From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Mon Jun  1 00:04:16 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2015 15:04:16 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Is there a way to access archives?
In-Reply-To: <CAKD0ODwVHOf0o0GC=Ea2_Eb9uVusXQ2Uf06CNQbz6P5=m0HvVg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKD0ODwVHOf0o0GC=Ea2_Eb9uVusXQ2Uf06CNQbz6P5=m0HvVg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3QgAdiFK3DVY-zAcSF=zAxUd4E3PVbE4F6MBY2JWTdg5g@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, May 31, 2015 at 2:45 PM, Jacqueline Kazil <jackiekazil at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Is there a way to access archives, so i can see what I missed?
> I didn't join this until now. Now sure how long it has been around or
> where conversations are at.
>
>
Good question Jacqueline,

It has been public-facing from the beginning, even to those not
subscribed.  Not
saying you should necessarily know that just refreshing our collective
memory.

Home page:

https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba

You'll find our charter, who the listowners are (not me) and other stuff.

We rock!

Kirby



>
> --
> Jacqueline Kazil | @jackiekazil
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From jackiekazil at gmail.com  Mon Jun  1 02:36:15 2015
From: jackiekazil at gmail.com (Jacqueline Kazil)
Date: Sun, 31 May 2015 20:36:15 -0400
Subject: [Python-cuba] Is there a way to access archives?
In-Reply-To: <CAPJgG3QgAdiFK3DVY-zAcSF=zAxUd4E3PVbE4F6MBY2JWTdg5g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKD0ODwVHOf0o0GC=Ea2_Eb9uVusXQ2Uf06CNQbz6P5=m0HvVg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAPJgG3QgAdiFK3DVY-zAcSF=zAxUd4E3PVbE4F6MBY2JWTdg5g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKD0ODy-m2tuf=6k_vte0LQ2btn6wGRjc151YUrESxYv6TjvZQ@mail.gmail.com>

Oh... there .... right there in front of my face. hahahaha
Thank you!
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From jackiekazil at gmail.com  Thu Jun 11 09:52:07 2015
From: jackiekazil at gmail.com (Jacqueline Kazil)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2015 03:52:07 -0400
Subject: [Python-cuba] =?utf-8?q?=2795=25_of_people_in_Cuba_don=E2=80=99t_?=
	=?utf-8?q?have_access_to_the_Internet=27?=
Message-ID: <CAKD0ODy67e8hrfUc839Upa7x-dXG9dDFXuVP3uuWU1B-r9fJsg@mail.gmail.com>

https://medium.com/backchannel/the-cuban-internet-crisis-c7b0beb10945
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From mertz at gnosis.cx  Thu Jun 11 10:17:58 2015
From: mertz at gnosis.cx (David Mertz)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2015 01:17:58 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba]
	=?utf-8?q?=2795=25_of_people_in_Cuba_don=E2=80=99t_?=
	=?utf-8?q?have_access_to_the_Internet=27?=
In-Reply-To: <CAKD0ODy67e8hrfUc839Upa7x-dXG9dDFXuVP3uuWU1B-r9fJsg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKD0ODy67e8hrfUc839Upa7x-dXG9dDFXuVP3uuWU1B-r9fJsg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAEbHw4ZE+6dc6GWR9WXWhSLi4ELyhOse4zshv_2Q75pGkrL3ew@mail.gmail.com>

A less blatantly ideological source gives the percentage as more like 25%
of total population, but higher among young people than older ones. This is
still FAR less than it should be, but it's good to make fact based
criticisms rather than political fantasies.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_in_Cuba
On Jun 11, 2015 12:52 AM, "Jacqueline Kazil" <jackiekazil at gmail.com> wrote:

> https://medium.com/backchannel/the-cuban-internet-crisis-c7b0beb10945
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Jun 11 16:46:44 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2015 07:46:44 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba]
	=?utf-8?q?=2795=25_of_people_in_Cuba_don=E2=80=99t_?=
	=?utf-8?q?have_access_to_the_Internet=27?=
In-Reply-To: <CAKD0ODy67e8hrfUc839Upa7x-dXG9dDFXuVP3uuWU1B-r9fJsg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKD0ODy67e8hrfUc839Upa7x-dXG9dDFXuVP3uuWU1B-r9fJsg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3RYWCNmZuPt-CL_qkTpcPTwS+RD=RC+YaAh6StHGNOr4Q@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 12:52 AM, Jacqueline Kazil <jackiekazil at gmail.com>
wrote:

> https://medium.com/backchannel/the-cuban-internet-crisis-c7b0beb10945
>
>
>

Anyway, you don't need Internet to propagate Python among computers,
along with Ubuntu and all the Freedom Toaster stuff. **  Just need storage
media.

Kirby

** introduced by Shuttleworth Foundation in Republic of South Africa, to
encourage free sharing of software:  http://www.freedomtoaster.org/
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From aethraiam at gmail.com  Thu Jun 18 22:44:07 2015
From: aethraiam at gmail.com (Josephine Garcia)
Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2015 20:44:07 +0000
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
Message-ID: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy everybody, great initiative.  Heard about it by some friends in Cuba
who are very excited!

I however have to speak up and right some wrongs before it is too late.  I
never speak ill about any one but I have to make an exception.  This
initiative will fail, not for technical or political reasons but by the
presence of an individual who has done enormous damage to several
communities and has set his eyes on the Python Cuba community as his next
stepping stone for recognition after failing to get a foothold into other
PSF initiatives.

I though long and hard before posting this as it would make me a target,
like many women in tech before me who decided to "talk", but doing the
right thing is more important as many people will be affected if I don't.
The person I am referring to, has harassed women, minorities, gays, leads a
group whose effects are being felt across several industries and has been
the sole reason entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved.

Harassment:
https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536052624068718592

Others have woken up to his deceit and have canceled his participation from
public events: http://2015.djangocon.eu/event/mayan-edms/

Has been identified by those for and against the anti-feminist movement
called GamerGate as one of their leader:

<http://chrisvoncsefalvay.com/2014/12/16/Gamergate-2-retweets.html>
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gamergate

http://chrisvoncsefalvay.com/2014/12/16/Gamergate-2-retweets.html

http://www.newsweek.com/one-womans-new-tool-stop-gamergate-harassment-twitter-288008

His public communications are either inflammatory or derogatory.  There are
many things I could show about his behvaiour but I guess it's best each of
you do your own research and realize the PSF and this working group would
be best served if this person silently left the group.  The PSF and this
group do not need the negative attention this person brings with him and
there many individual far better prepared to help Cuba like
https://www.facebook.com/epic.jefferson for example, who has actually been
to Cuba to help start the Python community.  Jefferson was too a victim of
harassment by the individual mentioned here.

I hope you see how having this person on board will send the wrong message,
that we and the PSF support his actions.

Thank you

J.

@}~}~~~

========
?I myself have never been able to find out precisely what feminism is: I
only know that people call me a feminist whenever I express sentiments that
differentiate me from a doormat.?
? Rebecca West <https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/8111.Rebecca_West>
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From mertz at gnosis.cx  Thu Jun 18 23:34:08 2015
From: mertz at gnosis.cx (David Mertz)
Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2015 14:34:08 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>

Josephine in Cuba:

In January 1966, Fidel Castro
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fidel_Castro> invited
Baker to perform at the Teatro Musical de La Habana in Havana, Cuba
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Havana,_Cuba> at the 7th anniversary
celebrations of his revolution. Her spectacular show in April broke
attendance records. In 1968, Baker visited Yugoslavia
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yugoslavia> and made appearances in
Belgrade <https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgrade> and in Skopje
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skopje>.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Josephine_Baker_1950.jpg
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From ewa at python.org  Tue Jun 23 23:07:47 2015
From: ewa at python.org (Ewa Jodlowska)
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2015 14:07:47 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Official PSF Workgroup - Python Cuba
Message-ID: <CADx+GQMmY1XKDUi2RqXG6C+7KXBzfm2Qwtr_7OjfNNv4h3BS2Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Python Cuba workgroup,

i just wanted to inform you that today the board approved the following
resolution:

RESOLVED, that the Python Software Foundation recognize the Python Cuba
> Workgroup as an official PSF workgroup
> https://wiki.python.org/psf/PythonCubaWG/Charter


If you have any questions or resource needs, please do not hesitate to
contact us.

-- 
Best regards,

Ewa
Event Coordinator
Python Software Foundation
Cell: 415-319-5237
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From pablocelayes at gmail.com  Tue Jun 23 23:12:39 2015
From: pablocelayes at gmail.com (Pablo Gabriel Celayes)
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2015 18:12:39 -0300
Subject: [Python-cuba] Official PSF Workgroup - Python Cuba
In-Reply-To: <CADx+GQMmY1XKDUi2RqXG6C+7KXBzfm2Qwtr_7OjfNNv4h3BS2Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CADx+GQMmY1XKDUi2RqXG6C+7KXBzfm2Qwtr_7OjfNNv4h3BS2Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMuNu12VeZR+QCwqi66CjHshXJz6KLwd-8uF9LWXV_8GH0LKMA@mail.gmail.com>

Great news! Thanks Ewa for the update!

On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 6:07 PM, Ewa Jodlowska <ewa at python.org> wrote:

> Hi Python Cuba workgroup,
>
> i just wanted to inform you that today the board approved the following
> resolution:
>
> RESOLVED, that the Python Software Foundation recognize the Python Cuba
>> Workgroup as an official PSF workgroup
>> https://wiki.python.org/psf/PythonCubaWG/Charter
>
>
> If you have any questions or resource needs, please do not hesitate to
> contact us.
>
> --
> Best regards,
>
> Ewa
> Event Coordinator
> Python Software Foundation
> Cell: 415-319-5237
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>


-- 

*?l**l**?l**l**?* ????? *?ll?**l?*
https://www.linkedin.com/in/pablogabrielcelayes
<http://ar.linkedin.com/pub/pablo-celayes/5/535/911/es>
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From steve at holdenweb.com  Wed Jun 24 00:41:06 2015
From: steve at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden)
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:41:06 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Official PSF Workgroup - Python Cuba
In-Reply-To: <CAMuNu12VeZR+QCwqi66CjHshXJz6KLwd-8uF9LWXV_8GH0LKMA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CADx+GQMmY1XKDUi2RqXG6C+7KXBzfm2Qwtr_7OjfNNv4h3BS2Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMuNu12VeZR+QCwqi66CjHshXJz6KLwd-8uF9LWXV_8GH0LKMA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FDE5079B-BE32-4D0B-AA84-D2DA28945ECF@holdenweb.com>

Hi all,

I just wanted to say that I may not be very active in this working group, as I have just accepted a full-time position in London.

I will continue as a member, however, and if you have specific needs or questions that you think I might help with I hope you will feel free to ask. I remain committed to helping make PyCon Cuba (under whatever name our Cuban friends prefer) happen.

regards
 Steve


On Jun 23, 2015, at 2:12 PM, Pablo Gabriel Celayes <pablocelayes at gmail.com> wrote:

> Great news! Thanks Ewa for the update!
> 
> On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 6:07 PM, Ewa Jodlowska <ewa at python.org> wrote:
> Hi Python Cuba workgroup,
> 
> i just wanted to inform you that today the board approved the following resolution:
> 
> RESOLVED, that the Python Software Foundation recognize the Python Cuba Workgroup as an official PSF workgroup https://wiki.python.org/psf/PythonCubaWG/Charter
> 
> If you have any questions or resource needs, please do not hesitate to contact us.  
> 
> -- 
> Best regards,
> 
> Ewa
> Event Coordinator
> Python Software Foundation
> Cell: 415-319-5237
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> ?ll?ll? ????? ?ll?l?
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/pablogabrielcelayes
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba

-- 
Steve Holden steve at holdenweb.com / +1 571 484 6266 / +44 208 289 6308 / @holdenweb





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From ewa at python.org  Wed Jun 24 02:30:04 2015
From: ewa at python.org (Ewa Jodlowska)
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2015 17:30:04 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Workgroup Monthly Reporting Policy
Message-ID: <CADx+GQMyrh6MJ9W+z4Eua6ym7_f3mOREaTcQYZUd1AtHQ5VqiQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi everyone,

In the process of improving our transparency and keeping everyone informed,
we are putting into place a new policy requiring all active workgroups to
send in monthly reports.

We would like the monthly reports sent in at the end of each month.  We do
not expect anything long/formal. It could be as simple as "no work has been
done this month" or

"""
For the month of April 2015, the Outreach and Education Committee received
the following grant requests:

* PyCon Young Coders Tutorial, $2000
* 2-day Python tutorial for the University students, $1000

We granted 100% of the above requests.
"""

We will be including these monthly reports in our board minutes, which are
posted on pydotorg and will be sent to the board public mailing list.

If a WG continuously does not supply a monthly report, the PSF board can
take away any future funding from the WG. I will send out a monthly
reminder 5 days prior to the end of the month to all active WGs.


-- 
Best regards,

Ewa
Event Coordinator
Python Software Foundation
Cell: 415-319-5237
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From pablocelayes at gmail.com  Wed Jun 24 02:35:55 2015
From: pablocelayes at gmail.com (Pablo Gabriel Celayes)
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2015 21:35:55 -0300
Subject: [Python-cuba] Workgroup Monthly Reporting Policy
In-Reply-To: <CADx+GQMyrh6MJ9W+z4Eua6ym7_f3mOREaTcQYZUd1AtHQ5VqiQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CADx+GQMyrh6MJ9W+z4Eua6ym7_f3mOREaTcQYZUd1AtHQ5VqiQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMuNu13fqTaAxw-TuziSvU-0=51wKttg2DFeCqmf3DYZrPoLUg@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Ewa!

In order to keep things moving and to get to know each other better, I
propose that we try to schedule an IRC chat sometime next week to agree on
what to put on our first report, and to do some brainstorming about how
what to do as a WG in the following months.

Best regards,

On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 9:30 PM, Ewa Jodlowska <ewa at python.org> wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> In the process of improving our transparency and keeping everyone
> informed, we are putting into place a new policy requiring all active
> workgroups to send in monthly reports.
>
> We would like the monthly reports sent in at the end of each month.  We do
> not expect anything long/formal. It could be as simple as "no work has been
> done this month" or
>
> """
> For the month of April 2015, the Outreach and Education Committee received
> the following grant requests:
>
> * PyCon Young Coders Tutorial, $2000
> * 2-day Python tutorial for the University students, $1000
>
> We granted 100% of the above requests.
> """
>
> We will be including these monthly reports in our board minutes, which are
> posted on pydotorg and will be sent to the board public mailing list.
>
> If a WG continuously does not supply a monthly report, the PSF board can
> take away any future funding from the WG. I will send out a monthly
> reminder 5 days prior to the end of the month to all active WGs.
>
>
> --
> Best regards,
>
> Ewa
> Event Coordinator
> Python Software Foundation
> Cell: 415-319-5237
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>


-- 

*?l**l**?l**l**?* ????? *?ll?**l?*
https://www.linkedin.com/in/pablogabrielcelayes
<http://ar.linkedin.com/pub/pablo-celayes/5/535/911/es>
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Wed Jun 24 03:05:31 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2015 18:05:31 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Official PSF Workgroup - Python Cuba
In-Reply-To: <FDE5079B-BE32-4D0B-AA84-D2DA28945ECF@holdenweb.com>
References: <CADx+GQMmY1XKDUi2RqXG6C+7KXBzfm2Qwtr_7OjfNNv4h3BS2Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMuNu12VeZR+QCwqi66CjHshXJz6KLwd-8uF9LWXV_8GH0LKMA@mail.gmail.com>
 <FDE5079B-BE32-4D0B-AA84-D2DA28945ECF@holdenweb.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3QPs4QOQwNG0jOnFoYTtwmynjxNTzZg2BjjH30=WST3MA@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 3:41 PM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I just wanted to say that I may not be very active in this working group,
> as I have just accepted a full-time position in London.
>

Congrats on the successful relocation!

Readers will be interested to know that Sir Steve was in erstwhile resident
of Portland, Oregon, my home town, site for OSCON (Open Source Convention)
and a big PSF Pycon, next two years (2016, 2017).



>
> I will continue as a member, however, and if you have specific needs or
> questions that you think I might help with I hope you will feel free to
> ask. I remain committed to helping make PyCon Cuba (under whatever name our
> Cuban friends prefer) happen.
>
> regards
>  Steve
>

Steve was the original catalyst for Pycons, starting in Washington DC.

He continued producing useful open source geek conferences:   ApacheCon,
DjangoCon, GOSCON and more.

In other words, he's an experienced event producer and well worth tapping,
if one does wish advice!

Steve, I learned at O'Reilly faculty meeting today that we're to defer our
spots to paying customers.  Patrick and I can still go, me on the Program
Committee and Patrick a speaker, but the rest of us should not expect hotel
or airfare -- except the school principal was already booked so lets make
sure she enjoys herself.  :-D

OSCON has outgrown Portland in other words, with hotels already mostly
booked.  That explains the move to Austin next year, a bigger venue.
Congrats to OSCON on its being such a success!  (Portland still has OS
Bridge for those staying behind).

I'd love to one day get to some PyEvent in Cuba but I realize the odds are
against it (not because we won't have those events, but because long
distance travel is expensive).

That doesn't dampen my enthusiasm in any way however.  I've learned to
participate vicariously, via streaming and recorded video.  Even if it's an
event I was at, I always miss more than I take in.  :-D

Kirby
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From roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com  Wed Jun 24 08:24:56 2015
From: roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com (Roberto Rosario)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2015 02:24:56 -0400
Subject: [Python-cuba] Official PSF Workgroup - Python Cuba
In-Reply-To: <CADx+GQMmY1XKDUi2RqXG6C+7KXBzfm2Qwtr_7OjfNNv4h3BS2Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CADx+GQMmY1XKDUi2RqXG6C+7KXBzfm2Qwtr_7OjfNNv4h3BS2Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJxbt+jo6+3UrOpV04fTo4+gAWowLNUiStA4veyLbR4Swy=MOQ@mail.gmail.com>

Excellent news! Thank you!
On Jun 23, 2015 5:07 PM, "Ewa Jodlowska" <ewa at python.org> wrote:

> Hi Python Cuba workgroup,
>
> i just wanted to inform you that today the board approved the following
> resolution:
>
> RESOLVED, that the Python Software Foundation recognize the Python Cuba
>> Workgroup as an official PSF workgroup
>> https://wiki.python.org/psf/PythonCubaWG/Charter
>
>
> If you have any questions or resource needs, please do not hesitate to
> contact us.
>
> --
> Best regards,
>
> Ewa
> Event Coordinator
> Python Software Foundation
> Cell: 415-319-5237
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com  Wed Jun 24 08:30:36 2015
From: roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com (Roberto Rosario)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2015 02:30:36 -0400
Subject: [Python-cuba] Workgroup Monthly Reporting Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAMuNu13fqTaAxw-TuziSvU-0=51wKttg2DFeCqmf3DYZrPoLUg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CADx+GQMyrh6MJ9W+z4Eua6ym7_f3mOREaTcQYZUd1AtHQ5VqiQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMuNu13fqTaAxw-TuziSvU-0=51wKttg2DFeCqmf3DYZrPoLUg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJxbt+gHSSwLBdgcPFxYoS-bd+igTSd9phQF354VO5+11aEoeA@mail.gmail.com>

+1
Next week I'm available after 3:00 pm every work day, but I have some
flexibility to adapt to others' schedules.
On Jun 23, 2015 8:36 PM, "Pablo Gabriel Celayes" <pablocelayes at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Thanks Ewa!
>
> In order to keep things moving and to get to know each other better, I
> propose that we try to schedule an IRC chat sometime next week to agree on
> what to put on our first report, and to do some brainstorming about how
> what to do as a WG in the following months.
>
> Best regards,
>
> On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 9:30 PM, Ewa Jodlowska <ewa at python.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> In the process of improving our transparency and keeping everyone
>> informed, we are putting into place a new policy requiring all active
>> workgroups to send in monthly reports.
>>
>> We would like the monthly reports sent in at the end of each month.  We
>> do not expect anything long/formal. It could be as simple as "no work has
>> been done this month" or
>>
>> """
>> For the month of April 2015, the Outreach and Education Committee
>> received the following grant requests:
>>
>> * PyCon Young Coders Tutorial, $2000
>> * 2-day Python tutorial for the University students, $1000
>>
>> We granted 100% of the above requests.
>> """
>>
>> We will be including these monthly reports in our board minutes, which
>> are posted on pydotorg and will be sent to the board public mailing list.
>>
>> If a WG continuously does not supply a monthly report, the PSF board can
>> take away any future funding from the WG. I will send out a monthly
>> reminder 5 days prior to the end of the month to all active WGs.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Ewa
>> Event Coordinator
>> Python Software Foundation
>> Cell: 415-319-5237
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Python-cuba mailing list
>> Python-cuba at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
> *?l**l**?l**l**?* ????? *?ll?**l?*
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/pablogabrielcelayes
> <http://ar.linkedin.com/pub/pablo-celayes/5/535/911/es>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From david.mertz at gmail.com  Wed Jun 24 16:05:54 2015
From: david.mertz at gmail.com (David Mertz)
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2015 07:05:54 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Cuba to offer Wi-Fi at 35 public spaces for the first
 time | World news | The Guardian
Message-ID: <CAEbHw4Y9Z9aDr7DS8fU-jan-tq=PZPK7NNcJn-d4kR0u4cuRvg@mail.gmail.com>

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/19/cuba-to-offer-wi-fi-at-35-public-spaces-for-the-first-time
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From aethraiam at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 19:17:42 2015
From: aethraiam at gmail.com (Josephine Garcia)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 17:17:42 +0000
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>

It's been a week, and the person I reported is still at the head of this
group. He has also ignored my claims, completely erasing my existence from
participation in this group. It shows how serious harassment and
inclusivness are regarded by this person. This is a big problem in his
ability to manage and lead this group. His disregards in this matter has
forced me to take this to the next level.

On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 9:34 PM, David Mertz <mertz at gnosis.cx> wrote:

> Josephine in Cuba:
>
> In January 1966, Fidel Castro
> <https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fidel_Castro> invited Baker to perform
> at the Teatro Musical de La Habana in Havana, Cuba
> <https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Havana,_Cuba> at the 7th anniversary
> celebrations of his revolution. Her spectacular show in April broke
> attendance records. In 1968, Baker visited Yugoslavia
> <https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yugoslavia> and made appearances in
> Belgrade <https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgrade> and in Skopje
> <https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skopje>.
>
>
> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Josephine_Baker_1950.jpg
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From steve at holdenweb.com  Thu Jun 25 19:55:06 2015
From: steve at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 10:55:06 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>

Josephine,

Thank you for your input. I'm sorry I didn't have time to adequately respond earlier. You may also consider this response as inadequate; if so, that's because I no longer have any official standing with the PSF except by virtue of my membership.

Without getting into personalities, I would just like to confirm that if anyone's presence in any PSF-related group is likely to discourage participation by others then the definitely IS a problem. If you would like me to engage the individual concerned by email (in a purely personal capacity) I will be happy to do so off-list if you will mail me personally with the relevant contact details. I can't guarantee any specific outcome though.

I'm not sure what you mean by "the next level," but I assume you mean the PSF Board. I'd be interested to know what response you get from there, and they are really the appropriate authority to handle this matter. I imagine other members feel, like me, a little impotent to do anything specific simply because we are all individually non-authoritative.

I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be able to explain).

regards
 Steve

On Jun 25, 2015, at 10:17 AM, Josephine Garcia <aethraiam at gmail.com> wrote:

> It's been a week, and the person I reported is still at the head of this group. He has also ignored my claims, completely erasing my existence from participation in this group. It shows how serious harassment and inclusivnessare regarded by this person. This is a big problem in his ability to manage and lead this group. His disregards in this matter has forced me to take this to the next level.

-- 
Steve Holden steve at holdenweb.com / +1 571 484 6266 / +44 208 289 6308 / @holdenweb





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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 21:18:55 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 12:18:55 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com> wrote:

<< SNIP >>


> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some
> people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel
> your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David
> Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be
> able to explain).
>
> regards
>  Steve
>


Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this WG
are board members, I stand to be corrected.

If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org listserv,
e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to complain to
but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't seem
Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.

Kirby
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From roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 22:08:33 2015
From: roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com (Roberto Rosario)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 16:08:33 -0400
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everybody,

I rarely engage messages when the supporting evidence is ambiguous or just
plain false to avoid escalation. But after careful consideration of this
defamation emails against me, and a meeting with my lawyers, I decided to
answer this message sent by "Josephine Garcia" (and I use " " because this
name may be an alias or not and I have no knowledge of who might be this
person).

It is unfortunate that in the initiative to make Python Cuba there are
people who are trying to divide more than unite. I find it interesting that
this person uses unfounded arguments to supposedly justify her accusations
against me. This person also uses group coercion to have me avoid exposing
my points of view on accusations about me: "silently left the group"
"having this person on board will send the wrong message, that we and the
PSF support his actions."

1) Allegation of harassment: I was being labeled a harasser by a tool which
equated twitter subscription to harassment. I criticized the logic of the
algorithm. Pretty much everybody agreed with my assertion, even The Mary
Sue, a feminist blog (
http://www.themarysue.com/twitter-users-mad-about-gamergate-block-bots/).
Even after all this, I extended an olive branch and publicly apologized for
my wording (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536255070086893568), the
reaction to my apology left much to be desired and shows the extension of
the treatment to which I am subjected daily.

1a) In reaction to the shortcomings of IGDA?s tool, I started creating a
FOSS case management tool which could be used too to help document
harassment (http://blog.robertorosario.com/imperfect-tools/) (
https://github.com/Cleisthenes/cleisthenes). It didn't matter that my
original intent was helping social services, the attacks and harassment I
received for being a man proposing such a tools which technologically
undermined the previous one built by a woman forced to abandon the project.

2) "entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved." Since it is not
mentioned which initiatives, I'm going to assume this is about the IGDA
Puerto Rico chapter. I was chairman of the chapter and neither myself nor
any member of the board has even publicized the reasons of the closure in
an official manner. It is very irresponsible to pass personal opinions as
fact.

3) Harassment of women: This can?t be more false as I actively promote the
inclusion of women in technology, giving money, making them t-shirts,
giving them my time and promoting them and their events. (
https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/553604723144925184) (
http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/Crypto-flyer.png) (
http://www.eventbrite.com/e/python-django-workshop-tickets-9132677083) (
http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/practical.jpg)
(http://ccom.uprrp.edu/activity_info.php?aid=80) (
http://aldia.microjuris.com/2013/10/07/ciclo-de-conferencias-sobre-criptografia/)
(https://www.patreon.com/siloraptor?pat=1)

I choose several members of the <include> Girls group for first government
technology internship at the Office Of Management and Budget working on
projects for the Governor of Puerto Rico and they have gone on to do great
things.

5) I canceled my participation in DjangoCon EU due to economic and health
issues. Daniele Procida can attest to this. My wife and myself are personal
friends of Daniele (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508491655297515521)
(https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/506913013144625152) (
https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508092355673485312/photo/1) lying
about his supposed actions as organizer of DjangoCOn EU is an offense to
all.

6) Gamergate: The links you provide don't prove any of your assertions.

6a) RationalWiki: The archived talk page about the article shows my
representation on the article to be the work of an user by the name Ryulong
(http://archive.is/ACBf5#selection-795.49-803.27) whose edits have been
reverse time and again: "I have also removed a similarly misleading and
unsourced portion, "Rosario blamed feminism". I don't know where you're
getting your info, but this is the third misrepresentation I have removed
from this article.--Naqoyqatsi (talk) 16:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)" This is the
same Ryulong, a wikipedian banned from Wikipedia, exactly for this (
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ryulong)

6b) Chris von Csefalvay?s graph only show I was one of the persons being
retweeted by people related to the gamergate movement.

6c) The Newsweek article doesn't say anything or prove anything about me
being a leader or even a member of gamergate.

7) In regards to Jefferson, I'm in shock, I do not understand how this
person dares to say he was the victim of harassment on my part. Jefferson
and I worked in various communities together until he moved from Puerto
Rico to pursue graduate studies. Since he left Puerto Rico I have not seen
him, but from what I've heard, he is doing well. I agree Jefferson would be
a good candidate to have onboard, I personally know him. My wife and myself
have helped him in the past to gain exposition to his projects at our
events: (http://www.slideshare.net/siloraptor/final-metapiano) (
http://www.piloto151.com/betabeers-san-juan-launches-in-piloto-151/) and
I'm too featured in his projects (https://vimeo.com/68919925)

8) Interestingly, Josephine Garc?a did not mention on her email that my
family was harassed, that someone published a photo that was private of me
with my son, a minor, and my wife, that someone published private
information about my family with said picture, that I have been called ?cunt?,
?harasser?, ?scum?, and so on without proof on a daily basis. The stress
from the witch hunts to which I am subjected and seeing my work tarnished
without proof have cause health problems not the least my last visit to the
emergency room with a cardiac event.

It is unfortunate that when one wants to do things to encourage and foster
the community we allow individuals who manipulate information just to
create division and drama. In the initiative to make Python Cuba we can?t
take seriously, unfounded accusations from people who are trying to divide
more than unite. I hope this email leaves everything clear and we can
continue working in the same direction to make PyCon Cuba a reality. That
being said, I am willing to leave the group if I am not wanted here, but I
will not leave the group because of lies about me. I am willing to leave
the group so that the possibilities of a PyCon in Cuba are not affected. I
await your responses, be public or made in private via my email. If
contacted privately via email, I will not disclose your position on the
matter be it in favor or against my continued presence in this group.

Best regards,

--Roberto

On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 3:18 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com>
> wrote:
>
> << SNIP >>
>
>
>> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some
>> people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel
>> your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David
>> Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be
>> able to explain).
>>
>> regards
>>  Steve
>>
>
>
> Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this WG
> are board members, I stand to be corrected.
>
> If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org
> listserv, e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to
> complain to but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't
> seem Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.
>
> Kirby
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Thu Jun 25 22:25:42 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 13:25:42 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3SkHchBxCC1DtiOSyGcmLWr5QUTz21w8optbKxEKs8Bcw@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you Rosario.

Please do not think me rude for responding in only nine minutes mas o meno,
but I actually did do considerable homework before the phone rang last time
and was starting to develop a picture.

So I respond quickly not because I'm uncaring but because due diligence is
part of my practice (Steve's too).

This may sound off topic, but it's true and I think relevant.  I'm
currently reading an excellent 1990s book called:

The Cryptographic Imagination:
Secret Writing from Edgar Poe
to the Internet

by James Rosenhem
Johns Hopkins University 1997

I was just reading yesterday in his last chapter, 'Ciphering the Net' about
precisely these big blow-ups where the question of identity is seriously in
question e.g. "how do I know all these warring people aren't heads of the
same medusa?".

That our Internet by its very nature enables and amplifies various new
forms of conflict is topical I think.

Our collective goal, as posters to a specific Python.org listserv with a WG
mandate, would be to stay topical.

So far I'd say we have, in that none of us can change history and the
various imbroglios (storms, kerfuffles) that occur do have their impacts.

Kirby
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From steve at holdenweb.com  Thu Jun 25 23:15:51 2015
From: steve at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 14:15:51 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <007DBA83-752A-4D59-B086-F09F6D7C938D@holdenweb.com>

Hi Robert,

Thanks for taking the time to prepare your lengthy response.

You will note, I hope, that in agreeing to contact you I made no assumptions about the truth or otherwise of the accusations against you. I was simply concerned that an apparently concerned member of the community should receive some sort of response to the allegations she made. I prefer things to be out in the open, as I have found openness to be the best defense against those who would sow dissent. Clearly on that basis there is now no need for us to have a private conversation.

I hope that Josephine will feel free to respond on this list, so that everyone can determine for themselves what her intent may be (it seems she wants you to leave, but she has no more power than I do to compel that action). For all I know she may be accepting false information from third parties as true.

So, Josephine, now Robert has responded I would like to hear your reply.

regards
 Steve


On Jun 25, 2015, at 1:08 PM, Roberto Rosario <roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello everybody,
> 
> I rarely engage messages when the supporting evidence is ambiguous or just plain false to avoid escalation. But after careful consideration of this defamation emails against me, and a meeting with my lawyers, I decided to answer this message sent by "Josephine Garcia" (and I use " " because this name may be an alias or not and I have no knowledge of who might be this person).
> 
> It is unfortunate that in the initiative to make Python Cuba there are people who are trying to divide more than unite. I find it interesting that this person uses unfounded arguments to supposedly justify her accusations against me. This person also uses group coercion to have me avoid exposing my points of view on accusations about me: "silently left the group" "having this person on board will send the wrong message, that we and the PSF support his actions."
> 
> 1) Allegation of harassment: I was being labeled a harasser by a tool which equated twitter subscription to harassment. I criticized the logic of the algorithm. Pretty much everybody agreed with my assertion, even The Mary Sue, a feminist blog (http://www.themarysue.com/twitter-users-mad-about-gamergate-block-bots/). Even after all this, I extended an olive branch and publicly apologized for my wording (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536255070086893568), the reaction to my apology left much to be desired and shows the extension of the treatment to which I am subjected daily.
> 
> 1a) In reaction to the shortcomings of IGDA?s tool, I started creating a FOSS case management tool which could be used too to help document harassment (http://blog.robertorosario.com/imperfect-tools/) (https://github.com/Cleisthenes/cleisthenes). It didn't matter that my original intent was helping social services, the attacks and harassment I received for being a man proposing such a tools which technologically undermined the previous one built by a woman forced to abandon the project.
> 
> 2) "entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved." Since it is not mentioned which initiatives, I'm going to assume this is about the IGDA Puerto Rico chapter. I was chairman of the chapter and neither myself nor any member of the board has even publicized the reasons of the closure in an official manner. It is very irresponsible to pass personal opinions as fact.
> 
> 3) Harassment of women: This can?t be more false as I actively promote the inclusion of women in technology, giving money, making them t-shirts, giving them my time and promoting them and their events. (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/553604723144925184) (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/Crypto-flyer.png) (http://www.eventbrite.com/e/python-django-workshop-tickets-9132677083) (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/practical.jpg) (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/activity_info.php?aid=80) (http://aldia.microjuris.com/2013/10/07/ciclo-de-conferencias-sobre-criptografia/) (https://www.patreon.com/siloraptor?pat=1)
> 
> I choose several members of the <include> Girls group for first government technology internship at the Office Of Management and Budget working on projects for the Governor of Puerto Rico and they have gone on to do great things.
> 
> 5) I canceled my participation in DjangoCon EU due to economic and health issues. Daniele Procida can attest to this. My wife and myself are personal friends of Daniele (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508491655297515521) (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/506913013144625152) (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508092355673485312/photo/1) lying about his supposed actions as organizer of DjangoCOn EU is an offense to all.
> 
> 6) Gamergate: The links you provide don't prove any of your assertions.
> 
> 6a) RationalWiki: The archived talk page about the article shows my representation on the article to be the work of an user by the name Ryulong (http://archive.is/ACBf5#selection-795.49-803.27) whose edits have been reverse time and again: "I have also removed a similarly misleading and unsourced portion, "Rosario blamed feminism". I don't know where you're getting your info, but this is the third misrepresentation I have removed from this article.--Naqoyqatsi (talk) 16:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)" This is the same Ryulong, a wikipedian banned from Wikipedia, exactly for this (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ryulong)
> 
> 6b) Chris von Csefalvay?s graph only show I was one of the persons being retweeted by people related to the gamergate movement.
> 
> 6c) The Newsweek article doesn't say anything or prove anything about me being a leader or even a member of gamergate.
> 
> 7) In regards to Jefferson, I'm in shock, I do not understand how this person dares to say he was the victim of harassment on my part. Jefferson and I worked in various communities together until he moved from Puerto Rico to pursue graduate studies. Since he left Puerto Rico I have not seen him, but from what I've heard, he is doing well. I agree Jefferson would be a good candidate to have onboard, I personally know him. My wife and myself have helped him in the past to gain exposition to his projects at our events: (http://www.slideshare.net/siloraptor/final-metapiano) (http://www.piloto151.com/betabeers-san-juan-launches-in-piloto-151/) and I'm too featured in his projects (https://vimeo.com/68919925)
> 
> 8) Interestingly, Josephine Garc?a did not mention on her email that my family was harassed, that someone published a photo that was private of me with my son, a minor, and my wife, that someone published private information about my family with said picture, that I have been called ?cunt?, ?harasser?, ?scum?, and so on without proof on a daily basis. The stress from the witch hunts to which I am subjected and seeing my work tarnished without proof have cause health problems not the least my last visit to the emergency room with a cardiac event.
> 
> It is unfortunate that when one wants to do things to encourage and foster the community we allow individuals who manipulate information just to create division and drama. In the initiative to make Python Cuba we can?t take seriously, unfounded accusations from people who are trying to divide more than unite. I hope this email leaves everything clear and we can continue working in the same direction to make PyCon Cuba a reality. That being said, I am willing to leave the group if I am not wanted here, but I will not leave the group because of lies about me. I am willing to leave the group so that the possibilities of a PyCon in Cuba are not affected. I await your responses, be public or made in private via my email. If contacted privately via email, I will not disclose your position on the matter be it in favor or against my continued presence in this group.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> --Roberto
> 
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 3:18 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com> wrote:
> 
> << SNIP >>
>  
> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be able to explain).
> 
> regards
>  Steve
> 
> 
> Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this WG are board members, I stand to be corrected.
> 
> If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org listserv, e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to complain to but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't seem Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.
> 
> Kirby
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba

-- 
Steve Holden steve at holdenweb.com / +1 571 484 6266 / +44 208 289 6308 / @holdenweb





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From aethraiam at gmail.com  Fri Jun 26 00:41:12 2015
From: aethraiam at gmail.com (Josephine Garcia)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 22:41:12 +0000
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>

Hello "Roberto" with just two first lines you have managed to erase my
identity, sweep my report under the rug, attacked me and threaten me with
legal action. If that is not white male privilege, I don't know what is!

Things that start bad end bad, I'm merely trying to make sure this group is
successful but all you do is get defensive and aggressive, thus proving the
points in my initial report. You could have silently left the group but
choose to make an spectacle of things. For such an accomplished person you
sure act in a very immature manner.

You provided link that show how you shield youself using women and
"helping" them, you didn't really provided evidence to that proved you
don't harass women.

Regarding the IGDA, an email was leaked that proved you were the reason for
the chapter closure and that two game developers (one of them a women
Ashley Alicea https://twitter.com/avashly) were run off the industry. Are
you going to erase her identity too?

The rest of your "reply" is just you crying about your feelings when
someone hurts you with words.

It is disappointing how all the beta men did a 180 when the alpha male
spoke.

I'm recruiting the help of others to help me fight this.

-J

On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 8:08 PM, Roberto Rosario <
roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello everybody,
>
> I rarely engage messages when the supporting evidence is ambiguous or just
> plain false to avoid escalation. But after careful consideration of this
> defamation emails against me, and a meeting with my lawyers, I decided to
> answer this message sent by "Josephine Garcia" (and I use " " because this
> name may be an alias or not and I have no knowledge of who might be this
> person).
>
> It is unfortunate that in the initiative to make Python Cuba there are
> people who are trying to divide more than unite. I find it interesting that
> this person uses unfounded arguments to supposedly justify her accusations
> against me. This person also uses group coercion to have me avoid exposing
> my points of view on accusations about me: "silently left the group"
> "having this person on board will send the wrong message, that we and the
> PSF support his actions."
>
> 1) Allegation of harassment: I was being labeled a harasser by a tool
> which equated twitter subscription to harassment. I criticized the logic of
> the algorithm. Pretty much everybody agreed with my assertion, even The
> Mary Sue, a feminist blog (
> http://www.themarysue.com/twitter-users-mad-about-gamergate-block-bots/).
> Even after all this, I extended an olive branch and publicly apologized for
> my wording (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536255070086893568),
> the reaction to my apology left much to be desired and shows the extension
> of the treatment to which I am subjected daily.
>
> 1a) In reaction to the shortcomings of IGDA?s tool, I started creating a
> FOSS case management tool which could be used too to help document
> harassment (http://blog.robertorosario.com/imperfect-tools/) (
> https://github.com/Cleisthenes/cleisthenes). It didn't matter that my
> original intent was helping social services, the attacks and harassment I
> received for being a man proposing such a tools which technologically
> undermined the previous one built by a woman forced to abandon the project.
>
> 2) "entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved." Since it is not
> mentioned which initiatives, I'm going to assume this is about the IGDA
> Puerto Rico chapter. I was chairman of the chapter and neither myself nor
> any member of the board has even publicized the reasons of the closure in
> an official manner. It is very irresponsible to pass personal opinions as
> fact.
>
> 3) Harassment of women: This can?t be more false as I actively promote the
> inclusion of women in technology, giving money, making them t-shirts,
> giving them my time and promoting them and their events. (
> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/553604723144925184) (
> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/Crypto-flyer.png) (
> http://www.eventbrite.com/e/python-django-workshop-tickets-9132677083) (
> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/practical.jpg)
> (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/activity_info.php?aid=80) (
> http://aldia.microjuris.com/2013/10/07/ciclo-de-conferencias-sobre-criptografia/)
> (https://www.patreon.com/siloraptor?pat=1)
>
> I choose several members of the <include> Girls group for first government
> technology internship at the Office Of Management and Budget working on
> projects for the Governor of Puerto Rico and they have gone on to do great
> things.
>
> 5) I canceled my participation in DjangoCon EU due to economic and health
> issues. Daniele Procida can attest to this. My wife and myself are personal
> friends of Daniele (
> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508491655297515521) (
> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/506913013144625152) (
> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508092355673485312/photo/1) lying
> about his supposed actions as organizer of DjangoCOn EU is an offense to
> all.
>
> 6) Gamergate: The links you provide don't prove any of your assertions.
>
> 6a) RationalWiki: The archived talk page about the article shows my
> representation on the article to be the work of an user by the name Ryulong
> (http://archive.is/ACBf5#selection-795.49-803.27) whose edits have been
> reverse time and again: "I have also removed a similarly misleading and
> unsourced portion, "Rosario blamed feminism". I don't know where you're
> getting your info, but this is the third misrepresentation I have removed
> from this article.--Naqoyqatsi (talk) 16:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)" This is the
> same Ryulong, a wikipedian banned from Wikipedia, exactly for this (
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ryulong)
>
> 6b) Chris von Csefalvay?s graph only show I was one of the persons being
> retweeted by people related to the gamergate movement.
>
> 6c) The Newsweek article doesn't say anything or prove anything about me
> being a leader or even a member of gamergate.
>
> 7) In regards to Jefferson, I'm in shock, I do not understand how this
> person dares to say he was the victim of harassment on my part. Jefferson
> and I worked in various communities together until he moved from Puerto
> Rico to pursue graduate studies. Since he left Puerto Rico I have not seen
> him, but from what I've heard, he is doing well. I agree Jefferson would be
> a good candidate to have onboard, I personally know him. My wife and myself
> have helped him in the past to gain exposition to his projects at our
> events: (http://www.slideshare.net/siloraptor/final-metapiano) (
> http://www.piloto151.com/betabeers-san-juan-launches-in-piloto-151/) and
> I'm too featured in his projects (https://vimeo.com/68919925)
>
> 8) Interestingly, Josephine Garc?a did not mention on her email that my
> family was harassed, that someone published a photo that was private of me
> with my son, a minor, and my wife, that someone published private
> information about my family with said picture, that I have been called ?cunt?,
> ?harasser?, ?scum?, and so on without proof on a daily basis. The stress
> from the witch hunts to which I am subjected and seeing my work tarnished
> without proof have cause health problems not the least my last visit to the
> emergency room with a cardiac event.
>
> It is unfortunate that when one wants to do things to encourage and foster
> the community we allow individuals who manipulate information just to
> create division and drama. In the initiative to make Python Cuba we can?t
> take seriously, unfounded accusations from people who are trying to divide
> more than unite. I hope this email leaves everything clear and we can
> continue working in the same direction to make PyCon Cuba a reality. That
> being said, I am willing to leave the group if I am not wanted here, but I
> will not leave the group because of lies about me. I am willing to leave
> the group so that the possibilities of a PyCon in Cuba are not affected. I
> await your responses, be public or made in private via my email. If
> contacted privately via email, I will not disclose your position on the
> matter be it in favor or against my continued presence in this group.
>
> Best regards,
>
> --Roberto
>
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 3:18 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> << SNIP >>
>>
>>
>>> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some
>>> people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel
>>> your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David
>>> Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be
>>> able to explain).
>>>
>>> regards
>>>  Steve
>>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this WG
>> are board members, I stand to be corrected.
>>
>> If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org
>> listserv, e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to
>> complain to but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't
>> seem Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.
>>
>> Kirby
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Python-cuba mailing list
>> Python-cuba at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From mertz at gnosis.cx  Fri Jun 26 02:40:40 2015
From: mertz at gnosis.cx (David Mertz)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 17:40:40 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAEbHw4ZfkU6a2+WODeS8eFUoANrV0LZxcPdT-7R4t6knu6cvQQ@mail.gmail.com>

As far as I can tell from what has been posted, the rambling accusations of
Josephine Garcia are both ill-founded and malicious. I wholeheatedly
support Roberto, and am thankful he volunteered to chair this group.

I posted my silly diversion on Josephine Baker in Cuba just because I
really like Baker, and it haD more to do with outreach to Cuba than does a
smear by her namesake against our chair.

As a moderator of this group I am very tempted to unsubscribe someone who
wishes to use it solely for a personal attack that is unrelated to the
purpose of the working group.

Yours, David
Vice-Chair, Python Cuba WG
On Jun 25, 2015 3:41 PM, "Josephine Garcia" <aethraiam at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello "Roberto" with just two first lines you have managed to erase my
> identity, sweep my report under the rug, attacked me and threaten me with
> legal action. If that is not white male privilege, I don't know what is!
>
> Things that start bad end bad, I'm merely trying to make sure this group
> is successful but all you do is get defensive and aggressive, thus proving
> the points in my initial report. You could have silently left the group but
> choose to make an spectacle of things. For such an accomplished person you
> sure act in a very immature manner.
>
> You provided link that show how you shield youself using women and
> "helping" them, you didn't really provided evidence to that proved you
> don't harass women.
>
> Regarding the IGDA, an email was leaked that proved you were the reason
> for the chapter closure and that two game developers (one of them a women
> Ashley Alicea https://twitter.com/avashly) were run off the industry. Are
> you going to erase her identity too?
>
> The rest of your "reply" is just you crying about your feelings when
> someone hurts you with words.
>
> It is disappointing how all the beta men did a 180 when the alpha male
> spoke.
>
> I'm recruiting the help of others to help me fight this.
>
> -J
>
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 8:08 PM, Roberto Rosario <
> roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello everybody,
>>
>> I rarely engage messages when the supporting evidence is ambiguous or
>> just plain false to avoid escalation. But after careful consideration of
>> this defamation emails against me, and a meeting with my lawyers, I decided
>> to answer this message sent by "Josephine Garcia" (and I use " " because
>> this name may be an alias or not and I have no knowledge of who might be
>> this person).
>>
>> It is unfortunate that in the initiative to make Python Cuba there are
>> people who are trying to divide more than unite. I find it interesting that
>> this person uses unfounded arguments to supposedly justify her accusations
>> against me. This person also uses group coercion to have me avoid exposing
>> my points of view on accusations about me: "silently left the group"
>> "having this person on board will send the wrong message, that we and the
>> PSF support his actions."
>>
>> 1) Allegation of harassment: I was being labeled a harasser by a tool
>> which equated twitter subscription to harassment. I criticized the logic of
>> the algorithm. Pretty much everybody agreed with my assertion, even The
>> Mary Sue, a feminist blog (
>> http://www.themarysue.com/twitter-users-mad-about-gamergate-block-bots/).
>> Even after all this, I extended an olive branch and publicly apologized for
>> my wording (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536255070086893568),
>> the reaction to my apology left much to be desired and shows the extension
>> of the treatment to which I am subjected daily.
>>
>> 1a) In reaction to the shortcomings of IGDA?s tool, I started creating a
>> FOSS case management tool which could be used too to help document
>> harassment (http://blog.robertorosario.com/imperfect-tools/) (
>> https://github.com/Cleisthenes/cleisthenes). It didn't matter that my
>> original intent was helping social services, the attacks and harassment
>> I received for being a man proposing such a tools which technologically
>> undermined the previous one built by a woman forced to abandon the project.
>>
>> 2) "entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved." Since it is not
>> mentioned which initiatives, I'm going to assume this is about the IGDA
>> Puerto Rico chapter. I was chairman of the chapter and neither myself nor
>> any member of the board has even publicized the reasons of the closure in
>> an official manner. It is very irresponsible to pass personal opinions as
>> fact.
>>
>> 3) Harassment of women: This can?t be more false as I actively promote
>> the inclusion of women in technology, giving money, making them t-shirts,
>> giving them my time and promoting them and their events. (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/553604723144925184) (
>> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/Crypto-flyer.png) (
>> http://www.eventbrite.com/e/python-django-workshop-tickets-9132677083) (
>> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/practical.jpg)
>> (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/activity_info.php?aid=80) (
>> http://aldia.microjuris.com/2013/10/07/ciclo-de-conferencias-sobre-criptografia/)
>> (https://www.patreon.com/siloraptor?pat=1)
>>
>> I choose several members of the <include> Girls group for first
>> government technology internship at the Office Of Management and Budget
>> working on projects for the Governor of Puerto Rico and they have gone on
>> to do great things.
>>
>> 5) I canceled my participation in DjangoCon EU due to economic and health
>> issues. Daniele Procida can attest to this. My wife and myself are personal
>> friends of Daniele (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508491655297515521) (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/506913013144625152) (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508092355673485312/photo/1) lying
>> about his supposed actions as organizer of DjangoCOn EU is an offense to
>> all.
>>
>> 6) Gamergate: The links you provide don't prove any of your assertions.
>>
>> 6a) RationalWiki: The archived talk page about the article shows my
>> representation on the article to be the work of an user by the name Ryulong
>> (http://archive.is/ACBf5#selection-795.49-803.27) whose edits have been
>> reverse time and again: "I have also removed a similarly misleading and
>> unsourced portion, "Rosario blamed feminism". I don't know where you're
>> getting your info, but this is the third misrepresentation I have removed
>> from this article.--Naqoyqatsi (talk) 16:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)" This is the
>> same Ryulong, a wikipedian banned from Wikipedia, exactly for this (
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ryulong)
>>
>> 6b) Chris von Csefalvay?s graph only show I was one of the persons being
>> retweeted by people related to the gamergate movement.
>>
>> 6c) The Newsweek article doesn't say anything or prove anything about me
>> being a leader or even a member of gamergate.
>>
>> 7) In regards to Jefferson, I'm in shock, I do not understand how this
>> person dares to say he was the victim of harassment on my part. Jefferson
>> and I worked in various communities together until he moved from Puerto
>> Rico to pursue graduate studies. Since he left Puerto Rico I have not seen
>> him, but from what I've heard, he is doing well. I agree Jefferson would be
>> a good candidate to have onboard, I personally know him. My wife and myself
>> have helped him in the past to gain exposition to his projects at our
>> events: (http://www.slideshare.net/siloraptor/final-metapiano) (
>> http://www.piloto151.com/betabeers-san-juan-launches-in-piloto-151/) and
>> I'm too featured in his projects (https://vimeo.com/68919925)
>>
>> 8) Interestingly, Josephine Garc?a did not mention on her email that my
>> family was harassed, that someone published a photo that was private of me
>> with my son, a minor, and my wife, that someone published private
>> information about my family with said picture, that I have been called ?cunt?,
>> ?harasser?, ?scum?, and so on without proof on a daily basis. The stress
>> from the witch hunts to which I am subjected and seeing my work tarnished
>> without proof have cause health problems not the least my last visit to the
>> emergency room with a cardiac event.
>>
>> It is unfortunate that when one wants to do things to encourage and
>> foster the community we allow individuals who manipulate information just
>> to create division and drama. In the initiative to make Python Cuba we
>> can?t take seriously, unfounded accusations from people who are trying to
>> divide more than unite. I hope this email leaves everything clear and we
>> can continue working in the same direction to make PyCon Cuba a reality.
>> That being said, I am willing to leave the group if I am not wanted here,
>> but I will not leave the group because of lies about me. I am willing to
>> leave the group so that the possibilities of a PyCon in Cuba are not
>> affected. I await your responses, be public or made in private via my
>> email. If contacted privately via email, I will not disclose your position
>> on the matter be it in favor or against my continued presence in this group.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> --Roberto
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 3:18 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> << SNIP >>
>>>
>>>
>>>> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some
>>>> people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel
>>>> your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David
>>>> Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be
>>>> able to explain).
>>>>
>>>> regards
>>>>  Steve
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this WG
>>> are board members, I stand to be corrected.
>>>
>>> If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org
>>> listserv, e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to
>>> complain to but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't
>>> seem Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.
>>>
>>> Kirby
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Python-cuba mailing list
>>> Python-cuba at python.org
>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Python-cuba mailing list
>> Python-cuba at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
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From jodlowska2 at gmail.com  Fri Jun 26 00:46:05 2015
From: jodlowska2 at gmail.com (Ewa Jodlowska)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 22:46:05 +0000
Subject: [Python-cuba] Invitation: This is a Reminder for PSF Board Monthly
 Report @ Monthly from 10:00 to 11:00 on day 25 (Ewa Jodlowska)
Message-ID: <001a113477687d009005195f6387@google.com>

You have been invited to the following event.

Title: This is a Reminder for PSF Board Monthly Report
Hi all,

This is just a reminder. At the end of this month, please submit your  
workgroup report to psf at python.org.

Thanks,
Ewa

When: Monthly from 10:00 to 11:00 on day 25 Pacific Time
Calendar: Ewa Jodlowska
Who:
     * Ewa Jodlowska - organizer
     * sprints at python.org
     * python-cuba at python.org
     * psf-trademarks at python.org
     * outreach-and-education at python.org
     * scientific at python.org

Event details:  
https://www.google.com/calendar/event?action=VIEW&eid=bnM5aGxwbmNzYXQzZmpoN3Npbm1waThtb2cgcHl0aG9uLWN1YmFAcHl0aG9uLm9yZw&tok=MjAjam9kbG93c2thMkBnbWFpbC5jb20xMjU3ZmEzMDUxNzQ4MTkxYzc2OTc1NzAyYzVmOGJmNWNmZTY4ZTc4&ctz=America/Los_Angeles&hl=en

Invitation from Google Calendar: https://www.google.com/calendar/

You are receiving this courtesy email at the account python-cuba at python.org  
because you are an attendee of this event.

To stop receiving future updates for this event, decline this event.  
Alternatively you can sign up for a Google account at  
https://www.google.com/calendar/ and control your notification settings for  
your entire calendar.

Forwarding this invitation could allow any recipient to modify your RSVP  
response. Learn more at  
https://support.google.com/calendar/answer/37135#forwarding
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Fri Jun 26 03:42:53 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 18:42:53 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAEbHw4ZfkU6a2+WODeS8eFUoANrV0LZxcPdT-7R4t6knu6cvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZfkU6a2+WODeS8eFUoANrV0LZxcPdT-7R4t6knu6cvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3SyxE1OP_=FEdkm-fDJDR50gTkLRC9k7SwGo+W10EGraA@mail.gmail.com>

While on the topic of people having baggage, including detractors, I have
some people who like to attack me.

Here's one of those attack pieces:

http://mathforum.org/kb/message.jspa?messageID=9782274

... the writer is publicly fine-tooth combing through what he can glean of
my bio, on a fishing expedition for some kind of scuttlebutt.

Then this guy on Youtube likes to attack me a lot and has followed me onto
math-teach.

https://youtu.be/AsD3K_oxV6E  (not sure if I'm mentioned in this one, never
mind, not suggesting your watch it)

So now, in mentioning these detractors, have I thereby attacked them?  Am I
kicking at sleeping dogs then?  My bad.

Anyway, my point is many of us will have accumulated some "anti-fans" over
the years, and that's part of what it means to have an identity.

Certainly we can relate that general observation to the theme of Cuba and
the fact that peoples become factional and fractious.

We can fight over whom we think is good, is evil.  That's always good for a
few reams.

I think Josephine might find some friends on Diversity, where people are
more up on the latest scandals, not to mention shoptalk.

Kirby
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Fri Jun 26 04:10:38 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 19:10:38 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAPJgG3SyxE1OP_=FEdkm-fDJDR50gTkLRC9k7SwGo+W10EGraA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZfkU6a2+WODeS8eFUoANrV0LZxcPdT-7R4t6knu6cvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAPJgG3SyxE1OP_=FEdkm-fDJDR50gTkLRC9k7SwGo+W10EGraA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3Rz+RJE95edpXnLpSXc7iRRxk-wZwOU-Kh01WgaVonrEQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 6:42 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:

> While on the topic of people having baggage, including detractors, I have
> some people who like to attack me.
>
> Here's one of those attack pieces:
>
> http://mathforum.org/kb/message.jspa?messageID=9782274
>
> ... the writer is publicly fine-tooth combing through what he can glean of
> my bio, on a fishing expedition for some kind of scuttlebutt.
>
>
PS:  I don't just take all this attacking laying down e.g. I mounted a
spirited defense here:

http://mathforum.org/kb/message.jspa?messageID=9782867

(plus some people rallied to my defense).

I feel OK posting these links as we're a new WG and just getting to know
each other.

Nothing wrong with sharing a little autobio for the archive.

Kirby
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From steve at holdenweb.com  Fri Jun 26 04:37:01 2015
From: steve at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden)
Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2015 19:37:01 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0A40449E-A686-4CC4-8C75-3F8F32EE1DA1@holdenweb.com>

Hi Josephine,

On Jun 25, 2015, at 3:41 PM, Josephine Garcia <aethraiam at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello "Roberto" with just two first lines you have managed to erase my identity, sweep my report under the rug, attacked me and threaten me with legal action. If that is not white male privilege, I don't know what is!
> 
I have no more idea who Robert is than I do who you are. Neither do I have any evidence for any of the accusations you have leveled at Roberto. This does not mean I believe or disbelieve you, but I am certainly not going to support a campaign of vilification without a real justification. Python is a broad church, and nobody is perfect.

> Things that start bad end bad, I'm merely trying to make sure this group is successful but all you do is get defensive and aggressive, thus proving the points in my initial report. You could have silently left the group but choose to make an spectacle of things. For such an accomplished person you sure act in a very immature manner.
> 
That's your opinion. I don't see Robert "making a spectacle of things" any more than you are. We are still listening, but not to unfounded accusations, hence my call for evidence.

> You provided link that show how you shield youself using women and "helping" them, you didn't really provided evidence to that proved you don't harass women.
> 
Proving a negative, as you must surely be aware, is difficult.

> Regarding the IGDA, an email was leaked that proved you were the reason for the chapter closure and that two game developers (one of them a women Ashley Alicea https://twitter.com/avashly) were run off the industry. Are you going to erase her identity too?
> 
So where is that email? I'm still looking for evidence.

> The rest of your "reply" is just you crying about your feelings when someone hurts you with words.
> 
I disagree.

> It is disappointing how all the beta men did a 180 when the alpha male spoke.
> 
I specifically reached out to you offering to take these matters up with Roberto. My stance remains the same: these allegations will have to be investigated before any action is taken. It would be improper to exclude anyone from a Python community on the basis of unsupported allegations. If that makes me "a beta man who did a 180," then I guess you are entitled to your opinion.

> I'm recruiting the help of others to help me fight this.
> 
Well I suppose we'll just have to wait until we find out who these others are. Surely you must realize that objectively at present there is no actionable information on which to proceed.

regards
 Steve

> -J
> 
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 8:08 PM, Roberto Rosario <roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello everybody,
> 
> I rarely engage messages when the supporting evidence is ambiguous or just plain false to avoid escalation. But after careful consideration of this defamation emails against me, and a meeting with my lawyers, I decided to answer this message sent by "Josephine Garcia" (and I use " " because this name may be an alias or not and I have no knowledge of who might be this person).
> 
> It is unfortunate that in the initiative to make Python Cuba there are people who are trying to divide more than unite. I find it interesting that this person uses unfounded arguments to supposedly justify her accusations against me. This person also uses group coercion to have me avoid exposing my points of view on accusations about me: "silently left the group" "having this person on board will send the wrong message, that we and the PSF support his actions."
> 
> 1) Allegation of harassment: I was being labeled a harasser by a tool which equated twitter subscription to harassment. I criticized the logic of the algorithm. Pretty much everybody agreed with my assertion, even The Mary Sue, a feminist blog (http://www.themarysue.com/twitter-users-mad-about-gamergate-block-bots/). Even after all this, I extended an olive branch and publicly apologized for my wording (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536255070086893568), the reaction to my apology left much to be desired and shows the extension of the treatment to which I am subjected daily.
> 
> 1a) In reaction to the shortcomings of IGDA?s tool, I started creating a FOSS case management tool which could be used too to help document harassment (http://blog.robertorosario.com/imperfect-tools/) (https://github.com/Cleisthenes/cleisthenes). It didn't matter that my original intent was helping social services, the attacks and harassment I received for being a man proposing such a tools which technologically undermined the previous one built by a woman forced to abandon the project.
> 
> 2) "entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved." Since it is not mentioned which initiatives, I'm going to assume this is about the IGDA Puerto Rico chapter. I was chairman of the chapter and neither myself nor any member of the board has even publicized the reasons of the closure in an official manner. It is very irresponsible to pass personal opinions as fact.
> 
> 3) Harassment of women: This can?t be more false as I actively promote the inclusion of women in technology, giving money, making them t-shirts, giving them my time and promoting them and their events. (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/553604723144925184) (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/Crypto-flyer.png) (http://www.eventbrite.com/e/python-django-workshop-tickets-9132677083) (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/practical.jpg) (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/activity_info.php?aid=80) (http://aldia.microjuris.com/2013/10/07/ciclo-de-conferencias-sobre-criptografia/) (https://www.patreon.com/siloraptor?pat=1)
> 
> I choose several members of the <include> Girls group for first government technology internship at the Office Of Management and Budget working on projects for the Governor of Puerto Rico and they have gone on to do great things.
> 
> 5) I canceled my participation in DjangoCon EU due to economic and health issues. Daniele Procida can attest to this. My wife and myself are personal friends of Daniele (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508491655297515521) (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/506913013144625152) (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508092355673485312/photo/1) lying about his supposed actions as organizer of DjangoCOn EU is an offense to all.
> 
> 6) Gamergate: The links you provide don't prove any of your assertions.
> 
> 6a) RationalWiki: The archived talk page about the article shows my representation on the article to be the work of an user by the name Ryulong (http://archive.is/ACBf5#selection-795.49-803.27) whose edits have been reverse time and again: "I have also removed a similarly misleading and unsourced portion, "Rosario blamed feminism". I don't know where you're getting your info, but this is the third misrepresentation I have removed from this article.--Naqoyqatsi (talk) 16:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)" This is the same Ryulong, a wikipedian banned from Wikipedia, exactly for this (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ryulong)
> 
> 6b) Chris von Csefalvay?s graph only show I was one of the persons being retweeted by people related to the gamergate movement.
> 
> 6c) The Newsweek article doesn't say anything or prove anything about me being a leader or even a member of gamergate.
> 
> 7) In regards to Jefferson, I'm in shock, I do not understand how this person dares to say he was the victim of harassment on my part. Jefferson and I worked in various communities together until he moved from Puerto Rico to pursue graduate studies. Since he left Puerto Rico I have not seen him, but from what I've heard, he is doing well. I agree Jefferson would be a good candidate to have onboard, I personally know him. My wife and myself have helped him in the past to gain exposition to his projects at our events: (http://www.slideshare.net/siloraptor/final-metapiano) (http://www.piloto151.com/betabeers-san-juan-launches-in-piloto-151/) and I'm too featured in his projects (https://vimeo.com/68919925)
> 
> 8) Interestingly, Josephine Garc?a did not mention on her email that my family was harassed, that someone published a photo that was private of me with my son, a minor, and my wife, that someone published private information about my family with said picture, that I have been called ?cunt?, ?harasser?, ?scum?, and so on without proof on a daily basis. The stress from the witch hunts to which I am subjected and seeing my work tarnished without proof have cause health problems not the least my last visit to the emergency room with a cardiac event.
> 
> It is unfortunate that when one wants to do things to encourage and foster the community we allow individuals who manipulate information just to create division and drama. In the initiative to make Python Cuba we can?t take seriously, unfounded accusations from people who are trying to divide more than unite. I hope this email leaves everything clear and we can continue working in the same direction to make PyCon Cuba a reality. That being said, I am willing to leave the group if I am not wanted here, but I will not leave the group because of lies about me. I am willing to leave the group so that the possibilities of a PyCon in Cuba are not affected. I await your responses, be public or made in private via my email. If contacted privately via email, I will not disclose your position on the matter be it in favor or against my continued presence in this group.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> --Roberto
> 
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 3:18 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com> wrote:
> 
> << SNIP >>
>  
> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be able to explain).
> 
> regards
>  Steve
> 
> 
> Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this WG are board members, I stand to be corrected.
> 
> If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org listserv, e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to complain to but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't seem Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.
> 
> Kirby
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba

-- 
Steve Holden steve at holdenweb.com / +1 571 484 6266 / +44 208 289 6308 / @holdenweb





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From aethraiam at gmail.com  Sat Jun 27 08:59:19 2015
From: aethraiam at gmail.com (Josephine Garcia)
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 06:59:19 +0000
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <0A40449E-A686-4CC4-8C75-3F8F32EE1DA1@holdenweb.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
 <0A40449E-A686-4CC4-8C75-3F8F32EE1DA1@holdenweb.com>
Message-ID: <CAMZEhhF9Ty0QokwvrcaLEPXKuPmzEAp2Uo4rhSvjjkUxhkyH+g@mail.gmail.com>

My anger got the best of me and things got out of hand. I hope you
understand where I?m coming from and why your words were hurtful. As a
trans woman I'm used to being constantly harassed and excluded from
software projects on the sole basis of my gender. The Python community has
made great advancements in how it treats minorities and the marginalized,
but turns a blind eye when cis white males abuse women.

I don't regret calling Roberto out. I believe that he should think before
posting egregious messages while identifying himself with a major project
such as this one. Now, with a clearer mind, I will further pursue this on a
more organized manner following the feedback received.

I want to thank those who are supporting me and helping me compile the list
of offenses to present to the PSF board shortly. I want to specially thank:
Jacky Kazil, Jacky Alcin?, Kurtis Rainbolt-Greene, Alexander Hitchins,
Nexxy, Randi Harper, Gregory Smith, Julian Simioni, Strand McCutchen, Greg
V and the super spectacular Jacob Kaplan-Moss for amplifying this and
helping me reach others.

We will continue, and bring forward a cleaner case that will serve as a
template for future cases.

J.




On Fri, Jun 26, 2015 at 2:37 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com> wrote:

> Hi Josephine,
>
> On Jun 25, 2015, at 3:41 PM, Josephine Garcia <aethraiam at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hello "Roberto" with just two first lines you have managed to erase my
> identity, sweep my report under the rug, attacked me and threaten me with
> legal action. If that is not white male privilege, I don't know what is!
>
> I have no more idea who Robert is than I do who you are. Neither do I have
> any evidence for any of the accusations you have leveled at Roberto. This
> does not mean I believe or disbelieve you, but I am certainly not going to
> support a campaign of vilification without a real justification. Python is
> a broad church, and nobody is perfect.
>
> Things that start bad end bad, I'm merely trying to make sure this group
> is successful but all you do is get defensive and aggressive, thus proving
> the points in my initial report. You could have silently left the group but
> choose to make an spectacle of things. For such an accomplished person you
> sure act in a very immature manner.
>
> That's your opinion. I don't see Robert "making a spectacle of things" any
> more than you are. We are still listening, but not to unfounded
> accusations, hence my call for evidence.
>
> You provided link that show how you shield youself using women and
> "helping" them, you didn't really provided evidence to that proved you
> don't harass women.
>
> Proving a negative, as you must surely be aware, is difficult.
>
> Regarding the IGDA, an email was leaked that proved you were the reason
> for the chapter closure and that two game developers (one of them a women
> Ashley Alicea https://twitter.com/avashly) were run off the industry. Are
> you going to erase her identity too?
>
> So where is that email? I'm still looking for evidence.
>
> The rest of your "reply" is just you crying about your feelings when
> someone hurts you with words.
>
> I disagree.
>
> It is disappointing how all the beta men did a 180 when the alpha male
> spoke.
>
> I specifically reached out to you offering to take these matters up with
> Roberto. My stance remains the same: these allegations will have to be
> investigated before any action is taken. It would be improper to exclude
> anyone from a Python community on the basis of unsupported allegations. If
> that makes me "a beta man who did a 180," then I guess you are entitled to
> your opinion.
>
> I'm recruiting the help of others to help me fight this.
>
> Well I suppose we'll just have to wait until we find out who these others
> are. Surely you must realize that objectively at present there is no
> actionable information on which to proceed.
>
> regards
>  Steve
>
> -J
>
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 8:08 PM, Roberto Rosario <
> roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello everybody,
>>
>> I rarely engage messages when the supporting evidence is ambiguous or
>> just plain false to avoid escalation. But after careful consideration of
>> this defamation emails against me, and a meeting with my lawyers, I decided
>> to answer this message sent by "Josephine Garcia" (and I use " " because
>> this name may be an alias or not and I have no knowledge of who might be
>> this person).
>>
>> It is unfortunate that in the initiative to make Python Cuba there are
>> people who are trying to divide more than unite. I find it interesting that
>> this person uses unfounded arguments to supposedly justify her accusations
>> against me. This person also uses group coercion to have me avoid exposing
>> my points of view on accusations about me: "silently left the group"
>> "having this person on board will send the wrong message, that we and the
>> PSF support his actions."
>>
>> 1) Allegation of harassment: I was being labeled a harasser by a tool
>> which equated twitter subscription to harassment. I criticized the logic of
>> the algorithm. Pretty much everybody agreed with my assertion, even The
>> Mary Sue, a feminist blog (
>> http://www.themarysue.com/twitter-users-mad-about-gamergate-block-bots/).
>> Even after all this, I extended an olive branch and publicly apologized for
>> my wording (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536255070086893568),
>> the reaction to my apology left much to be desired and shows the extension
>> of the treatment to which I am subjected daily.
>>
>> 1a) In reaction to the shortcomings of IGDA?s tool, I started creating a
>> FOSS case management tool which could be used too to help document
>> harassment (http://blog.robertorosario.com/imperfect-tools/) (
>> https://github.com/Cleisthenes/cleisthenes). It didn't matter that my
>> original intent was helping social services, the attacks and harassment
>> I received for being a man proposing such a tools which technologically
>> undermined the previous one built by a woman forced to abandon the project.
>>
>> 2) "entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved." Since it is not
>> mentioned which initiatives, I'm going to assume this is about the IGDA
>> Puerto Rico chapter. I was chairman of the chapter and neither myself nor
>> any member of the board has even publicized the reasons of the closure in
>> an official manner. It is very irresponsible to pass personal opinions as
>> fact.
>>
>> 3) Harassment of women: This can?t be more false as I actively promote
>> the inclusion of women in technology, giving money, making them t-shirts,
>> giving them my time and promoting them and their events. (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/553604723144925184) (
>> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/Crypto-flyer.png) (
>> http://www.eventbrite.com/e/python-django-workshop-tickets-9132677083) (
>> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/practical.jpg)
>> (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/activity_info.php?aid=80) (
>> http://aldia.microjuris.com/2013/10/07/ciclo-de-conferencias-sobre-criptografia/)
>> (https://www.patreon.com/siloraptor?pat=1)
>>
>> I choose several members of the <include> Girls group for first
>> government technology internship at the Office Of Management and Budget
>> working on projects for the Governor of Puerto Rico and they have gone on
>> to do great things.
>>
>> 5) I canceled my participation in DjangoCon EU due to economic and health
>> issues. Daniele Procida can attest to this. My wife and myself are personal
>> friends of Daniele (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508491655297515521) (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/506913013144625152) (
>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508092355673485312/photo/1) lying
>> about his supposed actions as organizer of DjangoCOn EU is an offense to
>> all.
>>
>> 6) Gamergate: The links you provide don't prove any of your assertions.
>>
>> 6a) RationalWiki: The archived talk page about the article shows my
>> representation on the article to be the work of an user by the name Ryulong
>> (http://archive.is/ACBf5#selection-795.49-803.27) whose edits have been
>> reverse time and again: "I have also removed a similarly misleading and
>> unsourced portion, "Rosario blamed feminism". I don't know where you're
>> getting your info, but this is the third misrepresentation I have removed
>> from this article.--Naqoyqatsi (talk) 16:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)" This is the
>> same Ryulong, a wikipedian banned from Wikipedia, exactly for this (
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ryulong)
>>
>> 6b) Chris von Csefalvay?s graph only show I was one of the persons being
>> retweeted by people related to the gamergate movement.
>>
>> 6c) The Newsweek article doesn't say anything or prove anything about me
>> being a leader or even a member of gamergate.
>>
>> 7) In regards to Jefferson, I'm in shock, I do not understand how this
>> person dares to say he was the victim of harassment on my part. Jefferson
>> and I worked in various communities together until he moved from Puerto
>> Rico to pursue graduate studies. Since he left Puerto Rico I have not seen
>> him, but from what I've heard, he is doing well. I agree Jefferson would be
>> a good candidate to have onboard, I personally know him. My wife and myself
>> have helped him in the past to gain exposition to his projects at our
>> events: (http://www.slideshare.net/siloraptor/final-metapiano) (
>> http://www.piloto151.com/betabeers-san-juan-launches-in-piloto-151/) and
>> I'm too featured in his projects (https://vimeo.com/68919925)
>>
>> 8) Interestingly, Josephine Garc?a did not mention on her email that my
>> family was harassed, that someone published a photo that was private of me
>> with my son, a minor, and my wife, that someone published private
>> information about my family with said picture, that I have been called ?cunt?,
>> ?harasser?, ?scum?, and so on without proof on a daily basis. The stress
>> from the witch hunts to which I am subjected and seeing my work tarnished
>> without proof have cause health problems not the least my last visit to the
>> emergency room with a cardiac event.
>>
>> It is unfortunate that when one wants to do things to encourage and
>> foster the community we allow individuals who manipulate information just
>> to create division and drama. In the initiative to make Python Cuba we
>> can?t take seriously, unfounded accusations from people who are trying to
>> divide more than unite. I hope this email leaves everything clear and we
>> can continue working in the same direction to make PyCon Cuba a reality.
>> That being said, I am willing to leave the group if I am not wanted here,
>> but I will not leave the group because of lies about me. I am willing to
>> leave the group so that the possibilities of a PyCon in Cuba are not
>> affected. I await your responses, be public or made in private via my
>> email. If contacted privately via email, I will not disclose your position
>> on the matter be it in favor or against my continued presence in this group.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> --Roberto
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 3:18 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> << SNIP >>
>>>
>>>
>>>> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some
>>>> people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel
>>>> your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David
>>>> Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be
>>>> able to explain).
>>>>
>>>> regards
>>>>  Steve
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this WG
>>> are board members, I stand to be corrected.
>>>
>>> If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org
>>> listserv, e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to
>>> complain to but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't
>>> seem Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.
>>>
>>> Kirby
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Python-cuba mailing list
>>> Python-cuba at python.org
>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Python-cuba mailing list
>> Python-cuba at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Python-cuba mailing list
> Python-cuba at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>
>
> --
> Steve Holden steve at holdenweb.com / +1 571 484 6266 / +44 208 289 6308
> / @holdenweb
>
>
>
>
>
>
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From aethraiam at gmail.com  Sat Jun 27 09:01:35 2015
From: aethraiam at gmail.com (Josephine Garcia)
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 07:01:35 +0000
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAMZEhhF9Ty0QokwvrcaLEPXKuPmzEAp2Uo4rhSvjjkUxhkyH+g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
 <0A40449E-A686-4CC4-8C75-3F8F32EE1DA1@holdenweb.com>
 <CAMZEhhF9Ty0QokwvrcaLEPXKuPmzEAp2Uo4rhSvjjkUxhkyH+g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMZEhhEGaAmSeYye0tr6k8J5UjtWWgYXhEwfmBGY4iodLbasVA@mail.gmail.com>

PS: New members contacted me about not being approved to the list, please
look into it, thank you.

J.

On Sat, Jun 27, 2015 at 6:59 AM, Josephine Garcia <aethraiam at gmail.com>
wrote:

> My anger got the best of me and things got out of hand. I hope you
> understand where I?m coming from and why your words were hurtful. As a
> trans woman I'm used to being constantly harassed and excluded from
> software projects on the sole basis of my gender. The Python community has
> made great advancements in how it treats minorities and the marginalized,
> but turns a blind eye when cis white males abuse women.
>
> I don't regret calling Roberto out. I believe that he should think before
> posting egregious messages while identifying himself with a major project
> such as this one. Now, with a clearer mind, I will further pursue this on a
> more organized manner following the feedback received.
>
> I want to thank those who are supporting me and helping me compile the
> list of offenses to present to the PSF board shortly. I want to specially
> thank: Jacky Kazil, Jacky Alcin?, Kurtis Rainbolt-Greene, Alexander
> Hitchins, Nexxy, Randi Harper, Gregory Smith, Julian Simioni, Strand
> McCutchen, Greg V and the super spectacular Jacob Kaplan-Moss for
> amplifying this and helping me reach others.
>
> We will continue, and bring forward a cleaner case that will serve as a
> template for future cases.
>
> J.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 26, 2015 at 2:37 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Josephine,
>>
>> On Jun 25, 2015, at 3:41 PM, Josephine Garcia <aethraiam at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hello "Roberto" with just two first lines you have managed to erase my
>> identity, sweep my report under the rug, attacked me and threaten me with
>> legal action. If that is not white male privilege, I don't know what is!
>>
>> I have no more idea who Robert is than I do who you are. Neither do I
>> have any evidence for any of the accusations you have leveled at Roberto.
>> This does not mean I believe or disbelieve you, but I am certainly not
>> going to support a campaign of vilification without a real justification.
>> Python is a broad church, and nobody is perfect.
>>
>> Things that start bad end bad, I'm merely trying to make sure this group
>> is successful but all you do is get defensive and aggressive, thus proving
>> the points in my initial report. You could have silently left the group but
>> choose to make an spectacle of things. For such an accomplished person you
>> sure act in a very immature manner.
>>
>> That's your opinion. I don't see Robert "making a spectacle of things"
>> any more than you are. We are still listening, but not to unfounded
>> accusations, hence my call for evidence.
>>
>> You provided link that show how you shield youself using women and
>> "helping" them, you didn't really provided evidence to that proved you
>> don't harass women.
>>
>> Proving a negative, as you must surely be aware, is difficult.
>>
>> Regarding the IGDA, an email was leaked that proved you were the reason
>> for the chapter closure and that two game developers (one of them a women
>> Ashley Alicea https://twitter.com/avashly) were run off the industry.
>> Are you going to erase her identity too?
>>
>> So where is that email? I'm still looking for evidence.
>>
>> The rest of your "reply" is just you crying about your feelings when
>> someone hurts you with words.
>>
>> I disagree.
>>
>> It is disappointing how all the beta men did a 180 when the alpha male
>> spoke.
>>
>> I specifically reached out to you offering to take these matters up with
>> Roberto. My stance remains the same: these allegations will have to be
>> investigated before any action is taken. It would be improper to exclude
>> anyone from a Python community on the basis of unsupported allegations. If
>> that makes me "a beta man who did a 180," then I guess you are entitled to
>> your opinion.
>>
>> I'm recruiting the help of others to help me fight this.
>>
>> Well I suppose we'll just have to wait until we find out who these others
>> are. Surely you must realize that objectively at present there is no
>> actionable information on which to proceed.
>>
>> regards
>>  Steve
>>
>> -J
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 8:08 PM, Roberto Rosario <
>> roberto.rosario.gonzalez at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hello everybody,
>>>
>>> I rarely engage messages when the supporting evidence is ambiguous or
>>> just plain false to avoid escalation. But after careful consideration of
>>> this defamation emails against me, and a meeting with my lawyers, I decided
>>> to answer this message sent by "Josephine Garcia" (and I use " " because
>>> this name may be an alias or not and I have no knowledge of who might be
>>> this person).
>>>
>>> It is unfortunate that in the initiative to make Python Cuba there are
>>> people who are trying to divide more than unite. I find it interesting that
>>> this person uses unfounded arguments to supposedly justify her accusations
>>> against me. This person also uses group coercion to have me avoid exposing
>>> my points of view on accusations about me: "silently left the group"
>>> "having this person on board will send the wrong message, that we and the
>>> PSF support his actions."
>>>
>>> 1) Allegation of harassment: I was being labeled a harasser by a tool
>>> which equated twitter subscription to harassment. I criticized the logic of
>>> the algorithm. Pretty much everybody agreed with my assertion, even The
>>> Mary Sue, a feminist blog (
>>> http://www.themarysue.com/twitter-users-mad-about-gamergate-block-bots/).
>>> Even after all this, I extended an olive branch and publicly apologized for
>>> my wording (https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/536255070086893568),
>>> the reaction to my apology left much to be desired and shows the extension
>>> of the treatment to which I am subjected daily.
>>>
>>> 1a) In reaction to the shortcomings of IGDA?s tool, I started creating a
>>> FOSS case management tool which could be used too to help document
>>> harassment (http://blog.robertorosario.com/imperfect-tools/) (
>>> https://github.com/Cleisthenes/cleisthenes). It didn't matter that my
>>> original intent was helping social services, the attacks and harassment
>>> I received for being a man proposing such a tools which technologically
>>> undermined the previous one built by a woman forced to abandon the project.
>>>
>>> 2) "entire chapters of initiatives have been dissolved." Since it is not
>>> mentioned which initiatives, I'm going to assume this is about the IGDA
>>> Puerto Rico chapter. I was chairman of the chapter and neither myself nor
>>> any member of the board has even publicized the reasons of the closure in
>>> an official manner. It is very irresponsible to pass personal opinions as
>>> fact.
>>>
>>> 3) Harassment of women: This can?t be more false as I actively promote
>>> the inclusion of women in technology, giving money, making them t-shirts,
>>> giving them my time and promoting them and their events. (
>>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/553604723144925184) (
>>> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/Crypto-flyer.png) (
>>> http://www.eventbrite.com/e/python-django-workshop-tickets-9132677083) (
>>> http://ccom.uprrp.edu/actividades/practical.jpg)
>>> (http://ccom.uprrp.edu/activity_info.php?aid=80) (
>>> http://aldia.microjuris.com/2013/10/07/ciclo-de-conferencias-sobre-criptografia/)
>>> (https://www.patreon.com/siloraptor?pat=1)
>>>
>>> I choose several members of the <include> Girls group for first
>>> government technology internship at the Office Of Management and Budget
>>> working on projects for the Governor of Puerto Rico and they have gone on
>>> to do great things.
>>>
>>> 5) I canceled my participation in DjangoCon EU due to economic and
>>> health issues. Daniele Procida can attest to this. My wife and myself are
>>> personal friends of Daniele (
>>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508491655297515521) (
>>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/506913013144625152) (
>>> https://twitter.com/siloraptor/status/508092355673485312/photo/1) lying
>>> about his supposed actions as organizer of DjangoCOn EU is an offense to
>>> all.
>>>
>>> 6) Gamergate: The links you provide don't prove any of your assertions.
>>>
>>> 6a) RationalWiki: The archived talk page about the article shows my
>>> representation on the article to be the work of an user by the name Ryulong
>>> (http://archive.is/ACBf5#selection-795.49-803.27) whose edits have been
>>> reverse time and again: "I have also removed a similarly misleading and
>>> unsourced portion, "Rosario blamed feminism". I don't know where you're
>>> getting your info, but this is the third misrepresentation I have removed
>>> from this article.--Naqoyqatsi (talk) 16:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)" This is the
>>> same Ryulong, a wikipedian banned from Wikipedia, exactly for this (
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ryulong)
>>>
>>> 6b) Chris von Csefalvay?s graph only show I was one of the persons being
>>> retweeted by people related to the gamergate movement.
>>>
>>> 6c) The Newsweek article doesn't say anything or prove anything about me
>>> being a leader or even a member of gamergate.
>>>
>>> 7) In regards to Jefferson, I'm in shock, I do not understand how this
>>> person dares to say he was the victim of harassment on my part. Jefferson
>>> and I worked in various communities together until he moved from Puerto
>>> Rico to pursue graduate studies. Since he left Puerto Rico I have not seen
>>> him, but from what I've heard, he is doing well. I agree Jefferson would be
>>> a good candidate to have onboard, I personally know him. My wife and myself
>>> have helped him in the past to gain exposition to his projects at our
>>> events: (http://www.slideshare.net/siloraptor/final-metapiano) (
>>> http://www.piloto151.com/betabeers-san-juan-launches-in-piloto-151/)
>>> and I'm too featured in his projects (https://vimeo.com/68919925)
>>>
>>> 8) Interestingly, Josephine Garc?a did not mention on her email that my
>>> family was harassed, that someone published a photo that was private of me
>>> with my son, a minor, and my wife, that someone published private
>>> information about my family with said picture, that I have been called ?cunt?,
>>> ?harasser?, ?scum?, and so on without proof on a daily basis. The stress
>>> from the witch hunts to which I am subjected and seeing my work tarnished
>>> without proof have cause health problems not the least my last visit to the
>>> emergency room with a cardiac event.
>>>
>>> It is unfortunate that when one wants to do things to encourage and
>>> foster the community we allow individuals who manipulate information just
>>> to create division and drama. In the initiative to make Python Cuba we
>>> can?t take seriously, unfounded accusations from people who are trying to
>>> divide more than unite. I hope this email leaves everything clear and we
>>> can continue working in the same direction to make PyCon Cuba a reality.
>>> That being said, I am willing to leave the group if I am not wanted here,
>>> but I will not leave the group because of lies about me. I am willing to
>>> leave the group so that the possibilities of a PyCon in Cuba are not
>>> affected. I await your responses, be public or made in private via my
>>> email. If contacted privately via email, I will not disclose your position
>>> on the matter be it in favor or against my continued presence in this group.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> --Roberto
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 3:18 PM, kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Steve Holden <steve at holdenweb.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> << SNIP >>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I wrote this reply, however, simply to assure you that at least some
>>>>> people do regard this as a potentially serious issue. Sorry of you feel
>>>>> your claims were being taken too lightly. (and I have no idea what David
>>>>> Mertz's message had to do with the discussion, but I imagine he will be
>>>>> able to explain).
>>>>>
>>>>> regards
>>>>>  Steve
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks Steve.  I could be wrong but I don't think any members of this
>>>> WG are board members, I stand to be corrected.
>>>>
>>>> If I were super concerned about a specific member of a Python.org
>>>> listserv, e.g. Diversity, I would probably find someone on the Board to
>>>> complain to but I'm not sure which one.  I did some reading but it didn't
>>>> seem Cuba-related and then the phone rang etc.
>>>>
>>>> Kirby
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Python-cuba mailing list
>>>> Python-cuba at python.org
>>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Python-cuba mailing list
>>> Python-cuba at python.org
>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Python-cuba mailing list
>> Python-cuba at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-cuba
>>
>>
>> --
>> Steve Holden steve at holdenweb.com / +1 571 484 6266 / +44 208 289 6308
>> / @holdenweb
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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From kirby.urner at gmail.com  Sat Jun 27 17:59:56 2015
From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner)
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:59:56 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Going forwards
In-Reply-To: <CAMZEhhF9Ty0QokwvrcaLEPXKuPmzEAp2Uo4rhSvjjkUxhkyH+g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMZEhhHM9bmYYPvzgWYC=8qhorbPvE_1N6ND_A8P997YyQWGxw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEbHw4ZqHEttcWKiqkpMKbSBJbnwTqY6xEphNUo-E88fPeU3_w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhGrfZZRQZwhbFug518KzvEZ2Mq=uq1k+Bcg6pQQ0dHQnQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <E59DB9DF-19CC-4A0D-B391-B4BCC060A42D@holdenweb.com>
 <CAPJgG3T9GAWp1Y6zi2GdiXBcwOovL1NsANgw6dPq+_3UxfibYg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJxbt+htJ_u88-TQRC2UXMCf4htyw8PtrHzS9SfnuOnw-k3fmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMZEhhG0msfAtAu3QxbxY4X0QzY+Thoqkze0WjgTRH4Neh01ww@mail.gmail.com>
 <0A40449E-A686-4CC4-8C75-3F8F32EE1DA1@holdenweb.com>
 <CAMZEhhF9Ty0QokwvrcaLEPXKuPmzEAp2Uo4rhSvjjkUxhkyH+g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPJgG3RtzHdZ2HtxrwBxp5vArL3Gybxy=aM5P_gfpe1zRkwuWQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jun 26, 2015 at 11:59 PM, Josephine Garcia <aethraiam at gmail.com>
wrote:

> My anger got the best of me and things got out of hand.
>


Does that happen often?  Perhaps you need to step back and reassess your
strategies?

Replaying the tape up to here, I don't see what you expected to happen.
That we would simply cave to the demands of a stranger and change our
structure, having just been approved as a WG?

We're protective of our new status and don't want to wreck it.  Our
listowners are free to close the membership at this point.  There's nothing
in the charter to stop them.  You probably didn't read the charter first.
How much homework did you do?  Any?

I was what some might call "angry" as a psf-member subscriber, that so much
important stuff about our internals (e.g. voting infrastructure) was made
topical in a private list where we were to agree to confidentiality.

I became disagreeable to many readers of psf-members for my position.  But
I haven't posted there in weeks and the important stuff about elections
infrastructure I wanted to go public, did in a big way:  elections-wg
(which may not yet have full WG status I'm not sure).  So I'm now satisfied
the Python.org infrastructure is healthier i.e. the e-voter stuff is more
out in the open.  That's important because the general public stands to
gain from being able to study real world examples of e-voter systems like
ours.  And as a 501(c)(3), PSF is all about serving the public (not hard to
do given Python is a huge public service already).



> I hope you understand where I?m coming from and why your words were
> hurtful.
>



The thought that you would think of me as a beta male was hilarious as I'm
alpha cis white and used to vast privilege, which I exercise daily without
apology.

I'd love it if more of our species were as well positioned as my caste
(semi-Brahmin I guess you could say, if this were classical India).  I do
not believe we should have untouchables and I do not refuse to associate or
work with people who are not as privileged as I am.

I'm in no white's only clubs, nor male only, nor do I believe in the whole
concept of "race" which I believe is used by the mentally inferior as a
last resort, when wanting to be in the oppressor role.

I mostly work to build peoples privileges so we relate as equals.  I do not
believe in "superpowers" (either political or like in Marvel comics) so I
do not believe any of my privilege is owing to such concepts, which
diminish people and make them stupid inside, like most in the Lower48
(ignorant and complacent folk I can't always work with easily, but do my
best).

I hope you understand where I'm coming from.

As a cis white, I hurt others feelings with wild abandon (actually not, I'm
usually pretty diplomatic except with people I love and trust) and expect
the same from others.  However I draw the line at outward weapons.  I'm a
Quaker and think outward weapons are for sissies and cowards (or for the
mentally ill if we want to be more delicate about it).





> As a trans woman I'm used to being constantly harassed and excluded from
> software projects on the sole basis of my gender.
>



Remember when it comes to HR matters, we as individuals not always
privileged to have the first or last word, which has nothing to do with
gender.

If I'm fired from job X and I *say* it's because of Z or V, or even just Q,
that's not the final verdict, given others are involved and have a say.

People like to arrogate the powers of judge and jury to themselves, but as
a white male of vast privilege (plus a Visa card), I know that even I will
be challenged if I start telling the world what's what about why people
won't work with me.

I'll sound defensive and shrill maybe, but likely not veridical
(authoritative), if I go around telling everyone exactly why I was fired or
not hired in some situation.  I'm seen as too biased.  The language is
built that way, or at least English is (like Japanese, it's full of
inflection and nuance).

So don't take this personally though.  We're all taught from a young age
that our emotions and judgements may be second guessed by others.

Indeed, a hallmark of privilege is being able to give a version of what
happened, and have others agree to one's narrative.  That's what power is,
in a nutshell I'd say.

I just learned on BBC last night that viruses and other parasites will
change our mood and persona.  One virus that rats get makes them love the
smell of cats and they get eaten pronto, which is how the virus spreads to
cats.  Clever virus.


The Python community has made great advancements in how it treats
> minorities and the marginalized, but turns a blind eye when cis white males
> abuse women.
>
>

I find a lot of people looking to some "Python community" for social
justice, but it's more just a good measuring stick of the global climate.

We're scattered and somewhat above average in privilege, as coders /
developers in general tend to be.

Though I'd say medical doctors still get more automatic respect all other
things being equal (e.g. lets say they're both trans, but one's a code the
other a doctor, which do you think gets more respect based on the
Stanford-Guilford Respect Metric -- which I made up but you know what I
mean, some clever test).

I'm glad you think the Python community is making great strides.  I would
be careful with words like "minority" though as that's often relevant to a
specific culture.  North Americans tend to be extremely ethnocentric and
think the world revolves around them.  They have this pathetic tendency to
inflict their terminology an nomenclature on others expecting the world to
go along.  I find this pathetic and stupid.  Some would call me
"anti-American" but I'm really just 3rd Culture (expat) and like to posture
(it's true -- given my power and privilege, it's easy for me).




> I don't regret calling Roberto out. I believe that he should think before
> posting egregious messages
>


Now THAT cuts both ways.  So far he seems only to have defended himself
against defamatory chargers.  You are the aggressor and prosecutor in the
context of just this list.  You're making the case it's different in other
contexts, but in getting angry and losing your cool, you have botched your
campaign (my assessment).




> while identifying himself with a major project such as this one. Now, with
> a clearer mind, I will further pursue this on a more organized manner
> following the feedback received.
>
> I want to thank those who are supporting me and helping me compile the
> list of offenses to present to the PSF board shortly. I want to specially
> thank: Jacky Kazil, Jacky Alcin?, Kurtis Rainbolt-Greene, Alexander
> Hitchins, Nexxy, Randi Harper, Gregory Smith, Julian Simioni, Strand
> McCutchen, Greg V and the super spectacular Jacob Kaplan-Moss for
> amplifying this and helping me reach others.
>
> We will continue, and bring forward a cleaner case that will serve as a
> template for future cases.
>
> J.
>
>
Run for the Board why not?

We have trans, we have whatever.

I think going after a specific individual and blaming the world's problems
on that individual looks like scapegoating or something.  How about you
come after me instead and give Roberto a break.

Want me to say something disparaging?  I probably already have in your
book, simply for being so out about my cis maleness and the privileges that
gets me.  What's wrong with privilege?  The goal is to give everyone more,
not for me to have less, right?

But then I think we should take our fight over to Diversity, where it more
belongs.  I've posted plenty for that archive and I think you might want to
do more homework before you make more mistakes.

Kirby
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From mertz at gnosis.cx  Sun Jun 28 07:34:13 2015
From: mertz at gnosis.cx (David Mertz)
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 22:34:13 -0700
Subject: [Python-cuba] Group focus
Message-ID: <CAEbHw4bfH5Fn7NKr=dYmtov5mhfSvxmX3qf0NGWeQ+XXyekN_w@mail.gmail.com>

As subscribers have seen, there is a person who joined this group (perhaps
because we have been overly permissive in subscribing everyone without any
sort of vetting, unlike with other PSF Working Groups), who has posted
NOTHING of the slightest relevance to the purpose of the group, but has
instead engaged entirely in vitriolic attacks against the Chair of this
group.

I really don't know the back-story of all of that, and I really do not
care.  It's not the purpose of this group to rehash unrelated issues and
debates about unrelated topics (all the less so since the accusation had
this creepy tone of insinuation and "guilt by association" but nothing
whatsoever suggestive of actual actions).

In any case, I have removed this person from this working group, and
members should focus on activities related to our charter and purpose.
Yes, of course digressions happen... but those should be digressions *from*
a relevant topic, not random out-of-the-blue rants and attacks.

Yours, David Mertz...
Vice-Chair, Python Cuba

-- 
Keeping medicines from the bloodstreams of the sick; food
from the bellies of the hungry; books from the hands of the
uneducated; technology from the underdeveloped; and putting
advocates of freedom in prisons.  Intellectual property is
to the 21st century what the slave trade was to the 16th.
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