From abdulmuneer at gmail.com  Mon Apr  1 11:02:01 2013
From: abdulmuneer at gmail.com (Abdul Muneer)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 2013 14:32:01 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Evaluating Web Frameworks based on certain criteria
Message-ID: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
I need to decide on a python web-framework based on the below listed
criteria.

   1. Ease of customization of bundled packages
   2. Ease of development
   3. Long term support of frameworks
   4. Learning curve
   5. Logging and monitoring
   6. Clustering
   7. Ease of deployment
   8. Testing: unit testing libraries
   9. DB management
   10. User management: e.g. should be possible to tie one user id to
   multiple entities
   11. LDAP integration

What would you recommend? Please share your experiences and insights
related to any of these points. Ignore the points in the list that appear
vague to you.

The existing app is written in pylons 0.9 , but as we want to enhance and
add lot more features, we would like to rebuild it on a new framework
altogether.

The current web app had too many dependencies and the new versions of some
of these libraries have conflicting requirements. Some other libraries were
long dead. So the choice is to rebuild entire stuff on a framework where we
will not end up in the same situation.

Regards,
Abdul Muneer

--
Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Mon Apr  1 11:57:36 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 2013 15:27:36 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Evaluating Web Frameworks based on certain criteria
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFQ7JnetX6hpF8yVmh-i4BbkmdN-eLC_fKBQOJJ9yx_DmA@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Apr 1, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com> wrote:

> I need to decide on a python web-framework based on the below listed
> criteria.
>
>    1. Ease of customization of bundled packages
>    2. Ease of development
>    3. Long term support of frameworks
>    4. Learning curve
>    5. Logging and monitoring
>    6. Clustering
>    7. Ease of deployment
>    8. Testing: unit testing libraries
>    9. DB management
>    10. User management: e.g. should be possible to tie one user id to
>    multiple entities
>    11. LDAP integration
>
> What would you recommend? Please share your experiences and insights
> related to any of these points. Ignore the points in the list that appear
> vague to you.
>
> The existing app is written in pylons 0.9 , but as we want to enhance and
> add lot more features, we would like to rebuild it on a new framework
> altogether.
>
> The current web app had too many dependencies and the new versions of some
> of these libraries have conflicting requirements. Some other libraries were
> long dead. So the choice is to rebuild entire stuff on a framework where we
> will not end up in the same situation.
>


Suggesting a web-framework is an easy task, but you as an owner have to
personally
evaluate the available options that fits into your needs. Personal bias in
these kind
of questions in open forums is pretty high. Also most frameworks would
support almost
all the features that you have requested.

Having said that, i tend to lean towards django.

-V

From kracethekingmaker at gmail.com  Mon Apr  1 12:48:44 2013
From: kracethekingmaker at gmail.com (kracekumar ramaraju)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 2013 16:18:44 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Evaluating Web Frameworks based on certain criteria
In-Reply-To: <CAN7tdFQ7JnetX6hpF8yVmh-i4BbkmdN-eLC_fKBQOJJ9yx_DmA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN7tdFQ7JnetX6hpF8yVmh-i4BbkmdN-eLC_fKBQOJJ9yx_DmA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO5c=m=61C=7AeM+5H4+t_nmP=Z2P1DYTyFB-HfcsPrvXWbppA@mail.gmail.com>

Try creating google doc or survey and ask people's opinion.


On Mon, Apr 1, 2013 at 3:27 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon, Apr 1, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I need to decide on a python web-framework based on the below listed
> > criteria.
> >
> >    1. Ease of customization of bundled packages
> >    2. Ease of development
> >    3. Long term support of frameworks
> >    4. Learning curve
> >    5. Logging and monitoring
> >    6. Clustering
> >    7. Ease of deployment
> >    8. Testing: unit testing libraries
> >    9. DB management
> >    10. User management: e.g. should be possible to tie one user id to
> >    multiple entities
> >    11. LDAP integration
> >
> > What would you recommend? Please share your experiences and insights
> > related to any of these points. Ignore the points in the list that appear
> > vague to you.
> >
> > The existing app is written in pylons 0.9 , but as we want to enhance and
> > add lot more features, we would like to rebuild it on a new framework
> > altogether.
> >
> > The current web app had too many dependencies and the new versions of
> some
> > of these libraries have conflicting requirements. Some other libraries
> were
> > long dead. So the choice is to rebuild entire stuff on a framework where
> we
> > will not end up in the same situation.
> >
>
>
> Suggesting a web-framework is an easy task, but you as an owner have to
> personally
> evaluate the available options that fits into your needs. Personal bias in
> these kind
> of questions in open forums is pretty high. Also most frameworks would
> support almost
> all the features that you have requested.
>
> Having said that, i tend to lean towards django.
>
> -V
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
*
Thanks & Regards

"Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
kracekumar
www.kracekumar.com
*

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Mon Apr  1 13:12:58 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Mon, 01 Apr 2013 16:42:58 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Evaluating Web Frameworks based on certain criteria
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
	(Abdul Muneer's message of "Mon, 1 Apr 2013 14:32:01 +0530")
References: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8738vao66d.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com> writes:

> Hi,
> I need to decide on a python web-framework based on the below listed
> criteria.
>
>    1. Ease of customization of bundled packages
>    2. Ease of development
>    3. Long term support of frameworks
>    4. Learning curve
>    5. Logging and monitoring
>    6. Clustering
>    7. Ease of deployment
>    8. Testing: unit testing libraries
>    9. DB management
>    10. User management: e.g. should be possible to tie one user id to
>    multiple entities
>    11. LDAP integration
>
> What would you recommend? Please share your experiences and insights
> related to any of these points. Ignore the points in the list that appear
> vague to you.
>
> The existing app is written in pylons 0.9 , but as we want to enhance and
> add lot more features, we would like to rebuild it on a new framework
> altogether.
>
> The current web app had too many dependencies and the new versions of
> some of these libraries have conflicting requirements. Some other
> libraries were long dead. So the choice is to rebuild entire stuff on
> a framework where we will not end up in the same situation.

Django has a track record. It's been around for a while and despite
smaller, leaner upstarts has managed to hold it's own. It has a large
community and contributed plugins. It bundles a lot of stuff with itself
leading to reduced dependency problems (and less flexibility).

You're not going to get "the best" framework that satisfies these
criteria. Also, typical management won't care about these tech. details
as long as the team making the recommendations can insulate them from
them.





[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From harshjha2006 at gmail.com  Mon Apr  1 13:18:22 2013
From: harshjha2006 at gmail.com (Harsh Jha)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 2013 16:48:22 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Error while building pygame project
Message-ID: <CAAy3xR2ysgk09Nky29omUSSyDLAvtMzH09vDR6w1wwD6TdTX3w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,

I'm trying to build a pygame project as given in
http://pygame.renpy.org/android-packaging.html. While running the build
command as mentioned in 4th step(*android.py build mygame release install*),
I'm getting -

*C:\pgs4a-0.9.4>android.py build mygame release install

Updating build files.

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "C:\pgs4a-0.9.4\android.py", line 66, in <module>
    main()
  File "C:\pgs4a-0.9.4\android.py", line 54, in main
    build.build(iface, args.argument[0], args.argument[1:])
  File "buildlib\build.py", line 301, in build
    build_core(iface, directory, commands)
  File "buildlib\build.py", line 221, in build_core
    subprocess.call([plat.android, "update", "project", "-p", '.', '-t',
'androi
d-8', '-n', versioned_name])
  File "C:\Python27\lib\subprocess.py", line 486, in call
    return Popen(*popenargs, **kwargs).wait()
  File "C:\Python27\lib\subprocess.py", line 672, in __init__
    errread, errwrite)
  File "C:\Python27\lib\subprocess.py", line 882, in _execute_child
    startupinfo)
WindowsError: [Error 2] The system cannot find the file specified
*
I don't understand the issue. Please help.

Thanks
-- 
Harsh Jha
Senior Member Technical Staff,
Oracle India Pvt. Ltd.

From larryt at winfirst.com  Mon Apr  1 21:04:46 2013
From: larryt at winfirst.com (larryt at winfirst.com)
Date: Mon,  1 Apr 2013 12:04:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [BangPypers] Evaluating Web Frameworks based on certain criteria
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20130401120446.CMH42195@ms1.mc.surewest.net>


>Hi,
>I need to decide on a python web-framework based on the below listed
>criteria.
>
>   1. Ease of customization of bundled packages
>   2. Ease of development
>   3. Long term support of frameworks
>   4. Learning curve
>   5. Logging and monitoring
>   6. Clustering
>   7. Ease of deployment
>   8. Testing: unit testing libraries
>   9. DB management
>   10. User management: e.g. should be possible to tie one user id to
>   multiple entities
>   11. LDAP integration
>
>What would you recommend? Please share your experiences and insights
>related to any of these points. Ignore the points in the list that appear
>vague to you.
>
>The existing app is written in pylons 0.9 , but as we want to enhance and
>add lot more features, we would like to rebuild it on a new framework
>altogether.
>
>The current web app had too many dependencies and the new versions of some
>of these libraries have conflicting requirements. Some other libraries were
>long dead. So the choice is to rebuild entire stuff on a framework where we
>will not end up in the same situation.

There are probably three to look at in following the advice you've already received: Pyramid, Django and Flask.  If you're a PC/Mac shop look first and harder at Django.  Otherwise start with Flask and Pyramid.  I use Flask because the ecosystem seems more manageable to me, but I'm sure that's just because of my previous experience, so yours may lead you to Pyramid, especially coming from pylons.

-larry



From abdulmuneer at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 10:02:49 2013
From: abdulmuneer at gmail.com (Abdul Muneer)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 13:32:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Evaluating Web Frameworks based on certain criteria
In-Reply-To: <20130401120446.CMH42195@ms1.mc.surewest.net>
References: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130401120446.CMH42195@ms1.mc.surewest.net>
Message-ID: <CAMJTfgmaY_WPPe-HoMmX9Dy=zJ_GFy-ttenaUMwPdojqTocA-g@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you all, especially larry. Pyramid and Django are what I have looked
at. I have worked with Django and all pylons stuff along with SQLA was
initially cumbersome. I would have really loved to go with Django as it is
'easy', but there are reasons why Pyramid is built the way it is and I
wanted to consider those factors too. I appreciate SQLA very much now,
although I haven't encountered a scenario where I had been at a loss if I
didn't use it.

I am looking forward to experiences from people which led them towards or
away from any framework. Did anyone hit the wall by using Django ORM? Or
did anyone find the SQLA too heavy and needless? I certainly hit the wall
with old pylons, or more precisely with the plugins for pylons. All those
deprecated dependencies make the upgrade or maintenance extremely difficult
and unreliable.

Regards,
Abdul Muneer

--
Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>


On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 12:34 AM, <larryt at winfirst.com> wrote:

>
> >Hi,
> >I need to decide on a python web-framework based on the below listed
> >criteria.
> >
> >   1. Ease of customization of bundled packages
> >   2. Ease of development
> >   3. Long term support of frameworks
> >   4. Learning curve
> >   5. Logging and monitoring
> >   6. Clustering
> >   7. Ease of deployment
> >   8. Testing: unit testing libraries
> >   9. DB management
> >   10. User management: e.g. should be possible to tie one user id to
> >   multiple entities
> >   11. LDAP integration
> >
> >What would you recommend? Please share your experiences and insights
> >related to any of these points. Ignore the points in the list that appear
> >vague to you.
> >
> >The existing app is written in pylons 0.9 , but as we want to enhance and
> >add lot more features, we would like to rebuild it on a new framework
> >altogether.
> >
> >The current web app had too many dependencies and the new versions of some
> >of these libraries have conflicting requirements. Some other libraries
> were
> >long dead. So the choice is to rebuild entire stuff on a framework where
> we
> >will not end up in the same situation.
>
> There are probably three to look at in following the advice you've already
> received: Pyramid, Django and Flask.  If you're a PC/Mac shop look first
> and harder at Django.  Otherwise start with Flask and Pyramid.  I use Flask
> because the ecosystem seems more manageable to me, but I'm sure that's just
> because of my previous experience, so yours may lead you to Pyramid,
> especially coming from pylons.
>
> -larry
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From gaurav.tula at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:08:22 2013
From: gaurav.tula at gmail.com (Gaurav Malhotra)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:38:22 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
Message-ID: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi everyone,

Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
Documentation:

>>> # Measure some strings:

... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']

>>> for w in words:

...     print w, len(w)

...

cat 3

window 6

defenestrate 12

# The Problem is:
When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??

Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w" with
any other variable, it will show the same output.

I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
handling it)" ??

Thanks & Regards,
Gaurav Malhotra

-- 
*Regards
Gaurav Malhotra
+91-9410562301*

From manishreddytirumala at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:13:47 2013
From: manishreddytirumala at gmail.com (Manish Reddy)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:43:47 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
In-Reply-To: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHhoE0G9ADUYM0jUq8YSgQhPu9zRp+EEUmXs3AX=X+MGtzCVTw@mail.gmail.com>

w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w and
get the same output.

Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the list.
So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the code
for each of them.

Hope I helped.


On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> Documentation:
>
> >>> # Measure some strings:
>
> ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
>
> >>> for w in words:
>
> ...     print w, len(w)
>
> ...
>
> cat 3
>
> window 6
>
> defenestrate 12
>
> # The Problem is:
> When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
>
> Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w" with
> any other variable, it will show the same output.
>
> I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> handling it)" ??
>
> Thanks & Regards,
> Gaurav Malhotra
>
> --
> *Regards
> Gaurav Malhotra
> +91-9410562301*
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Manish Reddy
www.LurnQ.com

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:14:39 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:44:39 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
In-Reply-To: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFQ92_LrFNiAezgTsWXBA-ULLn62DVoPHnPSYzECcBmefA@mail.gmail.com>

Before someone pops in and says, let me say it.... 'List
Comprehensions'.....ah! now i can RIP :)

On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> Documentation:
>
> >>> # Measure some strings:
>
> ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
>
> >>> for w in words:
>
> ...     print w, len(w)
>
> ...
>
> cat 3
>
> window 6
>
> defenestrate 12
>
> # The Problem is:
> When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
>
> Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w" with
> any other variable, it will show the same output.
>
> I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> handling it)" ??
>
> Thanks & Regards,
> Gaurav Malhotra
>
> --
> *Regards
> Gaurav Malhotra
> +91-9410562301*
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From satishsagar83 at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:14:57 2013
From: satishsagar83 at gmail.com (L Radhakrishna Rao)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:44:57 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
In-Reply-To: <CAHhoE0G9ADUYM0jUq8YSgQhPu9zRp+EEUmXs3AX=X+MGtzCVTw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAHhoE0G9ADUYM0jUq8YSgQhPu9zRp+EEUmXs3AX=X+MGtzCVTw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAZd-jRMwe8pRrQrkx-XH-tJf+NhJTAqfWqy8RsWCs1MSJMrOQ@mail.gmail.com>

for w in words:



On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM, Manish Reddy
<manishreddytirumala at gmail.com>wrote:

> w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w and
> get the same output.
>
> Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the list.
> So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the code
> for each of them.
>
> Hope I helped.
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> > Documentation:
> >
> > >>> # Measure some strings:
> >
> > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> >
> > >>> for w in words:
> >
> > ...     print w, len(w)
> >
> > ...
> >
> > cat 3
> >
> > window 6
> >
> > defenestrate 12
> >
> > # The Problem is:
> > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
> >
> > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w"
> with
> > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> >
> > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> > handling it)" ??
> >
> > Thanks & Regards,
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> >
> > --
> > *Regards
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> > +91-9410562301*
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Manish Reddy
> www.LurnQ.com
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From satishsagar83 at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:16:07 2013
From: satishsagar83 at gmail.com (L Radhakrishna Rao)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:46:07 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
In-Reply-To: <CAHhoE0G9ADUYM0jUq8YSgQhPu9zRp+EEUmXs3AX=X+MGtzCVTw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAHhoE0G9ADUYM0jUq8YSgQhPu9zRp+EEUmXs3AX=X+MGtzCVTw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAZd-jTifqZSv4F1Uy2p1KSjqgDXt5it25xZQ7jX3+j2jNrFow@mail.gmail.com>

for w in words:
     print w, len(w)

this is where w is getting initialized.

Even if you will use 'i' there, output will be same.


On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM, Manish Reddy
<manishreddytirumala at gmail.com>wrote:

> w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w and
> get the same output.
>
> Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the list.
> So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the code
> for each of them.
>
> Hope I helped.
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> > Documentation:
> >
> > >>> # Measure some strings:
> >
> > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> >
> > >>> for w in words:
> >
> > ...     print w, len(w)
> >
> > ...
> >
> > cat 3
> >
> > window 6
> >
> > defenestrate 12
> >
> > # The Problem is:
> > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
> >
> > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w"
> with
> > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> >
> > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> > handling it)" ??
> >
> > Thanks & Regards,
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> >
> > --
> > *Regards
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> > +91-9410562301*
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Manish Reddy
> www.LurnQ.com
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From abhat38 at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:21:25 2013
From: abhat38 at gmail.com (anirudh bhat)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:51:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
In-Reply-To: <CAAZd-jTifqZSv4F1Uy2p1KSjqgDXt5it25xZQ7jX3+j2jNrFow@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAHhoE0G9ADUYM0jUq8YSgQhPu9zRp+EEUmXs3AX=X+MGtzCVTw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAAZd-jTifqZSv4F1Uy2p1KSjqgDXt5it25xZQ7jX3+j2jNrFow@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHKD0sEU3Qo7ii2Hmgh2cCuea7+GqDzfUQfz3BkEm3Q+oFS5og@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
Python is dynamically typed language.You dont initialize variables with
data types as you do it in c.


On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:46 PM, L Radhakrishna Rao
<satishsagar83 at gmail.com>wrote:

> for w in words:
>      print w, len(w)
>
> this is where w is getting initialized.
>
> Even if you will use 'i' there, output will be same.
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM, Manish Reddy
> <manishreddytirumala at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w
> and
> > get the same output.
> >
> > Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the
> list.
> > So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the
> code
> > for each of them.
> >
> > Hope I helped.
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python
> Official
> > > Documentation:
> > >
> > > >>> # Measure some strings:
> > >
> > > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> > >
> > > >>> for w in words:
> > >
> > > ...     print w, len(w)
> > >
> > > ...
> > >
> > > cat 3
> > >
> > > window 6
> > >
> > > defenestrate 12
> > >
> > > # The Problem is:
> > > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the
> output??
> > >
> > > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w"
> > with
> > > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> > >
> > > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter
> is
> > > handling it)" ??
> > >
> > > Thanks & Regards,
> > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > >
> > > --
> > > *Regards
> > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > > +91-9410562301*
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Manish Reddy
> > www.LurnQ.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From gaurav.tula at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:38:05 2013
From: gaurav.tula at gmail.com (Gaurav Malhotra)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 15:08:05 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] BangPypers Digest, Vol 68, Issue 3
In-Reply-To: <mailman.203.1364894493.17480.bangpypers@python.org>
References: <mailman.203.1364894493.17480.bangpypers@python.org>
Message-ID: <CAOQBMqybp_uCO1U_JzUi1oLPUCWYx1PHsUpdhVomHn0QLfxkeg@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks all,

So Python is smarter as I expected. As I am exploring it, I am more excited
about it.


On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:51 PM, <bangpypers-request at python.org> wrote:

> Send BangPypers mailing list submissions to
>         bangpypers at python.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         bangpypers-request at python.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         bangpypers-owner at python.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of BangPypers digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Beginner Help (Gaurav Malhotra)
>    2. Re: Beginner Help (Manish Reddy)
>    3. Re: Beginner Help (Venkatraman S)
>    4. Re: Beginner Help (L Radhakrishna Rao)
>    5. Re: Beginner Help (L Radhakrishna Rao)
>    6. Re: Beginner Help (anirudh bhat)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:38:22 +0530
> From: Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com>
> To: bangpypers at python.org
> Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> Documentation:
>
> >>> # Measure some strings:
>
> ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
>
> >>> for w in words:
>
> ...     print w, len(w)
>
> ...
>
> cat 3
>
> window 6
>
> defenestrate 12
>
> # The Problem is:
> When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
>
> Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w" with
> any other variable, it will show the same output.
>
> I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> handling it)" ??
>
> Thanks & Regards,
> Gaurav Malhotra
>
> --
> *Regards
> Gaurav Malhotra
> +91-9410562301*
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:43:47 +0530
> From: Manish Reddy <manishreddytirumala at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
> Message-ID:
>         <CAHhoE0G9ADUYM0jUq8YSgQhPu9zRp+EEUmXs3AX=
> X+MGtzCVTw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w and
> get the same output.
>
> Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the list.
> So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the code
> for each of them.
>
> Hope I helped.
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> > Documentation:
> >
> > >>> # Measure some strings:
> >
> > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> >
> > >>> for w in words:
> >
> > ...     print w, len(w)
> >
> > ...
> >
> > cat 3
> >
> > window 6
> >
> > defenestrate 12
> >
> > # The Problem is:
> > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
> >
> > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w"
> with
> > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> >
> > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> > handling it)" ??
> >
> > Thanks & Regards,
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> >
> > --
> > *Regards
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> > +91-9410562301*
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Manish Reddy
> www.LurnQ.com
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:44:39 +0530
> From: Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CAN7tdFQ92_LrFNiAezgTsWXBA-ULLn62DVoPHnPSYzECcBmefA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Before someone pops in and says, let me say it.... 'List
> Comprehensions'.....ah! now i can RIP :)
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> > Documentation:
> >
> > >>> # Measure some strings:
> >
> > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> >
> > >>> for w in words:
> >
> > ...     print w, len(w)
> >
> > ...
> >
> > cat 3
> >
> > window 6
> >
> > defenestrate 12
> >
> > # The Problem is:
> > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
> >
> > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w"
> with
> > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> >
> > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> > handling it)" ??
> >
> > Thanks & Regards,
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> >
> > --
> > *Regards
> > Gaurav Malhotra
> > +91-9410562301*
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:44:57 +0530
> From: L Radhakrishna Rao <satishsagar83 at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CAAZd-jRMwe8pRrQrkx-XH-tJf+NhJTAqfWqy8RsWCs1MSJMrOQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> for w in words:
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM, Manish Reddy
> <manishreddytirumala at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w
> and
> > get the same output.
> >
> > Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the
> list.
> > So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the
> code
> > for each of them.
> >
> > Hope I helped.
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python
> Official
> > > Documentation:
> > >
> > > >>> # Measure some strings:
> > >
> > > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> > >
> > > >>> for w in words:
> > >
> > > ...     print w, len(w)
> > >
> > > ...
> > >
> > > cat 3
> > >
> > > window 6
> > >
> > > defenestrate 12
> > >
> > > # The Problem is:
> > > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the
> output??
> > >
> > > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w"
> > with
> > > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> > >
> > > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter
> is
> > > handling it)" ??
> > >
> > > Thanks & Regards,
> > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > >
> > > --
> > > *Regards
> > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > > +91-9410562301*
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Manish Reddy
> > www.LurnQ.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:46:07 +0530
> From: L Radhakrishna Rao <satishsagar83 at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CAAZd-jTifqZSv4F1Uy2p1KSjqgDXt5it25xZQ7jX3+j2jNrFow at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> for w in words:
>      print w, len(w)
>
> this is where w is getting initialized.
>
> Even if you will use 'i' there, output will be same.
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM, Manish Reddy
> <manishreddytirumala at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w
> and
> > get the same output.
> >
> > Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the
> list.
> > So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the
> code
> > for each of them.
> >
> > Hope I helped.
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python
> Official
> > > Documentation:
> > >
> > > >>> # Measure some strings:
> > >
> > > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> > >
> > > >>> for w in words:
> > >
> > > ...     print w, len(w)
> > >
> > > ...
> > >
> > > cat 3
> > >
> > > window 6
> > >
> > > defenestrate 12
> > >
> > > # The Problem is:
> > > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the
> output??
> > >
> > > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w"
> > with
> > > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> > >
> > > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter
> is
> > > handling it)" ??
> > >
> > > Thanks & Regards,
> > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > >
> > > --
> > > *Regards
> > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > > +91-9410562301*
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Manish Reddy
> > www.LurnQ.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 14:51:25 +0530
> From: anirudh bhat <abhat38 at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CAHKD0sEU3Qo7ii2Hmgh2cCuea7+GqDzfUQfz3BkEm3Q+oFS5og at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hi,
> Python is dynamically typed language.You dont initialize variables with
> data types as you do it in c.
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:46 PM, L Radhakrishna Rao
> <satishsagar83 at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > for w in words:
> >      print w, len(w)
> >
> > this is where w is getting initialized.
> >
> > Even if you will use 'i' there, output will be same.
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM, Manish Reddy
> > <manishreddytirumala at gmail.com>wrote:
> >
> > > w is like a variable for python. You can use any variable instead of w
> > and
> > > get the same output.
> > >
> > > Your code is telling python to execute something for each item in the
> > list.
> > > So, w takes 'cat', 'window', 'defenestrate' each time and executes the
> > code
> > > for each of them.
> > >
> > > Hope I helped.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com
> > > >wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi everyone,
> > > >
> > > > Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python
> > Official
> > > > Documentation:
> > > >
> > > > >>> # Measure some strings:
> > > >
> > > > ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
> > > >
> > > > >>> for w in words:
> > > >
> > > > ...     print w, len(w)
> > > >
> > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > cat 3
> > > >
> > > > window 6
> > > >
> > > > defenestrate 12
> > > >
> > > > # The Problem is:
> > > > When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the
> > output??
> > > >
> > > > Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace
> "w"
> > > with
> > > > any other variable, it will show the same output.
> > > >
> > > > I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter
> > is
> > > > handling it)" ??
> > > >
> > > > Thanks & Regards,
> > > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > *Regards
> > > > Gaurav Malhotra
> > > > +91-9410562301*
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Manish Reddy
> > > www.LurnQ.com
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of BangPypers Digest, Vol 68, Issue 3
> *****************************************
>



-- 
*Regards
Gaurav Malhotra
+91-9410562301*

From rishi at turtleyogi.com  Tue Apr  2 11:41:09 2013
From: rishi at turtleyogi.com (Hrishikesh Kulkarni)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 15:11:09 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
In-Reply-To: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALFWOz5c-PsTaYAd0y3hsHVnmXJgEKCgTZ30OAGZJFZO9Znn7g@mail.gmail.com>

>> # The Problem is:
>> When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??

When you say "defined" you are comparing it to a programming language you
have already know. I am guessing C or C++.

C/C++ supports the concept of variable declaration and definition. Variable
name is actually attaching a label or tag to a memory location where the
real value is stored (for simplicity ignore pointers for now).

in C, the pseudo code would have been:

for (int i = 0; i< numberofwords ; i++)
{
  printf("%s", words[i]);
}

here "i" is the index in the array "words", which means you could use "i"
to step into the memory owned by array "words".

In Python, the same thing is in play except that python allocates the label
or tag on the go. "w" is internally pointing to words[index]. The index is
auto generated. The "for" is auto incrementing index for you. "for" also
ensures "w" is available within its scope.

>>> for w in words:
...     print w, len(w)


Quick analogy:

Variable names in C/C++ vs Python is like sticking post-its along the
memory location (in RAM).  C/C++ makes you buy the post-its and makes you
figure out where to stick the post-its and even lets your make mistakes.
Python buys it for you and sticks it for you. You just have to pick the
color of the post-it and remember it.


Suggestion:
Another reason why it is so important to understand pointers C. Once you
get it, you can always figure out the internals of other programming
languages. (especially those which are built on top of C)

regards,
Rishi



On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> Documentation:
>
> >>> # Measure some strings:
>
> ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
>
> >>> for w in words:
>
> ...     print w, len(w)
>
> ...
>
> cat 3
>
> window 6
>
> defenestrate 12
>
> # The Problem is:
> When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
>
> Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w" with
> any other variable, it will show the same output.
>
> I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> handling it)" ??
>
> Thanks & Regards,
> Gaurav Malhotra
>
> --
> *Regards
> Gaurav Malhotra
> +91-9410562301*
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From gopalakrishnan.subramani at gmail.com  Tue Apr  2 11:54:42 2013
From: gopalakrishnan.subramani at gmail.com (Gopalakrishnan Subramani)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2013 15:24:42 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Evaluating Web Frameworks based on certain criteria
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfgmaY_WPPe-HoMmX9Dy=zJ_GFy-ttenaUMwPdojqTocA-g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMJTfgkbGf8Nk9xV8CfR8UEtO_yDgt-RSQD8YRVDwKB_=JdUrw@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130401120446.CMH42195@ms1.mc.surewest.net>
	<CAMJTfgmaY_WPPe-HoMmX9Dy=zJ_GFy-ttenaUMwPdojqTocA-g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHhacd2uKKfs2mkNZzaQY47WcsO2pR60mAXZmx1rsVH+ykwcFA@mail.gmail.com>

I was using Pylons for nearly 3 years and moved to Flask instead of Django.
The decision is based on my  'opinion' on opinionated frameworks.

Pylons and Pyramid is completely running DIY philosophy, it was not really
fun for me (personal preference matter, no argument please). I need to look
around too many things to fix the issues or add new auth system or
framework to it.

I certainly liked Flask in that manner. It is simple and easy.

I code Python from 11:00 PM to 3:00 AM after my day job, so I tend to go
simple one than the Pyramid.

I use SqlAlchemy, Jinja2 along with Flask. With Pylons, I have used Mako
and Sql Alchemy.





On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 1:32 PM, Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com> wrote:

> Thank you all, especially larry. Pyramid and Django are what I have looked
> at. I have worked with Django and all pylons stuff along with SQLA was
> initially cumbersome. I would have really loved to go with Django as it is
> 'easy', but there are reasons why Pyramid is built the way it is and I
> wanted to consider those factors too. I appreciate SQLA very much now,
> although I haven't encountered a scenario where I had been at a loss if I
> didn't use it.
>
> I am looking forward to experiences from people which led them towards or
> away from any framework. Did anyone hit the wall by using Django ORM? Or
> did anyone find the SQLA too heavy and needless? I certainly hit the wall
> with old pylons, or more precisely with the plugins for pylons. All those
> deprecated dependencies make the upgrade or maintenance extremely difficult
> and unreliable.
>
> Regards,
> Abdul Muneer
>
> --
> Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 12:34 AM, <larryt at winfirst.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > >Hi,
> > >I need to decide on a python web-framework based on the below listed
> > >criteria.
> > >
> > >   1. Ease of customization of bundled packages
> > >   2. Ease of development
> > >   3. Long term support of frameworks
> > >   4. Learning curve
> > >   5. Logging and monitoring
> > >   6. Clustering
> > >   7. Ease of deployment
> > >   8. Testing: unit testing libraries
> > >   9. DB management
> > >   10. User management: e.g. should be possible to tie one user id to
> > >   multiple entities
> > >   11. LDAP integration
> > >
> > >What would you recommend? Please share your experiences and insights
> > >related to any of these points. Ignore the points in the list that
> appear
> > >vague to you.
> > >
> > >The existing app is written in pylons 0.9 , but as we want to enhance
> and
> > >add lot more features, we would like to rebuild it on a new framework
> > >altogether.
> > >
> > >The current web app had too many dependencies and the new versions of
> some
> > >of these libraries have conflicting requirements. Some other libraries
> > were
> > >long dead. So the choice is to rebuild entire stuff on a framework where
> > we
> > >will not end up in the same situation.
> >
> > There are probably three to look at in following the advice you've
> already
> > received: Pyramid, Django and Flask.  If you're a PC/Mac shop look first
> > and harder at Django.  Otherwise start with Flask and Pyramid.  I use
> Flask
> > because the ecosystem seems more manageable to me, but I'm sure that's
> just
> > because of my previous experience, so yours may lead you to Pyramid,
> > especially coming from pylons.
> >
> > -larry
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Wed Apr  3 02:28:35 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 05:58:35 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Fwd: First ever DjangoCon AU - precedes Pycon-au in
	Hobart in early July
In-Reply-To: <515ABB8C.7030305@dewhirst.com.au>
References: <CABRwemnfNgL5iHeBt6J-uKarOdWsfkEXmHYz=5wV0dbOid+LJQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<515ABB8C.7030305@dewhirst.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFR0xuCJ=LKBAajVygPtec0TCHA347d_X2b0R8gNC3wevA@mail.gmail.com>

FYI

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Mike Dewhirst <miked at dewhirst.com.au>
Date: Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 4:35 PM
Subject: First ever DjangoCon AU - precedes Pycon-au in Hobart in early July
To: django-users at googlegroups.com


All

Just forwarding the Pycon-au notice for obvious reasons ...

"This year we're welcoming the Python on OpenStack day, and the first ever
DjangoCon AU. These will happen on Friday July 5, just before the CodeWars
Tournament, where we'll pit teams of developers against each other on the
big screen. After the conference are the PyCon Sprints on July 8 and 9
offering a valuable opportunity to shape the future of Python in a
face-to-face setting."

http://2013.pycon-au.org/**about/pycon_australia<http://2013.pycon-au.org/about/pycon_australia>

On 2/04/2013 11:18am, Chris Neugebauer wrote:

> This week marks your last opportunity to submit proposals to present
> at PyCon Australia 2013, the national conference for the Python
> programming community, to be held on July 6 and 7 in Hobart, Tasmania.
>
> The deadline for proposal submission is Friday April 5, 2013, and more
> information can be found at http://pycon-au.org/cfp
>
> PyCon Australia is an excellent opportunity to share experience and
> knowledge with like-minded Python developers from all walks of life --
> we attract professional developers from industry, government, science
> and education, along with enthusiast and student developers.
> Presentations can be targeted at all skill levels, on any topic
> related to Python programming.
>
> This year, we're welcoming DjangoCon AU under the PyCon Australia
> umbrella, it'll run on Friday 5 July, before the main conference.
> Every Django-related proposal we receive in the PyCon Australia CFP
> will also be considered as part of the DjangoCon AU programme.
>
> Our OpenStack Miniconf is running a separate CFP, and first-round
> submissions close on April 9. Details can be found at the OpenStack
> Miniconf CFP site (http://tinyurl.com/pyconau-**2013-openstack<http://tinyurl.com/pyconau-2013-openstack>
> ).
>
> If you're a first-time Python developer, don't be afraid to submit a
> presentation -- we're a community-driven conference, and we have a
> focus on building the next generation of Python programmers.
>
> We can't wait to see your proposals.
>
> == About PyCon Australia ==
>
> PyCon Australia is the national conference for the Python Programming
> Community. The fourth PyCon Australia will be held on July 5--7, 2013
> in Hobart, Tasmania, bringing together professional, student and
> enthusiast developers with a love for developing with Python. PyCon
> Australia informs the country?s Python developers with presentations,
> tutorials and panel sessions by experts and core developers of Python,
> as well as the libraries and frameworks that they rely on.
>
> To find out more about PyCon Australia 2013, visit our website at
> http://pycon-au.org or e-mail us at contact at pycon-au.org.
>
> PyCon Australia is presented by Linux Australia (www.linux.org.au) and
> acknowledges the support of our Platinum sponsor: Australian Computer
> Society (Tasmanian Branch) (www.acs.org.au); and our Gold Sponsor,
> Google Australia (www.google.com.au). For full details of our
> sponsors, see our website.
>
>
> --
> --
> --Christopher Neugebauer
> Conference Coordinator and Sponsor Liaison
>
> PyCon Australia: Hobart 2013 -- http://pycon-au.org -- @pyconau
> 5?7 July 2013; CFP now open: closes 5 April -- http://pycon-au.org/cfp
>
> Jabber: chrisjrn at gmail.com -- IRC: chrisjrn on irc.freenode.net --
> WWW: http://chris.neugebauer.id.au -- Twitter/Identi.ca: @chrisjrn
>
> ______________________________**_________________
> python-au maillist  -  python-au at starship.python.net
> http://starship.python.net/**mailman/listinfo/python-au<http://starship.python.net/mailman/listinfo/python-au>
>
>
-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Django users" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
email to django-users+unsubscribe@**googlegroups.com<django-users%2Bunsubscribe at googlegroups.com>
.
To post to this group, send email to django-users at googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/**group/django-users?hl=en<http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en>
.
For more options, visit
https://groups.google.com/**groups/opt_out<https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out>
.

From newtonhanes at hushmail.com  Wed Apr  3 00:58:55 2013
From: newtonhanes at hushmail.com (newtonhanes at hushmail.com)
Date: Tue, 02 Apr 2013 18:58:55 -0400
Subject: [BangPypers] Biggest Fake Conference in Computer Science
In-Reply-To: <E1UN8ZP-0001Dy-Ry@secure3.khronos.org>
Message-ID: <20130402225855.70A3110E2D6@smtp.hushmail.com>

We are researchers from different parts of the world and conducted a study on  
the world?s biggest bogus computer science conference WORLDCOMP 
( http://sites.google.com/site/worlddump1 ) organized by Prof. Hamid Arabnia 
from University of Georgia, USA.


We submitted a fake paper to WORLDCOMP 2011 and again (the 
same paper with a modified title) to WORLDCOMP 2012. This paper 
had numerous fundamental mistakes. Sample statements from 
that paper include: 

(1). Binary logic is fuzzy logic and vice versa
(2). Pascal developed fuzzy logic
(3). Object oriented languages do not exhibit any polymorphism or inheritance
(4). TCP and IP are synonyms and are part of OSI model 
(5). Distributed systems deal with only one computer
(6). Laptop is an example for a super computer
(7). Operating system is an example for computer hardware


Also, our paper did not express any conceptual meaning.  However, it 
was accepted both the times without any modifications (and without 
any reviews) and we were invited to submit the final paper and a 
payment of $500+ fee to present the paper. We decided to use the 
fee for better purposes than making Prof. Hamid Arabnia (Chairman 
of WORLDCOMP) rich. After that, we received few reminders from 
WORLDCOMP to pay the fee but we never responded. 


We MUST say that you should look at the above website if you have any thoughts 
to submit a paper to WORLDCOMP.  DBLP and other indexing agencies 
have stopped indexing WORLDCOMP?s proceedings since 2011 due to its fakeness. 
See http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~ley/db/conf/icai/index.html for of one of the 
conferences of WORLDCOMP and notice that there is no listing after 2010. See 
http://sites.google.com/site/dumpconf for comments from well-known researchers 
about WORLDCOMP.


The status of your WORLDCOMP papers can be changed from ?scientific? 
to ?other? (i.e., junk or non-technical) at any time. See the comments 
http://www.mail-archive.com/tccc at lists.cs.columbia.edu/msg05168.html   
of a respected researcher on this. Better not to have a paper than 
having it in WORLDCOMP and spoil the resume and peace of mind forever!


Our study revealed that WORLDCOMP is a money making business, 
using University of Georgia mask, for Prof. Hamid Arabnia. He is throwing 
out a small chunk of that money (around 20 dollars per paper published 
in WORLDCOMP?s proceedings) to his puppet (Mr. Ashu Solo or A.M.G. Solo) 
who publicizes WORLDCOMP and also defends it at various forums, using 
fake/anonymous names. The puppet uses fake names and defames other conferences
to divert traffic to WORLDCOMP. That is, the puppet does all his best 
to get a maximum number of papers published at WORLDCOMP to get more 
money into his (and Prof. Hamid Arabnia?s) pockets. 


Monte Carlo Resort (the venue of WORLDCOMP until 2012) has refused to 
provide the venue for WORLDCOMP?13 because of the fears of their image 
being tarnished due to WORLDCOMP?s fraudulent activities. WORLDCOMP?13 
will be held at a different resort.


WORLDCOMP will not be held after 2013.


The paper submission deadline for WORLDCOMP?13 was March 18 and it is 
extended to April 6 (it will be extended many times, as usual) but 
still there are no committee members, no reviewers, and there is no 
conference Chairman. The only contact details available on WORLDCOMP?s 
website is just an email address! 


What bothers us the most is that Prof. Hamid Arabnia never posted an 
apology for the damage he has done to the research community.  He is still 
trying to defend WORLDCOMP. Let us make a direct request to him: publish 
all reviews for all the papers (after blocking identifiable details) since 
2000 conference. Reveal the names and affiliations of all the reviewers 
(for each year) and how many papers each reviewer had reviewed on average. 
We also request him to look at the Open Challenge at  
http://sites.google.com/site/dumpconf


Sorry for posting to multiple lists. Spreading the word is the only way to stop 
this bogus conference. Please forward this message to other mailing lists and people. 


We are shocked with Prof. Hamid Arabnia and his puppet?s activities 
http://worldcomp-fake-bogus.blogspot.com   Search Google using the 
keyword worldcomp fake for additional links.


From abpillai at gmail.com  Wed Apr  3 14:30:32 2013
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 18:00:32 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Biggest Fake Conference in Computer Science
In-Reply-To: <20130402225855.70A3110E2D6@smtp.hushmail.com>
References: <E1UN8ZP-0001Dy-Ry@secure3.khronos.org>
	<20130402225855.70A3110E2D6@smtp.hushmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACpj97DUDyLfZYhw56mpMHtZvG=jA10k_OuRx5n-d0MbEsEH1g@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

 Thank you for educating the list. Though this is not exactly
relevant to our subject matter actually.

Regards,

--Anand


On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 4:28 AM, <newtonhanes at hushmail.com> wrote:

> We are researchers from different parts of the world and conducted a study
> on
> the world?s biggest bogus computer science conference WORLDCOMP
> ( http://sites.google.com/site/worlddump1 ) organized by Prof. Hamid
> Arabnia
> from University of Georgia, USA.
>
>
> We submitted a fake paper to WORLDCOMP 2011 and again (the
> same paper with a modified title) to WORLDCOMP 2012. This paper
> had numerous fundamental mistakes. Sample statements from
> that paper include:
>
> (1). Binary logic is fuzzy logic and vice versa
> (2). Pascal developed fuzzy logic
> (3). Object oriented languages do not exhibit any polymorphism or
> inheritance
> (4). TCP and IP are synonyms and are part of OSI model
> (5). Distributed systems deal with only one computer
> (6). Laptop is an example for a super computer
> (7). Operating system is an example for computer hardware
>
>
> Also, our paper did not express any conceptual meaning.  However, it
> was accepted both the times without any modifications (and without
> any reviews) and we were invited to submit the final paper and a
> payment of $500+ fee to present the paper. We decided to use the
> fee for better purposes than making Prof. Hamid Arabnia (Chairman
> of WORLDCOMP) rich. After that, we received few reminders from
> WORLDCOMP to pay the fee but we never responded.
>
>
> We MUST say that you should look at the above website if you have any
> thoughts
> to submit a paper to WORLDCOMP.  DBLP and other indexing agencies
> have stopped indexing WORLDCOMP?s proceedings since 2011 due to its
> fakeness.
> See http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~ley/db/conf/icai/index.html for
> of one of the
> conferences of WORLDCOMP and notice that there is no listing after 2010.
> See
> http://sites.google.com/site/dumpconf for comments from well-known
> researchers
> about WORLDCOMP.
>
>
> The status of your WORLDCOMP papers can be changed from ?scientific?
> to ?other? (i.e., junk or non-technical) at any time. See the comments
> http://www.mail-archive.com/tccc at lists.cs.columbia.edu/msg05168.html
> of a respected researcher on this. Better not to have a paper than
> having it in WORLDCOMP and spoil the resume and peace of mind forever!
>
>
> Our study revealed that WORLDCOMP is a money making business,
> using University of Georgia mask, for Prof. Hamid Arabnia. He is throwing
> out a small chunk of that money (around 20 dollars per paper published
> in WORLDCOMP?s proceedings) to his puppet (Mr. Ashu Solo or A.M.G. Solo)
> who publicizes WORLDCOMP and also defends it at various forums, using
> fake/anonymous names. The puppet uses fake names and defames other
> conferences
> to divert traffic to WORLDCOMP. That is, the puppet does all his best
> to get a maximum number of papers published at WORLDCOMP to get more
> money into his (and Prof. Hamid Arabnia?s) pockets.
>
>
> Monte Carlo Resort (the venue of WORLDCOMP until 2012) has refused to
> provide the venue for WORLDCOMP?13 because of the fears of their image
> being tarnished due to WORLDCOMP?s fraudulent activities. WORLDCOMP?13
> will be held at a different resort.
>
>
> WORLDCOMP will not be held after 2013.
>
>
> The paper submission deadline for WORLDCOMP?13 was March 18 and it is
> extended to April 6 (it will be extended many times, as usual) but
> still there are no committee members, no reviewers, and there is no
> conference Chairman. The only contact details available on WORLDCOMP?s
> website is just an email address!
>
>
> What bothers us the most is that Prof. Hamid Arabnia never posted an
> apology for the damage he has done to the research community.  He is still
> trying to defend WORLDCOMP. Let us make a direct request to him: publish
> all reviews for all the papers (after blocking identifiable details) since
> 2000 conference. Reveal the names and affiliations of all the reviewers
> (for each year) and how many papers each reviewer had reviewed on average.
> We also request him to look at the Open Challenge at
> http://sites.google.com/site/dumpconf
>
>
> Sorry for posting to multiple lists. Spreading the word is the only way to
> stop
> this bogus conference. Please forward this message to other mailing lists
> and people.
>
>
> We are shocked with Prof. Hamid Arabnia and his puppet?s activities
> http://worldcomp-fake-bogus.blogspot.com   Search Google using the
> keyword worldcomp fake for additional links.
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From satishsagar83 at gmail.com  Wed Apr  3 16:12:26 2013
From: satishsagar83 at gmail.com (L Radhakrishna Rao)
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 19:42:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Biggest Fake Conference in Computer Science
In-Reply-To: <CACpj97DUDyLfZYhw56mpMHtZvG=jA10k_OuRx5n-d0MbEsEH1g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <E1UN8ZP-0001Dy-Ry@secure3.khronos.org>
	<20130402225855.70A3110E2D6@smtp.hushmail.com>
	<CACpj97DUDyLfZYhw56mpMHtZvG=jA10k_OuRx5n-d0MbEsEH1g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAZd-jQADT97_djaOhQKwRR9+JT8wE=FCpJNxiAdKA6OVhXc3A@mail.gmail.com>

I am shocked that University of Georgia have these sort of Professor. It is
considered as one of the best university in USA.


On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 6:00 PM, Anand B Pillai <abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
>  Thank you for educating the list. Though this is not exactly
> relevant to our subject matter actually.
>
> Regards,
>
> --Anand
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 4:28 AM, <newtonhanes at hushmail.com> wrote:
>
> > We are researchers from different parts of the world and conducted a
> study
> > on
> > the world?s biggest bogus computer science conference WORLDCOMP
> > ( http://sites.google.com/site/worlddump1 ) organized by Prof. Hamid
> > Arabnia
> > from University of Georgia, USA.
> >
> >
> > We submitted a fake paper to WORLDCOMP 2011 and again (the
> > same paper with a modified title) to WORLDCOMP 2012. This paper
> > had numerous fundamental mistakes. Sample statements from
> > that paper include:
> >
> > (1). Binary logic is fuzzy logic and vice versa
> > (2). Pascal developed fuzzy logic
> > (3). Object oriented languages do not exhibit any polymorphism or
> > inheritance
> > (4). TCP and IP are synonyms and are part of OSI model
> > (5). Distributed systems deal with only one computer
> > (6). Laptop is an example for a super computer
> > (7). Operating system is an example for computer hardware
> >
> >
> > Also, our paper did not express any conceptual meaning.  However, it
> > was accepted both the times without any modifications (and without
> > any reviews) and we were invited to submit the final paper and a
> > payment of $500+ fee to present the paper. We decided to use the
> > fee for better purposes than making Prof. Hamid Arabnia (Chairman
> > of WORLDCOMP) rich. After that, we received few reminders from
> > WORLDCOMP to pay the fee but we never responded.
> >
> >
> > We MUST say that you should look at the above website if you have any
> > thoughts
> > to submit a paper to WORLDCOMP.  DBLP and other indexing agencies
> > have stopped indexing WORLDCOMP?s proceedings since 2011 due to its
> > fakeness.
> > See http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~ley/db/conf/icai/index.html for
> > of one of the
> > conferences of WORLDCOMP and notice that there is no listing after 2010.
> > See
> > http://sites.google.com/site/dumpconf for comments from well-known
> > researchers
> > about WORLDCOMP.
> >
> >
> > The status of your WORLDCOMP papers can be changed from ?scientific?
> > to ?other? (i.e., junk or non-technical) at any time. See the comments
> > http://www.mail-archive.com/tccc at lists.cs.columbia.edu/msg05168.html
> > of a respected researcher on this. Better not to have a paper than
> > having it in WORLDCOMP and spoil the resume and peace of mind forever!
> >
> >
> > Our study revealed that WORLDCOMP is a money making business,
> > using University of Georgia mask, for Prof. Hamid Arabnia. He is throwing
> > out a small chunk of that money (around 20 dollars per paper published
> > in WORLDCOMP?s proceedings) to his puppet (Mr. Ashu Solo or A.M.G. Solo)
> > who publicizes WORLDCOMP and also defends it at various forums, using
> > fake/anonymous names. The puppet uses fake names and defames other
> > conferences
> > to divert traffic to WORLDCOMP. That is, the puppet does all his best
> > to get a maximum number of papers published at WORLDCOMP to get more
> > money into his (and Prof. Hamid Arabnia?s) pockets.
> >
> >
> > Monte Carlo Resort (the venue of WORLDCOMP until 2012) has refused to
> > provide the venue for WORLDCOMP?13 because of the fears of their image
> > being tarnished due to WORLDCOMP?s fraudulent activities. WORLDCOMP?13
> > will be held at a different resort.
> >
> >
> > WORLDCOMP will not be held after 2013.
> >
> >
> > The paper submission deadline for WORLDCOMP?13 was March 18 and it is
> > extended to April 6 (it will be extended many times, as usual) but
> > still there are no committee members, no reviewers, and there is no
> > conference Chairman. The only contact details available on WORLDCOMP?s
> > website is just an email address!
> >
> >
> > What bothers us the most is that Prof. Hamid Arabnia never posted an
> > apology for the damage he has done to the research community.  He is
> still
> > trying to defend WORLDCOMP. Let us make a direct request to him: publish
> > all reviews for all the papers (after blocking identifiable details)
> since
> > 2000 conference. Reveal the names and affiliations of all the reviewers
> > (for each year) and how many papers each reviewer had reviewed on
> average.
> > We also request him to look at the Open Challenge at
> > http://sites.google.com/site/dumpconf
> >
> >
> > Sorry for posting to multiple lists. Spreading the word is the only way
> to
> > stop
> > this bogus conference. Please forward this message to other mailing lists
> > and people.
> >
> >
> > We are shocked with Prof. Hamid Arabnia and his puppet?s activities
> > http://worldcomp-fake-bogus.blogspot.com   Search Google using the
> > keyword worldcomp fake for additional links.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From kracethekingmaker at gmail.com  Wed Apr  3 18:27:16 2013
From: kracethekingmaker at gmail.com (kracekumar ramaraju)
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 21:57:16 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] April month meetup
In-Reply-To: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO5c=mndj5-7ZUZ-3ydEw_p8-OXjK7ZpvzLM1EhmPPb=p09GMA@mail.gmail.com>

All,

 Unfortunately Siva can't attend April month meetup, so Django Hands on
session is *CANCELLED*. If any one is willing to present a session is
welcome.


On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 1:24 AM, kracekumar ramaraju <
kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:

> All,
>
>   Siva informed me he is willing to handle 3 hours hands-on session about
> getting started with Django next month. We need a venue which has power
> socket and decent internet connection. I would like to have others
> suggestions about the format, looking forward for venue to host for next
> meetup. We will be also needing few volunteers to help during meetup.
>
> --
> *
> Thanks & Regards
>
> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> kracekumar
> www.kracekumar.com
> *
>



-- 
*
Thanks & Regards

"Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
kracekumar
www.kracekumar.com
*

From sumit786raj at gmail.com  Wed Apr  3 19:34:30 2013
From: sumit786raj at gmail.com (SUMIT KUMAR RAJ)
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 23:04:30 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Hosting the Python Code on web
Message-ID: <CAHLM5TsrznNZykXrzzgeA450LoCkvJ8AVm3jzOQ6WSXE0bJ8AA@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Everyone,
                        I have kept learning from you all and I am very
thankful to you also.
Actually I am doing my final year project of engg. ie. "Sentiment Analysis
of Twitter Data" and I got this code on github
https://github.com/ravikiranj/twitter-sentiment-analyzer
which is working in terminal to classify any tweet as positive, negative or
neutral.
I wan't the same to be happening in browser by uploading or hosting the
code to my domain as www.sentiment140.com works.
I am really confused about it.Please help
1).Do I need to write the code again using any framework or is there any
way?

2) I have a linux hosting plan for my domain www.techpython.com.So, how can
I host any django code or any python code which has third party module with
it? Will the hosting support codes other than standard python library?

-- 
Regards...
----------------------
Sumit Kumar Raj
Software & Web Developer
Contact no:-9590283524
Bangalore,India

From kracethekingmaker at gmail.com  Wed Apr  3 20:08:56 2013
From: kracethekingmaker at gmail.com (kracekumar ramaraju)
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 23:38:56 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Hosting the Python Code on web
In-Reply-To: <CAHLM5TsrznNZykXrzzgeA450LoCkvJ8AVm3jzOQ6WSXE0bJ8AA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHLM5TsrznNZykXrzzgeA450LoCkvJ8AVm3jzOQ6WSXE0bJ8AA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO5c=m=7rk4EN6GwitnvUrnh9Y_DeYZzi+sSyCRSBCBB2hBk-w@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 11:04 PM, SUMIT KUMAR RAJ <sumit786raj at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hello Everyone,
>                         I have kept learning from you all and I am very
> thankful to you also.
> Actually I am doing my final year project of engg. ie. "Sentiment Analysis
> of Twitter Data" and I got this code on github
> https://github.com/ravikiranj/twitter-sentiment-analyzer
> which is working in terminal to classify any tweet as positive, negative or
> neutral.
> I wan't the same to be happening in browser by uploading or hosting the
> code to my domain as www.sentiment140.com works.
> I am really confused about it.Please help
> 1).Do I need to write the code again using any framework or is there any
> way?
>
>
Yes, you can package the current work and choose framework to port existing
work as Web application. Yes framework is required, in case you are trying
any other trick it may end up dirty.


> 2) I have a linux hosting plan for my domain www.techpython.com.So, how
> can
> I host any django code or any python code which has third party module with
> it? Will the hosting support codes other than standard python library?
>
>
It depends on hosting, with VPS you will get root access, so all the third
party libraries can be installed. I don't think shared hosting as great
option. Service like dotcloud, heroku are free. It is great bet to try on
those and later migrate to VPS.


> --
> Regards...
> ----------------------
> Sumit Kumar Raj
> Software & Web Developer
> Contact no:-9590283524
> Bangalore,India
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
*
Thanks & Regards

"Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
kracekumar
www.kracekumar.com
*

From mandarvaze at gmail.com  Wed Apr  3 20:08:53 2013
From: mandarvaze at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?TWFuZGFyIFZhemUgLyDgpK7gpILgpKbgpL7gpLAg4KS14KSd4KWH?=)
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 23:38:53 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Hosting the Python Code on web
In-Reply-To: <CAHLM5TsrznNZykXrzzgeA450LoCkvJ8AVm3jzOQ6WSXE0bJ8AA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHLM5TsrznNZykXrzzgeA450LoCkvJ8AVm3jzOQ6WSXE0bJ8AA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADDYdfvVqAS9JaM5p4UeZgaoo7HV9mn218CQCAgD56iq6CAA9Q@mail.gmail.com>

> 1).Do I need to write the code again using any framework or is there any
> way?
>

Yes. Currently your code prints the output on the terminal
To display something in the browser, you'll need to use some web framework
You should be able to use most of the logic from your existing code


> 2) I have a linux hosting plan for my domain www.techpython.com.So, how
> can
> I host any django code or any python code which has third party module with
> it? Will the hosting support codes other than standard python library?
>

You should ask this to your hosting provider.
BTW, you can try https://www.pythonanywhere.com/pricing/
For free plan your application will be available at <username>.
pythonanywhere.com i.e. you can't use other domain name for free plan
(Might be OK if this is your final year project)


-Mandar

From satishsagar83 at gmail.com  Thu Apr  4 06:13:08 2013
From: satishsagar83 at gmail.com (L Radhakrishna Rao)
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2013 09:43:08 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] April month meetup
In-Reply-To: <CAO5c=mndj5-7ZUZ-3ydEw_p8-OXjK7ZpvzLM1EhmPPb=p09GMA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO5c=mndj5-7ZUZ-3ydEw_p8-OXjK7ZpvzLM1EhmPPb=p09GMA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAZd-jT2trov+LPKFY-fTRsbPtRK0Gz+EemQ6a1wFC9J_-TZxQ@mail.gmail.com>

Guys,

Is the venue decided?

Thanks


On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 9:57 PM, kracekumar ramaraju <
kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:

> All,
>
>  Unfortunately Siva can't attend April month meetup, so Django Hands on
> session is *CANCELLED*. If any one is willing to present a session is
> welcome.
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 1:24 AM, kracekumar ramaraju <
> kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > All,
> >
> >   Siva informed me he is willing to handle 3 hours hands-on session about
> > getting started with Django next month. We need a venue which has power
> > socket and decent internet connection. I would like to have others
> > suggestions about the format, looking forward for venue to host for next
> > meetup. We will be also needing few volunteers to help during meetup.
> >
> > --
> > *
> > Thanks & Regards
> >
> > "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> > kracekumar
> > www.kracekumar.com
> > *
> >
>
>
>
> --
> *
> Thanks & Regards
>
> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> kracekumar
> www.kracekumar.com
> *
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From gamebit07 at gmail.com  Thu Apr  4 12:46:00 2013
From: gamebit07 at gmail.com (Saket Bhushan)
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2013 16:16:00 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] BangPypers Digest, Vol 68, Issue 7
In-Reply-To: <mailman.11.1365069602.20226.bangpypers@python.org>
References: <mailman.11.1365069602.20226.bangpypers@python.org>
Message-ID: <CAO4xMFgTHkA5w-M+FXgtyRNMn7_zhRKS1kYvZcsjsdqM+UvmEQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 3:30 PM, <bangpypers-request at python.org> wrote:

> Send BangPypers mailing list submissions to
>         bangpypers at python.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         bangpypers-request at python.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         bangpypers-owner at python.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of BangPypers digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Hosting the Python Code on web (kracekumar ramaraju)
>    2. Re: Hosting the Python Code on web (Mandar Vaze / ????? ???)
>    3. Re: April month meetup (L Radhakrishna Rao)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 23:38:56 +0530
> From: kracekumar ramaraju <kracethekingmaker at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Hosting the Python Code on web
> Message-ID:
>         <CAO5c=m=
> 7rk4EN6GwitnvUrnh9Y_DeYZzi+sSyCRSBCBB2hBk-w at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 11:04 PM, SUMIT KUMAR RAJ <sumit786raj at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Hello Everyone,
> >                         I have kept learning from you all and I am very
> > thankful to you also.
> > Actually I am doing my final year project of engg. ie. "Sentiment
> Analysis
> > of Twitter Data" and I got this code on github
> > https://github.com/ravikiranj/twitter-sentiment-analyzer
> > which is working in terminal to classify any tweet as positive, negative
> or
> > neutral.
> > I wan't the same to be happening in browser by uploading or hosting the
> > code to my domain as www.sentiment140.com works.
> > I am really confused about it.Please help
> > 1).Do I need to write the code again using any framework or is there any
> > way?
> >
> >
> Yes, you can package the current work and choose framework to port existing
> work as Web application. Yes framework is required, in case you are trying
> any other trick it may end up dirty.
>
>
> > 2) I have a linux hosting plan for my domain www.techpython.com.So, how
> > can
> > I host any django code or any python code which has third party module
> with
> > it? Will the hosting support codes other than standard python library?
> >
> >
> It depends on hosting, with VPS you will get root access, so all the third
> party libraries can be installed. I don't think shared hosting as great
> option. Service like dotcloud, heroku are free. It is great bet to try on
> those and later migrate to VPS.
>
>
> > --
> > Regards...
> > ----------------------
> > Sumit Kumar Raj
> > Software & Web Developer
> > Contact no:-9590283524
> > Bangalore,India
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
>
> --
> *
> Thanks & Regards
>
> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> kracekumar
> www.kracekumar.com
> *
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 23:38:53 +0530
> From: Mandar Vaze / ????? ???   <mandarvaze at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Hosting the Python Code on web
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CADDYdfvVqAS9JaM5p4UeZgaoo7HV9mn218CQCAgD56iq6CAA9Q at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> > 1).Do I need to write the code again using any framework or is there any
> > way?
> >
>
> Yes. Currently your code prints the output on the terminal
> To display something in the browser, you'll need to use some web framework
> You should be able to use most of the logic from your existing code
>
>
> > 2) I have a linux hosting plan for my domain www.techpython.com.So, how
> > can
> > I host any django code or any python code which has third party module
> with
> > it? Will the hosting support codes other than standard python library?
> >
>
> You should ask this to your hosting provider.
> BTW, you can try https://www.pythonanywhere.com/pricing/
> For free plan your application will be available at <username>.
> pythonanywhere.com i.e. you can't use other domain name for free plan
> (Might be OK if this is your final year project)
>
>
> -Mandar
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2013 09:43:08 +0530
> From: L Radhakrishna Rao <satishsagar83 at gmail.com>
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] April month meetup
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CAAZd-jT2trov+LPKFY-fTRsbPtRK0Gz+EemQ6a1wFC9J_-TZxQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Guys,
>
> Is the venue decided?
>
> Thanks
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 3, 2013 at 9:57 PM, kracekumar ramaraju <
> kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > All,
> >
> >  Unfortunately Siva can't attend April month meetup, so Django Hands on
> > session is *CANCELLED*. If any one is willing to present a session is
> > welcome.
> >
>

I am in blore, I won't mind doing a session, please let me know date/venue.


> >
> > On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 1:24 AM, kracekumar ramaraju <
> > kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > All,
> > >
> > >   Siva informed me he is willing to handle 3 hours hands-on session
> about
> > > getting started with Django next month. We need a venue which has power
> > > socket and decent internet connection. I would like to have others
> > > suggestions about the format, looking forward for venue to host for
> next
> > > meetup. We will be also needing few volunteers to help during meetup.
> > >
> > > --
> > > *
> > > Thanks & Regards
> > >
> > > "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> > > kracekumar
> > > www.kracekumar.com
> > > *
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > *
> > Thanks & Regards
> >
> > "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> > kracekumar
> > www.kracekumar.com
> > *
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of BangPypers Digest, Vol 68, Issue 7
> *****************************************
>



-- 
Regards,
Saket Bhushan
twitter <https://twitter.com/gamebit07>,
linkedin<https://www.linkedin.com/in/bhushansaket>,
myshareplex <http://www.myshareplex.com>

From kracethekingmaker at gmail.com  Thu Apr  4 13:18:42 2013
From: kracethekingmaker at gmail.com (kracekumar ramaraju)
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2013 16:48:42 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] April month meetup
In-Reply-To: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO5c=mk9zD9S8AgH+vZ-fPuC7P5z-1Fia7QCFWp3rC891_uWEQ@mail.gmail.com>

Saket,

 Meetup is on 20th April, from 3.00PM to 6.00Pm you can present any topic.
Django or Machine Learning. Location is yet to be decided. Here is the
meetup page. RSVP: http://www.meetup.com/BangPypers/events/111834102/


On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 1:24 AM, kracekumar ramaraju <
kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:

> All,
>
>   Siva informed me he is willing to handle 3 hours hands-on session about
> getting started with Django next month. We need a venue which has power
> socket and decent internet connection. I would like to have others
> suggestions about the format, looking forward for venue to host for next
> meetup. We will be also needing few volunteers to help during meetup.
>
> --
> *
> Thanks & Regards
>
> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> kracekumar
> www.kracekumar.com
> *
>



-- 
*
Thanks & Regards

"Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
kracekumar
www.kracekumar.com
*

From shabda at agiliq.com  Fri Apr  5 08:46:33 2013
From: shabda at agiliq.com (Shabda Raaj)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 12:16:33 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
Message-ID: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>

Something I found interesting. (Please try answering before running in the
interpretor).

https://gist.github.com/shabda/5317134

--

import random
import string

def random_word_from_seed(seed, len):
    random.seed(seed)
    letters = string.ascii_lowercase
    return ''.join([random.choice(letters) for i in range(len)])

print random_word_from_seed(1944062, 5) +" "+random_word_from_seed(2068527, 5)



-- 
Thanks,
Shabda

Agiliq.com - Building Amazing Apps
agiliq.com/blog/ | github.com/agiliq
US: +13152854388 | IN: +919949997612 | Skype: shabda.raaj
Our Android Apps <https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=Agiliq> | Our
iOS Apps <https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/agiliq/id407918088>

From maniandram01 at gmail.com  Fri Apr  5 09:50:12 2013
From: maniandram01 at gmail.com (Ramchandra Apte)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 13:20:12 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
In-Reply-To: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAExgZOhoWmt8ANZGbriZMnhWhLK7zf1aN4mHQqva-fN7jBcO0Q@mail.gmail.com>

I suppose it will give Hello World? I've seen a similar question on
StackOverflow.


On 5 April 2013 12:16, Shabda Raaj <shabda at agiliq.com> wrote:

> Something I found interesting. (Please try answering before running in the
> interpretor).
>
> https://gist.github.com/shabda/5317134
>
> --
>
> import random
> import string
>
> def random_word_from_seed(seed, len):
>     random.seed(seed)
>     letters = string.ascii_lowercase
>     return ''.join([random.choice(letters) for i in range(len)])
>
> print random_word_from_seed(1944062, 5) +"
> "+random_word_from_seed(2068527, 5)
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks,
> Shabda
>
> Agiliq.com - Building Amazing Apps
> agiliq.com/blog/ | github.com/agiliq
> US: +13152854388 | IN: +919949997612 | Skype: shabda.raaj
> Our Android Apps <https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=Agiliq>
> | Our
> iOS Apps <https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/agiliq/id407918088>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From ruchiryshukla at gmail.com  Fri Apr  5 10:39:15 2013
From: ruchiryshukla at gmail.com (Ruchir Shukla)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 14:09:15 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
In-Reply-To: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALwJQj+YbduUb7f6YhF1UxoszYw+rTgDHKD9=az=FX6uUPzq2Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hello !

I did not get the Answer for how . can you explain the Answer ?


On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 12:16 PM, Shabda Raaj <shabda at agiliq.com> wrote:

> Something I found interesting. (Please try answering before running in the
> interpretor).
>
> https://gist.github.com/shabda/5317134
>
> --
>
> import random
> import string
>
> def random_word_from_seed(seed, len):
>     random.seed(seed)
>     letters = string.ascii_lowercase
>     return ''.join([random.choice(letters) for i in range(len)])
>
> print random_word_from_seed(1944062, 5) +"
> "+random_word_from_seed(2068527, 5)
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks,
> Shabda
>
> Agiliq.com - Building Amazing Apps
> agiliq.com/blog/ | github.com/agiliq
> US: +13152854388 | IN: +919949997612 | Skype: shabda.raaj
> Our Android Apps <https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=Agiliq>
> | Our
> iOS Apps <https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/agiliq/id407918088>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
----------------------------
Kind regards

Ruchir Shukla

Phone: +91 9099020687
ruchiryshukla at gmail.com; Ruchir Shukla <http://ruchir-shukla.blogspot.com/>

From gora at mimirtech.com  Fri Apr  5 11:29:38 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 14:59:38 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
In-Reply-To: <CALwJQj+YbduUb7f6YhF1UxoszYw+rTgDHKD9=az=FX6uUPzq2Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALwJQj+YbduUb7f6YhF1UxoszYw+rTgDHKD9=az=FX6uUPzq2Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGJgqyvbOJ4xx6ccRod17r801j_xODJKATnF+Yk0BM45fQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 5 April 2013 14:09, Ruchir Shukla <ruchiryshukla at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello !
>
> I did not get the Answer for how . can you explain the Answer ?
[...]

Seeding a pseudo-random number generator makes it
always generate a sequence specific to the seed. Someone
discovered the seeds to print the sequence for "hello" and
for "world".

Kind of cute, but IMHO teaches one nothing except maybe
to watch out for pseudo-random number generators where
the state,and the generated sequence can be gleaned from
a few examples. Unless one had already come across this
particular trick, there was no way to predict the output of the
program.

Regards,
Gora

From rammy.sagar at gmail.com  Fri Apr  5 11:40:23 2013
From: rammy.sagar at gmail.com (ram sagar)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 15:10:23 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Beginner Help
In-Reply-To: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOQBMqweuGb+eZFOMFZbG49rBJpAZLTS019tqMoExYRTm58ncg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABcLuY+cRpQx5R9Oky9kirfBw5jRai3Tz990K60MqJva5HL3vQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']

here words is a list and each element in that list can be accessed via
index.

words[0] will give cat
words[1] will give window

for more information on list :
http://docs.python.org/2/tutorial/introduction.html#lists



also in python for loop is quite from different from other programming
languages.

for more information on for loop :
http://docs.python.org/2/tutorial/controlflow.html#for-statements

for w in words:

for the first loop      ,the value in words[0] is picked and assigned to w
, i.e  w = words[0]
for the second loop ,the value in words[1] is picked and assigned to w ,
i.e  w = words[1]
.....so on

It is always better to have understanding of what data type we are working
on and then what are the operation we are performing.

I hope that you are clear about working of for loop.

Regards
Ram Sagar Mourya


On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Gaurav Malhotra <gaurav.tula at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> Below is the code (with output) which can be found in the Python Official
> Documentation:
>
> >>> # Measure some strings:
>
> ... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
>
> >>> for w in words:
>
> ...     print w, len(w)
>
> ...
>
> cat 3
>
> window 6
>
> defenestrate 12
>
> # The Problem is:
> When "w" is not defined how python interpreter can evaluate the output??
>
> Please Explain the lines where "w" is occurred. if i would replace "w" with
> any other variable, it will show the same output.
>
> I want to know "What is happening in the back (i mean how interpreter is
> handling it)" ??
>
> Thanks & Regards,
> Gaurav Malhotra
>
> --
> *Regards
> Gaurav Malhotra
> +91-9410562301*
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From mandarvaze at gmail.com  Fri Apr  5 12:36:18 2013
From: mandarvaze at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?TWFuZGFyIFZhemUgLyDgpK7gpILgpKbgpL7gpLAg4KS14KSd4KWH?=)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 16:06:18 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
In-Reply-To: <CACiMRGJgqyvbOJ4xx6ccRod17r801j_xODJKATnF+Yk0BM45fQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALwJQj+YbduUb7f6YhF1UxoszYw+rTgDHKD9=az=FX6uUPzq2Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGJgqyvbOJ4xx6ccRod17r801j_xODJKATnF+Yk0BM45fQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADDYdfuPLh=Q3V6L_MFTZ6Yg0oDSQPe8QVE81ADWdzjnTtPU0Q@mail.gmail.com>

> Seeding a pseudo-random number generator makes it
> always generate a sequence specific to the seed.


http://xkcd.com/221/

-Mandar

From abdulmuneer at gmail.com  Fri Apr  5 13:21:52 2013
From: abdulmuneer at gmail.com (Abdul Muneer)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 16:51:52 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
In-Reply-To: <CADDYdfuPLh=Q3V6L_MFTZ6Yg0oDSQPe8QVE81ADWdzjnTtPU0Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALwJQj+YbduUb7f6YhF1UxoszYw+rTgDHKD9=az=FX6uUPzq2Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGJgqyvbOJ4xx6ccRod17r801j_xODJKATnF+Yk0BM45fQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CADDYdfuPLh=Q3V6L_MFTZ6Yg0oDSQPe8QVE81ADWdzjnTtPU0Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMJTfgnjURBFeZLG6id2uy71rqt3a1SjhmKjJHh3R6awAOgSwA@mail.gmail.com>

Printing 'hello world' like a sir! :)

p.s.:caution when using builtins as variable names. (e.g.: len)

Regards,
Abdul Muneer

--
Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>


On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 4:06 PM, Mandar Vaze / ????? ??? <
mandarvaze at gmail.com> wrote:

> > Seeding a pseudo-random number generator makes it
> > always generate a sequence specific to the seed.
>
>
> http://xkcd.com/221/
>
> -Mandar
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From abpillai at gmail.com  Fri Apr  5 15:52:29 2013
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 19:22:29 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfgnjURBFeZLG6id2uy71rqt3a1SjhmKjJHh3R6awAOgSwA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALwJQj+YbduUb7f6YhF1UxoszYw+rTgDHKD9=az=FX6uUPzq2Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGJgqyvbOJ4xx6ccRod17r801j_xODJKATnF+Yk0BM45fQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CADDYdfuPLh=Q3V6L_MFTZ6Yg0oDSQPe8QVE81ADWdzjnTtPU0Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMJTfgnjURBFeZLG6id2uy71rqt3a1SjhmKjJHh3R6awAOgSwA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACpj97A2VCNqMk_-8F8eiNPXb4=vE3w_4N57GPXZm0ksLa4dZA@mail.gmail.com>

This tells one not to really on PRNGs to generate a truly random
state.

It is not very difficult to write some code to find the seed for
printing a given word if you got some time to waste :)

Here is one way.

http://pastebin.ca/2350376

Sample:

>>> findseed.find_seed_for_word('hello',100000)
0th count reached
100000th count reached
200000th count reached
300000th count reached
400000th count reached
500000th count reached
600000th count reached
700000th count reached
800000th count reached
900000th count reached
1000000th count reached
1100000th count reached
1200000th count reached
1300000th count reached
1400000th count reached
1500000th count reached
1600000th count reached
1700000th count reached
1800000th count reached
1900000th count reached
Seed is 1944062
Time taken: 30.5493340492

30s to find the seed, not as bad as I thought.




On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 4:51 PM, Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com> wrote:

> Printing 'hello world' like a sir! :)
>
> p.s.:caution when using builtins as variable names. (e.g.: len)
>
> Regards,
> Abdul Muneer
>
> --
> Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 4:06 PM, Mandar Vaze / ????? ??? <
> mandarvaze at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Seeding a pseudo-random number generator makes it
> > > always generate a sequence specific to the seed.
> >
> >
> > http://xkcd.com/221/
> >
> > -Mandar
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Regards,

--Anand

From gora at mimirtech.com  Fri Apr  5 16:16:54 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 19:46:54 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
In-Reply-To: <CACpj97A2VCNqMk_-8F8eiNPXb4=vE3w_4N57GPXZm0ksLa4dZA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALTVfMGQpxAQq=jiS=Mun6eKDMmpSgM5fyjDL51-KusichUXzw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALwJQj+YbduUb7f6YhF1UxoszYw+rTgDHKD9=az=FX6uUPzq2Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGJgqyvbOJ4xx6ccRod17r801j_xODJKATnF+Yk0BM45fQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CADDYdfuPLh=Q3V6L_MFTZ6Yg0oDSQPe8QVE81ADWdzjnTtPU0Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMJTfgnjURBFeZLG6id2uy71rqt3a1SjhmKjJHh3R6awAOgSwA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACpj97A2VCNqMk_-8F8eiNPXb4=vE3w_4N57GPXZm0ksLa4dZA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGLYOmXFDLLYo+3HZvgji+SmDqPFNc65mPwdQ4XphDxskg@mail.gmail.com>

On 5 April 2013 19:22, Anand B Pillai <abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:
> This tells one not to really on PRNGs to generate a truly random
> state.

Absolutely! PRNGs have their place, e.g., when one does
want a repeatable sequence if given the same seed. For
example, one would want that for Monte Carlo simulations
where the computation needs to be repeatable.

> It is not very difficult to write some code to find the seed for
> printing a given word if you got some time to waste :)
>
> Here is one way.
>
> http://pastebin.ca/2350376
[...]

Heh! Sounded like a fun exercise to do that, but was too busy
to try.

Regards,
Gora

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Fri Apr  5 17:19:58 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2013 20:49:58 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Fwd: Django Weekly - Issue #26
In-Reply-To: <eaef7dac7a307d2aa561dae7807aa364795.20130405143245@mail128.us2.mcsv.net>
References: <eaef7dac7a307d2aa561dae7807aa364795.20130405143245@mail128.us2.mcsv.net>
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFRKSRButxPW83hGmGbFK0_dnotfLdH55Jkfc4+Gymr5wQ@mail.gmail.com>

I see some interest w.r.t Django in this group; hope many have signed up
for this.

Venkat


**
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From kracethekingmaker at gmail.com  Sat Apr  6 19:04:51 2013
From: kracethekingmaker at gmail.com (kracekumar ramaraju)
Date: Sat, 6 Apr 2013 22:34:51 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] April month meetup
In-Reply-To: <CAO5c=mk9zD9S8AgH+vZ-fPuC7P5z-1Fia7QCFWp3rC891_uWEQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO5c=mk9zD9S8AgH+vZ-fPuC7P5z-1Fia7QCFWp3rC891_uWEQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO5c=mkfzL-76CJJu2-BJ42riQ4TC5eSXeBYFsRfYtvJ8EZC9w@mail.gmail.com>

All

 I may not be available for this month meetup, can some one take charge of
coordination April meetup. If interested let me know I will tell what needs
to be done.


On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 4:48 PM, kracekumar ramaraju <
kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:

> Saket,
>
>  Meetup is on 20th April, from 3.00PM to 6.00Pm you can present any topic.
> Django or Machine Learning. Location is yet to be decided. Here is the
> meetup page. RSVP: http://www.meetup.com/BangPypers/events/111834102/
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 1:24 AM, kracekumar ramaraju <
> kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> All,
>>
>>   Siva informed me he is willing to handle 3 hours hands-on session about
>> getting started with Django next month. We need a venue which has power
>> socket and decent internet connection. I would like to have others
>> suggestions about the format, looking forward for venue to host for next
>> meetup. We will be also needing few volunteers to help during meetup.
>>
>> --
>> *
>> Thanks & Regards
>>
>> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
>> kracekumar
>> www.kracekumar.com
>> *
>>
>
>
>
> --
> *
> Thanks & Regards
>
> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> kracekumar
> www.kracekumar.com
> *
>



-- 
*
Thanks & Regards

"Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
kracekumar
www.kracekumar.com
*

From shabda at agiliq.com  Sun Apr  7 07:56:06 2013
From: shabda at agiliq.com (Shabda Raaj)
Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2013 11:26:06 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] What is the output of this python program?
Message-ID: <CALTVfMHZ3=0r1EAZLeyWB2viueg6Dm4t+8=09WM262JS47rxtg@mail.gmail.com>

I saw this Java question on SO and ported to Python.

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15182496/why-does-this-code-print-hello-world

Here is the searcher function:
https://github.com/shabda/search-seed-for-word/blob/master/searcher.py

It tries to find the seeds using brute force.

Is there a way to optimize the searcher function? For example finding seed
for "hello" takes less than a minute. Finding  the seed for "hello world"
was taking longer than I was willing to let the program run. (The Python
random algo is Mersenne twister, which is a non cryptographic PRNG, so it
*might* be possible to find seeds without brute forcing.).

Related, we were recently discussing these (in our office) in terms of
Bitcoin type proof of work. Finding the seed for words is cpu intensive and
is a proof of work. Verifying the seed is trivial in cpu time.

-- 
Thanks,
Shabda

Agiliq.com - Building Amazing Apps
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From arvind.kamble at gmail.com  Sun Apr  7 08:14:48 2013
From: arvind.kamble at gmail.com (Aravind Kamble)
Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2013 11:44:48 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to set DNS IP of a machine
Message-ID: <CACw8P-nO=n-4gec5e97YLOM71-51tHHnAsdgyLWZH6VAB+jiyw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,

I am a beginner in Pyhton scripting. I want to know how can I set a
predefined IP address as DNS IP  of a machine in my Python script.



Thanks,
Aravind

From gora at mimirtech.com  Sun Apr  7 08:27:11 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2013 11:57:11 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to set DNS IP of a machine
In-Reply-To: <CACw8P-nO=n-4gec5e97YLOM71-51tHHnAsdgyLWZH6VAB+jiyw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACw8P-nO=n-4gec5e97YLOM71-51tHHnAsdgyLWZH6VAB+jiyw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGJwm7G+OQkLH79Md7hxYJEh1XgpbVRrv2inir_TsT0Kqg@mail.gmail.com>

On 7 April 2013 11:44, Aravind Kamble <arvind.kamble at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I am a beginner in Pyhton scripting. I want to know how can I set a
> predefined IP address as DNS IP  of a machine in my Python script.

You provide nowhere near enough details for anyone to help
you. To start with, what operating system? It is also not clear
what you want to do. Do you want to set the DNS nameserver
for the current machine that the DNS server is running on?
If so, you are very likely to need administrative access on the OS.

Regards,
Gora

From kishanmehta3 at gmail.com  Sun Apr  7 08:33:13 2013
From: kishanmehta3 at gmail.com (Kishan Mehta)
Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2013 12:03:13 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Job for python fresher?
Message-ID: <CAC5ThKG7kcK-AFnXF=p8uM5GnKHpnaCwfZoi3cYH5p9L5+SxMQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Is there any opening for python freshers?  Suggestion of groups that are
releated to python jobs will also be helpful.

Thank you,
Kishan Mehta

From arvind.kamble at gmail.com  Sun Apr  7 08:36:02 2013
From: arvind.kamble at gmail.com (Aravind Kamble)
Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2013 12:06:02 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to set DNS IP of a machine
In-Reply-To: <CACiMRGJwm7G+OQkLH79Md7hxYJEh1XgpbVRrv2inir_TsT0Kqg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACw8P-nO=n-4gec5e97YLOM71-51tHHnAsdgyLWZH6VAB+jiyw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGJwm7G+OQkLH79Md7hxYJEh1XgpbVRrv2inir_TsT0Kqg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACw8P-=VbRWE6Gc223e7syncd7K4x8QUT-R13ye6eKb5qa5V+w@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry for mistake. As I said I am the beginner, am still learning. I am
using windows 7 machine.
For my tests to run I need to set the machine's DNS IP address manually.
For example if my DNS server IP is 192.168.1.20 then I would go to Control
Panel\Network and Internet\Network Connections, open the properties of
Local LAN connection, open TCP/IP properties and set the DNS IP manually.

I want to do the same using script. Hope I am clear this time.


Thanks,
Aravind




On Sun, Apr 7, 2013 at 11:57 AM, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:

> On 7 April 2013 11:44, Aravind Kamble <arvind.kamble at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I am a beginner in Pyhton scripting. I want to know how can I set a
> > predefined IP address as DNS IP  of a machine in my Python script.
>
> You provide nowhere near enough details for anyone to help
> you. To start with, what operating system? It is also not clear
> what you want to do. Do you want to set the DNS nameserver
> for the current machine that the DNS server is running on?
> If so, you are very likely to need administrative access on the OS.
>
> Regards,
> Gora
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From gnuyoga at gmail.com  Sun Apr  7 10:19:19 2013
From: gnuyoga at gmail.com (Sreekandh B)
Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2013 13:49:19 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to set DNS IP of a machine
In-Reply-To: <CACw8P-=VbRWE6Gc223e7syncd7K4x8QUT-R13ye6eKb5qa5V+w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACw8P-nO=n-4gec5e97YLOM71-51tHHnAsdgyLWZH6VAB+jiyw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGJwm7G+OQkLH79Md7hxYJEh1XgpbVRrv2inir_TsT0Kqg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACw8P-=VbRWE6Gc223e7syncd7K4x8QUT-R13ye6eKb5qa5V+w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJ-rM4kJO-gbJTsufYBvOpVmUCyjWeWBchOQQJqG9gLs1P982g@mail.gmail.com>

On Sunday, April 7, 2013, Aravind Kamble wrote:

> Sorry for mistake. As I said I am the beginner, am still learning. I am
> using windows 7 machine.
> For my tests to run I need to set the machine's DNS IP address manually.
> For example if my DNS server IP is 192.168.1.20 then I would go to Control
> Panel\Network and Internet\Network Connections, open the properties of
> Local LAN connection, open TCP/IP properties and set the DNS IP manually


Am not sure about DNS entries but you can always edit hosts file under
system32\etc folder and get windows resolve to required IP

http://kb.simplywebhosting.com/idx/0/045/article/


-- 
gnuyoga.in

From foxrun2005 at gmail.com  Tue Apr  9 20:16:58 2013
From: foxrun2005 at gmail.com (Kamalakar gs)
Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2013 23:46:58 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] HI Need help for python
Message-ID: <CAN+F=acSVaAZgmDffpwdkX_Jy3ZJ39z9kT4Yxz+EdsEmbQz6eQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
Actually I have PCL file (i..e patran file).I want python coding to be done
so that it will read the PCL file and open Patran GUI window.How to do
that.Kindly find the attached PCL file for your ref.
Thanks regards
Kamalakar

From benignbala at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 03:33:08 2013
From: benignbala at gmail.com (Balachandran Sivakumar)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 07:03:08 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made mandatory
 for approved institutions by AICTE
Message-ID: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I understand that this is a Python group and not a free software
group. But there are quite a few free software enthusiasts here, and
they might already know/like to know the news. So, I apologise
upfront, for posting this off-topic information.


But Microsoft, has made a pact with AICTE, by which all college
approved my AICTE will have to mandatorily use office 365+MS's cloud
email solution. I came to know about this when my alma mater,
Thiagarajar College of Engineering where we have been running our own
mail servers with just free software was asked to migrate to AICTE by
pointing the MX records to some domain of Microsoft.

Here is the release from AICTE -
http://www.aicte-india.org/downloads/AICTE_notice.pdf

Here is an article about this on Microsoft's site -
http://www.microsoft.com/casestudies/Microsoft-Office-365/All-India-Council-for-Technical-Education/India-Institute-Deploys-7.5-Million-Office-365-Seats-to-Improve-Governance-Learning/710000002268

Linux Users Group, Chennai and a few other LUGs are also discussing
this issue. Would like to know if people here suggest something to
counter this. Thanks

-- 
Thank you
Balachandran Sivakumar

Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
                                                             - Swami Vivekananda

Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/

From gora at mimirtech.com  Mon Apr 15 05:43:00 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 09:13:00 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>

On 15 April 2013 07:03, Balachandran Sivakumar <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I understand that this is a Python group and not a free software
> group. But there are quite a few free software enthusiasts here, and
> they might already know/like to know the news. So, I apologise
> upfront, for posting this off-topic information.
[...]

Please do not indulge in such off-topic postings, no matter
how important you feel that your message is. By the argument
that your message is important enough that it should be seen
by people everywhere, every mailing list becomes a catch-all
for all content. As you seem to be well aware, there are lists
dedicated to such topics: Please stick to them.

Regards,
Gora

From benignbala at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 07:47:30 2013
From: benignbala at gmail.com (Balachandran Sivakumar)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 11:17:30 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:13 AM, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:
> On 15 April 2013 07:03, Balachandran Sivakumar <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Please do not indulge in such off-topic postings, no matter
> how important you feel that your message is. By the argument
> that your message is important enough that it should be seen
> by people everywhere, every mailing list becomes a catch-all
> for all content. As you seem to be well aware, there are lists
> dedicated to such topics: Please stick to them.
>

         I know there exists other lists elsewhere. I am not sure if
one such list/group of people exists in Bangalore. If you know of any
please point me. I am not going to argue with your response, but you
misjudged. Thanks


-- 
Thank you
Balachandran Sivakumar

Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
                                                             - Swami Vivekananda

Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/

From gora at mimirtech.com  Mon Apr 15 09:12:47 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 12:42:47 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRG+1o2Ca8tsjYGgDNQue6a7ExK2w_RY2XP=81P5n7o5L0Q@mail.gmail.com>

On 15 April 2013 11:17, Balachandran Sivakumar <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:13 AM, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:
>> On 15 April 2013 07:03, Balachandran Sivakumar <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Please do not indulge in such off-topic postings, no matter
>> how important you feel that your message is. By the argument
>> that your message is important enough that it should be seen
>> by people everywhere, every mailing list becomes a catch-all
>> for all content. As you seem to be well aware, there are lists
>> dedicated to such topics: Please stick to them.
>>
>
>          I know there exists other lists elsewhere. I am not sure if
> one such list/group of people exists in Bangalore. If you know of any
> please point me. I am not going to argue with your response, but you
> misjudged. Thanks

I am not sure of such an alternative list, but IMHO
that still does not make it right to post off-topic on
this list. Not sure what argument there is to be made
about this: Just requesting you to refrain from such
posts.

Regards,
Gora

From aditya at thinrhino.net.in  Mon Apr 15 11:30:59 2013
From: aditya at thinrhino.net.in (=?UTF-8?B?4KSG4KSm4KS/4KSk4KWN4KSvIOCksuCkmOCkvuCkn+Clhw==?=)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 15:00:59 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABPE4fVhOw3dQhzKsufyKS9+RUrVO0mrm917Hi5VtX-fjyaM3Q@mail.gmail.com>

On 15 April 2013 11:17, Balachandran Sivakumar <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:

>  I know there exists other lists elsewhere. I am not sure if
> one such list/group of people exists in Bangalore. If you know of any
> please point me.
>

?Bangalore Linux Users Group? http://linux-bangalore.org/blug/?



-- 
Life is like riding a bicycle.
To keep your balance you must keep moving.

From svaksha at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 11:50:49 2013
From: svaksha at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?IOCkuOCljeCkteCkleCljeCktw==?=)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 15:20:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:17 AM, Balachandran Sivakumar
<benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>          I know there exists other lists elsewhere. I am not sure if
> one such list/group of people exists in Bangalore. If you know of any

Try Bengaluru LUG  ? http://groups.google.com/group/ilug-bengaluru
And/Or,
Fosscomm.in's General Discussions on Campaigns and Tasks  ?
http://lists.fosscom.in/listinfo.cgi/network-fosscom.in
-- 
Best,  Vid  ? http://svaksha.com ?

From maniandram01 at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 14:15:10 2013
From: maniandram01 at gmail.com (Ramchandra Apte)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 17:45:10 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAExgZOjO-CbLSmWPRWa=W9Pot2wFcsBXD+EKdNLTiBDehKBgPw@mail.gmail.com>

+1000


On 15 April 2013 09:13, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:

> On 15 April 2013 07:03, Balachandran Sivakumar <benignbala at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I understand that this is a Python group and not a free software
> > group. But there are quite a few free software enthusiasts here, and
> > they might already know/like to know the news. So, I apologise
> > upfront, for posting this off-topic information.
> [...]
>
> Please do not indulge in such off-topic postings, no matter
> how important you feel that your message is. By the argument
> that your message is important enough that it should be seen
> by people everywhere, every mailing list becomes a catch-all
> for all content. As you seem to be well aware, there are lists
> dedicated to such topics: Please stick to them.
>
> Regards,
> Gora
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From benignbala at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 14:19:24 2013
From: benignbala at gmail.com (Balachandran Sivakumar)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 17:49:24 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 3:20 PM, ?????? <svaksha at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:17 AM, Balachandran Sivakumar
> <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Try Bengaluru LUG  ? http://groups.google.com/group/ilug-bengaluru
> And/Or,
> Fosscomm.in's General Discussions on Campaigns and Tasks  ?
> http://lists.fosscom.in/listinfo.cgi/network-fosscom.in


        Thanks for the links. I will try Bengaluru LUG. I didn't even
know that we have a LUG in Bangalore :(


-- 
Thank you
Balachandran Sivakumar

Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
                                                             - Swami Vivekananda

Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/

From san00718 at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 15:20:52 2013
From: san00718 at gmail.com (Santosh Kumar)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 18:50:52 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>

Also there is another vdry active community of linux users,
Free Software Movement Karnataka(FSMK),
www.fsmk.org


On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 5:49 PM, Balachandran Sivakumar <
benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 3:20 PM, ?????? <svaksha at gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:17 AM, Balachandran Sivakumar
> > <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Try Bengaluru LUG  ? http://groups.google.com/group/ilug-bengaluru
> > And/Or,
> > Fosscomm.in's General Discussions on Campaigns and Tasks  ?
> > http://lists.fosscom.in/listinfo.cgi/network-fosscom.in
>
>
>         Thanks for the links. I will try Bengaluru LUG. I didn't even
> know that we have a LUG in Bangalore :(
>
>
> --
> Thank you
> Balachandran Sivakumar
>
> Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
>                                                              - Swami
> Vivekananda
>
> Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
> Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From sriramnrn at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 16:53:19 2013
From: sriramnrn at gmail.com (Sriram Narayanan)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 09:53:19 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>

The reason FOSCOMM was setup some years ago was because various such groups
actually have some common interests.

There are times when we need to get together to defend even other
technologies and platforms. If we continue to declare "Not here" without
constructively figuring out if the discussion can be carried out elsewhere,
vested interests like MS will pick out areas one after the other, and there
wouldn't be enough voices when it's a specific group's turn to face their
brunt.

Please see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came

I'd attended the initial FOSCOMM meet at CIS, but I think it died out after
that.

-- Ram


On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:20 AM, Santosh Kumar <san00718 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Also there is another vdry active community of linux users,
> Free Software Movement Karnataka(FSMK),
> www.fsmk.org
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 5:49 PM, Balachandran Sivakumar <
> benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 3:20 PM, ?????? <svaksha at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:17 AM, Balachandran Sivakumar
> > > <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Try Bengaluru LUG  ? http://groups.google.com/group/ilug-bengaluru
> > > And/Or,
> > > Fosscomm.in's General Discussions on Campaigns and Tasks  ?
> > > http://lists.fosscom.in/listinfo.cgi/network-fosscom.in
> >
> >
> >         Thanks for the links. I will try Bengaluru LUG. I didn't even
> > know that we have a LUG in Bangalore :(
> >
> >
> > --
> > Thank you
> > Balachandran Sivakumar
> >
> > Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
> >                                                              - Swami
> > Vivekananda
> >
> > Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
> > Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
------------------------------------
Belenix: www.belenix.org
Twitter: @sriramnrn

From dialkforkaushik at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 17:24:18 2013
From: dialkforkaushik at gmail.com (Kaushik Kalyanaraman)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 10:24:18 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>

10 replies to Godwin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law. Good
job folks ! [/s]

But, seriously, and even though even this reply is completely OT to
the interests of this list, please try to provide your own reasons in
your own words without sensationalizing with quotes, etc. At least
then, some may be sympathetic (not claiming I am or I am not) to your
cause. Otherwise, it equally well reeks of FUD on your part.

Finally, people who are "religious" about FOSS (or other open source
movements) should stop for a tiny bit to figure out if their militant
propositioning pans out in the larger scheme of things. For example, I
notice that OP as well as other defendant(s) are using Gmail. So,
could they (or others) please enlighten me as to whether Gmail or
Google, and by extension the internet itself (including intermediate
routers, ISP server -- software as well as hardware components, etc.;
you get the picture) is all built on the notion of openness that they
are probably advocating in their "linux vs windows" battle. (For the
record, I use neither.) If not, and if this is a fight against some
notion of corporate greed, then why only in this particular instance ?
I don't think that people aren't posting OT discussions to these lists
proclaiming an urgent need for fight against corruption and/or other
systemic deficiencies in the Indian context.

tl;dr: Please follow ground rules and do not post these OT
discussions. Also, please don't provide your defense or get all
apologetic about why this needs to be posted here, especially after
being pointed to.

Thanks !

-Kaushik

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:53 AM, Sriram Narayanan <sriramnrn at gmail.com> wrote:
> The reason FOSCOMM was setup some years ago was because various such groups
> actually have some common interests.
>
> There are times when we need to get together to defend even other
> technologies and platforms. If we continue to declare "Not here" without
> constructively figuring out if the discussion can be carried out elsewhere,
> vested interests like MS will pick out areas one after the other, and there
> wouldn't be enough voices when it's a specific group's turn to face their
> brunt.
>
> Please see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came
>
> I'd attended the initial FOSCOMM meet at CIS, but I think it died out after
> that.
>
> -- Ram
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:20 AM, Santosh Kumar <san00718 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Also there is another vdry active community of linux users,
>> Free Software Movement Karnataka(FSMK),
>> www.fsmk.org
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 5:49 PM, Balachandran Sivakumar <
>> benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 3:20 PM, ?????? <svaksha at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:17 AM, Balachandran Sivakumar
>> > > <benignbala at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Try Bengaluru LUG  ? http://groups.google.com/group/ilug-bengaluru
>> > > And/Or,
>> > > Fosscomm.in's General Discussions on Campaigns and Tasks  ?
>> > > http://lists.fosscom.in/listinfo.cgi/network-fosscom.in
>> >
>> >
>> >         Thanks for the links. I will try Bengaluru LUG. I didn't even
>> > know that we have a LUG in Bangalore :(
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Thank you
>> > Balachandran Sivakumar
>> >
>> > Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
>> >                                                              - Swami
>> > Vivekananda
>> >
>> > Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
>> > Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > BangPypers mailing list
>> > BangPypers at python.org
>> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>
>
>
> --
> ------------------------------------
> Belenix: www.belenix.org
> Twitter: @sriramnrn
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers



-- 
To know that we know what we know, and that we do not know what we do
not know, that is true knowledge.

From svaksha at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 19:35:01 2013
From: svaksha at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?IOCkuOCljeCkteCkleCljeCktw==?=)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 23:05:01 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN9ztG--udj70tnaQtCY37g3iz_Ugu9g3Y2-pFO7YfAyK12piQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:54 PM, Kaushik Kalyanaraman
<dialkforkaushik at gmail.com> wrote:
> 10 replies to Godwin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law. Good
> job folks ! [/s]
>
> But, seriously, and even though even this reply is completely OT to
> the interests of this list, please try to provide your own reasons in
> your own words without sensationalizing with quotes, etc. At least
> then, some may be sympathetic (not claiming I am or I am not) to your
> cause. Otherwise, it equally well reeks of FUD on your part.
>
> Finally, people who are "religious" about FOSS (or other open source
> movements) should stop for a tiny bit to figure out if their militant

"militant"?  .... Ah, is the name-calling supposed to shame people into silence?

[...SNIP...]

> tl;dr: Please follow ground rules and do not post these OT
> discussions. Also, please don't provide your defense or get all
> apologetic about why this needs to be posted here, especially after

The second sentence/para of your email contradicts the above, where
you claim your reply is OT, against the interest of this list, and yet
exhorted list members thus: "please try to provide your own reasons in
your own words without sensationalizing with quotes, etc."</quote>.

-- 
Best,  Vid  ? http://svaksha.com ?

From benignbala at gmail.com  Mon Apr 15 20:28:58 2013
From: benignbala at gmail.com (Balachandran Sivakumar)
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 23:58:58 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMbkTgLQGRsMQXJE3Wv400JO0m3T9V99u53vJqCJcdwUHQt_mg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:54 PM, Kaushik Kalyanaraman
<dialkforkaushik at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> But, seriously, and even though even this reply is completely OT to
> the interests of this list, please try to provide your own reasons in
> your own words without sensationalizing with quotes, etc. At least
> then, some may be sympathetic (not claiming I am or I am not) to your
> cause. Otherwise, it equally well reeks of FUD on your part.
>

      What are you trying to say ? We aren't talk about "sympathy"
towards anything/anyone here.

> Finally, people who are "religious" about FOSS (or other open source

       I don't understand this either. What do you mean being
"religious" about foss/other open source movements. I was being
"religious" about freedom, and a few of the members pointed out that,
valid or not, this is not the place for it. A few were nice enough to
suggest forums where such issues could be brought up. That ended the
discussion. So, again, what are you trying to say ? That we should not
care about freedom ? Well...

> movements) should stop for a tiny bit to figure out if their militant
> propositioning pans out in the larger scheme of things. For example, I

      Care to explain what "militant propositioning" means. It would
be nice if people are careful with their language. And again, it would
be nice if people do not use phrases just because they have an urge to
use it somewhere.

> notice that OP as well as other defendant(s) are using Gmail. So,
> could they (or others) please enlighten me as to whether Gmail or

       I have seen this argument over and over. I use Gmail because I
decided to use it(I don't have the necessity to run my own server,
with exim/postfix whatever). It was not forced on me by
parents/teachers/college/friends/whatever . The whole point is about
freedom.

> you get the picture) is all built on the notion of openness that they
> are probably advocating in their "linux vs windows" battle. (For the
> record, I use neither.) If not, and if this is a fight against some

 I hate to say this - But please, read mails before you reply, and
reply only when you know what you are talking about. No one is talking
about windows vs linux(or what ever you are imagining this to be).
Again, I am forced to repeat, it would be nice if people do not use
phrases just because they have an urge to use it somewhere.

>
> discussions. Also, please don't provide your defense or get all
> apologetic about why this needs to be posted here, especially after
> being pointed to.
>

     I don't have to do either. I haven't committed any crime for
which there is a need to defend myself.  I had some assumptions before
I posted, and changed those later. Thanks.

-- 
Thank you
Balachandran Sivakumar

Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
                                                             - Swami Vivekananda

Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Tue Apr 16 07:40:24 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 11:10:24 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Please stop (was: [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for
	Education made mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE)
In-Reply-To: <CAMbkTgLQGRsMQXJE3Wv400JO0m3T9V99u53vJqCJcdwUHQt_mg@mail.gmail.com>
	(Balachandran Sivakumar's message of "Mon, 15 Apr 2013 23:58:58
	+0530")
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLQGRsMQXJE3Wv400JO0m3T9V99u53vJqCJcdwUHQt_mg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <871uabxcc7.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>


This conversation is getting more pointless than the original post which
was not really on topic to begin with.

If anyone has things that need to be sorted out, please do so but not on
the list.

-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From smrutilekha at gmail.com  Tue Apr 16 08:47:18 2013
From: smrutilekha at gmail.com (Smrutilekha Swain)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 12:17:18 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] I need some help/guidance
Message-ID: <CANTP=Fi+FAcE7zdic_SBSfysgijze356tJgSQAcYgUuG5ho5og@mail.gmail.com>

i am writing a program using PyQt4. i have created a table containg name of
the instruments, locations, its latitudes, longitude and altitude.

there may be two instruments and its locations are same but different
latitude and longitude with mild difference.

so now i want to sort the table by latitude or longitude whose have least
difference...

can u plz give me sume hints or guidance how to do.....


thanzzzzzzz in advance..........waiting for ur reply............

From abdulmuneer at gmail.com  Tue Apr 16 10:02:26 2013
From: abdulmuneer at gmail.com (Abdul Muneer)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 13:32:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] I need some help/guidance
In-Reply-To: <CANTP=Fi+FAcE7zdic_SBSfysgijze356tJgSQAcYgUuG5ho5og@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANTP=Fi+FAcE7zdic_SBSfysgijze356tJgSQAcYgUuG5ho5og@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMJTfgmpkEfxA7odA+xrHF_AWcorzBQOSej9V15Y4+xAdFk0hQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Basically you can sort any list by passing a key as follows:


base_location = (x,y)
locations = [(x1, y1), (x2, y2), ....(xn, yn)]

def distance_between(geocordinate1, geo_cordinate2):
    ''' write your code here to return the distance between two cordinates
      you can use google maps api for this.
    ''''
    pass
*locations.sort(key = lambda x: distance_between(x, base_location))* #sorts
the list in-place


Regards,
Abdul Muneer

--
Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>


On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 12:17 PM, Smrutilekha Swain
<smrutilekha at gmail.com>wrote:

> i am writing a program using PyQt4. i have created a table containg name of
> the instruments, locations, its latitudes, longitude and altitude.
>
> there may be two instruments and its locations are same but different
> latitude and longitude with mild difference.
>
> so now i want to sort the table by latitude or longitude whose have least
> difference...
>
> can u plz give me sume hints or guidance how to do.....
>
>
> thanzzzzzzz in advance..........waiting for ur reply............
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From abpillai at gmail.com  Tue Apr 16 10:44:18 2013
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 14:14:18 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Please stop (was: [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for
 Education made mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE)
In-Reply-To: <871uabxcc7.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLQGRsMQXJE3Wv400JO0m3T9V99u53vJqCJcdwUHQt_mg@mail.gmail.com>
	<871uabxcc7.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CACpj97Cq3236bTPzFupbTMiHMa2OLBh+F9ciGjOzpGzEcvCCGA@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 11:10 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

>
> This conversation is getting more pointless than the original post which
> was not really on topic to begin with.
>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorites_paradox

Let us not create heaps of sand which don't have any sand particles in them
:)



> If anyone has things that need to be sorted out, please do so but not on
> the list.
>

+1.


>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Regards,

--Anand

From gora at mimirtech.com  Tue Apr 16 12:20:55 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 15:50:55 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] I need some help/guidance
In-Reply-To: <CANTP=Fi+FAcE7zdic_SBSfysgijze356tJgSQAcYgUuG5ho5og@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANTP=Fi+FAcE7zdic_SBSfysgijze356tJgSQAcYgUuG5ho5og@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGKLMOaUXJbqhgnRsvMM4fwMci2uZsFE8K+CB4yumjuenw@mail.gmail.com>

On 16 April 2013 12:17, Smrutilekha Swain <smrutilekha at gmail.com> wrote:
> i am writing a program using PyQt4. i have created a table containg name of
> the instruments, locations, its latitudes, longitude and altitude.
>
> there may be two instruments and its locations are same but different
> latitude and longitude with mild difference.
>
> so now i want to sort the table by latitude or longitude whose have least
> difference...
[...]

What do you mean by a "table"? A database table, or a
Python sequence?

Abdul has already pointed out how to sort a list in
Python. However, if you want any kind of scale, you
will need a database that supports GIS operations,
and a web GIS framework if you need a presence on
the web. I would suggest GeoDjango with PostGIS.

Regards,
Gora

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Tue Apr 16 13:27:16 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 16:57:16 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Do not Email
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFTVLU38ObcTVbGgVK8xWfss8iWfOkxk+DBJhy3MdceZeg@mail.gmail.com>

In the wake of recent spam :
http://blogs.technet.com/b/exchange/archive/2004/04/08/109626.aspx

Venkat
http://twitter.com/venkasub

From ramdaz at gmail.com  Tue Apr 16 13:32:26 2013
From: ramdaz at gmail.com (Ramdas S)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 17:02:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Amazon and Django
Message-ID: <CAP915yX6srukZ-puSqbOsFeTpXaM_3swd4+nYDvX3Ggm4D=YaQ@mail.gmail.com>

Anyone running Django apps on amazon, I need to spec and figure out some
costing. Please do let me know? <http://ramdaz.wordpress.com>

From gora at mimirtech.com  Tue Apr 16 14:41:13 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 18:11:13 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Amazon and Django
In-Reply-To: <CAP915yX6srukZ-puSqbOsFeTpXaM_3swd4+nYDvX3Ggm4D=YaQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAP915yX6srukZ-puSqbOsFeTpXaM_3swd4+nYDvX3Ggm4D=YaQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGKAPAoyvW3mk7p+5SPQbyO_te2CLY_znzJX4=b38qOryA@mail.gmail.com>

On 16 April 2013 17:02, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> Anyone running Django apps on amazon, I need to spec and figure out some
> costing. Please do let me know? <http://ramdaz.wordpress.com>

This is maybe a little off-topic, but we do use Django
extensively on AWS. Maybe contact me off-list?

Regards,
Gora

From ramdaz at gmail.com  Tue Apr 16 14:43:48 2013
From: ramdaz at gmail.com (Ramdas S)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 18:13:48 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Amazon and Django
In-Reply-To: <CACiMRGKAPAoyvW3mk7p+5SPQbyO_te2CLY_znzJX4=b38qOryA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAP915yX6srukZ-puSqbOsFeTpXaM_3swd4+nYDvX3Ggm4D=YaQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGKAPAoyvW3mk7p+5SPQbyO_te2CLY_znzJX4=b38qOryA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAP915yUX2XKmRUU-oronX7e0EFi1DiPLTfaCXGbACoDCXpe0Lw@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 6:11 PM, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:

> On 16 April 2013 17:02, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Anyone running Django apps on amazon, I need to spec and figure out some
> > costing. Please do let me know? <http://ramdaz.wordpress.com>
>
> This is maybe a little off-topic, but we do use Django
> extensively on AWS. Maybe contact me off-list?
>

Absolutely, give me your contact details

>
> Regards,
> Gora
>



-- 
Ramdas S
+91 9342 583 065
My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com

From gora at mimirtech.com  Tue Apr 16 15:15:41 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 2013 18:45:41 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Amazon and Django
In-Reply-To: <CAP915yUX2XKmRUU-oronX7e0EFi1DiPLTfaCXGbACoDCXpe0Lw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAP915yX6srukZ-puSqbOsFeTpXaM_3swd4+nYDvX3Ggm4D=YaQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGKAPAoyvW3mk7p+5SPQbyO_te2CLY_znzJX4=b38qOryA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUX2XKmRUU-oronX7e0EFi1DiPLTfaCXGbACoDCXpe0Lw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGL625=tM72baQfKO3z5nBWsUN1EAMrLmte1E9nav__4jQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 16 April 2013 18:13, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 6:11 PM, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:
>>
>> On 16 April 2013 17:02, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Anyone running Django apps on amazon, I need to spec and figure out some
>> > costing. Please do let me know? <http://ramdaz.wordpress.com>
>>
>> This is maybe a little off-topic, but we do use Django
>> extensively on AWS. Maybe contact me off-list?
>
>
> Absolutely, give me your contact details

Please email me at this address.

Regards,
Gora

From smrutilekha at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 06:30:40 2013
From: smrutilekha at gmail.com (Smrutilekha Swain)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 10:00:40 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] I need some help/guidance
In-Reply-To: <CACiMRGKLMOaUXJbqhgnRsvMM4fwMci2uZsFE8K+CB4yumjuenw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANTP=Fi+FAcE7zdic_SBSfysgijze356tJgSQAcYgUuG5ho5og@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGKLMOaUXJbqhgnRsvMM4fwMci2uZsFE8K+CB4yumjuenw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANTP=Fhqt0f_CZ7_o2_bFCyWLpu5LDJr+uWFJuONrPo9jTtCAg@mail.gmail.com>

It is a database table which i have created using QTableWidget n it
contains 7 columns. first column is checkbox for selecting the rows den
name, site, latitude, longitude, altitude and date of entry.

in that database some r redundant data like same name n same site but
little difference in latitude or longitude. so i want to sort the table in
such a way that the redundant data having least value will come first like
in name- A, Site- V, latitude-23.456, longitude-87.789 n in another row
name-A, Site-V, latitude-23.222, longitude-87.789. so i want the minimum
value sud come first.


another query is how to sort the table by date of entry as the date of
entry is in string....

i will b vry grateful if u give me sum help............no api n no GIS...


thanzzz in advance..............


On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 3:50 PM, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:

> On 16 April 2013 12:17, Smrutilekha Swain <smrutilekha at gmail.com> wrote:
> > i am writing a program using PyQt4. i have created a table containg name
> of
> > the instruments, locations, its latitudes, longitude and altitude.
> >
> > there may be two instruments and its locations are same but different
> > latitude and longitude with mild difference.
> >
> > so now i want to sort the table by latitude or longitude whose have least
> > difference...
> [...]
>
> What do you mean by a "table"? A database table, or a
> Python sequence?
>
> Abdul has already pointed out how to sort a list in
> Python. However, if you want any kind of scale, you
> will need a database that supports GIS operations,
> and a web GIS framework if you need a presence on
> the web. I would suggest GeoDjango with PostGIS.
>
> Regards,
> Gora
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From gora at mimirtech.com  Wed Apr 17 06:49:25 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 10:19:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] I need some help/guidance
In-Reply-To: <CANTP=Fhqt0f_CZ7_o2_bFCyWLpu5LDJr+uWFJuONrPo9jTtCAg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANTP=Fi+FAcE7zdic_SBSfysgijze356tJgSQAcYgUuG5ho5og@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGKLMOaUXJbqhgnRsvMM4fwMci2uZsFE8K+CB4yumjuenw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CANTP=Fhqt0f_CZ7_o2_bFCyWLpu5LDJr+uWFJuONrPo9jTtCAg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGLjCdZQ_Bfq+NHv8P9CAMJdAjPe=JA5LvOwkCXs6iCBnQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 17 April 2013 10:00, Smrutilekha Swain <smrutilekha at gmail.com> wrote:
> It is a database table which i have created using QTableWidget n it
> contains 7 columns. first column is checkbox for selecting the rows den
> name, site, latitude, longitude, altitude and date of entry.
[...]

In that case, I would look into what facilities PyQt4 offers to
access such database tables. I am not familiar with PyQt4.
Alternatively,  you can use standard Python DB access and
run specific SQL, or use a ORM as a higher-level interface.

Regards,
Gora

From anandology at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 11:08:20 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 14:38:20 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] April month meetup
In-Reply-To: <CAO5c=mkfzL-76CJJu2-BJ42riQ4TC5eSXeBYFsRfYtvJ8EZC9w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO5c=mk9zD9S8AgH+vZ-fPuC7P5z-1Fia7QCFWp3rC891_uWEQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO5c=mkfzL-76CJJu2-BJ42riQ4TC5eSXeBYFsRfYtvJ8EZC9w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFxv+60SRW9U1sbW=3HDqUNmdWeWzSaMwoxZnws3S3=-cA@mail.gmail.com>

Krace is out of town. I've asked Baiju if he can coordinate the meetup at
ZeOmega. He said he'll find someone to coordinate the event there.

So we have Zeomega as tentative venue. Lets wait for a final confirmation
from Baiju.

Tentative Venue: ZeOmega, Basavanagudi

Date: Saturday, April 20, 2013
Time: 3:00PM

Agenda:

* Hands on django Session - Beginner/Intermediate Level. by Saket Bhushan
* Lightening talks

If you any of you would like to present something, you are welcome.

Meetup page: http://www.meetup.com/BangPypers/events/111834102/

Anand




On Sat, Apr 6, 2013 at 10:34 PM, kracekumar ramaraju <
kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:

> All
>
>  I may not be available for this month meetup, can some one take charge of
> coordination April meetup. If interested let me know I will tell what needs
> to be done.
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 4:48 PM, kracekumar ramaraju <
> kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Saket,
> >
> >  Meetup is on 20th April, from 3.00PM to 6.00Pm you can present any
> topic.
> > Django or Machine Learning. Location is yet to be decided. Here is the
> > meetup page. RSVP: http://www.meetup.com/BangPypers/events/111834102/
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 1:24 AM, kracekumar ramaraju <
> > kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> All,
> >>
> >>   Siva informed me he is willing to handle 3 hours hands-on session
> about
> >> getting started with Django next month. We need a venue which has power
> >> socket and decent internet connection. I would like to have others
> >> suggestions about the format, looking forward for venue to host for next
> >> meetup. We will be also needing few volunteers to help during meetup.
> >>
> >> --
> >> *
> >> Thanks & Regards
> >>
> >> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> >> kracekumar
> >> www.kracekumar.com
> >> *
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > *
> > Thanks & Regards
> >
> > "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> > kracekumar
> > www.kracekumar.com
> > *
> >
>
>
>
> --
> *
> Thanks & Regards
>
> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
> kracekumar
> www.kracekumar.com
> *
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Anand
http://anandology.com/

From baiju.m.mail at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 16:50:11 2013
From: baiju.m.mail at gmail.com (Baiju M)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 20:20:11 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] April month meetup
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFxv+60SRW9U1sbW=3HDqUNmdWeWzSaMwoxZnws3S3=-cA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO5c=mmgY5j78vPN-yPtWBAdav7Vk6w2Ck6QhpeXCMoxy+0y_A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO5c=mk9zD9S8AgH+vZ-fPuC7P5z-1Fia7QCFWp3rC891_uWEQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO5c=mkfzL-76CJJu2-BJ42riQ4TC5eSXeBYFsRfYtvJ8EZC9w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxv+60SRW9U1sbW=3HDqUNmdWeWzSaMwoxZnws3S3=-cA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN8ZCbxF9Q4-bxjqQUpLRPAhu_DHMAtUc-Jg3+jtzXStCB_TeA@mail.gmail.com>

Yes, I confirm this venue.

This is the address:

ZeOmega Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
"Subhashri Pride", 4th Floor, Southend Road,
Basavanagudi, Bangalore-560-004
(Just look for "Axis Bank", it's the same building)

My mobile number:  9945973441

On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com> wrote:
> Krace is out of town. I've asked Baiju if he can coordinate the meetup at
> ZeOmega. He said he'll find someone to coordinate the event there.
>
> So we have Zeomega as tentative venue. Lets wait for a final confirmation
> from Baiju.
>
> Tentative Venue: ZeOmega, Basavanagudi
>
> Date: Saturday, April 20, 2013
> Time: 3:00PM
>
> Agenda:
>
> * Hands on django Session - Beginner/Intermediate Level. by Saket Bhushan
> * Lightening talks
>
> If you any of you would like to present something, you are welcome.
>
> Meetup page: http://www.meetup.com/BangPypers/events/111834102/
>
> Anand
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Apr 6, 2013 at 10:34 PM, kracekumar ramaraju <
> kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> All
>>
>>  I may not be available for this month meetup, can some one take charge of
>> coordination April meetup. If interested let me know I will tell what needs
>> to be done.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 4:48 PM, kracekumar ramaraju <
>> kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Saket,
>> >
>> >  Meetup is on 20th April, from 3.00PM to 6.00Pm you can present any
>> topic.
>> > Django or Machine Learning. Location is yet to be decided. Here is the
>> > meetup page. RSVP: http://www.meetup.com/BangPypers/events/111834102/
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 1:24 AM, kracekumar ramaraju <
>> > kracethekingmaker at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> All,
>> >>
>> >>   Siva informed me he is willing to handle 3 hours hands-on session
>> about
>> >> getting started with Django next month. We need a venue which has power
>> >> socket and decent internet connection. I would like to have others
>> >> suggestions about the format, looking forward for venue to host for next
>> >> meetup. We will be also needing few volunteers to help during meetup.
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> *
>> >> Thanks & Regards
>> >>
>> >> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
>> >> kracekumar
>> >> www.kracekumar.com
>> >> *
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > *
>> > Thanks & Regards
>> >
>> > "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
>> > kracekumar
>> > www.kracekumar.com
>> > *
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *
>> Thanks & Regards
>>
>> "Talk is cheap, show me the code" -- Linus Torvalds
>> kracekumar
>> www.kracekumar.com
>> *
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Anand
> http://anandology.com/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 17:30:26 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 21:00:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
Message-ID: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hey  Guys,

Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after "n" number
of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary performs lazy
deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy data their
in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after deleting a
few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way , where I can
forcibly resize the dictionary ?

I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new dict and
deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.

Thanks,
./Rahul

From anandology at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 17:35:49 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 21:05:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>

dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any order in
dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.

If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module (new in
Python 2.7).

Anand


On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey  Guys,
>
> Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after "n" number
> of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary performs lazy
> deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy data their
> in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after deleting a
> few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way , where I can
> forcibly resize the dictionary ?
>
> I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new dict and
> deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
>
> Thanks,
> ./Rahul
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Anand
http://anandology.com/

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 17:52:30 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 21:22:30 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>

Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder the data
in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.

./Rahul

On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any order in
> dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
>
> If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module (new in
> Python 2.7).
>
> Anand
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hey  Guys,
> >
> > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after "n" number
> > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary performs
> lazy
> > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy data
> their
> > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after deleting a
> > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way , where I can
> > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> >
> > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new dict
> and
> > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > ./Rahul
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Anand
> http://anandology.com/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From ramdaz at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 17:53:47 2013
From: ramdaz at gmail.com (Ramdas S)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 21:23:47 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder the data
> in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
>

What do you mean by resize?


>
> ./Rahul
>
> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any order in
> > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> >
> > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module (new in
> > Python 2.7).
> >
> > Anand
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hey  Guys,
> > >
> > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after "n"
> number
> > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary performs
> > lazy
> > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy data
> > their
> > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> deleting a
> > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way , where I can
> > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > >
> > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new dict
> > and
> > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > ./Rahul
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Anand
> > http://anandology.com/
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Ramdas S
+91 9342 583 065
My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Wed Apr 17 18:00:33 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2013 21:30:33 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>

As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when we
insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?

./Rahul

On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder the data
> > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> >
>
> What do you mean by resize?
>
>
> >
> > ./Rahul
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any order
> in
> > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > >
> > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module (new in
> > > Python 2.7).
> > >
> > > Anand
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > >
> > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after "n"
> > number
> > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> performs
> > > lazy
> > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy data
> > > their
> > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> > deleting a
> > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way , where I
> can
> > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > >
> > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new
> dict
> > > and
> > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > ./Rahul
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Anand
> > > http://anandology.com/
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Ramdas S
> +91 9342 583 065
> My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From anandology at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 02:23:24 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 05:53:24 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when we
> insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
> dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
>

Don't try to optimize something that is not required. Python core
developers are smarted than you, trust them.

Premature optimization is root cause of all evil.

Anand

From abdulmuneer at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 05:55:12 2013
From: abdulmuneer at gmail.com (Abdul Muneer)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 09:25:12 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMJTfgnvUGCcgrEKTYuMkLGOPRdif6+Gdpt2jwdBvtAcnQCD7A@mail.gmail.com>

Expecting this behaviour from built-in dict is not a good idea. However try
if garbage collection helps.
>>> import gc
>>> gc.collect()
I have not tried it out myself, though.

Regards,
Abdul Muneer

--
Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:53 AM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> we
> > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
> > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> >
>
> Don't try to optimize something that is not required. Python core
> developers are smarted than you, trust them.
>
> Premature optimization is root cause of all evil.
>
> Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 07:17:52 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 10:47:52 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes7Leq8O6V2awnctcpmVDvdDSDt7YWiU0B9N0MSbrxxCOg@mail.gmail.com>

 I dont intent to pre optimize things , I am rather driven by curiosity on
how one could do that.

Thanks,
./Rahul

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:53 AM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> we
> > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
> > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> >
>
> Don't try to optimize something that is not required. Python core
> developers are smarted than you, trust them.
>
> Premature optimization is root cause of all evil.
>
> Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 07:18:49 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 10:48:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfgnvUGCcgrEKTYuMkLGOPRdif6+Gdpt2jwdBvtAcnQCD7A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMJTfgnvUGCcgrEKTYuMkLGOPRdif6+Gdpt2jwdBvtAcnQCD7A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes5cXUhgyBM2jWVmueRo46Ow2Qce1gn4kJt13_n1NQoEjw@mail.gmail.com>

As far as i know , gc.collect() works on objects which are not used
anymore. Not for resizing existing objects.

Thanks,
./Rahul

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 9:25 AM, Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com> wrote:

> Expecting this behaviour from built-in dict is not a good idea. However try
> if garbage collection helps.
> >>> import gc
> >>> gc.collect()
> I have not tried it out myself, though.
>
> Regards,
> Abdul Muneer
>
> --
> Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:53 AM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> > we
> > > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't
> see
> > > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> > >
> >
> > Don't try to optimize something that is not required. Python core
> > developers are smarted than you, trust them.
> >
> > Premature optimization is root cause of all evil.
> >
> > Anand
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Apr 18 07:24:21 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 10:54:21 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes7Leq8O6V2awnctcpmVDvdDSDt7YWiU0B9N0MSbrxxCOg@mail.gmail.com>
	(Rahul R.'s message of "Thu, 18 Apr 2013 10:47:52 +0530")
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes7Leq8O6V2awnctcpmVDvdDSDt7YWiU0B9N0MSbrxxCOg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87vc7k76nu.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> writes:

>  I dont intent to pre optimize things , I am rather driven by curiosity on
> how one could do that.

I'm with Anand on recommendations but like you, I'm curious as to
whether this is possible. Do you have some estimates of size for your
dictionary and the average size for the values? 

I'm trying some experiments. 

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From abpillai at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 07:46:25 2013
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 11:16:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <87vc7k76nu.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes7Leq8O6V2awnctcpmVDvdDSDt7YWiU0B9N0MSbrxxCOg@mail.gmail.com>
	<87vc7k76nu.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CACpj97BKMWymuk-QJ+aU2-Kg_-Adkk4vt+aLABLx70o0OpgYgA@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 10:54 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> writes:
>
> >  I dont intent to pre optimize things , I am rather driven by curiosity
> on
> > how one could do that.
>
> I'm with Anand on recommendations but like you, I'm curious as to
> whether this is possible. Do you have some estimates of size for your
> dictionary and the average size for the values?
>

Does this help you ?

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2211965/python-memory-usage-loading-large-dictionaries-in-memory

Python dictionaries always take up extra memory to allow fast access
to contents. You might want to experiment with optimizing the objects
you store in it or use some other dictionary like objects which are
implemented
differently - like shelve or dbm or bsddb.


>
> I'm trying some experiments.
>
> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Regards,

--Anand

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Apr 18 08:10:22 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 11:40:22 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <87vc7k76nu.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain> (Noufal Ibrahim's message
	of "Thu, 18 Apr 2013 10:54:21 +0530")
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes7Leq8O6V2awnctcpmVDvdDSDt7YWiU0B9N0MSbrxxCOg@mail.gmail.com>
	<87vc7k76nu.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <87bo9c74j5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> writes:

> Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>>  I dont intent to pre optimize things , I am rather driven by curiosity on
>> how one could do that.
>
> I'm with Anand on recommendations but like you, I'm curious as to
> whether this is possible. Do you have some estimates of size for your
> dictionary and the average size for the values? 
>
> I'm trying some experiments. 

My experiments were not particularly revealing. However, 
take a look at
http://hg.python.org/cpython/file/3e02d70cd07b/Objects/dictnotes.txt

There are *compile time* parameters that can be tweaked in the
implementation which will affect behaviour. These things all affect
performance in subtle ways and the values that they've chosen are
probably based on varied data which best represent real life
cases. Tweaking them will probably be a micro optimisation that you'll
need only for specific cases.

The ones I see are dictionary size, load, growth rate, sparseness and
shrinkage rate. The last two are things you can tweak to get the
behaviour you want.

However, as it notes, shrinkage checks are never done when an item is
removed. So, it looks as though you have to actually add an item after
deleting everything else for the dictionary itself to shrink which is an
interesting quirk. 

Another thing that occurs to me is that the "size" of the dictionary is
probably dominated by the size of the keys and, perhaps more so, the
values. Unless these are super small, I don't think the extra overhead
of the dictionary itself will become a burden. In other words, the empty
slots you're worried about shouldn't be a problem unless your actual
data is so small that the free slots are the dominant data. 


[...]



-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From rishi at turtleyogi.com  Thu Apr 18 08:16:57 2013
From: rishi at turtleyogi.com (Hrishikesh Kulkarni)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 11:46:57 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFwXzip6VX22u=zcb8gnKsQKkaXmQvJ=Xmn5OCMqcK-mRw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALFWOz4NEGZiqcLdtYaC_gv5m_shXwZs0RGT2Qc=VDfkBtgRHQ@mail.gmail.com>

Rahul,

Get the source code of Python http://www.python.org/download/releases/
Search for the implementation of dictionary. I believe it should be
Objects/dictobject.c

Now you should be able to try out what you want.

Python core developers maybe smarter but that is no good reason to not try
out ideas (however silly they might seem), else we wouldnt have Stackless
Python or PyPy.

regards,
Rishi



On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:53 AM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> we
> > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
> > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> >
>
> Don't try to optimize something that is not required. Python core
> developers are smarted than you, trust them.
>
> Premature optimization is root cause of all evil.
>
> Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rishi at turtleyogi.com  Thu Apr 18 08:36:55 2013
From: rishi at turtleyogi.com (Hrishikesh Kulkarni)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 12:06:55 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when we
> insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
> dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
>


Are you measuring this shrinking?
the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals. The
deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted item
is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.

PyDict_DelItem () :
..
    old_key = ep->me_key;
    Py_INCREF(dummy);
    ep->me_key = dummy;
    old_value = ep->me_value;
    ep->me_value = NULL;
    mp->ma_used--;
    Py_DECREF(old_value);
    Py_DECREF(old_key);
..


dict_length():
..
    return mp->ma_used;
..

PyDict_Size():
..
    return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
..



regards,
Rishi




>
> ./Rahul
>
> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder the
> data
> > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > >
> >
> > What do you mean by resize?
> >
> >
> > >
> > > ./Rahul
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> anandology at gmail.com
> > > >wrote:
> > >
> > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any order
> > in
> > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > >
> > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module (new
> in
> > > > Python 2.7).
> > > >
> > > > Anand
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > >
> > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after "n"
> > > number
> > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> > performs
> > > > lazy
> > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy
> data
> > > > their
> > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> > > deleting a
> > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way , where I
> > can
> > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > >
> > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new
> > dict
> > > > and
> > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Anand
> > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Ramdas S
> > +91 9342 583 065
> > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 09:40:29 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 13:10:29 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Intro Video - Companies in India
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFTNe-gHiXSNi+SCkRbfToS-dYGQPtPRjfnL2mGmHrunDw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

How do the companies in India make the intro videos to be put up on their
website? Do they outsource it to someone in the US to get the language and
the accent right or is there some automated Voice SDK? Offlate, i stumbled
on a few small companies(/startups) who have their intro-videos with an
American Accent and wasn't sure whether they do indeed outsource it.

-V
@venkasub <http://about.me/venkasub>

From vsapre80 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 09:41:27 2013
From: vsapre80 at gmail.com (Vishal)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 13:11:27 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACPguY8ij0Wbd__u3P2Um_m2Nn3eymSrseH0bkEy_ukHSdBrMg@mail.gmail.com>

Not sure what the exact intent of resizing the dict is...however, if you
wish to reduce the overall memory consumption of your python process...i
would suggest:

- copy the required contents to a new dict..(use dict comprehension if you
can)
>>> d2 = dict((k,v) for k,v in d1.items() if <insert your conditions here>)

- Assign the old dict name to None
>>> d1 = None

- do a gc.collect()
>>> import gc
>>> gc.collect()

you should see immediate results on process memory consumption.

Enjoy Python
Vishal Sapre

On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder the data
> in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
>
> ./Rahul
>
> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any order in
> > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> >
> > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module (new in
> > Python 2.7).
> >
> > Anand
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hey  Guys,
> > >
> > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after "n"
> number
> > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary performs
> > lazy
> > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy data
> > their
> > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> deleting a
> > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way , where I can
> > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > >
> > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new dict
> > and
> > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > ./Rahul
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Anand
> > http://anandology.com/
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Thanks and best regards,
Vishal Sapre

---
"Life is 10% how you make it, and 90% how you take it"
"????? ?????, ????? ????? (Benefit for most people, Happiness for most
people.)"
---
Please DONT print this email, unless you really need to.
Save Energy & Paper. Save the Earth.

From harish.shastry at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 09:44:31 2013
From: harish.shastry at gmail.com (Harish Vishwanath)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 13:14:31 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+D2wW1AFjLyooCKnXpqHCKMLQYjXzpC9ej6hoOMAj_s_bJS_A@mail.gmail.com>

Here is a good talk on how dictionaries are implemented in python :
http://blip.tv/pycon-us-videos-2009-2010-2011/pycon-2010-the-mighty-dictionary-55-3352147

Due to possibility of collisions in the hash table, dict keeps allocating
4x or 2x the size of existing allocation and *will* reorder the items when
such an operation happens. They go and acquire more memory when the dict is
2/3rds full. But the reverse is not possible. A dummy key has to be
inserted in a free slot, so that valid items in the dictionary can be
found. Since all this depends on the order of insertion, you cannot
guarantee that copying existing items into a new dictionary will consume
less space.

If look up times is not a concern, and you are trying to optimize for space
the stackoverflow link that Anand shared earlier could help.

Regards,
Harish


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
<rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> we
> > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
> > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> >
>
>
> Are you measuring this shrinking?
> the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals. The
> deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted item
> is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.
>
> PyDict_DelItem () :
> ..
>     old_key = ep->me_key;
>     Py_INCREF(dummy);
>     ep->me_key = dummy;
>     old_value = ep->me_value;
>     ep->me_value = NULL;
>     mp->ma_used--;
>     Py_DECREF(old_value);
>     Py_DECREF(old_key);
> ..
>
>
> dict_length():
> ..
>     return mp->ma_used;
> ..
>
> PyDict_Size():
> ..
>     return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
> ..
>
>
>
> regards,
> Rishi
>
>
>
>
> >
> > ./Rahul
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder the
> > data
> > > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > > >
> > >
> > > What do you mean by resize?
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > ./Rahul
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> > anandology at gmail.com
> > > > >wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any
> order
> > > in
> > > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > > >
> > > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module
> (new
> > in
> > > > > Python 2.7).
> > > > >
> > > > > Anand
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after
> "n"
> > > > number
> > > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> > > performs
> > > > > lazy
> > > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy
> > data
> > > > > their
> > > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> > > > deleting a
> > > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way ,
> where I
> > > can
> > > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new
> > > dict
> > > > > and
> > > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Anand
> > > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Ramdas S
> > > +91 9342 583 065
> > > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 09:47:06 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 13:17:06 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Intro Video - Companies in India
In-Reply-To: <CAN7tdFTNe-gHiXSNi+SCkRbfToS-dYGQPtPRjfnL2mGmHrunDw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN7tdFTNe-gHiXSNi+SCkRbfToS-dYGQPtPRjfnL2mGmHrunDw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFS3g7qqf_x7nuXQ310A8YUowJwW30=Ei_URuWgHFfvRcA@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 1:10 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:

> How do the companies in India make the intro videos to be put up on their
> website? Do they outsource it to someone in the US to get the language and
> the accent right or is there some automated Voice SDK? Offlate, i stumbled
> on a few small companies(/startups) who have their intro-videos with an
> American Accent and wasn't sure whether they do indeed outsource it.
>
>
Should have searched in Quora :)
http://www.quora.com/Are-there-any-Indian-explainer-video-production-houses
http://www.quora.com/Are-there-any-production-studios-in-India-like-Epipheo-and-PictureLab-that-make-short-intro-videos

Interesting. Now, a slightly different Q: any DIY video sites? :)

From jayneil.dalal at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 10:03:03 2013
From: jayneil.dalal at gmail.com (Jayneil Dalal)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 03:03:03 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Intro Video - Companies in India
In-Reply-To: <CAN7tdFS3g7qqf_x7nuXQ310A8YUowJwW30=Ei_URuWgHFfvRcA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN7tdFTNe-gHiXSNi+SCkRbfToS-dYGQPtPRjfnL2mGmHrunDw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN7tdFS3g7qqf_x7nuXQ310A8YUowJwW30=Ei_URuWgHFfvRcA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMP95e4p=3FNUjoFdJ_U-T0OYwcJ2rGii4ZPCrZoBtoLDJMAfw@mail.gmail.com>

Venkataraman,

This should help:

http://www.powtoon.com/

I have used it a couple of times and it is really good! It is free to try
but you have to pay to get the video in HD format and for removing their
logo.

Best,
Jayneil.




On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 1:10 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > How do the companies in India make the intro videos to be put up on their
> > website? Do they outsource it to someone in the US to get the language
> and
> > the accent right or is there some automated Voice SDK? Offlate, i
> stumbled
> > on a few small companies(/startups) who have their intro-videos with an
> > American Accent and wasn't sure whether they do indeed outsource it.
> >
> >
> Should have searched in Quora :)
> http://www.quora.com/Are-there-any-Indian-explainer-video-production-houses
>
> http://www.quora.com/Are-there-any-production-studios-in-India-like-Epipheo-and-PictureLab-that-make-short-intro-videos
>
> Interesting. Now, a slightly different Q: any DIY video sites? :)
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 10:30:56 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 14:00:56 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+D2wW1AFjLyooCKnXpqHCKMLQYjXzpC9ej6hoOMAj_s_bJS_A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+D2wW1AFjLyooCKnXpqHCKMLQYjXzpC9ej6hoOMAj_s_bJS_A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes6VVTmoS0=YEcDBM6ZEi=cqG6sSn7Y-wptY3zed3F-B4w@mail.gmail.com>

Harish , you nailed it!  Thanks for the video.  So, decreasing the size
will not be possible afterall.
But what confuses me is why is copying the items to new dictionary will not
consume less space ? By copying you will get rid of all the dummy variables
and lookup time will also decrease.

Thanks a lot!
./Rahul

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 1:14 PM, Harish Vishwanath <harish.shastry at gmail.com
> wrote:

> Here is a good talk on how dictionaries are implemented in python :
>
> http://blip.tv/pycon-us-videos-2009-2010-2011/pycon-2010-the-mighty-dictionary-55-3352147
>
> Due to possibility of collisions in the hash table, dict keeps allocating
> 4x or 2x the size of existing allocation and *will* reorder the items when
> such an operation happens. They go and acquire more memory when the dict is
> 2/3rds full. But the reverse is not possible. A dummy key has to be
> inserted in a free slot, so that valid items in the dictionary can be
> found. Since all this depends on the order of insertion, you cannot
> guarantee that copying existing items into a new dictionary will consume
> less space.
>
> If look up times is not a concern, and you are trying to optimize for space
> the stackoverflow link that Anand shared earlier could help.
>
> Regards,
> Harish
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
> <rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> > we
> > > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't
> see
> > > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> > >
> >
> >
> > Are you measuring this shrinking?
> > the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals. The
> > deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted item
> > is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.
> >
> > PyDict_DelItem () :
> > ..
> >     old_key = ep->me_key;
> >     Py_INCREF(dummy);
> >     ep->me_key = dummy;
> >     old_value = ep->me_value;
> >     ep->me_value = NULL;
> >     mp->ma_used--;
> >     Py_DECREF(old_value);
> >     Py_DECREF(old_key);
> > ..
> >
> >
> > dict_length():
> > ..
> >     return mp->ma_used;
> > ..
> >
> > PyDict_Size():
> > ..
> >     return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
> > ..
> >
> >
> >
> > regards,
> > Rishi
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > ./Rahul
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder
> the
> > > data
> > > > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > What do you mean by resize?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> > > anandology at gmail.com
> > > > > >wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any
> > order
> > > > in
> > > > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module
> > (new
> > > in
> > > > > > Python 2.7).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Anand
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after
> > "n"
> > > > > number
> > > > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> > > > performs
> > > > > > lazy
> > > > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy
> > > data
> > > > > > their
> > > > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> > > > > deleting a
> > > > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way ,
> > where I
> > > > can
> > > > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to
> new
> > > > dict
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Ramdas S
> > > > +91 9342 583 065
> > > > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 10:39:33 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 14:09:33 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes4YeYqEc_JdKOYYF9wkz-wYnuCiAOAP+oRT4raJjuwd8A@mail.gmail.com>

Hey Hrishikesk,

So are you saying, if i run gc.collect() in my program I will get rid of
all the dummy variables in the dictionary ?

Thanks,
./Rahul

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
<rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> we
> > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't see
> > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> >
>
>
> Are you measuring this shrinking?
> the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals. The
> deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted item
> is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.
>
> PyDict_DelItem () :
> ..
>     old_key = ep->me_key;
>     Py_INCREF(dummy);
>     ep->me_key = dummy;
>     old_value = ep->me_value;
>     ep->me_value = NULL;
>     mp->ma_used--;
>     Py_DECREF(old_value);
>     Py_DECREF(old_key);
> ..
>
>
> dict_length():
> ..
>     return mp->ma_used;
> ..
>
> PyDict_Size():
> ..
>     return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
> ..
>
>
>
> regards,
> Rishi
>
>
>
>
> >
> > ./Rahul
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder the
> > data
> > > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > > >
> > >
> > > What do you mean by resize?
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > ./Rahul
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> > anandology at gmail.com
> > > > >wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any
> order
> > > in
> > > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > > >
> > > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module
> (new
> > in
> > > > > Python 2.7).
> > > > >
> > > > > Anand
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after
> "n"
> > > > number
> > > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> > > performs
> > > > > lazy
> > > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy
> > data
> > > > > their
> > > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> > > > deleting a
> > > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way ,
> where I
> > > can
> > > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to new
> > > dict
> > > > > and
> > > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Anand
> > > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Ramdas S
> > > +91 9342 583 065
> > > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From harish.shastry at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 10:42:29 2013
From: harish.shastry at gmail.com (Harish Vishwanath)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 14:12:29 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes6VVTmoS0=YEcDBM6ZEi=cqG6sSn7Y-wptY3zed3F-B4w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+D2wW1AFjLyooCKnXpqHCKMLQYjXzpC9ej6hoOMAj_s_bJS_A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6VVTmoS0=YEcDBM6ZEi=cqG6sSn7Y-wptY3zed3F-B4w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+D2wW2Sm3TcMtj=ZPe2HVFHqz5MMx1r2AheQPE1qDcCHYm0hQ@mail.gmail.com>

As you may have noticed, dictionary size depends greatly on the order of
insertion. Let us say you are trying to copy the current items from your
existing dict [which could have been re-ordered multiple times because of
collisions and increase in allocated memory]. It is definitely possible
that the order in which you iterate your existing items may not be the most
optimal order, and could generate more collisions and items could end up in
much deeper slots than their original hash values. This will definitely
hamper your lookup time.

But it will probably reduce the memory consumption, since there are
definitely lesser items in the new dictionary.

Regards,
Harish


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Harish , you nailed it!  Thanks for the video.  So, decreasing the size
> will not be possible afterall.
> But what confuses me is why is copying the items to new dictionary will not
> consume less space ? By copying you will get rid of all the dummy variables
> and lookup time will also decrease.
>
> Thanks a lot!
> ./Rahul
>
> On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 1:14 PM, Harish Vishwanath <
> harish.shastry at gmail.com
> > wrote:
>
> > Here is a good talk on how dictionaries are implemented in python :
> >
> >
> http://blip.tv/pycon-us-videos-2009-2010-2011/pycon-2010-the-mighty-dictionary-55-3352147
> >
> > Due to possibility of collisions in the hash table, dict keeps allocating
> > 4x or 2x the size of existing allocation and *will* reorder the items
> when
> > such an operation happens. They go and acquire more memory when the dict
> is
> > 2/3rds full. But the reverse is not possible. A dummy key has to be
> > inserted in a free slot, so that valid items in the dictionary can be
> > found. Since all this depends on the order of insertion, you cannot
> > guarantee that copying existing items into a new dictionary will consume
> > less space.
> >
> > If look up times is not a concern, and you are trying to optimize for
> space
> > the stackoverflow link that Anand shared earlier could help.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Harish
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
> > <rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > > > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So,
> when
> > > we
> > > > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't
> > see
> > > > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case,
> is
> > > > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Are you measuring this shrinking?
> > > the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals. The
> > > deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted
> item
> > > is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.
> > >
> > > PyDict_DelItem () :
> > > ..
> > >     old_key = ep->me_key;
> > >     Py_INCREF(dummy);
> > >     ep->me_key = dummy;
> > >     old_value = ep->me_value;
> > >     ep->me_value = NULL;
> > >     mp->ma_used--;
> > >     Py_DECREF(old_value);
> > >     Py_DECREF(old_key);
> > > ..
> > >
> > >
> > > dict_length():
> > > ..
> > >     return mp->ma_used;
> > > ..
> > >
> > > PyDict_Size():
> > > ..
> > >     return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
> > > ..
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > regards,
> > > Rishi
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > ./Rahul
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder
> > the
> > > > data
> > > > > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > What do you mean by resize?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> > > > anandology at gmail.com
> > > > > > >wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any
> > > order
> > > > > in
> > > > > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module
> > > (new
> > > > in
> > > > > > > Python 2.7).
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary
> after
> > > "n"
> > > > > > number
> > > > > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> > > > > performs
> > > > > > > lazy
> > > > > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a
> dummy
> > > > data
> > > > > > > their
> > > > > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but
> after
> > > > > > deleting a
> > > > > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way ,
> > > where I
> > > > > can
> > > > > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to
> > new
> > > > > dict
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Ramdas S
> > > > > +91 9342 583 065
> > > > > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rishi at turtleyogi.com  Thu Apr 18 10:45:39 2013
From: rishi at turtleyogi.com (Hrishikesh Kulkarni)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 14:15:39 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes4YeYqEc_JdKOYYF9wkz-wYnuCiAOAP+oRT4raJjuwd8A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4YeYqEc_JdKOYYF9wkz-wYnuCiAOAP+oRT4raJjuwd8A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALFWOz7ARbMENFPeZ_Ua8ve+GyQaKLNCqew8xwVagc9w6itQPA@mail.gmail.com>

The code snippet shows the old_value and old_keys are marked by decref not
the dummy. I wouldnt worry about dummy keys so much. btw checkout dictresize
which is called during insert/set which does resize the dict. When? that
would be a good learning exercise.



On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:09 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hey Hrishikesk,
>
> So are you saying, if i run gc.collect() in my program I will get rid of
> all the dummy variables in the dictionary ?
>
> Thanks,
> ./Rahul
>
> On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
> <rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So, when
> > we
> > > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't
> see
> > > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case, is
> > > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> > >
> >
> >
> > Are you measuring this shrinking?
> > the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals. The
> > deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted item
> > is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.
> >
> > PyDict_DelItem () :
> > ..
> >     old_key = ep->me_key;
> >     Py_INCREF(dummy);
> >     ep->me_key = dummy;
> >     old_value = ep->me_value;
> >     ep->me_value = NULL;
> >     mp->ma_used--;
> >     Py_DECREF(old_value);
> >     Py_DECREF(old_key);
> > ..
> >
> >
> > dict_length():
> > ..
> >     return mp->ma_used;
> > ..
> >
> > PyDict_Size():
> > ..
> >     return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
> > ..
> >
> >
> >
> > regards,
> > Rishi
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > ./Rahul
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder
> the
> > > data
> > > > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > What do you mean by resize?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> > > anandology at gmail.com
> > > > > >wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any
> > order
> > > > in
> > > > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module
> > (new
> > > in
> > > > > > Python 2.7).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Anand
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary after
> > "n"
> > > > > number
> > > > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> > > > performs
> > > > > > lazy
> > > > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a dummy
> > > data
> > > > > > their
> > > > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but after
> > > > > deleting a
> > > > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way ,
> > where I
> > > > can
> > > > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to
> new
> > > > dict
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Ramdas S
> > > > +91 9342 583 065
> > > > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 11:01:17 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 14:31:17 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CALFWOz7ARbMENFPeZ_Ua8ve+GyQaKLNCqew8xwVagc9w6itQPA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4YeYqEc_JdKOYYF9wkz-wYnuCiAOAP+oRT4raJjuwd8A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz7ARbMENFPeZ_Ua8ve+GyQaKLNCqew8xwVagc9w6itQPA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes6rFCUKaRCw3=+oFREosP4RnRr5OrHTHRedYfdUj5TD_Q@mail.gmail.com>

Afaik,  python gc is threshold based. So, gc should trigger after a given
threshold value (which can be changed) . but defintely the code is worth
looking. thanks for pointing it out.

./Rahul

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:15 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
<rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:

> The code snippet shows the old_value and old_keys are marked by decref not
> the dummy. I wouldnt worry about dummy keys so much. btw checkout
> dictresize
> which is called during insert/set which does resize the dict. When? that
> would be a good learning exercise.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:09 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hey Hrishikesk,
> >
> > So are you saying, if i run gc.collect() in my program I will get rid of
> > all the dummy variables in the dictionary ?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > ./Rahul
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
> > <rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when we
> > > > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So,
> when
> > > we
> > > > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I don't
> > see
> > > > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case,
> is
> > > > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Are you measuring this shrinking?
> > > the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals. The
> > > deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted
> item
> > > is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.
> > >
> > > PyDict_DelItem () :
> > > ..
> > >     old_key = ep->me_key;
> > >     Py_INCREF(dummy);
> > >     ep->me_key = dummy;
> > >     old_value = ep->me_value;
> > >     ep->me_value = NULL;
> > >     mp->ma_used--;
> > >     Py_DECREF(old_value);
> > >     Py_DECREF(old_key);
> > > ..
> > >
> > >
> > > dict_length():
> > > ..
> > >     return mp->ma_used;
> > > ..
> > >
> > > PyDict_Size():
> > > ..
> > >     return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
> > > ..
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > regards,
> > > Rishi
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > ./Rahul
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean reorder
> > the
> > > > data
> > > > > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > What do you mean by resize?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> > > > anandology at gmail.com
> > > > > > >wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect any
> > > order
> > > > > in
> > > > > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections module
> > > (new
> > > > in
> > > > > > > Python 2.7).
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary
> after
> > > "n"
> > > > > > number
> > > > > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python dictionary
> > > > > performs
> > > > > > > lazy
> > > > > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a
> dummy
> > > > data
> > > > > > > their
> > > > > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but
> after
> > > > > > deleting a
> > > > > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way ,
> > > where I
> > > > > can
> > > > > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary to
> > new
> > > > > dict
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Ramdas S
> > > > > +91 9342 583 065
> > > > > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From dhruvbaldawa at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 11:28:57 2013
From: dhruvbaldawa at gmail.com (Dhruv Baldawa)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 14:58:57 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Reorder Dictionary Size in python
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes6rFCUKaRCw3=+oFREosP4RnRr5OrHTHRedYfdUj5TD_Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+ixes55RyM3RaX9XO9cWegTs43K7pgyDGOQ+=w+zthFqC+iGQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAC7wXFxm-dsVfDgc_Ohdj0OzJyiGVZpYUQabgakJSuusHrOXPQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4ugSMBt6m8aCFY+Kgzr27cpRCvSSJtZvnoPosPU0Y4Uw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAP915yUauxki7F+F0K2gABFcjBYw2aPE8_anxqVrnaQnaugt_w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6YP_si1314QSjS-tuxxQ2rhkzNYuku1obUg9SvEUXuwQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz5tP-VJbMip=6Ld6kHLk52oeuwXf0YEz+UJ6BwjfhC0LQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes4YeYqEc_JdKOYYF9wkz-wYnuCiAOAP+oRT4raJjuwd8A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALFWOz7ARbMENFPeZ_Ua8ve+GyQaKLNCqew8xwVagc9w6itQPA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes6rFCUKaRCw3=+oFREosP4RnRr5OrHTHRedYfdUj5TD_Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC5Hnjg3y_DZS4gW=oc_+d+CCVdX_C4emU2b7y=+JP5TnZaUqA@mail.gmail.com>

http://code.activestate.com/recipes/578375-proof-of-concept-for-a-more-space-efficient-faster/?in=user-178123

--
Dhruv Baldawa
(http://www.dhruvb.com)


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:31 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Afaik,  python gc is threshold based. So, gc should trigger after a given
> threshold value (which can be changed) . but defintely the code is worth
> looking. thanks for pointing it out.
>
> ./Rahul
>
> On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:15 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
> <rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:
>
> > The code snippet shows the old_value and old_keys are marked by decref
> not
> > the dummy. I wouldnt worry about dummy keys so much. btw checkout
> > dictresize
> > which is called during insert/set which does resize the dict. When? that
> > would be a good learning exercise.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 2:09 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hey Hrishikesk,
> > >
> > > So are you saying, if i run gc.collect() in my program I will get rid
> of
> > > all the dummy variables in the dictionary ?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > ./Rahul
> > >
> > > On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Hrishikesh Kulkarni
> > > <rishi at turtleyogi.com>wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:30 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > As far as i know, python performs a lazy deletion of values , when
> we
> > > > > delete content from a dictionary (correct me if i am wrong) .  So,
> > when
> > > > we
> > > > > insert a lot of values the dictionary automatically expands. I
> don't
> > > see
> > > > > dict shrinking when we delete values from dictionary. In such case,
> > is
> > > > > there a way to forcibly reduce the dictionary size ?
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Are you measuring this shrinking?
> > > > the following  in dictobject.c should guide you with the internals.
> The
> > > > deleted item is simply replaced with a refcounted dummy. The deleted
> > item
> > > > is marked for cleanup by gc with decref.
> > > >
> > > > PyDict_DelItem () :
> > > > ..
> > > >     old_key = ep->me_key;
> > > >     Py_INCREF(dummy);
> > > >     ep->me_key = dummy;
> > > >     old_value = ep->me_value;
> > > >     ep->me_value = NULL;
> > > >     mp->ma_used--;
> > > >     Py_DECREF(old_value);
> > > >     Py_DECREF(old_key);
> > > > ..
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > dict_length():
> > > > ..
> > > >     return mp->ma_used;
> > > > ..
> > > >
> > > > PyDict_Size():
> > > > ..
> > > >     return ((PyDictObject *)mp)->ma_used;
> > > > ..
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > regards,
> > > > Rishi
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ramdas S <ramdaz at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Ahh , sorry If i wasnt clear the first time. I dint mean
> reorder
> > > the
> > > > > data
> > > > > > > in dictionary. I meant resize the dictionary.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > What do you mean by resize?
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:05 PM, Anand Chitipothu <
> > > > > anandology at gmail.com
> > > > > > > >wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > dictionaries are unordered. It is not a good idea to expect
> any
> > > > order
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > dictionaries, even if you are seeing some order by chance.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > If you need order, then use OrderedDict from collections
> module
> > > > (new
> > > > > in
> > > > > > > > Python 2.7).
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 17, 2013 at 9:00 PM, Rahul R <
> rahul8590 at gmail.com>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Hey  Guys,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Is it possible to forcibly reorder the python dictionary
> > after
> > > > "n"
> > > > > > > number
> > > > > > > > > of inserts and deletions. As far as i know, python
> dictionary
> > > > > > performs
> > > > > > > > lazy
> > > > > > > > > deletes. Thus , even if the data is deleted, python has a
> > dummy
> > > > > data
> > > > > > > > their
> > > > > > > > > in order to preserve consistency. The python dictionary
> > > > > > > > > keeps expanding when the size of dict is increasing, but
> > after
> > > > > > > deleting a
> > > > > > > > > few parameters the size does not decrease. Is there a way ,
> > > > where I
> > > > > > can
> > > > > > > > > forcibly resize the dictionary ?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I was thinking of copying content from existing dictionary
> to
> > > new
> > > > > > dict
> > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > deleting the previous one.But thats a cumbersome operation.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > ./Rahul
> > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > Anand
> > > > > > > > http://anandology.com/
> > > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Ramdas S
> > > > > > +91 9342 583 065
> > > > > > My Personal Blog on http://ramdaz.wordpress.com
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BangPypers mailing list
> > > BangPypers at python.org
> > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From jaganadhg at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 13:18:40 2013
From: jaganadhg at gmail.com (JAGANADH G)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 16:48:40 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] pyodbc Teradata connection
Message-ID: <CAM4qvdF8AdHD290r55M+tk3UrWPz0fHoBLCauh9OBQeCBUQYzw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi ,
Does anybody have experience with pyodbc and teradata .
I was trying to connect to a remote teredata instance using pyodbc. it
gives the following error.

 Error: ('IM002', '[IM002] [Microsoft][ODBC Driver Manager] Data source
name not found and no default driver specified  (SQLDriverConnect)')


The connection string is
pyodbc.connect("DRIVER={Teradata};DBCNAME=DB;UID=UU;PWD=PW",
autocommit=True,ansi=True)


Any clue on how to resolve the same .


Best regards




-- 
**********************************
JAGANADH G
http://jaganadhg.in
*ILUGCBE*
http://ilugcbe.org.in

From foxrun2005 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 14:45:27 2013
From: foxrun2005 at gmail.com (Kamalakar gs)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 18:15:27 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
Message-ID: <CAN+F=ae8WuvcisxqbbKL_Y_ByiyAqgfrXe9_sy2w-BE=2F0Dng@mail.gmail.com>

HI all,
I have a query that i have doc which is  read through python.But instead of
giving path and filename
in the coding.I want to manipulate it like "python has to ask USER for a
specific filename so that python recognizes the directory internally and
read the file ".How do i do this.I have tried with
filename = input ("filename") but it just file name and will not recognises
the path.

For example:

file name = input ("file name: ")

             file name = python

it has to recognizes the path like    "C:\users\desktop\python"


Thanks
Regards
Kamalakar

From maniandram01 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 14:54:07 2013
From: maniandram01 at gmail.com (Ramchandra Apte)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 18:24:07 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Intro Video - Companies in India
In-Reply-To: <CAN7tdFTNe-gHiXSNi+SCkRbfToS-dYGQPtPRjfnL2mGmHrunDw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN7tdFTNe-gHiXSNi+SCkRbfToS-dYGQPtPRjfnL2mGmHrunDw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAExgZOjd6jnP7Pqnhtz_SEYicOBkjPqRN++u9UpL1BDNKSvrjg@mail.gmail.com>

This is OT to this list which is about Python.


On 18 April 2013 13:10, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> How do the companies in India make the intro videos to be put up on their
> website? Do they outsource it to someone in the US to get the language and
> the accent right or is there some automated Voice SDK? Offlate, i stumbled
> on a few small companies(/startups) who have their intro-videos with an
> American Accent and wasn't sure whether they do indeed outsource it.
>
> -V
> @venkasub <http://about.me/venkasub>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From abdulmuneer at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 14:59:05 2013
From: abdulmuneer at gmail.com (Abdul Muneer)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 18:29:05 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
In-Reply-To: <CAN+F=ae8WuvcisxqbbKL_Y_ByiyAqgfrXe9_sy2w-BE=2F0Dng@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN+F=ae8WuvcisxqbbKL_Y_ByiyAqgfrXe9_sy2w-BE=2F0Dng@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMJTfg=zgjoQR9SAdhxTtYf9-7Z5h258bt9z-mzwo2HZjz6zQg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Kamalakar,
You can use os.path.join() to join the user input to a base path. Python
will take care of unix/windows differentiation and append slashes
accordingly.

>>> import os
>>> base_path = os.getcwd()
>>> base_path
'/home/amuneer/workspace/playground'
>>> file_name = raw_input("Enter Filename\n")
Enter Filename
play
>>> complete_path = os.path.join(base_path, file_name)
>>> complete_path
'/home/amuneer/workspace/playground/play'
>>>


Note:if you are not using python3, use raw_input instead of input.
raw_input accepts the values as string and therefore people cannot do nasty
things by typing executable code.


Regards,
Abdul Muneer

--
Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Kamalakar gs <foxrun2005 at gmail.com> wrote:

> HI all,
> I have a query that i have doc which is  read through python.But instead of
> giving path and filename
> in the coding.I want to manipulate it like "python has to ask USER for a
> specific filename so that python recognizes the directory internally and
> read the file ".How do i do this.I have tried with
> filename = input ("filename") but it just file name and will not recognises
> the path.
>
> For example:
>
> file name = input ("file name: ")
>
>              file name = python
>
> it has to recognizes the path like    "C:\users\desktop\python"
>
>
> Thanks
> Regards
> Kamalakar
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From rahul8590 at gmail.com  Thu Apr 18 15:04:43 2013
From: rahul8590 at gmail.com (Rahul R)
Date: Thu, 18 Apr 2013 18:34:43 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
In-Reply-To: <CAN+F=ae8WuvcisxqbbKL_Y_ByiyAqgfrXe9_sy2w-BE=2F0Dng@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN+F=ae8WuvcisxqbbKL_Y_ByiyAqgfrXe9_sy2w-BE=2F0Dng@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+ixes5pCF3WB2tmbJ_eiaT69XXs1VVguMrTamvNjy7aiTjd0g@mail.gmail.com>

os.path.realpath(__filename__)
that should do the trick.

./Rahul



On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 6:15 PM, Kamalakar gs <foxrun2005 at gmail.com> wrote:

> HI all,
> I have a query that i have doc which is  read through python.But instead of
> giving path and filename
> in the coding.I want to manipulate it like "python has to ask USER for a
> specific filename so that python recognizes the directory internally and
> read the file ".How do i do this.I have tried with
> filename = input ("filename") but it just file name and will not recognises
> the path.
>
> For example:
>
> file name = input ("file name: ")
>
>              file name = python
>
> it has to recognizes the path like    "C:\users\desktop\python"
>
>
> Thanks
> Regards
> Kamalakar
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From mandarvaze at gmail.com  Fri Apr 19 08:56:27 2013
From: mandarvaze at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?TWFuZGFyIFZhemUgLyDgpK7gpILgpKbgpL7gpLAg4KS14KSd4KWH?=)
Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2013 12:26:27 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
In-Reply-To: <CA+ixes5pCF3WB2tmbJ_eiaT69XXs1VVguMrTamvNjy7aiTjd0g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN+F=ae8WuvcisxqbbKL_Y_ByiyAqgfrXe9_sy2w-BE=2F0Dng@mail.gmail.com>
	<CA+ixes5pCF3WB2tmbJ_eiaT69XXs1VVguMrTamvNjy7aiTjd0g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADDYdfszYgOzQ3tD=9OSKoR+McJB7_-0_rBHeO=+4bA8yaz6cg@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 6:34 PM, Rahul R <rahul8590 at gmail.com> wrote:
> os.path.realpath(__filename__)
> that should do the trick.

As much as I understand the requirement, Kamalakar wants to
"recognize" the path, then he needs some equivalent of "which" command
(for binaries) or "locate" for non-binaries

realpath didn't work for me when I tried "ipython" on linux for either
of the above requirements.

-Mandar

From saager.mhatre at gmail.com  Fri Apr 19 23:11:17 2013
From: saager.mhatre at gmail.com (Saager Mhatre)
Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2013 02:41:17 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] Microsoft Office 365 for Education made
 mandatory for approved institutions by AICTE
In-Reply-To: <CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMbkTgLDsWv5_6DSLEjx41Z2u9HF__R+xTRQK1RM2wHgikzB+w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGLzFwuXHfODQhFAu7S_E9DTtDgRLUZsifCm2qw=iNgOjA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgLsb84ai=nZ1u4=U_=9K+nsmvriL7-c_BYL-tur_1n+MA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAN9ztG_apHdWGpEb88nuUSv572ko8DZCb-oO_yn75d9mBkrSMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAMbkTgJLTqJxye=r5J1BUQ2JaNwE9iwQFgi4CNs1jm=rtsL_bg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAD0RFPDyeEx=i3VRJDZMJ_TMrMk1iHnbEMzeYiGVPqhNDV5UJA@mail.gmail.com>
	<CANiY96YV0G54755iYM-=PPGyomXuF-+19o20EgQRfbKxCYpQtw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAO6PMqrDqnb5+-k7202V14NuoanW+xyXp5t0=k1fG1gRmEED_w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADfLaaDbp_=sGWTQy9yA4=jj-kes4hOw6Y3TRNhigqUOi7p6yg@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:54 PM, Kaushik Kalyanaraman <
dialkforkaushik at gmail.com> wrote:

> 10 replies to Godwin


Damn, nice catch! ;)

- d

From foxrun2005 at gmail.com  Sat Apr 20 19:17:26 2013
From: foxrun2005 at gmail.com (Kamalakar gs)
Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2013 22:47:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
Message-ID: <CAN+F=aecryo3Z-rd7jqJ9HMCTWtUxJbQRQ_8rf+p7qYv9vKa9w@mail.gmail.com>

What i am asking is i have a file of other format for example .PCL which is
Patran file (Software used for analysis). Now what i want is if user inputs
a file name,python has to recognise the file name and directory of file
which exists and executes the file in patran window.

For example following lines executes to open a new database in a patran.
Now it is automatically recognising the path of the file inside PCL file.
Like as below
*uil_file_new.go( "C:\MSC.Software\Patran_x64\20121/template.db",  @*
*"C:\Users\Desktop\patran\plate.db" )*
*
*
*POP UP WINDOW WILL SHOWS IN PATRAN WHEN ABOVE CODE READS THROUGH PCL FILE.*
*
*
Now what i want is, python code has to execute in this way as it happens in
Patran
For Example:
Userinput= Filename = plate.pcl
now it has to recognise the file and directory as shown above and create a
new database
*
*
*Regards *
*Kamalakar*

From gora at mimirtech.com  Sat Apr 20 20:31:32 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2013 00:01:32 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
In-Reply-To: <CAN+F=aecryo3Z-rd7jqJ9HMCTWtUxJbQRQ_8rf+p7qYv9vKa9w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN+F=aecryo3Z-rd7jqJ9HMCTWtUxJbQRQ_8rf+p7qYv9vKa9w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGL7meT-QGDXiqJgSRRhpSRa8KFXqLRcQQgU_ZRrf+NoOA@mail.gmail.com>

On 20 April 2013 22:47, Kamalakar gs <foxrun2005 at gmail.com> wrote:
> What i am asking is i have a file of other format for example .PCL which is
> Patran file (Software used for analysis). Now what i want is if user inputs
> a file name,python has to recognise the file name and directory of file
> which exists and executes the file in patran window.

(a) Please do not start separate threads for the same question
(b) You might wish to review how to use mailing lists to your
     advantage, and with the added benefit of preserving the
     sanity of people trying to respond to your messages. Here
     are some excellent pointers:
     - http://wiki.apache.org/solr/UsingMailingLists
     - https://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/UsingTheMailingList
     - http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

I am not sure who on this list might have an idea of some random
software that you are interested in. Please formulate this in a way
relevant to this list.

Regards,
Gora

From hrdspl at gmail.com  Sat Apr 20 21:10:25 2013
From: hrdspl at gmail.com (hiharry danny)
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2013 00:40:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
In-Reply-To: <CACiMRGL7meT-QGDXiqJgSRRhpSRa8KFXqLRcQQgU_ZRrf+NoOA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN+F=aecryo3Z-rd7jqJ9HMCTWtUxJbQRQ_8rf+p7qYv9vKa9w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CACiMRGL7meT-QGDXiqJgSRRhpSRa8KFXqLRcQQgU_ZRrf+NoOA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKPC1i+-eqA_=fLirLjuOzFnywfAJ=0a3S2PGwJVWVrrmMh=yQ@mail.gmail.com>

HELLO, please check for the file extension  in ur code for .PCL , AND if
the check matches then invoke the corresponding application required to
open for that particular file using the if...elif...elif construct in
python which is the substitute of switch case statements in other languages.


On Sun, Apr 21, 2013 at 12:01 AM, Gora Mohanty <gora at mimirtech.com> wrote:

> On 20 April 2013 22:47, Kamalakar gs <foxrun2005 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > What i am asking is i have a file of other format for example .PCL which
> is
> > Patran file (Software used for analysis). Now what i want is if user
> inputs
> > a file name,python has to recognise the file name and directory of file
> > which exists and executes the file in patran window.
>
> (a) Please do not start separate threads for the same question
> (b) You might wish to review how to use mailing lists to your
>      advantage, and with the added benefit of preserving the
>      sanity of people trying to respond to your messages. Here
>      are some excellent pointers:
>      - http://wiki.apache.org/solr/UsingMailingLists
>      - https://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/UsingTheMailingList
>      - http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
>
> I am not sure who on this list might have an idea of some random
> software that you are interested in. Please formulate this in a way
> relevant to this list.
>
> Regards,
> Gora
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From hrdspl at gmail.com  Sat Apr 20 21:01:25 2013
From: hrdspl at gmail.com (hiharry danny)
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2013 00:31:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [HELP] QUERIES RELATED TO PYTHON
Message-ID: <CAKPC1iKzPvZPXiA9T4-qxg=H9OQ6HMAFmDNwLT_41U=r-45q6w@mail.gmail.com>

I have Python 2.5.4 installed on windows platform ..(win xp) ...and in the
installation folder there is a folder named Tcl(Tool Command Language)
which contains subfolders like Tk, Tix etc ..the version of tcl is 8.4 .The
default gui standard of python is through Tkinter module and when this
module is used the calls are made to the Tcl embedded interpreter to
execute the code.
So, is it for this reason Tcl is embedded in python or for anything else ?
If i haven't installed tcl separately, what are the ways to access Tcl
interpreter other than using ELmer and Using Tkinter module ,Tcl
interpreter can be invoked using Tkinter.Tcl().
Can wish or telsh be  for such ?

    import Tkinter
    a = Tkinter.Tcl()
    result = a.eval(' puts "hello, world" ')

TclError: can not find channel named "stdout"
But still it doesn't work, giving error why ?

And one more thing when i type dir('Tkinter') or any other module name to
display it's contents , why does it always show the same thing every time
which is as follows

['__add__', '__class__', '__contains__', '__delattr__', '__doc__',
'__eq__', '__ge__', '__getattribute__', '__getitem__', '__getnewargs__',
'__getslice__', '__gt__', '__hash__', '__init__', '__le__', '__len__',
'__lt__', '__mod__', '__mul__', '__ne__', '__new__', '__reduce__',
'__reduce_ex__', '__repr__', '__rmod__', '__rmul__', '__setattr__',
'__str__', 'capitalize', 'center', 'count', 'decode', 'encode', 'endswith',
'expandtabs', 'find', 'index', 'isalnum', 'isalpha', 'isdigit', 'islower',
'isspace', 'istitle', 'isupper', 'join', 'ljust', 'lower', 'lstrip',
'partition', 'replace', 'rfind', 'rindex', 'rjust', 'rpartition', 'rsplit',
'rstrip', 'split', 'splitlines', 'startswith', 'strip', 'swapcase',
'title', 'translate', 'upper', 'zfill']

From gora at mimirtech.com  Sat Apr 20 21:22:04 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2013 00:52:04 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [HELP] QUERIES RELATED TO PYTHON
In-Reply-To: <CAKPC1iKzPvZPXiA9T4-qxg=H9OQ6HMAFmDNwLT_41U=r-45q6w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKPC1iKzPvZPXiA9T4-qxg=H9OQ6HMAFmDNwLT_41U=r-45q6w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRG+Twu=b9uFgS5Wzt1i3ALXjnGEYKgo-b70O7w=tt-E2pA@mail.gmail.com>

On 21 April 2013 00:31, hiharry danny <hrdspl at gmail.com> wrote:
> I have Python 2.5.4 installed on windows platform ..(win xp) ...and in the
> installation folder there is a folder named Tcl(Tool Command Language)
> which contains subfolders like Tk, Tix etc ..the version of tcl is 8.4 .The
> default gui standard of python is through Tkinter module and when this
> module is used the calls are made to the Tcl embedded interpreter to
> execute the code.
> So, is it for this reason Tcl is embedded in python or for anything else ?
> If i haven't installed tcl separately, what are the ways to access Tcl
> interpreter other than using ELmer and Using Tkinter module ,Tcl
> interpreter can be invoked using Tkinter.Tcl().
> Can wish or telsh be  for such ?

Not sure what you are asking here.

>     import Tkinter
>     a = Tkinter.Tcl()
>     result = a.eval(' puts "hello, world" ')

> TclError: can not find channel named "stdout"
> But still it doesn't work, giving error why ?

This works just fine for me on Linux with Python 2.7.
Python 2.5 is quite old, and I would suspect some
issue with your Python vs. Tk installation.

> And one more thing when i type dir('Tkinter') or any other module name to
> display it's contents , why does it always show the same thing every time
> which is as follows
[...]

What you want is dir(Tkinter). Please note the absence of
single quotes. What you are getting now is the dictionary
for string, since that's you asked for.

Regards,
Gora

From abpillai at gmail.com  Sun Apr 21 11:30:19 2013
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2013 15:00:19 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python coding
In-Reply-To: <CAN+F=aecryo3Z-rd7jqJ9HMCTWtUxJbQRQ_8rf+p7qYv9vKa9w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAN+F=aecryo3Z-rd7jqJ9HMCTWtUxJbQRQ_8rf+p7qYv9vKa9w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACpj97A+C7swJvfRQimXUGbuz7peuqPDDi+hdqys0LNfKxdg8w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Kamalakar,

   You are trying to frequently send large files as attachments to this
list. I (list owner)
has already rejected one such email. Today I found 2 more messages from you
held
because of the same problem at the list server.

  Please avoid sending attachments to the list. Make your questions small
and
relevant and post attachments or other accessory information somewhere else
and send the link to the list.

  Please abide or I will have to temporarily ban your messages for a while
from the list.



On Sat, Apr 20, 2013 at 10:47 PM, Kamalakar gs <foxrun2005 at gmail.com> wrote:

> What i am asking is i have a file of other format for example .PCL which is
> Patran file (Software used for analysis). Now what i want is if user inputs
> a file name,python has to recognise the file name and directory of file
> which exists and executes the file in patran window.
>
> For example following lines executes to open a new database in a patran.
> Now it is automatically recognising the path of the file inside PCL file.
> Like as below
> *uil_file_new.go( "C:\MSC.Software\Patran_x64\20121/template.db",  @*
> *"C:\Users\Desktop\patran\plate.db" )*
> *
> *
> *POP UP WINDOW WILL SHOWS IN PATRAN WHEN ABOVE CODE READS THROUGH PCL
> FILE.*
> *
> *
> Now what i want is, python code has to execute in this way as it happens in
> Patran
> For Example:
> Userinput= Filename = plate.pcl
> now it has to recognise the file and directory as shown above and create a
> new database
> *
> *
> *Regards *
> *Kamalakar*
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Regards,

--Anand

From gora at mimirtech.com  Sun Apr 21 19:38:47 2013
From: gora at mimirtech.com (Gora Mohanty)
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2013 23:08:47 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [Ncr-Python.in] [HELP] QUERIES RELATED TO PYTHON
In-Reply-To: <CANzdhLiHhy+Wjajs7Pt8hTQzA=CSWaKvDzNV5DhCV+7pE_tcLg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANzdhLiHhy+Wjajs7Pt8hTQzA=CSWaKvDzNV5DhCV+7pE_tcLg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACiMRGJEOX9v3wW0hdgLABZuzsZt1VQvwLK8E6JQAUq6azAz4g@mail.gmail.com>

On 21 April 2013 16:54, saurabh chandra <fatboyslimchandra at gmail.com> wrote:
> I am trying to develop an algorithm for a combinatorial optimization. The
> problem consists of a graph network with nodes and connected arcs. In this
> algorithm I have to choose an optimal combination of nodes out of all the
> nodes in the graph. The successive nodes are selected as entries in the list
> using a random search technique. Successive nodes share a precedence
> relationship.

This description is not very clear, at least to me. What is an
"optimal combination"
in this case? Why does it make sense to use a random search?

> In each iteration of the algorithm I generate a combination of a subset of
> nodes chosen randomly from the whole node-set, as a list. In the same loop I
> carry out a modification of the generated list and calculate the objective
> value associated with this . A particular generated list in any loop will
> give rise to a single modified list.
>
> Now I do not want same list to be generated again and again, so I maintain a
> super-list of generated lists and check the membership of each new list in
> this super-list. I restart the loop if same list appears again in the
> algorithm. As I already said the original list gets modified within an
> iteration. The problem is that although I append the super-list with the
> original list before modification, as soon as I modify this original list
> the list added to the super-list also changes automatically. Thus the
> iteration goes on even if the same list is generated again and again.
[...]

Perhaps your best bet would be to show us some code, and describe
which parts are not working as you expect them to. You might want
to use pastebin.com for that. See if you can distil your code down to
a small example that demonstrates the issue that you are facing.

Regards,
Gora

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Mon Apr 22 09:25:42 2013
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 12:55:42 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Simple Search With Django ORM
Message-ID: <CAN7tdFRgCSKQpAf0tOBKZPTB_30uCLhC0U5KLUmbfGNGhEBLQA@mail.gmail.com>

Linky :  http://maxburstein.com/blog/simple-search-with-django-orm/

-Venkat
@venkasub <http://about.me/venkasub>

From vsapre80 at gmail.com  Mon Apr 22 14:00:59 2013
From: vsapre80 at gmail.com (Vishal)
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 17:30:59 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] hiredis on Windows
Message-ID: <CACPguY9ybhmGxPx+P9_Ku9AXnr4qnrCqNttA+PqFeFhdcxzymA@mail.gmail.com>

Hello friends,

As you might know, Redis is an in-memory key-value store library..and much
more. Its officially supported only on *nix operating systems.

redis-py <https://pypi.python.org/pypi/redis/2.7.2> is the default client
Redis interface in python. redis-py is pure python.

hiredis <https://github.com/antirez/redis/tree/unstable/deps/hiredis> is a
C client interface to reading responses from a Redis server.
hiredis-py<https://pypi.python.org/pypi/hiredis/0.1.1> is
the python wrapper on hiredis. *It works only in *nix operating systems
(mostly because its officially designed to use POSIX socket api)*
*
*
Redis and hiredis have been made available in Windows by Microsoft Open
Source wing on github (https://github.com/MSOpenTech/redis)
However that version of hiredis is not wrapped in Python !!

I am looking for a hiredis-py port on Windows. Any ideas?
Anybody willing to be kind enough make this available to the open source
world at large would be doing a great job. Any takers :)) ?

Thanks and best regards,
Vishal Sapre

p.s: I have access to hiredis.lib and hiredis.dll, but they would need
ctypes/pywin32 wrappers to call.

---
"Life is 10% how you make it, and 90% how you take it"
"????? ?????, ????? ????? (Benefit for most people, Happiness for most
people.)"
---
Please DONT print this email, unless you really need to. Save Energy &
Paper. Save the Earth.

From foxrun2005 at gmail.com  Tue Apr 23 20:01:11 2013
From: foxrun2005 at gmail.com (Kamalakar gs)
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 23:31:11 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Need help for python
Message-ID: <CAN+F=afhperQxifx7-Nj6UgLJOEiTB9gJQ3jv=owiJxX3O7vnA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
I have a PCL file which consists of following lines for the first few lines.

*uil_file_new.go( "C:\MSC.Software\Patran_x64\20121/template.db",  @*
*"C:\Users\IMEMS SDC\Desktop\patran\plate.db" )*
*
*
*set_current_dir( "C:\Users\IMEMS SDC\Desktop\patran" )*
*
*
*
*
The* uil_file_new.go *which is a default command for creating new database
in patran. Now i want to keep the * file name* as an user input so
that directory
name should automatically picked-up for execution.

or one more option either user has to input both filename and dir name for
execution of patran. How to associate filename and directory name for
execution in MSC patran.

For execution of patran through python, the following command would be used

*os,system('patran -sfp')* which opens up patran window but file is not
associating.
How to do that.

Regards
Kamalakar

From davidsnt at gmail.com  Tue Apr 23 21:39:55 2013
From: davidsnt at gmail.com (davidsnt)
Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 01:09:55 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] RPM Build Help
Message-ID: <CAGvL6KUajht=jgaG-x6iaqKBnDRjUv1MrXbMW_p1MJm4x4uU=w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Can you help to find out the module that will help me to build RPM's and
manipulate with RPM database.

I followed
http://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/Fedora_Draft_Documentation/0.1/html/RPM_Guide/ch-rpm-programming-python.html
but unable to find rpm or python-rpm modules.

pip search rpm

just list few rpm packages like pyrpm which not much of help.

Refer:
http://rpm5.org/docs/api/classRpm.html


Regards,
Davidsanthosh L

From gnuyoga at gmail.com  Wed Apr 24 05:50:36 2013
From: gnuyoga at gmail.com (Sreekandh Balakrishnan)
Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 09:20:36 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] RPM Build Help
In-Reply-To: <CAGvL6KUajht=jgaG-x6iaqKBnDRjUv1MrXbMW_p1MJm4x4uU=w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGvL6KUajht=jgaG-x6iaqKBnDRjUv1MrXbMW_p1MJm4x4uU=w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3E63E289180A4BDA994F6147CA3F7809@gmail.com>

On Wednesday, 24 April 2013 at 1:09, davidsnt wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Can you help to find out the module that will help me to build RPM's and
> manipulate with RPM database.
> 
> I followed
> http://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/Fedora_Draft_Documentation/0.1/html/RPM_Guide/ch-rpm-programming-python.html
> but unable to find rpm or python-rpm modules.
> 
> pip search rpm
> 
> just list few rpm packages like pyrpm which not much of help.
> 
> Refer:
> http://rpm5.org/docs/api/classRpm.htm
> 
Are you in a Redhat/fedora/centos box ?  If yes then do "yum install rpm-devel" 

From davidsnt at gmail.com  Wed Apr 24 17:03:47 2013
From: davidsnt at gmail.com (davidsnt)
Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 20:33:47 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] RPM Build Help
In-Reply-To: <3E63E289180A4BDA994F6147CA3F7809@gmail.com>
References: <CAGvL6KUajht=jgaG-x6iaqKBnDRjUv1MrXbMW_p1MJm4x4uU=w@mail.gmail.com>
	<3E63E289180A4BDA994F6147CA3F7809@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAGvL6KUzy2oN-=eV4NGw=bzdpHUYdGU4PDQj0+-nMMxR38sh-Q@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you :)

Regards,
Davidsanthosh L


On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 9:20 AM, Sreekandh Balakrishnan
<gnuyoga at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Wednesday, 24 April 2013 at 1:09, davidsnt wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > Can you help to find out the module that will help me to build RPM's and
> > manipulate with RPM database.
> >
> > I followed
> >
> http://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/Fedora_Draft_Documentation/0.1/html/RPM_Guide/ch-rpm-programming-python.html
> > but unable to find rpm or python-rpm modules.
> >
> > pip search rpm
> >
> > just list few rpm packages like pyrpm which not much of help.
> >
> > Refer:
> > http://rpm5.org/docs/api/classRpm.htm
> >
> Are you in a Redhat/fedora/centos box ?  If yes then do "yum install
> rpm-devel"
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Apr 25 09:46:40 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2013 13:16:40 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [OT] A decade of commits
Message-ID: <874nevrr1b.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>


A nice post by Brett Cannon about working on the Python project for a
decade

http://sayspy.blogspot.ca/2013/04/a-decade-of-commits.html

-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From shabda at agiliq.com  Sun Apr 28 15:33:24 2013
From: shabda at agiliq.com (Shabda Raaj)
Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2013 19:03:24 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Announce - Django Graphos
Message-ID: <CALTVfMH+P0xUKHs9sxtmdeEVcS-QCAKZZZLunqmvNhnH3Be8Pg@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

I would like to announce our new app: Django-graphos.
https://github.com/agiliq/django-graphos

This is meant to make working with Django charting really easy.

You can mix and match Data source charting APIs.

* Python Nested lists
* CSV Files
* MongoDB
* Redis
* Django ORM

### Charting API Supported

* [Flot](http://flotcharts.org)
* [Google Charts API](https://developers.google.com/chart/)
* [YUI Charts](http://yuilibrary.com/yui/docs/charts/)

Feedback/Pull requests etc welcome and appreciated. :) I am particularly
looking for a design critque of the class structure.

-- 
Thanks,
Shabda

Agiliq.com - Building Amazing Apps
agiliq.com/blog/ | github.com/agiliq
US: +13152854388 | IN: +919949997612 | Skype: shabda.raaj
Our Android Apps <https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=Agiliq> | Our
iOS Apps <https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/agiliq/id407918088>