[Distutils] Expectations on how pip needs to change for Python 3.4

[Paul Moore]

On 13 July 2013 16:03, Donald Stufft <donald at stufft.io> wrote:

>
> > 1. Install to user-packages by default.
>
> Do people really want this? I hadn't seen it (other than if pip was
> installed to user by default). I think it's a bad idea to switch this on
> people. I doubt the user-packages is going to be in people's default PATH
> so they'll easily get into cases where things are installed but they don't
> know where it was installed too.
>

I believe Nick wants to make user-packages the default. I know at least
some of the pip maintainers (yourself included) have reservations.
Personally, I've never used user-packages, so I don't know what issues
might arise. But I hope to try it out sometime when I get the chance, just
to get some specific information.


> > 2. Not depend on setuptools (??? - Nick's "inversion" idea)
>
> I wanted to do this anyways. It will still "depend" on it, but it will
> just bundle setuptools itself like its other dependencies. For pip
> dependencies are an implementation detail not an actual thing it can/should
> have.
>

Bundling is not the same as Nick's suggestion. I personally have no problem
with bundling, but pip install with a bundled setuptools might not work
because the setup subprocess won't see the bundled setuptools when it
imports it in setup.py. But either way, it's doable, I just want to know if
it's on the critical path...


> > 3. Possibly change the wrapper command name from pip to pip3 on Unix.
>
> Not sure on this. Ideally i'd want the commands to be pipX.Y, pipX, and
> pip all available and not install the less specific ones if they already
> exist but that might be too hard?
>
> > 4. Ensure that pip upgrading itself in-place is sufficiently robust and
> reliable that users don't get "stuck" on the Python-supplied version.
>
> I've always used pip to upgrade pip. The only time i've had problems is
> when setuptools messes up (which would be prevented if bundled).
>

I've never tried myself, but I'm on Windows and I expect in-place stuff
like this to fail. Maybe I'm paranoid :-) Again I need to check.

Thanks for the comments.
Paul
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