From opensource at ronnypfannschmidt.de Sat Feb 8 08:39:54 2020 From: opensource at ronnypfannschmidt.de (Ronny Pfannschmidt) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2020 14:39:54 +0100 Subject: [pytest-dev] [RFC] experimenting with using matrix as chat/community platform for potentially superseding irc Message-ID: Hi Everyone, since a while now i have stopped using irc directly/controlled and instead switched to a setup using matrix that i like much better. Matrix enables a few features that i really like, for example * multiple synced clients (on my computers and my mobile) * server side persistent history (where i don't have to manage/juggle logs) In addition my personal perception of the communication structure on matrix is close to irc in a sense. (this is a emotional perception hard to put into word, but i like that matrix is IRC-like with nice features while being not like slack&co at all). In order to see how acceptance works out for that, i'd like to set up a community with? a small number of channels for dev talk, support, general chatter. However before starting, i would like to get feedback from the community on the ML. -- Ron From rajib.jolite at gmail.com Sun Feb 9 14:54:38 2020 From: rajib.jolite at gmail.com (Rajib Mitra) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2020 01:24:38 +0530 Subject: [pytest-dev] [RFC] experimenting with using matrix as chat/community platform for potentially superseding irc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: +1 for this. Best Regards Rajib On Sat, Feb 8, 2020 at 7:16 PM Ronny Pfannschmidt < opensource at ronnypfannschmidt.de> wrote: > Hi Everyone, > > since a while now i have stopped using irc directly/controlled and > instead switched to a setup using matrix that i like much better. > > Matrix enables a few features that i really like, for example > > * multiple synced clients (on my computers and my mobile) > * server side persistent history (where i don't have to manage/juggle logs) > > In addition my personal perception of the communication structure on > matrix is close to irc in a sense. > (this is a emotional perception hard to put into word, but i like that > matrix is IRC-like with nice features while being not like slack&co at > all). > > In order to see how acceptance works out for that, > i'd like to set up a community with a small number of channels for dev > talk, support, general chatter. > > However before starting, i would like to get feedback from the community > on the ML. > > > -- Ron > > _______________________________________________ > pytest-dev mailing list > pytest-dev at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pytest-dev > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From me at the-compiler.org Wed Feb 12 08:00:27 2020 From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2020 14:00:27 +0100 Subject: [pytest-dev] [RFC] experimenting with using matrix as chat/community platform for potentially superseding irc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20200212130027.i63ghm5e42wjroum@hooch.localdomain> Hey Ronny, hey everyone, On Sat, Feb 08, 2020 at 02:39:54PM +0100, Ronny Pfannschmidt wrote: > since a while now i have stopped using irc directly/controlled and > instead switched to a setup using matrix that i like much better. > > Matrix enables a few features that i really like, for example > > * multiple synced clients (on my computers and my mobile) > * server side persistent history (where i don't have to manage/juggle logs) > > In addition my personal perception of the communication structure on matrix > is close to irc in a sense. > (this is a emotional perception hard to put into word, but i like that > matrix is IRC-like with nice features while being not like slack&co at all). > > In order to see how acceptance works out for that, > i'd like to set up a community with? a small number of channels for dev > talk, support, general chatter. > > However before starting, i would like to get feedback from the community on > the ML. This certainly is a better alternative than the walled gardens I've seen in other communities (Slack/Gitter/...). However, I'm still -1 for splitting up an already quite small community even more. I don't really see the benefits, given that IRC apparently can be used via Matrix as well. If it's possible to bridge the IRC and Matrix channels in a somewhat seamless way, then I guess that changes to a +0. Florian -- me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP) | https://www.qutebrowser.org https://bruhin.software/ | https://github.com/sponsors/The-Compiler/ GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | https://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc I love long mails! | https://email.is-not-s.ms/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 833 bytes Desc: not available URL: From tgoodlet at gmail.com Wed Feb 12 08:17:38 2020 From: tgoodlet at gmail.com (Tyler Goodlet) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2020 08:17:38 -0500 Subject: [pytest-dev] [RFC] experimenting with using matrix as chat/community platform for potentially superseding irc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Been using riot/matrix since it's early start (used to work in telephony and was at conferences with the team that started matrix). I personally believe in it and think it's the future for an IRC alternative. They had a hack a while back which was handled correctly: https://matrix.org/blog/2019/04/11/we-have-discovered-and-addressed-a-security-breach-updated-2019-04-12/ They also used to have brutal syncing problems with the old app but the new one (which I just recently installed) seems to have alleviated most of these: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=im.vector.riotx&hl=en_US Definitely big ++1 from me. - goodboy On Sat, Feb 8, 2020 at 8:46 AM Ronny Pfannschmidt wrote: > > Hi Everyone, > > since a while now i have stopped using irc directly/controlled and > instead switched to a setup using matrix that i like much better. > > Matrix enables a few features that i really like, for example > > * multiple synced clients (on my computers and my mobile) > * server side persistent history (where i don't have to manage/juggle logs) > > In addition my personal perception of the communication structure on > matrix is close to irc in a sense. > (this is a emotional perception hard to put into word, but i like that > matrix is IRC-like with nice features while being not like slack&co at all). > > In order to see how acceptance works out for that, > i'd like to set up a community with a small number of channels for dev > talk, support, general chatter. > > However before starting, i would like to get feedback from the community > on the ML. > > > -- Ron > > _______________________________________________ > pytest-dev mailing list > pytest-dev at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pytest-dev From h.goebel at crazy-compilers.com Thu Feb 13 05:44:34 2020 From: h.goebel at crazy-compilers.com (Hartmut Goebel) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2020 11:44:34 +0100 Subject: [pytest-dev] [RFC] experimenting with using matrix as chat/community platform for potentially superseding irc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Am 12.02.20 um 14:17 schrieb Tyler Goodlet: > the future for an IRC alternative Why would we need an alternative to IRC? Which issues we have with IRC are solved by Matrix? IRC is available on nearly every system, developers are used to it and one does not need any account. -- Regards Hartmut Goebel | Hartmut Goebel | h.goebel at crazy-compilers.com | | www.crazy-compilers.com | compilers which you thought are impossible | -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 0x7B752811BF773B65.asc Type: application/pgp-keys Size: 18910 bytes Desc: not available URL: From daniel at daniel-watkins.co.uk Fri Feb 14 16:15:19 2020 From: daniel at daniel-watkins.co.uk (Daniel Watkins) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2020 16:15:19 -0500 Subject: [pytest-dev] [RFC] experimenting with using matrix as chat/community platform for potentially superseding irc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Ronny (et al), I wouldn't consider myself an active member of the community, but I do engage in some conversations and occasional support on IRC, and most days I'll read all the conversation in the channel. As a pytest power user, I like to keep abreast of what's happening in pytest development. I don't remember when I joined, but I've remained in there because I'm already connected to Freenode for other channels; the cost to me of another IRC channel is very low. As a concrete data point: I am not invested enough that I would set up a Matrix client in order to remain in the pytest chat community. Another concrete data point: I have joined gitter in the past to get support for a project, but I didn't remain there very long afterwards, because I didn't want a whole tab that was only for chatting about a single project that I'm not very involved in. To generalise from my situation (i.e. to wildly guess ^_^), I wouldn't be surprised if you retain the most active members of the community, but lose a lot of the "I use pytest and would like to know what's going on" sort of people, who don't need Yet Another Chat Client in their life. You will also (I suspect) see greater attrition of people who do join but don't get hooked. If my conjecture is correct, then these are tradeoffs you'll need to consider. I hope this input is helpful, and, finally: thanks for your work on pytest, I really appreciate it! Cheers, Dan On Sat, Feb 8, 2020 at 8:46 AM Ronny Pfannschmidt < opensource at ronnypfannschmidt.de> wrote: > Hi Everyone, > > since a while now i have stopped using irc directly/controlled and > instead switched to a setup using matrix that i like much better. > > Matrix enables a few features that i really like, for example > > * multiple synced clients (on my computers and my mobile) > * server side persistent history (where i don't have to manage/juggle logs) > > In addition my personal perception of the communication structure on > matrix is close to irc in a sense. > (this is a emotional perception hard to put into word, but i like that > matrix is IRC-like with nice features while being not like slack&co at > all). > > In order to see how acceptance works out for that, > i'd like to set up a community with a small number of channels for dev > talk, support, general chatter. > > However before starting, i would like to get feedback from the community > on the ML. > > > -- Ron > > _______________________________________________ > pytest-dev mailing list > pytest-dev at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pytest-dev > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From flub at devork.be Mon Feb 17 14:08:24 2020 From: flub at devork.be (Floris Bruynooghe) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 20:08:24 +0100 Subject: [pytest-dev] [RFC] experimenting with using matrix as chat/community platform for potentially superseding irc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <87pnedav6f.fsf@powell.devork.be> Hi Ronny, It seems reactions here are have not been overly positive so far. I strongly suspect this is selection bias though, you're asking the people who are currently on mailing lists and IRC. E.g. if it was up to me pytest would never have bothered moving from hg to git, yet that move was immensely beneficial overall for attracting many more contributors. So I think you should create a matrix community and see how it goes. Even link to it from the contact page from the docs and anywhere else IRC is mentioned. If it doesn't work out we can remove it again, but it's impossible to say if we don't try. And for those on IRC there's no threat of the IRC channel going away, I imagine many of us who do use it will remain using it for other reasons anyway and thus remain logged in. My only suggestion would be to limit the number of channels initially, to avoid fragmenting a potentially already small userbase. You can always split up if it becomes too noisy, but for IRC there only ever was one channel too and seemed to work. But then again, I'm not familiar with how matrix communities work so feel free to ignore my opinion here. Cheers, Floris On Sat 08 Feb 2020 at 14:39 +0100, Ronny Pfannschmidt wrote: > Hi Everyone, > > since a while now i have stopped using irc directly/controlled and > instead switched to a setup using matrix that i like much better. > > Matrix enables a few features that i really like, for example > > * multiple synced clients (on my computers and my mobile) > * server side persistent history (where i don't have to manage/juggle logs) > > In addition my personal perception of the communication structure on > matrix is close to irc in a sense. > (this is a emotional perception hard to put into word, but i like that > matrix is IRC-like with nice features while being not like slack&co at all). > > In order to see how acceptance works out for that, > i'd like to set up a community with? a small number of channels for dev > talk, support, general chatter. > > However before starting, i would like to get feedback from the community > on the ML. > > > -- Ron > > _______________________________________________ > pytest-dev mailing list > pytest-dev at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pytest-dev