Python as first language (Re: static variables?)

[Hung Jung Lu]

"Terry Reedy" <tjreedy at udel.edu> wrote in message news:<JxqdnQqI-cZFnEGgXTWcqA at comcast.com>...
> "Hung Jung Lu" <hungjunglu at yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > Well, the thing is that Python works with "name binding". And the
> > concepts of name spaces, name binding, objects, mutability, etc. are
> > just a bit non-obvious.
> 
> I somewhat disagree.  

A few days ago National Geographic Society released a survey report.
Surprisingly or not, only about 13 percent of college age (18-24)
young people in the USA were able point out Iraq on a map. And as if
that were not depressing enough, 11 percent of them couldn't even find
their own country (U.S.A.) on a map. That's a sobering reality check.
(European countries like Sweden and Germany did much better, but the
figures still were below what people would normally expect.)

It is OK to fantasize the easiness that beginners can understand how
Python work. But it is also good to keep a reality check. People have
faces and names. That's why I selected an example from a start. Please
look over Mr. Erik Max Francis' comments again (and trace to the
original thread.) And tell me why he made the comments he made. (Of
course I am not saying he is right, in fact, anyone who knows Python
well won't agree with his comments. I am simply keeping a reality
check.) Having taught thousands of students before in my life, I tend
to get into other people's mindset and try to understand where they
are coming from, be them right or wrong.

Unfortunately, this kind of reality check you can see daily in the
Python newsgroup, and in real-life work place, too.

> How is mutability non-obvious?  

I am not saying it's non-obvious per se. I am saying you have to check
on people with names and faces, instead of doing speculations.

> >Maybe it's just
> > me, but I have been horrified by programmers writing a few lines of
> > code, without realizing their few lines of code can actually have
> > severe impact on the RAM or the harddrive.
> 
> Impact on the RAM?  Are you talking about merely filling things up
> with data (easily reversible) or something possibly more damaging,
> like thrashing a drive for hours on end?  Or erasing unbacked data?
> Certainly, people should not learn to open a file (open() or file())
> or access the os (os.system()) without also being taught the possible
> dangers. 

Let me ask you, just in case you totally missed the point. Is it
possible for a program to severely hit the harddrive without the
programmer writing any code on file operation?

-----------------------

My message was simply that Python has a place in
colleges/universities. But I believe that teachers out there are
erring in their direction. There is very limited time in a 2-year
Master's program, and how to capitalize Python's potential in a short
period of time is crucial. Today's programmers need to know all kinds
of things like regular expressions, TCP/IP socket, web programming,
application servers, e-mail protocols (SMTP/IMAP/POP), database,
encryption, COM, XML processing, exception handling, multi-thread
programming, UI (user-interface) design, multimedia
programming/processing, build/install systems, etc. etc. and much
more. Python is excellent choice for a workshop course to cover these
topics. I believe that's where the full firepower of Python is. In
today's programming world, you don't need to use any of these skills
on a daily basis, but you've gotta know where to start.

regards,

Hung Jung