600.2368.356.camel@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 01:46, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: > On Mon, 2011-03-14 at 18:05 +0530, Ramdas S wrote: >> > X is IPSS, Y is an Indian company, Z is foreign sponsor. Please note >> that >> I'm suggesting is 100% legal, to my best of knowledge. Y is >> facilitating a >> foreign collaborator to sponsor an Indian event, and for which Y will >> pay >> service tax, and since the service does not belong to any of the >> illegal >> services, and is accounted for, I do not see any issues. >> >> > > it is violating the law in spirit if not in the letter. Agree, it does not sound legit when X routes funds through Y -- Extremely sticky ground for a non-profit org to be in. Isnt it easier if the guest speakers were paid in their own currency for travel/lodging and would not have to depend on IPSS or Indian companies to help with the event sponsorship. It seems to unnecessarily complicate matters. On a tangent, some mails seem to be missing -- only hit the list when Kenneth replies to them. Are they private mails hitting the list or was it meant for the list -- which means my email is borked (doubtful). A few weeks ago the list settings had been changed and I hope people note this before hitting on the reply button. -- vid ? http://svaksha.com ? From noufal at gmail.com Tue Mar 15 15:42:12 2011 From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 07:42:12 -0700 Subject: [Inpycon] Receiving funds from foreign sponsors In-Reply-To: (=?utf-8?B?IuClpS4g4KS44KWN4KS14KSV4KWN4KS3IOClpS4iJ3M=?= message of "Tue, 15 Mar 2011 06:34:43 +0000") References: <87lj0ko1r4.fsf@gmail.com> <87zkp0kpes.fsf@gmail.com>

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