What has PEP 285 done to us?

[Cliff Wells]

I have to say that the most damaging thing introduced by PEP 285 has little to
do with the technical merits of the discussion.  The level of respect accorded
others in this community has taken the most damage.  It seems that almost every
discussion on this topic has quickly gone down in flames.

If you are trying to win an argument, and not simply argue for argument's sake,
it usually goes against your best interest to start that argument by insulting
the other party.  I know when I read a response to any of my posts that start
out with "That's stupid!" or "You call that code?? Why I oughta..." or some
such nonsense, I have a difficult time properly assessing the respondent's
arguments.  In fact, because I'm human (as are most people on this list,
Timbots notwithstanding), it would be very difficult for me to reconsider my
position at this point (no matter how wrong I might be) as it's become a
personal issue rather than a technical one.

We are all familiar with the tendency of Usenet to perpetuate
misunderstandings.  Many of the flames I have seen have been the result of the
respondent not fully understanding the poster's meaning and getting
self-righteous about a non-issue (often re-stating the original poster's
argument in different terms yet somehow making it seem like a disagreement).

It is possible to argue heatedly without resorting to personal insults and
insinuations.  Being unable to do so is a good indication that your argument
can't stand on its own.  Such techniques are grounds for a default in a formal
debate.

I'd also like to point out that insulting someone and apologizing for it in the
same post is worthless. If you sincerely meant that apology you could as easily
have edited the post as add some empty words at the end (the "sorry if this
sounds like a flame" variety).

This list is known for being particularly helpful and friendly.  Let's keep it
that way.  If you want to argue technical issues and programming techniques,
this is a good place.  If you want to fight and bicker, take it to the
playground (or maybe Yahoo!'s Fight Room - the people there won't know what the
hell a boolean is, but they'll be more than willing to exchange insults with
you over it, because you don't know either, you moron ;)

Regards,

-- 
Cliff Wells, Software Engineer
Logiplex Corporation (www.logiplex.net)
(503) 978-6726 x308  (800) 735-0555 x308