From guido at python.org Tue Dec 10 12:10:11 2002 From: guido at python.org (Guido van Rossum) Date: Tue Dec 10 12:10:46 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] Rich Bowen: [Oscon] Useful comments about conferences Message-ID: <200212101710.gBAHAB932242@odiug.zope.com> >From another list on conferences... --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) ------- Forwarded Message Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 11:45:58 -0500 From: Rich Bowen To: Subject: [Oscon] Useful comments about conferences This blog reiterates things that I've often thought. Worth considering: http://www.aaronsw.com/weblog/000750 - -- Oh I have slipped the surly bonds of earth And danced the sky on laughter-silvered wings --High Flight (John Gillespie Magee) _______________________________________________ Oscon mailing list Oscon@labs.oreilly.com http://labs.oreilly.com/mailman/listinfo/oscon ------- End of Forwarded Message From aahz at pythoncraft.com Wed Dec 11 00:24:33 2002 From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz) Date: Wed Dec 11 00:24:37 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] Useful comments about conferences In-Reply-To: <200212101710.gBAHAB932242@odiug.zope.com> References: <200212101710.gBAHAB932242@odiug.zope.com> Message-ID: <20021211052433.GA25575@panix.com> On Tue, Dec 10, 2002, Guido van Rossum wrote: > > http://www.aaronsw.com/weblog/000750 While I personally agree with the comments on that URL, I think Aaron has what I call "a shoe problem", as in, being unable to walk in another person's shoes. I've been doing enough teaching of enough different subjects in enough different venues over a long enough period of time that I've concluded that a lot of people really do learn better (or at least feel more comfortable) with someone teaching orally. There are lots of things that can be done to increase the effectiveness of a presentation, of course, and I believe that many of Aaron's criticisms apply more to poor presentations than to the fact that the basis of the presentation is speech. That said, I'd sure like a conference run more along the lines of what Aaron suggests. What I'd like to see discussed -- although maybe this list isn't the place for it -- is ways to accomodate multiple learning and communication styles within a single social/professional event. -- Aahz (aahz@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/ "To me vi is Zen. To use vi is to practice zen. Every command is a koan. Profound to the user, unintelligible to the uninitiated. You discover truth everytime you use it." --reddy@lion.austin.ibm.com From matt at ooiio.com Tue Dec 17 23:57:32 2002 From: matt at ooiio.com (Matt Croydon) Date: Wed Dec 18 00:39:52 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] DC Weblogger Message-ID: <005201c2a651$f9e8caa0$0f00a8c0@trebuchet> Hello, My name is Matt Croydon and I dabble in Python, I'm a compsci major, a weblogger, and I live near DC. I've already announced the con on my weblog (http://postneo.com), but I'd like to know what else I can do to help. --Matt ... matt@ooiio.com http://postneo.com From Payne at MattPayne.org Wed Dec 18 15:33:41 2002 From: Payne at MattPayne.org (Matt Payne) Date: Wed Dec 18 16:34:15 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] I'm interested.... kinda Message-ID: <1040247221.3e00e9b5f2541@webmail.spamcop.net> This morning I received Steve Holden's email alerting a bunch of people to the low cost Python conference coming this March. Thank you Steve! I'm numb to conferences because they are traditionally priced at the corporate level. I had missed previous announcements of http://www.python.org/pycon/... perhaps my head was in the sand. Is this the first time a low cost Python conference has been held in the USA? My main interest in Python is Jython. The wiki (http://www.python.org/cgi- bin/moinmoin/PyCon) mentions that others are interested in this as well. Great! Perhaps there could be a Jython track? There's a call for Volunteers on the wiki. What would the Volunteers do? I live in Nebraska. What might I be able to do? Are you looking for volunteers before the conference or to do things during? Or both? Is it ok to post talk and paper ideas to the wiki? To the mailing list? Only send them into the committee? -- Matt Payne, Payne@MattPayne.org \|/ (o o) ------------------------------oOo--(_)--oOo-------------------------------- Slow down to go faster. From sholden at holdenweb.com Wed Dec 18 17:16:58 2002 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Wed Dec 18 17:19:28 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] I'm interested.... kinda References: <1040247221.3e00e9b5f2541@webmail.spamcop.net> Message-ID: <017a01c2a6e3$2f65c160$6b01a8c0@holdenweb.com> > This morning I received Steve Holden's email alerting a bunch of people to the > low cost Python conference coming this March. Thank you Steve! > A pleasure. > I'm numb to conferences because they are traditionally priced at the corporate > level. > I was a bit shocked at the cost of IPC8 and IPC10, the only two I paid for. Only went to IPC8, but that's another story. > I had missed previous announcements of http://www.python.org/pycon/... perhaps > my head was in the sand. > > Is this the first time a low cost Python conference has been held in the USA? > To the best of my knowledge. We were inspired by the YAS (Yet Another Society) approach. I believe I sent the first message to the python-conferences list after IPC10, and I'll quote from that message for those who have joined the pycon-interest list: """Summarizing: 1. Attendance could be higher at future conferences run along the same lines as Python 10. These things are small beer to Foretec compared with the cash-cow IETF bashes, and I don't really feel they are in touch with the market for Python. This may be heresy, I don't know enough to know who these comments might offend. Don't really care much, either: Foretec certainly didn't make me feel, as a first-time attender, that I was anything special, or that they were glad to see me, or even that they would like me to come back next time. I think Foretec think Python is a yawn. The way they approach it, I think they're right. 2. Whether or not Python 11 is much like Python 10, there is certainly room for some sort of no-frills (Python 11.5?) conference to attract and cater for Pythonistas who don't have the benefit of commercial backing of one kind or another. This would also better enable the PSF to judge groundswell growth in Python usage, and put them nearer the "beer and skittles" end of the market, such as it is. 3. My own feeling is that the PSF or some other visibly non-profit organization could do at least as good a job as Foretec, but I shudder when I remember the time it takes to organize an even half-way professional conference. """ Those impressions and intentions still stand. I don't feel that PyCon will be a success unless we can persuade "ordinary" Python users like you and me to take responsibility for making sure the things they want to happen do actually happen. I don't have the time to spoon-feed a passive audience, and I don't think PyCon should be catering to that audience. I'm quite prepared for it to be a little rougher around the edges than the International Python Conference, as long as it appeals to the broad church of Python users (most of whom can't shell out $500+ for a three-day event). > My main interest in Python is Jython. The wiki (http://www.python.org/cgi- > bin/moinmoin/PyCon) mentions that others are interested in this as well. Great! > Perhaps there could be a Jython track? > Perhaps. It mostly depends on how many Jython papers we get, and who is prepared to ensure that Jython users are well-represented in the registrations. It would be nice to have some organized mechanism for feedback, but there's only one of me. Guido's snowed under with various development projects right now. > There's a call for Volunteers on the wiki. What would the Volunteers do? I > live in Nebraska. What might I be able to do? Are you looking for volunteers > before the conference or to do things during? Or both? > Well, before PyCon you could help design mechanisms that make sure the audience's interests are reflected in the presentations. You could encourage favorite Python authors or contributors to submit a paper by suggesting topics you'd find interesting. You could write a paper of your own. You could write a lightning talk. You could organize one or more Wiki pages for use in preparing a Jython track (PyConJython?). You could encourage others to contribute to that Wiki, and/or establish other Wiki areas to indicate support for and possibly even sponsorship of particular topics. You could publicize the conference anywhere and everywhere relevant. You could move to DC :-). You could think about all the administrivia that's need to run a friendly and professional conference and produce checklists, liaise with suppliers, suggest sources. You could help to get the papers ready for publication on the web. You could help to prepare brochures and circulate them. During PyCon you could help out at the registration desk. You could help to build, operate and tear down the wireless infrstructure we are putting in place to keep everybody up on the Internet. You could make sure that speakers are ready to speak, with viewgraphs and handouts as appropriate. You could run a BoF (birds-of-a-feather) session or three. You could make sure that extempore sessions were recorded. You could organize transport sharing to help conferees to keep costs down. You could monitor the accommodation position for late arrivals. You could put a task force together to organize the *next* PyCon. You could offer me a free place :-) I'm posting the above on the Wiki to try to stimulate others. The next task for the PyCon organizers is to create a task list that we can order and use to drive the planning for and execution of the event. > Is it ok to post talk and paper ideas to the wiki? To the mailing list? > Only send them into the committee? > Any or all three will be perfectly acceptable. I'll leave it to you to judge the appropriateness of each channel for the particular concerns you want to address. Nice to hear from you. regards ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Bring your musical instrument to PyCon! http://www.python.org/pycon/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From chris.johnson at netiq.com Wed Dec 18 16:47:17 2002 From: chris.johnson at netiq.com (Chris Johnson) Date: Wed Dec 18 17:48:29 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] i wanna go. Message-ID: All: Just posting so ya'll know i am gonna come , if can afford it.I requested vacation days today. Lodging. Maybe we can get a group discount some where in foggy creek. cj Chris Johnson From chris.johnson at netiq.com Wed Dec 18 16:59:09 2002 From: chris.johnson at netiq.com (Chris Johnson) Date: Wed Dec 18 18:00:21 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint Message-ID: I am interested in attending a sprint. Why: I am a newbie to python and programming. I have played with asp and php and taken vb classes so I get the basics of programming. I bet i could learn a lot just watching the code come out and hearing discussion about the app. I am coming to pycon just hopeing to learn more becouse greping from books is not a learning style I utilize well. Watching others and listening is the way I learn best. I have no python mentors here where I live. Are newbie's welcome ? Is this a cool way to learn the pythonic way ? Chris Johnson 713-996-1619 QE NetIQ From tismer at tismer.com Thu Dec 19 00:09:02 2002 From: tismer at tismer.com (Christian Tismer) Date: Wed Dec 18 18:09:17 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E01000E.2070408@tismer.com> Chris Johnson wrote: > I am interested in attending a sprint. > > Why: > > I am a newbie to python and programming. I have played with asp and php and > taken vb classes so I get the basics of programming. > > I bet i could learn a lot just watching the code come out and hearing > discussion about the app. > > I am coming to pycon just hopeing to learn more becouse greping from books > is not a learning style I utilize well. Watching others and listening is the > way I learn best. I have no python mentors here where I live. > > Are newbie's welcome ? > > Is this a cool way to learn the pythonic way ? I think so. Maybe even cooler if a couple of oldtimers join the sprint? -- Christian Tismer :^) Mission Impossible 5oftware : Have a break! Take a ride on Python's Johannes-Niemeyer-Weg 9a : *Starship* http://starship.python.net/ 14109 Berlin : PGP key -> http://wwwkeys.pgp.net/ work +49 30 89 09 53 34 home +49 30 802 86 56 pager +49 173 24 18 776 PGP 0x57F3BF04 9064 F4E1 D754 C2FF 1619 305B C09C 5A3B 57F3 BF04 whom do you want to sponsor today? http://www.stackless.com/ From sholden at holdenweb.com Wed Dec 18 20:40:37 2002 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Wed Dec 18 20:42:54 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint References: <3E01000E.2070408@tismer.com> Message-ID: <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> Christian Tismer wrote: > Chris Johnson wrote: > > I am interested in attending a sprint. > > > > Why: > > > > I am a newbie to python and programming. I have played with asp and php and > > taken vb classes so I get the basics of programming. > > You'll take to Python like a duck to water, then. > > I bet i could learn a lot just watching the code come out and hearing > > discussion about the app. > > That's one of the reasons I'm planning to attend. > > I am coming to pycon just hopeing to learn more becouse greping from books > > is not a learning style I utilize well. Watching others and listening is the > > way I learn best. I have no python mentors here where I live. > > That's a pity. Have you tried http://python.meetup.com/, I wonder? Certainly conferences are great for through-the-face conversations about the things you want to learn. > > Are newbie's welcome ? > > Definitely. Encouraged, even. > > Is this a cool way to learn the pythonic way ? > > I think so. > Maybe even cooler if a couple of oldtimers join the sprint? > I believe that one of the ideas behind the sprint(s) is to transfer skills and knowledge. It's expected that the main benefit will be to the Python core, but there's a lot of Python code even in that. I am also personally interested in improving my Agile Development skills (sprints, scrums, XP techniques, &c., &c.) so I'm hoping there'll be some of that. I am also hoping that the sprints and/or the conference presentations will help me to better understand how to use CVS and the other development tools. One of my lightning talk ideas is simply explaining how to get started with ssh - establishing a private/public key pair and distributing the public key to machines you need remote access to. going-to-write-it-up-on-the-Wiki-ly y'rs - steve ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Bring your musical instrument to PyCon! http://www.python.org/pycon/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From sholden at holdenweb.com Wed Dec 18 21:08:25 2002 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Wed Dec 18 21:10:43 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint References: <3E01000E.2070408@tismer.com> <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> Brett Cannon > [Steve Holden] > > > Christian Tismer wrote: > > > Chris Johnson wrote: > > > > I am interested in attending a sprint. > > > > > > Ditto here. How is this going to be handled? My impression from reading > about the Zope sprints was that people came in and did XP-style hacking on > the core code. I assumed that meant you had to already know a good amount > about the core, but this little discussion has led me to think I was wrong > about that assumption. > > Obviously not everyone can do the sprints. This is going to be a queue > sign-up? Or is Jeremy going to decide who gets to do it? If the word is > spread that anyone can do them regardless of abilities then the sprints > might have a rather large inflow of people wanting to do it. > > And if anyone can do it regardless of skill base, then I want to be on the > list behind Chris. =) > Jeremy? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Bring your musical instrument to PyCon! http://www.python.org/pycon/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From guido at python.org Wed Dec 18 21:22:44 2002 From: guido at python.org (Guido van Rossum) Date: Wed Dec 18 21:22:40 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 18 Dec 2002 21:08:25 EST." <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> References: <3E01000E.2070408@tismer.com> <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: <200212190222.gBJ2Mid03539@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> > > > Christian Tismer wrote: > > > > Chris Johnson wrote: > > > > > I am interested in attending a sprint. > > > > > > > > > Ditto here. How is this going to be handled? My impression from reading > > about the Zope sprints was that people came in and did XP-style hacking on > > the core code. I assumed that meant you had to already know a good amount > > about the core, but this little discussion has led me to think I was wrong > > about that assumption. > > > > Obviously not everyone can do the sprints. This is going to be a queue > > sign-up? Or is Jeremy going to decide who gets to do it? If the word is > > spread that anyone can do them regardless of abilities then the sprints > > might have a rather large inflow of people wanting to do it. > > > > And if anyone can do it regardless of skill base, then I want to be on the > > list behind Chris. =) We can do this in several ways. If we make the sprinters pay extra for use of facilities during the sprint, we can basically handle as many people as sign up. If we pay for the sprint facilities out of conference surplus, we have to be more selective. Sprints for pure newbies (no Python experience) probably won't work well, although there are some local folks in DC who have some experience. (George Paci should know more; you should ask him if he wants to run one.) Sprints for people with Python experience but no experience on a particular code base (e.g. Zope) can work if there's an introductory talk at the beginning. This is how Jim Fulton does most Zope3 sprints. But that takes time away from sprinting (his intro was almost a full day at the recent sprint in Rotterdam). Sprints need focused projects that have been selected by more experienced developers ahead of time; you can't just get together without a plan and expect much to happen. I suggest that we shouldn't try to plan the sprints just yet. But maybe someone can transfer some of this to the Wiki so there's info for people interested in sprints. --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) From sholden at holdenweb.com Wed Dec 18 21:40:54 2002 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Wed Dec 18 21:43:11 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint References: <3E01000E.2070408@tismer.com> <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <200212190222.gBJ2Mid03539@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> Message-ID: <00be01c2a708$0ee54a80$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> > > > > Christian Tismer wrote: > > > > > Chris Johnson wrote: > > > > > > I am interested in attending a sprint. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ditto here. How is this going to be handled? My impression from reading > > > about the Zope sprints was that people came in and did XP-style hacking on > > > the core code. I assumed that meant you had to already know a good amount > > > about the core, but this little discussion has led me to think I was wrong > > > about that assumption. > > > > > > Obviously not everyone can do the sprints. This is going to be a queue > > > sign-up? Or is Jeremy going to decide who gets to do it? If the word is > > > spread that anyone can do them regardless of abilities then the sprints > > > might have a rather large inflow of people wanting to do it. > > > > > > And if anyone can do it regardless of skill base, then I want to be on the > > > list behind Chris. =) > [Guido] [ ... ] > > I suggest that we shouldn't try to plan the sprints just yet. But > maybe someone can transfer some of this to the Wiki so there's info > for people interested in sprints. > Done. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Bring your musical instrument to PyCon! http://www.python.org/pycon/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From neal at metaslash.com Wed Dec 18 21:49:20 2002 From: neal at metaslash.com (Neal Norwitz) Date: Wed Dec 18 21:49:57 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint In-Reply-To: <200212190222.gBJ2Mid03539@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> References: <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <200212190222.gBJ2Mid03539@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20021219024919.GF12063@epoch.metaslash.com> On Wed, Dec 18, 2002 at 09:22:44PM -0500, Guido van Rossum wrote: > > Sprints for people with Python experience but no experience on a > particular code base (e.g. Zope) can work if there's an introductory > talk at the beginning. This is how Jim Fulton does most Zope3 > sprints. But that takes time away from sprinting (his intro was > almost a full day at the recent sprint in Rotterdam). > > Sprints need focused projects that have been selected by more > experienced developers ahead of time; you can't just get together > without a plan and expect much to happen. Sounds like words of experience. :-) Would it make sense to have mini-classes throughout the conference? I'd hate to sit down with each new person and have to teach, ssh, cvs, sf (maybe roundup by march?), etc. Perhaps we could have short classes/tutorials throughout the conference. Maybe a half-hour to an hour. That way people could learn or improve the skills they don't have. > I suggest that we shouldn't try to plan the sprints just yet. Agreed. I'm just thinking out loud. Neal From guido at python.org Wed Dec 18 21:57:09 2002 From: guido at python.org (Guido van Rossum) Date: Wed Dec 18 21:57:06 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 18 Dec 2002 21:49:20 EST." <20021219024919.GF12063@epoch.metaslash.com> References: <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <200212190222.gBJ2Mid03539@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> <20021219024919.GF12063@epoch.metaslash.com> Message-ID: <200212190257.gBJ2v9i03881@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> > Would it make sense to have mini-classes throughout the conference? > I'd hate to sit down with each new person and have to teach, ssh, cvs, > sf (maybe roundup by march?), etc. > Perhaps we could have short classes/tutorials throughout the > conference. Maybe a half-hour to an hour. That way people could > learn or improve the skills they don't have. Good idea! But since the sprints are planned Mon/Tue, i.e. *before* the conference, this would have to be done on the first morning of the sprint. For the Zope3 sprint in Rotterdam we had a Wiki page (and reminder emails) for all participants to encourage them to set up and test their ssh/cvs setup on their laptop *before* coming to the sprint, so we wouldn't waste time on that. --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) From sholden at holdenweb.com Wed Dec 18 21:55:34 2002 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Wed Dec 18 21:57:51 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint References: <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <200212190222.gBJ2Mid03539@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> <20021219024919.GF12063@epoch.metaslash.com> Message-ID: <001201c2a70a$1b15f2d0$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> > On Wed, Dec 18, 2002 at 09:22:44PM -0500, Guido van Rossum wrote: > > > > Sprints for people with Python experience but no experience on a > > particular code base (e.g. Zope) can work if there's an introductory > > talk at the beginning. This is how Jim Fulton does most Zope3 > > sprints. But that takes time away from sprinting (his intro was > > almost a full day at the recent sprint in Rotterdam). > > > > Sprints need focused projects that have been selected by more > > experienced developers ahead of time; you can't just get together > > without a plan and expect much to happen. > > Sounds like words of experience. :-) > > Would it make sense to have mini-classes throughout the conference? > I'd hate to sit down with each new person and have to teach, ssh, cvs, > sf (maybe roundup by march?), etc. > > Perhaps we could have short classes/tutorials throughout the > conference. Maybe a half-hour to an hour. That way people could > learn or improve the skills they don't have. > > > I suggest that we shouldn't try to plan the sprints just yet. > > Agreed. I'm just thinking out loud. > Neal: Terriffic. I've started to write up potential lightning talks on the Wiki (http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/moinmoin/PyCon) -- perhaps you could expand this idea there? I really do think that, while it's perhaps not directly relevant to core Python, we could expand the "volunteer" base a lot by teaching some fairly elementary skills. And I'd like to learn some of them myself. Maybe you could point out that "lightning tutorials" will have a slightly different flavor from "lightning talks"? regards ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Bring your musical instrument to PyCon! http://www.python.org/pycon/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From sholden at holdenweb.com Wed Dec 18 22:00:00 2002 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Wed Dec 18 22:02:22 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] sprint References: <005801c2a6ff$a273bb00$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <007f01c2a703$85734620$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> <200212190222.gBJ2Mid03539@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> <20021219024919.GF12063@epoch.metaslash.com> <200212190257.gBJ2v9i03881@pcp02138704pcs.reston01.va.comcast.net> Message-ID: <002401c2a70a$bacfb040$6ff26c42@holdenweb.com> Guido: I suppose you mena http://www.zope.org//Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/CMSprintPr eparation We could certainly do something like that, and probably pre-publish the lightning tutorial material for the especially clueless :-) It would also add flavor to the tutorials to have first-timer war stories, I guess. regards ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Bring your musical instrument to PyCon! http://www.python.org/pycon/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Guido van Rossum" To: Cc: "Steve Holden" ; ; Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2002 9:57 PM Subject: Re: [Pycon-interest] sprint > > Would it make sense to have mini-classes throughout the conference? > > I'd hate to sit down with each new person and have to teach, ssh, cvs, > > sf (maybe roundup by march?), etc. > > > Perhaps we could have short classes/tutorials throughout the > > conference. Maybe a half-hour to an hour. That way people could > > learn or improve the skills they don't have. > > Good idea! But since the sprints are planned Mon/Tue, i.e. *before* > the conference, this would have to be done on the first morning of the > sprint. > > For the Zope3 sprint in Rotterdam we had a Wiki page (and reminder > emails) for all participants to encourage them to set up and test > their ssh/cvs setup on their laptop *before* coming to the sprint, so > we wouldn't waste time on that. > > --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) > > From tlilley at perspex.com Thu Dec 19 01:05:29 2002 From: tlilley at perspex.com (Tripp Lilley) Date: Thu Dec 19 01:07:59 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] I'm interested.... kinda In-Reply-To: <017a01c2a6e3$2f65c160$6b01a8c0@holdenweb.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Dec 2002, Steve Holden wrote: > > My main interest in Python is Jython. The wiki > (http://www.python.org/cgi- > > bin/moinmoin/PyCon) mentions that others are interested in this as well. > Great! > > Perhaps there could be a Jython track? > > > Perhaps. It mostly depends on how many Jython papers we get, and who is > prepared to ensure that Jython users are well-represented in the > registrations. It would be nice to have some organized mechanism for > feedback, but there's only one of me. Guido's snowed under with various > development projects right now. I'm interested in Jython, but mainly because there's a bunch of Java stuff to which I want access from Python (e.g., Lucene). So I might submit a proposal on building Jython "islands" to use via XML-RPC (or PickleRPC or what have you) from the Python mainland I'm also interested in Parrot, so I might run a BoF (since I'm not sure there's enough interest for a full-fledged presentation). But all of this, of course, is after I catch up on my organizational duties :) From chris.johnson at netiq.com Thu Dec 19 09:45:23 2002 From: chris.johnson at netiq.com (Chris Johnson) Date: Thu Dec 19 10:46:38 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] hotel group rate. Message-ID: OK: Are there any plans for any group rates any where. I called the sales dept at George Washington university inn http://www.gwuinn.com . They said a block of ten rooms could hold until Until feb 28 at 196.00 a night. If reservation for the block are not filled by then they will let them go. I have looked on the web and there are several nice hotels around the area or close to the blue train line for around 125.00 a night. That is a much better rate. That week I understand is "cherry blossom" week. I suppose Washington has events year round so I don't know how early reservations typically need to be made. chris j From pobrien at orbtech.com Thu Dec 19 09:50:11 2002 From: pobrien at orbtech.com (Patrick K. O'Brien) Date: Thu Dec 19 10:51:53 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] hotel group rate. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200212190950.11920.pobrien@orbtech.com> On Thursday 19 December 2002 09:45 am, Chris Johnson wrote: > Are there any plans for any group rates any where. Much better rates are likely to be had using Priceline.com. We use Priceline to book hotel rooms quite often and have always gotten great deals at nice hotels. -- Patrick K. O'Brien Orbtech http://www.orbtech.com/web/pobrien ----------------------------------------------- "Your source for Python programming expertise." ----------------------------------------------- From guido at python.org Thu Dec 19 10:53:16 2002 From: guido at python.org (Guido van Rossum) Date: Thu Dec 19 10:53:52 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] hotel group rate. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Dec 2002 09:45:23 CST." References: Message-ID: <200212191553.gBJFrG026310@odiug.zope.com> > Are there any plans for any group rates any where. > > I called the sales dept at George Washington university inn > http://www.gwuinn.com . > > They said a block of ten rooms could hold until Until feb 28 at 196.00 a > night. If reservation for the block are not filled by then they will let > them go. > > I have looked on the web and there are several nice hotels around the area > or close to the blue train line for around 125.00 a night. > > That is a much better rate. > > > That week I understand is "cherry blossom" week. I suppose Washington has > events year round so I don't know how early reservations typically need to > be made. > > chris j I live near DC so I don't really know anything about hotels there, but I expect that hotels close to the event might be expensive and fill up soon. Fortunately it's close to the metro so you should be able to find hotels in the suburbs with better rates. Please record any info you find about hotels in the Wiki! The conference organizers don't have time or experience to go research hotel options. However, here's a list that Adam Turoff once mailed me: > I've been looking into hotels. I poked around expedia for availability > from March 26 to 29 (4 nights, wednesday thorugh saturday). > > I've also started contacting hotels for group rates; some of the group > rates are no better than the regular rates, and they require signing a > contract with a minimum number of rooms sold (with someone financially > responsible for unbooked rooms). Most hotels are less than responsive... > > Radission - Barcelo Hotel (DuPont Circle) > $125/night, $99/weekend > > State Plaza hotel (Foggy Bottom; near GWU) > $119/night, $99/weekend > > Hilton Silver Spring (Near Metro, in suburban MD) > $99/hight, $74/weekend > > Windsor Park Hotel > Conn Ave, between DuPont Circle/Woodley Park Metro stations > $95/night; needs a car > > Econo Lodge Alexandria (Near Metro, in suburban VA) > $95/night > > This is a hand picked list; I ignored anything over $125/night, even > though there are some really well situated hotels nearby at higher rates. > Also, I'm not sure how much these prices reflect an expedia-only > discount. I can't vouch for any of these hotels, either. > > I also found out that the down season for DC Hotels are mid-june through > mid-september, and mid-november through mid-january. Feel free to copy this into the Wiki too! http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/moinmoin/PyCon --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) From sholden at holdenweb.com Thu Dec 19 11:17:27 2002 From: sholden at holdenweb.com (Steve Holden) Date: Thu Dec 19 11:19:57 2002 Subject: [Pycon-interest] hotel group rate. References: Message-ID: <00a001c2a77a$2236ca60$6b01a8c0@holdenweb.com> > > OK: > > Are there any plans for any group rates any where. > > I called the sales dept at George Washington university inn > http://www.gwuinn.com . > > They said a block of ten rooms could hold until Until feb 28 at 196.00 a > night. If reservation for the block are not filled by then they will let > them go. > > I have looked on the web and there are several nice hotels around the area > or close to the blue train line for around 125.00 a night. > > That is a much better rate. > > > That week I understand is "cherry blossom" week. I suppose Washington has > events year round so I don't know how early reservations typically need to > be made. > Chris: Terrific work. Can I ask you to put this info in a "PyConAccommodation" page in the Wiki? It's waiting for you at http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/moinmoin/PyConAccommodation I hadn't realised we were conferring during Cherry Blossom week. That might put pressure on hptel sapce, but it will give us a local event to tie in with. Early bookings will probably be advisable. regards ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Holden http://www.holdenweb.com/ Python Web Programming http://pydish.holdenweb.com/pwp/ Bring your musical instrument to PyCon! http://www.python.org/pycon/ -----------------------------------------------------------------------