[Edu-sig] RE: [Tutor] a couple of ideas I've been bouncing around

[Kevin & Masako Ollivier]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Andrews" <rob@jam.rr.com>
To: "Kevin & Masako Ollivier" <guess-who@kevin-masako.com>;
<tutor@python.org>; <Edu-sig@python.org>
Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2001 9:56 PM
Subject: RE: [Edu-sig] RE: [Tutor] a couple of ideas I've been bouncing
around


> #
> # Hi Patrick and Rob,
> #
> # I also like both of your ideas! (BTW, thanks Patrick for sharing this
with
> # the edu-sig list! I had not realized there was also a Tutor list!)
> #
>
> The Tutor list is great! I can't easily think of a more helpful, decent
> group of people. And some of the answers to newbie coding questions could
> easily be quoted verbatim in documentation.

Actually, I signed up to the Python edu-sig list just yesterday because I
was thinking about the very topic you were discussing. I had always wanted
to be able to teach family and friends who are computer users Python simply
because I often find myself writing little scripts to automate everyday,
repetitive tasks I do on the computer. I was hoping to bounce some ideas
back and forth through the list, and the same day I sign up I'm getting my
wish! =)

The classroom courses I've taken and books I've read almost seem to take all
the fun out of programming, and focus on learning syntax, not problem
solving. I remember in my first C programming class, one of the students
whispered to his friend "So when are we going to start learning how to
program GAMES?" That stuck with me. They didn't see how the lessons they
were learning could be used to create games. And if they don't see that (in
other words, they didn't see how what they were learning could accomplish
their goal), what are they going to take out of the class? If it's anything
like the Trig I learned... Nothing. =)

> # Building on the ideas you presented, what about an software tool
(possibly
> # an "enhanced" version of IDLE?) that gives learners a set of
successively
> # harder programming tasks? At any point, the learner can jump to a
virtual
> # "help center" and view tutorials, the Python references, FAQs/trivia, or
> # even be given a way to ask a question on the lists. As the learner
> # successfully complete the tasks given to them, the software will keep a
> # record and let them know how far they are towards "mastery." (Of course,
> # true mastery comes only with experience, but it's a start!) I think it
has
> # elements of everything discussed thus far, trivia, tutor, and
> # testing. While
> # I'm not sure how we could "officially" certify people who complete the
> # training, we can at least give them a list of all the skills they've
> # gathered over the course of the training, along with when they were last
> # assessed.
> #
> # I think making "real-world tasks" would help increase motivation and
give
> # them examples of what Python is typically used for. The more real
> # it seems,
> # the more it will be part-game and part-edusoft I think. If we did it
well
> # enough, it could even lead to a finished software product, which
> # is at least
> # as good as a certificate IMHO!
> #
> # What do you all think?
> #
> # Kevin Ollivier
> #
>
> Sounds quite interesting, although quite far beyond my skill level. There
> are probably lots of odd games we could develop using curses, pygame, etc.
> to reinforce learning. If we came up with enough components, I could even
> see a Python Learning Lab on sourceforge or similar (or on Useless Python
> heehee).

Some of it is beyond my skill level too. <gg> Of course I believe you don't
learn new skills until you need them, so I like to give myself a challenge
every now and then. =)

At the same time, there's quite a bit of work, programming and
non-programming, to go around! The tutorials would be quite a bit of work,
and then there's Trivial Python (errr... different name maybe?), and if
we're serious about the real-world scenarios then someone would have to drum
those up too. Like good object-oriented programmers, we could develop each
component separately then in the end integrate them into the software.

The Useless Python Learning Lab, huh? =) I have to admit the thing I don't
like about SourceForge is that it sometimes can be dead slow, or down at
times.

Thanks,

Kevin