[Inpycon] Necessity of foreign delegates.

[Noufal Ibrahim]

On Mon, Feb 21 2011, Ramdas S wrote:


[...]

> I would rather be happier if we could invest 1 L and produce 100 or
> even 10 good young Python developers, whom the industry can hire
> instead of flying in a big name. I am not against getting big names
> in, it adds color to the event. But beyond that I don't see anything
> great.

It's not for a "big name". We're discussing conducting a conference
here (not general evangelism). You argument suggests that this whole
business of flying people is for "advertising". That's not true.

Experienced Pythonistas who are part of the core community help the
conference. We have the resources to bring them here for the event and
we should. 

As for your investment of money and time to create Python programmers. I
have two points. 
        - We had half a year since the last event and no one came
          forward with any such suggestions backed by work.
        - The sponsorships, money etc. are for the conference and should
          be focussed on that. After that, if there are leftovers, we
          can use it for general evangelism. Compromising on the
          conference to train young Python programmers is damaging to
          the event and I for one don't agree with it at all.
        
I'm not really interested in making Python another "popular" language
Bangalore where there's tons of mediocre people available. I'm
*especially* not interested in doing that by siphoning money away from
the conference which we're trying to improve every year. 

> The fact of the matter is even if you have five big names come in,
> they can only interact with a dozen or so people personally over the
> event. If 700 people actually turn up at an event, only about 50-60
> can hob knob with a Holden or Shaw.

The point of inviting these people over is not so that every delegate
has 5 minutes of personal one on one time with them.

> If you really want to listen to them, then there are many
> presentations online which you can watch at your leisure.

We could cancel the whole conference then and just create a mailing list
where people can interact and evangelism takes place. Physically being
there during a presentation is something else.

> A judicial investment of surplus funds can help us produce better
> Python programmers, which would have a domino effect.

Agreed but the important word in your sentence is *surplus*. We can have
a really small conference with lots of newbie attendees that's just a
glorified workshop and plenty of funds left over. That's damaging to the
event and something I'm against.

> I'm personally frustrated that my company have not been able to hire
> any Python programmers of less than 1 year experience, that we are
> actively thinking of going back to PHP, since we have work and we need
> people to execute. What is IPSS doing about it? Mind you, this is not
> just my opinion, several other entrepreneurs whom I personally know
> have been reluctant to switch projects to Python for the same reason.

This is a problem with your company and not something that is relevant
to the conference. 

As for "what is the IPSS doing about it?", this is also not relevant to
the conference. 

I don't speak for everyone on this list but I don't take it upon me to
generate Python programmers for companies.

[...]

> I believe that every event should be self sufficient on its own, and
> should produce surplus cash which should be invested in real Python
> evangelism, and that starts from grass roots, and sponsoring contests,
> SOC like projects, get youngsters involved.

Fair enough. In addition to this, the conference should grow. People
should look forward to attending it, companies should get interested in
sponsoring it.

> I feel good about the fact that 700 people attended it or 1000 made it
> to the event.  But what about the million developers in the country,
> and the million wannabe which are being churned out by our educational
> institutions?  Can we use these funds to reach a fraction of them? Or
> should we look at flying in as many foreign speakers as possible, and
> basically boost our egos?

No on is trying to boost their egos. If that's what you think this is
about, I don't think this is a productive dicussion. 

[...]

> Please do not get me wrong, and take this personal. We need to think
> beyond the conference and look at building a community.

We're discussing the conference on this list and in this thread. It's a
rallying point for the "community" and should be something people look
forward to. Not just "another thing we do".

When the conference is over and the surplus money is left, we can spend
time doing evangelism and "building the community". Derailing the
efforts right now to train people on Python is damaging to the work here
and something that should be avoided. 

[...]


-- 
~noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in