From Irv at furrypants.com Wed Oct 5 01:12:59 2016 From: Irv at furrypants.com (Irv Kalb) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 22:12:59 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Python Programming for Beginners class at UCSC Extension In-Reply-To: References: <700DD572-A94E-429D-B316-728ED72114B7@furrypants.com> Message-ID: <21151DD4-3EF3-4556-835A-28AB5C50C3B7@furrypants.com> Hello, I will be teaching a course called ?Python Programming for Beginners? at University of California Santa Cruz - Extension in Santa Clara. (UCSC Extension now has a beautiful new facility.) The course is designed for people with no previous programming experience and teaches basic programming concepts using Python. I have developed my own curriculum for this class, and I?ve received consistent feedback from students that they enjoyed the class and have found the material to highly useful. The course meets on six Wednesday nights from Oct 19 through Nov 30th from 6:30 to 9:30 (no meeting Thanksgiving week). Very hands-on - lots of sample programs. Sign ups are open to the general public and there is still time to register. The course fee is $580 (many companies will reimburse the cost of courses at UCSC-Extension). More details are available at: http://course.ucsc-extension.edu/modules/shop/index.html?action=section&OfferingID=3576274&SectionID=5278785 If you have any questions, free to contact me directly at ikalb at ucsc.edu Feel free to forward this message on to anyone that you think might be interested. Irv PS: In the course, I go over much of the material in my new book: Learn to Program with Python -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wescpy at gmail.com Wed Oct 5 13:20:06 2016 From: wescpy at gmail.com (wescpy at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 10:20:06 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Exploring Google APIs with Python... again Message-ID: In case you missed my Google APIs talk and attempted live demos complete with hecklers -- you know who you are ;-) -- 6 weeks ago, I'm doing a reprise and variation in a few weeks up in the city for the SF Python Meetup's project night , held *at* the Google SF office (easily walkable from BART or Lyftable/Uberable/bikable from CalTrain). Not only will I be doing (err, attempting) the live demos (again), but it being project night means that I'll be helping *you* code afterwards during the hands-on hack portion. There are other speakers and projects too, so hope you can come join us. Only ~160 (half the size of a normal meetup) will be allowed since our office space isn't *that* big, so RSVP as soon as you know you can make it. If several team members from you company are attending, please consider and ask for funding from your manager to help sponsor dinner/snacks and get a corporate table in exchange! Ping me or Grace for more details. Oh and of course, don't forget to bring your laptops and Python editors! Cheers, --Wesley -- "A computer never does what you want... only what you tell it." -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bbrelin at gmail.com Tue Oct 11 05:29:33 2016 From: bbrelin at gmail.com (Braun Brelin) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 10:29:33 +0100 Subject: [Baypiggies] What's the "Pythonic" way to access class attributes? Message-ID: Hello all, I just wanted to get the list's opinion on something. Since Python doesn't really have the concept of private and protected attribute access protections a la Java or C++ (Yes, I know you can use the __ and _ prefixes to declare something private or protected in Python, but that really only does name-mangling on the attribute name rather than explicitly disallow access to the attribute from outside the class), is it better to still access the attribute directly a la Foo.bar = 10 or use a setter/getter approach like Foo.setBar(10)? It seems to me that option one is better, especially if I can use a descriptor with the attribute. Any thoughts? Thanks, Braun Brelin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ken at seehart.com Tue Oct 11 13:49:59 2016 From: ken at seehart.com (Ken Seehart) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 10:49:59 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] What's the "Pythonic" way to access class attributes? Message-ID: <20161011175001.08EC3213F770@smtp.webfaction.com> The hazards associated with accessing attributes that are intended as private or protected depend entirely on the situation at hand. In many cases the main issue is that the module defining the class is subject to change and there is no contract to maintain compatibility with respect to those attributes. As with all rules, avoid blind dogma, try to understand the actual consequences, and remember we are grown ups. We are all. Free. To do. Whatever. We want. To do. - Richard Bach Regarding getters and setters, I'm convinced that these are utterly useless in Python, and often a horrendous waste of time. They are often quite necessary for future-proofing in statically typed languages such as Java, but there exists no scenario in Python in which that pattern can yield an increase in robustness, resilience, or productivity. I rarely get this passionate and one sided about an issue, but I recently witnessed a LOC increase of around 8000 lines attributable to this horrific anti-pattern, and along with it a substantial decrease in the resilience of the code base. It was horrible. I and my colleagues were unable to compose any hypothetical future scenario for which this provided any protection. In fact, ironically, there were a couple bugs caused by failure to keep the setters up to date! More code = more bugs. I find that it is usually best to just "keep it simple, stupid". If an attribute makes sense in terms of the View, and currently represented in the Model as an ordinary attribute, just make it public and don't make a big fuss over OOP ideas about hiding implementation details, (unless you can think of a "clear and present" reason for doing so). The reason you can get by with this in Python or simple, but subtle: an ordinary attribute is already syntactically equivalent to a property, so you've effectively got implementation hiding for free. Sure, you're exposing data members, but you haven't committed to doing so. What if the data model changes (e.g. the attribute is now stored in remote database)? If you are coming from a Java background, you can have your 30 second panic attack: Bloody Hell! We forgot to publish an accessor interface! We are so humped! Then relax. This is Python. It's all good. It's never too late. Just refactor the attribute into a @property and all is well. http://docs.quantifiedcode.com/python-anti-patterns/correctness/implementing_java-style_getters_and_setters.html ~ken (Sent from my phone) On Oct 11, 2016 2:29 AM, Braun Brelin wrote: > > Hello all, > > I just wanted to get the list's opinion on something.? > > Since Python doesn't really have the concept of private and protected > attribute access protections a la Java or C++ (Yes, I know you can use > the __ and _ prefixes to declare something private or protected in > Python, but that really only does name-mangling on the attribute name > rather than explicitly disallow access to the attribute from outside the class), is it better to still access the attribute directly a la? > Foo.bar = 10 or use a setter/getter approach like Foo.setBar(10)? > It seems to me that option one is better, especially if I can use a descriptor with the attribute.? > > Any thoughts? > > Thanks, > > Braun Brelin > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rodrigc at freebsd.org Tue Oct 11 13:51:34 2016 From: rodrigc at freebsd.org (Craig Rodrigues) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 10:51:34 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] What's the "Pythonic" way to access class attributes? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, In various Python libraries and projects, I have seen that Foo.bar = 10 is the preferred convention, since as you mentioned, there are no private/protected keywords in Python. You may want to look at the Python attrs library, which offers some interesting ways to use classes with attributions: https://glyph.twistedmatrix.com/2016/08/attrs.html https://attrs.readthedocs.io -- Craig On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:29 AM, Braun Brelin wrote: > Hello all, > > I just wanted to get the list's opinion on something. > > Since Python doesn't really have the concept of private and protected > attribute access protections a la Java or C++ (Yes, I know you can use > the __ and _ prefixes to declare something private or protected in > Python, but that really only does name-mangling on the attribute name > rather than explicitly disallow access to the attribute from outside the > class), is it better to still access the attribute directly a la > Foo.bar = 10 or use a setter/getter approach like Foo.setBar(10)? > It seems to me that option one is better, especially if I can use a > descriptor with the attribute. > > Any thoughts? > > Thanks, > > Braun Brelin > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shaleh at speakeasy.net Tue Oct 11 14:17:53 2016 From: shaleh at speakeasy.net (=?utf-8?b?U2VhbiBQZXJyeQ==?=) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 11:17:53 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] What's the "Pythonic" way to access class attributes? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20161011111753.yrsks99tcsc0cw84@mail.speakeasy.net> get/set is a bad idea in almost any language actually. The OO design folk will tell you the methods should be action and use oriented. ? foo.unlock() instead of foo.setLocked(false) ? foo.activateEngine() ? etc. ? The biggest value for a function of some sort in my opinion is it is easier to refactor later. Finding all of the places that foo.bar = 1 can be annoying and worse you fall into idioms like: ? foo.bar = 1 if reason: ?? foo.bar += 2? # yikes, I have to refactor that too. On Tue, 11 Oct 2016 10:29:33 +0100, Braun Brelin wrote: Hello all,? I just wanted to get the list's opinion on something.? ? Since Python doesn't really have the concept of private and protected attribute access protections a la Java or C++ (Yes, I know you can use the __ and _ prefixes to declare something private or protected in Python, but that really only does name-mangling on the attribute name rather than explicitly disallow access to the attribute from outside the class), is it better to still access the attribute directly a la? Foo.bar = 10 or use a setter/getter approach like Foo.setBar(10)? It seems to me that option one is better, especially if I can use a descriptor with the attribute.? ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sandipb at sandipb.net Tue Oct 11 14:41:57 2016 From: sandipb at sandipb.net (Sandip Bhattacharya) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 11:41:57 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] What's the "Pythonic" way to access class attributes? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I believe the Python way is not to use getFoo() or setFoo(), but obj.foo directly. You may however like to name the actual variable something else entirely and expose foo using the property decorator if you feel the need to manage it within some sane parameters. - Sandip On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 10:51 AM, Craig Rodrigues wrote: > Hi, > > In various Python libraries and projects, I have seen that Foo.bar = 10 > is the preferred convention, since as you mentioned, there are no > private/protected > keywords in Python. > > You may want to look at the Python attrs library, which offers some > interesting > ways to use classes with attributions: > > https://glyph.twistedmatrix.com/2016/08/attrs.html > https://attrs.readthedocs.io > > -- > Craig > > > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:29 AM, Braun Brelin wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> I just wanted to get the list's opinion on something. >> >> Since Python doesn't really have the concept of private and protected >> attribute access protections a la Java or C++ (Yes, I know you can use >> the __ and _ prefixes to declare something private or protected in >> Python, but that really only does name-mangling on the attribute name >> rather than explicitly disallow access to the attribute from outside the >> class), is it better to still access the attribute directly a la >> Foo.bar = 10 or use a setter/getter approach like Foo.setBar(10)? >> It seems to me that option one is better, especially if I can use a >> descriptor with the attribute. >> >> Any thoughts? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Braun Brelin >> > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cappy2112 at gmail.com Tue Oct 11 17:07:29 2016 From: cappy2112 at gmail.com (Tony Cappellini) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 14:07:29 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] What's the "Pythonic" way to access class attributes? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'm surprise that properties wasn't brought up. https://docs.python.org/3/howto/descriptor.html#properties http://www.python-course.eu/python3_properties.php On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:29 AM, Braun Brelin wrote: > Hello all, > > I just wanted to get the list's opinion on something. > > Since Python doesn't really have the concept of private and protected > attribute access protections a la Java or C++ (Yes, I know you can use > the __ and _ prefixes to declare something private or protected in > Python, but that really only does name-mangling on the attribute name > rather than explicitly disallow access to the attribute from outside the > class), is it better to still access the attribute directly a la > Foo.bar = 10 or use a setter/getter approach like Foo.setBar(10)? > It seems to me that option one is better, especially if I can use a > descriptor with the attribute. > > Any thoughts? > > Thanks, > > Braun Brelin > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies From wescpy at gmail.com Tue Oct 11 22:54:44 2016 From: wescpy at gmail.com (wescpy at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 22:54:44 -0400 Subject: [Baypiggies] What's the "Pythonic" way to access class attributes? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: - Python is not Java - use Foo.bar = 10 - Yep, there's no private, protected, nor friend in Python - Use __slots__ if you want some to set some protection (although it wasn't created for security) - Use properties to implement custom set, get(, and del) behavior (h/t to Tony) - Use descriptors if properties don't do the job (properties == descriptor shortcut) Cheers, --Wesley On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 5:07 PM, Tony Cappellini wrote: > I'm surprise that properties wasn't brought up. > > https://docs.python.org/3/howto/descriptor.html#properties > > http://www.python-course.eu/python3_properties.php > > > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:29 AM, Braun Brelin wrote: > > Hello all, > > > > I just wanted to get the list's opinion on something. > > > > Since Python doesn't really have the concept of private and protected > > attribute access protections a la Java or C++ (Yes, I know you can use > > the __ and _ prefixes to declare something private or protected in > > Python, but that really only does name-mangling on the attribute name > > rather than explicitly disallow access to the attribute from outside the > > class), is it better to still access the attribute directly a la > > Foo.bar = 10 or use a setter/getter approach like Foo.setBar(10)? > > It seems to me that option one is better, especially if I can use a > > descriptor with the attribute. > > > > Any thoughts? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Braun Brelin > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Baypiggies mailing list > > Baypiggies at python.org > > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -- "A computer never does what you want... only what you tell it." ~Wesley Chun -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From annaraven at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 17:47:39 2016 From: annaraven at gmail.com (Anna Ravenscroft) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 14:47:39 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? Message-ID: So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm curious to get some your input before I go further with it. Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. -- cordially, Anna -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jjinux at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 20:19:28 2016 From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 00:19:28 +0000 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I've done interviews where you pair program for 2-3 hours. I've done this twice, but neither one led to an offer. It was unpaid. However, one of them resulted in a couple life long acquaintances (including the guy who wrote the library, Jasmine), which was a bonus. For 8 hours, I doubt they'd pay you--it'd require too much paperwork. I wouldn't feel too bad about working for free for 8 hours, but I'd refuse if they wanted 2-3 days. On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 2:55 PM Anna Ravenscroft wrote: > So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial day". > Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they usually > paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm curious to > get some your input before I go further with it. > > Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. > > -- > cordially, > Anna > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pythonistaforhire at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 21:27:57 2016 From: pythonistaforhire at gmail.com (Alex McFerron) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 18:27:57 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Usually it's just hang out and interview some, collaborate some, lunch, and interview more but work on actual stuff with the team. I wouldn't sweat it. Sometimes they want you to work and then present your stuff to others at the end. Ugggg what we have to do to get jobs now days! Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 21, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens wrote: > > I've done interviews where you pair program for 2-3 hours. I've done this twice, but neither one led to an offer. It was unpaid. However, one of them resulted in a couple life long acquaintances (including the guy who wrote the library, Jasmine), which was a bonus. > > For 8 hours, I doubt they'd pay you--it'd require too much paperwork. I wouldn't feel too bad about working for free for 8 hours, but I'd refuse if they wanted 2-3 days. > >> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 2:55 PM Anna Ravenscroft wrote: >> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >> >> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >> >> -- >> cordially, >> Anna >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mahmoud at hatnote.com Fri Oct 21 21:50:50 2016 From: mahmoud at hatnote.com (Mahmoud Hashemi) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 18:50:50 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I've worked with a couple groups that did things this way. Never heard of it being paid, but I've always been a fan. Normal interviews are all so focused on whether you are good enough with a really weird power dynamic. A whole day with the team members and the code gives you a great opportunity to decide if the environment and technology is up to your own standards. Not sure if this company has the same idea in mind, but I'd like to think candidates find the longer time more amenable to relaxing and doing your own interview process. Either way, I hope it works out for you! Mahmoud https://github.com/mahmoud http://sedimental.org On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 6:27 PM, Alex McFerron wrote: > Usually it's just hang out and interview some, collaborate some, lunch, > and interview more but work on actual stuff with the team. > > I wouldn't sweat it. > > Sometimes they want you to work and then present your stuff to others at > the end. > > Ugggg what we have to do to get jobs now days! > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Oct 21, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens wrote: > > I've done interviews where you pair program for 2-3 hours. I've done this > twice, but neither one led to an offer. It was unpaid. However, one of them > resulted in a couple life long acquaintances (including the guy who wrote > the library, Jasmine), which was a bonus. > > For 8 hours, I doubt they'd pay you--it'd require too much paperwork. I > wouldn't feel too bad about working for free for 8 hours, but I'd refuse if > they wanted 2-3 days. > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 2:55 PM Anna Ravenscroft > wrote: > >> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial >> day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they >> usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm >> curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >> >> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >> >> -- >> cordially, >> Anna >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From david.berthelot at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 22:05:37 2016 From: david.berthelot at gmail.com (David Berthelot) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 19:05:37 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >From my point of view, the most important aspect is to find out if you really want to work at a place, it's always hard without knowing the people, so working with them for a day can give you more confidence in your choice. I haven't been to such an interview but I'd welcome the experience if I were looking for a position in an early startup. On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 6:50 PM, Mahmoud Hashemi wrote: > I've worked with a couple groups that did things this way. Never heard of > it being paid, but I've always been a fan. > > Normal interviews are all so focused on whether you are good enough with a > really weird power dynamic. A whole day with the team members and the code > gives you a great opportunity to decide if the environment and technology > is up to your own standards. > > Not sure if this company has the same idea in mind, but I'd like to think > candidates find the longer time more amenable to relaxing and doing your > own interview process. Either way, I hope it works out for you! > > Mahmoud > https://github.com/mahmoud > http://sedimental.org > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 6:27 PM, Alex McFerron < > pythonistaforhire at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Usually it's just hang out and interview some, collaborate some, lunch, >> and interview more but work on actual stuff with the team. >> >> I wouldn't sweat it. >> >> Sometimes they want you to work and then present your stuff to others at >> the end. >> >> Ugggg what we have to do to get jobs now days! >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Oct 21, 2016, at 5:19 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens >> wrote: >> >> I've done interviews where you pair program for 2-3 hours. I've done this >> twice, but neither one led to an offer. It was unpaid. However, one of them >> resulted in a couple life long acquaintances (including the guy who wrote >> the library, Jasmine), which was a bonus. >> >> For 8 hours, I doubt they'd pay you--it'd require too much paperwork. I >> wouldn't feel too bad about working for free for 8 hours, but I'd refuse if >> they wanted 2-3 days. >> >> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 2:55 PM Anna Ravenscroft >> wrote: >> >>> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial >>> day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they >>> usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm >>> curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >>> >>> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >>> >>> -- >>> cordially, >>> Anna >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Baypiggies mailing list >>> Baypiggies at python.org >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hasan.diwan at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 22:19:38 2016 From: hasan.diwan at gmail.com (Hasan Diwan) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 19:19:38 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get the job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off the top of my head. -- H On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" wrote: > So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial day". > Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they usually > paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm curious to > get some your input before I go further with it. > > Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. > > -- > cordially, > Anna > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sfseth at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 23:09:11 2016 From: sfseth at gmail.com (seth f) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 20:09:11 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I don't think this practice is reasonable, nor do I think a "coding challenge" is reasonable if the hiring company wants to retain rights to the code that is produced. If a hiring organization can't figure out whether or not they want you on the team from phone calls and in-person interviews, I say they're not working hard enough on figuring out how to interview candidates. If I do work that shows what I can do, that's not suddenly their property. If one assumes that there is a huge variety of technologies we might have experience with and what employers happen to have chosen, be it Docker, Xen, Vmware, Jenkins/Hudson, Salt, Ansible, Puppet, chef, CFengine, fabric, ... I haven't even gotten into databases or OS's yet... how is this practice any different from treating a candidate pool as a freebie tutoring session? I mean I'm happy to talk about this stuff, but if it occupies time where i'd otherwise be interviewing, and they're asking me to do it for free, it seems like a pretty clear exploit to me. ~seth On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Hasan Diwan wrote: > I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get the > job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off the > top of my head. -- H > > On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" wrote: > >> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial >> day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they >> usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm >> curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >> >> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >> >> -- >> cordially, >> Anna >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hasan.diwan at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 23:12:54 2016 From: hasan.diwan at gmail.com (Hasan Diwan) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 20:12:54 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Seth, I'm not sure what you're opposed to -- I was compensated for my time by the company, in addition to the salary I commanded as part of the company. -- H On 21 Oct 2016 8:09 p.m., "seth f" wrote: > > I don't think this practice is reasonable, nor do I think a "coding challenge" is reasonable if the hiring company wants to retain rights to the code that is produced. > > If a hiring organization can't figure out whether or not they want you on the team from phone calls and in-person interviews, I say they're not working hard enough on figuring out how to interview candidates. If I do work that shows what I can do, that's not suddenly their property. > > If one assumes that there is a huge variety of technologies we might have experience with and what employers happen to have chosen, be it Docker, Xen, Vmware, Jenkins/Hudson, Salt, Ansible, Puppet, chef, CFengine, fabric, ... I haven't even gotten into databases or OS's yet... how is this practice any different from treating a candidate pool as a freebie tutoring session? I mean I'm happy to talk about this stuff, but if it occupies time where i'd otherwise be interviewing, and they're asking me to do it for free, it seems like a pretty clear exploit to me. > > ~seth > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Hasan Diwan wrote: >> >> I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get the job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off the top of my head. -- H >> >> >> On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" wrote: >>> >>> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >>> >>> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >>> >>> -- >>> cordially, >>> Anna >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Baypiggies mailing list >>> Baypiggies at python.org >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sfseth at gmail.com Fri Oct 21 23:20:40 2016 From: sfseth at gmail.com (seth f) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 20:20:40 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'm opposed to sloppy hiring practices and expectation of free labor. I have no issue with an employer taking someone on with pay for short term to evaluate fit. I apologize if I sounded disparaging in some overly broad way. I have seen employers ask candidates (me for example) significant tasks and they wanted rights without compensation. That's my only issue. ~s On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 8:12 PM, Hasan Diwan wrote: > Seth, > I'm not sure what you're opposed to -- I was compensated for my time by > the company, in addition to the salary I commanded as part of the company. > -- H > > On 21 Oct 2016 8:09 p.m., "seth f" wrote: > > > > I don't think this practice is reasonable, nor do I think a "coding > challenge" is reasonable if the hiring company wants to retain rights to > the code that is produced. > > > > If a hiring organization can't figure out whether or not they want you > on the team from phone calls and in-person interviews, I say they're not > working hard enough on figuring out how to interview candidates. If I do > work that shows what I can do, that's not suddenly their property. > > > > If one assumes that there is a huge variety of technologies we might > have experience with and what employers happen to have chosen, be it > Docker, Xen, Vmware, Jenkins/Hudson, Salt, Ansible, Puppet, chef, CFengine, > fabric, ... I haven't even gotten into databases or OS's yet... how is > this practice any different from treating a candidate pool as a freebie > tutoring session? I mean I'm happy to talk about this stuff, but if it > occupies time where i'd otherwise be interviewing, and they're asking me to > do it for free, it seems like a pretty clear exploit to me. > > > > ~seth > > > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Hasan Diwan > wrote: > >> > >> I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get the > job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off the > top of my head. -- H > >> > >> > >> On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" > wrote: > >>> > >>> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial > day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they > usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm > curious to get some your input before I go further with it. > >>> > >>> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. > >>> > >>> -- > >>> cordially, > >>> Anna > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Baypiggies mailing list > >>> Baypiggies at python.org > >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Baypiggies mailing list > >> Baypiggies at python.org > >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jjinux at gmail.com Sat Oct 22 01:13:10 2016 From: jjinux at gmail.com (Shannon -jj Behrens) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 05:13:10 +0000 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Expecting people to write real code for free in the promise of a job is indeed a horrible practice. However, using real working conditions (collaboratively working with friendly co-workers) as a way of judging a candidate instead of forcing them to solve problems all day on a whiteboard seems like it could potentially be a better way of interviewing. On Fri, Oct 21, 2016, 8:20 PM seth f wrote: > I'm opposed to sloppy hiring practices and expectation of free labor. I > have no issue with an employer taking someone on with pay for short term to > evaluate fit. I apologize if I sounded disparaging in some overly broad > way. I have seen employers ask candidates (me for example) significant > tasks and they wanted rights without compensation. That's my only issue. > ~s > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 8:12 PM, Hasan Diwan > wrote: > > Seth, > I'm not sure what you're opposed to -- I was compensated for my time by > the company, in addition to the salary I commanded as part of the company. > -- H > > On 21 Oct 2016 8:09 p.m., "seth f" wrote: > > > > I don't think this practice is reasonable, nor do I think a "coding > challenge" is reasonable if the hiring company wants to retain rights to > the code that is produced. > > > > If a hiring organization can't figure out whether or not they want you > on the team from phone calls and in-person interviews, I say they're not > working hard enough on figuring out how to interview candidates. If I do > work that shows what I can do, that's not suddenly their property. > > > > If one assumes that there is a huge variety of technologies we might > have experience with and what employers happen to have chosen, be it > Docker, Xen, Vmware, Jenkins/Hudson, Salt, Ansible, Puppet, chef, CFengine, > fabric, ... I haven't even gotten into databases or OS's yet... how is > this practice any different from treating a candidate pool as a freebie > tutoring session? I mean I'm happy to talk about this stuff, but if it > occupies time where i'd otherwise be interviewing, and they're asking me to > do it for free, it seems like a pretty clear exploit to me. > > > > ~seth > > > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Hasan Diwan > wrote: > >> > >> I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get the > job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off the > top of my head. -- H > >> > >> > >> On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" > wrote: > >>> > >>> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial > day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they > usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm > curious to get some your input before I go further with it. > >>> > >>> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. > >>> > >>> -- > >>> cordially, > >>> Anna > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Baypiggies mailing list > >>> Baypiggies at python.org > >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Baypiggies mailing list > >> Baypiggies at python.org > >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From deirdre at deirdre.net Sat Oct 22 01:23:27 2016 From: deirdre at deirdre.net (Deirdre Saoirse Moen) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 07:23:27 +0200 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3B0F8D85-ADE5-4017-94EF-93EBB810C03A@deirdre.net> Personally, I'd be disinclined to a day of free labor. If you're already working, that's at significant cost, and if you're not, it costs you the opportunity of interviewing elsewhere. If that's not compensated, it shouldn't be required. Deirdre (aka founder of Baypiggies) > On Oct 22, 2016, at 7:13 AM, Shannon -jj Behrens wrote: > > Expecting people to write real code for free in the promise of a job is indeed a horrible practice. > > However, using real working conditions (collaboratively working with friendly co-workers) as a way of judging a candidate instead of forcing them to solve problems all day on a whiteboard seems like it could potentially be a better way of interviewing. > > >> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016, 8:20 PM seth f wrote: >> I'm opposed to sloppy hiring practices and expectation of free labor. I have no issue with an employer taking someone on with pay for short term to evaluate fit. I apologize if I sounded disparaging in some overly broad way. I have seen employers ask candidates (me for example) significant tasks and they wanted rights without compensation. That's my only issue. ~s >> >> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 8:12 PM, Hasan Diwan wrote: >> Seth, >> I'm not sure what you're opposed to -- I was compensated for my time by the company, in addition to the salary I commanded as part of the company. -- H >> >> >> On 21 Oct 2016 8:09 p.m., "seth f" wrote: >> > >> > I don't think this practice is reasonable, nor do I think a "coding challenge" is reasonable if the hiring company wants to retain rights to the code that is produced. >> > >> > If a hiring organization can't figure out whether or not they want you on the team from phone calls and in-person interviews, I say they're not working hard enough on figuring out how to interview candidates. If I do work that shows what I can do, that's not suddenly their property. >> > >> > If one assumes that there is a huge variety of technologies we might have experience with and what employers happen to have chosen, be it Docker, Xen, Vmware, Jenkins/Hudson, Salt, Ansible, Puppet, chef, CFengine, fabric, ... I haven't even gotten into databases or OS's yet... how is this practice any different from treating a candidate pool as a freebie tutoring session? I mean I'm happy to talk about this stuff, but if it occupies time where i'd otherwise be interviewing, and they're asking me to do it for free, it seems like a pretty clear exploit to me. >> > >> > ~seth >> > >> > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Hasan Diwan wrote: >> >> >> >> I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get the job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off the top of my head. -- H >> >> >> >> >> >> On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" wrote: >> >>> >> >>> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >> >>> >> >>> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >> >>> >> >>> -- >> >>> cordially, >> >>> Anna >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Baypiggies mailing list >> >>> Baypiggies at python.org >> >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Baypiggies mailing list >> >> Baypiggies at python.org >> >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> > >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eric at ericwalstad.com Sat Oct 22 13:47:24 2016 From: eric at ericwalstad.com (Eric Walstad) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 10:47:24 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I recently had to look for a job - the first time I had to go to interviews in over 20 years, so it was an as-new and kind of scary experience for me. I didn't do any full-days of work but I did spend some time pair-programming during the interview. That was actually a nice experience because I'm more comfortable writing code than I am talking about myself. I think being able to spend a day with potential coworkers would be awesome. A new job is like any new long-term relationship and spending a day with them before signing on is good for both parties. I don't see it as free labor (few people's first day at a new job would be net profitable for the employer) as much as it is a way for both sides to see if the relationship feels worth pursuing. Eric On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 10:13 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens wrote: > Expecting people to write real code for free in the promise of a job is > indeed a horrible practice. > > However, using real working conditions (collaboratively working with > friendly co-workers) as a way of judging a candidate instead of forcing > them to solve problems all day on a whiteboard seems like it could > potentially be a better way of interviewing. > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016, 8:20 PM seth f wrote: > >> I'm opposed to sloppy hiring practices and expectation of free labor. I >> have no issue with an employer taking someone on with pay for short term to >> evaluate fit. I apologize if I sounded disparaging in some overly broad >> way. I have seen employers ask candidates (me for example) significant >> tasks and they wanted rights without compensation. That's my only issue. >> ~s >> >> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 8:12 PM, Hasan Diwan >> wrote: >> >> Seth, >> I'm not sure what you're opposed to -- I was compensated for my time by >> the company, in addition to the salary I commanded as part of the company. >> -- H >> >> On 21 Oct 2016 8:09 p.m., "seth f" wrote: >> > >> > I don't think this practice is reasonable, nor do I think a "coding >> challenge" is reasonable if the hiring company wants to retain rights to >> the code that is produced. >> > >> > If a hiring organization can't figure out whether or not they want you >> on the team from phone calls and in-person interviews, I say they're not >> working hard enough on figuring out how to interview candidates. If I do >> work that shows what I can do, that's not suddenly their property. >> > >> > If one assumes that there is a huge variety of technologies we might >> have experience with and what employers happen to have chosen, be it >> Docker, Xen, Vmware, Jenkins/Hudson, Salt, Ansible, Puppet, chef, CFengine, >> fabric, ... I haven't even gotten into databases or OS's yet... how is >> this practice any different from treating a candidate pool as a freebie >> tutoring session? I mean I'm happy to talk about this stuff, but if it >> occupies time where i'd otherwise be interviewing, and they're asking me to >> do it for free, it seems like a pretty clear exploit to me. >> > >> > ~seth >> > >> > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Hasan Diwan >> wrote: >> >> >> >> I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get >> the job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off >> the top of my head. -- H >> >> >> >> >> >> On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial >> day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they >> usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm >> curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >> >>> >> >>> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >> >>> >> >>> -- >> >>> cordially, >> >>> Anna >> >>> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Baypiggies mailing list >> >>> Baypiggies at python.org >> >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Baypiggies mailing list >> >> Baypiggies at python.org >> >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> > >> > >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wescpy at gmail.com Sat Oct 22 15:02:26 2016 From: wescpy at gmail.com (wescpy at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 12:02:26 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Pretty sure these aren't paid either. It's like a follow-up on-site 8-hour interview in a slightly different form factor. However, this concept is new to me... first time I've ever heard of such a thing. Cheers, -Wesley Sent from one of my many mobile devices. On Oct 22, 2016 10:47 AM, "Eric Walstad" wrote: > I recently had to look for a job - the first time I had to go to > interviews in over 20 years, so it was an as-new and kind of scary > experience for me. I didn't do any full-days of work but I did spend some > time pair-programming during the interview. That was actually a nice > experience because I'm more comfortable writing code than I am talking > about myself. I think being able to spend a day with potential coworkers > would be awesome. A new job is like any new long-term relationship and > spending a day with them before signing on is good for both parties. I > don't see it as free labor (few people's first day at a new job would be > net profitable for the employer) as much as it is a way for both sides to > see if the relationship feels worth pursuing. > > Eric > > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 10:13 PM, Shannon -jj Behrens > wrote: > >> Expecting people to write real code for free in the promise of a job is >> indeed a horrible practice. >> >> However, using real working conditions (collaboratively working with >> friendly co-workers) as a way of judging a candidate instead of forcing >> them to solve problems all day on a whiteboard seems like it could >> potentially be a better way of interviewing. >> >> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016, 8:20 PM seth f wrote: >> >>> I'm opposed to sloppy hiring practices and expectation of free labor. I >>> have no issue with an employer taking someone on with pay for short term to >>> evaluate fit. I apologize if I sounded disparaging in some overly broad >>> way. I have seen employers ask candidates (me for example) significant >>> tasks and they wanted rights without compensation. That's my only issue. >>> ~s >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 8:12 PM, Hasan Diwan >>> wrote: >>> >>> Seth, >>> I'm not sure what you're opposed to -- I was compensated for my time by >>> the company, in addition to the salary I commanded as part of the company. >>> -- H >>> >>> On 21 Oct 2016 8:09 p.m., "seth f" wrote: >>> > >>> > I don't think this practice is reasonable, nor do I think a "coding >>> challenge" is reasonable if the hiring company wants to retain rights to >>> the code that is produced. >>> > >>> > If a hiring organization can't figure out whether or not they want you >>> on the team from phone calls and in-person interviews, I say they're not >>> working hard enough on figuring out how to interview candidates. If I do >>> work that shows what I can do, that's not suddenly their property. >>> > >>> > If one assumes that there is a huge variety of technologies we might >>> have experience with and what employers happen to have chosen, be it >>> Docker, Xen, Vmware, Jenkins/Hudson, Salt, Ansible, Puppet, chef, CFengine, >>> fabric, ... I haven't even gotten into databases or OS's yet... how is >>> this practice any different from treating a candidate pool as a freebie >>> tutoring session? I mean I'm happy to talk about this stuff, but if it >>> occupies time where i'd otherwise be interviewing, and they're asking me to >>> do it for free, it seems like a pretty clear exploit to me. >>> > >>> > ~seth >>> > >>> > On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Hasan Diwan >>> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> I remember when I interviewed for a company, did a quiz, didn't get >>> the job, but was compensated for my time. Not sure what the company was off >>> the top of my head. -- H >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> On 21 Oct 2016 2:56 p.m., "Anna Ravenscroft" >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial >>> day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they >>> usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm >>> curious to get some your input before I go further with it. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> cordially, >>> >>> Anna >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Baypiggies mailing list >>> >>> Baypiggies at python.org >>> >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >>> >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> Baypiggies mailing list >>> >> Baypiggies at python.org >>> >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >>> >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Baypiggies mailing list >>> Baypiggies at python.org >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Baypiggies mailing list >>> Baypiggies at python.org >>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Baypiggies mailing list >> Baypiggies at python.org >> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From samanthazeitlin at gmail.com Sat Oct 22 17:56:38 2016 From: samanthazeitlin at gmail.com (Samantha Zeitlin) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 14:56:38 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Job Trial day In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <580BE096.9080309@gmail.com> Hi Anna, I did a couple of interviews like this. None resulted in an offer, but maybe that's just me - I tend to do better with take-homes, and actually prefer the ones that are 2-3 days because it gives me time to sleep on the problem and revisit/revise. The nice thing about a trial day is that it gives you an idea of what the work environment is like - do people look you in the eye? Are they friendly? Is it noisy? etc. Sometimes when you just visit for a formal interview, they keep you in conference rooms all day, and you don't even see where you'd be sitting if you joined. A great example - I interviewed at a food science company, and had not considered that because it's an open office, adjacent to the food labs, in addition to lots of noise, there are smells wafting through the space all day! I agree that it feels like it should be remunerated, especially in the case where they don't hire you. Even an honorarium would be nice - I try to view it as, they're usually feeding me lunch, and I usually learn something. I wouldn't do it if I didn't think it would be useful or I wasn't really interested in the job. Good luck with your interviews! Sam Today's Topics: 1. Job "trial day"? (Anna Ravenscroft) 2. Re: Job "trial day"? (Shannon -jj Behrens) 3. Re: Job "trial day"? (Alex McFerron) 4. Re: Job "trial day"? (Mahmoud Hashemi) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 14:47:39 -0700 From: Anna Ravenscroft To: Baypiggies Subject: [Baypiggies] Job "trial day"? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" So, this company I interviewed with wants to set up an 8 hour "trial day". Has anyone had one of these? What's your experience? And are they usually paid or unpaid? They haven't mentioned either way yet and I'm curious to get some your input before I go further with it. Thanks in advance. Feel free to email me offlist. -- Samantha G. Zeitlin, PhD github: http://github.com.szeitlin blog: http://codrspace/szeitlin linkedin: http://linkedin.com/in/sgzeitlin microscopy: http://samzeitlin.com scientific publications on google scholar: http://bit.ly/zeitlin_papers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shortdudey123 at gmail.com Sun Oct 23 16:21:33 2016 From: shortdudey123 at gmail.com (Grant Ridder) Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2016 13:21:33 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] [Organizers] count this week Message-ID: Hey Everyone, I will be unable to attend this Thursday due to things with work. Since I normally take an attendance count, someone else will need to do so. You can email me with the number and i can send it out, or you can reply to the "Talk attendance numbers for 2016" thread. Thanks! -Grant -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From glen at glenjarvis.com Wed Oct 26 23:56:40 2016 From: glen at glenjarvis.com (Glen Jarvis) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2016 20:56:40 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] BAyPIGgies Meeting: REMINDER We're in a NEW location Message-ID: REMINDER: We are no longer in the place that we have been Meeting the past few years!! I would feel bad if you went to the old location by mistake. Also, we have LIMITED SEATING this Thursday night. SEATING ======== There are only 60 chairs this meeting. We only found this out the past few days. I have reached out to the people who RSVPd already ( https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and asked everyone to update their RSVP if they weren't going. There were some awesome people who updated their RSVPs so that we can better plan. I get the feeling that a few people who wanted to come were being generous and updated their RSVP to "No" to make room for others. [That's so generous. But, I really only wanted people to keep their RSVP accurate, not discourage our thoughtful members from coming]. So, here is what I know: * We have 186 people who RSVPd yes * Our ratio of RSVP and attendance has been: Date | RSVP | Attendance | Ratio =======+======+============+====== Jan 28 | 298 | 105 | 35 % Feb 25 | 308 | 140 | 45 % Mar 24 | 181 | 60 | 33 % Apr 28 | 187 | 110 | 59 % May 26 | 136 | 35 | 26 % Jun 23 | 260 | 115 | 44 % Jul 21 | 217 | 85 | 39 % Aug 25 | 374 | 140 | 37 % Sep 22 | 230 | 150 | 65 % So, our maximum (with lots of RSVP chasing and a wait list) was 65%. Our minimum (with I think a traffic Jam and concert problems) was 26%. Median was 39%. So, with 186 RSVPs, we should have between 48 and 120 attendees. I think it will be much closer (or below) our median because of our new space and because our good RSVP'ers have yielded their spot. I believe that we will have just enough chairs for this RSVP list. But, it's hard to predict [And, *this* is why we like everyone to keep their RSVP up to date ;)] With that said, I wouldn't be surprised if there were unfilled seats. We will NOT TURN ANYONE AWAY (unless we get above 200 (fire code) and have to). So, if you don't mind standing or sitting on the floor, feel free. You may even be able to get a seat. PRIORITY SEATING will be given to those who RSVPd Yes. That's as transparent as I can possibly be -- and all that I know about seating. I will stand and give my seat to another. RSVP LINK ========= https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/ LOCATION ======== We will be at 580 North Mary Avenue (THIS MEETING ONLY). I will do my best to help people get to the location. Feel free to email or call (I can send you my number) if you get lost or stuck. Also, post on the messages here ( https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and the community will be watching to help you. Here is an awesome map: https://goo.gl/uw0x0R? VIDEO RECORDING ================ We normally get our meetings recorded by LinkedIn. If we can't get our normal recording, we can do a screencast and audio recording. We'll do our best to capture this for you. VOLUNTEERS ============ You awesome volunteers that have been helping since January of this year. We may have more cat herding than normal, so I could always use the assistance. Find me at the meeting if you can help. AUTHOR'S ABSTRACT ================== Ever want to know what is behind the "Internet of Things" hype? Back in February, I wanted to as well, so I embarked on a side project to learn more. This talk is the story of my journey, using, of course, my favorite programming language, Python. In this talk, I will take you through my project, a lighting replay system. I captured light sensor data (using Micropython and the ESP8266) in three rooms of my house. I then analyzed the data using Jupyter notebooks, Numpy, Pandas, and Scikit-learn. My goal was to replay realistic light usage when my family and I are out of town. After exploring several machine learning approaches, I settled on Hidden Markov Models (using Hmmlearn). I now have a simple application that runs on my Raspberry Pi and controls Phillips Hue lights based on the learned model. Along the way, I played around with hardware for the first time since college and co-developed an open source data filtering framework, called AntEvents (joint work with Rupak Majumdar of the Max Planck Institute for Software Systems). SPEAKER ======== Jeff Fischer has held developer, management, and research roles in small and large companies. He currently is consulting for a commercial research laboratory, advising them on how to spin-off a healthcare IoT project. Previously, he was co-founder and VP of Engineering at Quaddra Software, a file analytics startup. He has a PhD in Computer Science from UCLA, focused on programming languages and software verification. His current technical interests include IoT analytics, distributed systems, and programming languages. Jeff first came across Python in the last century, and liked it much better than the alternative he was using at the time (which seemed to resemble modem line noise). He has tried to work Python into his projects ever since. He is the co-organizer of BayPiggies and looks forward to the great talks and the enthusiastic audience at our monthly meetings. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From glen at glenjarvis.com Thu Oct 27 19:28:57 2016 From: glen at glenjarvis.com (Glen Jarvis) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 16:28:57 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] BAyPIGgies Meeting: REMINDER We're in a NEW location In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: UPDATE ======= Attendance prediction is between 39 and 96 people. The new RSVP update is 148. So, using our past history as a measure, I came up with the above predictions. Or, with this unusual situation we may have a higher or lower than normal Attendance / RSVP ratio. It's really hard to say. My gut tells me it'll be lower and there will be way plenty of chairs. But, my gut has been wrong before :) Regardless, we aren't turning anyone way.... We just may have a shortage of chairs. Thanks for your patience and generosity everyone! Cheers, Glen On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 8:56 PM, Glen Jarvis wrote: > REMINDER: We are no longer in the place that we have been Meeting the past > few years!! I would feel bad if you went to the old location by mistake. > > Also, we have LIMITED SEATING this Thursday night. > > > SEATING > ======== > There are only 60 chairs this meeting. We only found this out the past few > days. I have reached out to the people who RSVPd already ( > https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and asked everyone > to update their RSVP if they weren't going. > > There were some awesome people who updated their RSVPs so that we can > better plan. I get the feeling that a few people who wanted to come were > being generous and updated their RSVP to "No" to make room for others. > [That's so generous. But, I really only wanted people to keep their RSVP > accurate, not discourage our thoughtful members from coming]. > > So, here is what I know: > > * We have 186 people who RSVPd yes > * Our ratio of RSVP and attendance has been: > > > Date | RSVP | Attendance | Ratio > =======+======+============+====== > Jan 28 | 298 | 105 | 35 % > Feb 25 | 308 | 140 | 45 % > Mar 24 | 181 | 60 | 33 % > Apr 28 | 187 | 110 | 59 % > May 26 | 136 | 35 | 26 % > Jun 23 | 260 | 115 | 44 % > Jul 21 | 217 | 85 | 39 % > Aug 25 | 374 | 140 | 37 % > Sep 22 | 230 | 150 | 65 % > > > So, our maximum (with lots of RSVP chasing and a wait list) was 65%. Our > minimum (with I think a traffic Jam and concert problems) was 26%. Median > was 39%. > > So, with 186 RSVPs, we should have between 48 and 120 attendees. I think > it will be much closer (or below) our median because of our new space and > because our good RSVP'ers have yielded their spot. > > I believe that we will have just enough chairs for this RSVP list. But, > it's hard to predict [And, *this* is why we like everyone to keep their > RSVP up to date ;)] > > > With that said, I wouldn't be surprised if there were unfilled seats. We > will NOT TURN ANYONE AWAY (unless we get above 200 (fire code) and have to). > > So, if you don't mind standing or sitting on the floor, feel free. You may > even be able to get a seat. > > PRIORITY SEATING will be given to those who RSVPd Yes. > > > That's as transparent as I can possibly be -- and all that I know about > seating. I will stand and give my seat to another. > > RSVP LINK > ========= > > https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/ > > > LOCATION > ======== > > We will be at 580 North Mary Avenue (THIS MEETING ONLY). I will do my best > to help people get to the location. Feel free to email or call (I can send > you my number) if you get lost or stuck. Also, post on the messages here ( > https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and the community > will be watching to help you. > > Here is an awesome map: > > https://goo.gl/uw0x0R? > > > > VIDEO RECORDING > ================ > > We normally get our meetings recorded by LinkedIn. If we can't get our > normal recording, we can do a screencast and audio recording. We'll do our > best to capture this for you. > > > VOLUNTEERS > ============ > > You awesome volunteers that have been helping since January of this year. > We may have more cat herding than normal, so I could always use the > assistance. Find me at the meeting if you can help. > > > AUTHOR'S ABSTRACT > ================== > Ever want to know what is behind the "Internet of Things" hype? Back in > February, I wanted to as well, so I embarked on a side project to learn > more. This talk is the story of my journey, using, of course, my favorite > programming language, Python. > > In this talk, I will take you through my project, a lighting replay > system. I captured light sensor data (using Micropython and the ESP8266) in > three rooms of my house. I then analyzed the data using Jupyter notebooks, > Numpy, Pandas, and Scikit-learn. My goal was to replay realistic light > usage when my family and I are out of town. After exploring several machine > learning approaches, I settled on Hidden Markov Models (using Hmmlearn). I > now have a simple application that runs on my Raspberry Pi and controls > Phillips Hue lights based on the learned model. Along the way, I played > around with hardware for the first time since college and co-developed an > open source data filtering framework, called AntEvents (joint work with > Rupak Majumdar of the Max Planck Institute for Software Systems). > > > SPEAKER > ======== > Jeff Fischer has held developer, management, and research roles in small > and large companies. He currently is consulting for a commercial research > laboratory, advising them on how to spin-off a healthcare IoT project. > Previously, he was co-founder and VP of Engineering at Quaddra Software, a > file analytics startup. He has a PhD in Computer Science from UCLA, focused > on programming languages and software verification. His current technical > interests include IoT analytics, distributed systems, and programming > languages. > > > Jeff first came across Python in the last century, and liked it much > better than the alternative he was using at the time (which seemed to > resemble modem line noise). He has tried to work Python into his projects > ever since. He is the co-organizer of BayPiggies and looks forward to the > great talks and the enthusiastic audience at our monthly meetings. > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From glen at glenjarvis.com Thu Oct 27 21:50:14 2016 From: glen at glenjarvis.com (Glen Jarvis) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 18:50:14 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] BAyPIGgies Meeting: REMINDER We're in a NEW location In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: UPDATE #2 ========= There's PLENTY of space! (My gut was right :) This is awesome! There are a ton of sofas in addition to the chairs. Also, to get in the building. From what appears to be the main entrance, follow the "Visitors" signs to the Visitor's entrance. Security guards will let you in. Then, take the elevator to the 5th floor. I'll be waiting out front to help people who need it. Cheers, Glen On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 4:28 PM, Glen Jarvis wrote: > UPDATE > ======= > > Attendance prediction is between 39 and 96 people. The new RSVP update is > 148. > > So, using our past history as a measure, I came up with the above > predictions. > > Or, with this unusual situation we may have a higher or lower than normal > Attendance / RSVP ratio. It's really hard to say. > > My gut tells me it'll be lower and there will be way plenty of chairs. > But, my gut has been wrong before :) > > Regardless, we aren't turning anyone way.... We just may have a shortage > of chairs. > > Thanks for your patience and generosity everyone! > > > Cheers, > > > Glen > > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 8:56 PM, Glen Jarvis wrote: > >> REMINDER: We are no longer in the place that we have been Meeting the >> past few years!! I would feel bad if you went to the old location by >> mistake. >> >> Also, we have LIMITED SEATING this Thursday night. >> >> >> SEATING >> ======== >> There are only 60 chairs this meeting. We only found this out the past >> few days. I have reached out to the people who RSVPd already ( >> https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and asked everyone >> to update their RSVP if they weren't going. >> >> There were some awesome people who updated their RSVPs so that we can >> better plan. I get the feeling that a few people who wanted to come were >> being generous and updated their RSVP to "No" to make room for others. >> [That's so generous. But, I really only wanted people to keep their RSVP >> accurate, not discourage our thoughtful members from coming]. >> >> So, here is what I know: >> >> * We have 186 people who RSVPd yes >> * Our ratio of RSVP and attendance has been: >> >> >> Date | RSVP | Attendance | Ratio >> =======+======+============+====== >> Jan 28 | 298 | 105 | 35 % >> Feb 25 | 308 | 140 | 45 % >> Mar 24 | 181 | 60 | 33 % >> Apr 28 | 187 | 110 | 59 % >> May 26 | 136 | 35 | 26 % >> Jun 23 | 260 | 115 | 44 % >> Jul 21 | 217 | 85 | 39 % >> Aug 25 | 374 | 140 | 37 % >> Sep 22 | 230 | 150 | 65 % >> >> >> So, our maximum (with lots of RSVP chasing and a wait list) was 65%. Our >> minimum (with I think a traffic Jam and concert problems) was 26%. Median >> was 39%. >> >> So, with 186 RSVPs, we should have between 48 and 120 attendees. I think >> it will be much closer (or below) our median because of our new space and >> because our good RSVP'ers have yielded their spot. >> >> I believe that we will have just enough chairs for this RSVP list. But, >> it's hard to predict [And, *this* is why we like everyone to keep their >> RSVP up to date ;)] >> >> >> With that said, I wouldn't be surprised if there were unfilled seats. We >> will NOT TURN ANYONE AWAY (unless we get above 200 (fire code) and have to). >> >> So, if you don't mind standing or sitting on the floor, feel free. You >> may even be able to get a seat. >> >> PRIORITY SEATING will be given to those who RSVPd Yes. >> >> >> That's as transparent as I can possibly be -- and all that I know about >> seating. I will stand and give my seat to another. >> >> RSVP LINK >> ========= >> >> https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/ >> >> >> LOCATION >> ======== >> >> We will be at 580 North Mary Avenue (THIS MEETING ONLY). I will do my >> best to help people get to the location. Feel free to email or call (I can >> send you my number) if you get lost or stuck. Also, post on the messages >> here (https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and the >> community will be watching to help you. >> >> Here is an awesome map: >> >> https://goo.gl/uw0x0R? >> >> >> >> VIDEO RECORDING >> ================ >> >> We normally get our meetings recorded by LinkedIn. If we can't get our >> normal recording, we can do a screencast and audio recording. We'll do our >> best to capture this for you. >> >> >> VOLUNTEERS >> ============ >> >> You awesome volunteers that have been helping since January of this year. >> We may have more cat herding than normal, so I could always use the >> assistance. Find me at the meeting if you can help. >> >> >> AUTHOR'S ABSTRACT >> ================== >> Ever want to know what is behind the "Internet of Things" hype? Back in >> February, I wanted to as well, so I embarked on a side project to learn >> more. This talk is the story of my journey, using, of course, my favorite >> programming language, Python. >> >> In this talk, I will take you through my project, a lighting replay >> system. I captured light sensor data (using Micropython and the ESP8266) in >> three rooms of my house. I then analyzed the data using Jupyter notebooks, >> Numpy, Pandas, and Scikit-learn. My goal was to replay realistic light >> usage when my family and I are out of town. After exploring several machine >> learning approaches, I settled on Hidden Markov Models (using Hmmlearn). I >> now have a simple application that runs on my Raspberry Pi and controls >> Phillips Hue lights based on the learned model. Along the way, I played >> around with hardware for the first time since college and co-developed an >> open source data filtering framework, called AntEvents (joint work with >> Rupak Majumdar of the Max Planck Institute for Software Systems). >> >> >> SPEAKER >> ======== >> Jeff Fischer has held developer, management, and research roles in small >> and large companies. He currently is consulting for a commercial research >> laboratory, advising them on how to spin-off a healthcare IoT project. >> Previously, he was co-founder and VP of Engineering at Quaddra Software, a >> file analytics startup. He has a PhD in Computer Science from UCLA, focused >> on programming languages and software verification. His current technical >> interests include IoT analytics, distributed systems, and programming >> languages. >> >> >> Jeff first came across Python in the last century, and liked it much >> better than the alternative he was using at the time (which seemed to >> resemble modem line noise). He has tried to work Python into his projects >> ever since. He is the co-organizer of BayPiggies and looks forward to the >> great talks and the enthusiastic audience at our monthly meetings. >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eddymul at gmail.com Thu Oct 27 22:03:32 2016 From: eddymul at gmail.com (Eddy Mulyono) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 19:03:32 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] BAyPIGgies Meeting: REMINDER We're in a NEW location In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The unlocked door is at Dropped Pin https://goo.gl/maps/4XF76X35fEU2 On Oct 27, 2016 6:50 PM, "Glen Jarvis" wrote: > UPDATE #2 > ========= > > There's PLENTY of space! (My gut was right :) This is awesome! There are > a ton of sofas in addition to the chairs. > > > Also, to get in the building. From what appears to be the main entrance, > follow the "Visitors" signs to the Visitor's entrance. Security guards will > let you in. Then, take the elevator to the 5th floor. > > > I'll be waiting out front to help people who need it. > > > Cheers, > > > Glen > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 4:28 PM, Glen Jarvis wrote: > >> UPDATE >> ======= >> >> Attendance prediction is between 39 and 96 people. The new RSVP update is >> 148. >> >> So, using our past history as a measure, I came up with the above >> predictions. >> >> Or, with this unusual situation we may have a higher or lower than >> normal Attendance / RSVP ratio. It's really hard to say. >> >> My gut tells me it'll be lower and there will be way plenty of chairs. >> But, my gut has been wrong before :) >> >> Regardless, we aren't turning anyone way.... We just may have a shortage >> of chairs. >> >> Thanks for your patience and generosity everyone! >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> >> Glen >> >> >> On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 8:56 PM, Glen Jarvis wrote: >> >>> REMINDER: We are no longer in the place that we have been Meeting the >>> past few years!! I would feel bad if you went to the old location by >>> mistake. >>> >>> Also, we have LIMITED SEATING this Thursday night. >>> >>> >>> SEATING >>> ======== >>> There are only 60 chairs this meeting. We only found this out the past >>> few days. I have reached out to the people who RSVPd already ( >>> https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and asked everyone >>> to update their RSVP if they weren't going. >>> >>> There were some awesome people who updated their RSVPs so that we can >>> better plan. I get the feeling that a few people who wanted to come were >>> being generous and updated their RSVP to "No" to make room for others. >>> [That's so generous. But, I really only wanted people to keep their RSVP >>> accurate, not discourage our thoughtful members from coming]. >>> >>> So, here is what I know: >>> >>> * We have 186 people who RSVPd yes >>> * Our ratio of RSVP and attendance has been: >>> >>> >>> Date | RSVP | Attendance | Ratio >>> =======+======+============+====== >>> Jan 28 | 298 | 105 | 35 % >>> Feb 25 | 308 | 140 | 45 % >>> Mar 24 | 181 | 60 | 33 % >>> Apr 28 | 187 | 110 | 59 % >>> May 26 | 136 | 35 | 26 % >>> Jun 23 | 260 | 115 | 44 % >>> Jul 21 | 217 | 85 | 39 % >>> Aug 25 | 374 | 140 | 37 % >>> Sep 22 | 230 | 150 | 65 % >>> >>> >>> So, our maximum (with lots of RSVP chasing and a wait list) was 65%. Our >>> minimum (with I think a traffic Jam and concert problems) was 26%. Median >>> was 39%. >>> >>> So, with 186 RSVPs, we should have between 48 and 120 attendees. I think >>> it will be much closer (or below) our median because of our new space and >>> because our good RSVP'ers have yielded their spot. >>> >>> I believe that we will have just enough chairs for this RSVP list. But, >>> it's hard to predict [And, *this* is why we like everyone to keep their >>> RSVP up to date ;)] >>> >>> >>> With that said, I wouldn't be surprised if there were unfilled seats. We >>> will NOT TURN ANYONE AWAY (unless we get above 200 (fire code) and have to). >>> >>> So, if you don't mind standing or sitting on the floor, feel free. You >>> may even be able to get a seat. >>> >>> PRIORITY SEATING will be given to those who RSVPd Yes. >>> >>> >>> That's as transparent as I can possibly be -- and all that I know about >>> seating. I will stand and give my seat to another. >>> >>> RSVP LINK >>> ========= >>> >>> https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/ >>> >>> >>> LOCATION >>> ======== >>> >>> We will be at 580 North Mary Avenue (THIS MEETING ONLY). I will do my >>> best to help people get to the location. Feel free to email or call (I can >>> send you my number) if you get lost or stuck. Also, post on the messages >>> here (https://www.meetup.com/BAyPIGgies/events/228274916/) and the >>> community will be watching to help you. >>> >>> Here is an awesome map: >>> >>> https://goo.gl/uw0x0R? >>> >>> >>> >>> VIDEO RECORDING >>> ================ >>> >>> We normally get our meetings recorded by LinkedIn. If we can't get our >>> normal recording, we can do a screencast and audio recording. We'll do our >>> best to capture this for you. >>> >>> >>> VOLUNTEERS >>> ============ >>> >>> You awesome volunteers that have been helping since January of this >>> year. We may have more cat herding than normal, so I could always use the >>> assistance. Find me at the meeting if you can help. >>> >>> >>> AUTHOR'S ABSTRACT >>> ================== >>> Ever want to know what is behind the "Internet of Things" hype? Back in >>> February, I wanted to as well, so I embarked on a side project to learn >>> more. This talk is the story of my journey, using, of course, my favorite >>> programming language, Python. >>> >>> In this talk, I will take you through my project, a lighting replay >>> system. I captured light sensor data (using Micropython and the ESP8266) in >>> three rooms of my house. I then analyzed the data using Jupyter notebooks, >>> Numpy, Pandas, and Scikit-learn. My goal was to replay realistic light >>> usage when my family and I are out of town. After exploring several machine >>> learning approaches, I settled on Hidden Markov Models (using Hmmlearn). I >>> now have a simple application that runs on my Raspberry Pi and controls >>> Phillips Hue lights based on the learned model. Along the way, I played >>> around with hardware for the first time since college and co-developed an >>> open source data filtering framework, called AntEvents (joint work with >>> Rupak Majumdar of the Max Planck Institute for Software Systems). >>> >>> >>> SPEAKER >>> ======== >>> Jeff Fischer has held developer, management, and research roles in small >>> and large companies. He currently is consulting for a commercial research >>> laboratory, advising them on how to spin-off a healthcare IoT project. >>> Previously, he was co-founder and VP of Engineering at Quaddra Software, a >>> file analytics startup. He has a PhD in Computer Science from UCLA, focused >>> on programming languages and software verification. His current technical >>> interests include IoT analytics, distributed systems, and programming >>> languages. >>> >>> >>> Jeff first came across Python in the last century, and liked it much >>> better than the alternative he was using at the time (which seemed to >>> resemble modem line noise). He has tried to work Python into his projects >>> ever since. He is the co-organizer of BayPiggies and looks forward to the >>> great talks and the enthusiastic audience at our monthly meetings. >>> >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From glen at glenjarvis.com Thu Oct 27 22:29:46 2016 From: glen at glenjarvis.com (Glen Jarvis) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 19:29:46 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Talk attendance numbers for 2016 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM ) Jan 28 - 105 (298) Feb 25 - 140 (308) Mar 24 - 60 (181) Apr 28 - 110 (187) May 26 - 35 (136) Jun 23 - 115 (260) Jul 21 - 85 (217) Aug 25 - 140 (374) Sep 22 - 150 (230 + waitlist) Oct 27 - 75 (135) Nov 17 - Dec 15 - On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 7:45 PM, Grant Ridder wrote: > Updated with tonights meetup > > DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM) > Jan 28 - 105 (298) > Feb 25 - 140 (308) > Mar 24 - 60 (181) > Apr 28 - 110 (187) > May 26 - 35 (136) > Jun 23 - 115 (260) > Jul 21 - 85 (217) > Aug 25 - 140 (374) > Sep 22 - 150 (230 + waitlist) > Oct 27 - > Nov 17 - > Dec 15 - > > -Grant > > On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 7:35 PM, Grant Ridder > wrote: > >> Updated with tonights meetup >> >> DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM) >> Jan 28 - 105 (298) >> Feb 25 - 140 (308) >> Mar 24 - 60 (181) >> Apr 28 - 110 (187) >> May 26 - 35 (136) >> Jun 23 - 115 (260) >> Jul 21 - 85 (217) >> Aug 25 - 140 (374) >> Sep 22 - >> Oct 27 - >> >> -Grant >> >> On Thu, Jul 21, 2016 at 7:38 PM, Grant Ridder >> wrote: >> >>> Updated with tonights meetup >>> >>> DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM) >>> Jan 28 - 105 (298) >>> Feb 25 - 140 (308) >>> Mar 24 - 60 (181) >>> Apr 28 - 110 (187) >>> May 26 - 35 (136) >>> Jun 23 - 115 (260) >>> Jul 21 - 85 (217) >>> Aug 25 - >>> Sep 22 - >>> Oct 27 - >>> >>> -Grant >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Jun 23, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Grant Ridder >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Updated with tonights meetup >>>> >>>> DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM) >>>> Jan 28 - 105 (298) >>>> Feb 25 - 140 (308) >>>> Mar 24 - 60 (181) >>>> Apr 28 - 110 (187) >>>> May 26 - 35 (136) >>>> Jun 23 - 115 (260) >>>> Jul 28 - >>>> Aug 25 - >>>> Sep 22 - >>>> Oct 27 - >>>> >>>> -Grant >>>> >>>> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 10:24 PM, Grant Ridder >>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>> Updated with tonights meetup >>>>> Attendance was pretty low tonight most likely due to the traffic >>>>> casused by the Shoreline concert >>>>> >>>>> July 28 is a Keith Urban concert so we may want to change the date on >>>>> that >>>>> The rest of the dates are clean on the shoreline amphitheatre show >>>>> shedule >>>>> >>>>> DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM) >>>>> Jan 28 - 105 (298) >>>>> Feb 25 - 140 (308) >>>>> Mar 24 - 60 (181) >>>>> Apr 28 - 110 (187) >>>>> May 26 - 35 (136) >>>>> Jun 23 - >>>>> Jul 28 - >>>>> Aug 25 - >>>>> Sep 22 - >>>>> Oct 27 - >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Apr 28, 2016 at 8:11 PM, Grant Ridder >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Updated with tonights meetup >>>>>> >>>>>> DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM ) >>>>>> Jan 28 - 105 (298) >>>>>> Feb 25 - 140 (308) >>>>>> Mar 24 - 60 (181) >>>>>> Apr 28 - 110 (187) >>>>>> May 26 - >>>>>> Jun 23 - >>>>>> Jul 28 - >>>>>> Aug 25 - >>>>>> Sep 22 - >>>>>> Oct 27 - >>>>>> >>>>>> -Grant >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 11:18 AM, Grant Ridder < >>>>>> shortdudey123 at gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Ah, thanks for the correction Glen! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -Grant >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 7:46 AM, Glen Jarvis >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Slight correction, these numbers for "YES" on MeetUp can be >>>>>>>> adjusted by attendance after the fact. For example, We had almost 300 YESs >>>>>>>> in January. But, when I was given the attendance number (I thought 110), I >>>>>>>> told MeetUp how many people attended. This "attendance" reflects reality >>>>>>>> and not the people who sign up. About 1/3 to 2/3 of the people who sign up >>>>>>>> actually attend (and they aren't always the same people who signed up :) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> So, a "YES" of around 300 is about perfect for us -- it gets us >>>>>>>> close to filling the room. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If you adjust the 110 back to the 298 (if I remember right), the >>>>>>>> numbers and ratio is about like this: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 105 / 298 = 35% >>>>>>>> 140 / 308 = 45% >>>>>>>> 60 / 181 = 33% >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Glen >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> DATE - ATTENDED (YES'S ON MEETUP.COM) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Jan 28 - 105 (110) >>>>>>>>> Feb 25 - 140 (308) >>>>>>>>> Mar 24 - 60 (181) >>>>>>>>> Apr 28 - >>>>>>>>> May 26 - >>>>>>>>> Jun 23 - >>>>>>>>> Jul 28 - >>>>>>>>> Aug 25 - >>>>>>>>> Sep 22 - >>>>>>>>> Oct 27 - >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -Grant >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Baypiggies mailing list >>>>>>>>> Baypiggies at python.org >>>>>>>>> To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: >>>>>>>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Machines take me by surprise with great frequency. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> --Alan Turing >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> .>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++.>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++++.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>+++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>+++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>+++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>+++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> +.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>>>>> ++++++++++++.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Baypiggies mailing list > Baypiggies at python.org > To change your subscription options or unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/baypiggies > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeffrey.fischer at gmail.com Fri Oct 28 18:35:06 2016 From: jeffrey.fischer at gmail.com (Jeff Fischer) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 15:35:06 -0700 Subject: [Baypiggies] Slides from last night's talk Message-ID: The slides from my talk on Python and IoT are here (pdf) . There is a summary of the project on my blog: https://data-ken.org/lighting-replay-app.html Thanks for coming! If anyone actually tries to build something on their own, I'd love to hear about it. Sorry about the seating issues -- LinkedIn is in the process of moving and their new room was not ready yet. For November, we will be in a new, more permanent room. It is theater-style and can seat 250 people. I think we are done worrying about whether we have enough seating! Thanks, Jeff -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: