From schochet@globecomm.net Mon Mar 2 19:52:30 1998 From: schochet@globecomm.net (schochet) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 98 14:52:30 -0500 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Floating window Message-ID: <199803021951.OAA05960@ren.globecomm.net> I'm new to Python so sorry if this doesn't make sense. Can anyone tell me how to create a application window that will always stay on top of other applications. In TK or preferably in native calls. TIA, -ben _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From billpy@mousa.demon.co.uk Wed Mar 4 14:35:11 1998 From: billpy@mousa.demon.co.uk (Bill Bedford) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 1998 14:35:11 +0000 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Python Applescript In-Reply-To: <199803021951.OAA05960@ren.globecomm.net> Message-ID: <419266994669177213871@mousa.demon.co.uk> I have been working on some replacement modules for the python scripting support. They dynamically load and read the target application's aete in much the same way that Applescript does. I now need some input from other people on a couple points. I have to provide Python with its own application user terminology (aeut). Most of this will be the suites in the applescript dialect file. However most of the applescript suite is redundant, and I would like to come to some agreement as to which calls would be useful an which aren't. I have a similar problem with scrpting additions. Most of them are not needed in python though some are convenient. Should I provide a mechanism to include them and what would be the best way of doing it? _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Fri Mar 6 10:27:23 1998 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 1998 11:27:23 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Missent Message-ID: This one was missent to the pythonmac-sig-request address. Please reply to the original author (or the list), not to me... ------- Forwarded Message Date: 4 Mar 1998 16:26:48 -0000 From: "Mark Alford" Subject: Tkinter chokes Laptop I've been using Tkinter to write a GUI application. I'm running Mac System 8 on a PowerPC laptop and a Performa. On the laptop, my application invariably freezes up the *second* time I run it, during the Frame.__init__ . I then have to reboot the machine. I am using Python 1.5b3, but this used to happen with Python 1.33 as well. On the Performa, this doesn't happen, although it does occasionally die with "error 10" for no apparent reason. The laptop is a Powerbook 3400c, with 80M of RAM. Any suggestions for things to try? - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Alford School of Natural Sciences Institute for Advanced Study Princeton, NJ 08540 U.S.A. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- End of Forwarded Message _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From alford@IAS.EDU Fri Mar 6 21:57:34 1998 From: alford@IAS.EDU (Mark Alford) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 16:57:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] MacSpeech Message-ID: <199803062157.QAA06220@avaris.sns.ias.edu> I'm sorry about my earlier "missent" attempt. Please ignore it. Here is a clearer description of my problem. I've been having a problem using Tkinter and MacSpeech together, on a PowerPC laptop. I'm running Mac System 8, with Python 1.5b3. I've created a script that displays the problem (see below). On the laptop, this script invariably dies the *second* time I run it. How it dies depends on how much memory is allocated to Python. Usually it freezes up the whole machine, or gives "error type 112". I'd be very grateful if anyone else could verify that this happens (and perhaps suggest a cure...) The laptop is a Powerbook 3400c, with 80M of RAM. #----------- Example script, dies on *second* running ----------- from Tkinter import * import macspeech class MacSpeaker: # taken and simplified from grail.py in Mac speech demo def __init__(self): self.voices = [] self.nvoices = macspeech.CountVoices() self.curvoice = 1 def _newvoice(self): vd = macspeech.GetIndVoice(self.curvoice) sc = vd.NewChannel() self.curvoice = self.curvoice + 1 if self.curvoice > self.nvoices: self.curvoice = 1 return sc def newvoices(self, n): self.voices = [] for i in range(n): self.voices.append(self._newvoice()) # The class for the main window: class Box(Frame): def __init__(self, parent=None): Frame.__init__(self, parent) self.speaker = MacSpeaker() # open up the speaker nv = self.speaker.nvoices print nv # Here is where it freezes upon the second running if nv is 22, # the full number of voices available # *******>>>>>> self.speaker.newvoices(nv) bb = Box() bb.mainloop() #--------------- End of example script -------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Alford School of Natural Sciences Institute for Advanced Study Princeton, NJ 08540 U.S.A. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Wed Mar 11 14:45:06 1998 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 15:45:06 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] cfm68k Python 1.5b3, who uses it? Message-ID: Well, since the release of MacPython 1.5b3 I have made only very limited progress on the cfm68k bugs (packages not working and NumPy crashing), and I don't really see any way forward either: I don't have a reasonable 68k machine anymore, and single-stepping Python on a 16 Mhz 68020 with 4Mb of memory and no disk to speak of is _no_ _fun_. So, I'm planning to release a final 1.5 for the mac with these two bugs still unresolved. But, before I do that I would like to hear from people how much trouble these bugs are causing them, if any. -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From johngslater@earthlink.net Tue Mar 17 07:27:53 1998 From: johngslater@earthlink.net (John Slater) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 23:27:53 -0800 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] tk corrupting Finder Message-ID: <199803170726.XAA24717@norway.it.earthlink.net> I am trying to use tcl&tk. This has resulted in my having to reinstall OS 8.0 (on a G3) several times because the finder got corrupted and I could not even restart my machine (error type 41). I don't know how to "bless" a copy of the system folder, so this whole reinstall business gets laborious in a hurry. Anyways, at this point it seems like menusare doing the dirty deeds. This code is very suspect: frame .mbar -borderwidth 1 -relief raised pack .mbar -fill x menubutton .mbar.file -text "File" -menu .mbar.file.m pack .mbar.file -side left menu .mbar.file.m .mbar.file.m add command -label "Exit" -command exit menubutton .mbar.edit -text "Edit" -menu .mbar.edit.m pack .mbar.edit -side left menu .mbar.edit.m .mbar.edit.m add command -label "Clear" -command { .sketchpad delete all } I noticed in the 1.5b3 README that " Other outstanding problems are tkinter problems with menus (all platforms) " is mentioned. The tcl/tk 8.0 Mac release README does not mention any problems with menus, but it seems likely that there is a fundamental problem with tk - not a problem with tkinter. I will try to get the attention of someone at Sun - if there is anyone in the tcl group that is still there. I live a half mile from Sun, so there can't be any excuses about non-reproducability, they will be welcome to look at my computer. If any of you are interested in this outcome, let me know. Also, if anyone is reading "Effective Tcl/Tk Programming" and wants to port some of the programs to Python, send me mail since I will do some of this if I can get tk to work on a Mac. -John _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From fernando@digital.ddnet.es Tue Mar 17 09:07:27 1998 From: fernando@digital.ddnet.es (Fernando Garcia) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 04:07:27 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Tkinter vs. native calls Message-ID: Hello I'm mostly a newbie onf Python on the Mac, although I've long experience with Macintosh programming. The basic guestion is what to use: Tkinter or the native OS calls that Jack gave us to handle menus, windows, etc, etc, etc. The first one will gave me compatibility across platform (suposing I don't use any Mac specific feature, like QuickTime), the later one will create a more Mac native app. I've never worked with Tk (less with Tk on the Mac) and I don't know how Tk Mac applications looks or how they integrate with the standard user interface. Any insights on this? TIA, Fernando ***************************************************************************** Digital Domain es miembro de ASIMELEC ***************************************************************************** Digital Domain S.L. Tlef. (91) 7268038 Fax. (91) 7262102 http://www.ddnet.es/ email administrativo: admin@digital.ddnet.es email personal: fernando@digital.ddnet.es ***************************************************************************** _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From rcohen@humbug.llnl.gov Wed Mar 18 20:30:02 1998 From: rcohen@humbug.llnl.gov (Ron Cohen) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:30:02 -0800 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Tkinter vs. native calls In-Reply-To: (message from Fernando Garcia on Tue, 17 Mar 1998 04:07:27 -0500 (EST)) Message-ID: <199803182030.MAA00395@humbug.llnl.gov> I have been using TkInter on the mac for a while now, with Python 1.4, without incident. I have almost identical codes also running on a UNIX environment, and everything looks pretty much the same. As to the posted problems with menus, it would thus seem to be a Py1.5 problem, unless Py1.5 also comes with a newer TK that is itself buggy. -Ron Cohen- _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From fernando@digital.ddnet.es Wed Mar 18 21:54:47 1998 From: fernando@digital.ddnet.es (Fernando Garcia) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 23:54:47 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Tkinter vs. native calls In-Reply-To: <199803182030.MAA00395@humbug.llnl.gov> References: (message from Fernando Garcia on Tue, 17 Mar 1998 04:07:27 -0500 (EST)) Message-ID: Hello >I have been using TkInter on the mac for a while now, >with Python 1.4, without incident. I have almost identical >codes also running on a UNIX environment, and everything >looks pretty much the same. As to the posted problems >with menus, it would thus seem to be a Py1.5 problem, >unless Py1.5 also comes with a newer TK that is itself >buggy. Oops, I think I mispelled my original statement. I didn't wanted to say that Python and Tkinter have any problems. BUT what I wanted to know is that if python programs for the Macintosh made with Tkinter looks like a native Macintosh program, with it's menu bar, standard windows behaviour, etc. like any other Mac program (TextEdit, ClarisWorks...). I'm an experienced Macintosh programmer and have some experience programming python on Linux (strange, isn't it?) now I want to adopt python for many projects on the Mac, and Tkinter would be great allowing me to do just the same on Unix and Mac but I don't want to loose the look and feel of the Macintosh standard. >From the little I have seen until now, Tkinter can include most of the funcionalities of the Mac (including menu bar), dialogs, windows... but I'm not sure up to what level of integration. That's my doubt. Regards, Fernando ***************************************************************************** Digital Domain es miembro de ASIMELEC ***************************************************************************** Digital Domain S.L. Tlef. (91) 7268038 Fax. (91) 7262102 http://www.ddnet.es/ email administrativo: admin@digital.ddnet.es email personal: fernando@digital.ddnet.es ***************************************************************************** _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From just@letterror.com Wed Mar 18 23:51:27 1998 From: just@letterror.com (Just van Rossum) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 00:51:27 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Tkinter vs. native calls In-Reply-To: References: <199803182030.MAA00395@humbug.llnl.gov> (message from Fernando Garcia on Tue, 17 Mar 1998 04:07:27 -0500 (EST)) Message-ID: At 11:54 PM +0200 3/18/98, Fernando Garcia wrote: >Oops, I think I mispelled my original statement. I didn't wanted to say >that Python and Tkinter have any problems. BUT what I wanted to know is >that if python programs for the Macintosh made with Tkinter looks like a >native Macintosh program, with it's menu bar, standard windows behaviour, >etc. like any other Mac program (TextEdit, ClarisWorks...). > >I'm an experienced Macintosh programmer and have some experience >programming python on Linux (strange, isn't it?) now I want to adopt python >for many projects on the Mac, and Tkinter would be great allowing me to do >just the same on Unix and Mac but I don't want to loose the look and feel >of the Macintosh standard. > >>From the little I have seen until now, Tkinter can include most of the >funcionalities of the Mac (including menu bar), dialogs, windows... but I'm >not sure up to what level of integration. That's my doubt. A Tkinter app will be way too slow on 040 macs, and perhaps still too slow on low-end PowerMacs. Buttons and scrollbars are native, but text editing fields don't seem to be Mac-like enough. It depends on how close you want to get: for simple interfaces it should look and feel just fine, but in my (brief) experience it gets quite clumsy to to work with beyond that. Lots of little things don't behave quite like you would expect. Apparently the situation is similar on Windows: Fredrik Lundh told me that the reason he wrote Topaz (a lightweight GUI kit, implementing a subset of Tkinter with native Windows stuff) was exactly this: Tkinter doesn't get close enough to the Win look & feel if your demands are higher that average. I would say, try it out, and see for yourself. Perhaps it does meet your expectations after all... Just _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From rcohen@humbug.llnl.gov Thu Mar 19 00:54:09 1998 From: rcohen@humbug.llnl.gov (Ron Cohen) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 16:54:09 -0800 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Tkinter vs. native calls In-Reply-To: (message from Fernando Garcia on Wed, 18 Mar 1998 23:54:47 +0200) Message-ID: <199803190054.QAA00492@humbug.llnl.gov> Sorry, there were two separate mac/TK messages posted at the same time and I responded to both at once. TK on the mac produces widgets separate from the mac menus. The menu-containning widgets be dragged around on your screen like any other, pretty much like any menued x application on UNIX. If you want to create a real mac menubar, best to use the mac Framework that comes with the mac Python distribution.. at the cost of losing portability. -Ron- _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From FoulCraven@aol.com Thu Mar 19 13:08:29 1998 From: FoulCraven@aol.com (FoulCraven) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 08:08:29 EST Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Medusa under MacPython? Message-ID: <523b4636.351118cf@aol.com> Has anyone successfully gotten Sam Rushing's Medusa to work under MacPython? More specifically, 1.5b3? I get an error in the macpath, which says that the path it is trying to work on begins with '::' and I have not been able to find the source of the problem. Thanks, Dave DiCarlo Austin, TX _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Fri Mar 20 15:55:38 1998 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 16:55:38 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Administratrivia: ptyhonmac-sig is moved to mailman Message-ID: Folks, real soon now the list will move from being managed by majordomo to listman, which is a much nicer package (and written in Python). When the list has moved you'll all get a message with instructions on how to use listman, plus your password for changing options, etc. Hopefully this move will not cause any problems, but just to be sure I'll post a message to the new list early next week. So, if you do see this message and you don't see the one next week: contact me and I'll see what went wrong. -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Tue Mar 24 09:49:47 1998 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 10:49:47 +0100 Subject: [Pythonmac-SIG] List migration Message-ID: Folks, as you can see the pythonmac-sig has migrated to listman, and hopefully nobody fell overboard. So, if you don't get this message please contact me:-) -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm