OT: Autism in discussion groups (was: Re: Proposal: Disconnect comp.lang.python from python-list)

[dn]

On 09/05/2021 20.31, Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer wrote:
> On Sun, May 9, 2021 at 5:29 AM Chris Angelico <rosuav at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>>
>> Probably the same reason it has never worked. The only thing that's
>> changed is the social acceptability of vilifying those you don't like.
>> Once upon a time, there were those in the community who had all the
>> power, and those on the fringes that had none, and if someone on the
>> fringe misbehaved, everyone inside just shunned them and they left.
>> Now, if someone on the fringe misbehaves and everyone treats them
>> badly, there's a massive political kerfuffle and everyone gets hurt.
> 
> 
> Just a note here, though not in relation to CoC but
> as someone speaking English far away from a country
> called America, sometimes i wonder at some changes
> introduced just because it does not ring well within the
> country. I agree that the US pushed many many changes
> used around the world but English is not the property of
> the people of a specific country. The English community
> is the sum of people speaking English over the world.
> Though i am very far from CPython contributions but once
> changes no longer occur on the basis of technical reasons
> it raises eyebrows far beyond CPython contributors.
> 
> Now in the Python community we must verify not only
> grammatical and structural errors but also US-based
> nuances in the language. This requires community
> folks to be in tune with American current affairs and
> ideological tendencies. This might be a bit too much
> work as the bridge of union of the community is the Python
> language, usage and tools. Though English is a core-part
> of the programming language, this is going too deep.
> 
> A practical effect of this is that each and every event
> posters, flyers and websites have to be double checked
> against US nuances and phrasing. And the PSF must
> make sure that events sponsored by it or affiliated must
> follow the same standards.
> 
> This post is in no way a US-bashing one, or intended to be
> hurtful in any way. It's an observation that some changes
> appear totally ok to english speakers until you understand
> that this and that sounds wrong in a particular country. This
> poses the question of the legitimacy of the influence of a certain
> nation over the PSF.

+1

The inherent problem however, is that an author can only write from
his/her own position. Few have lived in multiple cultures. Even fewer
have taken the trouble to understand such differences. It is often
difficult-enough to write what needs to be said in a cogent fashion,
without having to double-guess how multiple cultures might prefer things
be done. That said, there is nothing to be gained by upsetting people...


Nevertheless, when the Linux Foundation announced a discussion looking
into such (largely) US-concerning terms as Master/Slave in computing
contexts, the same newsletter blatantly localised events which were
publicised, and intended to draw, world-wide participation.
(and has yet to respond to my observation of same)

The ISO 8601 International Standard recommends usage of UTC "Universal
Time" as a means for communicating times and dates in an international
or multinational context, ie "interchange". (So the LF's advert of a
Rust seminar commencing at a time listed in "CEST" is unfriendly and
somewhat inconsiderate to people outside Europe)
- example to prove we're not 'US-bashing', even though similar US-based
examples would be very easy to quote.

ISO 8601 was updated with 'Part 2' in 2019. It deals with "common
expressions". Many of which are meaningless, or even misleading to
others. In this case, an invitation to "Spring Internships" seemed six
months early to me. However, it is 'now' to anyone in the US. Such
seasonal terms only apply to the temperate zones of this planet -
neither the tropics nor the poles have such seasons, plus many cultures
use other terms for specific times of year, eg "Monsoon Season". Thus,
are not appropriate for use amongst an international audience.

Web.Ref:
Amusing discussion of ISO 8601:2019 (not the usual dry and turgid
documentation one expects from a standards organisation)
https://www.iso.org/news/2017/02/Ref2164.html
-- 
Regards,
=dn