[Python-Dev] [python-committers] PEP 581 (Using GitHub issues for CPython) is accepted

[Paul Moore]

On Wed, 15 May 2019 at 15:56, Victor Stinner <vstinner at redhat.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Paul,
> Le mer. 15 mai 2019 à 11:40, Paul Moore <p.f.moore at gmail.com> a écrit :
> > Also, is there an archive of the discussions anywhere? The PEP says
> > discussions happened on Zulip, but I don't follow that and I don't
> > know where I can find an archived copy of the discussions.
>
> Well, the PEP has been discussed a lot at many places since May 2018.

Thanks for all of these. I appreciate the time you took locating them
for me. But I do have to say that I still can't really follow any
useful "thread of discussion" - it all seems very fragmented, and it's
difficult to see the progress towards consensus. Maybe that's just
because I'm too used to mailing lists :-)

> The PEP 581 has been (first?) discussed at the Language Summit which
> was part of Pycon US 2018 (May 2018).

Was that written up, or is it all just from people's memories by now?

> https://github.com/python/peps/pull/681/

Ah - I don't really follow this sort of PR discussion, as the github
emails don't tend to have sufficient context on what's being said, so
I (mostly) gave up a long time ago. Also, I tend to assume that
discussions on PRs are mostly about details of wording, and
substantive changes will be dealt with in a wider forum. I wonder if I
should be following PRs on the PEPs repository more closely...?

> Multiple threads on Discourse:
>
> https://discuss.python.org/t/move-pep-581-discussion/873
> https://discuss.python.org/t/pep-581-using-github-issues/535
> https://discuss.python.org/t/what-are-next-steps-for-pep-581/864
> https://discuss.python.org/t/pep-process-after-pep-8016/558/4
>
> Thread on python-dev:
>
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2019-March/156626.html
>
> Threads on python-committers:
>
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-committers/2018-May/005428.html
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-committers/2018-June/005506.html
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-committers/2018-July/005657.html

I saw these, but didn't get much of a sense of progress towards
agreement. Again, maybe just because they were lots of fragmented
threads and locations.

> Discussion on Zulip Chat:
>
> https://python.zulipchat.com/#narrow/stream/130206-pep581

I can't see this without logging in :-(

> The Steering Council discussed it internally as well:
>
> https://github.com/python/steering-council/blob/master/updates/2019-04-26_steering-council-update.md

I did see that, I was more wondering what led to that decision
(whether it was a general consensus from the core devs that it was a
good move, or mainly the SC's own view that prevailed).

> The PEP 581 and 588 have been discussed at the Language Summit which
> was part of Pycon US 2019 (2 weeks ago).

Again, has there been any write up of that (yet)?

As I say, I don't object to the decision, I'm more just trying to
better understand the process of being involved under the new regime
of the SC, combined with multiple fragmented forums for discussion. It
feels a lot harder these days to keep track of all the
discussions/decisions going on. But maybe that's a good thing - only
people with a genuine interest get involved, and I can spend less of
my time reading mailing lists! :-)

Paul