From sanger@nucmed.med.nyu.edu Sat Aug 2 23:41:26 1997 From: sanger@nucmed.med.nyu.edu (Joseph Sanger) Date: Sat, 02 Aug 1997 18:41:26 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] No subject was specified. Message-ID: <33E3B794.A54CE3C7@nucmed.med.nyu.edu> Can anyone direct me towards an Oracle access method for Macintosh? I suppose ODBC would be sufficient ... thanks. _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From sanger@nucmed.med.nyu.edu Sat Aug 2 23:42:20 1997 From: sanger@nucmed.med.nyu.edu (Joseph Sanger) Date: Sat, 02 Aug 1997 18:42:20 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Oracle DB Access from Mac Python Message-ID: <33E3B7CA.FEE3E070@nucmed.med.nyu.edu> Can anyone direct me to a package to facilitate Oracle DB access from Mac Python. Thanks. _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Tue Aug 5 12:55:53 1997 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Tue, 05 Aug 1997 13:55:53 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? Message-ID: Folks, starting with the next distribution (or, actually, starting with the 1.5a2 distribution that PSA members have gotten) the python application and python applets are fat binaries. However, I'm still undecided as to whether to fully integrate the ppc and cfm68k distributions. The advantage of a fully integrated fat release, with fat plugin modules and a fat PythonCore shared library, is that people can store a single copy of Python on a file server for everyone to use. The disadvantage is that a Python distribution will take 2-3 Mb more diskspace than it does currently. Another option is to have all three distributions (ppc, cfm68k and fat) but I'm a bit reluctant to do that because it'll cause me more work. Yet another option is to use an installer package, but I'm also reluctant to do that because these things are rather expensive and I have no experience with how good they are. Also, this'll make the download at least as big as for the fat option. Feedback, please, -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From jeff@ollie.clive.ia.us Tue Aug 5 14:19:01 1997 From: jeff@ollie.clive.ia.us (Jeffrey C. Ollie) Date: Tue, 05 Aug 1997 08:19:01 -0500 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 05 Aug 1997 13:55:53 +0200." Message-ID: <199708051319.IAA18291@worf.netins.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- On Tue, 05 Aug 1997 13:55:53 +0200, jack.jansen@cwi.nl writes: > >Yet another option is to use an installer package, but I'm also >reluctant to do that because these things are rather expensive Don't assume that an installer would be expensive. Try contacting Aladdin and explain that you want to create an installer for a freeware product. They may be willing to grant the Python community a limited license for Stuffit InstallerMaker at little or no cost. Perhaps the PSA would be able to chip in some money if we can't get it for free. >and I >have no experience with how good they are. Stuffit Installermaker is pretty good. The basics are really easy and more advanced things can be accomplished with a little scripting or programming. Best of all, there's a free trial version: >Also, this'll make the >download at least as big as for the fat option. True, but the improved simplicity is a good thing too. [A copy of the headers and the PGP signature follow.] Cc: pythonmac-sig@python.org Date: Tue, 05 Aug 1997 08:19:01 -0500 From: "Jeffrey C. Ollie" In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 05 Aug 1997 13:55:53 +0200." Subject: Re: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? To: Jack Jansen -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: AnySign 1.4 - A Python tool for PGP signing e-mail and news. iQCVAwUBM+coTpwkOQz8sbZFAQGhvwP/U6AG9qX9GvEUXXy4zrYyjWSeRsxePMtY qeXY51wCn3GiL3qnJabvhcrL9+Jg2SBxKsQZLMN74MzPvogbIFtsTB0GOnWp3uD1 RqSUh/ZFf2pDbJ6JrDf3B4DLRyEcVz6nhPuvzgGDpqskFFG3N/GJbneIMGoPvN7L EXGTShKOj9Y= =oluK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- Jeffrey C. Ollie | Should Work Now (TM) _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From guzdial@cc.gatech.edu Tue Aug 5 17:25:06 1997 From: guzdial@cc.gatech.edu (Mark Guzdial) Date: Tue, 5 Aug 1997 12:25:06 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? Message-ID: >The disadvantage is that a Python distribution will take >2-3 Mb more diskspace than it does currently. > >Another option is to have all three distributions (ppc, cfm68k and >fat) but I'm a bit reluctant to do that because it'll cause me more >work. I lean toward just distributing FAT. There are tools that I can use to strip off the piece that I don't need, if I wanted to THIN the application. I'd rather decrease Jack's work in creating the distribution and save his time for (much more interesting and valuable) hacking. Disk space is cheap, time is expensive. Mark -------------------------- Mark Guzdial : Georgia Tech : College of Computing : Atlanta, GA 30332-0280 (404) 894-5618 : Fax (404) 894-0673 : guzdial@cc.gatech.edu http://www.cc.gatech.edu/gvu/people/Faculty/Mark.Guzdial.html _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From just@knoware.nl Wed Aug 6 13:08:09 1997 From: just@knoware.nl (Just van Rossum) Date: Wed, 6 Aug 1997 13:08:09 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 1:55 PM +0200 8/5/97, Jack Jansen wrote: >Yet another option is to use an installer package, but I'm also >reluctant to do that because these things are rather expensive and I >have no experience with how good they are. Also, this'll make the >download at least as big as for the fat option. I would certainly favor an installer, if it would make installing Python easier altogether: I would love to see the file "ReadMeOrSuffer" be renamed to "ReadMe" ;-). Which would mean that the installer copies PythonCore to the extensions folder and create the prefs file containing at least the pointer to the Python home directory (maybe that's harder?). But it's getting easier already: now that Jack & I have learned how relative aliases work, the MkPluginAliases applet could disappear (Jack, have you played with that yet?). That's one bugger gone. On a slightly related note: I would prefer the "mkapplet" applet to be named "MakeApplet". "mk" is a unix-ism, that is not familiar to the average Mac user. I have the InstallerMaker demo here, I'll play around with it. Maybe I can help. Just _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From jeff@ollie.clive.ia.us Wed Aug 6 13:44:25 1997 From: jeff@ollie.clive.ia.us (Jeffrey C. Ollie) Date: Wed, 06 Aug 1997 07:44:25 -0500 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 06 Aug 1997 13:08:09 BST." Message-ID: <199708061244.HAA06000@worf.netins.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- On Wed, 6 Aug 1997 13:08:09 +0100, just@knoware.nl writes: > >At 1:55 PM +0200 8/5/97, Jack Jansen wrote: >>Yet another option is to use an installer package, but I'm also >>reluctant to do that because these things are rather expensive and I >>have no experience with how good they are. Also, this'll make the >>download at least as big as for the fat option. > >I would certainly favor an installer, if it would make installing Python >easier altogether: Things would definitely be easier, at the cost of larger downloads for everyone. >I have the InstallerMaker demo here, I'll play around with it. Maybe I can >help. I'm willing to help out also, as I have a bit of previous experience with InstallerMaker. I just got a copy of CW Pro 1 so I can probably help out with some coding too. Has someone made a Mac/CW Pro version of 1.5a2 available yet? [A copy of the headers and the PGP signature follow.] Cc: pythonmac-sig@python.org Date: Wed, 06 Aug 1997 07:44:25 -0500 From: "Jeffrey C. Ollie" In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 06 Aug 1997 13:08:09 BST." Subject: Re: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? To: Just van Rossum -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: AnySign 1.4 - A Python tool for PGP signing e-mail and news. iQCVAwUBM+hxsZwkOQz8sbZFAQGNmQQAmCwpTfy8yTXuO633bKKNXTHstyceKkYy 8cK7v/IZ2ohhctK5YYyYOST2HLiIUJ+ZA8R83ORycMWwSJnttfvDdet05y4HogPz ARczn+znHnWNWzTvIL7FC0j2+co9lnKb+bQmsmFeJ8OGoBBTRiRcNK2uAMP5QcN4 7FezvvrZBpk= =qfIZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- Jeffrey C. Ollie | Should Work Now (TM) _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Thu Aug 7 10:40:54 1997 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Thu, 07 Aug 1997 11:40:54 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Fat distributions or separate cfm68k/ppc distributions? In-Reply-To: Message by "Jeffrey C. Ollie" , Wed, 06 Aug 1997 07:44:25 -0500 , <199708061244.HAA06000@worf.netins.net> Message-ID: Well, it seems that almost everyone is in favor of a single fat distribution for the normal shared Python, preferrably with an installer. It appears that InstallerMaker is everyone's favourite, I will check it out. On the other hand: ReadMeOrSuffer isn't really so apt a name anymore, since the amount of suffering isn't that great. So, maybe I'll stick with the current method with one or two modifications (like making the interpreter non-executable until MkPluginAliases has been run for the first time). Something else: is anyone still using the non-cfm68k Python? Is there any need to continue distributing it? Oh yes, something else again: > I'm willing to help out also, as I have a bit of previous experience > with InstallerMaker. I just got a copy of CW Pro 1 so I can probably > help out with some coding too. Has someone made a Mac/CW Pro version > of 1.5a2 available yet? I have a pre-1.5a3 running on my machine, compiled with CW Pro 1. As soon as Guido releases 1.5a3 I'll do a mac distribution too. -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From jeff@ollie.clive.ia.us Thu Aug 14 14:15:14 1997 From: jeff@ollie.clive.ia.us (Jeffrey C. Ollie) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 08:15:14 -0500 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Another Installer Option Message-ID: <199708141315.IAA06328@worf.netins.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Another Installer option is Installer VISE Lite 3.6 from MindVision Software. One BIG benefit is that it is free for shareware/freeware authors. I played with it for five minutes or so and it looks like it would do everything that we would need. I still kind of prefer the way that Stuffit InstallerMaker works, but you can't beat free! [A copy of the headers and the PGP signature follow.] Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 08:15:14 -0500 From: "Jeffrey C. Ollie" Subject: Another Installer Option To: pythonmac-sig@python.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 Comment: AnySign 1.4 - A Python tool for PGP signing e-mail and news. iQCVAwUBM/ME5pwkOQz8sbZFAQFfnQP+KX8le0g9ZkebfxZenwcXE+bogfWgt1/0 Xs6vSuh4tQ0wG/RH8TmgkmzP6FPmTuE81IiWXMXN6rNQMjjLpYMioM4n1XzzLFj8 z92qmAb8CBD4ikIP8ZIJnmr4w5RY/sq8FcGaBa8FwVCc7E9vdcxtTonDKSAwaaIG YiH1ikbs3YE= =1oLb -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- Jeffrey C. Ollie | Should Work Now (TM) _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Sat Aug 16 17:28:46 1997 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 18:28:46 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Working directories under MacOS 8 Message-ID: [crossposted to pythonmac-sig and gusi to reach a wider audience] I just got an error report which seems to indicate that GUSI's working directory code stopped working under MacOS 8. It appears that getcwd() returns the correct path, but open() will always try to open something in the disk toplevel folder. Note that this is hearsay (or, actually, my interpretation of what goes on based on hearsay), I haven't got MacOS 8 yet and the problem could be unrelated to GUSI as well. So, don't go hunting bugs yet, but it would be helpful if people could tell me that GUSI does (or does not) work for them under MacOS 8. -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From neeri@iis.ee.ethz.ch Sat Aug 16 18:46:50 1997 From: neeri@iis.ee.ethz.ch (Matthias Ulrich Neeracher) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 19:46:50 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Re: [GUSI] Working directories under MacOS 8 In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 16 Aug 1997 18:28:46 +0200. Message-ID: <199708161746.TAA13448@solar.ethz.ch> Jack Jansen writes: >I just got an error report which seems to indicate that GUSI's working >directory code stopped working under MacOS 8. It appears that getcwd() >returns the correct path, but open() will always try to open >something in the disk toplevel folder. I've been running 100% on MacOS8 (b5 and final) in the last few months and have run fairly extensive Perl tests without observing this phenomenon. However, this behaviour is similar to what I have seen on CFM68K machines when linking GUSI programs with the Metrowerks-provided version of PLStringFuncs for CFM68K (which is severely broken). Matthias ----- Matthias Neeracher http://www.iis.ee.ethz.ch/~neeri "One fine day in my odd past..." -- Pixies, _Planet of Sound_ _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From just@knoware.nl Tue Aug 19 22:56:02 1997 From: just@knoware.nl (Just van Rossum) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 22:56:02 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Planning The Installer for MacPython 1.5 Message-ID: Hi, We're in the process of getting a free licence for MindVision's installer package, and I have a good feeling that this is going to work out. Many thanks to Jeffrey C. Ollie for pointing us toward MindVision, it seems a great package, much easier to use than StuffIt InstallerMaker. Anyway, I have volunteered to set it up, and (when the license works out) am starting to plan it. There's a couple of things I am not so sure about, so I'd like your opinion. The installer would has two main options, "Easy Install" and "Custom Install". Question number one: should the "Easy Install" install fat binaries by default or binaries for the system we're installing to? What is usual? With "Custom Install" we can separate everything into packages (with the Lite version we'll have to use, we can't make sub packages). Does it make sense to do this? And if yes, what do you think of the following subdivision: - interpreter + core (also makes prefs file) - all "plug ins" (also makes plug in aliasses) (some pseudo sub-packages? overkill?) - toolboxmodules (Qd, Res, Win, the lot) - _tkinter - waste - img - ... what else? - library - tools (EditPythonPrefs, MakeApplet, applet template, scripts, ...?) - demos (:Demo & :Mac:Demo ?) - ... what else? Is this handy? Thanks for any feedback, Just _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From just@knoware.nl Tue Aug 19 23:44:31 1997 From: just@knoware.nl (Just van Rossum) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 23:44:31 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Planning The Installer for MacPython 1.5 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Some more thoughts. - Does anyone know if Apple allows to redistribute the "CFM68k runtime enabler"? It would make life easier on 68k macs if we could. Only install it (v4.0) if it's not there or if the version if earlier than 4.0 of course. It would be the only item that would require a restart. - It doesn't seem to make sense to ever install fat binaries, since you need to use the installer anyway. ??? (An exception would be the applet template, to make applets portable.) Just _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From guido@CNRI.Reston.Va.US Tue Aug 19 22:54:46 1997 From: guido@CNRI.Reston.Va.US (Guido van Rossum) Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 17:54:46 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Planning The Installer for MacPython 1.5 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 19 Aug 1997 23:44:31 BST." References: Message-ID: <199708192154.RAA14359@eric.CNRI.Reston.Va.US> > Some more thoughts. > > - Does anyone know if Apple allows to redistribute the "CFM68k runtime > enabler"? It would make life easier on 68k macs if we could. Only install > it (v4.0) if it's not there or if the version if earlier than 4.0 of > course. It would be the only item that would require a restart. I can't find anything on Apple's page http://www.macos.apple.com/macos/cfm-68k.html thay says you can't, but since CNRI has real lawyers, I'd say don't do it -- point people to that page. > - It doesn't seem to make sense to ever install fat binaries, since you > need to use the installer anyway. ??? > (An exception would be the applet template, to make applets portable.) Actually, lots of software installs as fat binaries by default. I believe it's useful for people sharing software on a network. But it should be an option. --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From just@knoware.nl Wed Aug 20 00:54:03 1997 From: just@knoware.nl (Just van Rossum) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 00:54:03 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Planning The Installer for MacPython 1.5 In-Reply-To: <199708192154.RAA14359@eric.CNRI.Reston.Va.US> References: Your message of "Tue, 19 Aug 1997 23:44:31 BST." Message-ID: >> - Does anyone know if Apple allows to redistribute the "CFM68k runtime >> enabler"? It would make life easier on 68k macs if we could. Only install >> it (v4.0) if it's not there or if the version if earlier than 4.0 of >> course. It would be the only item that would require a restart. > >I can't find anything on Apple's page > >http://www.macos.apple.com/macos/cfm-68k.html > >thay says you can't, but since CNRI has real lawyers, I'd say don't do >it -- point people to that page. I couldn't find anything either. The readme doesn't include a single word of legaleese. But you're probably right. Also, after I hit "send" I realized that it would add yet another 200k or so to the installer. Bleh. I wonder if I can make the installer check for it, and display a dialog (with the URL) when it's not there (or when it's too old). >> - It doesn't seem to make sense to ever install fat binaries, since you >> need to use the installer anyway. ??? >> (An exception would be the applet template, to make applets portable.) > >Actually, lots of software installs as fat binaries by default. I >believe it's useful for people sharing software on a network. But it >should be an option. Ok, let's make it an option. But when using it over a network, you still need PythonCore in your local extensions folder. Or an alias. Speaking of which, the latter doesn't seem to work 100% on my 68k mac: when I make the alias and drop in into the extensions folder it works ok, but after a restart it doesn't. I'm puzzled by this. Unless I find a solution, I am tempted to let the installer install the Real Thing into the extensions folder. Is this ok? Just _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Wed Aug 20 10:27:12 1997 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 11:27:12 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Planning The Installer for MacPython 1.5 In-Reply-To: Message by Just van Rossum , Tue, 19 Aug 1997 22:56:02 +0100 , Message-ID: > With "Custom Install" we can separate everything into packages (with the > Lite version we'll have to use, we can't make sub packages). > Does it make sense to do this? And if yes, what do you think of the > following subdivision: > > - interpreter + core (also makes prefs file) > - all "plug ins" (also makes plug in aliasses) > (some pseudo sub-packages? overkill?) > - toolboxmodules (Qd, Res, Win, the lot) > - _tkinter > - waste > - img > - ... what else? A minimal install needs at least toolboxmodules, all of Lib and Mac:Lib to be remotely useful. Things that could be factored out are img and Tk, and some tiny things like waste, gdbm, icconfig. I don't think I'm in favor of leaving things out, though, the diskspace used isn't all that big, if you don't use them you don't pay for them and having them available will get people to play with them. What I can imagine that we include optionally are the two "common" extensions pil and numpy. -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From viens@pubnix.net Wed Aug 20 17:36:19 1997 From: viens@pubnix.net (Robert Viens) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 12:36:19 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Compiling PythonCorePPC Message-ID: Hi, I'm in serious trouble, I try to compile PythonCorePPC using the CodeWarrior= Pro and I getting a lot of link errors that I can not resolve.=20 Does anyone succeed compiling PythonCorePPC using CodeWarrior Pro IDE 2.01? Jack please help me! / Robert Viens (viens@pubnix.net) / / 2675, Pr=E9fontaine / / Robert Viens consultant enr. / / Montr=E9al (Qu=E9bec) / / (514) 527-4296 / / Canada H1W 2P6 / / Fax (514) 524-9214 Paget: (514) 330-9446 / _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From sdm7g@Virginia.EDU Wed Aug 20 18:14:45 1997 From: sdm7g@Virginia.EDU (Steven D. Majewski) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 13:14:45 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Compiling PythonCorePPC In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 20 Aug 1997, Robert Viens wrote: > > I'm in serious trouble, I try to compile PythonCorePPC using the CodeWarrior Pro and I getting a lot of link errors that I can not resolve. > > Does anyone succeed compiling PythonCorePPC using CodeWarrior Pro IDE 2.01? > I haven't yet tried CWPro yet, but from CW11, I remember that you *at least* have to set it up to use the old Plumb Hall libraries, rather than MSL, (there are notes on this in the CW release notes) and you may also have to recompile MacHeaders with OLDROUTINENAMES and perhaps also OLDROUTINELOCATIONS defined to nonzero. ( Look in MacOS Support:MacHeaders: ) ---| Steven D. Majewski (804-982-0831) |--- ---| Department of Molecular Physiology and Biological Physics |--- ---| University of Virginia Health Sciences Center |--- ---| P.O. Box 10011 Charlottesville, VA 22906-0011 |--- All power corrupts and obsolete power corrupts obsoletely." - Ted Nelson _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Thu Aug 21 12:59:53 1997 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Thu, 21 Aug 1997 13:59:53 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] Compiling PythonCorePPC In-Reply-To: Message by Robert Viens , Wed, 20 Aug 1997 12:36:19 -0400 , Message-ID: > Hi, > = > I'm in serious trouble, I try to compile PythonCorePPC using the CodeWa= rrior Pro and I getting a lot of link errors that I can not resolve. = > = > Does anyone succeed compiling PythonCorePPC using CodeWarrior Pro IDE 2= =2E01? This is not easy: CW Pro uses the new MSL libraries, and quite some thing= s = have to be changed for that (not really in Python, mostly in GUSI, but a = few = minor things in Python too). The easiest thing to do is to wait for Pytho= n 1.5 = beta, which'll probably be out within months. Or Python 1.5a3 if you're a= PSA = member, which'll be out in one or two weeks, I hope. If you really need it now: either load the obsolete ANSI libraries from t= he = CodeWarrior CD and link with that, or revert to CW10 or CW11 (again with = the = obsolete ANSI libraries). -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++= Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig = ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.= htm = _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From jay@tinkeri.com Fri Aug 22 17:49:53 1997 From: jay@tinkeri.com (Jay Koutavas) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 1997 11:49:53 -0500 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] My email address has changed Message-ID: Please change the destionation of my pythonmac-sig email from jay@tinkeri.com to jay@heynow.com. Thanks, /Jay ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' Jay Koutavas mailto:jay@tinkeri.com Tinkeri, Inc. http://www.tinkeri.com Windham, NH, USA ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From guido@CNRI.Reston.Va.US Fri Aug 22 16:51:53 1997 From: guido@CNRI.Reston.Va.US (Guido van Rossum) Date: Fri, 22 Aug 1997 11:51:53 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] My email address has changed In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 22 Aug 1997 11:49:53 CDT." References: Message-ID: <199708221551.LAA09795@eric.CNRI.Reston.Va.US> > Please change the destionation of my pythonmac-sig email from > jay@tinkeri.com to jay@heynow.com. Done. But you should have used the pythonmac-sig-request@python.org address for such administrivia. --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From just@knoware.nl Wed Aug 27 12:40:31 1997 From: just@knoware.nl (Just van Rossum) Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 12:40:31 +0100 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] QuickTime and CFM68k? Message-ID: Dear all, Importing Qt fails on my CFM68k machine in Python 1.4 and both 1.5 alfas: >>> import Qt Traceback (innermost last): File "", line 1, in ? ImportError: QuickTimeLib: library name not found in Frag registry >>> (It *does* work with 1.4/1.5 stand-alone) I tried AltaVista, and found similar questions, although they didn't seem CFM68k specific (or at least were not specified as such). The answers were just a tad useless, like: something's wrong with QuickTime... Anyway, I would be grateful if other CFM68k users could tell me whether Qt works for them (a non-failing "import Qt" would suffice ;-). I am running MacOS 7.6.1 on a Quadra 840 AV with QuickTime 2.5 and QuickTime PowerPlug installed (although I'm almost certain that the latter doesn't help me, since it is a PPC extension...). Thanks for any clues. Just _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From A.M.INGRALDI@larc.nasa.gov Fri Aug 29 20:00:35 1997 From: A.M.INGRALDI@larc.nasa.gov (Anthony M. Ingraldi) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 1997 15:00:35 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] daemons on the Mac In-Reply-To: <9706251945.AA07256=jack@snelboot.cwi.nl> References: Message by "Anthony M. Ingraldi" , Wed, 25 Jun 1997 15:27:42 -0400 , Message-ID: Hello, I am trying to implement a very simple finger daemon in python on a Mac. Do all of the socket calls work properly in Mac Python 1.4? My process seems to hang and never respond to requests. Code snippet follows ---- from socket import * PORT = 79 # the finger port BUFSIZE = 1024 def main(): s = socket(AF_INET, SOCK_STREAM) s.bind('', PORT) s.listen(0) while 1: conn, (remotehost, remoteport) = s.accept() data = conn.recv(BUFSIZE) # do something with data conn.send("done") conn.close() del conn main() ---- The idea is to listen for a connection on port 79, send back a response, and then wait for another connection. Ideally I would generate an applet from the script and place the applet in my startup folder. (Is there a way to make an applet run faceless in the background only?) -- Tony Ingraldi | e-mail: A.M.INGRALDI@LaRC.NASA.GOV NASA Langley Research Center | Mail Stop 267 | Phone : (757) 864-3039 Hampton, VA 23681-0001 | Fax : (757) 864-7892 _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From guido@CNRI.Reston.Va.US Fri Aug 29 20:11:32 1997 From: guido@CNRI.Reston.Va.US (Guido van Rossum) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 1997 15:11:32 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] daemons on the Mac In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 29 Aug 1997 15:00:35 EDT." References: Message by "Anthony M. Ingraldi" , Wed, 25 Jun 1997 15:27:42 -0400 , Message-ID: <199708291911.PAA12326@eric.CNRI.Reston.Va.US> > I am trying to implement a very simple finger daemon in python on a Mac. > Do all of the socket calls work properly in Mac Python 1.4? My process > seems to hang and never respond to requests. Code snippet follows > > s.listen(0) Shouldn't that be listen(1)? I use socket stuff on the Mac "all the time" and it's all working for me... but on some systems listen(0) really doesn't work... --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From A.M.INGRALDI@larc.nasa.gov Fri Aug 29 21:36:58 1997 From: A.M.INGRALDI@larc.nasa.gov (Anthony M. Ingraldi) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 1997 16:36:58 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] daemons on the Mac In-Reply-To: <199708291911.PAA12326@eric.CNRI.Reston.Va.US> References: Your message of "Fri, 29 Aug 1997 15:00:35 EDT." Message by "Anthony M. Ingraldi" , Wed, 25 Jun 1997 15:27:42 -0400 , Message-ID: >Shouldn't that be listen(1)? I use socket stuff on the Mac "all the >time" and it's all working for me... but on some systems listen(0) >really doesn't work... > I changed the listen(0) to listen(1) and the server works. However, if I bring the server application to the front I have to force quit it or my Mac is stuck racing around the 'while 1' loop. Can a python app be made into a faceless background app? Alternatively, is there a way to allow user interaction in the 'while 1' loop? Here's the code again... from socket import * PORT = 79 # the finger port BUFSIZE = 1024 def main(): s = socket(AF_INET, SOCK_STREAM) s.bind('', PORT) s.listen(1) while 1: conn, (remotehost, remoteport) = s.accept() data = conn.recv(BUFSIZE) # do something with data conn.send("done") conn.close() del conn main() -- Tony Ingraldi | e-mail: A.M.INGRALDI@LaRC.NASA.GOV NASA Langley Research Center | Mail Stop 267 | Phone : (757) 864-3039 Hampton, VA 23681-0001 | Fax : (757) 864-7892 _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From doug@sonosphere.com Fri Aug 29 21:56:18 1997 From: doug@sonosphere.com (Doug Wyatt) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 1997 16:56:18 -0400 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] time.timezone In-Reply-To: <199708291911.PAA12326@eric.CNRI.Reston.Va.US> References: Your message of "Fri, 29 Aug 1997 15:00:35 EDT." Message by "Anthony M. Ingraldi" , Wed, 25 Jun 1997 15:27:42 -0400 , Message-ID: In the process of hacking together a little bit of code to send email messages from Python (to deliver notifications from a build system, not spam the world :) ), I discovered that Mac Python doesn't have time.timezone. I hacked something together in Python, comparing localtime with gmtime, but it's often off by a minute, yielding silly-looking email headers with "-0659". If someone wanted to implement timezone() for mac, here's an off-the-cuff adaptation of MSL's time.mac.cpp: long timezone(void) { MachineLocation loc; long delta; ReadLocation(&loc); if (loc.latitude == 0 && loc.longitude == 0 && loc.u.gmtDelta == 0) return(0); delta = loc.u.gmtDelta & 0x00FFFFFF; if (delta & 0x00800000) delta |= 0xFF000000; return (delta); } Also loc.u.dlsDelta (signed byte representing the hour offset for daylight savings time) might be useful too. Doug -- Doug Wyatt software development, Opcode Systems Inc. work: doug@opcode.com http://www.opcode.com/ personal: doug@sonosphere.com http://www.sonosphere.com/doug/ _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From jstrout@ucsd.edu Sat Aug 30 01:03:39 1997 From: jstrout@ucsd.edu (Joseph J. Strout) Date: Fri, 29 Aug 1997 17:03:39 -0700 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] daemons on the Mac In-Reply-To: References: <199708291911.PAA12326@eric.CNRI.Reston.Va.US> Your message of "Fri, 29 Aug 1997 15:00:35 EDT." Message by "Anthony M. Ingraldi" , Wed, 25 Jun 1997 15:27:42 -0400 , Message-ID: >I changed the listen(0) to listen(1) and the server works. However, if I >bring the server application to the front I have to force quit it or my Mac >is stuck racing around the 'while 1' loop. Yes, this is a serious problem -- I have the same trouble with my POO server. The window only updates when output is sent to the console, or when the input is requested. The only work-around I've been able to find is to periodically print something to the window. And since the console window doesn't have any cursor-movement functions, you can't even print something and then erase it. You end up with a big string of periods (or whatever) in your output window. (There's another danger here, too; when the window gets more than 32K of data, it crashes, and crashes your computer with it -- this one has bitten me several times.) >Can a python app be made into a faceless background app? Jack looked into this for us, and gave it a good effort, but it just didn't seem to work for reasons that remained mysterious. In short, no. >Alternatively, is there a way to allow user >interaction in the 'while 1' loop? Not really. I think you just have to print periods while idling. Or hide your app in the background, and be VERY careful not to bring it to the front! Cheers, -- Joe ,------------------------------------------------------------------. | Joseph J. Strout Department of Neuroscience, UCSD | | jstrout@ucsd.edu http://www-acs.ucsd.edu/~jstrout/ | `------------------------------------------------------------------' _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________ From Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl Sun Aug 31 21:34:34 1997 From: Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Date: Sun, 31 Aug 1997 22:34:34 +0200 Subject: [PYTHONMAC-SIG] daemons on the Mac In-Reply-To: Message by "Anthony M. Ingraldi" , Fri, 29 Aug 1997 15:00:35 -0400 , Message-ID: Well, I tried your script under 1.5a3 (which'll be available to PSA members sometime this week) and it works fine (even with the listen(0)). It also doesn't eat CPU time and is responsive to events when in the foreground. The whole event handling in the mainloop has been revamped for 1.5a3, so I'd definitely like feedback if people still find funny behaviour with it... As to FBA's: I can't get them to work. Is anyone on the list familiar with writing them? I think the problem is related either to someone (Sioux? Python itself?) trying to install a menubar or someone calling WaitNextEvent. Does anyone happen to know whether either of these is illegal for FBA's? Also: is there a runtime call I can do to see whether I run as a FBA or a normal application (so I can try to refrain from any illegal behaviour when running an FBA-applet)? (In case it helps: my FBA *does* create an entry in the applications menu, but it is an empty entry, i.e. without a name. Trying to select the entry means immedeate death to your system). Once we can write FBA's in Python the only hurdle left is device drivers:-) -- Jack Jansen | ++++ stop the execution of Mumia Abu-Jamal ++++ Jack.Jansen@cwi.nl | ++++ if you agree copy these lines to your sig ++++ http://www.cwi.nl/~jack | see http://www.xs4all.nl/~tank/spg-l/sigaction.htm _______________ PYTHONMAC-SIG - SIG on Python for the Apple Macintosh send messages to: pythonmac-sig@python.org administrivia to: pythonmac-sig-request@python.org _______________