Popular conceit about learning programming languages

[Gary Duncan]

David Mertz, Ph.D. wrote:
> Carl Banks <imbosol at vt.edu> wrote previously:
> |Try two or three months [to learn Common Lisp], at worst.  A competent
> |and experienced programmer can probably learn a language like Common
> |Lisp in a couple weeks in their spare time.
> 
> There's a strange phenomenon with programmers, especially (but not
> exclusively) ones who are attached to one or a couple favorite
> langauges.  They claim--rather persistently--that someone/anyone can
> learn their language in an absurdly short time period.
> 
> Sometimes it is "a few hours to pick up the basics of Python;" other
> times "a couple weeks to master CL;" or occasionally "a few months to
> become an expert in X."  All these claims are quite literally
> unbelievable... and yet they come up over and over from every advocate.
> 
> The funny thing about all the claims is that they are enthymatic
> contrasts with all "those other languages."  The writers apparently
> expect readers to have a realistic sense about how long it takes to
> learn most programming languages (months or years), so the silly claim
> about <favorite-language> is then drawn as such a strong contrast with
> that.  But as soon as anyone explicitly STATES the claim that
> <non-favorite-language> actually takes -many- months to learn, the
> optimistic "days" for <favorite-language> appears as an absurdity rather
> than a language advantage.
> 
> It's a funny structure... sort of like what ordinary language
> philosophers (Grice or Dummett, I think) call "essentially accidental"
> events.  But this is "essentially implicit."
> 
> Yours, David...
> 
> P.S. I'm a pretty smart guy, btw.  From kindergarten through doctorate,
> I always learned things faster than just about everyone around me.  I
> remember more than almost anyone I know.  Everywhere I've worked as a
> programmer, I've been pretty much the best one at the site.

Hmm, David - if I can interject a joke, at your expense :-

"I'm not conceited although I have reason to be" :)
[ Btw, I thought that only insecure Germans appended Ph D to their name :)

Well I'm a modest person ("have a lot to be modest about" :)
but after 15 yrs + of real-time C-programming  (from about the time, mid-70s
that Timbot wrestled with Crays and f/p) I thought I knew it well. Then I
picked up some specialized ref books (Jaeschke: "Solutions in C",
"Portability and the C-language" ) and realised how superficial my
understanding of the language and its surrounding environment was.

<JOKE>
Some previous work colleagues have said (enviously/spitefully) about my
C-knowledge:-
         "You know fuck-NOTHING", to which my reply was :-
         "Yeah; but I know fuck-ALL!".
</JOKE>



- Gary (who just fondled a real 10ft Python at the Bairnsdale Vic Australia show;
          - forgot to get its Version number :)

P.S. Browsing c.l.p is like spending quiet time in the British Museum.
      So civilized. (Most Trans-Atlantic readers will not comprehend ...)



> 
> And you know what:  I CANNOT learn CL in a couple weeks of my spare
> time.  I've spent more than that, and understand little about it,
> really.  When I first learned Python, it took me much longer than a few
> hours to pick up even the barest essentials.  And when I have programmed
> with languages fulltime for several years, I continued to learn new
> things about them after those years.
> 
> --
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