[Python-Dev] Python-3 transition in Arch Linux

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Thomas Wouters writes:

 > To clarify (but I dont speak for the rest of #python, just myself), I think
 > the move was premature, but I don't use Arch and I don't know what typical
 > Arch users expect.

All of the Arch users I know expect Arch to occasionally do radical
things because they're the right things to do in the long run.  But
every avant garde distribution picks up its share of wannabes who
don't understand how the process works.

 > The reason I think it's premature is that 'python2' just doesn't
 > work everywhere, and I would have gone for a transitionary period
 > where '/usr/bin/python' is something that screams loudly that it
 > shouldn't be used before it executes 'python2'.

This is unrealistic.  It would seriously annoy Arch's intended
audience.  (Eg, recently I've become a lot more favorable to using
Word instead of OOo because Word doesn't pop up a useless warning
every time I save a .doc file.)  Practically speaking, it would have
to be off by default, like Python pending deprecation warnings.

Anyway, I bet that anybody capable of upgrading their *Arch* packages
and complaining to *#python* about resulting breakage would be capable
of complaining to #python about the weird warning about python2.  And
you can't have a NO /USR/BIN/PYTHON topic, can you?<wink>

 > As for #python, well, we got this storm of people utterly confused
 > about how their stuff doesn't work anymore, and putting the blame
 > in the wrong place.

How so?  Ultimately, Guido is responsible for this.  Sure, the
immediate symptom was caused by Arch's action, but Python 3 *is*
rather incompatible with Python 2.  You're going to get a storm every
time a distro changes, and in a year or two, it's no longer going to
be something you can dispose of by setting a hotkey to "Google for
'BOGUS Linux python'" -- it's going to be stuff that requires a real
understanding of how Python 3 differs from Python 2, and often will be
pretty subtle.

 > I don't think a distribution should ever cause that (even though
 > many do in lesser ways)

Sure, and Guido should have exercised the Time Machine a little harder
so that Python 3 never needed to happen.  IOW, this is the price of
success and wide distribution.

BTW, I hope the next distribution make the jump does try your
suggestion to make /usr/bin/python scream.  It might work, even work
well.