From dscherertemp at gmail.com  Thu Jun  5 20:10:49 2008
From: dscherertemp at gmail.com (David Scherer)
Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2008 14:10:49 -0400
Subject: [Idle-dev] Fix for long delays
In-Reply-To: <52632.71.59.123.159.1211856219.squirrel@webmail.brynmawr.edu>
References: <483AE025.9070004@ncsu.edu>
	<49812.71.59.123.159.1211836576.squirrel@webmail.brynmawr.edu>
	<41288ed40805261901s15520d19n1fb861a13b0af6ca@mail.gmail.com>
	<41288ed40805261903r21b75d3bw9f24678e030a480e@mail.gmail.com>
	<52632.71.59.123.159.1211856219.squirrel@webmail.brynmawr.edu>
Message-ID: <41288ed40806051110p53559a6eg5fb267f91ba34ca@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I'm back from my trip.

[Douglas]

> Exception exceptions.AttributeError: "'NoneType' object has no attribute
> 'maxint'" in <bound method Popen.__del__ of <subprocess.Popen object at
> 0x9007e0c>> ignored


Believe it or not, this appears to be a bug in the subprocess module that
was fixed in Python 2.5.1.  The relevant checkin is this
one<http://svn.python.org/view?rev=54918&view=rev>
.

[Douglas]

> I had to adjust the patch a bit as it got mangled through the mailer (and
> I've attached the version to this email) so please check that I got it all.


What you sent looks right to me, though the bug Tal pointed out is still
there (SIGTERM = 9 instead of SIGKILL = 9).

[Douglas]

> I agree that for the us the "no subprocess mode" causes confusion. I'd vote
> to make get rid of it, or at least to not make it the default.


[Tal]

> I certainly agree that using a subprocess should always be the default.
> However, no-subprocess mode is very useful in certain cases, such as
> debugging IDLE itself, so we'd need a good reason to get rid of it.
>

Agreed.  This isn't as high priority for us as the termination issue, but it
would be best to default to using a subprocess regardless of how IDLE is
started, and to support multiple instances of IDLE with subprocesses.
There's no problem with having a command line option or setting for
no-subprocess mode, it just shouldn't happen to the naive user.

[Tal]

> The reason no-subprocess mode is the default on Windows is to avoid
> trying to open more than subprocess, since opening a second one
> usually fails because of port clashes. About a year ago I worked up a
> patch: http://bugs.python.org/issue1529142, "Allowing multiple
> instances of IDLE with sub-processes". The problem with it is that I
> haven't been able to get it accepted, because of lack of interest and
> its relative complexity.


Why not just bind to port 0 ("any") and then do self.port =
self.rpcclt.listening_sock.getsockname()[1] to find what port the OS has
assigned?  I tried that and IWFM.

Dave
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From taleinat at gmail.com  Fri Jun  6 12:03:23 2008
From: taleinat at gmail.com (Tal Einat)
Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2008 13:03:23 +0300
Subject: [Idle-dev] Fix for long delays
In-Reply-To: <41288ed40806051110p53559a6eg5fb267f91ba34ca@mail.gmail.com>
References: <483AE025.9070004@ncsu.edu>
	<49812.71.59.123.159.1211836576.squirrel@webmail.brynmawr.edu>
	<41288ed40805261901s15520d19n1fb861a13b0af6ca@mail.gmail.com>
	<41288ed40805261903r21b75d3bw9f24678e030a480e@mail.gmail.com>
	<52632.71.59.123.159.1211856219.squirrel@webmail.brynmawr.edu>
	<41288ed40806051110p53559a6eg5fb267f91ba34ca@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7afdee2f0806060303l39740947m775da2bfaa091f02@mail.gmail.com>

David Scherer wrote:

>
> The reason no-subprocess mode is the default on Windows is to avoid
>> trying to open more than subprocess, since opening a second one
>> usually fails because of port clashes. About a year ago I worked up a
>> patch: http://bugs.python.org/issue1529142, "Allowing multiple
>> instances of IDLE with sub-processes". The problem with it is that I
>> haven't been able to get it accepted, because of lack of interest and
>> its relative complexity.
>
>
> Why not just bind to port 0 ("any") and then do self.port =
> self.rpcclt.listening_sock.getsockname()[1] to find what port the OS has
> assigned?  I tried that and IWFM.
>

I've never heard of that option - it sounds great! Is it supported on all
platforms? Can't that cause problems by binding to ports commonly used by
other programs?

- Tal
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From dscherertemp at gmail.com  Sat Jun  7 01:25:36 2008
From: dscherertemp at gmail.com (David Scherer)
Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2008 19:25:36 -0400
Subject: [Idle-dev] Fix for long delays
In-Reply-To: <7afdee2f0806060303l39740947m775da2bfaa091f02@mail.gmail.com>
References: <483AE025.9070004@ncsu.edu>
	<49812.71.59.123.159.1211836576.squirrel@webmail.brynmawr.edu>
	<41288ed40805261901s15520d19n1fb861a13b0af6ca@mail.gmail.com>
	<41288ed40805261903r21b75d3bw9f24678e030a480e@mail.gmail.com>
	<52632.71.59.123.159.1211856219.squirrel@webmail.brynmawr.edu>
	<41288ed40806051110p53559a6eg5fb267f91ba34ca@mail.gmail.com>
	<7afdee2f0806060303l39740947m775da2bfaa091f02@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <41288ed40806061625n61477fa4tdf594a84597b0eb1@mail.gmail.com>

[Me]

> Why not just bind to port 0 ("any") and then do self.port =
>> self.rpcclt.listening_sock.getsockname()[1] to find what port the OS has
>> assigned?  I tried that and IWFM.
>>
>
[Tal]

> I've never heard of that option - it sounds great! Is it supported on all
> platforms? Can't that cause problems by binding to ports commonly used by
> other programs?
>

I can't guarantee that it works on all platforms, but my belief is that it's
standard BSD sockets behavior.  It almost certainly works on Windows and
Linux.

As for binding to commonly used ports, nearly all *client* programs are also
asking the OS to allocate ports for them, so I don't IDLE asking for two
ports instead of one is a big problem :-).  I expect each OS does something
very similar to what you did internally, allocating ports from a range that
doesn't have a lot of well-known ports.

Dave
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From Scott.Daniels at Acm.Org  Mon Jun  9 01:42:22 2008
From: Scott.Daniels at Acm.Org (Scott David Daniels)
Date: Sun, 08 Jun 2008 16:42:22 -0700
Subject: [Idle-dev] idle on 2.6+ and warnings
Message-ID: <g2hq79$mr0$1@ger.gmane.org>

idle's warnings formatters need to grow another arg (line = None),
just as the formatwarnings function in the warnings module grew one.

This is needed for:
In idlelib.PyShell.py:
     idle_showwarning
     idle_formatwarning

and in idlelib.run.py:
     idle_formatwarning_subproc

I noticed this when I tried code that did "import md5".


-Scott David Daniels
Scott.Daniels at Acm.Org


From crowyeh at vip.sina.com  Mon Jun  9 18:08:29 2008
From: crowyeh at vip.sina.com (=?GB2312?B?ItK2ILflfENyb3cgWWVoKFllIEZlbmcpIg==?=)
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 00:08:29 +0800
Subject: [Idle-dev] Help needed for using IDLE under Ubuntu 8.04
Message-ID: <484D557D.6000109@vip.sina.com>

Hi,

I'm totally a beginner of python. I met some strange problem on using IDLE.

Python version is 2.5.2
IDLE version is 1.2.2
Ubuntu version: 8.04

All works fine except function invoking.
Say, the basic help() function, if I type in help(dir) and hit RETURN,
nothing happens, and the keyboard seems to be locked inside IDLE. I mean
no matter what I type afterwards, it looks like I typed nothing. The
pointer keeps flickering and IDLE just refuses to accept any further
keyboard input. The keyboard still functions well outside IDLE.
To see the feedback of help(dir), I have to invoke File->Print Window
(Yes the mouse still works fine inside IDLE), then I see the pointer
moves to the beginning of the next line, and now if I hit RETURN again,
it prints out the help info for "dir", and then my keyboard seems alive
inside IDLE again!

Python interactive session works OK as expected. It seems that only IDLE
doesn't like RETURN to be hit after the tailing "()" of functions. I've
tried several different function calls, same issue happens every time I
hit RETURN after typing in the function call (like
"somefunction(whatever)").

I've tried IDLE under Windows too, works fine. Ubuntu is main OS for me
to work on, and I don't want to switch to Windows for such a reason.
I've tried reinstalling IDLE with no luck. I also tried asking for help
in Ubuntu community like ubuntuforums.org, but all I get is suggestions
of trying out other python compatible IDEs insted of how to solve the
problem. And I get no confirm about the issue. So I don't even know if
it is some problem happens to me only.

Really strange, isn't it? Or am I missing something?

Please help. I'd really like to use IDLE as python IDE as I thought it
should be more native to python!

-- 

Sincerely,

? ?|Crow Yeh(Ye Feng)


From Bruce_Sherwood at ncsu.edu  Sat Jun 21 06:10:01 2008
From: Bruce_Sherwood at ncsu.edu (Bruce Sherwood)
Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 22:10:01 -0600
Subject: [Idle-dev] Help needed for using IDLE under Ubuntu 8.04
In-Reply-To: <484D557D.6000109@vip.sina.com>
References: <484D557D.6000109@vip.sina.com>
Message-ID: <485C7F19.4070300@ncsu.edu>

I'm also running Ubuntu 8 with Python 2.5, and I don't see any of the
misbehavior that you see.

However, it's possible that I don't understand your comment, "Python
interactive session works OK as expected. It seems that only IDLE
doesn't like RETURN to be hit after the tailing "()" of functions."
First you say it works OK, then you say it doesn't work OK.

I have no idea what's wrong on your machine, but in the IDLE shell
window I can definitely execute the function calls that you are unable
to execute.

Bruce Sherwood


? ?|Crow Yeh(Ye Feng) wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I'm totally a beginner of python. I met some strange problem on using IDLE.
>
> Python version is 2.5.2
> IDLE version is 1.2.2
> Ubuntu version: 8.04
>
> All works fine except function invoking.
> Say, the basic help() function, if I type in help(dir) and hit RETURN,
> nothing happens, and the keyboard seems to be locked inside IDLE. I mean
> no matter what I type afterwards, it looks like I typed nothing. The
> pointer keeps flickering and IDLE just refuses to accept any further
> keyboard input. The keyboard still functions well outside IDLE.
> To see the feedback of help(dir), I have to invoke File->Print Window
> (Yes the mouse still works fine inside IDLE), then I see the pointer
> moves to the beginning of the next line, and now if I hit RETURN again,
> it prints out the help info for "dir", and then my keyboard seems alive
> inside IDLE again!
>
> Python interactive session works OK as expected. It seems that only IDLE
> doesn't like RETURN to be hit after the tailing "()" of functions. I've
> tried several different function calls, same issue happens every time I
> hit RETURN after typing in the function call (like
> "somefunction(whatever)").
>
> I've tried IDLE under Windows too, works fine. Ubuntu is main OS for me
> to work on, and I don't want to switch to Windows for such a reason.
> I've tried reinstalling IDLE with no luck. I also tried asking for help
> in Ubuntu community like ubuntuforums.org, but all I get is suggestions
> of trying out other python compatible IDEs insted of how to solve the
> problem. And I get no confirm about the issue. So I don't even know if
> it is some problem happens to me only.
>
> Really strange, isn't it? Or am I missing something?
>
> Please help. I'd really like to use IDLE as python IDE as I thought it
> should be more native to python!
>
>   

From crowyeh at vip.sina.com  Sat Jun 21 19:22:24 2008
From: crowyeh at vip.sina.com (=?GB2312?B?ItK2ILflfENyb3cgWWVoKFllIEZlbmcpIg==?=)
Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2008 01:22:24 +0800
Subject: [Idle-dev] Help needed for using IDLE under Ubuntu 8.04
In-Reply-To: <485C7F19.4070300@ncsu.edu>
References: <484D557D.6000109@vip.sina.com> <485C7F19.4070300@ncsu.edu>
Message-ID: <485D38D0.7070903@vip.sina.com>

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