[Tutor] Python + editor

[Marc]

Hi Alan!

alan.gauld@bt.com (alan.gauld@bt.com) wrote:

 
> > > > Block selection (ctrl+mouse selection).
> > There's also Visual mode in Vim 
> > 
> > Can't beat crtl+mouse selection.
> 
> You can use the mouse to select in vim and the 
> cut n' paste etc all work as expected...
> 
> After dragging with the mouse select the mode:
> v = Visual(default)
> V = Visual Line(whole lines always selected)
> CTRL [vV] = Visual block

Still can't beat crtl+mouse selection, over a phone line :)

> 
> > > > Can redefine the print command:
> > > I'm sure you can do this in vim, I'm just not sure how.
> 
> Just filter the file or region to any external 
> command using :}!
> 
Didn't worked here... But I'm sure it will after reading lots of docs, searching
google, etc.

> > They have a lot of power, but hidden deep inside a dotfile.
> 
> Absolutely. Like any powerful tool they aren't really 
> intended for casual amateur use.

Hey ! :-).
OK, I'll bite.
Some times being powerful does not necessarily translate to being difficult to use.
Heck, python is powerful! Yet used by a lot of "casual amateur".
Are u saying we just should pack our things, our hopes, our enthusiasm and go? 
That we should forget about using this wonderful tool just because of its power?
I don't think so. Python is a nice example of a powerful tool that can be used by
simple mortals, you know the "casual amateur", with the aid of the great tutors
of this list, people that believe on "casual amateur", helping us to aim a
little higher, away from our own foot.

> 
> > OK, we can use gvim but is still hard to do some things like 
> > the print command above.
> 
> The basic print command is easy redirecting does require 
> memorizing a three character string but you could easily 
> map it to a hot key!

Again, try the explain-over-a-phone-line method. Besides, there is a usability
factor. Can u guarantee that the hot key will be the same on every vim out there?
No! because the user can redefine it to whatever (s)he wants! Sometimes too
many options is not an option. 
Have u ever tried to use others people vim? Or out of the box?
What a nightmare! nothing seems to work as u, advanced user , expect.
But nedit seems the same anywhere I try to use it.Only minor tweaks are needed. 

> > Same goes to emacs-X11.
> 
> It is a hybrid, it has a lot internally but has access 
> to the OS too.

Old joke: emacs is a complete OS. Only lacks a descent text editor. :)

> 
> > after some time and u need the work done.Quick.
> 
> vim does most of the work out of the box
> (unlike emacs!) My vimrc file is only about 
> 10 lines long, my emacsrc is over 200...

My .neditrc is.... Gee I just don't know.No kidding!
I'll tell u why: Because I don't need to edit the resource file directly! There's
a menu item just for this:
Preferences -> default settings. It allows me to play with the options _without_
reading a lot of docs/other people dotfiles.A time saver, no doubt.
 
> > asking how to redefine the print command .Yup, u just lost a 
> > customer while you was looking at the docs.:)
> 
> But surely redefining the print command is a nonsense, 
> the print command prints. WEhat they really want to 
> do is output to some other output device/format. 

C'mon man! This is nit-picking... :)

> > You know, life is short.That's why I'm slowly giving up from 
> > things like:
> > - C/perl ;
> > - vi/emacs;
> 
> Life is short thats why I stick to those things, 
> I don't have time to waste on extra keystrokes!

Like :}! or :wq! . Man, I thought u really liked lots of keystrokes.
 
> > experience, something I'm experimenting right now with 
> > GNU/linux and python.And nedit of course :) .
> 
> Get a modern Mac. My iBook with Mac OS X has convinced me 
> that Linux has so far to go I can't be bothered waiting!

Gee... Life is not _that_ short... :)
Man  u just solved all the micro$ft problems! They should just buy a mac to
every linux, gnome, kde, apache, perl, mozilla, python,open-source developers 
out there! Why bother develop something new when we have word, VB, aqua, quartz,
IE, outlook already made, ready for use?

Jokes aside, we are talking about different enjoyable experiences here...
I'm talking about the feeling of freedom , the good sensation of not depending  
on vendors that  hide thinks from you(API anyone?), don't show the code, 
keep their secrets using obscure licenses  that take away all your rights 
in exchange for a pretty interface. 
No thanks, I'll keep playing with my bloated gnome, my slow kde, my ugly-font
mozilla because I know they won't be that way forever thanks to a community 
that believe we can have a better software, a better world, without giving up
our freedoms.
> 
> Alan g
Thanks for replying.

.:: MarcoLinux ::.

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