From Richard at Damon-Family.org  Sat Mar  1 03:21:45 2014
From: Richard at Damon-Family.org (Richard Damon)
Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2014 21:21:45 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman list questions about password and
 bounces-back for invalid emails
In-Reply-To: <20140228172109.GY10820@hendricks.amyl.org.uk>
References: <530F8BA1.6010403@sky-ip.org> <5310B52A.10608@att.net>
 <20140228172109.GY10820@hendricks.amyl.org.uk>
Message-ID: <53114439.2060603@Damon-Family.org>

On 2/28/14, 12:21 PM, Adam McGreggor wrote:
> On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 10:11:22AM -0600, Barry S. Finkel wrote:
>> As for passwords, I disabled the monthly password reminders.
>> Many of my lists were auto-subscribe lists (from HR), and the
>> subscriber almost never needed his/her password.  I do not remember
>> a case where a subscriber needed assistance with a list password.
> +1. 
>
> When setting up a new Mailman (2) instance, one of the things I do
> is to remove that line from the crontab.
>
> If users want a password reset, they can trigger it themselves. I've
> never known anyone to think "oh, I had a mail on the 1st, I'll check
> that?".
>
Where I find it very useful is when subscribers forget what address they
are subscribed with. Now and then someone forgets that they have a
forwarding going on, or that their mail server changed its name (but
still takes email from the old domain). This might have happened a while
in the past, but just now they are needing to log into the option page
or trying to post. Being able to refer them to the monthly subscription
reminder is very helpful for this. If it is just a domain change, I can
usually find the old address in the members list, but if someone set up
a forwarding for them that they forgot about, it isn't so easy.

-- 
Richard Damon


From jim at wrightthisway.com  Mon Mar  3 01:07:14 2014
From: jim at wrightthisway.com (Jim Wright)
Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2014 18:07:14 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman on OS X, launchctl
Message-ID: <2682DF44-432C-466B-825B-FCD2B3714389@wrightthisway.com>

I've been lurking on this list for a few years now, and have been running Mailman 2.1.14 for a few years here.  I have no idea what install tips I may have followed originally, but Mailman is generally working fine.  The issue I'm running into is that Mailman needs to be restarted periodically, usually where I notice this is that at the beginning of the month Mailman doesn't send out it's usual monthly reminder.  I only have 1 very low volume mailing list, so this is usually the first clue that it has stopped.

I have several LaunchDaemons set up to perform various functions at various intervals, but like I said I'm not sure what steps I originally followed when setting this up, if I created these from scratch, etc.  So, basically, I'm looking for help from any other OS X users that might have a working set of launchctl files that I could leverage, I'm currently running OS X 10.7.5 (non-Server) on the mail server.

Thanks!

From lstone19 at stonejongleux.com  Mon Mar  3 05:32:42 2014
From: lstone19 at stonejongleux.com (Larry Stone)
Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2014 22:32:42 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman on OS X, launchctl
In-Reply-To: <2682DF44-432C-466B-825B-FCD2B3714389@wrightthisway.com>
References: <2682DF44-432C-466B-825B-FCD2B3714389@wrightthisway.com>
Message-ID: <F36C501F-EB91-492D-8386-D3423967A875@stonejongleux.com>


On Mar 2, 2014, at 6:07 PM, Jim Wright <jim at wrightthisway.com> wrote:

> I've been lurking on this list for a few years now, and have been running Mailman 2.1.14 for a few years here.  I have no idea what install tips I may have followed originally, but Mailman is generally working fine.  The issue I'm running into is that Mailman needs to be restarted periodically, usually where I notice this is that at the beginning of the month Mailman doesn't send out it's usual monthly reminder.  I only have 1 very low volume mailing list, so this is usually the first clue that it has stopped.
> 
> I have several LaunchDaemons set up to perform various functions at various intervals, but like I said I'm not sure what steps I originally followed when setting this up, if I created these from scratch, etc.  So, basically, I'm looking for help from any other OS X users that might have a working set of launchctl files that I could leverage, I'm currently running OS X 10.7.5 (non-Server) on the mail server.


I think the real question you have to answer is why it needs to be restarted. I run Mailman on OS X (client) but am on the current Mavericks (10.9.2). My launchctl plist merely starts Mailman at boot (mailmanctl -s start) and exits (RunAtLoad true). It does not monitor and restart it and I do not have a problem with Mailman dying on me (but if it does, I have an hourly cron job that checks to make sure what should be running (more than just Mailman) is running. Rarely does it catch something). 

Unfortunately, as I understand it (I am not a launchd expert), launchd expects any program it starts to keep running. Programs that are started with a command that starts the daemon and then exit (such as Mailman?s mailmanctl command) do not fit the launchd model. In a normal launchd environment where it?s told to keep a program running with KeepAlive, it would see mailmanctl exit and restart it - obviously not what we want with Mailman. Since the command it is running is mailmanctl, it has not idea of what other processes start as a result so has no way to monitor them.

-- 
Larry Stone
lstone19 at stonejongleux.com
http://www.stonejongleux.com/




From dikim at cs.indiana.edu  Mon Mar  3 22:25:26 2014
From: dikim at cs.indiana.edu (DongInn Kim)
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 16:25:26 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
Message-ID: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>

Hi,

Is there a way to send a mail after it is archived and then add the archive link to the new mail?

Currently it seems to be pretty difficult to implement this because all the new mails are delivered first and then mail archives are generated.

As long as I know how mailman sends a mail, I think I can play a little bit further.

Can anyone please help me out?

Regards,

--
- DongInn




From joemailgroups at gmail.com  Mon Mar  3 22:32:22 2014
From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 13:32:22 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can discarded message be restored and reposted to
	mailing list ?
Message-ID: <C1EF8EF0-F61A-48AC-AA86-D6FAFBB6645F@gmail.com>

Hi, everyone.

I accidentally discarded a message that was held for moderation and I meant to accept it.

Is there a way to restore this message (perhaps from archives) ?

Thank you in advance,

Joe.

From bsfinkel at att.net  Mon Mar  3 22:51:19 2014
From: bsfinkel at att.net (Barry S. Finkel)
Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2014 15:51:19 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
Message-ID: <5314F957.3060209@att.net>

On 3/3/2014 3:25 PM, DongInn Kim wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Is there a way to send a mail after it is archived and then add the archive link to the new mail?
>
> Currently it seems to be pretty difficult to implement this because all the new mails are delivered first and then mail archives are generated.
>
> As long as I know how mailman sends a mail, I think I can play a little bit further.
>
> Can anyone please help me out?
>
> Regards,
>
> --
> - DongInn


It is unclear to me exactly what you want to do.  If the list has
an archive, then after the posting is processed, that posting
appears in the archives, where people can search and view the
posting (assuming that they present the correct credentials,
if required).

Once a mail message has been sent and it is in the archives, then
any subsequent mail message can include the URL to the archived
message as a reference.

--Barry Finkel

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Mar  4 01:28:26 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2014 16:28:26 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can discarded message be restored and reposted
 to mailing list ?
In-Reply-To: <C1EF8EF0-F61A-48AC-AA86-D6FAFBB6645F@gmail.com>
References: <C1EF8EF0-F61A-48AC-AA86-D6FAFBB6645F@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <53151E2A.7000503@msapiro.net>

On 03/03/2014 01:32 PM, Joe wrote:
> 
> I accidentally discarded a message that was held for moderation and I meant to accept it.
> 
> Is there a way to restore this message (perhaps from archives) ?


Sorry, no, unless you happened to do a backup that included Mailman's
data/ directory during the period that the message was held.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From dikim at cs.indiana.edu  Tue Mar  4 01:46:13 2014
From: dikim at cs.indiana.edu (DongInn Kim)
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 19:46:13 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
Message-ID: <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>

Can anyone please help me to debug the syntax error in mm_cfg.py?

ompi_list = [ 'test-crest', 'osl-test' ]
if listname in ompi_list:
    archive_url = ("http://www.open-mpi.org/community/lists/devel/%s/date.php" % (time.strftime("%Y/%m")))
    DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER = """_______________________________________________
%(real_name)s mailing list
%(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
subscribe: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s
searchable archives: %(archive_url)s
"""  % { 'archive_url' : archive_url }


What I wanted here is to apply the new DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER only for the specific mailing lists.
Is there something wrong here? 

Regards,

--
- DongInn



On Mar 3, 2014, at 4:59 PM, DongInn Kim <dikim at cs.indiana.edu> wrote:

> Hi Barry,
> 
> Yes, that is the normal case. We have used it that way so far.
> Lately we found that it could be useful if a new mail has a link of the new archive at the bottom of message and it seems to be tricky to implement it because the process order is the opposite.
> 
> Don?t you see any benefits of doing this?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> --
> - DongInn
> 
> 
> 
> On Mar 3, 2014, at 4:51 PM, Barry S. Finkel <bsfinkel at att.net> wrote:
> 
>> On 3/3/2014 3:25 PM, DongInn Kim wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Is there a way to send a mail after it is archived and then add the archive link to the new mail?
>>> 
>>> Currently it seems to be pretty difficult to implement this because all the new mails are delivered first and then mail archives are generated.
>>> 
>>> As long as I know how mailman sends a mail, I think I can play a little bit further.
>>> 
>>> Can anyone please help me out?
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> --
>>> - DongInn
>> 
>> 
>> It is unclear to me exactly what you want to do.  If the list has
>> an archive, then after the posting is processed, that posting
>> appears in the archives, where people can search and view the
>> posting (assuming that they present the correct credentials,
>> if required).
>> 
>> Once a mail message has been sent and it is in the archives, then
>> any subsequent mail message can include the URL to the archived
>> message as a reference.
>> 
>> --Barry Finkel
>> ------------------------------------------------------
>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
>> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/dikim%40cs.indiana.edu
> 


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Mar  4 01:58:07 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2014 16:58:07 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
Message-ID: <5315251F.9090303@msapiro.net>

On 03/03/2014 01:25 PM, DongInn Kim wrote:
> 
> Is there a way to send a mail after it is archived and then add the archive link to the new mail?


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/RAKJ> for a way to invoke some
process on a message after it is archived. This process could send an
email message in various ways. If you wanted it to send a message to the
list membership, you could create a pipeline attribute in the messages
metadata consisting of something like

    [
    'CalcRecips',
    'AvoidDuplicates',
    'ToOutgoing',
    ]

and queue the resultant message for IncomingRunner.

See Mailman's scripts/post and Mailman/Queue/Switchboard.py for hints as
to how to do this.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From pshute at nuw.org.au  Tue Mar  4 02:14:38 2014
From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute)
Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2014 12:14:38 +1100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can discarded message be restored and reposted
 to mailing list ?
In-Reply-To: <53151E2A.7000503@msapiro.net>
References: <C1EF8EF0-F61A-48AC-AA86-D6FAFBB6645F@gmail.com>
 <53151E2A.7000503@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B352F@nuwvicms1>

When this happens to us, we normally either ask the sender to send it again, or we forward the copy in the moderator alert email ourselves.

Peter Shute 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mailman-Users 
> [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+pshute=nuw.org.au at python.org] 
> On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro
> Sent: Tuesday, 4 March 2014 11:28 AM
> To: mailman-users at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Can discarded message be 
> restored and reposted to mailing list ?
> 
> On 03/03/2014 01:32 PM, Joe wrote:
> > 
> > I accidentally discarded a message that was held for 
> moderation and I meant to accept it.
> > 
> > Is there a way to restore this message (perhaps from archives) ?
> 
> 
> Sorry, no, unless you happened to do a backup that included 
> Mailman's data/ directory during the period that the message was held.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: 
> http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: 
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/pshute%4
0nuw.org.au
> 

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Mar  4 02:14:55 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2014 17:14:55 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
Message-ID: <5315290F.6030702@msapiro.net>

On 03/03/2014 04:46 PM, DongInn Kim wrote:
> Can anyone please help me to debug the syntax error in mm_cfg.py?
> 
> ompi_list = [ 'test-crest', 'osl-test' ]
> if listname in ompi_list:
>     archive_url = ("http://www.open-mpi.org/community/lists/devel/%s/date.php" % (time.strftime("%Y/%m")))
>     DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER = """_______________________________________________
> %(real_name)s mailing list
> %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
> subscribe: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s
> searchable archives: %(archive_url)s
> """  % { 'archive_url' : archive_url }
> 
> 
> What I wanted here is to apply the new DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER only for the specific mailing lists.
> Is there something wrong here? 


There are several thinks wrong. At the time mm_cfg.py is imported, the
name listname is not defined. This is your syntax error, but beyond
that, you have a huge misunderstanding of how to go about what you are
trying to do.

DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER only establishes the default value for a newly
created list. What you want is to set the msg_footer attribute for the
'test-crest' and 'osl-test' lists to something like:

"""_______________________________________________
%(real_name)s mailing list
%(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
subscribe: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s
searchable archives:
http://www.open-mpi.org/community/lists/devel/%(time)s/date.php
"""

And then modify Mailman/Handlers/Decorate.py to import time and augment
the replacement dictionary by adding {'time': time.strftime("%Y/%m")}.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From dikim at cs.indiana.edu  Tue Mar  4 02:29:52 2014
From: dikim at cs.indiana.edu (DongInn Kim)
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 20:29:52 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <5315290F.6030702@msapiro.net>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5315290F.6030702@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <DC546B2A-C361-4467-9E56-35286C7D3BF7@cs.indiana.edu>

Hi Mark,

Thanks for all your help but I still have a problem with updating foot_msg attribute.

[root at lion Mailman]# grep -n10 time Handlers/Decorate.py
11-# GNU General Public License for more details.
12-#
13-# You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
14-# along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software
15-# Foundation, Inc., 51 Franklin Street, Fifth Floor, Boston, MA 02110-1301,
16-# USA.
17-
18-"""Decorate a message by sticking the header and footer around it."""
19-
20-import re
21:import time
22-
23-from types import ListType
24-from email.MIMEText import MIMEText
25-
26-from Mailman import mm_cfg
27-from Mailman import Utils
28-from Mailman import Errors
29-from Mailman.Message import Message
30-from Mailman.i18n import _
31-from Mailman.SafeDict import SafeDict
--
221-    # blacklist of known bad ones.
222-    d = SafeDict({'real_name'     : mlist.real_name,
223-                  'list_name'     : mlist.internal_name(),
224-                  # For backwards compatibility
225-                  '_internal_name': mlist.internal_name(),
226-                  'host_name'     : mlist.host_name,
227-                  'web_page_url'  : mlist.web_page_url,
228-                  'description'   : mlist.description,
229-                  'info'          : mlist.info,
230-                  'cgiext'        : mm_cfg.CGIEXT,
231:                  'time'          : time.strftime("%Y/%m"),
232-                  })
233-    if extradict is not None:
234-        d.update(extradict)
235-    # Using $-strings?
236-    if getattr(mlist, 'use_dollar_strings', 0):
237-        template = Utils.to_percent(template)
238-    # Interpolate into the template
239-    try:
240-        text = re.sub(r'(?m)(?<!^--) +(?=\n)', '',
241-                      re.sub(r'\r\n', r'\n', template % d))

I added the ?time? variable to the ?d? dictionary in Handlers/Decorate.py as you mentioned but I got the following error:
"Warning: The following illegal substitution variables were found in the msg_footer string: time
Your list may not operate properly until you correct this problem. "

Is there anything wrong with this?

Regards,

--
- DongInn



On Mar 3, 2014, at 8:14 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:

> On 03/03/2014 04:46 PM, DongInn Kim wrote:
>> Can anyone please help me to debug the syntax error in mm_cfg.py?
>> 
>> ompi_list = [ 'test-crest', 'osl-test' ]
>> if listname in ompi_list:
>>    archive_url = ("http://www.open-mpi.org/community/lists/devel/%s/date.php" % (time.strftime("%Y/%m")))
>>    DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER = """_______________________________________________
>> %(real_name)s mailing list
>> %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
>> subscribe: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s
>> searchable archives: %(archive_url)s
>> """  % { 'archive_url' : archive_url }
>> 
>> 
>> What I wanted here is to apply the new DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER only for the specific mailing lists.
>> Is there something wrong here? 
> 
> 
> There are several thinks wrong. At the time mm_cfg.py is imported, the
> name listname is not defined. This is your syntax error, but beyond
> that, you have a huge misunderstanding of how to go about what you are
> trying to do.
> 
> DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER only establishes the default value for a newly
> created list. What you want is to set the msg_footer attribute for the
> 'test-crest' and 'osl-test' lists to something like:
> 
> """_______________________________________________
> %(real_name)s mailing list
> %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
> subscribe: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s
> searchable archives:
> http://www.open-mpi.org/community/lists/devel/%(time)s/date.php
> """
> 
> And then modify Mailman/Handlers/Decorate.py to import time and augment
> the replacement dictionary by adding {'time': time.strftime("%Y/%m")}.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/dikim%40cs.indiana.edu


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Mar  4 03:17:59 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2014 18:17:59 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <DC546B2A-C361-4467-9E56-35286C7D3BF7@cs.indiana.edu>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5315290F.6030702@msapiro.net>
 <DC546B2A-C361-4467-9E56-35286C7D3BF7@cs.indiana.edu>
Message-ID: <531537D7.9040602@msapiro.net>

On 03/03/2014 05:29 PM, DongInn Kim wrote:
> 
> I added the ?time? variable to the ?d? dictionary in
> Handlers/Decorate.py as you mentioned but I got the following error:
> "Warning: The following illegal substitution variables were found in
> the msg_footer string: time
> Your list may not operate properly until you correct this problem. "


Did you restart Mailman after modifying Decorate.py?. If so, the
substitution should work despite the warning. If you want to get rid of
the warning, you can add 'time' to the ALLOWEDS tuple in
Mailman/Gui/Digest.py, but it should work anyway.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From dikim at cs.indiana.edu  Tue Mar  4 03:26:22 2014
From: dikim at cs.indiana.edu (DongInn Kim)
Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 21:26:22 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <531537D7.9040602@msapiro.net>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5315290F.6030702@msapiro.net>
 <DC546B2A-C361-4467-9E56-35286C7D3BF7@cs.indiana.edu>
 <531537D7.9040602@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <85AF1410-55B0-4CF4-9994-131A3539A4A7@cs.indiana.edu>

Yes, I already restarted mailman when I got the warning message but it did not help.
Thanks, your help on Mailman/Gui/Digest.py removed the warning message.
The footer message shows up as expected. Thank you again.

Regards,

--
- DongInn



On Mar 3, 2014, at 9:17 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:

> On 03/03/2014 05:29 PM, DongInn Kim wrote:
>> 
>> I added the ?time? variable to the ?d? dictionary in
>> Handlers/Decorate.py as you mentioned but I got the following error:
>> "Warning: The following illegal substitution variables were found in
>> the msg_footer string: time
>> Your list may not operate properly until you correct this problem. "
> 
> 
> Did you restart Mailman after modifying Decorate.py?. If so, the
> substitution should work despite the warning. If you want to get rid of
> the warning, you can add 'time' to the ALLOWEDS tuple in
> Mailman/Gui/Digest.py, but it should work anyway.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From stephen at xemacs.org  Tue Mar  4 12:36:39 2014
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2014 20:36:39 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
Message-ID: <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

DongInn Kim writes:

 > Can anyone please help me to debug the syntax error in mm_cfg.py?
 > 
 > ompi_list = [ 'test-crest', 'osl-test' ]
 > if listname in ompi_list:
 >     archive_url = ("http://www.open-mpi.org/community/lists/devel/%s/date.php" % (time.strftime("%Y/%m")))
 >     DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER = """_______________________________________________
 > %(real_name)s mailing list
 > %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
 > subscribe: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s
 > searchable archives: %(archive_url)s
 > """  % { 'archive_url' : archive_url }
 > 
 > 
 > What I wanted here is to apply the new DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER only for
 > the specific mailing lists.  Is there something wrong here? 

It would help if you report the whole error that you're seeing, or if
you're not able to find the error message, precisely what behavior
leads you to think something's wrong.

I'm guessing that the problem is that you have a large number of
format elements without corresponding values to interpolate in the
format string for DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER.  Double all of the '%'
characters except that corresponding to archive_url and you'll
probably get the result you want.





From dikim at cs.indiana.edu  Wed Mar  5 01:17:12 2014
From: dikim at cs.indiana.edu (DongInn Kim)
Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2014 19:17:12 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] control delivery processes
In-Reply-To: <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Message-ID: <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>

Hi Stephen,

Thanks for your help.

> It would help if you report the whole error that you're seeing, or if
> you're not able to find the error message, precisely what behavior
> leads you to think something's wrong.
The error message showed up at the log message and any new mails could not go through.
Mar  3 19:05:53 lion postfix/local[12378]: 847A5261380: to=<test-crest at crest.iu.edu>, relay=local, delay=0.14, delays=0.07/0.01/0/0.05, dsn=5.3.0, status=bounced (Command died with status 1: "/opt/mailman-2.1.15/mail/mailman post test-crest". Command output: Traceback (most recent call last):   File "/opt/mailman-2.1.15/scripts/post", line 32, in <module>     from Mailman import mm_cfg   File "/opt/mailman-2.1.15/Mailman/mm_cfg.py", line 88, in <module>     if listname in ompi_list: NameError: name 'listname' is not defined )

> I'm guessing that the problem is that you have a large number of
> format elements without corresponding values to interpolate in the
> format string for DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER.  Double all of the '%'
> characters except that corresponding to archive_url and you'll
> probably get the result you wan
I am not sure how to do this but Mark Sapiro gave me a good input to fix my problem on this.

Regards,

--
- DongInn



On Mar 4, 2014, at 6:36 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull <stephen at xemacs.org> wrote:

> DongInn Kim writes:
> 
>> Can anyone please help me to debug the syntax error in mm_cfg.py?
>> 
>> ompi_list = [ 'test-crest', 'osl-test' ]
>> if listname in ompi_list:
>>    archive_url = ("http://www.open-mpi.org/community/lists/devel/%s/date.php" % (time.strftime("%Y/%m")))
>>    DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER = """_______________________________________________
>> %(real_name)s mailing list
>> %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s
>> subscribe: %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s
>> searchable archives: %(archive_url)s
>> """  % { 'archive_url' : archive_url }
>> 
>> 
>> What I wanted here is to apply the new DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER only for
>> the specific mailing lists.  Is there something wrong here? 
> 
> It would help if you report the whole error that you're seeing, or if
> you're not able to find the error message, precisely what behavior
> leads you to think something's wrong.
> 
> I'm guessing that the problem is that you have a large number of
> format elements without corresponding values to interpolate in the
> format string for DEFAULT_MSG_FOOTER.  Double all of the '%'
> characters except that corresponding to archive_url and you'll
> probably get the result you want.


From richard at KarmannGhia.org  Wed Mar  5 18:30:01 2014
From: richard at KarmannGhia.org (Richard)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2014 09:30:01 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble changing web_page_url
In-Reply-To: <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>


Hello All,

My system that serves both email and mailman sits behind a firewall. Email 
gets forwarded on by a gateway / firewall, and web access comes from a 
different server machine that sits on the boundary - has access to both 
networks, internal and external - and users get to mailman's web features 
through use of an Apache mechanism I can't quite recite to you now. If the 
user has the correct URL, everything works fine, but the automatically 
generated web pages and text at header / footer of emails is wrong, and, 
in particular that of welcome messages for new people.

I have a list I'd like to update and fix this (more than one, possibly, if 
I get this figured out!) but recreating it with proper attributes won't be 
easy as it has a bit of archive to it already. So, I thought I'd simply 
dump the config, edit the output file and re-import the change, but it 
won't take. On reloading, it always says, "Non-standard property restored: 
web_page_url". And, indeed, the parameter is NOT changed. Damn.

So, I know about the wonderful tools available here: 
http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/ I looked and found "set_attributes". 
Great! But while it spits out a few happy looking lines of text and 
appears to work at first, it returns the same error:

$ ./set_attributes "web_page_url = 'http://MyDomain.com/mailman/'" myList
attribute "web_page_url" changed
Non-standard property restored: web_page_url
$

-frown-

How am I supposed to do this?

Again, to be most precise, mailman is using the system's own internal 
network name (which I don't want to / can't change) instead of the 
external domain name I want it to use. I have not found a standard 
administrator way of setting this value. Note that it's NOT a virtual 
name! BOTH email and web server are accessable using the same domain name.

Thanks for any help.

Richard

From richard at KarmannGhia.org  Wed Mar  5 20:03:08 2014
From: richard at KarmannGhia.org (Richard)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2014 11:03:08 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sending "password reminder" emails.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050930110.14168@KarmannGhia.org>


Hello Everyone,

I have more than once wished I could send out password reminder emails to 
either individuals or an entire list. However, I haven't found a way to do 
that yet. How can I do this, please?

Thanks,
Richard

From richard at KarmannGhia.org  Wed Mar  5 20:21:13 2014
From: richard at KarmannGhia.org (Richard)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2014 11:21:13 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble changing web_page_url
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403051118290.14168@KarmannGhia.org>


Earlier, I wrote:
>
> Hello All,
>
> My system that serves both email and mailman sits behind a firewall. Email 
> gets forwarded on by a gateway / firewall, and web access comes from a 
> different server machine that sits on the boundary - has access to both 
> networks, internal and external - and users get to mailman's web features 
> through use of an Apache mechanism I can't quite recite to you now. If the 
> user has the correct URL, everything works fine, but the automatically 
> generated web pages and text at header / footer of emails is wrong, and, in 
> particular that of welcome messages for new people.

Please note that this is a particular problem for accessing attachments 
from the archive - the URL is just plain wrong. This is a big deal...

>
> I have a list I'd like to update and fix this (more than one, possibly, if I 
> get this figured out!) but recreating it with proper attributes won't be easy 
> as it has a bit of archive to it already. So, I thought I'd simply dump the 
> config, edit the output file and re-import the change, but it won't take. On 
> reloading, it always says, "Non-standard property restored: web_page_url". 
> And, indeed, the parameter is NOT changed. Damn.
>
> So, I know about the wonderful tools available here: 
> http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/ I looked and found "set_attributes". Great! 
> But while it spits out a few happy looking lines of text and appears to work 
> at first, it returns the same error:
>
> $ ./set_attributes "web_page_url = 'http://MyDomain.com/mailman/'" myList
> attribute "web_page_url" changed
> Non-standard property restored: web_page_url
> $

For what it's worth, I also tried about every version of what a URL might 
look like - removing 'http://", including on the domain name, etc - 
nothing sticks.    Frustrating!

>
> -frown-
>
> How am I supposed to do this?
>
> Again, to be most precise, mailman is using the system's own internal network 
> name (which I don't want to / can't change) instead of the external domain 
> name I want it to use. I have not found a standard administrator way of 
> setting this value. Note that it's NOT a virtual name! BOTH email and web 
> server are accessable using the same domain name.
>
> Thanks for any help.
>
> Richard


From joemailgroups at gmail.com  Wed Mar  5 20:43:01 2014
From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2014 11:43:01 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can discarded message be restored and reposted
	to mailing list ?
In-Reply-To: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B352F@nuwvicms1>
References: <C1EF8EF0-F61A-48AC-AA86-D6FAFBB6645F@gmail.com>
 <53151E2A.7000503@msapiro.net>
 <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B352F@nuwvicms1>
Message-ID: <638DC5AE-9A0D-496B-B95C-531459A0DB5E@gmail.com>

Thank you Mark and Peter.

I asked the subscriber to repost his message and will be twice as careful from now on to avoid deleting messages I mean to accept.

Thank you for your help,

Joe.


On March 03, 2014, at 5:14 PM, Peter Shute <pshute at nuw.org.au> wrote:

> When this happens to us, we normally either ask the sender to send it again, or we forward the copy in the moderator alert email ourselves.
> 
> Peter Shute 
> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Mailman-Users 
>> [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+pshute=nuw.org.au at python.org] 
>> On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro
>> Sent: Tuesday, 4 March 2014 11:28 AM
>> To: mailman-users at python.org
>> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Can discarded message be 
>> restored and reposted to mailing list ?
>> 
>> On 03/03/2014 01:32 PM, Joe wrote:
>>> 
>>> I accidentally discarded a message that was held for 
>> moderation and I meant to accept it.
>>> 
>>> Is there a way to restore this message (perhaps from archives) ?
>> 
>> 
>> Sorry, no, unless you happened to do a backup that included 
>> Mailman's data/ directory during the period that the message was held.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
>> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>> ------------------------------------------------------
>> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org 
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
>> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: 
>> http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: 
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>> Unsubscribe: 
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/pshute%4
> 0nuw.org.au
>> 
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/joemailgroups%40gmail.com


From bsfinkel at att.net  Wed Mar  5 21:21:33 2014
From: bsfinkel at att.net (Barry S. Finkel)
Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2014 14:21:33 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sending "password reminder" emails.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050930110.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050930110.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
Message-ID: <5317874D.4090203@att.net>

On 3/5/2014 1:03 PM, Richard wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
>
> I have more than once wished I could send out password reminder emails
> to either individuals or an entire list. However, I haven't found a way
> to do that yet. How can I do this, please?
>
> Thanks,
> Richard

There should be a cron to send password reminders each month.
IIRC, each list has an admin setting that determines if that
list gets reminders.  ALL of my list-creation templates had
reminders disabled; I did nothing to disable the cron job.
As I wrote to this list on Feb. 28 - when I was running a
Mailman installation, I saw no need to send password reminders.

--Barry Finkel

From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Mar  5 23:12:39 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2014 14:12:39 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble changing web_page_url
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403051118290.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403051118290.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
Message-ID: <5317A157.5030306@msapiro.net>

On 03/05/2014 11:21 AM, Richard wrote:
> 
...
> 
> Please note that this is a particular problem for accessing attachments
> from the archive - the URL is just plain wrong. This is a big deal...
> 
...
>> So, I know about the wonderful tools available here:
>> http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/ I looked and found "set_attributes".
>> Great! But while it spits out a few happy looking lines of text and
>> appears to work at first, it returns the same error:
>>
>> $ ./set_attributes "web_page_url = 'http://MyDomain.com/mailman/'" myList
>> attribute "web_page_url" changed
>> Non-standard property restored: web_page_url


First of all, config_list will issue that message whenever you set a
list attribute that isn't in the web admin GUI, but the message means it
'restored' the attribute to the value you gave, not it's original value.
That should work. Why do you think it doesn't?

Second, the preferred tool for changing web_page_url is fix_url.py. See
the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/mIA9> and perhaps others that mention
fix_url.

Note also that public archive URLs are somewhat different and are based
on PUBLIC_ARCHIVE_URL rather than DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN, although the
'hostname' should come from that in web_page_url.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Mar  5 22:43:53 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2014 13:43:53 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sending "password reminder" emails.
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050930110.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
References: <58B09252-A44E-4168-97D3-742BBC72120F@cs.indiana.edu>
 <5314F957.3060209@att.net>
 <FBC40C60-DFEC-4493-820D-1E8E8732A779@cs.indiana.edu>
 <4DD9CAF0-D5E1-4557-B0A9-ACC034C6D0A3@cs.indiana.edu>
 <87wqgaqjp4.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <5CE5521A-B618-4583-A95B-FC4DAF515AB4@cs.indiana.edu>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050911160.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
 <alpine.LFD.2.03.1403050930110.14168@KarmannGhia.org>
Message-ID: <53179A99.5020502@msapiro.net>

On 03/05/2014 11:03 AM, Richard wrote:
> 
> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I have more than once wished I could send out password reminder emails
> to either individuals or an entire list. However, I haven't found a way
> to do that yet. How can I do this, please?


As Barry F. notes, you can run Mailman's

 cron/mailpasswds -l LISTNAME

to send reminders for LISTNAME, but this will only send the reminders
for LISTNAME if LISTNAME's send_reminders setting is Yes and will only
send them to those members who haven't opted out of reminders via the
"Get password reminder email for this list?" setting on their user
options page.

To send a reminder to user at example.com, go to a URL like
<http://mailman.host/mailman/options/LISTNAME/user at example.com> and
click the Remind button.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From pshute at nuw.org.au  Sat Mar  8 19:25:37 2014
From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2014 05:25:37 +1100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web
 page?
In-Reply-To: <755151B9-9651-4D4E-A75B-D67CEEABA97C@nuw.org.au>
References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1>
 <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net>
 <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au>
 <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net>
 <D37B8E0B-6208-4330-B138-43B87A5B6875@nuw.org.au>
 <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1>
 <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net>
 <CF4C9C03-D3B1-487B-96F7-81AD12972D08@nuw.org.au>
 <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net>
 <B8B4ABB3-BD42-4258-9C23-CAF670420B42@nuw.org.au>
 <104FF743-A89A-40A1-8A5A-20EC758128A7@nuw.org.au>
 <52F2BC3A.50207@ulticom.com>
 <C55E3A14-F850-4727-BA54-D43FF6187093@nuw.org.au>
 <52F2D10D.8090108@msapiro.net>
 <755151B9-9651-4D4E-A75B-D67CEEABA97C@nuw.org.au>
Message-ID: <E76A39A7-FAD7-4317-AE04-A1CF693BEAF3@nuw.org.au>

In case anyone's interested, I've "solved" this problem of Safari, etc, letting the cookie expire and logging out of the moderator page on the iPad by installing LastPass Tab. This is a password manager and, because of iOS restrictions that prevent an app from entering a password for another app like Safari, it contains its own browser.

I have saved a bookmark for my moderator page and edited it to save the password. Unfortunately the app needs to be logged in to access that password, which is stored in the cloud, and regularly logs itself out (and closes the web page), but it does allow me to save its own password, so a couple of taps get me back into the page.

Peter Shute

Sent from my iPad

On 6 Feb 2014, at 1:00 pm, "Peter Shute" <pshute at nuw.org.au> wrote:

>> On 6 Feb 2014, at 11:03 am, "Mark Sapiro" <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
>> 
>> I use Firefox on an Android phone and it quite happily saves Mailman's
>> admin login passwords w/o a user field.
> 
> No such thing for iOS, unfortunately, although I'm betting all the other browsers available for Android will save a mailman password too.
> 
> 
> I just tried the Mercury browser, on the grounds that its logo looks a bit like the Firefox logo, and it too doesn't ask to save it. It must be dependent on an iOS API.
> 
> Peter Shute
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/pshute%40nuw.org.au

From info at certuspersonality.com  Sun Mar  9 14:48:27 2014
From: info at certuspersonality.com (certuspersonality)
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2014 23:48:27 +1000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Suspending Requests for Subscription
Message-ID: <20140309142151.WLCL8665.nschwmtas04p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw08p>

Some scammer has discovered the possibility to subscribe to my 
Mailman subscriber list and is now inundating me with requests for 
subscription.

So far, I have dealt with the requests by rejecting them through 
Mailman, but the next day there are new ones with different email addresses.
Is there a way of suspending requests for subscription temporarily?

Regards,
Herward


From jacques at lavignotte.org  Sun Mar  9 22:35:26 2014
From: jacques at lavignotte.org (Jacques Lav!gnotte.)
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2014 22:35:26 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Suspending Requests for Subscription
In-Reply-To: <20140309142151.WLCL8665.nschwmtas04p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw08p>
References: <20140309142151.WLCL8665.nschwmtas04p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw08p>
Message-ID: <531CDE9E.20507@lavignotte.org>

Le 09/03/2014 14:48, certuspersonality a ?crit :

> Is there a way of suspending requests for subscription temporarily?

Are they spamming you on a particular list ?

If so, maybe you can try to comment the ralated line on /etc/aliases

> Regards,
> Herward

Jacques, not so sure


-- 
GnuPg : C8F5B1E3 WeUsePGP Because privacy matters http://weusepgp.info/

From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Mar 10 00:00:03 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2014 16:00:03 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Suspending Requests for Subscription
In-Reply-To: <20140309142151.WLCL8665.nschwmtas04p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw08p>
References: <20140309142151.WLCL8665.nschwmtas04p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw08p>
Message-ID: <531CF273.9040501@msapiro.net>

On 03/09/2014 06:48 AM, certuspersonality wrote:
>
> Is there a way of suspending requests for subscription temporarily?


If the requests are coming by email to the list-join, list-subscribe or
list-request (with a subscribe command) addresses, you could disable
delivery to those addresses in your MTA or possibly temporarily move
aside Mailman's scripts/join, scripts/subscribe and maybe
scripts/request files.

If the requests are coming from the subscribe form on the list's
listinfo page, you could temporarily remove the form by editing the page
through the web admin UI. You would have to check your web server logs
to see how the requests are arriving. If they are direct POSTs to the
subscribe CGI, you could temporarily move aside Mailman's
cgi-bin/subscribe wrapper or you could install/upgrade Mailman >= 2.1.16
and enable Mailman's SUBSCRIBE_FORM_SECRET (See the description in
Mailman/Defaults.py.

If your issue is that it is tedious to 'discard' (don't ever 'reject'
spam or a spammer's subscription request, 'discard' it.) all the
requests from the web UI, you may find the script at
<http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/list_requests> more convenient.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Mar 10 18:54:41 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2014 10:54:41 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Suspending Requests for Subscription
In-Reply-To: <20140310102748.TWMI11190.nschwmtas06p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw06p>
References: <20140309142151.WLCL8665.nschwmtas04p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw08p>
 <531CF273.9040501@msapiro.net>
 <20140310102748.TWMI11190.nschwmtas06p.mx.bigpond.com@nschwcmgw06p>
Message-ID: <531DFC61.6080004@msapiro.net>

On 03/10/2014 03:26 AM, certuspersonality wrote:
> Mailman is installed on the Linux server that I am subscribed to.
> I can only make changes by going into cpanel, Mailing Lists, choosing
> the list in question ..., General Options
> Section.
> In which section should I change a setting?


None of the things I suggested can be done from the Mailman list admin
web UI. They all require direct access to the Mailman installalation on
the server which users of a cPanel hosted Mailman typically don't have.

See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Mailman+and+CPanel>.


> The following is a typical email requesting a list subscription:


That email is the notice from Mailman to the list owner of a pending
subscription. It doesn't say how the subscription request arrived to
Mailman.

The bottom line is in a cPanel hosted Mailman installation, there is
probably nothing more you can do beyond what you've been doing.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From sherwindu at att.net  Mon Mar 10 20:27:05 2014
From: sherwindu at att.net (sherwin)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2014 14:27:05 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with missing text
Message-ID: <531E1209.9020309@att.net>

Hello,


As administrator for the Midfex forum on Ibiblio, I am having a problem 
with a user
who posts messages that result in no text appearing on the final 
message.  I do see
the text in the moderated request sent to me.  Here is the message he is 
sending.
Note that this request for confirmation from Ibiblio contains the text, 
but after
approving the message, it is no longer present.

                     Sherwin Dubren
                     Midfex Forum Administrator

 From - Fri Mar 07 02:58:19 2014
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Subject: midfex post from sherwindu at att.net requires approval
From: midfex-owner at lists.ibiblio.org
To: midfex-owner at lists.ibiblio.org
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============5073932158053673459=="
Message-ID: <mailman.1484.1394182675.3356.midfex at lists.ibiblio.org>
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2014 03:57:55 -0500
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--===============5073932158053673459==
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

As list administrator, your authorization is requested for the
following mailing list posting:

     List:    midfex at lists.ibiblio.org
     From:    sherwindu at att.net
     Subject: [Bulk] Status of Empty Messages
     Reason:  Post to moderated list

At your convenience, visit:

     http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/admindb/midfex
         
to approve or deny the request.

--===============5073932158053673459==
Content-Type: message/rfc822
MIME-Version: 1.0

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Message-ID: <531989FB.7060401 at att.net>
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2014 02:57:31 -0600
From: sherwin <sherwindu at att.net>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64;
	rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: "midfex at lists.ibiblio.org >> \"Midwest Fruit Explorers (members only)\""
	<midfex at lists.ibiblio.org>
Subject: [Bulk] Status of Empty Messages
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi All,

You may have seen a few empty messages recently posted.  This
happened before last January.  So far, only two users are having
this problem.  I am investigating this issue and hopefully will find
some resolution.  In the meantime, you may see a few test messages
appearing that you can ignore.

                              Sherwin Dubren
                              Midfex Forum Administrator


--===============5073932158053673459==
Content-Type: message/rfc822
MIME-Version: 1.0

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: confirm 355032ed40da311e897b3febe6cc363b4c0bf975
Sender: midfex-request at lists.ibiblio.org
From: midfex-request at lists.ibiblio.org

If you reply to this message, keeping the Subject: header intact,
Mailman will discard the held message.  Do this if the message is
spam.  If you reply to this message and include an Approved: header
with the list password in it, the message will be approved for posting
to the list.  The Approved: header can also appear in the first line
of the body of the reply.
--===============5073932158053673459==--

















From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Mar 11 03:21:25 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2014 19:21:25 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with missing text
In-Reply-To: <531E1209.9020309@att.net>
References: <531E1209.9020309@att.net>
Message-ID: <531E7325.5030302@msapiro.net>

On 03/10/2014 12:27 PM, sherwin wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> 
> As administrator for the Midfex forum on Ibiblio, I am having a problem
> with a user
> who posts messages that result in no text appearing on the final
> message.  I do see
> the text in the moderated request sent to me.  Here is the message he is
> sending.
> Note that this request for confirmation from Ibiblio contains the text,
> but after
> approving the message, it is no longer present.


The message you included below is exactly what we would want to see,
i.e. the complete raw message of a held message notification to the list
admin.

Unfortunately, it appears to be the wrong held message notification. It
is a notification of your list post

...
> Subject: [Bulk] Status of Empty Messages
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> You may have seen a few empty messages recently posted.  This
> happened before last January.  So far, only two users are having
> this problem.  I am investigating this issue and hopefully will find
> some resolution.  In the meantime, you may see a few test messages
> appearing that you can ignore.
> 
>                              Sherwin Dubren
>                              Midfex Forum Administrator


I am guessing that this is not the message that resulted in an "empty"
message being delivered to the list.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From cwieland at uci.edu  Tue Mar 11 17:25:20 2014
From: cwieland at uci.edu (Con Wieland)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2014 09:25:20 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] permissions error
Message-ID: <641D08F8-0DE3-49A5-8785-A703CC95D391@uci.edu>

Hello,

Does anyone have any ideas why I am receiving this error. The permissions look the same as the other archives and I have run check_perms -f


Your "cron" job on maillists.nac.uci.edu
/opt/csw/bin/python -S /opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip

produced the following output:

Traceback (most recent call last):
 File "/opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 154, in <module>
   main()
 File "/opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 140, in main
   compress(f)
 File "/opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 81, in compress
   outfp = gzip.open(txtfile+'.gz', 'wb', 6)
 File "/opt/csw/lib/python/gzip.py", line 33, in open
   return GzipFile(filename, mode, compresslevel)
 File "/opt/csw/lib/python/gzip.py", line 79, in __init__
   fileobj = self.myfileobj = __builtin__.open(filename, mode or 'rb')
IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/opt/nsp/mailman/archives/private/mph/2009-October.txt.gz'

Con Wieland
Office of Information Technology


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Mar 11 21:06:37 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2014 13:06:37 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] permissions error
In-Reply-To: <641D08F8-0DE3-49A5-8785-A703CC95D391@uci.edu>
References: <641D08F8-0DE3-49A5-8785-A703CC95D391@uci.edu>
Message-ID: <531F6CCD.1080800@msapiro.net>

On 03/11/2014 09:25 AM, Con Wieland wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Does anyone have any ideas why I am receiving this error. The permissions look the same as the other archives and I have run check_perms -f
> 
> 
> Your "cron" job on maillists.nac.uci.edu
> /opt/csw/bin/python -S /opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip
> 
> produced the following output:
> 
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 154, in <module>
>    main()
>  File "/opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 140, in main
>    compress(f)
>  File "/opt/nsp/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 81, in compress
>    outfp = gzip.open(txtfile+'.gz', 'wb', 6)
>  File "/opt/csw/lib/python/gzip.py", line 33, in open
>    return GzipFile(filename, mode, compresslevel)
>  File "/opt/csw/lib/python/gzip.py", line 79, in __init__
>    fileobj = self.myfileobj = __builtin__.open(filename, mode or 'rb')
> IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/opt/nsp/mailman/archives/private/mph/2009-October.txt.gz'


Have you done

  ls -l /opt/nsp/mailman/archives/private/

and compared the group and permissions on mph to those of other lists?
In particular, they should be Mailman's group and permissions drwxrwsr-x

And have you done

  ls -l /opt/nsp/mailman/archives/private/mph/

Here, the group and permissions on all the .txt and .txt.gz files should
be Mailman's group and permissions -rw-rw-r--

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From chadcrowell at gmail.com  Wed Mar 12 17:08:45 2014
From: chadcrowell at gmail.com (Chad Crowell)
Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2014 09:08:45 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Notifications sent to main server domain instead of
	site domain
Message-ID: <etPan.532086ab.661e3f1e.1821@Chads-rMBP-3.local>

I have some mailing lists running on a site hosted at Liquidweb. We are on a CentOS VPS with WHM, cPanel and Mailman. The lists are working fine other than the messages that should be sent to the list owner and moderator aren?t going to the right address according to the WHM email logs.

The hostname for the server is www.cfwebserver.com. This is just used for DNS, nameservers, etc. The site where the mailing lists are located is pack186.com. I have the list administrator and moderator fields populated with my email address. I have the ?Host name this list prefers for email? set to pack186.com. People post to the list which are listname at pack186.com and it works. However when something is moderated, the sender is?
mailman-bounces at www.cfwebserver.com and the recipient is mailman-owner at www.cfwebserver.com. Is there a setting somewhere that I am missing that would set this correctly in mailman? Is this more likely a server email config setting?

--
Chad

From rodti at macleary.com  Thu Mar 13 10:40:28 2014
From: rodti at macleary.com (Rodti MacLeary)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 09:40:28 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] 'Dynamic' footer
Message-ID: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>

Hi there,

I've trawled the archives and found a variety of questions asking how 
dynamic content might be added to Mailman message footers, but no real 
answers.

While I appreciate that the Mailman tags available to the footer can be 
useful for adding list admin info etc into the footer, it would be nice 
to be able to inject scripted or dynamic content in there.  Even if the 
footer could be persuaded to read a text file (like the other template 
files) then that text file could be updated.

If there's no current solution or workaround to this is it something 
that could be considered for Mailman 3?

Many thanks!

r.

From sajan at parikh.io  Wed Mar 12 22:40:42 2014
From: sajan at parikh.io (Sajan Parikh)
Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2014 16:40:42 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Changing Archive Frequency
In-Reply-To: <5320D2F6.5030601@parikh.io>
References: <5320D2F6.5030601@parikh.io>
Message-ID: <5320D45A.2070207@parikh.io>

Sorry.  Just realized there was a arch file in the bin directory.

./arch --wipe [listname] did the trick.

Sajan Parikh

On 03/12/2014 04:34 PM, Sajan Parikh wrote:
> I'm running Mailman 2.1-3 on Ubuntu, installed from the repositories.
>
> I changed the archive frequency on my list from daily to monthly and
> noticed that the actual archive web page has not updated.  It still
> shows the previous messages by day.
>
> Assuming that it will be monthly from here on out, is there any way I
> can regenerate the previous archives and have them show monthly as well?
>
> Thanks.

From stevenospam2000 at yahoo.com  Wed Mar 12 19:25:31 2014
From: stevenospam2000 at yahoo.com (Steve Nospam)
Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2014 11:25:31 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Add a footer to each digest entry that will allow a
	reply
Message-ID: <1394648731.86926.YahooMailNeo@web160106.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

I would like to add a footer to each message in the digest that will allow the recipient to click and post a reply with the correct subject, etc.? Is this possible?? My searches haven't produced any useful hits.

I have subscribers who only want to get a single email each day but they would like to answer some of the postings.

Thanks!

From stevenospam2000 at yahoo.com  Thu Mar 13 15:00:51 2014
From: stevenospam2000 at yahoo.com (Steve Nospam)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 07:00:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] add mailto: link to the bottom of each posting
Message-ID: <1394719251.29004.YahooMailNeo@web160102.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

Because each email client deals with mime differently, I would like to add a link to the bottom of each posting that would allow the recipient to click and replay to the posting.? This will allow digest recipients to reply more easily and hopefully avoid replies with the entire digest being sent back.

mailto: listname at my.domain subject=subject of the message being read

In my experiments, I see that gmail interprets the digest as a single email with all the postings strung together and no ability to reply to a particular message.? Outlook creates a separate attachment for each posting in the digest.? With a handler like above, digests would become much more useful for my lists.? I've done lots of searching the archives and have not found this capability.

From barry at list.org  Thu Mar 13 16:10:42 2014
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 11:10:42 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] 'Dynamic' footer
In-Reply-To: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>
References: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>
Message-ID: <20140313111042.44a46fd0@anarchist.wooz.org>

On Mar 13, 2014, at 09:40 AM, Rodti MacLeary wrote:

>If there's no current solution or workaround to this is it something that
>could be considered for Mailman 3?

This is planned for Mailman 3, and most of the infrastructure is there.  The
one bit that's missing is the ability to interpolate custom data into a custom
footer (we can handle retrieving a custom footer).

I've thought about how to handle the retrieval of data, but just haven't
gotten around to implementing it yet.  My thoughts would be to do an HTTP GET
call and require that to return JSON key/value data.

-Barry

From mailman-admin at uni-konstanz.de  Thu Mar 13 16:21:34 2014
From: mailman-admin at uni-konstanz.de (Mailman Admin)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 16:21:34 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] 'Dynamic' footer
In-Reply-To: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>
References: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>
Message-ID: <5321CCFE.8000108@uni-konstanz.de>

Hello Rodti MacLeary

Am 2014-03-13 10:40, schrieb Rodti MacLeary:
> 
> I've trawled the archives and found a variety of questions asking how
> dynamic content might be added to Mailman message footers, but no real
> answers.
> 
> While I appreciate that the Mailman tags available to the footer can be
> useful for adding list admin info etc into the footer, it would be nice
> to be able to inject scripted or dynamic content in there.  Even if the
> footer could be persuaded to read a text file (like the other template
> files) then that text file could be updated.
> 
> If there's no current solution or workaround to this is it something
> that could be considered for Mailman 3?
> 

You could use
bin/config_list -i text_file.txt yourlist
for the corresponding list.
You would have to provide your text file in mailman config syntax to
this command.

So something like this in the text file text_file.txt would work:

msg_footer = """Some Text to put at the footer.
With multiple lines.
And with tags like %(host_name)s."""
digest_footer = """Some Text to put at the digest footer.
With multiple lines.
And with tags like %(host_name)s."""


This also works for headers.


Kind regards,
Christian Mack

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Mar 13 16:28:06 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 08:28:06 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] 'Dynamic' footer
In-Reply-To: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>
References: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>
Message-ID: <5321CE86.8010607@msapiro.net>

On 03/13/2014 02:40 AM, Rodti MacLeary wrote:
> 
> While I appreciate that the Mailman tags available to the footer can be
> useful for adding list admin info etc into the footer, it would be nice
> to be able to inject scripted or dynamic content in there.  Even if the
> footer could be persuaded to read a text file (like the other template
> files) then that text file could be updated.


For Mailman 2.1, the Mailman/Handlers/Decorate.py module (called by
SMTPDirect.py during outgoing message processing) augments the
replacement dictionary for headers and footers from a 'decoration-data'
dictionary in the messages metadata if it exists.

Thus, you can create a custom handler (see
<http://wiki.list.org/x/l4A9>) and insert it in the pipeline before
ToOutgoing to make the appropriate dictionary and add it to the metadata.

E.g., it could do something like

    ... build dynamic_content ...
    msgdata.decoration-data = {'mystuff': dynamic_content}

Then, a %(mystuff)s replacement in the footer would be replaced by the
dynamic content built by the custom handler.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mailman-admin at uni-konstanz.de  Thu Mar 13 16:36:30 2014
From: mailman-admin at uni-konstanz.de (Mailman Admin)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 16:36:30 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Add a footer to each digest entry that will
 allow a reply
In-Reply-To: <1394648731.86926.YahooMailNeo@web160106.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <1394648731.86926.YahooMailNeo@web160106.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5321D07E.1010309@uni-konstanz.de>

Hello Steve Nospam

Am 2014-03-12 19:25, schrieb Steve Nospam:
> I would like to add a footer to each message in the digest that will
> allow the recipient to click and post a reply with the correct
> subject, etc.  Is this possible?  My searches haven't produced any
> useful hits.
> 

No, it is not possible.


> I have subscribers who only want to get a single email each day but
> they would like to answer some of the postings.
> 

For that there is MIME digest.
http://www.list.org/mailman-member/node28.html
But then your subscribers have to use an email client which supports
MIME digest mails.


Kind regards,
Christian Mack

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Mar 13 16:41:04 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 08:41:04 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Notifications sent to main server domain
 instead of site domain
In-Reply-To: <etPan.532086ab.661e3f1e.1821@Chads-rMBP-3.local>
References: <etPan.532086ab.661e3f1e.1821@Chads-rMBP-3.local>
Message-ID: <5321D190.6000505@msapiro.net>

On 03/12/2014 09:08 AM, Chad Crowell wrote:
> ... cPanel and Mailman. ...
> 
> The hostname for the server is www.cfwebserver.com. This is just used for DNS, nameservers, etc. The site where the mailing lists are located is pack186.com. I have the list administrator and moderator fields populated with my email address. I have the ?Host name this list prefers for email? set to pack186.com. People post to the list which are listname at pack186.com and it works. However when something is moderated, the sender is 
> mailman-bounces at www.cfwebserver.com and the recipient is mailman-owner at www.cfwebserver.com. Is there a setting somewhere that I am missing that would set this correctly in mailman? Is this more likely a server email config setting?


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Mailman+and+CPanel>.

If this were a standard GNU Mailman installation, I would say fix_url
can fix this (See <http://wiki.list.org/x/mIA9>).

cPanel Mailman has its own cPanel list creation process that "should"
set things up properly when a list is created in the pack186.com domain.
I can't say why that didn't happen here unless the list was created by
some means other than cPanel's process. At this point, the admins of the
host installation can probably fix this with fix_url, but there's
probably nothing you as a list owner can do unless you have shell access
to the Mailman installation on the server.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 14 01:12:19 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 17:12:19 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] add mailto: link to the bottom of each posting
In-Reply-To: <1394719251.29004.YahooMailNeo@web160102.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <1394719251.29004.YahooMailNeo@web160102.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <53224963.10604@msapiro.net>

On 03/13/2014 07:00 AM, Steve Nospam wrote:
> Because each email client deals with mime differently, I would like to add a link to the bottom of each posting that would allow the recipient to click and replay to the posting.  This will allow digest recipients to reply more easily and hopefully avoid replies with the entire digest being sent back.


You cannot do this with list configuration settings for reasons
including the fact that Mailman fdoesn't add msg_footer to the messages
in the digest; it only adds digest_footer at the end.

You would have to modify Mailman/Handlers/ToDigest.py to add the footer
after each message, but even then, since the "plain" digest is plain
text by default, you couldn't add it as an anchor tag. You would just
have to add something like

<mailto:listname at my.domain?subject="subject of the message being read">

and hope that the user's MUA would render that as a clickable link.

> In my experiments, I see that gmail interprets the digest as a single email with all the postings strung together and no ability to reply to a particular message.  Outlook creates a separate attachment for each posting in the digest.  With a handler like above, digests would become much more useful for my lists.  I've done lots of searching the archives and have not found this capability.

There are two digest formats, MIME and plain. In the plain digest, all
the messages are concatenated in a single plain text digest. There do
exist digest exploders for some MUAs that will break the digest into
individual messages.

In the MIME digest, each message is a separate message/rfc822
attachment. As you have seen, some MUAs like gmail display all the
messages strung together and offer no ability to reply to a single
message. Others like thunderbird (I'm not sure about outlook) will
display all the messages inline, but still give the ability to open a
single message and reply to it.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From jsetton at waycast.com  Thu Mar 13 19:59:35 2014
From: jsetton at waycast.com (Jacques Setton)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 19:59:35 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Messages addressed to Mailman lists are
	systematically diverted to predefined default email account
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAESKyZUlaeBBlU3XIMM7ZAgBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>

Hi,

 

I have been able to get the Mailman web interface to fully operate
satisfactorily. This includes lists consultation, subscription /
un-subscription, setup and management.

But I am not yet able to get mailing to any list accounts (ex.
mylist at domain.tld, mylist-request at domain.tld, etc. ) to correctly operate. 

Every time a mail is sent to one of these accounts, the sender's mail gets
systematically diverted to a predefined default email account. This
indicates that the above email addresses are not recognized by Postfix as
Mailman related lists to be processed accordingly.

For example, in the below maillog trace we see that the memo initially
addressed to myslist at domain.net by admin-europe at waycast.eu is finally
delivered to the default account admin at domain.net instead of being processed
by '/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mylist' as it should normally be the
case :

- - -
[root at vps12345 ~]# more /usr/local/psa/var/log/maillog | grep 1A52911616E

Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/smtpd[19763]: 1A52911616E:
client=relay6-d.mail.gandi.net[217.70.183.198]

Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/cleanup[19767]: 1A52911616E:
message-id=<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAABDlMhHAh
X9PqvkRNi1Uq10BAAAAAA==@waycast.eu>

Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/qmgr[19671]: 1A52911616E:
from=<admin-europe at waycast.eu>, size=17420, nrcpt=1 (queue active)

Mar 11 23:14:57 vps129345 postfix/smtp[19770]: 1A52911616E:
to=<admin at domain.fr>, orig_to=<mylist at domain.net>, 
relay=mx1.ovh.net[213.186.33.29]:25, delay=150, delays=0.1/0.01/60/90,
dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (250 ok 1394576096 qp 28763)

Mar 11 23:14:57 vps12345 postfix/qmgr[19671]: 1A52911616E: removed

[root at vps12345 ~]#

- - - 

Despite skimming through this Mailman-Users list and many other source
publications, I haven't yet been able to figure out the exact origin of this
abnormal behavior. Though I suspect a poorly defined Postfix 'transport'
specification (see item 7 further below), but this remains to be confirmed.

Please note that I am using a hosted VPS running CentOS with, among other
things, Plesk, Postfix and Mailman. All software versions and configuration
details are communicated below. Another piece of useful information : the
'admin at domain.fr' default account has been specified at Plesk's web admin
interface level.

I'd therefore welcome any help  on this issue. Many thanks in advance !

Regards,
Jacques

__________________________

 

Mailman System Configuration and Related Relevant Data

In the below listings :

-       The server machine name is labeled 'vps12345'

-       The server full hostname is  labeled 'vps12345.ovh.net'

-       The attached virtual domain is labeled 'domain.net'

1.      Host server software components & revision details :

linux CentOS 6.4 (Final)

awstats 7.1.1-13052215.parallels 

bind 9.8.2-0.17.rc1.el6_4.5 

courier-imap 4.12.0-cos6.build115130710.20 

drweb 6.0.2.1-1211092005pleskel5 

httpd 2.2.15-29.el6.centos 

mailman 2.1.12-18.el6 

mod_perl 2.0.4-10.el6 

mod_python 3.3.1-14.el6.1 

mysql 5.1.73-3.el6_5 

nginx 1.5.0-1.13060711.centos6 

php 5.3.3-27.el6_5 

postfix 2.8.14-13040119 

PPSitebuilder 11.5.10-42107.13120413 

psa 11.5.30-cos6.build115130819.13 

psa-api-rpc 11.5.30-cos6.build115130819.13 

psa-autoinstaller 3.15.15-130814.09 

psa-backup-manager 11.5.30-cos6.build115130819.13 

psa-drweb-configurator 11.5.30-cos6.build115130819.13 

psa-horde 5.1.5-cos6.build115131216.11 

psa-imp 6.1.6-cos6.build115131216.11 

psa-logrotate 3.8.2-cos6.build115130211.11 

psa-mod-fcgid-configurator 2.3.9-14012811 

psa-proftpd 1.3.4c-cos6.build115130528.15 

psa-turba 4.1.3-cos6.build115131216.11 

roundcube 0.9.5-cos6.build115131112.14 

webalizer 2.21_02-3.3.el6

 

2.      Mailman Configuration File relevant excerpts (mm_cfg.py located in
/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/)

{ . }

DEFAULT_URL_HOST   = 'lists.vps12345.ovh.net'

DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'vps12345.ovh.net'

MTA = 'Postfix'

VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()

add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)

add_virtualhost('lists.domain.net', domain.net')

POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['domain.net']

VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN = 'localhost'

{ .}

 

3.      Mailman aliases set-up for sample list named  'mylist' (aliases and
aliases.db located in /etc/mailman/)

# The ultimate loop stopper address

mailman-loop: /var/lib/mailman/data/owner-bounces.mbox

{ .} 

# STANZA START: mylist

# CREATED: Mon Feb 24 21:00:44 2014

mylist:             "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mylist"

mylist-admin:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman admin mylist"

mylist-bounces:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mylist"

mylist-confirm:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mylist"

mylist-join:        "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman join mylist"

mylist-leave:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman leave mylist"

mylist-owner:       "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman owner mylist"

mylist-request:     "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman request mylist"

mylist-subscribe:   "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mylist"

mylist-unsubscribe: "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mylist"

# STANZA END: mylist

{ .}

 

4.      Mailman virtual aliases set-up for sample list named  'mylist'
(virtual-mailman and virtual-mailman.db located in /etc/mailman/)

# LOOP ADDRESSES START

mailman-loop at domain.net        mailman-loop

# LOOP ADDRESSES END

{ .}

# STANZA START: mylist

# CREATED: Mon Feb 24 21:00:44 2014

mylist at domain.net              mylist

mylist-admin at domain.net        mylist-admin

mylist-bounces@ domain.net      mylist-bounces

mylist-confirm@ domain.net      mylist-confirm

mylist-join@ domain.net         mylist-join

mylist-leave@ domain.net        mylist-leave

mylist-owner@ domain.net        mylist-owner

mylist-request@ domain.net      mylist-request

mylist-subscribe@ domain.net    mylist-subscribe

mylist-unsubscribe@ domain.net  mylist-unsubscribe

# STANZA END: mylist

{ .}

 

5.      Postfix Configuration File customized parameters (main.cf located in
/etc/postfix/)

{ .}

# *** Added $mydomain and '$myorigin' to 'mydestination' parameter list

mydestination = $myhostname, localhost.$mydomain, localhost.localdomain,
localhost, $mydomain, $myorigin

# *** Redefine 'local_recipient_maps' parameter values

local_recipient_maps = proxy:unix:passwd.byname $alias_maps
$virtual_alias_maps

# *** Added Mailman 'aliases' reference in 'alias_maps'

alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases, hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/aliases,
hash:/etc/mailman/aliases

# *** Uncommented 'recipient_delimiter' parameter setting

recipient_delimiter = +

# *** Added 'virtual-mailman' reference in 'virtual_alias_maps'

virtual_alias_maps = $virtual_maps, hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/virtual,
hash:/etc/mailman/virtual-mailman

virtual_mailbox_domains = $virtual_mailbox_maps,
hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/virtual_domains

virtual_mailbox_maps = , hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/vmailbox

# *** Added Postfix Transport location to 'transport_maps' parameter

transport_maps = , hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/transport,
hash:/etc/postfix/transport

# *** Remainder of customized parameters follows below.

smtpd_tls_cert_file = /etc./postfix/postfix_default.pem

smtpd_tls_key_file = $smtpd_tls_cert_file

smtpd_tls_security_level = may

smtpd_use_tls = yes

smtp_tls_security_level = may

smtp_use_tls = no

smtpd_timeout = 3600s

smtpd_proxy_timeout = 3600s

disable_vrfy_command = yes

mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8 [::1]/128 37.187.87.139/32,
hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk-pop/poplock

smtpd_sender_restrictions = check_sender_access
hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/blacklists, permit_sasl_authenticated,
check_client_access pcre:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/non_auth.re

smtpd_client_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, permit_sasl_authenticated

smtp_send_xforward_command = yes

smtpd_authorized_xforward_hosts = 127.0.0.0/8 [::1]/128

smtpd_sasl_auth_enable = yes

smtpd_recipient_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, check_client_access
pcre:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/no_relay.re, permit_sasl_authenticated,
reject_unauth_destination

virtual_mailbox_base = /var/qmail/mailnames

virtual_uid_maps = static:30

virtual_gid_maps = static:31

smtpd_milters = , inet:127.0.0.1:12768

non_smtpd_milters = , inet:127.0.0.1:12768

sender_dependent_default_transport_maps =
hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/sdd_transport_maps

virtual_transport = plesk_virtual

plesk_virtual_destination_recipient_limit = 1

mailman_destination_recipient_limit = 1

mailbox_size_limit = 0

virtual_mailbox_limit = 0

myhostname = vps12345.ovh.net

message_size_limit = 10240000

 

6.      Postfix Master Process Configuration File - Only uncommented lines
are shown (master.conf located in /etc/postfix)

# ==========================================================================

# service type  private unpriv  chroot  wakeup  maxproc command + args

#               (yes)   (yes)   (yes)   (never) (100)

# ==========================================================================

smtp      inet  n       -       n       -       -       smtpd

pickup fifo n - n 60 1 pickup

cleanup   unix  n       -       n       -       0       cleanup

qmgr fifo n - n 1 1 qmgr

tlsmgr    unix  -       -       n       1000?   1       tlsmgr

rewrite   unix  -       -       n       -       -       trivial-rewrite

bounce    unix  -       -       n       -       0       bounce

defer     unix  -       -       n       -       0       bounce

trace     unix  -       -       n       -       0       bounce

verify    unix  -       -       n       -       1       verify

flush     unix  n       -       n       1000?   0       flush

proxymap  unix  -       -       n       -       -       proxymap

proxywrite unix -       -       n       -       1       proxymap

smtp      unix  -       -       n       -       -       smtp

relay     unix  -       -       n       -       -       smtp

      -o smtp_fallback_relay=

showq     unix  n       -       n       -       -       showq

error     unix  -       -       n       -       -       error

retry     unix  -       -       n       -       -       error

discard   unix  -       -       n       -       -       discard

local     unix  -       n       n       -       -       local

virtual   unix  -       n       n       -       -       virtual

lmtp      unix  -       -       n       -       -       lmtp

anvil     unix  -       -       n       -       1       anvil

scache    unix  -       -       n       -       1       scache

plesk_virtual unix - n n - - pipe flags=DORhu user=popuser:popuser
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-local -f ${sender} -d ${recipient} -p
/var/qmail/mailnames

mailman unix - n n - - pipe flags=R user=mailman:mailman
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman ${nexthop} ${user} ${recipient}

plesk_saslauthd unix y y n - 1 plesk_saslauthd status=5 listen=6
dbpath=/var/spool/postfix/plesk/passwd.db

smtps inet n - n - - smtpd -o smtpd_tls_wrappermode=yes

submission inet n - n - - smtpd -o smtpd_enforce_tls=yes -o
smtpd_tls_security_level=encrypt -o smtpd_sasl_auth_enable=yes -o
smtpd_client_restrictions=permit_sasl_authenticated,reject -o
smtpd_sender_restrictions= -o
smtpd_recipient_restrictions=permit_mynetworks,permit_sasl_authenticated,rej
ect_unauth_destination

37.187.87.139- unix - n n - - smtp -o smtp_bind_address=37.187.87.139 -o
smtp_bind_address6= -o smtp_address_preference=ipv4

Note : The 'postfix_to_mailman.py' scheme is NOT USED as the related lines
stayed commented out.

 

7.       Postfix Added Transport Table scheme (transport and transport.db
located in /etc/postfix/)

The below-specified transports remained commented out because they cause a
transport failure when uncommented. It seems that the specifications used
are probably invalid. These will need to be reworked and we'd welcome
suggestions as to what to specify instead... 

{ .}

# *** ADDED TRANSPORT(5)

# vps12345.ovh.net   mailman:

# domain.net   mailman:

#

________________________________________________ 

 


From khbkhb at gmail.com  Fri Mar 14 00:21:19 2014
From: khbkhb at gmail.com (Keith Bierman)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 17:21:19 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Direct message to archive only?
Message-ID: <CAHSokPyXqBOcXAisM=8=EcHyLGr7v0qHtBgru3a7rQs_arbEYA@mail.gmail.com>

The closest thing I can find in previous threads was entitled
"Archive a message without send email" (sic)

Similar to that posting, I find myself needing to "replay" off list
discussions for the record. With mailman, controlled by cPanel is there any
way to accomplish this without actually posting to the list itself?

Keith Bierman
khbkhb at gmail.com

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 14 02:19:39 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 18:19:39 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Direct message to archive only?
In-Reply-To: <CAHSokPyXqBOcXAisM=8=EcHyLGr7v0qHtBgru3a7rQs_arbEYA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHSokPyXqBOcXAisM=8=EcHyLGr7v0qHtBgru3a7rQs_arbEYA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5322592B.9050201@msapiro.net>

On 03/13/2014 04:21 PM, Keith Bierman wrote:
> 
> Similar to that posting, I find myself needing to "replay" off list
> discussions for the record. With mailman, controlled by cPanel is there any
> way to accomplish this without actually posting to the list itself?


Here's how I would do it.

1) create a *nix mbox format file containing the messages.
2) stop mailman
3) run Mailman's 'bin/arch LISTNAME /path/to/mbox_created_in_1
4) cat >> archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox <
/path/to/mbox_created_in_1
5) start mailman

LISTNAME is the cPanel list name, i.e. list_domain

steps 2 and 5 are to ensure no other messages arrive between steps 3 and
4. It isn't critical if they do, but it would result in renumbering of
these messages if the archive is ever rebuilt in total from
archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox.

Another way to do it would be to stop Mailman's OutgoingRunner only,
post the messages to the list, remove the queue entries for those
messages only from Mailman's out/ queue and restart OutgoingRunner.

Or do a similar thing with the MTA rather than OutgoingRunner.

Note that it is unlikely that a list owner in a shared hosted cPanel
environment would have the necessary access to do any of the above.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From khbkhb at gmail.com  Fri Mar 14 02:30:58 2014
From: khbkhb at gmail.com (Keith Bierman)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 19:30:58 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Direct message to archive only?
In-Reply-To: <5322592B.9050201@msapiro.net>
References: <CAHSokPyXqBOcXAisM=8=EcHyLGr7v0qHtBgru3a7rQs_arbEYA@mail.gmail.com>
 <5322592B.9050201@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <CAHSokPwHwXhtrg_09VPGJs452tuWnuW+r6QkdNy-hgcZv4-_nQ@mail.gmail.com>

"environment would have the necessary access to do any of the above."

Indeed!

Back when I was administering my own mailserver it was easy enough to have
a -archive list which only went to the same archive file as the list itself
(I don't recall the syntax, but I recall setting it up under multiple
generations of SunOS ;>).

It's a common enough use-case I'd hoped there was a civilized way to do it
through the cPanel/mailman front door.

Keith Bierman
khbkhb at gmail.com
kbiermank AIM
303 997 2749


On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 7:19 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:

> On 03/13/2014 04:21 PM, Keith Bierman wrote:
> >
> > Similar to that posting, I find myself needing to "replay" off list
> > discussions for the record. With mailman, controlled by cPanel is there
> any
> > way to accomplish this without actually posting to the list itself?
>
>
> Here's how I would do it.
>
> 1) create a *nix mbox format file containing the messages.
> 2) stop mailman
> 3) run Mailman's 'bin/arch LISTNAME /path/to/mbox_created_in_1
> 4) cat >> archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox <
> /path/to/mbox_created_in_1
> 5) start mailman
>
> LISTNAME is the cPanel list name, i.e. list_domain
>
> steps 2 and 5 are to ensure no other messages arrive between steps 3 and
> 4. It isn't critical if they do, but it would result in renumbering of
> these messages if the archive is ever rebuilt in total from
> archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox.
>
> Another way to do it would be to stop Mailman's OutgoingRunner only,
> post the messages to the list, remove the queue entries for those
> messages only from Mailman's out/ queue and restart OutgoingRunner.
>
> Or do a similar thing with the MTA rather than OutgoingRunner.
>
> Note that it is unlikely that a list owner in a shared hosted cPanel
> environment would have the necessary access to do any of the above.
>
> --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe:
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/khbkhb%40gmail.com
>

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 14 03:12:43 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 19:12:43 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Messages addressed to Mailman lists are
 systematically diverted to predefined default email account
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAESKyZUlaeBBlU3XIMM7ZAgBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAESKyZUlaeBBlU3XIMM7ZAgBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
Message-ID: <5322659B.5010904@msapiro.net>

On 03/13/2014 11:59 AM, Jacques Setton wrote:
> 
> For example, in the below maillog trace we see that the memo initially
> addressed to myslist at domain.net by admin-europe at waycast.eu is finally
> delivered to the default account admin at domain.net instead of being processed
> by '/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mylist' as it should normally be the
> case :


But we don't see why? Strangely enough, there is no Postfix log entry
saying anything about the redirect from orig_to=<mylist at domain.net> to
to=<admin at domain.fr>. Also, there is a 2 and a half minute delay between
receipt of the message and delivery (delays=0.1/0.01/60/90) of which 60
seconds is connection setup time including DNS, HELO and TLS; and 90
seconds is message transmission time. Does this seem OK?

Anyway, this can occur if there is a virtual mapping from
mylist at domain.net to admin at domain.fr that is taking priority over
/etc/mailman/virtual-mailman


> - - -
> [root at vps12345 ~]# more /usr/local/psa/var/log/maillog | grep 1A52911616E
> 
> Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/smtpd[19763]: 1A52911616E:
> client=relay6-d.mail.gandi.net[217.70.183.198]
> 
> Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/cleanup[19767]: 1A52911616E:
> message-id=<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAABDlMhHAh
> X9PqvkRNi1Uq10BAAAAAA==@waycast.eu>
> 
> Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/qmgr[19671]: 1A52911616E:
> from=<admin-europe at waycast.eu>, size=17420, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
> 
> Mar 11 23:14:57 vps129345 postfix/smtp[19770]: 1A52911616E:
> to=<admin at domain.fr>, orig_to=<mylist at domain.net>, 
> relay=mx1.ovh.net[213.186.33.29]:25, delay=150, delays=0.1/0.01/60/90,
> dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (250 ok 1394576096 qp 28763)
> 
> Mar 11 23:14:57 vps12345 postfix/qmgr[19671]: 1A52911616E: removed
> 
> [root at vps12345 ~]#
> 
> - - - 
> 
> Despite skimming through this Mailman-Users list and many other source
> publications, I haven't yet been able to figure out the exact origin of this
> abnormal behavior. Though I suspect a poorly defined Postfix 'transport'
> specification (see item 7 further below), but this remains to be confirmed.


The transport involved should be local.


> Please note that I am using a hosted VPS running CentOS with, among other
> things, Plesk, Postfix and Mailman. All software versions and configuration
> details are communicated below. Another piece of useful information : the
> 'admin at domain.fr' default account has been specified at Plesk's web admin
> interface level.


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Mailman+and+Plesk>


> 2.      Mailman Configuration File relevant excerpts (mm_cfg.py located in
> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/)
> 
> { . }
> 
> DEFAULT_URL_HOST   = 'lists.vps12345.ovh.net'
> 
> DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'vps12345.ovh.net'
> 
> MTA = 'Postfix'
> 
> VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()
> 
> add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
> 
> add_virtualhost('lists.domain.net', domain.net')
> 
> POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['domain.net']
> 
> VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN = 'localhost'


You may or may not need this, but if you do, you may need Mailman's
bin/genaliases to update virtual-mailman.


> 3.      Mailman aliases set-up for sample list named  'mylist' (aliases and
> aliases.db located in /etc/mailman/)


OK


> 4.      Mailman virtual aliases set-up for sample list named  'mylist'
> (virtual-mailman and virtual-mailman.db located in /etc/mailman/)
> 
> # LOOP ADDRESSES START
> 
> mailman-loop at domain.net        mailman-loop
> 
> # LOOP ADDRESSES END
> 
> { .}
> 
> # STANZA START: mylist
> 
> # CREATED: Mon Feb 24 21:00:44 2014
> 
> mylist at domain.net              mylist


With VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN = 'localhost', these should be

mylist at domain.net              mylist at localhost

and so on.


> 5.      Postfix Configuration File customized parameters (main.cf located in
> /etc/postfix/)
> 
> { .}
> 
> # *** Added $mydomain and '$myorigin' to 'mydestination' parameter list
> 
> mydestination = $myhostname, localhost.$mydomain, localhost.localdomain,
> localhost, $mydomain, $myorigin
> 
> # *** Redefine 'local_recipient_maps' parameter values
> 
> local_recipient_maps = proxy:unix:passwd.byname $alias_maps
> $virtual_alias_maps
> 
> # *** Added Mailman 'aliases' reference in 'alias_maps'
> 
> alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases, hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/aliases,
> hash:/etc/mailman/aliases
> 
> # *** Uncommented 'recipient_delimiter' parameter setting
> 
> recipient_delimiter = +
> 
> # *** Added 'virtual-mailman' reference in 'virtual_alias_maps'
> 
> virtual_alias_maps = $virtual_maps, hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/virtual,
> hash:/etc/mailman/virtual-mailman


virtual_alias_domains = domain.net


> virtual_mailbox_domains = $virtual_mailbox_maps,
> hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/virtual_domains
> 
> virtual_mailbox_maps = , hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/vmailbox
> 
> # *** Added Postfix Transport location to 'transport_maps' parameter


Why? This is probably only for postfix_to_mailman.


> transport_maps = , hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/transport,
> hash:/etc/postfix/transport
> 
> # *** Remainder of customized parameters follows below.
> 
> smtpd_tls_cert_file = /etc./postfix/postfix_default.pem
> 
> smtpd_tls_key_file = $smtpd_tls_cert_file
> 
> smtpd_tls_security_level = may
> 
> smtpd_use_tls = yes
> 
> smtp_tls_security_level = may
> 
> smtp_use_tls = no
> 
> smtpd_timeout = 3600s
> 
> smtpd_proxy_timeout = 3600s
> 
> disable_vrfy_command = yes
> 
> mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8 [::1]/128 37.187.87.139/32,
> hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk-pop/poplock
> 
> smtpd_sender_restrictions = check_sender_access
> hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/blacklists, permit_sasl_authenticated,
> check_client_access pcre:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/non_auth.re
> 
> smtpd_client_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, permit_sasl_authenticated
> 
> smtp_send_xforward_command = yes
> 
> smtpd_authorized_xforward_hosts = 127.0.0.0/8 [::1]/128
> 
> smtpd_sasl_auth_enable = yes
> 
> smtpd_recipient_restrictions = permit_mynetworks, check_client_access
> pcre:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/no_relay.re, permit_sasl_authenticated,
> reject_unauth_destination
> 
> virtual_mailbox_base = /var/qmail/mailnames
> 
> virtual_uid_maps = static:30
> 
> virtual_gid_maps = static:31
> 
> smtpd_milters = , inet:127.0.0.1:12768
> 
> non_smtpd_milters = , inet:127.0.0.1:12768
> 
> sender_dependent_default_transport_maps =
> hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/sdd_transport_maps
> 
> virtual_transport = plesk_virtual


This makes plesk_virtual the transport for all virtual mailbox domains.


> plesk_virtual_destination_recipient_limit = 1
> 
> mailman_destination_recipient_limit = 1


This is for postfix_to_mailman


> mailbox_size_limit = 0
> 
> virtual_mailbox_limit = 0
> 
> myhostname = vps12345.ovh.net
> 
> message_size_limit = 10240000
> 
>  
> 
> 6.      Postfix Master Process Configuration File - Only uncommented lines
> are shown (master.conf located in /etc/postfix)
> 
> # ==========================================================================
> 
> # service type  private unpriv  chroot  wakeup  maxproc command + args
> 
> #               (yes)   (yes)   (yes)   (never) (100)
> 
> # ==========================================================================
> 
> smtp      inet  n       -       n       -       -       smtpd
> 
> pickup fifo n - n 60 1 pickup
> 
> cleanup   unix  n       -       n       -       0       cleanup
> 
> qmgr fifo n - n 1 1 qmgr
> 
> tlsmgr    unix  -       -       n       1000?   1       tlsmgr
> 
> rewrite   unix  -       -       n       -       -       trivial-rewrite
> 
> bounce    unix  -       -       n       -       0       bounce
> 
> defer     unix  -       -       n       -       0       bounce
> 
> trace     unix  -       -       n       -       0       bounce
> 
> verify    unix  -       -       n       -       1       verify
> 
> flush     unix  n       -       n       1000?   0       flush
> 
> proxymap  unix  -       -       n       -       -       proxymap
> 
> proxywrite unix -       -       n       -       1       proxymap
> 
> smtp      unix  -       -       n       -       -       smtp
> 
> relay     unix  -       -       n       -       -       smtp
> 
>       -o smtp_fallback_relay=
> 
> showq     unix  n       -       n       -       -       showq
> 
> error     unix  -       -       n       -       -       error
> 
> retry     unix  -       -       n       -       -       error
> 
> discard   unix  -       -       n       -       -       discard
> 
> local     unix  -       n       n       -       -       local
> 
> virtual   unix  -       n       n       -       -       virtual
> 
> lmtp      unix  -       -       n       -       -       lmtp
> 
> anvil     unix  -       -       n       -       1       anvil
> 
> scache    unix  -       -       n       -       1       scache
> 
> plesk_virtual unix - n n - - pipe flags=DORhu user=popuser:popuser
> argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-local -f ${sender} -d ${recipient} -p
> /var/qmail/mailnames
> 
> mailman unix - n n - - pipe flags=R user=mailman:mailman
> argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman ${nexthop} ${user} ${recipient}
> 
> plesk_saslauthd unix y y n - 1 plesk_saslauthd status=5 listen=6
> dbpath=/var/spool/postfix/plesk/passwd.db
> 
> smtps inet n - n - - smtpd -o smtpd_tls_wrappermode=yes
> 
> submission inet n - n - - smtpd -o smtpd_enforce_tls=yes -o
> smtpd_tls_security_level=encrypt -o smtpd_sasl_auth_enable=yes -o
> smtpd_client_restrictions=permit_sasl_authenticated,reject -o
> smtpd_sender_restrictions= -o
> smtpd_recipient_restrictions=permit_mynetworks,permit_sasl_authenticated,rej
> ect_unauth_destination
> 
> 37.187.87.139- unix - n n - - smtp -o smtp_bind_address=37.187.87.139 -o
> smtp_bind_address6= -o smtp_address_preference=ipv4
> 
> Note : The 'postfix_to_mailman.py' scheme is NOT USED as the related lines
> stayed commented out.


OK, but why have all that baggage along anyway?


> 7.       Postfix Added Transport Table scheme (transport and transport.db
> located in /etc/postfix/)
> 
> The below-specified transports remained commented out because they cause a
> transport failure when uncommented. It seems that the specifications used
> are probably invalid. These will need to be reworked and we'd welcome
> suggestions as to what to specify instead... 


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/EYDt>, in particular the paragraph

postfix_to_mailman.py is an alternative to and is incompatible with
Mailman delivery via aliases. If you are configuring both Mailman
aliases and postfix_to_mailman.py, you are making a mistake.


> { .}
> 
> # *** ADDED TRANSPORT(5)
> 
> # vps12345.ovh.net   mailman:
> 
> # domain.net   mailman:


-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From stephen at xemacs.org  Fri Mar 14 04:29:29 2014
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 12:29:29 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] add mailto: link to the bottom of each posting
In-Reply-To: <53224963.10604@msapiro.net>
References: <1394719251.29004.YahooMailNeo@web160102.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <53224963.10604@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <871ty5mp9i.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Mark Sapiro writes:

 > text by default, you couldn't add it as an anchor tag. You would just
 > have to add something like
 > 
 > <mailto:listname at my.domain?subject="subject of the message being read">
 > 
 > and hope that the user's MUA would render that as a clickable link.

This still helps a lot because most users will be able to cut and
paste.  If the message content-type is "text/plain", I think this is
an excellent approach.

 > There are two digest formats, MIME and plain. In the plain digest, all
 > the messages are concatenated in a single plain text digest. There do
 > exist digest exploders for some MUAs that will break the digest into
 > individual messages.

Note that the plain digest format is a very old standard (RFCs 934,
1153), and should be implemented by MUAs.  Unfortunately there's not
much you can do if they don't (Gmail is especially cantankerous about
requests to fix its insane behavior).  OTOH, it's not clear to me why
you would want to use plain (RFC 934) digests nowadays.


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 14 04:34:28 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 20:34:28 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Direct message to archive only?
In-Reply-To: <CAHSokPwHwXhtrg_09VPGJs452tuWnuW+r6QkdNy-hgcZv4-_nQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHSokPyXqBOcXAisM=8=EcHyLGr7v0qHtBgru3a7rQs_arbEYA@mail.gmail.com>
 <5322592B.9050201@msapiro.net>
 <CAHSokPwHwXhtrg_09VPGJs452tuWnuW+r6QkdNy-hgcZv4-_nQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <532278C4.8090707@msapiro.net>

On 03/13/2014 06:30 PM, Keith Bierman wrote:
> 
> Back when I was administering my own mailserver it was easy enough to
> have a -archive list which only went to the same archive file as the
> list itself (I don't recall the syntax, but I recall setting it up under
> multiple generations of SunOS ;>).


One way this could be done would be to create the 'list' list and the
'list-archive' list and then create symlinks from
archives/private/list-archive to archives/private/list and from
archives/private/list-archive.mbox to archives/private/list.mbox.

I think this would work, but there is a potential race issue if
ArchRunner is sliced and posts arrive for both lists concurrently
because there is really only one archive, but separate locks for the two
lists. This wouldn't be an issue if ArchRunner is not sliced as then
there would only be a single thread/process doing archiving.


> It's a common enough use-case I'd hoped there was a civilized way to do
> it through the cPanel/mailman front door.


Sorry, not that I know of.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 14 04:54:56 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2014 20:54:56 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] add mailto: link to the bottom of each posting
In-Reply-To: <871ty5mp9i.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
References: <1394719251.29004.YahooMailNeo@web160102.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>	<53224963.10604@msapiro.net>
 <871ty5mp9i.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Message-ID: <53227D90.7070201@msapiro.net>

On 03/13/2014 08:29 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Mark Sapiro writes:
> 
>  > text by default, you couldn't add it as an anchor tag. You would just
>  > have to add something like
>  > 
>  > <mailto:listname at my.domain?subject="subject of the message being read">
>  > 
>  > and hope that the user's MUA would render that as a clickable link.
> 
> This still helps a lot because most users will be able to cut and
> paste.  If the message content-type is "text/plain", I think this is
> an excellent approach.


If one were actually to do this, one should also include an In-Reply-To
fragment with the message-id of the message replied to as this is useful
to archivers and MUAs for threading. E.g.,

<mailto:list_address?subject=message_subject&in-reply-to=message-id>


-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From colinsp at tiscali.co.uk  Fri Mar 14 07:14:49 2014
From: colinsp at tiscali.co.uk (Colin)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 07:14:49 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unsubscribed members still getting emails.
Message-ID: <000901cf3f4c$b90d3a70$2b27af50$@tiscali.co.uk>

I have got a problem that has suddenly arisen.

Three members left my mailing list over a year ago and they stopped getting
messages. Suddenly last week all 3 started getting emails again. Their email
addresses are not in the membership list. I have not made any changes to the
list. 

Any suggestions? 

I can't find anything in the FAQ or on Google about something like this.

--
Regards

Colin


From stephen at xemacs.org  Fri Mar 14 15:46:46 2014
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 23:46:46 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users]  Unsubscribed members still getting emails.
In-Reply-To: <000901cf3f4c$b90d3a70$2b27af50$@tiscali.co.uk>
References: <000901cf3f4c$b90d3a70$2b27af50$@tiscali.co.uk>
Message-ID: <87pploltwp.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Colin writes:

 > Three members left my mailing list over a year ago and they stopped getting
 > messages. Suddenly last week all 3 started getting emails again. Their email
 > addresses are not in the membership list. I have not made any changes to the
 > list. 

Are they current messages?  Mail can sit in a queue somewhere for a
*very* long time, and then somebody gives it a kick and it suddenly
appears in somebody else's mailbax.

Are they at the same domain?


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 14 15:54:58 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 07:54:58 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unsubscribed members still getting emails.
In-Reply-To: <000901cf3f4c$b90d3a70$2b27af50$@tiscali.co.uk>
References: <000901cf3f4c$b90d3a70$2b27af50$@tiscali.co.uk>
Message-ID: <53231842.4090809@msapiro.net>

On 03/13/2014 11:14 PM, Colin wrote:
> I have got a problem that has suddenly arisen.
> 
> Three members left my mailing list over a year ago and they stopped getting
> messages. Suddenly last week all 3 started getting emails again. Their email
> addresses are not in the membership list. I have not made any changes to the
> list. 


Have you checked the list membership for their addresses and possible
alternative addresses that forward to them since this started?

If their addresses "reappeared" on the list, there are a couple of ways
that could have happened. An old version of lists/LISTNAME/config.pck
could have been inadvertently restored, or if this mailman was upgraded
from 2.0, there could have been an old config.db from 2.0 that wasn't
removed, and if the config.pck became corrupt somehow, Mailman would
fall back to the config.db. This would be logged in Mailman's error log.

If the addresses are not on the current membership list, you need to
obtain a copy of one of these mails as delivered to the former member
and examine the complete headers to see how it got to the destination.
If you need help, you can post the headers here.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From chadcrowell at gmail.com  Fri Mar 14 17:04:14 2014
From: chadcrowell at gmail.com (Chad Crowell)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 09:04:14 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Notifications sent to main server domain
 instead of site domain
In-Reply-To: <5321D190.6000505@msapiro.net>
References: <etPan.532086ab.661e3f1e.1821@Chads-rMBP-3.local>
 <5321D190.6000505@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <etPan.5323289c.71c91298.1821@Chads-rMBP-3.local>

Thanks Mark. I do have shell access so went in to give it a try. I found this?https://forums.cpanel.net/f5/how-fix-mailman-url-after-transfer-change-hostname-107593.html?and tried it, and it worked. Thanks for the direction.
--
Chad

On March 13, 2014 at 8:41:19 AM, Mark Sapiro (mark at msapiro.net) wrote:

On 03/12/2014 09:08 AM, Chad Crowell wrote:
> ... cPanel and Mailman. ...
>  
> The hostname for the server is www.cfwebserver.com. This is just used for DNS, nameservers, etc. The site where the mailing lists are located is pack186.com. I have the list administrator and moderator fields populated with my email address. I have the ?Host name this list prefers for email? set to pack186.com. People post to the list which are listname at pack186.com and it works. However when something is moderated, the sender is  
> mailman-bounces at www.cfwebserver.com and the recipient is mailman-owner at www.cfwebserver.com. Is there a setting somewhere that I am missing that would set this correctly in mailman? Is this more likely a server email config setting?


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Mailman+and+CPanel>.

If this were a standard GNU Mailman installation, I would say fix_url
can fix this (See <http://wiki.list.org/x/mIA9>).

cPanel Mailman has its own cPanel list creation process that "should"
set things up properly when a list is created in the pack186.com domain.
I can't say why that didn't happen here unless the list was created by
some means other than cPanel's process. At this point, the admins of the
host installation can probably fix this with fix_url, but there's
probably nothing you as a list owner can do unless you have shell access
to the Mailman installation on the server.

--  
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/chadcrowell%40gmail.com

From cedric at gn.apc.org  Fri Mar 14 23:16:36 2014
From: cedric at gn.apc.org (Cedric Knight)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 22:16:36 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Reducing false positives with spam markings
	with Gmail, etc.
Message-ID: <53237FC4.4070409@gn.apc.org>

Stephen J. Turnbull <stephen at xemacs.org> wrote on Wed Nov 20 2013:
> Steven Clift writes:
>  > Thanks Stephen.
>  > 
>  > Are most mailman hosts finding their mail in Gmail heading to the
>  > "Promotions" tab or "Forums" optional tab?
> 
> I don't receive any Mailman mail at my Gmail address, so I can't say.
> But hold that thought ... if you don't get any response, I'll ping
> some of my gmail subscribers and ask them.  (Remind me after a week or
> so, I've been unreliable at remembering promises recently.)

Reminder?

I've had complaints about this specifically with list *confirmation
emails* being being misclassified under "promotions", resulting in some
users assuming they are subscribed when they haven't actually confirmed.

There are hints about this change at Gmail at
<http://groupserver.org/groups/development/messages/topic/iYuRUBysGQMMbZ98m73dZ>,
that it might be a result of the "Precedence: bulk" header added to
administrivia messages.

Any more evidence?  Do any standards help decide if Gmail or Mailman is
wrong?

CK

From paul.crown at cdp4.me  Fri Mar 14 23:12:02 2014
From: paul.crown at cdp4.me (Paul Crown)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 17:12:02 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Configuration of New Mailman Instance
Message-ID: <53237EB2.4030803@cdp4.me>

Greetings,

This is my first experience with installing and setting up Mailman.  My
servers are all Ubuntu 12.04.  Mailman was install to install from
repositories.

I could use some pointers to where on Wiki, Docs or Archives describing
configuring Mailman.  Most of the help I am reading is for Mailman,
Apache2 and Postfix to all be running on the same server.

My scenerio:

Server W is running Apache2, and my initial config has
http://lists.mydomain.com letting me login as admin and create new lists.
Server P is running Postfix
Server R is my mail-relay for outbound SMTP traffic unique to this domain

No messages are being sent out through R or any other server for that
matter.
No messages are being received by P.  (5.1.1 list-email address
rejected: user unknown in relay recipient table.

Any pointers appreciated.

Paul

From yan.juras at qc.cuny.edu  Fri Mar 14 22:42:52 2014
From: yan.juras at qc.cuny.edu (Yan Juras)
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 21:42:52 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can confirmation messages use custom Received:
	headers?
Message-ID: <1BECBC8031DA49408C157A9839EC096B20F1883B@XMBX1.qc.ads>

Hi.

I've searched the archives several different ways about this and not found anything, so...

We run Mailman v2.1.4 on SuSE Enterprise v11 SP3 using Sendmail. The box is a virtual machine and pretty much dedicated to the purpose of being a listserver, at least at present.

We recently got a slew of Spamcop complaints about confirmation emails we sent as a result of subscription requests submitted via the web interface. These emails clearly state that the confirmation emails are a result of subscription requests submitted from a specific IP address. Clearly from the user's POV these emails are spam and I totally understand why the users are submitting the complaints in this instance. However, I also don't think that my mail system should be held responsible for sending these emails. (Consider that I am not held responsible for damage caused by my car if the person driving the car stole it from me.)

I was looking at the Spamcop FAQ and noticed a brief comment about the Received headers that some webmail interfaces add that list the IP address of the client that used HTTP to submit the email via a webmail GUI, for example:

Received: from 66.191.176.186 by webmail-d137.sysops.aol.com (149.174.18.27) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Sat, 13 Apr 2013 08:07:55 -0400

The Spamcop FAQ kind of implies that Spamcop will consider the source of the HTTP (in this example, 66.191.176.186) as the sender, rather than the email server that converted the HTTP to SMTP. I've not checked this at all, so I may be reading into the FAQ.

So my question is this: can Mailman be configured in some straightforward way to add a Received: header with the IP address of the host that requested the subscription? I am not a Python programmer, but I am capable of making code changes if necessary.

Comments?
--
Yan Juras
Manager of Systems Engineering
Office of Converging Technologies, I Bldg room 100
Queens College / 65-30 Kissena Blvd / Flushing NY 11367
(718)997-5906 / FAX: (718)997-5678

Need Assistance? Call The OCT Help Desk at (718) 997-4444
OCT will never ask for your personal information or password. Never share this information with anyone.


From rodti at macleary.com  Sat Mar 15 12:08:43 2014
From: rodti at macleary.com (Rodti MacLeary)
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 11:08:43 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] 'Dynamic' footer
In-Reply-To: <5321CE86.8010607@msapiro.net>
References: <a980f08ad158db9c4e4b694ca42cdc12@macleary.com>
 <5321CE86.8010607@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <E7ADCDA5-6925-4046-A52F-44B04D4E8610@macleary.com>


On 13 Mar 2014, at 15:28, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:

> For Mailman 2.1, the Mailman/Handlers/Decorate.py module (called by
> SMTPDirect.py during outgoing message processing) augments the
> replacement dictionary for headers and footers from a 'decoration-data'
> dictionary in the messages metadata if it exists.

Thanks Barry, Mark and Christian for these suggestions.  I?ll try them out this weekend :-)

r.

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Mar 15 17:05:12 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 09:05:12 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Reducing false positives with spam markings
 with Gmail, etc.
In-Reply-To: <53237FC4.4070409@gn.apc.org>
References: <53237FC4.4070409@gn.apc.org>
Message-ID: <53247A38.6040704@msapiro.net>

On 03/14/2014 03:16 PM, Cedric Knight wrote:
> 
> There are hints about this change at Gmail at
> <http://groupserver.org/groups/development/messages/topic/iYuRUBysGQMMbZ98m73dZ>,
> that it might be a result of the "Precedence: bulk" header added to
> administrivia messages.


Most Mailman generated messages are Precedence: bulk. The use of
Precedence: headers is discouraged by RFC 2076, and I would consider not
adding the Precedence: bulk header to confirmations.

This would seem reasonable even though some confirmation messages are
actually spurious [1]. The question is should there be a Precedence
header at all, and if so, what should its value be?

[1] I once thoughtlessly posted an example of an unsubscribe URL using
real data for my address and this list, and now every time a search
engine web crawler crawls the list archive, I get an unsubscribe
confirmation request.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Mar 15 18:20:29 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 10:20:29 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can confirmation messages use custom Received:
 headers?
In-Reply-To: <1BECBC8031DA49408C157A9839EC096B20F1883B@XMBX1.qc.ads>
References: <1BECBC8031DA49408C157A9839EC096B20F1883B@XMBX1.qc.ads>
Message-ID: <53248BDD.6060303@msapiro.net>

On 03/14/2014 02:42 PM, Yan Juras wrote:
> 
> I was looking at the Spamcop FAQ and noticed a brief comment about the Received headers that some webmail interfaces add that list the IP address of the client that used HTTP to submit the email via a webmail GUI, for example:
> 
> Received: from 66.191.176.186 by webmail-d137.sysops.aol.com (149.174.18.27) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Sat, 13 Apr 2013 08:07:55 -0400
> 
> The Spamcop FAQ kind of implies that Spamcop will consider the source of the HTTP (in this example, 66.191.176.186) as the sender, rather than the email server that converted the HTTP to SMTP. I've not checked this at all, so I may be reading into the FAQ.
> 
> So my question is this: can Mailman be configured in some straightforward way to add a Received: header with the IP address of the host that requested the subscription? I am not a Python programmer, but I am capable of making code changes if necessary.


Received: headers and the circumstances in which they are added are
defined by RFC 5321 and its predecessors. They are to be added at the
beginning of the headers by servers that relay the message. The
implication is that the agent that generates the message (Mailman in
this case) should not be including a Received: header in the generated
message, but you could do it.

The attached patch is an example of how this could be done. Note that
the Received: header is inserted at the front of the msg._headers list
rather than setting it in the normal way which would add it at the end.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
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From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Mar 15 18:45:57 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 10:45:57 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Configuration of New Mailman Instance
In-Reply-To: <53237EB2.4030803@cdp4.me>
References: <53237EB2.4030803@cdp4.me>
Message-ID: <532491D5.8020008@msapiro.net>

On 03/14/2014 03:12 PM, Paul Crown wrote:
> 
> My scenerio:
> 
> Server W is running Apache2, and my initial config has
> http://lists.mydomain.com letting me login as admin and create new lists.
> Server P is running Postfix
> Server R is my mail-relay for outbound SMTP traffic unique to this domain
> 
> No messages are being sent out through R or any other server for that
> matter.
> No messages are being received by P.  (5.1.1 list-email address
> rejected: user unknown in relay recipient table.


Which server has Mailman installed?

It looks like W.

This can work, but I might install Mailman on P and configure Postfix on
P per <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node12.html>.

If Mailman is on W, you have to configure Postfix on P to relay list
mail to W and have some kind of MTA/MDA on W to deliver that mail to
Mailman.

If Mailman is on P you need to share Mailman's file system or at least
$var-prefix via NFS or whatever between W and P.

Either way, you need to set SMTPHOST in Mailman/mm_cfg.py to point to R.

If your only issue is P's "user unknown in relay recipient table" see
<user unknown in relay recipient table> for how to get Mailman to write
it's virtual-mailman file which can be used as relay_recipient_maps on P.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Mar 15 21:36:41 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 13:36:41 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Configuration of New Mailman Instance
In-Reply-To: <532491D5.8020008@msapiro.net>
References: <53237EB2.4030803@cdp4.me> <532491D5.8020008@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <5324B9D9.2030106@msapiro.net>

On 03/15/2014 10:45 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> 
> If your only issue is P's "user unknown in relay recipient table" see
> <user unknown in relay recipient table> for how to get Mailman to write
> it's virtual-mailman file which can be used as relay_recipient_maps on P.


Ooops... copy/paste error. That should be

... see <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node12.html> for how to get
Mailman to write it's virtual-mailman file ...

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Mar 15 23:08:08 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 15:08:08 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Can confirmation messages use custom Received:
 headers?
In-Reply-To: <53248BDD.6060303@msapiro.net>
References: <53248BDD.6060303@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <5324CF48.2030909@msapiro.net>

Mark Sapiro wrote:
> The attached patch is an example of how this could be done.


Here's an updated patch. The only difference is it uses
email.Utils.formatdate() instead of strftime() to create the date/time
string.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
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From peterf at wcasa.org  Thu Mar 20 19:05:28 2014
From: peterf at wcasa.org (Peter Fiala - WCASA)
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2014 13:05:28 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Non-Members Get Messages
Message-ID: <3BAC8501B847AA438D6A7A4EFC8C893879BFE14252@WCASA-DC-01.wcasa.local>

Mailman Community,

I've been a Mailman user for a few years but have never been able to figure out this mystery, which may be completely obvious I realize. Someone emails me and requests to be taken off the list. I go to remove them and they are not members. They confirm that they are not on the list under any other email address. How could this possibly happen?

Thanks anyone for your help.

Peter

Peter Fiala
Technology & Events Coordinator
Wisconsin Coalition Against Sexual Assault (WCASA)
2801 W. Beltline Hwy., Ste 202, Madison, WI 53713
Telephone: 608-257-1516; Direct: 608-284-5494
Fax: 608-257-2150
Website: www.wcasa.org<http://www.wcasa.org/>

Creating the Social Change Necessary to End Sexual Violence
Please consider a holiday gift to help us continue our important work into 2014.  You can make donations to WCASA directly online by visiting our website<http://www.wcasa.org/>.


From jsetton at waycast.com  Fri Mar 21 00:54:23 2014
From: jsetton at waycast.com (Jacques Setton)
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2014 00:54:23 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Messages addressed to Mailman lists are
	systematically diverted to predefined default email account
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAABrkrVwVjUhEkR8dnKBofUABAAAAAA==@waycast.com>

MEMO RESENT with minor corrections 
-----Message d'origine-----
De?: Jacques Setton [mailto:jsetton at waycast.com] 
Envoy??: vendredi 21 mars 2014 00:26
??: 'Mark Sapiro'
Cc?: 'mailman-users at python.org'
Objet?: RE: [Mailman-Users] Messages addressed to Mailman lists are
systematically diverted to predefined default email account

Hi Mark,

Thank you for your appreciated comments to which I responded individually :
see the embedded annotations further below...

I did modify some of the parameters you  highlighted. Unfortunately, at best
the previously observed problem still persists despite the modifications
made. In other instances, some modifications cause the alteration of
Postfix' operation which results in a non-delivery of all emails...

To further investigate the issue, I have decided to use two separate domains
attached to same VPS machine as follows :

1) 'domain.info' for incoming & outgoing messages addressed to and from
mails solely related to Mailman lists.

2) 'domain.net' for all non-Mailman lists incoming & outgoing regular
messages.  

The test results show - see the 1st attachment - that all messages addressed
to Mailman accounts (like testlist at domain.info and
testlist-request at domain.info )  are systematically diverted to the
previously specified default account admin at domain.fr . Whereas messages
addressed to standard email accounts (for ex. admin-lists at domain.net ) get
through without any problem...

In conclusion, it turns out that even domain differentiation does not solve
the problem. It thus seems as if  Plesk's supervision of Postfix does not
cope well with the standard operation Mailman's lists. 

This is very puzzling as Parallels claims that Mailman is officially
supported by Plesk V10+ . On such configured systems, Mailman is even
activated directly from Plesk's Control Pannel - see their Manual section
about this in the second attachment.

So my ultimate question will simply be : has anyone ever succeeded in
adequately deploying Mailman over a Plesk-based Linux server ? If this is
the case, I would invite anyone who has done it before to let us know how
they managed to make it work as expected.

Many thanks in advance for your and others help on this, as I have spent an
enormous amount of time trying to resolve the case without any success so
far...

Kind regards,
  
 Jacques Setton
 jsetton at waycast.com  
   
-----Message d'origine-----
De?: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] Envoy??: vendredi 14 mars 2014
03:13 ??: mailman-users at python.org Objet?: Re: [Mailman-Users] Messages
addressed to Mailman lists are systematically diverted to predefined default
email account

On 03/13/2014 11:59 AM, Jacques Setton wrote:
> 
> For example, in the below maillog trace we see that the memo initially 
> addressed to myslist at domain.net by admin-europe at waycast.eu is finally 
> delivered to the default account admin at domain.net instead of being 
> processed by '/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mylist' as it should 
> normally be the case :

>> But we don't see why? Strangely enough, there is no Postfix log entry
saying anything about the redirect from orig_to=<mylist at domain.net> to
to=<admin at domain.fr>. Also, there is a 2 and a half minute delay between
receipt of the message and delivery (delays=0.1/0.01/60/90) of which 60
seconds is connection setup time including DNS, HELO and TLS; and 90 seconds
is message transmission time. Does this seem OK?

I am not sure why there a such long delay before mail rejection and
rerouting. As previously indicated, this behavior seems to result from an
non recognition of a Mailman related recipient account which requires a
different treatment, as opposed to standard user email accounts.

>> Anyway, this can occur if there is a virtual mapping from 
>> mylist at domain.net to admin at domain.fr that is taking priority over 
>> /etc/mailman/virtual-mailman

To my knowledge, such mapping is not established. The only mapping that I am
aware of, in this respect, is one depicted in the 'aliases' file located in
the /var/spool/postfix/plesk directory and which contains the following
mapping :
 drweb	admin at domain.fr 
 kluser	admin at domain.fr 
 postmaster	admin at domain.fr 
 root	admin at domain.fr 
 anonymous	admin at domain.fr 
 drweb-daemon	admin at domain.fr 
 mailer-daemon	admin at domain.fr 


> - - -
> [root at vps12345 ~]# more /usr/local/psa/var/log/maillog | grep 
> 1A52911616E
> 
> Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/smtpd[19763]: 1A52911616E:
> client=relay6-d.mail.gandi.net[217.70.183.198]
> 
> Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/cleanup[19767]: 1A52911616E:
> message-id=<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAABD
> lMhHAh
> X9PqvkRNi1Uq10BAAAAAA==@waycast.eu>
> 
> Mar 11 23:12:27 vps12345 postfix/qmgr[19671]: 1A52911616E:
> from=<admin-europe at waycast.eu>, size=17420, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
> 
> Mar 11 23:14:57 vps129345 postfix/smtp[19770]: 1A52911616E:
> to=<admin at domain.fr>, orig_to=<mylist at domain.net>, 
> relay=mx1.ovh.net[213.186.33.29]:25, delay=150, delays=0.1/0.01/60/90, 
> dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (250 ok 1394576096 qp 28763)
> 
> Mar 11 23:14:57 vps12345 postfix/qmgr[19671]: 1A52911616E: removed
> 
> [root at vps12345 ~]#
> 
> - - -
> 
> Despite skimming through this Mailman-Users list and many other source 
> publications, I haven't yet been able to figure out the exact origin 
> of this abnormal behavior. Though I suspect a poorly defined Postfix
'transport'
> specification (see item 7 further below), but this remains to be
confirmed.

>> The transport involved should be local.

I have removed all transport definitions, meaning that we fallback to the
default values applied for Postfix.


> Please note that I am using a hosted VPS running CentOS with, among 
> other things, Plesk, Postfix and Mailman. All software versions and 
> configuration details are communicated below. Another piece of useful 
> information : the 'admin at domain.fr' default account has been specified 
> at Plesk's web admin interface level.

>> See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Mailman+and+Plesk>

I have already seen this as well as other published docs, and have applied
all the recommendations applicable to using Mailman with Plesk, including
the related Admin Guide.

> 2.      Mailman Configuration File relevant excerpts (mm_cfg.py located in
> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/)
> 
> { . }
> 
> DEFAULT_URL_HOST   = 'lists.vps12345.ovh.net'
> 
> DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'vps12345.ovh.net'
> 
> MTA = 'Postfix'
> 
> VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()
> 
> add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
> 
> add_virtualhost('lists.domain.net', domain.net')
> 
> POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['domain.net']
> 
> VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN = 'localhost'

>> You may or may not need this, but if you do, you may need Mailman's
bin/genaliases to update virtual-mailman.

I have removed the 'VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN' above setting.

> # STANZA START: mylist
> 
> # CREATED: Mon Feb 24 21:00:44 2014
> 
> mylist at domain.net              mylist

>> With VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN = 'localhost', these should be
>> mylist at domain.net              mylist at localhost
>> and so on.

This is no longer applicable, since I am no longer using the
'VIRTUAL_MAILMAN_LOCAL_DOMAIN' setting.
However, after removing this parameter, no improvement was noticed...

> # *** Added 'virtual-mailman' reference in 'virtual_alias_maps'
> 
> virtual_alias_maps = $virtual_maps,
> hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/virtual,
> hash:/etc/mailman/virtual-mailman

>> virtual_alias_domains = domain.net

When I apply this setting, the regular Postfix mail operation stops to
function while this still does not resolve the previously reported
problem... 


> # *** Added Postfix Transport location to 'transport_maps' parameter

>> Why? This is probably only for postfix_to_mailman.

I am not using the postfix_to_mailman scheme. The related section was/is
left commented in the 'master.cf' configuration file.

> virtual_transport = plesk_virtual

>> This makes plesk_virtual the transport for all virtual mailbox domains.

For normal mail operation, the transport has to be 'plesk-virtual' (see the
1st attached document). Otherwise, I don't see what else could be specified
here which won't break the normal mail operation...

> plesk_virtual_destination_recipient_limit = 1
> 
> mailman_destination_recipient_limit = 1

>>This is for postfix_to_mailman

As previously indicated, we are not using the 'Postfix_to_Mailman' scheme.
Hence, this parameter has been dropped, however without seeing any
improvement of the original problem. 

> 7.       Postfix Added Transport Table scheme (transport and transport.db
> located in /etc/postfix/)
> 
> The below-specified transports remained commented out because they 
> cause a transport failure when uncommented. It seems that the 
> specifications used are probably invalid. These will need to be 
> reworked and we'd welcome suggestions as to what to specify instead...

>> See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/EYDt>, in particular the paragraph
postfix_to_mailman.py is an alternative to and is incompatible with Mailman
delivery via aliases. If you are configuring both Mailman aliases and
postfix_to_mailman.py, you are making a mistake.

I have read mots FAQs on the subject and followed all related
recommendations. In addition, I restate that it was not, and is still not,
our intention to use the 'postfix_to_mailman.py' scheme...  

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan



From cpz at tuunq.com  Fri Mar 21 01:04:50 2014
From: cpz at tuunq.com (Carl Zwanzig)
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2014 17:04:50 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Non-Members Get Messages
In-Reply-To: <3BAC8501B847AA438D6A7A4EFC8C893879BFE14252@WCASA-DC-01.wcasa.local>
References: <3BAC8501B847AA438D6A7A4EFC8C893879BFE14252@WCASA-DC-01.wcasa.local>
Message-ID: <532B8222.1030702@tuunq.com>

On 3/20/2014 11:05 AM, Peter Fiala - WCASA wrote:
> Someone emails me and requests to be taken off the list. I go to remove
> them and they are not members. They confirm that they are not on the list
> under any other email address. How could this possibly happen?

Have you checked both the mailman and smtp logs to see if the address is 
being sent the mail by mailman? It's possible that some other entity is 
forwarding or redirecting the email.

z!

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 21 01:34:32 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2014 17:34:32 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Non-Members Get Messages
In-Reply-To: <3BAC8501B847AA438D6A7A4EFC8C893879BFE14252@WCASA-DC-01.wcasa.local>
References: <3BAC8501B847AA438D6A7A4EFC8C893879BFE14252@WCASA-DC-01.wcasa.local>
Message-ID: <532B8918.4050005@msapiro.net>

On 03/20/2014 11:05 AM, Peter Fiala - WCASA wrote:
> Mailman Community,
> 
> I've been a Mailman user for a few years but have never been able to figure out this mystery, which may be completely obvious I realize. Someone emails me and requests to be taken off the list. I go to remove them and they are not members. They confirm that they are not on the list under any other email address. How could this possibly happen?


You need to obtain one of the "list" mails from the user and examine all
the headers of that message. This will tell you two things:

That the message did in fact come from your Mailman list if it did.

And if it did, most likely there will be information in the Received:
headers that will reveal the member address that Mailman sent to.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 21 02:17:20 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2014 18:17:20 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Messages addressed to Mailman lists are
 systematically diverted to predefined default email account
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAABrkrVwVjUhEkR8dnKBofUABAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAABrkrVwVjUhEkR8dnKBofUABAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
Message-ID: <532B9320.8070009@msapiro.net>

On 03/20/2014 04:54 PM, Jacques Setton wrote:
> 
> In conclusion, it turns out that even domain differentiation does not solve
> the problem. It thus seems as if  Plesk's supervision of Postfix does not
> cope well with the standard operation Mailman's lists. 
> 
> This is very puzzling as Parallels claims that Mailman is officially
> supported by Plesk V10+ . On such configured systems, Mailman is even
> activated directly from Plesk's Control Pannel - see their Manual section
> about this in the second attachment.


Please (re)read the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/tIA9>.


> So my ultimate question will simply be : has anyone ever succeeded in
> adequately deploying Mailman over a Plesk-based Linux server ? If this is
> the case, I would invite anyone who has done it before to let us know how
> they managed to make it work as expected.


The above referenced FAQ says in part "It is possible to trick Plesk
into recognizing newer versions installed manually but it's not for the
faint of heart."

There may be someone on this list that can tell you more than that, but
I can't.

The implication is you should use the Mailman packaged with Plesk and
follow Plesk's documentation and get help from Plesk resources, and
after you get that working you might consider trying to upgrade Mailman.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From farokh at mcfsoftware.com  Fri Mar 21 01:27:26 2014
From: farokh at mcfsoftware.com (Farokh Irani)
Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2014 20:27:26 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Non-Members Get Messages
In-Reply-To: <3BAC8501B847AA438D6A7A4EFC8C893879BFE14252@WCASA-DC-01.wcasa.local>
References: <3BAC8501B847AA438D6A7A4EFC8C893879BFE14252@WCASA-DC-01.wcasa.local>
Message-ID: <532B876E.1050406@mcfsoftware.com>

They were originally subscribed under some other email address (now long 
forgotten) and that email address is still valid and has forwarding set 
up. You can verify what is going on by getting the full headers of the 
message(s) in question (something not always so easy to do).

Farokh
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
MCF Software...simply dependably engineered
For all your computer and networking needs including hosting solutions
for every need.
Phone: 845-735-0210
Cell: 914-262-1594



> Peter Fiala - WCASA <mailto:peterf at wcasa.org>
> March 20, 2014 14:05
> Mailman Community,
>
> I've been a Mailman user for a few years but have never been able to 
> figure out this mystery, which may be completely obvious I realize. 
> Someone emails me and requests to be taken off the list. I go to 
> remove them and they are not members. They confirm that they are not 
> on the list under any other email address. How could this possibly happen?
>
> Thanks anyone for your help.
>
> Peter
>
> Peter Fiala
> Technology & Events Coordinator
> Wisconsin Coalition Against Sexual Assault (WCASA)
> 2801 W. Beltline Hwy., Ste 202, Madison, WI 53713
> Telephone: 608-257-1516; Direct: 608-284-5494
> Fax: 608-257-2150
> Website: www.wcasa.org<http://www.wcasa.org/>
>
> Creating the Social Change Necessary to End Sexual Violence
> Please consider a holiday gift to help us continue our important work 
> into 2014. You can make donations to WCASA directly online by visiting 
> our website<http://www.wcasa.org/>.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: 
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/farokh%40mcfsoftware.com

From stephen at xemacs.org  Fri Mar 21 03:39:00 2014
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2014 11:39:00 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Reducing false positives with spam
	markings	with Gmail, etc.
In-Reply-To: <53237FC4.4070409@gn.apc.org>
References: <53237FC4.4070409@gn.apc.org>
Message-ID: <87lhw4i8cb.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Cedric Knight writes:
 > Stephen J. Turnbull <stephen at xemacs.org> wrote on Wed Nov 20 2013:

 > >  > Are most mailman hosts finding their mail in Gmail heading to the
 > >  > "Promotions" tab or "Forums" optional tab?
 > > 
 > > I don't receive any Mailman mail at my Gmail address, so I can't say.

Recently I do get some Mailman mail at my Gmail address, and I've
never seen it in the Promotions folder.  Nor have any of the xemacs
subscribers I've talked to.  But these are all programming-related
lists; it may be that Gmail's "AI" realizes that there's no way this
is a sales pitch.

It occurs to me now that if someone has a "Forums" tab, I would expect
Mailman mail to got there if and only if Mailman uses the RFC 2369
headers (possibly with the exception of List-Unsubscribe) and/or the
RFC 2919 List-Id header.  You can turn these off.

 > I've had complaints about this specifically with list *confirmation
 > emails* being being misclassified under "promotions", resulting in some
 > users assuming they are subscribed when they haven't actually confirmed.

That I can't help with.  As Mark suggests the "Precedence: bulk"
header may confuse some MUAs like Gmail.

 > Any more evidence?  Do any standards help decide if Gmail or Mailman is
 > wrong?

There are no standards for classifying mail, really.  I would say
Gmail is wrong, though, because confirmation emails are very easy to
recognize, and very urgent to most users (consider password reset).
Mailman might be able to help by trying to mimic the typical password
reset confirmation mail.

The problem may be that phishers often use mail that looks like a
confirmation mail, but then you should get a phishing warning.  Or
maybe the issue is that Mailman allows confirmation by email, where
most password confirmations require going to a specific web address.


From stephen at xemacs.org  Fri Mar 21 17:51:10 2014
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 01:51:10 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Reducing false positives with
	spam	markings	with Gmail, etc.
In-Reply-To: <87lhw4i8cb.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
References: <53237FC4.4070409@gn.apc.org>
 <87lhw4i8cb.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Message-ID: <87fvmbijgh.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Stephen J. Turnbull writes:
 > Cedric Knight writes:

 >  > Any more evidence?  Do any standards help decide if Gmail or Mailman is
 >  > wrong?

Late-breaking news: apparently comment notification for Google Summer
of Code are ending up in some folder, not in Inbox in Gmail.  Clearly
Google's bad if they can't even get their own (somewhat urgent, this
was reported with student app submission less than 12 hours away) mail
through. :-(

From thend20 at pair.com  Sat Mar 22 18:20:59 2014
From: thend20 at pair.com (Tim H.)
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 13:20:59 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to remove invalid e-mail address
Message-ID: <532DC67B.8010909@pair.com>

Somehow an e-mail address with the below form was subscribed to one of 
my lists:

"user at domain.tld /"

The e-mail address does not show up in the web interface, nor does it 
show in "list_members", "find_members", or "list_members -i".  I also 
tried using withlist.  Essentially, I tried everything on this page:

http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030544

But, the e-mail address persists.  Does anyone know of another method 
for removing this address?  I've been trying to use dumpdb to dump the 
config.pck to a text file, and manually edit them out.  However, the 
config_list command does not like the format of the dumpdb txt file.

I found this e-mail address because 'disabled' reports it as 
"Mailman.Errors.NotAMemberError" every morning :/

Thanks,
Tim H.

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Mar 22 19:32:51 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 11:32:51 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to remove invalid e-mail address
In-Reply-To: <532DC67B.8010909@pair.com>
References: <532DC67B.8010909@pair.com>
Message-ID: <532DD753.7070006@msapiro.net>

On 03/22/2014 10:20 AM, Tim H. wrote:
> Somehow an e-mail address with the below form was subscribed to one of
> my lists:
> 
> "user at domain.tld /"
> 
> The e-mail address does not show up in the web interface, nor does it
> show in "list_members", "find_members", or "list_members -i".
...
> I found this e-mail address because 'disabled' reports it as
> "Mailman.Errors.NotAMemberError" every morning :/


I suspect what's really happening is the address "user at domain.tld /" is
not a member, i.e. it is not in either of the list's 'members' or
'digest_members' dictionaries, but it does have bounce_info. If this is
the case, the script at
<http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/fix_bad_bounce_info.py> should fix it,
and if this is not the case, running the script will do no harm.

Copy the script to Mailman's bin/ directory and run it per the
instructions at the beginning.

If this does not fix the problem, report everything related to this
address in the output from the dumpdb of the config.pck.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From thend20 at pair.com  Sat Mar 22 20:06:22 2014
From: thend20 at pair.com (Tim H.)
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 15:06:22 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] [SOLVED] Unable to remove invalid e-mail address
In-Reply-To: <532DD753.7070006@msapiro.net>
References: <532DC67B.8010909@pair.com> <532DD753.7070006@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <532DDF2E.8060601@pair.com>

>
> I suspect what's really happening is the address "user at domain.tld /" is
> not a member, i.e. it is not in either of the list's 'members' or
> 'digest_members' dictionaries, but it does have bounce_info. If this is
> the case, the script at
> <http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/fix_bad_bounce_info.py> should fix it,
> and if this is not the case, running the script will do no harm.
>
> Copy the script to Mailman's bin/ directory and run it per the
> instructions at the beginning.
>
> If this does not fix the problem, report everything related to this
> address in the output from the dumpdb of the config.pck.
>

The script was exactly what I needed.  I just manually ran withlist and 
executed the command:

 >>> del m.bounce_info["user at domain.tld /"]

Thanks!


From jsetton at waycast.com  Sat Mar 22 22:54:23 2014
From: jsetton at waycast.com (Jacques Setton)
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 22:54:23 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman over a
	Plesk-based Linux system ?
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>

Hi,

We continue to experience serious difficulties in getting Mailman to fully
operate as expected on a Plesk- packaged Linux server system.

The list management web interface works fine but we definitely can't get
messages addressed to Mailman-related list accounts be correctly processed.

We'd therefore like to know whether anyone ever succeeded in deploying
Mailman over Plesk and, if so, what was done to have it work satisfactorily.


 

For information, the relevant configuration details of the VPS we are using
are :

-       CentOS 6.4

-       Apache 2.2.15

-       Plesk Panel 11.5.30

-       Postfix 2.8.14

-       Mailman 2.1.12

-       Python 3.3.1

We'd appreciate any feedback / guidance with respect to such environment.

Regards,

 Jacques Setton

  <mailto:jsetton at waycast.com> jsetton at waycast.com


From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Mar 22 23:17:39 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 15:17:39 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
 over a Plesk-based Linux system ?
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
Message-ID: <532E0C03.10801@msapiro.net>

On 03/22/2014 02:54 PM, Jacques Setton wrote:
> 
> For information, the relevant configuration details of the VPS we are using
> are :
> 
...
> -       Mailman 2.1.12
> 
> -       Python 3.3.1


I overlooked this in your original post because it isn't relevant to
your mail delivery issue, but Mailman 2.1.12 is not compatible with
Python 3.3.x. See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/pYA9>.

I also see from your OP that you are trying to run the RHEL Mailman
package under Plesk. I suggest that instead of this, you try the Plesk
provided Mailman.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From jsetton at waycast.com  Sun Mar 23 18:15:00 2014
From: jsetton at waycast.com (Jacques Setton)
Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2014 18:15:00 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
	over a Plesk-based Linux system ?
In-Reply-To: <532E0C03.10801@msapiro.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532E0C03.10801@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAADB7T/6Nu5lLr1Hdg1Bwn+MBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>

The software version listing in my original post was produced directly from
within Plesk Panel : ' Server Tab > Server Components Link > Components
Listing Page '.
In the resulting page listing, Python appeared as :  'mod_python
3.3.1-14.el6.1' 

However, to be more accurate, here is a trimmed component listing that I get
when using the console command  ' $ yum list installed ' :
[ ... ]
httpd.x86_64			2.2.15-29.el6.centos
@base  
mailman.x86_64		3:2.1.12-18.el6			@base
plesk-base.x86_64		11.5.30-cos6.build115130819.13
@PSA_11_5_30-dist
postfix.x86_64		2:2.8.14-13040119
@PSA_11_5_30-dist
python.x86_64		2.6.6-37.el6_4 			@updates         
python-ethtool.x86_64	0.6-3.el6				@base

python-iniparse.noarch	0.3.1-2.1.el6
@anaconda-CentOS-201106060106.x86_64/6.0
python-iwlib.x86_64		0.1-1.2.el6
@anaconda-CentOS-201106060106.x86_64/6.0
python-libs.x86_64		2.6.6-37.el6_4
@updates         
python-pycurl.x86_64		7.19.0-8.el6
@updates         
python-urlgrabber.noarch	 3.9.1-8.el6
@base  
[ ... ]

On this last listing, Pyhton's version is 2.6.x which seems to be what the
FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/pYA9> is recommending for Mailman 2.2.12 . So
I guess we should be OK on that side...
 
Regarding Mailman, the revision that I am using is the one which came along
with the Plesk-based server pack delivered by our cloud hosting supplier
(OVH). I checked Parallels' forums and found Plesk upgrade trace logs
including statements like "... skip keypackage
'mailman-3:2.1.12-18.el6.x86_64' from component mailman - same or newer
version of this package is already installed (in system
mailman-3:2.1.12-18.el6.x86_64) ... ". Thus, I trust that we should be OK on
that side as well... 
- - - 
 Jacques Setton
 jsetton at waycast.com
 
(*) See for example
http://forum.parallels.com/showthread.php?289824-Upgrade-11-0-9-gt-11-5-30&p
=705452&viewfull=1#post705452 

-----Message d'origine-----
De?: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Envoy??: samedi 22 mars 2014 23:18
??: mailman-users at python.org
Objet?: Re: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
over a Plesk-based Linux system ?

On 03/22/2014 02:54 PM, Jacques Setton wrote:
> 
> For information, the relevant configuration details of the VPS we are 
> using are :
> 
...
> -       Mailman 2.1.12
> 
> -       Python 3.3.1

I overlooked this in your original post because it isn't relevant to your
mail delivery issue, but Mailman 2.1.12 is not compatible with Python 3.3.x.
See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/pYA9>.

I also see from your OP that you are trying to run the RHEL Mailman package
under Plesk. I suggest that instead of this, you try the Plesk provided
Mailman.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan



From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Mar 24 02:23:44 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2014 18:23:44 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
 over a Plesk-based Linux system ?
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAADB7T/6Nu5lLr1Hdg1Bwn+MBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532E0C03.10801@msapiro.net>
 <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAADB7T/6Nu5lLr1Hdg1Bwn+MBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
Message-ID: <532F8920.5060507@msapiro.net>

On 03/23/2014 10:15 AM, Jacques Setton wrote:
> 
> On this last listing, Pyhton's version is 2.6.x which seems to be what the
> FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/pYA9> is recommending for Mailman 2.2.12 . So
> I guess we should be OK on that side...


Yes, that looks OK.


> Regarding Mailman, the revision that I am using is the one which came along
> with the Plesk-based server pack delivered by our cloud hosting supplier
> (OVH). I checked Parallels' forums and found Plesk upgrade trace logs
> including statements like "... skip keypackage
> 'mailman-3:2.1.12-18.el6.x86_64' from component mailman - same or newer
> version of this package is already installed (in system
> mailman-3:2.1.12-18.el6.x86_64) ... ". Thus, I trust that we should be OK on
> that side as well... 


OK.

Stepping back a bit, your original posts showed a lot of
postfix_to_mailman specific stuff in your Postfix configuration. I think
you said or implied that you didn't intentionally configure this.
Perhaps it is there because of Plesk. I.e. maybe Plesk's other Postfix
stuff requires that postfix_to_mailman be used for Mailman.

Perhaps you should try removing all the Mailman specific aliases and
virtual-mailman stuff and configuring postfix_to_mailman instead.

You might also talk with the provider of your VPS to ensure that the
software with which they provisioned the VPS is known to interoperate to
produce a viable Mailman server.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From jsetton at waycast.com  Mon Mar 24 15:32:07 2014
From: jsetton at waycast.com (Jacques Setton)
Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2014 15:32:07 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
	over a Plesk-based Linux system ?
In-Reply-To: <532F8920.5060507@msapiro.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532E0C03.10801@msapiro.net>
 <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAADB7T/6Nu5lLr1Hdg1Bwn+MBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532F8920.5060507@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAJHPfd9ZmY1HhC3gAQQArUsBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>

>> Stepping back a bit, your original posts showed a lot of
postfix_to_mailman 
>> specific stuff in your Postfix configuration. I think you said or implied
that you 
>> didn't intentionally configure this. Perhaps it is there because of
Plesk. I.e. 
>> maybe Plesk's other Postfix stuff requires that postfix_to_mailman be
used 
>> for Mailman.
 
The 'postfix_to_mailman' occurrences in my original posting most likely
resulted from my various attempts to solve the initially encountered
problem. I applied changes to the original Postfix and Mailman configuration
files based on information I collected from forums dealing with this topic.
Whereas I may have given a different impression, I am pretty much sure that
such scheme is NOT used by a standard Plesk-based server. 
 
To my understanding, the proof of this relies on the following facts :
 
1) There is no file labeled 'postfix-to-mailman.py' on the server => the
'locate' command returns nothing...
 
2) The corresponding lines in the 'master.cf' file were never uncommented
and always remained like this -
 
	#mailman   unix  -       n       n       -       -       pipe
	#  flags=FR user=list
argv=/usr/lib/mailman/bin/postfix-to-mailman.py
	#  ${nexthop} ${user}  
 
3) There is a diagram posted on Parallels' Knowledge Base => Page 3 of an
MTA Presentation (source URL :
http://kb.parallels.com/Attachments/kcs-15646/MTA_presentation.pdf) which
highlights the alternative use of 'plesk_virtual', 'mailman' or 'relay'
modules to process/deliver mails to their appropriate destinations.
 
4) Such finding corroborates well with the corresponding actual settings
appearing in the 'master.cf' on our server, as follows :
 
	[ ... ]
	plesk_virtual unix - n n - - pipe flags=DORhu user=popuser:popuser
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-local -f ${sender} -d ${recipient} -p
/var/qmail/mailnames

	mailman unix - n n - - pipe flags=R user=mailman:mailman
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman ${nexthop} ${user} ${recipient}
	
	# When relaying mail as backup MX, disable fallback_relay to avoid
MX loops
	relay     unix  -       -       n       -       -       smtp      -o
smtp_fallback_relay=
	smtp      inet  n       -       n       -       -       smtpd
 	[ ... ]

5) The above settings specify the target 'argv=' routines as being either
'postfix-local' or 'postfix-mailman', both located in
'/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/' directory. I checked and confirm that they are there
as expected. In addition, this is fully in-line with the MTA Presentation
diagram referred to in point 3 above...   
 
  
>> Perhaps you should try removing all the Mailman specific aliases and 
>> virtual-mailman stuff and configuring postfix_to_mailman instead.
 
Based on the previous comments, if we removed all the Mailman specific
aliases, etc. I believe that the system wouldn't work better and would
probably even generate errors (due to the missing 'p-to-m.py' file). My
feeling is that the problem results more from a possible wrong parameter
setup in the remainder of 'master.cf' or possibly in 'main.cf' configuration
files, but I wouldn't be able to determine where... Would you agree with
this assessment ?

>> You might also talk with the provider of your VPS to ensure that the 
>> software with which they provisioned the VPS is known to interoperate 
>> to produce a viable Mailman server.
 
Yes. I am currently discussing with our host provider. I am also evaluating
a different pre-configured server package not using Plesk at all. I'll post
the result of this evaluation to this list shortly...

Meanwhile, any thought/suggestion on the above would be highly welcomed.
Thanks !
 
- - - 
  Jacques Setton
  jsetton at waycast.com 
 
 
-----Message d'origine-----
De?: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Envoy??: lundi 24 mars 2014 02:24
??: mailman-users at python.org
Objet?: Re: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
over a Plesk-based Linux system ?

On 03/23/2014 10:15 AM, Jacques Setton wrote:
> 
> On this last listing, Pyhton's version is 2.6.x which seems to be what 
> the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/pYA9> is recommending for Mailman 
> 2.1.12 . So I guess we should be OK on that side...

Yes, that looks OK.

> Regarding Mailman, the revision that I am using is the one which came 
> along with the Plesk-based server pack delivered by our cloud hosting 
> supplier (OVH). I checked Parallels' forums and found Plesk upgrade 
> trace logs including statements like "... skip keypackage 
> 'mailman-3:2.1.12-18.el6.x86_64' from component mailman - same or 
> newer version of this package is already installed (in system
> mailman-3:2.1.12-18.el6.x86_64) ... ". Thus, I trust that we should be 
> OK on that side as well...

OK.

Stepping back a bit, your original posts showed a lot of postfix_to_mailman
specific stuff in your Postfix configuration. I think you said or implied
that you didn't intentionally configure this.
Perhaps it is there because of Plesk. I.e. maybe Plesk's other Postfix stuff
requires that postfix_to_mailman be used for Mailman.

Perhaps you should try removing all the Mailman specific aliases and
virtual-mailman stuff and configuring postfix_to_mailman instead.

You might also talk with the provider of your VPS to ensure that the
software with which they provisioned the VPS is known to interoperate to
produce a viable Mailman server.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan



From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Mar 24 18:49:31 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2014 10:49:31 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
 over a Plesk-based Linux system ?
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAJHPfd9ZmY1HhC3gAQQArUsBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532E0C03.10801@msapiro.net>
 <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAADB7T/6Nu5lLr1Hdg1Bwn+MBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532F8920.5060507@msapiro.net>
 <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAJHPfd9ZmY1HhC3gAQQArUsBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
Message-ID: <5330702B.8010605@msapiro.net>

On 03/24/2014 07:32 AM, Jacques Setton wrote:

>  
> 3) There is a diagram posted on Parallels' Knowledge Base => Page 3 of an
> MTA Presentation (source URL :
> http://kb.parallels.com/Attachments/kcs-15646/MTA_presentation.pdf) which
> highlights the alternative use of 'plesk_virtual', 'mailman' or 'relay'
> modules to process/deliver mails to their appropriate destinations.


And the Postfix section of this presentation clearly shows the use of a
'mailman' transport which uses the module
/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman (almost certainly a version of
postfix_to_mailman.py or similar) to deliver to Mailman.

The issue appears to be that you are configuring Mailman lists in a
Postfix virtual domain which is using the plesk-virtual transport which
is apparently not compatible with normal Postfix virtual alias domains.


> 4) Such finding corroborates well with the corresponding actual settings
> appearing in the 'master.cf' on our server, as follows :
>  
> 	[ ... ]
> 	plesk_virtual unix - n n - - pipe flags=DORhu user=popuser:popuser
> argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-local -f ${sender} -d ${recipient} -p
> /var/qmail/mailnames
> 
> 	mailman unix - n n - - pipe flags=R user=mailman:mailman
> argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman ${nexthop} ${user} ${recipient}
> 	
> 	# When relaying mail as backup MX, disable fallback_relay to avoid
> MX loops
> 	relay     unix  -       -       n       -       -       smtp      -o
> smtp_fallback_relay=
> 	smtp      inet  n       -       n       -       -       smtpd
>  	[ ... ]
> 
> 5) The above settings specify the target 'argv=' routines as being either
> 'postfix-local' or 'postfix-mailman', both located in
> '/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/' directory. I checked and confirm that they are there
> as expected. In addition, this is fully in-line with the MTA Presentation
> diagram referred to in point 3 above...   
>  
>   
>>> Perhaps you should try removing all the Mailman specific aliases and 
>>> virtual-mailman stuff and configuring postfix_to_mailman instead.
>  
> Based on the previous comments, if we removed all the Mailman specific
> aliases, etc. I believe that the system wouldn't work better and would
> probably even generate errors (due to the missing 'p-to-m.py' file). My
> feeling is that the problem results more from a possible wrong parameter
> setup in the remainder of 'master.cf' or possibly in 'main.cf' configuration
> files, but I wouldn't be able to determine where... Would you agree with
> this assessment ?


No. I think if you remove the Mailman specific aliases, etc and
configure yout transport maps to use the 'mailman' transport fot your
list domain, it will work.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From jsetton at waycast.com  Tue Mar 25 21:42:59 2014
From: jsetton at waycast.com (Jacques Setton)
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2014 21:42:59 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Q : Has anyone successfully deployed Mailman
	over a Plesk-based Linux system ?
In-Reply-To: <5330702B.8010605@msapiro.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAH8NvWvvSG5JpZYNImauoF0BAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532E0C03.10801@msapiro.net>
 <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAADB7T/6Nu5lLr1Hdg1Bwn+MBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <532F8920.5060507@msapiro.net>
 <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAHqVdj4TMlNNnKyTMxcTrDTCgAAAEAAAAJHPfd9ZmY1HhC3gAQQArUsBAAAAAA==@waycast.com>
 <5330702B.8010605@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <01dc01cf486a$d01bcd90$705368b0$@waycast.com>


> 3) There is a diagram posted on Parallels' Knowledge Base => Page 3 of 
> an MTA Presentation (source URL :
> http://kb.parallels.com/Attachments/kcs-15646/MTA_presentation.pdf) 
> which highlights the alternative use of 'plesk_virtual', 'mailman' or
'relay'
> modules to process/deliver mails to their appropriate destinations.

>>And the Postfix section of this presentation clearly shows the use of a
'mailman' 
>>transport which uses the module /usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman
(almost 
>>certainly a version of postfix_to_mailman.py or similar) to deliver to
Mailman.

This could be possible, but I don't have background information details that
would support such assumption.

>> The issue appears to be that you are configuring Mailman lists in a
Postfix virtual 
>> domain which is using the plesk-virtual transport which is apparently not
compatible 
>> with normal Postfix virtual alias domains.

Again, this could be possible... But my reading of Parallels' MTA functional
diagram is that the three mechanisms should be able to co-exist :
1. ' postfix-local ' to process the local regular mails reaching $mydomain.
2. ' postfix-mailman' to process lists related mails reaching $mydomain.
3. 'smtp-relay' to process mails destined to a (remote) location referenced
in $nexthop.
But as we can see from the tests carried out further below, it doesn't seem
to operate in such manner, thus highlighting the incompatibility you
mentioned. 


> 5) The above settings specify the target 'argv=' routines as being 
> either 'postfix-local' or 'postfix-mailman', both located in 
> '/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/' directory. I checked and confirm that they are 
> there as expected. In addition, this is fully in-line with the MTA
Presentation
> diagram referred to in point 3 above...   
>  
>   

>> Perhaps you should try removing all the Mailman specific aliases and 
>> virtual-mailman stuff and configuring postfix_to_mailman instead.

a) When I remove 'virtual-mailman' and mailman 'aliases', I get the
following error when mailing to 'testlist-request' with, for example, 'help'
in the subject line :
	__________________________________
	Mar 25 19:39:45 vps39345 postfix/smtpd[12263]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT
from unknown[212.227.17.24]: 550 5.1.1 
	<testlist-request at domain.info>: Recipient address rejected: User
unknown in virtual mailbox table; from=<jsetton at waycast.fr> 
	to=<testlist-request at domain.info> proto=ESMTP
helo=<moutng.kundenserver.de>
	Mar 25 19:39:45 vps39345 postfix/smtpd[12263]: disconnect from
unknown[212.227.17.24]
	Mar 25 19:39:45 vps39345 /usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/psa-pc-remote[1763]:
Message aborted.
	__________________________________

b) When I set ' virtual_transport = mailman', all messages addressed to
'teslist' are still rerouted to 'admin at domain.fr' ! 
In addition, standard - i.e. non lists-related - mail messaging stops to
function, which is annoying as we have other applications (with associated
mail accounts) running on the same server.
For information, this server has 3 domains attached to it : domain.net,
domain.org and domain.info, the latter being the one we lately for Mailman
lists handling.  

One last detail : these tests were carried out with the Postfix 'transport'
/ 'transport.db' files containing the following added relationships :
  ' vps12345.ovh.net     mailman: '
  ' domain.info                mailman: '
These files were then used to define the transport maps parameter ins
'main.cf', as follows :
'transport_maps = , hash:/var/spool/postfix/plesk/transport,
hash:/etc/postfix/transport' .
On the other hand, the 'master.cf' configuration file remained unchanged. 

> Based on the previous comments, if we removed all the Mailman specific 
> aliases, etc. I believe that the system wouldn't work better and would 
> probably even generate errors (due to the missing 'p-to-m.py' file). 
> My feeling is that the problem results more from a possible wrong 
> parameter setup in the remainder of 'master.cf' or possibly in 
> 'main.cf' configuration files, but I wouldn't be able to determine 
> where... Would you agree with this assessment ?

>> No. I think if you remove the Mailman specific aliases, etc and configure

>> your transport maps to use the 'mailman' transport for your list domain, 
>> it will work.

As seen above, it didn't really work satisfactorily. As a result, I have
decided to abandon the use of Plesk-based server, having spent significant
time searching for a solution without finding one.
I am therefore moving ahead with the investigation of the other non-Plesk
VPS package I mentioned earlier on.

Anyway, many thanks Mark for your assistance so far. I feel sorry that it
didn't work in the end...

- - - 
 Jacques Setton
 jsetton at waycast.com




From peterf at wcasa.org  Wed Mar 26 05:49:35 2014
From: peterf at wcasa.org (Peter Fiala - WCASA)
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2014 23:49:35 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] HTML to Text-Only
Message-ID: <9AFD1925-6BBB-4A41-BCF2-0372FF132D11@wcasa.org>

One of the listservs I manage sends text-only messages though I have that option unchecked under content filtering. This happens to this list and not any others, though the option is the same for all lists I manage.

Should Mailman convert text/html parts to plain text? This conversion happens after MIME attachments have been stripped.
(Edit convert_html_to_plaintext)<http://lists.wcasa-blog.org/admin.cgi/regional_ta_sc-wcasa-blog.org/?VARHELP=contentfilter/convert_html_to_plaintext>

No      Yes



Wondering if anyone has any solutions.

Thanks.
Peter

Sent from my iPad

From rex.linuxuser at gmail.com  Wed Mar 26 08:28:26 2014
From: rex.linuxuser at gmail.com (rex)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 00:28:26 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] There are no pending requests
Message-ID: <20140326072826.GT21245@ninja.nosyntax.net>

The Mailman web page to approve messages held for approval always has
the message: "There are no pending requents," even when there 
are messages in /var/lib/mailman/data/heldmsg-mynewlist-1.pck

Running Mailman 2.1.15 under Debian Wheezy with a new list that has
never existed on any local machine. 

1) Mail that does not require approval is posted to the list normally.
2) All web pages with the exception of the one below function normally.
3) Mail from moderated subscribers produces the usual notice to the
list admin, but when the page:

http://myserver.net/cgi-bin/mailman/admindb/mynewlist

is visited, this message appears:

"There are no pending requests. Click here to reload this page."

Reloading the page makes no difference. 

I tried the hold_again script from here:
http://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/

When the hold_again script is run, this is the result:

root@ /usr/lib/mailman/bin# ./hold_again -n -v -l mynewlist
Requeueing message from file heldmsg-mynewlist-1.pck

The held message is in the data directory:

root@:/var/lib/mailman/data# ls -l
-rw-r----- 1 root list       41 May  3  2013 adm.pw
-rw-rw---- 1 root list     1997 Nov  6  2012 aliases
-rw-rw---- 1 list list    12288 Nov  6  2012 aliases.db
[...]
-rw-rw-r-- 1 list list      775 Mar 25 16:11 heldmsg-mynewlist-1.pck
[...]
-rw-rw-r-- 1 root list       10 Jul 13  2012 last_mailman_version
-rw-r--r-- 1 root list    14100 Jun 16  2012 sitelist.cfg
-rw-rw---- 1 root list     1831 Nov  6  2012 virtual-mailman
-rw-rw---- 1 list list    12288 Nov  6  2012 virtual-mailman.db

The hold_again command results in a new notice to the list admin re
the held message, but revisiting the web page shows the same "There
are no pending requests" message.

Responding via email to the list admin message with an 
"Approved: listadminpswd" header" results in a copy of the sent message
being sent to the list admin, but no action re the held message; it's
still held, with the same timestamp.

The server is running apache 2.4.6-3.

The mailman.conf file in /etc/apache2/sites-available has:

# Sample configuration for Debian mailman with Apache

# We can find mailman here:
ScriptAlias /cgi-bin/mailman/ /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/
# And the public archives:
Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/
# Logos:
Alias /images/mailman/ /usr/share/images/mailman/

# Use this if you don't want the "cgi-bin" component in your URL:
# In case you want to access mailman through a shorter URL you should enable
# this:
#ScriptAlias /mailman/ /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/
# In this case you need to set the DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN in
# /etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py to http://%s/mailman/ for the cookie
# authentication code to work.  Note that you need to change the base
# URL for all the already-created lists as well.

<Directory /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/>
    AllowOverride None
    Options ExecCGI
    AddHandler cgi-script .cgi
    Require all granted
</Directory>
<Directory /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/>
    Options FollowSymlinks 
    AllowOverride None
    Require all granted 
</Directory>
<Directory /usr/share/images/mailman/>
    AllowOverride None
    Require all granted
</Directory>


I've spent hours trying to resolve this problem.  Any help would be
much appreciated.

TIA,

-rex
-- 

From sylvain at opensource-expert.com  Wed Mar 26 12:49:27 2014
From: sylvain at opensource-expert.com (Sylvain Viart)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 12:49:27 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] handler to auto detach attachment and link it to a
	website?
Message-ID: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>

Hi,

I've a project to setup a mailman for newsletter.

I've found many interesting links about it. I will post them as a 
reminder at the end of this message, as it can help someone else.


My question is:

Is there any handler that I can setup in the pipeline to:

  * detach an attachment
  * post it to a webservice (or run a script uploading it to an online
    storage)
  * modify the content of the mail, linking it to the online stored
    attachment

?

Or a good base to program it.

The goal to achieve, is to permit restricted sender to write mail with 
attachment but do not replicate it to all member of the list.

Also for non technical writer, uploading the attachment and linking may 
be too painful.


Regards,
Sylvain.



Reference links, some may be pretty old.

newsletter : How do I create a newsletter/announcement/one-way list?
http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030685

personalisation VERP exemple de mail, simple piste :
https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2003-February/026008.html

4.48. How can I change the HTML (or .txt) templates used by my mailing 
lists?
http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030605

4.33. How do I put a subscribe form for my list on a web page? 
<http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030596>

3.40. I want to completely customize the look and feel of Mailman ? how 
do I do that? <http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030560>

What is the largest list Mailman can run? 
<http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030518>

[Mailman-Users] Keeping the Publich_HTML subscription page from popping 
up. <http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/msg24296.html>

[Mailman-Users] Editing confirm page 
<http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/msg32261.html>

Mailman processes incoming messages through a pipeline of handlers which 
each do parts of the message processing 
<http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=7602227>



From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Mar 26 20:28:37 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 12:28:37 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] There are no pending requests
In-Reply-To: <20140326072826.GT21245@ninja.nosyntax.net>
References: <20140326072826.GT21245@ninja.nosyntax.net>
Message-ID: <2c2b1f20a82527115b50472cd10fb9d5.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>


rex wrote:
> The Mailman web page to approve messages held for approval always has
> the message: "There are no pending requents," even when there
> are messages in /var/lib/mailman/data/heldmsg-mynewlist-1.pck


This seems related to, but "opposite" the issue of the FAQ at
<http://wiki.list.org/x/EoCE>.

Possibly the link or URL you are following/visiting to get to the admindb
interface for this list is somehow accessing a different Mailman
installation.

Possibly there is some other issue with this list's request.pck or
pending.pck in the /var/lib/mailman/data/mynewlist/ directory. Is there
anything in Mailman's 'error' log?

Do the scripts at <http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/list_pending> when run
with the -m option and <http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/list_requests> show
the held message?

The -1 in heldmsg-mynewlist-1.pck is curious as this number should
increment with each new held message.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Mar 26 20:32:35 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 12:32:35 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] handler to auto detach attachment and link it
 to a website?
In-Reply-To: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>
References: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>
Message-ID: <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>


Sylvain Viart wrote:
>
> My question is:
>
> Is there any handler that I can setup in the pipeline to:
>
>   * detach an attachment
>   * post it to a webservice (or run a script uploading it to an online
>     storage)
>   * modify the content of the mail, linking it to the online stored
>     attachment


How about just setting the list's web admin Non-digest options ->
scrub_nondigest to Yes.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From harrison at utm.edu  Wed Mar 26 22:19:32 2014
From: harrison at utm.edu (Bruce Harrison)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 21:19:32 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
Message-ID: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>


We are currently running an old mailman instance and am planning to bring up the newest version of mailman and migrate to it.  Current system uses sendmail.  Since I now have a chance to change things, what is the best mail server to run on my mailman box?  It will be talking to an exchange 2010 frontend server (current mailman system is doing that now).  I can install sendmail or go with postfix or ???
This is running on a debian box.

Bruce Harrison
UT Martin

From sajan at parikh.io  Wed Mar 26 22:29:45 2014
From: sajan at parikh.io (Sajan Parikh)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 16:29:45 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
Message-ID: <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io>

It seems the 3 most popular MTAs are sendmail, Exim, and Postfix.  All 
do the job well if you're running just a standard install of mailman 
without much fuss.

sendmail is still widely used, and if I were you, I'd just stick with 
what works unless you have you a particular need that sendmail wasn't 
filling.

Sajan Parikh
On 03/26/2014 04:19 PM, Bruce Harrison wrote:
> We are currently running an old mailman instance and am planning to bring up the newest version of mailman and migrate to it.  Current system uses sendmail.  Since I now have a chance to change things, what is the best mail server to run on my mailman box?  It will be talking to an exchange 2010 frontend server (current mailman system is doing that now).  I can install sendmail or go with postfix or ???
> This is running on a debian box.
>
> Bruce Harrison
> UT Martin
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/sajan%40parikh.io



From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Mar 26 23:33:27 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 15:33:27 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
Message-ID: <533355B7.9090206@msapiro.net>

On 03/26/2014 02:19 PM, Bruce Harrison wrote:
> 
> We are currently running an old mailman instance and am planning to bring up the newest version of mailman and migrate to it.  Current system uses sendmail.  Since I now have a chance to change things, what is the best mail server to run on my mailman box?  It will be talking to an exchange 2010 frontend server (current mailman system is doing that now).  I can install sendmail or go with postfix or ???
> This is running on a debian box.


Disclaimer: I am not an MTA expert. This is all personal opinion based
on possibly limited experience.

I would go with either Postfix or Exim. Both integrate well with
Mailman; <http://www.exim.org/howto/mailman21.html> and
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node12.html>.

I have used both in Mailman environments, but Exim only in a Mailman
development environment, Postfix both in development and on a production
server handling both Mailman and other mail.

My impression is that if you want to do esoteric things, it's easier (at
least for a coder like me) with Exim's routers and transports than with
Postfix, but I've always been able to accomplish whatever I've wanted
with Postfix.

I have little experience with sendmail, and while it is possible to
hijack Mailman's Postfix integration to use with sendmail, on the whole
it seems 'clunkier' to configure, and I see no reason to chose sendmail
over Postfix.

I'd be inclined to chose Postfix over Exim simply because Postfix is
more popular, and new things (e.g. Mailman 3) tend to be implemented
first for Postfix.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Mar 27 00:50:45 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 16:50:45 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] HTML to Text-Only
In-Reply-To: <9AFD1925-6BBB-4A41-BCF2-0372FF132D11@wcasa.org>
References: <9AFD1925-6BBB-4A41-BCF2-0372FF132D11@wcasa.org>
Message-ID: <533367D5.8000501@msapiro.net>

On 03/25/2014 09:49 PM, Peter Fiala - WCASA wrote:
> One of the listservs I manage sends text-only messages though I have that option unchecked under content filtering. This happens to this list and not any others, though the option is the same for all lists I manage.
> 
> Should Mailman convert text/html parts to plain text? This conversion happens after MIME attachments have been stripped.
> (Edit convert_html_to_plaintext)<http://lists.wcasa-blog.org/admin.cgi/regional_ta_sc-wcasa-blog.org/?VARHELP=contentfilter/convert_html_to_plaintext>
> 
> No      Yes
> 
> 
> 
> Wondering if anyone has any solutions.


I suspect the issue is that your users are sending multipart/alternative
messages and your collapse_alternatives setting is Yes. Either that or
you don't have text/html in pass_mime_types.

You need at least

multipart
text/plain
text/html

in pass_mime_types and collapse_alternatives = No.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From cpz at tuunq.com  Thu Mar 27 05:32:50 2014
From: cpz at tuunq.com (Carl Zwanzig)
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 21:32:50 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <533355B7.9090206@msapiro.net>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533355B7.9090206@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <5333A9F2.7040107@tuunq.com>

On 3/26/2014 3:33 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> I'd be inclined to chose Postfix over Exim simply because Postfix is
> more popular, and new things (e.g. Mailman 3) tend to be implemented
> first for Postfix.

FWIW, I found postfix to be generally easier to deal with than the others. 
And the config files don't look like line noise with comments :).

z!


From stephen at xemacs.org  Thu Mar 27 09:26:53 2014
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 17:26:53 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io>
Message-ID: <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Sajan Parikh writes:

 > sendmail is still widely used, and if I were you, I'd just stick with 
 > what works unless you have you a particular need that sendmail wasn't 
 > filling.

+1 with caveat:

Exim and Postfix both have recipes for working with Mailman 3.  It
seems likely to me that it "won't be hard" to get Mailman 3 and
Sendmail to work and play well together -- but nobody has done it yet.


From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk  Thu Mar 27 10:48:35 2014
From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 09:48:35 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <5333A9F2.7040107@tuunq.com>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533355B7.9090206@msapiro.net> <5333A9F2.7040107@tuunq.com>
Message-ID: <20140327094835.GR10820@hendricks.amyl.org.uk>

On Wed, Mar 26, 2014 at 09:32:50PM -0700, Carl Zwanzig wrote:
> On 3/26/2014 3:33 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> >I'd be inclined to chose Postfix over Exim simply because Postfix is
> >more popular, and new things (e.g. Mailman 3) tend to be implemented
> >first for Postfix.
> 
> FWIW, I found postfix to be generally easier to deal with than the
> others. And the config files don't look like line noise with
> comments :).

grep -v ^\# exim.conf is too much?

I don't know if it's down to popularity or not, but I notice far more
questions on this list concerning Postfix than I do exim.

(Exim user/admin for >10 years here)

-- 
Suburbia: where they cut down the trees then name streets after them

From barry at list.org  Thu Mar 27 14:22:02 2014
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 09:22:02 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io>
 <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Message-ID: <20140327092202.555de4fb@limelight.wooz.org>

On Mar 27, 2014, at 05:26 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:

>Exim and Postfix both have recipes for working with Mailman 3.  It
>seems likely to me that it "won't be hard" to get Mailman 3 and
>Sendmail to work and play well together -- but nobody has done it yet.

It's certainly the intent of the project to interoperate with any FLOSS MTA.

It should be rather trivial to integrate MM3 with any MTA that supports LMTP
delivery (currently the only supported method) which includes Postfix and
Exim, and should include Sendmail afaik.  For the most part, not much needs to
be done on the Mailman side, so it's mostly getting your MTA configured
correctly.  Contributions welcome of course!

-Barry

From Hagedorn at uni-koeln.de  Thu Mar 27 14:26:19 2014
From: Hagedorn at uni-koeln.de (Sebastian Hagedorn)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 14:26:19 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <20140327092202.555de4fb@limelight.wooz.org>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io> <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <20140327092202.555de4fb@limelight.wooz.org>
Message-ID: <ECB1325C35154015A49A5888@tyrion.rrz.uni-koeln.de>

--On 27. M?rz 2014 09:22:02 -0400 Barry Warsaw <barry at list.org> wrote:

> On Mar 27, 2014, at 05:26 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
>
>> Exim and Postfix both have recipes for working with Mailman 3.  It
>> seems likely to me that it "won't be hard" to get Mailman 3 and
>> Sendmail to work and play well together -- but nobody has done it yet.
>
> It's certainly the intent of the project to interoperate with any FLOSS
> MTA.
>
> It should be rather trivial to integrate MM3 with any MTA that supports
> LMTP delivery (currently the only supported method) which includes
> Postfix and Exim, and should include Sendmail afaik.  For the most part,
> not much needs to be done on the Mailman side, so it's mostly getting
> your MTA configured correctly.  Contributions welcome of course!

We are a Sendmail shop, so perhaps I can find the time to help with that. 
It does support LMTP delivery, so that's not an issue.

Cheers
Sebastian
-- 
    .:.Sebastian Hagedorn - Weyertal 121 (Geb?ude 133), Zimmer 2.02.:.
                 .:.Regionales Rechenzentrum (RRZK).:.
   .:.Universit?t zu K?ln / Cologne University - ? +49-221-470-89578.:.

From gaa at ulticom.com  Thu Mar 27 15:25:19 2014
From: gaa at ulticom.com (Gary Algier)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 10:25:19 -0400
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io> <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
Message-ID: <533434CF.3060107@ulticom.com>

On 03/27/14 04:26, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Sajan Parikh writes:
>
>   > sendmail is still widely used, and if I were you, I'd just stick with
>   > what works unless you have you a particular need that sendmail wasn't
>   > filling.
>
> +1 with caveat:
>
> Exim and Postfix both have recipes for working with Mailman 3.  It
> seems likely to me that it "won't be hard" to get Mailman 3 and
> Sendmail to work and play well together -- but nobody has done it yet.
>

I have it working fine.  I recently replaced a very old implementation
of sendmail and Mailman on Solaris with a new one on CentOS 6.  When I
did so, I used the POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD mechanism to automatically process
the aliases.  See: 
https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2004-June/037518.html

In mm_cfg.py:
     MTA='Postfix'
     POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/bin/sudo /etc/mail/import-mailman-aliases'
/etc/mail/import-mailman-aliases contains:
     #! /bin/sh
     /bin/cp /etc/mailman/aliases /etc/mail/mailman.aliases
     /usr/bin/newaliases
In /etc/sudoers.d/mailman:
     Cmnd_Alias IMPORT_MAILMAN_ALIASES = /etc/mail/import-mailman-aliases
     apache ALL= NOPASSWD: IMPORT_MAILMAN_ALIASES
     mailman ALL= NOPASSWD: IMPORT_MAILMAN_ALIASES
     Defaults!IMPORT_MAILMAN_ALIASES !requiretty
In the sendmail.mc file I changed:
     define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/aliases')dnl
to:
     define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/aliases,/etc/mail/mailman.aliases')dnl
so that the Mailman aliases would be in a separate file.

Warning: You need to have Mailman 2.1.15 or better (or patch it).
See this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/mailman/+bug/266408.
A fix is here: 
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/revision/1291
(Thanks to Mark Sapiro)

I stayed with sendmail because I am using LDAP for aliases and routing and I 
did not want to figure out how to do it with Postfix.  My one exposure to 
Postfix was a disaster trying to fix the email services on our marketing 
department's web server at a hosting provider that did not support sendmail. 
Perhaps with time, I could have made it work for our mail server, but the 
duckling syndrome may have set in (yes, I still use vi and sometimes ed).

-- 
Gary Algier, WB2FWZ            gaa at ulticom.com             +1 856 787 2758
Ulticom Inc., 1020 Briggs Rd, Mt. Laurel, NJ 08054     Fax:+1 856 866 2033

Nielsen's First Law of Computer Manuals:
     People don't read documentation voluntarily.

From cpz at tuunq.com  Thu Mar 27 16:22:00 2014
From: cpz at tuunq.com (Carl Zwanzig)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 08:22:00 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <20140327094835.GR10820@hendricks.amyl.org.uk>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533355B7.9090206@msapiro.net> <5333A9F2.7040107@tuunq.com>
 <20140327094835.GR10820@hendricks.amyl.org.uk>
Message-ID: <53344218.2030809@tuunq.com>

On 3/27/2014 2:48 AM, Adam McGreggor wrote:
> I don't know if it's down to popularity or not, but I notice far more
> questions on this list concerning Postfix than I do exim.

I suspect it's due to installed base- my very unscientific survey says that 
there are far more sendmail and postfix sites than exim sites. (In the end, 
I also suspect this is rather like the perl/tcl/python/ruby arguments; take 
whatever works for you and run with it.)

z!


From vancleef at lostwells.net  Thu Mar 27 16:22:41 2014
From: vancleef at lostwells.net (Hank van Cleef)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 09:22:41 -0600 (MDT)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <533355B7.9090206@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <201403271522.s2RFMfYj008947@joanne.lostwells.net>

The esteemed Mark Sapiro has said:
> 
> On 03/26/2014 02:19 PM, Bruce Harrison wrote:
> > 
> > We are currently running an old mailman instance and am planning to bring up the newest version of mailman and migrate to it.  Current system uses sendmail.  Since I now have a chance to change things, what is the best mail server to run on my mailman box?  It will be talking to an exchange 2010 frontend server (current mailman system is doing that now).  I can install sendmail or go with postfix or ???
> > This is running on a debian box.
> 
> 
> Disclaimer: I am not an MTA expert. This is all personal opinion based
> on possibly limited experience.
> 
> I would go with either Postfix or Exim. Both integrate well with
> Mailman; <http://www.exim.org/howto/mailman21.html> and
> <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node12.html>.
> 
> I have used both in Mailman environments, but Exim only in a Mailman
> development environment, Postfix both in development and on a production
> server handling both Mailman and other mail.
> 
> I have little experience with sendmail, and while it is possible to
> hijack Mailman's Postfix integration to use with sendmail, on the whole
> it seems 'clunkier' to configure, and I see no reason to chose sendmail
> over Postfix.
> 
I'm not an "MTA expert," either.  However, I've used sendmail ever
since there was a sendmail.  My systems are Solaris, which comes with
a good implementation of sendmail, and my installations are all
configured to do what I want them to do with regular e-mail.  

I found adding Mailman to my existing setups to be quite simple.
You'll need to manually add the Mailman pipes to the aliases, using
the Mailman utility that gives you the list, but with the vi editor,
it's a simply copy-and-paste.  The only issue I had with integrating
Mailman with sendmail was getting the Masquerades set up properly to
host a different domain on my systems.  however, that is covered in 
the O'Reilly "Bat Book," which you should have.  It is not a Mailman
issue, and proper configuration is done through the M4 macro files.  
I haven't had to tamper with the sendmail.cf file separately.

I think that if you're familiar with sendmail, and have a satisfactory
setup, do your upgrade, and integrate it with your current sendmail.
I'm aware that most of the people posting to this list are using other
MTA's on Linux systems, so there's little support here for a sendmail
setup.  

For reference, my links between Mailman and sendmail are through
localhost to a local sendmail, and I also have a caching DNS server,
all on the same box.  

For me, switching to another MTA would mean a lot of work learning how
to integrate all of the spam filtering and other things I already have
integrated and working in sendmail.  

Hank

From harrison at utm.edu  Thu Mar 27 22:40:00 2014
From: harrison at utm.edu (Bruce Harrison)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 21:40:00 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <20140327092202.555de4fb@limelight.wooz.org>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io> <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <20140327092202.555de4fb@limelight.wooz.org>
Message-ID: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94AB60@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>

Thanks to all who replied.  Since I've used sendmail and have limited experience with it, I decided to go with that.  Less variables in the mix!  :)

Anyway, proceeded with the install and got to make install, which failed with Permission denied for the mkdir commands.
I'm running from a non-root userid who has a membership in the mailman group.  The directory /usr/local/mailman has rws privs for the mailman group (but is owned by root).  Do I need to do a sudo make install or am I missing some type of privilege setting?  

Bruce
UTM



From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 28 00:57:26 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 16:57:26 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94AB60@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io> <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <20140327092202.555de4fb@limelight.wooz.org>
 <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94AB60@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
Message-ID: <5334BAE6.7080502@msapiro.net>

On 03/27/2014 02:40 PM, Bruce Harrison wrote:
> 
> Anyway, proceeded with the install and got to make install, which failed with Permission denied for the mkdir commands.
> I'm running from a non-root userid who has a membership in the mailman group.  The directory /usr/local/mailman has rws privs for the mailman group (but is owned by root).  Do I need to do a sudo make install or am I missing some type of privilege setting?  


Yes, I think you may need to 'sudo make install'. Either that or chown
the /usr/local/mailman directory to the user you're running as.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From stephen at xemacs.org  Fri Mar 28 05:39:59 2014
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 13:39:59 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users] building a new mailman server
In-Reply-To: <533434CF.3060107@ulticom.com>
References: <E6C16961ECB6B044A889CDAC6BA7B4B2016D94713A@EXCH2010MBOX1.utm.edu>
 <533346C9.5030902@parikh.io>
 <871txoqc6q.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>
 <533434CF.3060107@ulticom.com>
Message-ID: <87k3bfos0w.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp>

Gary Algier writes:
 > On 03/27/14 04:26, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:

 > > Exim and Postfix both have recipes for working with Mailman 3.  It
 > > seems likely to me that it "won't be hard" to get Mailman 3 and
 > > Sendmail to work and play well together -- but nobody has done it yet.
 > >
 > 
 > I have it working fine.

Did you notice I specified Mailman **3**?

 > Warning: You need to have Mailman 2.1.15 or better (or patch it).

Mailman 3 is not a trivial upgrade from Mailman 2.x.


From sylvain at opensource-expert.com  Fri Mar 28 07:31:50 2014
From: sylvain at opensource-expert.com (Sylvain Viart)
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 07:31:50 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] handler to auto detach attachment and link it
 to a website?
In-Reply-To: <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>
References: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>
 <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <53351756.3050408@opensource-expert.com>

Hi Mark,

Le 26/03/2014 20:32, Mark Sapiro a ?crit :
> My question is:
>
> Is there any handler that I can setup in the pipeline to:
>
>    * detach an attachment
>    * post it to a webservice (or run a script uploading it to an online
>      storage)
>    * modify the content of the mail, linking it to the online stored
>      attachment
>
> How about just setting the list's web admin Non-digest options ->
> scrub_nondigest to Yes.

I've also found this option here, I didn't notice it before.

Any attachments larger than that size, I'd like to be scrubbed and a 
link url inserted 
<https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2010-July/069955.html>

4.82 How do I filter or scrub content before checking if a message is 
"too big"? <http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=7602227>


Is it related to archiving only, or does it perform what I've described?
I didn't know that word 'scrub', it's used in the meaning of deep 
washing, right?


I must specify, is that the web server hosting the detached part of the 
message, will probably be a different server that the one hosting the 
mailman.

I may start to look at the code of Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py, right?

Thanks pointing me on this feature.
Regards,
Sylvain.

From pshute at nuw.org.au  Fri Mar 28 15:06:51 2014
From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute)
Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2014 01:06:51 +1100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] handler to auto detach attachment and link it
 to a website?
In-Reply-To: <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>
References: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>
 <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <4282F398-C8B9-40C2-A35D-5E0ACC918C67@nuw.org.au>

Could someone please tell me which manual this scrub_nondigest option is described in? I didn't know mailman could do this.

Sent from my iPad

> On 27 Mar 2014, at 5:33 am, "Mark Sapiro" <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> Sylvain Viart wrote:
>> 
>> My question is:
>> 
>> Is there any handler that I can setup in the pipeline to:
>> 
>>  * detach an attachment
>>  * post it to a webservice (or run a script uploading it to an online
>>    storage)
>>  * modify the content of the mail, linking it to the online stored
>>    attachment
> 
> 
> How about just setting the list's web admin Non-digest options ->
> scrub_nondigest to Yes.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/pshute%40nuw.org.au

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 28 16:48:33 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 08:48:33 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] handler to auto detach attachment and link it
 to a website?
In-Reply-To: <4282F398-C8B9-40C2-A35D-5E0ACC918C67@nuw.org.au>
References: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>
 <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>
 <4282F398-C8B9-40C2-A35D-5E0ACC918C67@nuw.org.au>
Message-ID: <533599D1.4040205@msapiro.net>

On 03/28/2014 07:06 AM, Peter Shute wrote:
> Could someone please tell me which manual this scrub_nondigest option is described in? I didn't know mailman could do this.


It should be documented in the List Administrator's Manual
<http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Mailman+2.1+List+Administrators+Manual>,
but that manual is incomplete and it's not there.

The only documentation is in the web admin GUI on the Non-digest options
page at the (Details for scrub_nondigest) link.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Mar 28 16:58:45 2014
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2014 08:58:45 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] handler to auto detach attachment and link it
 to a website?
In-Reply-To: <53351756.3050408@opensource-expert.com>
References: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>
 <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>
 <53351756.3050408@opensource-expert.com>
Message-ID: <53359C35.4020305@msapiro.net>

On 03/27/2014 11:31 PM, Sylvain Viart wrote:
> 
> Le 26/03/2014 20:32, Mark Sapiro a ?crit :
>>
>> How about just setting the list's web admin Non-digest options ->
>> scrub_nondigest to Yes.
> 
> I've also found this option here, I didn't notice it before.
> 
> Any attachments larger than that size, I'd like to be scrubbed and a
> link url inserted
> <https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2010-July/069955.html>


As it says in that post, scrub_nondigest is an all or nothing feature.
There is no current mechanism for scrubbing only those attachments
greater than a given size.


> 4.82 How do I filter or scrub content before checking if a message is
> "too big"? <http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=7602227>
> 
> 
> Is it related to archiving only, or does it perform what I've described?


That FAQ is about applying content filtering and/or scrubbing before
testing the message for a "too big" hold. It does nothing about only
scrubbing attachments over some size.


> I didn't know that word 'scrub', it's used in the meaning of deep
> washing, right?


Essentially, yes.


> I must specify, is that the web server hosting the detached part of the
> message, will probably be a different server that the one hosting the
> mailman.


The scrubber stores attachments in the list's archive which is normally
on the Mailman server. If you want them stored elsewhere, you should
probably look at a custom handler to do the scrubbing and also to only
scrub attachments over some size.


> I may start to look at the code of Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py, right?


Right.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

From sylvain at opensource-expert.com  Sat Mar 29 09:37:38 2014
From: sylvain at opensource-expert.com (Sylvain Viart)
Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2014 09:37:38 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] handler to auto detach attachment and link it
 to a website?
In-Reply-To: <53359C35.4020305@msapiro.net>
References: <5332BEC7.1050701@opensource-expert.com>
 <ae6d97fc6fe81e28901d367c8c05c773.squirrel@www.msapiro.net>
 <53351756.3050408@opensource-expert.com> <53359C35.4020305@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <53368652.90207@opensource-expert.com>

Hi,

Thanks for the information.
In fact, topics I've found about scrubbing, or detaching attachment, are 
pretty old, related to computer science?

That's why I'm asking for fresh 2014 confirmation. :-)

Le 28/03/2014 16:58, Mark Sapiro a ?crit :
> As it says in that post, scrub_nondigest is an all or nothing feature. 
> There is no current mechanism for scrubbing only those attachments 
> greater than a given size. 

Hum, I will experiment it.
I may code the behavior I've described for my need :

Detaching attachment, storing, linking back into the original mail.

Which is supposed to be already mostly part of Scrubber.py handler.

I will probably requiring coding help, as I'm python new-bee (yes, a 
voluntary honey gift 8-) ).

>> 4.82 How do I filter or scrub content before checking if a message is
>> "too big"? <http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=7602227>
>>
>>
>> Is it related to archiving only, or does it perform what I've described?
>
> That FAQ is about applying content filtering and/or scrubbing before
> testing the message for a "too big" hold. It does nothing about only
> scrubbing attachments over some size.

Is it not the same goal?
If you switch the order. Big attachment will be "scrubbed" so the 
message wont be too big anymore.

Oh, you're right I see? You mean you cant select the size of the 
attachment which will be detached by the scrubbing process. All 
attachment will be detached, no size checking.

I will let you informed.

Regards,
Sylvain.