The only moderated language groups now are those for ML and Dylan, so
proposing a moderated language group would be historically unusual (=
would invite an egalitarian backlash). I'd like instead to see the
proposal be so simple and ordinary that nobody can find a procedural
point to pick on.
> [steve m]
> ... the kinds of groups that NEED moderation are the ones where there
> is some subjective ambiguity in the charter.
Also those devoted to programs people are _forced_ to use. E.g., it's
not unusual to see a tedious thread in comp.lang.fortran started by
someone who has to use Fortran but doesn't like it. Ditto for C or C++.
Anyone using Python (or Icon or ...) is doing so because they want to, so
won't be coming in with an axe to grind.
> [two people agreed with this]
> ... both sides of the moderated/unmoderated debate can be satisfied
> with the initial creation of a comp.lang.python and a follow-on (or
> simultaneous) creation of other sub-groups that could be moderated ...
I'm afraid this won't work, so people who really want moderation should
fight for it from the start:
1) Simultaneous proposal of multiple Python groups would at best make the
proposal so complex that a large number of well-known news.group'ers
would object for that reason alone.
2) If we start with an unmoderated group only, chances are we'll never
get a moderated group too later. E.g., look at comp.lang.c: even
those language groups that _clearly_ need a moderated sub-group can't
get them (see reference to "news.groups wieners" above <0.5 grin>).
So let's take our best shot, but not expect to get another one.
> [bill j]
> ... I hadn't really considered that perhaps it's [Python] just a little
> backwater language like Icon.
Icon currently supports more users, more implementations, two snail-mail
newsletters (one of which that costs $), at least 3 good books, at least
one commercial implementation ... and its newsgroup is darned-near empty.
I expect Python will become more popular than Icon, and _should_ be more
popular than C++ <wink>. But does anyone believe it will get as popular
shit-floats-ly y'rs - tim
Tim Peters firstname.lastname@example.org
not speaking for Kendall Square Research Corp