From bmurray at aiveacorp.aivea.com Fri May 1 20:20:29 2009 From: bmurray at aiveacorp.aivea.com (Beth Murray) Date: Fri, 1 May 2009 11:20:29 -0700 Subject: [portland] Portland Code Camp - May 30, 2009 at Reed College Message-ID: Hi, Portland Code Camp - May 30, 2009 at Reed College Code Camp is a place for developers to come and learn from their peers. This FREE community driven event has become an international trend where peer groups of all platforms, programming languages and disciplines band together to bring content to the community. Go to the website: http://PortlandCodeCamp.org and Register or Submit a Session Proposal Use this link to Volunteer: http://portlandcodecamp.org/contact.aspx Let us know that you can be counted on to support the Developer Community in Portland. Best Regards, Beth Murray T +1 503 520 9999 x3925 M +1 503 545 2714 F +1 503 214 8164 bmurray at aivea.com Aivea Corporation 14631 SW Millikan Way Beaverton, OR 97006 http://www.aivea.com Portland | Seattle | San Francisco | New York ************************************************************************************************** Any statements made, or intentions expressed in this communication may not necessarily reflect the view of Aivea. Be advised that no content herein may be held binding upon Aivea or any associated company unless confirmed by the issuance of a formal contractual document. This email is confidential and intended only for the stated addressee(s). If you receive this in error, please inform us immediately and delete it and all copies from your system. Any unauthorized disclosure, use, or dissemination, either whole or partial, is prohibited. 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URL: From kirby.urner at gmail.com Wed May 6 16:57:54 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 6 May 2009 07:57:54 -0700 Subject: [portland] Short essay on workflow Message-ID: Re: http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/05/workflow.html I blogged this little essay on "workflow" this morning, inviting discussion and feedback (to this list even). If we get a little thread going, I'll link to it. This is sort of in the spirit of OS Bridge, wanting to bring cultural and chemistry issues to the foreground (to use the conference track shop talk). Regarding Lindsey, mentioned in the opening paragraph, she's worked in C, Perl, JavaScript (also SVG -- to generate wiring diagrams from a database, way cool). I encouraged her to check out (a) Calagator (b) Cubespace and (c) FreeGeek (she's only been in Portland a few days, moved here from West Virginia or one of those). She's especially interested in getting into home monitoring of power consumption i.e. graphing what each of your appliances are doing, giving home owners like a control panel, or at least feedback. She expects others are working on this and would like to get involved. I don't have an email address though. Maybe we'll see her around. Kirby PS: the workflow essay stems from long experience working in the nonprofit sector around Greater Portland, including pre FOSS (gotta remember, FOSS is new). I've always wanted clients to develop as much ownership over the software as feasible, think with FOSS philosophy and simpler approaches, that's often an attainable goal. From jek at discorporate.us Tue May 12 05:54:23 2009 From: jek at discorporate.us (jason kirtland) Date: Mon, 11 May 2009 20:54:23 -0700 Subject: [portland] Meeting Tomorrow: Distributed Version Control Message-ID: <4A08F2EF.4060804@discorporate.us> Pythonistas, The next Portland Python User Group meeting is tomorrow, Tuesday May 12th, 7pm at CubeSpace. This month's topic is distributed version control systems and we have a great meeting lined up! * Module of the month (Bob) * Introduction to DVCS (Jason) * Darcs (John) * Reviewboard (Craig) * Bzr (Michael) + Launchpad (Michel) * Hg (Brett) + Bitbucket (Adam) * Git + Github (Igal) And then off to the pub. Hope to see you all there! Cheers, Jason http://www.meetup.com/pdxpython/calendar/10188449/ From pcurtain at gmail.com Tue May 12 07:52:41 2009 From: pcurtain at gmail.com (Patrick Curtain) Date: Mon, 11 May 2009 22:52:41 -0700 Subject: [portland] Meeting Tomorrow: Distributed Version Control In-Reply-To: <4A08F2EF.4060804@discorporate.us> References: <4A08F2EF.4060804@discorporate.us> Message-ID: Enjoy, everyone! I've got to be at a rehearsal (orchestra for CYT's prod of the Wizard of Oz). Hope to see you all monthly otherwise. Blessings! --p On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 8:54 PM, jason kirtland wrote: > Pythonistas, > > The next Portland Python User Group meeting is tomorrow, Tuesday May 12th, > 7pm at CubeSpace. > > This month's topic is distributed version control systems and we have a > great meeting lined up! > > ?* Module of the month (Bob) > ?* Introduction to DVCS (Jason) > ?* Darcs (John) > ?* Reviewboard (Craig) > ?* Bzr (Michael) + Launchpad (Michel) > ?* Hg (Brett) + Bitbucket (Adam) > ?* Git + Github (Igal) > > And then off to the pub. ?Hope to see you all there! > > Cheers, > Jason > > http://www.meetup.com/pdxpython/calendar/10188449/ > _______________________________________________ > Portland mailing list > Portland at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland > -- Patrick Curtain, Husband & Father ( i also write software ) http://www.patrickcurtain.com/ 360.521.9625 From michael at susens-schurter.com Tue May 12 18:34:07 2009 From: michael at susens-schurter.com (Michael Schurter) Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 09:34:07 -0700 Subject: [portland] Meeting Tomorrow: Distributed Version Control In-Reply-To: <4A08F2EF.4060804@discorporate.us> References: <4A08F2EF.4060804@discorporate.us> Message-ID: <1242146047.4260.16.camel@harvey> On Mon, 2009-05-11 at 20:54 -0700, jason kirtland wrote: > * Bzr (Michael) + Launchpad (Michel) The good news is some of my old friends from college got their band signed to a major label. The bad news is they're playing in town tonight @ 7:30pm. I'm going to have to back out of presenting on bzr tonight, sorry. I doubt my short little presentation will be missed with presentations on git & hg. I'm sure somebody could just quickly describe bzr's major differences: * slow :) * directory based branching only (afaik) * lightweight branching that works more like svn (operations work on "remote" repo instead of the "local" one) * easiest to learn imho (no smart server setup needed) Thats about all I can think of other than minor things like rename/move following & some behavior differences (bzr pull = hg pull -u). I'm sad to be missing out tonight! Hope all goes well! Michael From kirby.urner at gmail.com Thu May 14 02:19:53 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 17:19:53 -0700 Subject: [portland] in followup to May meeting... Message-ID: Thx for a great mtg! I learned a lot. Although I told "border collie" michelle (good at herding!) I'd be joining ya'll at Produce Row, when we dispersed to our motor vehicles (aka "cars") I got the proverbial cell call -- actually, I was in that Shell across from Cubespace, gassing up said Razz (her name). I texted Jason about my sudden change, dunno if relevant (just tying off loose ends). Next time maybe? I never know in advance it seems. When still on the sidewalk with the first group outside, Michel asked me what version control systems I'd used and I said mainly cvs for Python.org (the website), which brought up this question: is it just the source tree for Python-the-language (CPython), or the whole website (the proverbial kit and kaboodle) that's moving to hg? I sought clarification about that just now and learned on good authority that the website is still in svn. My guess is it'll move to hg, but that hasn't happened yet. Here's my write-up of last night's, where I fade in and out around stuff, lots going on in my little world, distracting: http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/05/ppug-2009512.html Per my many autobiographical blog postings, I came up through the ranks as an xBase programmer, meaning Visual FoxPro eventually, still popular in Prague (liking Igal's allusions to Kafka's Castle as Friend Hyzy went to Prague precisely to study said master, has been one of my dear correspondents over the years). FYI, before FOSS revolution I worked mostly for Greater Portland's nonprofits using non-Mac solutions, though my organization (EMO/CUE) had some of the first LaserWriters in town, slaved to PageMaker, and we had classes for Portland Alliance, Rain Magazine, other proud dirt worshipers, tree huggers and so on (CUE = Center for Urban Education, tech support for NGOs, well before Free Geek's CollabTech experiment). My move to Python was in connection with geometry research, testing the waters in a few other languages along the way (starting with Fox) before finding this pool of deep talent and true wonders: http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/oop.html (my transition from FoxPro to Python, in multiple chapters) http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/oopalgebra.html (lets make "dot notation" part of everyday math) http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/pyqvectors.html (yes, there's an article on "quadrays" in FoxPro Advisor -- collectors' edition?) I could give a more in-depth talk on this stuff sometime if people wanna do mathy stuff (seems we're pretty heavy into CS already, so why not?). What I'd say my day job is about these days is trying to get nuns and pirates (FOSS bosses) into the same room for cordial conversations with an eye to doing some business together. Have to work against stereotypes. Takes HR skills I maybe don't have, so I outsource to others in that department sometimes, e.g. Mosaic Consulting has helped with Sisters of Providence work etc.. On the geometry front, I was first web wrangler for Buckminster Fuller Insitute, was promoting his stuff around Portland before Python was a glimmer in our benevolent dicator's eye, even wound up in the Oregonian a couple times, as a "local futurist" (sounds pretty retro), here's a link to one of those articles, minus the picture which I've mislaid someplace: http://coffeeshopsnet.blogspot.com/2009/02/in-news.html (no, Portland didn't go with any stadium style global projection either, but this was before Google Earth or Google Street Views). More later, thanks again, Kirby 4D From michelle at pdxpython.org Thu May 14 02:34:14 2009 From: michelle at pdxpython.org (michelle rowley) Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 17:34:14 -0700 Subject: [portland] in followup to May meeting... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <813046e40905131734s43925120mafff050ed1bf4af6@mail.gmail.com> Kirby, "Border Collie" is probably low on my list of preferred pet names, but thanks for the intended sentiment. ;) Michelle On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:19 PM, kirby urner wrote: > Thx for a great mtg! ?I learned a lot. > > > > Although I told "border collie" michelle (good at herding!) I'd be > joining ya'll at Produce Row, when we dispersed to our motor vehicles > (aka "cars") I got the proverbial cell call -- actually, I was in that > Shell across from Cubespace, gassing up said Razz (her name). > > I texted Jason about my sudden change, dunno if relevant (just tying > off loose ends). ?Next time maybe? ?I never know in advance it seems. > > When still on the sidewalk with the first group outside, Michel asked > me what version control systems I'd used and I said mainly cvs for > Python.org (the website), which brought up this question: ?is it just > the source tree for Python-the-language (CPython), or the whole > website (the proverbial kit and kaboodle) that's moving to hg? > > I sought clarification about that just now and learned on good > authority that the website is still in svn. > > My guess is it'll move to hg, but that hasn't happened yet. > > Here's my write-up of last night's, where I fade in and out around > stuff, lots going on in my little world, distracting: > > http://worldgame.blogspot.com/2009/05/ppug-2009512.html > > > > > > Per my many autobiographical blog postings, I came up through the > ranks as an xBase programmer, meaning Visual FoxPro eventually, still > popular in Prague (liking Igal's allusions to Kafka's Castle as Friend > Hyzy went to Prague precisely to study said master, has been one of my > dear correspondents over the years). > > FYI, before FOSS revolution I worked mostly for Greater Portland's > nonprofits using non-Mac solutions, though my organization (EMO/CUE) > had some of the first LaserWriters in town, slaved to PageMaker, and > we had classes for Portland Alliance, Rain Magazine, other proud dirt > worshipers, tree huggers and so on (CUE = Center for Urban Education, > tech support for NGOs, well before Free Geek's CollabTech experiment). > > My move to Python was in connection with geometry research, testing > the waters in a few other languages along the way (starting with Fox) > before finding this pool of deep talent and true wonders: > > http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/oop.html ?(my transition from FoxPro to > Python, in multiple chapters) > http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/oopalgebra.html (lets make "dot > notation" part of everyday math) > http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/pyqvectors.html (yes, there's an > article on "quadrays" in FoxPro Advisor -- collectors' edition?) > > I could give a more in-depth talk on this stuff sometime if people > wanna do mathy stuff (seems we're pretty heavy into CS already, so why > not?). > > What I'd say my day job is about these days is trying to get nuns and > pirates (FOSS bosses) into the same room for cordial conversations > with an eye to doing some business together. ?Have to work against > stereotypes. > > Takes HR skills I maybe don't have, so I outsource to others in that > department sometimes, e.g. Mosaic Consulting has helped with Sisters > of Providence work etc.. > > On the geometry front, I was first web wrangler for Buckminster Fuller > Insitute, was promoting his stuff around Portland before Python was a > glimmer in our benevolent dicator's eye, even wound up in the > Oregonian a couple times, as a "local futurist" (sounds pretty retro), > here's a link to one of those articles, minus the picture which I've > mislaid someplace: > > http://coffeeshopsnet.blogspot.com/2009/02/in-news.html ?(no, Portland > didn't go with any stadium style global projection either, but this > was before Google Earth or Google Street Views). > > > > More later, thanks again, > > Kirby > 4D > _______________________________________________ > Portland mailing list > Portland at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland > From kirby.urner at gmail.com Thu May 14 02:40:27 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 17:40:27 -0700 Subject: [portland] in followup to May meeting... In-Reply-To: <813046e40905131734s43925120mafff050ed1bf4af6@mail.gmail.com> References: <813046e40905131734s43925120mafff050ed1bf4af6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Oooo, snappy too. :-D Kirby On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:34 PM, michelle rowley wrote: > Kirby, > > "Border Collie" is probably low on my list of preferred pet names, but > thanks for the intended sentiment. ;) > > > Michelle > > On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:19 PM, kirby urner wrote: >> Thx for a great mtg! ?I learned a lot. >> >> >> >> Although I told "border collie" michelle (good at herding!) I'd be >> joining ya'll at Produce Row, when we dispersed to our motor vehicles From kirby.urner at gmail.com Thu May 14 02:57:42 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 17:57:42 -0700 Subject: [portland] in followup to May meeting... In-Reply-To: References: <813046e40905131734s43925120mafff050ed1bf4af6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: PS: more work (as a volunteer) for Python.org was on this edu-sig page, since taken over by Andre Roberge. I just wanted to brag a bit, as his university is on track to becoming one of the greenest anywhere, per this fragment from a few minutes ago: """ > Yes, and this is an usually busy time of the year. > > If any of you guys read French, you might find the following interesting > http://www.usainteanne.ca/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=337:127-million-attribue-a-sainte-anne-pour-ses-projets-denergie-renouvelable&catid=3:nouvelles&Itemid=160 > > > (just found an English link http://www.gregkerrmp.ca/?p=163 ... not as > interesting though ;-) > Hey this is really cool. Means our edu-sig guy is from the greenest university in Canada with Canada already being on the green side in most minds (as in earth friendly (everyone loves Canadians eh?)). If anyone attacks Python Nation for having too big a carbon footprint (like fat-ass VBA), and we'll know what to tell 'em! Kirby """ And now for something completely different (I'm pretty sure I posted this before, too funny): http://mybizmo.blogspot.com/2008/08/crazy-horse-play.html and the spoof: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXJZVZFRFJc OK, back to work everyone, or hit the boss key at least... Kirby ... and yes Michelle, if talking Golden Compass familiars, I'd cast yours as feline trending towards mink, way slinkier than a dog (obviously). Mine's a wolf-horse (on good authority). But given we're all PPUGs, I think we need to put up with a certain amount of stereotyping, better than piggies anyway. On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:40 PM, kirby urner wrote: > Oooo, snappy too. :-D > > Kirby > > > On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:34 PM, michelle rowley wrote: >> Kirby, >> >> "Border Collie" is probably low on my list of preferred pet names, but >> thanks for the intended sentiment. ;) >> >> >> Michelle >> >> On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:19 PM, kirby urner wrote: >>> Thx for a great mtg! ?I learned a lot. >>> >>> >>> >>> Although I told "border collie" michelle (good at herding!) I'd be >>> joining ya'll at Produce Row, when we dispersed to our motor vehicles > From peter at osuosl.org Thu May 14 18:26:59 2009 From: peter at osuosl.org (Peter Krenesky) Date: Thu, 14 May 2009 09:26:59 -0700 Subject: [portland] FiftyStates Codesprint @ OSBridge Message-ID: <4A0C4653.5060005@osuosl.org> Hi Everyone, The OSU Open Source Lab is organizing a codesprint for the FiftyStates Project to take place the Open Source Bridge conference. FiftyStates is a project from Sunlight Labs the coding group from the Sunlight Foundation. FiftyStates is a system that parses and makes available legislative data from all 50 states. This is a statelevel version of the OpenCongress.org project that provides details on federal legislation. SunlightLabs has been having code sprints around the country and has legislations parsers for over half the states already, but theres still a lot of work to do. We think this is a great project and hope you'll join us in helping them out. What : FiftyStates Codesprint @ Open Source Bridge When : June 17-19 Where (Hacker Lounge): Hilton Portland & Executive Tower 921 SW Sixth Avenue Portland, Oregon Where (conference): Oregon Convention Center For more info: http://blogs.osuosl.org/kreneskyp/2009/05/08/hackathon-open-source-bridge/ http://upcoming.yahoo.com/event/2677280/ -Peter From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sat May 23 01:20:54 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 16:20:54 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... Message-ID: I put my own spin on it in my blog (feel free to ignore), but if you click through on "real estate issue" you'll get a first person account from CS management. http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/05/usb-to-kill-cubespace.html Just when Portland was about to unleash a "FOSS Renaissance" eh? Leave it to imaginative (not!) middle managers to misread the tea leaves. Kirby From python at dylanreinhardt.com Sat May 23 01:54:20 2009 From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 16:54:20 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4c645a720905221654v60acba42gc48584f79a82f679@mail.gmail.com> Sad as this is, it seems a bit much to paint this as a failure of vision on Portland's part... or even a failure of management on US Bank's part. If you take the management of your organization seriously, you *must* pay the rent. Banks and commercial landlords are not interested in hearing that you'd rather pay for your staff to have health care, virtuous as that choice may seem. I really hope CS finds a way to pull through, but let's not flagellate the whole town or the banking industry if they don't. Lots of people are struggling right now and though CS is special, their situation is far from unique. $.02 On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 4:20 PM, kirby urner wrote: > I put my own spin on it in my blog (feel free to ignore), but if you > click through on "real estate issue" you'll get a first person account > from CS management. > > http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/05/usb-to-kill-cubespace.html > > Just when Portland was about to unleash a "FOSS Renaissance" eh? > > Leave it to imaginative (not!) middle managers to misread the tea leaves. > > Kirby > _______________________________________________ > Portland mailing list > Portland at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sat May 23 02:18:06 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 17:18:06 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: <4c645a720905221654v60acba42gc48584f79a82f679@mail.gmail.com> References: <4c645a720905221654v60acba42gc48584f79a82f679@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 4:54 PM, Dylan Reinhardt wrote: > Sad as this is, it seems a bit much to paint this as a failure of vision on > Portland's part... or even a failure of management on US Bank's part. ?If > you take the management of your organization seriously, you *must* pay the > rent. ?Banks and commercial landlords are not interested in hearing that > you'd rather pay for your staff to have health care, virtuous as that choice > may seem. The thing is banks are supposed to be more than just additional commercial landlords who mindlessly collect rent but do nothing to trail-blaze new business opportunities that actually help generate those incomes needed to pay that rent. I'm not persuaded USB has done all it might do to rub two sticks together, think of synergies on its own, based on all that back office analysis they supposedly pay people to undertake. Anyway, that's why we have bankers as distinct from landlords, in terms of social role. But "investment bankers" may be a scarce resource in Portland, I don't know. The only investment banker I personally know (worked for JPMorgan last I heard): Peter Jaeger aka "Yago" speaks fluent Japanese (a Brooklyn native). Impressive guy. Re my blogged excoriation of powers that be, I added a more constructive link to my Javascript Admirers idea that we give paying user groups and their attenders a higher profile in the form of pixels at the Cubespace site. That's a prestige address in some ways, a natural asset, could be leveraged. I also used the "F word" ("franchise") somewhere given I'm monitoring a national surge to form cubespace bevies identical to pdxCS in many ways. A management with overview could leverage the many advantages of comparing notes between branches (closed source people do that too (smile)). Might mean an overseas buyer. I should contact my friend... Kirby > > I really hope CS finds a way to pull through, but let's not flagellate the > whole town or the banking industry if they don't. ?Lots of people are > struggling right now and though CS is special, their situation is far from > unique. > > $.02 > > > > On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 4:20 PM, kirby urner wrote: > >> I put my own spin on it in my blog (feel free to ignore), but if you >> click through on "real estate issue" you'll get a first person account >> from CS management. >> >> http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/05/usb-to-kill-cubespace.html >> >> Just when Portland was about to unleash a "FOSS Renaissance" eh? >> >> Leave it to imaginative (not!) middle managers to misread the tea leaves. >> >> Kirby >> _______________________________________________ >> Portland mailing list >> Portland at python.org >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland >> > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > _______________________________________________ > Portland mailing list > Portland at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland > From python at dylanreinhardt.com Sat May 23 02:42:01 2009 From: python at dylanreinhardt.com (Dylan Reinhardt) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 17:42:01 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: References: <4c645a720905221654v60acba42gc48584f79a82f679@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4c645a720905221742t2b5944ceh7f8c08dba7a34d63@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 5:18 PM, kirby urner wrote: > The thing is banks are supposed to be more than just additional > commercial landlords who mindlessly collect rent but do nothing to > trail-blaze new business opportunities that actually help generate > those incomes needed to pay that rent. Whether your landlord is a bank or your buddy Dave down the street, you have to pay the rent. Failing to pay people (even banks) what you owe them is neither a sustainable nor a particularly moral business model. A bank's role isn't to blaze business opportunities per se, but to make capital available to those who have the vision and energy to give it a try. Part of keeping that capital available for new projects involves collecting payments from old projects. By court order, if necessary. Not every good idea for an organization succeeds as an actual organization. Cube Space may still be an excellent idea, even if this particular execution does not survive. Blaming banks is not going to help us learn how to do it better next time. For what that's worth... Dylan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sat May 23 02:58:47 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 17:58:47 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: <4c645a720905221742t2b5944ceh7f8c08dba7a34d63@mail.gmail.com> References: <4c645a720905221654v60acba42gc48584f79a82f679@mail.gmail.com> <4c645a720905221742t2b5944ceh7f8c08dba7a34d63@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 5:42 PM, Dylan Reinhardt wrote: > On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 5:18 PM, kirby urner wrote: > >> The thing is banks are supposed to be more than just additional >> commercial landlords who mindlessly collect rent but do nothing to >> trail-blaze new business opportunities that actually help generate >> those incomes needed to pay that rent. > > > Whether your landlord is a bank or your buddy Dave down the street, you have > to pay the rent. ?Failing to pay people (even banks) what you owe them is > neither a sustainable nor a particularly moral business model. > Yeah, not disputing that. Same problem at LEP High, not having the rent. Whether Cleveland is paying rent on that giant building on Powell's I don't know, but LEP High was forced into the expensive real estate market, found that place on 20th & SE Burnside, has a landlord, even though it's a public school trying to operate in service of Portland's enterprising teenagers. State law makes it easy to intercept any funding for charters and divert it to older charters (e.g. Cleveland -- which has a charter too, just an older one). My daughter is at Cleveland by the way, and I bank at US Bank, so it's not like I'm not putting money where my mouth is here (taught Python at LEP High for Koreducators...). Anyway, I digress, just adding logs to the fire that Portland has some kind of "death wish" when it comes to killing off its most imaginative institutions. Possibly not fatal though. > A bank's role isn't to blaze business opportunities per se, but to make > capital available to those who have the vision and energy to give it a try. > Part of keeping that capital available for new projects involves collecting > payments from old projects. ?By court order, if necessary. > There are many interpretations of a bank's role, my family's involvement going back to Cairo where the game was to know something about the business and to provide a modicum of advice (this was micro-lending, also practiced in Dhaka, also home to Grameen -- even found a booth at OSCON about this kind of banking, though few noticed it). A large bank with broader experience gets to learn things about who does business with whom and maybe nudges client X to meet with client Y whereas maybe they'd not have met on their own in a million years, owing to being five blocks apart. US Bank sees who pays me, where my checks come from. That's privileged information they get in exchange for holding my money. Multiply that 1000x and you see where astute back office speculators might see lights go on, from connecting the dots. At least that's my understanding of how some banking works, correct me if I'm wrong maybe. It's not just like being a rent or tax collector. > Not every good idea for an organization succeeds as an actual organization. > Cube Space may still be an excellent idea, even if this particular execution > does not survive. ?Blaming banks is not going to help us learn how to do it > better next time. > > For what that's worth... > > Dylan I'm inclined to blame the banks, I admit it. Runs in the family. Kirby > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > _______________________________________________ > Portland mailing list > Portland at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland > From markgross at thegnar.org Sat May 23 01:55:46 2009 From: markgross at thegnar.org (mgross) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 16:55:46 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090522235546.GA11407@thegnar.org> My reading the cubespace open letter makes me guess that USB is looking for an out from the 15 year lease, and using missed payments as an excuse. Its really too bad and I hope they get a break. --mgross On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 04:20:54PM -0700, kirby urner wrote: > I put my own spin on it in my blog (feel free to ignore), but if you > click through on "real estate issue" you'll get a first person account > from CS management. > > http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/05/usb-to-kill-cubespace.html > > Just when Portland was about to unleash a "FOSS Renaissance" eh? > > Leave it to imaginative (not!) middle managers to misread the tea leaves. > > Kirby > _______________________________________________ > Portland mailing list > Portland at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From jd at commandprompt.com Sat May 23 03:14:39 2009 From: jd at commandprompt.com (Joshua D. Drake) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 18:14:39 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9b42e0bdeec39af56f4222d29d125977@commandprompt.com> On Fri, 22 May 2009 16:20:54 -0700, kirby urner wrote: > I put my own spin on it in my blog (feel free to ignore), but if you > click through on "real estate issue" you'll get a first person account > from CS management. > > http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/05/usb-to-kill-cubespace.html > > Just when Portland was about to unleash a "FOSS Renaissance" eh? > > Leave it to imaginative (not!) middle managers to misread the tea leaves. You either pay the bills or you don't. It is really that simple. Is it unfortunate that they are going down? Of course. It doesn't change the reality. Besides you could always just use the local library. Joshua D. Drake -- PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake(at)jabber(dot)postgresql(dot)org Consulting, Development, Support, Training 503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/ The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997 From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sat May 23 03:55:37 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 18:55:37 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: <9b42e0bdeec39af56f4222d29d125977@commandprompt.com> References: <9b42e0bdeec39af56f4222d29d125977@commandprompt.com> Message-ID: On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 6:14 PM, Joshua D. Drake wrote: > On Fri, 22 May 2009 16:20:54 -0700, kirby urner > wrote: >> I put my own spin on it in my blog (feel free to ignore), but if you >> click through on "real estate issue" you'll get a first person account >> from CS management. >> >> http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2009/05/usb-to-kill-cubespace.html >> >> Just when Portland was about to unleash a "FOSS Renaissance" eh? >> >> Leave it to imaginative (not!) middle managers to misread the tea leaves. > > You either pay the bills or you don't. It is really that simple. > Is it unfortunate that they are going down? Of course. It doesn't change > the reality. > Still kind of ironic, given coworker movement is gallivanting across the nation, e.g. NYT: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/17/jobs/17pre.html?_r=1&8dpc)? > Besides you could always just use the local library. > Yeah, I do that too, lost a book on Pascal's Triangle though, so I'm afraid to go. PPUG leadership needs to find new digs soon maybe. Belmont branch has a meeting room. Kirby > Joshua D. Drake > > -- > PostgreSQL - XMPP: jdrake(at)jabber(dot)postgresql(dot)org > ? Consulting, Development, Support, Training > ? 503-667-4564 - http://www.commandprompt.com/ > ? The PostgreSQL Company, serving since 1997 From jeff at taupro.com Sat May 23 04:22:55 2009 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 21:22:55 -0500 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: References: <9b42e0bdeec39af56f4222d29d125977@commandprompt.com> Message-ID: <4A175DFF.80903@taupro.com> kirby urner wrote: > On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 6:14 PM, Joshua D. Drake wrote: >> >> You either pay the bills or you don't. It is really that simple. >> Is it unfortunate that they are going down? Of course. It doesn't change >> the reality. Pricing for something like rent isn't really that black and white. The price is a fabrication between the renter and the landlord, based on many assumptions. It's not like buying a commodity at a store. And there are significant legal/opportunity costs to changing out tenants that might dwarf the amount they would lose through re-negotiating a few months of rent in good faith. They know the economy is tight and it is very unlikely there is another tenant ready to move in at equal or higher rent. There's a place near me, a former very popular restaurant hooked into community activities (Lions club, Rotary club, etc.) and a breakfast/lunch meeting place for business dealings for years. The landlord wanted to double their rent. The tenant sought something more reasonable and the landlord would not budge. The place was vacated, then left derelict for four years. It got run-down and eventually had to be ripped out and rebuilt, where it sat empty for another two years. It just got rented this month (hence why it's on my mind). Silly landlord lost tons of money playing hardball and the restaurant owner left the business altogether. > Still kind of ironic, given coworker movement is gallivanting across > the nation, e.g. NYT: > http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/17/jobs/17pre.html?_r=1&8dpc)? > >> Besides you could always just use the local library. Not quite - the value of coworking is not just having a place to sit and surf, but benefiting from the synergy of mingling with others with great ideas. A coworking place opened up on Wednesday of this week very close to me. Several of us in the Dallas Python usergroup took a tour, for potentially holding meetings there. While I have a nice office at home, I am tempted to join the coworker facility because there are people of different backgrounds whom I would enjoy working with. The place is owned by an AI company in the building and they are looking to open up their tech to others and explore spin-off opportunities that use it. There are also several graphic artists and marketing advisers joining and I could use some informal time with them around the ping-pong table or water cooler. http://companydallas.com/ I am seeing what Kirby is seeing though, a growing swell in the existence coworking facilities. Another one opened in Dallas two months ago, http://cohabitat.us/ and one in Austin http://www.conjunctured.com/. I'm not yet sure what forces are driving the trend though. -Jeff From kirby.urner at gmail.com Sat May 23 05:35:58 2009 From: kirby.urner at gmail.com (kirby urner) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 20:35:58 -0700 Subject: [portland] Cubespace to close unless buyer found... In-Reply-To: <4A175DFF.80903@taupro.com> References: <9b42e0bdeec39af56f4222d29d125977@commandprompt.com> <4A175DFF.80903@taupro.com> Message-ID: On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 7:22 PM, Jeff Rush wrote: << SNIP >> > Not quite - the value of coworking is not just having a place to sit and surf, > but benefiting from the synergy of mingling with others with great ideas. ?A > coworking place opened up on Wednesday of this week very close to me. ?Several > of us in the Dallas Python usergroup took a tour, for potentially holding > meetings there. ?While I have a nice office at home, I am tempted to join the > coworker facility because there are people of different backgrounds whom I > would enjoy working with. ?The place is owned by an AI company in the building > and they are looking to open up their tech to others and explore spin-off > opportunities that use it. ?There are also several graphic artists and > marketing advisers joining and I could use some informal time with them around > the ping-pong table or water cooler. ?http://companydallas.com/ > Yeah, was just reading about that... """ I meant to write something to let you guys know, but well, I was just a tad busy. Yesterday was our first day, and to kick off we did a coworking open house as well as kicked off SemWebDallas, a monthly semantic web meetup we plan to host. Response was great I think. Had 14 people through, with our first members signing on. We were also contacted by Andy Louis-Charles about doing his new "On Coworking" podcast which should be posted up at www.cosociety.com sometime today. Matthew Titsworth """ Sounds a lot like us (we do SemWeb stuff sometimes). I'm thinking Cubespace helps Portland walk its talk about being a FOSS capital (Christian Science Monitor 2005), not that everyone here relishes that reputation, but some of us do (helps attracts capital some would argue, creates jobs). Seemed kinda cool to have a bank building, good marketing for US Bank (they should factor that in?). http://www.flickr.com/photos/17157315 at N00/3535505506/ (example: FOSS boss Michelle as US Bank poster child ) Economists used to teach about "good will" and my friend Patrick will talk for hours about "brand loyalty" as a company's most precious possession in some cases (works for Synovate, office @ Linus Pauling House owned by ISEPP -- a possible buyer?). http://www.flickr.com/photos/17157315 at N00/3512645949/ (another Silicon Forest HQS) It's gonna be embarrassing when OS Bridge roles around and these out-of-towners, boning up on Portland lore, discovering Free Geek etc., ask "so, where's this famous CubeSpace we've been hearing about" and we're like "uh, duh, we closed it". Oh well... hey, you think Microsoft wants in? Might help with its image, and they already sponsor Barcamps... maybe buy the whole building? Anyway, good conversation, lots of food for thought. Good hearing from ya Jeff, still mulling over your eduPycon idea with Vern and such, the usual edu-sig threads (Andre to upgrade our page sometime soon). Kirby > I am seeing what Kirby is seeing though, a growing swell in the existence > coworking facilities. ?Another one opened in Dallas two months ago, > http://cohabitat.us/ and one in Austin http://www.conjunctured.com/. ?I'm not > yet sure what forces are driving the trend though. > > -Jeff > > _______________________________________________ > Portland mailing list > Portland at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/portland > From freyley at gmail.com Sat May 23 03:44:59 2009 From: freyley at gmail.com (Jeff Schwaber) Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 18:44:59 -0700 Subject: [portland] CubeSpace donations Message-ID: <8db4a1910905221844l32355e78pafde8cba466bd47f@mail.gmail.com> For those who think CubeSpace has provided a significant benefit to the community, you may want to donate something back to them to help out. There's a website some folks set up for that: http://savecubespacepdx.com/ You can probably also donate in person. Jeff -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From michael at susens-schurter.com Wed May 27 23:24:39 2009 From: michael at susens-schurter.com (Michael Schurter) Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 14:24:39 -0700 Subject: [portland] TurboGears 2 Talk? Message-ID: <240b71640905271424y20867a3fqc948c078cb8cc0b3@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, Just saw Mark Ramm post the TG2 is out: http://compoundthinking.com/blog/index.php/2009/05/27/639/ I'd love to hear a talk from a TG fan about it. As a Django and yet-another-custom-web-framework user, TG intrigues me, but I don't exactly understand its appeal vs. Django or a more DIY solution. Thanks, Michael Schurter (schmichael on twitter & irc)