Web templating/db tool with best designer/coder separation?

[Paul Boddie]

bokr at oz.net (Bengt Richter) wrote in message news:<af8dtp$5qp$0 at 216.39.172.122>...
> 
> No one mentioned ZPT (Zope Page Templates),
>     http://www.zope.org//Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ZPT/FAQ

This thread wouldn't end if we all started naming template systems,
though. ;-) For something similar to the jonpy templating, take a look
at http://www.clearsilver.org - a system which I was made aware of
recently. If nothing else, that site gives some very good arguments
against "Python in HTML" systems.

> and from the description, this would seem to have a real advantage over all of
> the above, in that it uses attributes of html tags as opposed to special tags
> that browsers or design tools won't generally understand and render usefully.

It should work well with XML-capable tools. However...

> This is touted as enabling the "round trip" from graphic designer to template
> logic programmer and back using the same html source. I assume this is
> the "round trip" Paul was referring to. To me, it seems a winning point for
> ZPT, though I don't know how ZPT works out in practice.

Yes, that was what I was referring to. However...

> They have a list of design tools that apparently pass through the ZPT markup
> they don't understand. According to the FAQ:
> 
>    "Q8: What HTML editors work well with ZPT?
>         We are still compiling a list, but on the commercial (industrial
>         strength) front, GoLive and Dreamweaver 4 work well with ZPT. Recent
>         versions of Amaya work well in HTML mode."
> 
> Opinions on ZPT?

In my experience, "recent versions of Amaya" either don't work with
ZPT, or the secret incantation to make it work hasn't been widely
publicised - "HTML mode" doesn't really tell me anything. What happens
when I try to load ZPT into Amaya is a large number of warnings about
invalid attributes, followed by the loss of those attributes in the
saving process.

On the other hand, if I use some 'id' attributes in HTML to give
"structure" to my template, Amaya will only intervene when two such
attributes are identical. Consequently, it's possible to do like
Enhydra's XMLC and make a template system operating around those
principles.

Paul