[Edu-sig] Re: The right learning environment

[Arthur Siegel]

Eeks.  Forgot Mathias was here.

>  If the language offers a shell, one should also use the shell,
>  without even a text editor.  Entering 1+1 to get 2 is even more
>  basic than 'Hello World'.  The command line just sits there,
>  waiting to give immediate feedback.  Some people don't discover
>   this about Python until late in the game, and I think that's a
>   pity.  I like that Guido's tutorial starts with 'using Python
>   as a calculator'.

Yup. Kind of neat that I don't need to abstract about this,
"Worked for me" covers it.

>And how exactly does DrScheme differ? -- Matthias

The short answer is I don't know, and you would know
much better than I.

The longer answer is that I  - so we have as cross-section
of one -  experience it very differently.  I was in an
environment, created by folks who thought they might
have a beat on how I learned, but probably didn't.

I happen to learn sloppy, not neat. Three measures
of "start from the beginning ", and a measure of "let me
skip over to that for a bit" and a measure of "what would
happen if I tried that" and a few measures of "now that I 
get that, let's start back from the beginning again 
and see if I understand some of what I missed the first time
around", and a measure of "let's see what happens in Chapter
Six, just to get a taste of what's to come",  a measure of 
"you know I don't *really* even understand what 'pi' is,
so let's get that straight before I do much else", and
a measure of "oh yeah were we programming, shucks got 
to start at the beginning again". 

But damn it I do learn.

Not sure an environment or lesson plans can handle
that.  

Though if I thought I really was unusual in any real way, I wouldn't
expect anyone to be interested.

But it does explain why the Open Source movement and 
the internet have changed the intellectual lives of folks 
like myself.  Make the tools and information we might use
available, a push to get us started is well appreciated, 
(keep some tabs on us if you must - I understand
a teacher does have a responsibility to do that)
and us sloppy learners will take it from there  - each 
in our own sloppy way. *If*, of course it happens that 
the time is right - i.e. we *want* to learn. 

Because if we don't, none of this is very interesting for 
anybody.

The fact is that DrScheme was - I am willing to bet -
the best pre-Internet alternative there was. But now 
any environment that is in any way isolating - and
yes Mathias it's an opinion/experience that DrScheme 
is (somewhat) - is no longer optimum. 

The Internet is the ultimate learning environment. 

Students find a text editor you are comfortable with. 
There are plenty to choose from. I happen to 
recommend X, Y, or Z. but the important thing to know
is that it doesn't really matter that much which you choose.

We got bigger fish to fry.

Art