From lizzoob at gmail.com Sun Feb 2 04:44:59 2014 From: lizzoob at gmail.com (Liz Zoob) Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2014 22:44:59 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman setting not "sticking" Message-ID: Hi-- This is my first post, and I hope you can help me figure something out. I am a therapist who administers a Mailman (2.1.15) list for a local group of other therapists. The Mailman software was set up by someone else with whom I don't interact in an ongoing way. I handle all administrative requests for our list, and have customized various Mailman administration pages for our mailing group (custom Welcome Message, footer, plain vs MIME digests, ACK or no, etc.). One of the Umbrella list settings under General Options is "Send monthly password reminders?" which I have set to NO. (None of our members want to access the list messages via the web, so they don't have or need passwords.) Nonetheless, some of our members are getting these Monthly Reminder Messages anyway, despite the NO setting (not all--I haven't gotten one myself), and they are writing to me, confused. Can anyone explain to me why the NO setting is not sticking, or is being overridden? It is also puzzling why only some of the members are getting the reminder. There is no setting in the individual members' settings/options that has anything to do with this reminder, nor do all recipients of the reminders have the same email domains. One more bit of information: The person who set up the mailing list for us also set up two other regional lists, all within the same domain. In other words, my list is xxx_xxx.ourdomain.org, while another is yyy_yyy.ourdomain.org. Is it possible that there are "master umbrella" (?) settings somewhere that override mine, settings that the original setter-upper of this software can tweak? By the way, I did write to him too, but I like to find out whatever I can on my own. Plus I may not be at the top of his priority list. Any ideas? Thanks. Liz From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 2 18:40:55 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2014 09:40:55 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman setting not "sticking" In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> On 02/01/2014 07:44 PM, Liz Zoob wrote: > > One of the Umbrella list settings under General Options is "Send monthly > password reminders?" which I have set to NO. (None of our members want to > access the list messages via the web, so they don't have or need > passwords.) Actually, this is (or should be) the first setting under "Notifications" which is the section immediately below "Umbrella list settings" on the admin General Options page. > Nonetheless, some of our members are getting these Monthly > Reminder Messages anyway, despite the NO setting (not all--I haven't gotten > one myself), and they are writing to me, confused. Can anyone explain to me > why the NO setting is not sticking, or is being overridden? It is also > puzzling why only some of the members are getting the reminder. I suspect this is related to the FAQ at . I.e., there is another Mailman installation somewhere with a previous incarnation of the list that is sending these reminders. See that FAQ, particularly the final paragraph. > There is no setting in the individual members' settings/options that has > anything to do with this reminder, nor do all recipients of the reminders > have the same email domains. Actually, there is a "Get password reminder email for this list?" user option which is not in the admin Membership List checkboxes but is on the user's options page, BUT this can only turn off reminders for a user if the list setting is ON. It cannot turn reminders on for a user if the list setting is OFF. > One more bit of information: The person who set up the mailing list for us > also set up two other regional lists, all within the same domain. In other > words, my list is xxx_xxx.ourdomain.org, while another is > yyy_yyy.ourdomain.org. Is it possible that there are "master umbrella" (?) > settings somewhere that override mine, settings that the original > setter-upper of this software can tweak? By the way, I did write to him > too, but I like to find out whatever I can on my own. Plus I may not be at > the top of his priority list. There are no "master" settings that would override the individual list settings, but as I suggest above, there is likely a separate list that is the source of these reminders. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From Steven.Jones at vuw.ac.nz Sun Feb 2 21:18:17 2014 From: Steven.Jones at vuw.ac.nz (Steven Jones) Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2014 20:18:17 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Populating mailman lists out of AD or LDAP. In-Reply-To: <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> References: , <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <709918b2f00844609ab0a06d49c1a9c1@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com> Hi, I want to populate a specific mailman list with users from AD (if possible) or IPA/LDAP that have a specific attribute in AD. Is this possible? I can see lots of old comments dated 2004 from googling but nothing newer so far. regards Steven From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 2 21:55:29 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2014 12:55:29 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Populating mailman lists out of AD or LDAP. In-Reply-To: <709918b2f00844609ab0a06d49c1a9c1@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com> References: , <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> <709918b2f00844609ab0a06d49c1a9c1@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52EEB0C1.7010001@msapiro.net> On 02/02/2014 12:18 PM, Steven Jones wrote: > Hi, > > I want to populate a specific mailman list with users from AD (if possible) or IPA/LDAP that have a specific attribute in AD. > > Is this possible? I can see lots of old comments dated 2004 from googling but nothing newer so far. Assuming you mean you want Mailman to maintain the list membership dynamically from the database and not simply do periodic extraction of a user list from the database to use with a tool like sync_members, there is an LDAP member adaptor for Mailman at . Read the entire comment thread to see all versions. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From lizzoob at gmail.com Sun Feb 2 22:15:58 2014 From: lizzoob at gmail.com (Liz Zoob) Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2014 16:15:58 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman setting not "sticking" In-Reply-To: <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> References: <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> Message-ID: Hi Mark, Thanks for writing back, and thanks for the reference to the wiki. <> Right--I double checked and that is indeed where it is! Sorry for that. <> This is an interesting idea--I wonder if the list creator set up a test list or something prior to the xxx_xxx and yyy_yyy lists. Unfortunately I won't be able to verify this without his cooperation--so I hope he is responsive when I write to him and ask! Thanks again. Liz On Sun, Feb 2, 2014 at 12:40 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/01/2014 07:44 PM, Liz Zoob wrote: > > > > One of the Umbrella list settings under General Options is "Send monthly > > password reminders?" which I have set to NO. (None of our members want to > > access the list messages via the web, so they don't have or need > > passwords.) > > > > > Nonetheless, some of our members are getting these Monthly > > Reminder Messages anyway, despite the NO setting (not all--I haven't > gotten > > one myself), and they are writing to me, confused. Can anyone explain to > me > > why the NO setting is not sticking, or is being overridden? It is also > > puzzling why only some of the members are getting the reminder. > > > I suspect this is related to the FAQ at . > I.e., there is another Mailman installation somewhere with a previous > incarnation of the list that is sending these reminders. See that FAQ, > particularly the final paragraph. > > > > One more bit of information: The person who set up the mailing list for > us > > also set up two other regional lists, all within the same domain. In > other > > words, my list is xxx_xxx.ourdomain.org, while another is > > yyy_yyy.ourdomain.org. Is it possible that there are "master umbrella" > (?) > > settings somewhere that override mine, settings that the original > > setter-upper of this software can tweak? By the way, I did write to him > > too, but I like to find out whatever I can on my own. Plus I may not be > at > > the top of his priority list. > > > There are no "master" settings that would override the individual list > settings, but as I suggest above, there is likely a separate list that > is the source of these reminders. > > -- > From nikos at qbit.gr Mon Feb 3 09:43:27 2014 From: nikos at qbit.gr (nikos) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 10:43:27 +0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Prefix for subject line Message-ID: <52EF56AF.9090700@qbit.gr> Hello list What will happened if i remove (leave blank) Prefix for subject line? Thank you in advance From mailman-admin at uni-konstanz.de Mon Feb 3 10:48:35 2014 From: mailman-admin at uni-konstanz.de (Mailman Admin) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 10:48:35 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Prefix for subject line In-Reply-To: <52EF56AF.9090700@qbit.gr> References: <52EF56AF.9090700@qbit.gr> Message-ID: <52EF65F3.5030004@uni-konstanz.de> Hello nikos Am 2014-02-03 09:43, schrieb nikos: > > What will happened if i remove (leave blank) Prefix for subject line? > You will get subjects without any prefix for that list ;-) Kind regards, Christian Mack From brad at fineby.me.uk Mon Feb 3 11:15:21 2014 From: brad at fineby.me.uk (Brad Rogers) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2014 10:15:21 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Prefix for subject line In-Reply-To: <52EF56AF.9090700@qbit.gr> References: <52EF56AF.9090700@qbit.gr> Message-ID: <20140203101521.3258f8e3@abydos.stargate.org.uk> On Mon, 03 Feb 2014 10:43:27 +0200 nikos wrote: Hello nikos, >What will happened if i remove (leave blank) Prefix for subject line? There will be no prefix to add to the subject line. This is not harmful in any way but some people prefer, for various reasons, to have them. Some MUAs seem to have a rather limited ability to filter messages. A subject prefix generally placates the users of such software. I prefer to *not* have prefixes, although that's largely due to the fact that, in the past, they could eat up screen real estate. That's not such an issue these days with nearly all monitors being of the wide screen variety. -- Regards _ / ) "The blindingly obvious is / _)rad never immediately apparent" You're only 29 got a lot to learn Seventeen - Sex Pistols -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 490 bytes Desc: not available URL: From drew.tenenholz at isid.org Mon Feb 3 16:01:40 2014 From: drew.tenenholz at isid.org (Drew Tenenholz) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2014 10:01:40 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Rescuing Misdirected Mail from Moderation Queue - possible? Message-ID: All -- I have a problem I hope you can help me with. I am a owner/manager of about a dozen interrelated lists and we've just discovered that about 50 posts which should have been delivered to the French-language list were actually being sent to the English language list. Is it possible to actually have them sent to the correct list with their original date/time? Here's the details: -- All lists are announce-only, with approval passwords, and explicit address restrictions. -- The messages incorrectly sent to the English list are being held in that list's moderation queue because they have the wrong password, as they should be. I'm wondering if it is possible to somehow copy/move/duplicate the moderation queue of the English list into the French list, then use the moderation webpage to 'accept' the posts for delivery. Since I have complete root access to the server running Mailman, I can do whatever I like at the file system level and then refresh Mailman. So, a couple of questions about this idea: 1) If this is a feasible method, with the accepted posts come with their original date/time? 2) Will Mailman appropriately strip out the 'Approved:password' line when a message is released from the moderation queue, or will it deliver the message in it's entirety? 3) Do I need to temporarily update the require_explicit_address option in the French list, or will accepting the posts from the moderation queue override that preference? Are there other ways to achieve what I'm looking to do? Thanks in Advance, Drew Tenenholz From info at skeena.net Mon Feb 3 07:14:32 2014 From: info at skeena.net (Marcel Giannelia (Felix)) Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2014 22:14:32 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] converting an e-mail discussion to a list (with existing archive) Message-ID: <20140202221432.5c76ab76@siobhan> Well, I was originally going to post about a strange issue I encountered with dates being mangled... but since I figured out the answer on my own, I'll just post these instructions instead, in case someone finds them useful :) Some friends and I were e-mailing back and forth with regular e-mails, putting everyone in the CC list, etc. and it was getting too confusing to keep track of. We want to move the discussion topic onto a mailing list instead. 1. Make a new blank Mailman list 2. Set yourself as the admin and the only subscriber 3. Go into Mailman's Defaults.py and change these settings: ARCHIVER_CLOBBER_DATE_POLICY = 2 ARCHIVER_ALLOWABLE_SANE_DATE_SKEW = days(15) Very important! If you don't change those, the archive threading will be completely messed up. (this is the issue I was having... didn't figure out that this setting existed until after I'd imported a hundred e-mails... see below for how to fix it if you did that too.) 4. Turn off respond_to_post_requests on the Mailman general settings page for the list Very important! If you don't turn this off, everyone may get lots of "your message has been held" e-mails. 5. Find an e-mail program that has a 'bounce' or 'redirect with full headers' command (e.g. alpine, claws-mail, ...) -- this will preserve who sent what, instead of it all coming from you 6. Start 'bounce'ing all messages related to the conversation to the new list's posting address 7. Verify that threading and attachments are being handled correctly in the archive 8. When you've finished creating the archive, subscribe everyone else to the list. If you find yourself past step 3 without having turned off date mangling and all your older e-mails are in the wrong archive month: - go into (Mailman)/private/listname.mbox/ - Delete Date: and convert X-Original-Date: back to Date: on the affected messages in (Mailman)/private/listname.mbox/listname.mbox - move (Mailman)/private/listname/ to a backup location - From the Mailman base directory, run 'bin/arch listname' - move the 'attachments' subdirectory of the backed-up archive back into the newly generated one (If you have Mailman set to scrub attachments; the attachments are not kept in the mbox archive, but the generated links are completely preserved when re-running 'arch', so simply moving the old folder back into place preserves all the attachment links in the new archive.) ~Felix. From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 3 18:32:01 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 09:32:01 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Rescuing Misdirected Mail from Moderation Queue - possible? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52EFD291.9080600@msapiro.net> On 02/03/2014 07:01 AM, Drew Tenenholz wrote: > > Is it possible to actually have them sent to the correct list with their original date/time? There are at least two ways to do this. The messages are in Mailman's data/ directory as files with names like heldmsg-LIST-nnn.ext where LIST is the listname, nnn is a sequence number and ext is either 'pck' if mm_cfg.HOLD_MESSAGES_AS_PICKLES is True (the default) or 'txt' if it is False. One way would be to extract the messages from the heldmsg-*.pck files (or just use them as if they're .txt) and queue them to the correct list's incoming queue with Mailman's bin/inject command. The tricky part here is if the heldmsg-* files are pickles, extracting the message requires a separate step, but something like for f in `ls data/heldmsg-englishlist-*.pck; do bin/show_qfiles $f | bin/inject -l frenchlist rm $f done should work, or just for f in `ls data/heldmsg-englishlist-*.msg; do bin/inject -l frenchlist $f rm $f done for the .msg case. Another way is to use the script at . This requires renaming all the heldmsg-englishlist-* files to heldmsg-frenchlist-*, while preserving the extension an then running /path/to/hold_again -l frenchlist > So, a couple of questions about this idea: > 1) If this is a feasible method, with the accepted posts come with their original date/time? Yes, with either method. > 2) Will Mailman appropriately strip out the 'Approved:password' line when a message is released from the moderation queue, or will it deliver the message in it's entirety? The Approved: password will be stripped. > 3) Do I need to temporarily update the require_explicit_address option in the French list, or will accepting the posts from the moderation queue override that preference? You will need to turn off require_explicit_destination or add the english list to acceptable_aliases or the messages will be held by the french list. After doing either method, the admindb page for the english list will show a bunch of "Message with id nnn was lost." messages the first time it is visited. This is harmless. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 3 21:11:25 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 12:11:25 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] converting an e-mail discussion to a list (with existing archive) In-Reply-To: <20140202221432.5c76ab76@siobhan> References: <20140202221432.5c76ab76@siobhan> Message-ID: <52EFF7ED.3010807@msapiro.net> On 2/2/14 10:14 PM, Marcel (Felix) Giannelia wrote: > > 1. Make a new blank Mailman list > > > 2. Set yourself as the admin and the only subscriber > > > 3. Go into Mailman's Defaults.py and change these settings: > ARCHIVER_CLOBBER_DATE_POLICY = 2 > ARCHIVER_ALLOWABLE_SANE_DATE_SKEW = days(15) > > Very important! If you don't change those, the archive threading will be > completely messed up. (this is the issue I was having... didn't figure > out that this setting existed until after I'd imported a hundred > e-mails... see below for how to fix it if you did that too.) > > > 4. Turn off respond_to_post_requests on the Mailman general settings > page for the list > > Very important! If you don't turn this off, everyone may get lots of > "your message has been held" e-mails. > > > 5. Find an e-mail program that has a 'bounce' or 'redirect with full > headers' command (e.g. alpine, claws-mail, ...) -- this will preserve > who sent what, instead of it all coming from you > > > 6. Start 'bounce'ing all messages related to the conversation to the > new list's posting address > > > 7. Verify that threading and attachments are being handled correctly in > the archive > > > 8. When you've finished creating the archive, subscribe everyone else > to the list. Steps 3. through 6. could be more easily accomplished by the following: 1) Gather all the emails into a single *nix mbox format file. Depending on your email client, this may already exist as the folder containing the desired messages. 2) copy that mbox file to /path/to/mailman/archives/private/listname.mbox/listname.mbox 3) run Mailman's bin/arch --wipe listname -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California Better use your sense - B. Dylan From larry at qhpress.org Mon Feb 3 21:53:12 2014 From: larry at qhpress.org (Larry Kuenning) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 15:53:12 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] converting an e-mail discussion to a list (with existing archive) In-Reply-To: <52EFF7ED.3010807@msapiro.net> References: <20140202221432.5c76ab76@siobhan> <52EFF7ED.3010807@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52F001B8.8050203@qhpress.org> On 2/3/2014 3:11 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote: > Steps 3. through 6. could be more easily accomplished by the following: > > 1) Gather all the emails into a single *nix mbox format file. Depending > on your email client, this may already exist as the folder containing > the desired messages. > > 2) copy that mbox file to > /path/to/mailman/archives/private/listname.mbox/listname.mbox > > 3) run Mailman's > bin/arch --wipe listname Before running step 3 it might be a good idea to verify that all the messages in your mbox file have correct "Date:" lines. Incorrect Date lines will cause Mailman to arrange messages in the wrong order. Date lines can be incorrect if the original sender's MUA was misconfigured. If a wrong timestamp is given, Mailman will accept it and order the messages accordingly. If a message has no timestamp at all, Mailman will order that message as if it had been sent at the moment when Mailman is indexing the archive. At least this is what happened for me when I tried a somewhat similar project. -- Larry Kuenning larry at qhpress.org From pshute at nuw.org.au Tue Feb 4 02:04:15 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2014 12:04:15 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> I use the moderator web page with Firefox, and it stays logged in for as long as I keep the browser open. But with Safari on iPhone and iPad, I often have to log in again when I return to it. Same for every other browser I've tried under iOS. Can anyone tell me why? Peter Shute From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 4 02:26:19 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 17:26:19 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> Message-ID: <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> On 02/03/2014 05:04 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > I use the moderator web page with Firefox, and it stays logged in for as long as I keep the browser open. But with Safari on iPhone and iPad, I often have to log in again when I return to it. Same for every other browser I've tried under iOS. Can anyone tell me why? Because the session cookie which keeps the fact that you've logged in is being expired, presumably because when you leave the browser and return to it, iOS starts a new session or otherwise invalidates the session cookie. Why it does this is an Apple question. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From pshute at nuw.org.au Tue Feb 4 02:53:20 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2014 12:53:20 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> > On 4 Feb 2014, at 12:26 pm, "Mark Sapiro" wrote: > >> On 02/03/2014 05:04 PM, Peter Shute wrote: >> I use the moderator web page with Firefox, and it stays logged in for as long as I keep the browser open. But with Safari on iPhone and iPad, I often have to log in again when I return to it. Same for every other browser I've tried under iOS. Can anyone tell me why? > > > Because the session cookie which keeps the fact that you've logged in is > being expired, presumably because when you leave the browser and return > to it, iOS starts a new session or otherwise invalidates the session > cookie. Why it does this is an Apple question. That makes sense. Is there any way around it? Is it possible to make it use persistent cookies? Note that this problem wasn't anywhere near as bad until I upgraded from iOS6 to iOS7. I don't mind logging in again every few days. Peter Shute From Steven.Jones at vuw.ac.nz Tue Feb 4 03:13:54 2014 From: Steven.Jones at vuw.ac.nz (Steven Jones) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2014 02:13:54 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Populating mailman lists out of AD or LDAP. In-Reply-To: <52EEB0C1.7010001@msapiro.net> References: , <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> <709918b2f00844609ab0a06d49c1a9c1@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com>, <52EEB0C1.7010001@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <47c02d99cfc54c4bb56d039c0c1ac1a7@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com> Thanks, I see there is a comment #10 on possible problems with 3000 users?, we want to do 20000+. Is that possible? regards Steven ________________________________________ From: Mailman-Users on behalf of Mark Sapiro Sent: Monday, 3 February 2014 9:55 a.m. To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Populating mailman lists out of AD or LDAP. On 02/02/2014 12:18 PM, Steven Jones wrote: > Hi, > > I want to populate a specific mailman list with users from AD (if possible) or IPA/LDAP that have a specific attribute in AD. > > Is this possible? I can see lots of old comments dated 2004 from googling but nothing newer so far. Assuming you mean you want Mailman to maintain the list membership dynamically from the database and not simply do periodic extraction of a user list from the database to use with a tool like sync_members, there is an LDAP member adaptor for Mailman at . Read the entire comment thread to see all versions. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/steven.jones%40vuw.ac.nz From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 4 03:27:01 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 18:27:01 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> Message-ID: <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> On 02/03/2014 05:53 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > > That makes sense. Is there any way around it? Is it possible to make it use persistent cookies? If you're willing to modify the code, see the MakeCookie function in Mailman/SecurityManager.py. You could replace the comment # We use session cookies, so don't set `expires' or `max-age' keys. by something like c[key]['Max-Age'] = 3600 * 24 * 5 to give the cookie a lifetime of 5 days. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 4 03:48:53 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 18:48:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Populating mailman lists out of AD or LDAP. In-Reply-To: <47c02d99cfc54c4bb56d039c0c1ac1a7@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com> References: , <52EE8327.4090301@msapiro.net> <709918b2f00844609ab0a06d49c1a9c1@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com>, <52EEB0C1.7010001@msapiro.net> <47c02d99cfc54c4bb56d039c0c1ac1a7@SINPR04MB298.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52F05515.2060107@msapiro.net> On 02/03/2014 06:13 PM, Steven Jones wrote: > > Thanks, I see there is a comment #10 on possible problems with 3000 users?, we want to do 20000+. > > Is that possible? Comment #10 is over 7 years and several versions old. Also, the required Python LDAP module has been updated many times since then. I suspect that the problem in the case of the author of comment #10 was timeouts in the LDAP query, but only testing will say for sure. If that's still an issue with large databases, there might be controls in the LDAP module that would help. See . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From pshute at nuw.org.au Tue Feb 4 06:20:33 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2014 16:20:33 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> Message-ID: > On 4 Feb 2014, at 1:27 pm, "Mark Sapiro" wrote: > >> On 02/03/2014 05:53 PM, Peter Shute wrote: >> >> That makes sense. Is there any way around it? Is it possible to make it use persistent cookies? > > > If you're willing to modify the code, see the MakeCookie function in > Mailman/SecurityManager.py. > > You could replace the comment > > # We use session cookies, so don't set `expires' or `max-age' keys. > > by something like > > c[key]['Max-Age'] = 3600 * 24 * 5 > > to give the cookie a lifetime of 5 days. I don't have access to do that, and I think it's probably too difficult for me anyway. I was hoping it was a configuration option that I could ask the administrator to try. Maybe I'll just pray that iOS 7.1 fixes it. Peter Shute From stephen at xemacs.org Tue Feb 4 16:41:28 2014 From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2014 00:41:28 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Peter Shute writes: > I don't have access to do that, and I think it's probably too > difficult for me anyway. I was hoping it was a configuration option > that I could ask the administrator to try. Maybe I'll just pray > that iOS 7.1 fixes it. Unlikely. This "feature" is a *fix*. The problem is that "convenience" may be defined as "things that do what I want without asking annoying questions." Since "what I want" requires mind-reading, which few computers are capable of as yet, most vendors focus on "avoiding annoying questions". As any martinet with a teaching degree knows, *all* questions are annoying, so don't ask any is the (naive) consumer-friendly policy. That policy is what earned Windows its reputation for insecurity (deserved IMHO, YMMV). Apple is trying to do better (after all, computer viruses were invented basically to screw the Mac -- they have been seriously burned), and so they are taking a conservative approach to getting confirmation from the user that they really are the owner of the device and that they really do want to do whatever it is that some random program off the Internet proposed that they do. So iOS 7.1 might be a little bit better, but I wouldn't bet on a lot. From bmalin at franklinamerican.com Mon Feb 3 18:49:50 2014 From: bmalin at franklinamerican.com (Ben Malin) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2014 11:49:50 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Removing admins using command line Message-ID: <0389480b.00000fd4.0000000e@VDI-DESKTOP-014.windows.franklinamerican.com> Is there any way to remove an admin from a list from the command line similar to the remove_members command? I have to remove old users from 150+ lists and am not looking forward to doing it one at a time from the web interface :-/ Thanks in advance! Ben ______________________________________________________________________ The information contained in and transmitted with this communication is strictly confidential, is intended only for use of the intended recipient, and is the property of Franklin American Mortgage Company. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use of the information contained in or transmitted with the communication or distribution, dissemination or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited by law. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately return this communication to the Sender and delete the original message and any copy of it in your possession. From duihi77 at gmail.com Tue Feb 4 03:27:41 2014 From: duihi77 at gmail.com (Duane Hill) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2014 20:27:41 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> Message-ID: <89762998.20140203202741@gmail.com> Monday, February 3, 2014, 7:53:20 PM, Peter wrote: >> On 4 Feb 2014, at 12:26 pm, "Mark Sapiro" wrote: >> >>> On 02/03/2014 05:04 PM, Peter Shute wrote: >>> I use the moderator web page with Firefox, and it stays logged in for as long as I keep the browser open. But with Safari on iPhone and iPad, I often have to log in again when I return to it. Same for every other browser I've tried under iOS. Can anyone tell me why? >> >> >> Because the session cookie which keeps the fact that you've logged in is >> being expired, presumably because when you leave the browser and return >> to it, iOS starts a new session or otherwise invalidates the session >> cookie. Why it does this is an Apple question. > That makes sense. Is there any way around it? Is it possible to make it use persistent cookies? > Note that this problem wasn't anywhere near as bad until I upgraded > from iOS6 to iOS7. I don't mind logging in again every few days. Have you tried setting the Safari setting 'Block Cookies' to 'Never' to see if that in fact makes a difference? There is only three options to choose from. I wish they had an exception list you could add sites to like other browsers. -- Best regards, Duane mailto:duihi77 at gmail.com From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk Tue Feb 4 19:28:34 2014 From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2014 18:28:34 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Removing admins using command line In-Reply-To: <0389480b.00000fd4.0000000e@VDI-DESKTOP-014.windows.franklinamerican.com> References: <0389480b.00000fd4.0000000e@VDI-DESKTOP-014.windows.franklinamerican.com> Message-ID: <20140204182834.GZ10820@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> On Mon, Feb 03, 2014 at 11:49:50AM -0600, Ben Malin wrote: > Is there any way to remove an admin from a list from the command line > similar to the remove_members command? I have to remove old users from > 150+ lists and am not looking forward to doing it one at a time from the > web interface :-/ http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/change_admins.py (with a list_lists -b loop)? You'll probably want to change list passwords, too (so maybe a list_owners run first?) -- To an optimist, the glass is half full. To a pessimist, the glass is half empty. To an engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be. From pshute at nuw.org.au Tue Feb 4 23:50:51 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2014 09:50:51 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <89762998.20140203202741@gmail.com> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <89762998.20140203202741@gmail.com> Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3360@nuwvicms1> Duane Hill wrote: > >>> I use the moderator web page with Firefox, and it stays > logged in for as long as I keep the browser open. But with > Safari on iPhone and iPad, I often have to log in again when > I return to it. Same for every other browser I've tried under > iOS. Can anyone tell me why? > >> > >> > >> Because the session cookie which keeps the fact that > you've logged in > >> is being expired, presumably because when you leave the > browser and > >> return to it, iOS starts a new session or otherwise > invalidates the > >> session cookie. Why it does this is an Apple question. > > > That makes sense. Is there any way around it? Is it > possible to make it use persistent cookies? > > > Note that this problem wasn't anywhere near as bad until I upgraded > > from iOS6 to iOS7. I don't mind logging in again every few days. > > Have you tried setting the Safari setting 'Block Cookies' to 'Never' > to see if that in fact makes a difference? There is only > three options to choose from. I wish they had an exception > list you could add sites to like other browsers. Yes. I was set to the default, which is to block cookies from "third parties and advertisers". I assumed it wasn't blocking mailman cookies anyway because it stays logged in if I stay in Safari. I tried "never", just in case, but no improvement. Peter Shute From pshute at nuw.org.au Wed Feb 5 00:03:33 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2014 10:03:33 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > > I don't have access to do that, and I think it's probably > too > difficult for me anyway. I was hoping it was a > configuration option > that I could ask the administrator to > try. Maybe I'll just pray > that iOS 7.1 fixes it. > > Unlikely. This "feature" is a *fix*. > > The problem is that "convenience" may be defined as "things > that do what I want without asking annoying questions." > Since "what I want" > requires mind-reading, which few computers are capable of as > yet, most vendors focus on "avoiding annoying questions". As > any martinet with a teaching degree knows, *all* questions > are annoying, so don't ask any is the (naive) > consumer-friendly policy. > > That policy is what earned Windows its reputation for > insecurity (deserved IMHO, YMMV). Apple is trying to do > better (after all, computer viruses were invented basically > to screw the Mac -- they have been seriously burned), and so > they are taking a conservative approach to getting > confirmation from the user that they really are the owner of > the device and that they really do want to do whatever it is > that some random program off the Internet proposed that they do. > > So iOS 7.1 might be a little bit better, but I wouldn't bet on a lot. I agree that convenience is often at the expense of security, but I feel that this is just a side efect of something they've done with multitasking. The cookies are supposed to expire if I close the browser, but I haven't. I've only swapped to another program for a while. Safari is a native app, not a random program off the internet. Sometimes when I come back, the session remains logged in. It might be if I come back quickly. But generally I find it's logged out, so I assume iOS has temporarily closed the browser, causing the cookie to expire. This happened in iOS6, but nowhere near as much. In iOS7, it seems to happens almost without fail. It's fair enough to expire the cookie if the browser was closed, but they iOS tries to give the impression it wasn't closed by keeping all the tabs open with the content still visible. As Mark said, this is an Apple problem, not a mailman problem. but if it has become a permanent feature of iOS, and if lots of mailman administrators use iOS, does it become a mailman problem? Peter Shute From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 5 00:55:38 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2014 15:55:38 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> Message-ID: <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> On 02/04/2014 03:03 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > > I agree that convenience is often at the expense of security, but I feel that this is just a side efect of something they've done with multitasking. The cookies are supposed to expire if I close the browser, but I haven't. I've only swapped to another program for a while. Safari is a native app, not a random program off the internet. The security issues are not with the browser sofware, but rather with Cross Site Request Forgery attacks. > As Mark said, this is an Apple problem, not a mailman problem. but if it has become a permanent feature of iOS, and if lots of mailman administrators use iOS, does it become a mailman problem? And have you asked Apple about it? As far as providing "relief" in Mailman in the form of persistent cookies, I'm not inclined to do that in Mailman 2.1 because of the potential CSRF implications. The login/security model for Mailman 3/Postorius is different, so this may or may not be an issue there. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From Richard at Damon-Family.org Wed Feb 5 01:36:20 2014 From: Richard at Damon-Family.org (Richard Damon) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2014 19:36:20 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> Message-ID: <52F18784.5010601@Damon-Family.org> On 2/4/14, 6:03 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > I agree that convenience is often at the expense of security, but I feel that this is just a side efect of something they've done with multitasking. The cookies are supposed to expire if I close the browser, but I haven't. I've only swapped to another program for a while. Safari is a native app, not a random program off the internet. > > Sometimes when I come back, the session remains logged in. It might be if I come back quickly. But generally I find it's logged out, so I assume iOS has temporarily closed the browser, causing the cookie to expire. > > This happened in iOS6, but nowhere near as much. In iOS7, it seems to happens almost without fail. It's fair enough to expire the cookie if the browser was closed, but they iOS tries to give the impression it wasn't closed by keeping all the tabs open with the content still visible. > > As Mark said, this is an Apple problem, not a mailman problem. but if it has become a permanent feature of iOS, and if lots of mailman administrators use iOS, does it become a mailman problem? > > Peter Shute > My guess is it depend on if iOS has asked the browser to actually close to reclaim memory, or just put it aside, while it has been in the background. -- Richard Damon From info at skeena.net Wed Feb 5 05:24:20 2014 From: info at skeena.net (Marcel Giannelia (Felix)) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2014 20:24:20 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] converting an e-mail discussion to a list (with existing archive) In-Reply-To: <52EFF7ED.3010807@msapiro.net> References: <20140202221432.5c76ab76@siobhan> <52EFF7ED.3010807@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <20140204202420.382cf6f8@siobhan> On Mon, 03 Feb 2014 12:11:25 -0800 Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 2/2/14 10:14 PM, Marcel (Felix) Giannelia wrote: > > [...] > > 6. Start 'bounce'ing all messages related to the conversation to the > > new list's posting address > > Steps 3. through 6. could be more easily accomplished by the > following: > > 1) Gather all the emails into a single *nix mbox format file. > Depending on your email client, this may already exist as the folder > containing the desired messages. > > 2) copy that mbox file to > /path/to/mailman/archives/private/listname.mbox/listname.mbox > > 3) run Mailman's > bin/arch --wipe listname > I considered that, but didn't actually try it because: - I didn't have all that many mails to import - I thought mailman might be unhappy at being asked to process a bunch of e-mails that didn't have list headers Can you confirm that arch will definitely handle an outside mbox without issue? If so, that's good to know. ~Felix. From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 5 05:34:53 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2014 20:34:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] converting an e-mail discussion to a list (with existing archive) In-Reply-To: <20140204202420.382cf6f8@siobhan> References: <20140202221432.5c76ab76@siobhan> <52EFF7ED.3010807@msapiro.net> <20140204202420.382cf6f8@siobhan> Message-ID: <52F1BF6D.8070006@msapiro.net> On 02/04/2014 08:24 PM, Marcel (Felix) Giannelia wrote: > > Can you confirm that arch will definitely handle an outside mbox > without issue? If so, that's good to know. Yes, as long as there are no unescaped lines beginning with "From " in the bodies of the messages, and Mailman's bin/cleanarch can be used to check for that. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From pshute at nuw.org.au Wed Feb 5 08:30:27 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2014 18:30:27 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> Message-ID: > On 5 Feb 2014, at 10:55 am, "Mark Sapiro" wrote: > > And have you asked Apple about it? No, I wanted to eliminate the possibility that it's a mailman problem first. It's a pity I don't still have access to iOS6, so I could make sure it's an iOS7 problem. Another change that occurred around the same time is that we moved the list to another server. Can anyone tell me why the moderator page won't let me save the password in any of the iOS browser apps I've tried? None let me enter the URL and password myself, I have to wait for them to offer to save them, but none of them offer for that web page. Peter Shute From rcaron at igpp.ucla.edu Wed Feb 5 01:53:21 2014 From: rcaron at igpp.ucla.edu (Ryan Caron) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2014 16:53:21 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] list reply domain mangled Message-ID: <52F18B81.406@igpp.ucla.edu> I have a aaa at yyy.zzz.ucla.edu, but when an email is sent out, it appears to come from aaa at zzz.ucla.edu. Only an explicit reply-list works, and then not all the time. I should note that the server is not virtual, and doesn't have any other names beyond yyy.zzz.ucla.edu. DEFAULT_URL_HOST & DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST are explicitly defined that way anyway. The individual lists have th host_name properly defined as well. Even reply-to header munging (first_strip_reply_to, reply_goes_to_list, & reply_to_address) are ineffective at preserving the yyy portion. At this point I'm guessing MTA somewhere is changing all this, but where? The MTA in the box is sendmail, but as for the rest of the network... Thanks, Ryan From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 5 15:45:43 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2014 06:45:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> On 02/04/2014 11:30 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > > Can anyone tell me why the moderator page won't let me save the password in any of the iOS browser apps I've tried? None let me enter the URL and password myself, I have to wait for them to offer to save them, but none of them offer for that web page. This again would appear to be either an iOS issue or something to do with the particular web server on the Mailman host. Are you offered password saving for other pages from the same host? My experience with Firefox mostly on various Linux, Mac and Windows platforms is that it does not always offer to save passwords, particularly those from financial institution websites, but it does always offer to save Mailman passwords. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 5 16:06:24 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2014 07:06:24 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] list reply domain mangled In-Reply-To: <52F18B81.406@igpp.ucla.edu> References: <52F18B81.406@igpp.ucla.edu> Message-ID: <52F25370.5080803@msapiro.net> On 02/04/2014 04:53 PM, Ryan Caron wrote: > > At this point I'm guessing MTA somewhere is changing all this, but > where? The MTA in the box is sendmail, but as for the rest of the > network... Does sendmail deliver directly to the recipient MX or does it relay through another host in the local (ucla.edu) network? The Received: headers in a message will tell you which MTAs it passed through. It is almost certainly some MTA in the ucla.edu if not in the zzz.ucla.edu domain. Since 'reply list' works sometimes (I'm guessing when it doesn't, it isn't offered because you are looking at a direct Cc:, not a list copy), the List-Post: header is correct, so Mailman is doing the right thing and it is a downstream MTA that is munging From: and Reply-To: domains. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From fholson at cohousing.org Wed Feb 5 16:00:24 2014 From: fholson at cohousing.org (Fred H Olson) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2014 09:00:24 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sub. Invitation digest option Message-ID: Over half of the subscribers (~800 active subs) to my main list ( http://lists.cohousing.org/mailman/listinfo/cohousing-l ) are in digest mode. Individual mode is still default; replying from digest mode is so problematic - subject line and excessive quoting that I do not want to discourage regular mode. My ISP that hosts a very nice, easy to use Mailman instalation requires that subscribers subscribe themselves or respond to invitations (ie I can no longer unilaterally subscribe people) to protect against spam acusations. Therefore I use the invitation process fairly frequently. Today I realized (and experimented) that responding to a subscription invitation doee not include an easy option to select digest mode. Could the verify page include this option? FRed -- Fred H. Olson Minneapolis,MN 55411 USA (near north Mpls) Email: fholson at cohousing.org 612-588-9532 My Link Pg: http://fholson.cohousing.org My org: Communications for Justice -- Free, superior listserv's w/o ads From rcaron at igpp.ucla.edu Wed Feb 5 18:36:45 2014 From: rcaron at igpp.ucla.edu (Ryan Caron) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2014 09:36:45 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] list reply domain mangled In-Reply-To: <52F18B81.406@igpp.ucla.edu> References: <52F18B81.406@igpp.ucla.edu> Message-ID: <52F276AD.4010201@igpp.ucla.edu> I have a aaa at yyy.zzz.ucla.edu, but when an email is sent out, it appears to come from aaa at zzz.ucla.edu. Only an explicit reply-list works, and then not all the time. I should note that the server is not virtual, and doesn't have any other names beyond yyy.zzz.ucla.edu. DEFAULT_URL_HOST & DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST are explicitly defined that way anyway. The individual lists have the host_name properly defined as well. Even reply-to header munging (first_strip_reply_to, reply_goes_to_list, & reply_to_address) are ineffective at preserving the yyy portion. Most list members have addressed zzz.ucla.edu, but those who are external (like gmail) always get proper yyy.zzz reply-to domains. At this point I'm guessing MTA somewhere is changing all this, but at this point I'm definitely out of my element. The MTA on the box is sendmail, but as for the rest of the network... Thanks, Ryan From pshute at nuw.org.au Wed Feb 5 19:21:47 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 05:21:47 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> Message-ID: > On 6 Feb 2014, at 1:45 am, "Mark Sapiro" wrote: > >> On 02/04/2014 11:30 PM, Peter Shute wrote: >> >> Can anyone tell me why the moderator page won't let me save the password in any of the iOS browser apps I've tried? None let me enter the URL and password myself, I have to wait for them to offer to save them, but none of them offer for that web page. > > > This again would appear to be either an iOS issue or something to do > with the particular web server on the Mailman host. Are you offered > password saving for other pages from the same host? IOS's Safari doesn't offer to save the password to the membership configuration page on the same server either. > My experience with Firefox mostly on various Linux, Mac and Windows > platforms is that it does not always offer to save passwords, > particularly those from financial institution websites, but it does > always offer to save Mailman passwords. Firefox offers to save the passwords to the same pages on a PC. I guess that means it's totally an iOS problem. Peter Shute From pshute at nuw.org.au Wed Feb 5 22:12:14 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 08:12:14 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <104FF743-A89A-40A1-8A5A-20EC758128A7@nuw.org.au> On 6 Feb 2014, at 5:22 am, "Peter Shute" wrote: >> My experience with Firefox mostly on various Linux, Mac and Windows >> platforms is that it does not always offer to save passwords, >> particularly those from financial institution websites, but it does >> always offer to save Mailman passwords. > > Firefox offers to save the passwords to the same pages on a PC. I guess that means it's totally an iOS problem. It's interesting though that none of the other iOS apps I've tried offer to save it either - Atomic Lite, Chrome, Dolphin and Opera. Unless each of these uses the same faulty API to determine whether to offer to save the password or not, there must be something different about the mailman page that's fooling them. Maybe the lack of a username field? Can anyone confirm whether they've had the same experience? It's happening for me on two different servers, so I'm assuming it's universal. Getting back to the original problem of the cookie expiring, I've now closed all the Safari tabs except the mailman one, and it has stayed logged in for over an hour, despite me using other apps in the meantime. Prior to iOS7, my solution to the problem was to use chrome exclusively for this mailman page so I could have a single tab open in that app, while using many tabs in Safari. That stopped working with iOS7, but perhaps later minor iOS updates have fixed it. I'll go back to this method for a few days to check if it's working again. Peter Shute From gaa at ulticom.com Wed Feb 5 23:33:30 2014 From: gaa at ulticom.com (Gary Algier) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2014 17:33:30 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <104FF743-A89A-40A1-8A5A-20EC758128A7@nuw.org.au> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> <104FF743-A89A-40A1-8A5A-20EC758128A7@nuw.org.au> Message-ID: <52F2BC3A.50207@ulticom.com> On 02/05/14 16:12, Peter Shute wrote: > On 6 Feb 2014, at 5:22 am, "Peter Shute" wrote: > >>> My experience with Firefox mostly on various Linux, Mac and Windows >>> platforms is that it does not always offer to save passwords, >>> particularly those from financial institution websites, but it does >>> always offer to save Mailman passwords. This can because the web sites have a setting on the form: autocomplete="off". I know Safari honors this. I don't think Mailman uses this. >> >> Firefox offers to save the passwords to the same pages on a PC. I guess that means it's totally an iOS problem. > > It's interesting though that none of the other iOS apps I've tried offer to save it either - Atomic Lite, Chrome, Dolphin and Opera. Unless each of these uses the same faulty API to determine whether to offer to save the password or not, there must be something different about the mailman page that's fooling them. Maybe the lack of a username field? > > Can anyone confirm whether they've had the same experience? It's happening for me on two different servers, so I'm assuming it's universal. > I use a password management plugin with Firefox (and IE8) and it does not handle the Mailman code well. I assumed it was because of the lack of a user field. I had the same problem when managing our VoIP PBX that only had a password field without a user name. When a recent upgrade included a user name field my problems went away. -- Gary Algier, WB2FWZ gaa at ulticom.com +1 856 787 2758 Ulticom Inc., 1020 Briggs Rd, Mt. Laurel, NJ 08054 Fax:+1 856 866 2033 Nielsen's First Law of Computer Manuals: People don't read documentation voluntarily. From pshute at nuw.org.au Thu Feb 6 00:57:27 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 10:57:27 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52F2BC3A.50207@ulticom.com> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> <104FF743-A89A-40A1-8A5A-20EC758128A7@nuw.org.au> <52F2BC3A.50207@ulticom.com> Message-ID: > On 6 Feb 2014, at 9:55 am, "Gary Algier" wrote: >>> Firefox offers to save the passwords to the same pages on a PC. I guess that means it's totally an iOS problem. >> >> It's interesting though that none of the other iOS apps I've tried offer to save it either - Atomic Lite, Chrome, Dolphin and Opera. Unless each of these uses the same faulty API to determine whether to offer to save the password or not, there must be something different about the mailman page that's fooling them. Maybe the lack of a username field? >> >> Can anyone confirm whether they've had the same experience? It's happening for me on two different servers, so I'm assuming it's universal. > > I use a password management plugin with Firefox (and IE8) and it does not > handle the Mailman code well. I assumed it was because of the lack of a user > field. I had the same problem when managing our VoIP PBX that only had a > password field without a user name. When a recent upgrade included a user > name field my problems went away. That's likely to be the reason then, but it doesn't explain why my Firefox does ask to save the password, without any plugins. Peter Shute From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 6 01:02:21 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2014 16:02:21 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> <104FF743-A89A-40A1-8A5A-20EC758128A7@nuw.org.au> <52F2BC3A.50207@ulticom.com> Message-ID: <52F2D10D.8090108@msapiro.net> On 02/05/2014 03:57 PM, Peter Shute wrote: >> On 6 Feb 2014, at 9:55 am, "Gary Algier" wrote: >> >> I use a password management plugin with Firefox (and IE8) and it does not >> handle the Mailman code well. I assumed it was because of the lack of a user >> field. I had the same problem when managing our VoIP PBX that only had a >> password field without a user name. When a recent upgrade included a user >> name field my problems went away. > > That's likely to be the reason then, but it doesn't explain why my Firefox does ask to save the password, without any plugins. I use Firefox on an Android phone and it quite happily saves Mailman's admin login passwords w/o a user field. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From pshute at nuw.org.au Thu Feb 6 03:00:03 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 13:00:03 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why does iOS's Safari log out the moderator web page? In-Reply-To: <52F2D10D.8090108@msapiro.net> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3343@nuwvicms1> <52F041BB.6040607@msapiro.net> <52D6145C-D2CB-44FE-A638-00E5BFD57CA7@nuw.org.au> <52F04FF5.5010409@msapiro.net> <87eh3i6g2f.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B3361@nuwvicms1> <52F17DFA.7070203@msapiro.net> <52F24E97.20205@msapiro.net> <104FF743-A89A-40A1-8A5A-20EC758128A7@nuw.org.au> <52F2BC3A.50207@ulticom.com> <52F2D10D.8090108@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <755151B9-9651-4D4E-A75B-D67CEEABA97C@nuw.org.au> > On 6 Feb 2014, at 11:03 am, "Mark Sapiro" wrote: > > I use Firefox on an Android phone and it quite happily saves Mailman's > admin login passwords w/o a user field. No such thing for iOS, unfortunately, although I'm betting all the other browsers available for Android will save a mailman password too. I just tried the Mercury browser, on the grounds that its logo looks a bit like the Firefox logo, and it too doesn't ask to save it. It must be dependent on an iOS API. Peter Shute From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 6 03:12:43 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2014 18:12:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sub. Invitation digest option In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52F2EF9B.8070909@msapiro.net> On 02/05/2014 07:00 AM, Fred H Olson wrote: > > Today I realized (and experimented) that responding to a > subscription invitation doee not include an easy option to > select digest mode. Could the verify page include this option? If you follow the web link to the confirm page in the invitation email, it includes a 'digests' radio button selection if the user actually has a choice, i.e. the list is both digestable and nondigestable. Granted, there is no such option if you confirm by email. Is that what you're asking for, or does your confirmation page not include the digests option? If the latter, is the list you experimented with both digestable and nondigestable? -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From frankly3d at gmail.com Thu Feb 6 18:10:40 2014 From: frankly3d at gmail.com (Frank Murphy) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 17:10:40 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Block of text near footer? Message-ID: <20140206171040.4236b465@frank01.frankly3d.home> Mailman version 2.1.12 Can a block of text be placed near the footer on created\posted mails, e.g.? Request will expire June 2014 -- http://list.example.com I'm uncertain how to enter such a string in the footer text box. ___ Regards Frank frankly3d.com From nick.hudson at gmail.com Thu Feb 6 16:46:34 2014 From: nick.hudson at gmail.com (Nick Hudson) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 09:46:34 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archive Email Issue Message-ID: I recently had to rebuild the server our mailing list was running on. When I brought it back up everything seems to be fine, with exception of the archives. The archive list shows each individual email, but when you click on it, it's always the last email that was received. So every archive link goes to the same email. Any thoughts on what I might can do to correct this? Mailman 2.1.15 running on Ubuntu 13.04 Thanks! -- Nick Hudson nick.hudson at gmail.com From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 6 19:34:13 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2014 10:34:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archive Email Issue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52F3D5A5.1090108@msapiro.net> On 02/06/2014 07:46 AM, Nick Hudson wrote: > I recently had to rebuild the server our mailing list was running on. When > I brought it back up everything seems to be fine, with exception of the > archives. The archive list shows each individual email, but when you click > on it, it's always the last email that was received. So every archive link > goes to the same email. > > Any thoughts on what I might can do to correct this? Run Mailman's bin/arch --wipe LISTNAME but first make sure that archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox exists and contains the full archive, and maybe check for unescaped "From " lines with bin/cleanarch. See . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 6 19:37:11 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2014 10:37:11 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Block of text near footer? In-Reply-To: <20140206171040.4236b465@frank01.frankly3d.home> References: <20140206171040.4236b465@frank01.frankly3d.home> Message-ID: <52F3D657.4080901@msapiro.net> On 02/06/2014 09:10 AM, Frank Murphy wrote: > Mailman version 2.1.12 > > Can a block of text be placed near the footer on created\posted mails, > e.g.? > > Request will expire June 2014 > -- > http://list.example.com > > > I'm uncertain how to enter such a string in the footer text box. Just enter it preceding the _______ line in the msg_footer and perhaps digest_footer text boxes and Submit Your Changes. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From nick.hudson at gmail.com Thu Feb 6 19:48:34 2014 From: nick.hudson at gmail.com (Nick Hudson) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 12:48:34 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Archive Email Issue In-Reply-To: <52F3D5A5.1090108@msapiro.net> References: <52F3D5A5.1090108@msapiro.net> Message-ID: Thanks this worked. On Thu, Feb 6, 2014 at 12:34 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/06/2014 07:46 AM, Nick Hudson wrote: > > I recently had to rebuild the server our mailing list was running on. > When > > I brought it back up everything seems to be fine, with exception of the > > archives. The archive list shows each individual email, but when you > click > > on it, it's always the last email that was received. So every archive > link > > goes to the same email. > > > > Any thoughts on what I might can do to correct this? > > > Run Mailman's > > bin/arch --wipe LISTNAME > > but first make sure that archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox > exists and contains the full archive, and maybe check for unescaped > "From " lines with bin/cleanarch. See . > > -- > Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, > San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > Searchable Archives: > http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/nick.hudson%40gmail.com > -- Nick Hudson nick.hudson at gmail.com From joemailgroups at gmail.com Thu Feb 6 22:56:54 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 13:56:54 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription notifications - how to turn it off. Message-ID: Hello, everyone. I have decided to transfer my mailman lists to a third party Mailman host. What options do I have to transfer all subscriptions to the new server ? Is there a way to export the files and then transfer to the host's server ? Assuming I am not able to do this (I am currently experiencing problems with the hard drive where the files are located) and have to manually enter all subscriptions (there are nearly 500 members total) is there a way to prevent subscription notices from being sent out again ? Each subscriber has already been sent a notification when they were subscribed and I want to make this transition smooth be avoiding subscription notices from being sent again. Thank you in advance. Joe. From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 6 23:09:13 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2014 14:09:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription notifications - how to turn it off. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52F40809.1080108@msapiro.net> On 02/06/2014 01:56 PM, Joe wrote: > > What options do I have to transfer all subscriptions to the new server ? Is there a way to export the files and then transfer to the host's server ? See the FAQ at . > Assuming I am not able to do this (I am currently experiencing problems with the hard drive where the files are located) and have to manually enter all subscriptions (there are nearly 500 members total) is there a way to prevent subscription notices from being sent out again ? Each subscriber has already been sent a notification when they were subscribed and I want to make this transition smooth be avoiding subscription notices from being sent again. If you use the web list admin Membership Management... -> Mass Subscription page, there are radio buttons to control notifications. Also see the FAQ at . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From dsl225 at gmail.com Fri Feb 7 07:50:52 2014 From: dsl225 at gmail.com (dsl225 at gmail.com) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 13:50:52 +0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Changing existing real_name & host_name Message-ID: <000001cf23d0$f32ac570$d9805050$@gmail.com> Hello, I'm running a List for a client since a couple of years without problem, but my client decided to change his company's brand name... I already edited most instances of previous brand name and what is left are the real_name & host_name entries. Is there a guided howto for doing so or is it simpler than it appears? Thanks for any help! John From addw at phcomp.co.uk Fri Feb 7 18:23:22 2014 From: addw at phcomp.co.uk (Alain Williams) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 17:23:22 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail list statistics Message-ID: <20140207172321.GZ14262@phcomp.co.uk> I sometimes get asked how many messages are sent out to a mail list. So I wrote a script to tell me. This works under ksh or bash. The script is attached and I am happy for this to become part of mailman or put into an associated library. You need to run it in the list's archive directory. Regards -- Alain Williams Linux/GNU Consultant - Mail systems, Web sites, Networking, Programmer, IT Lecturer. +44 (0) 787 668 0256 http://www.phcomp.co.uk/ Parliament Hill Computers Ltd. Registration Information: http://www.phcomp.co.uk/contact.php #include From addw at phcomp.co.uk Fri Feb 7 18:33:36 2014 From: addw at phcomp.co.uk (Alain Williams) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 17:33:36 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail list statistics In-Reply-To: <20140207172321.GZ14262@phcomp.co.uk> References: <20140207172321.GZ14262@phcomp.co.uk> Message-ID: <20140207173336.GA14262@phcomp.co.uk> On Fri, Feb 07, 2014 at 05:23:22PM +0000, Alain Williams wrote: > I sometimes get asked how many messages are sent out to a mail list. > > So I wrote a script to tell me. This works under ksh or bash. > > The script is attached and I am happy for this to become part of mailman or put > into an associated library. > > You need to run it in the list's archive directory. Drat, this list does not allow attachments, so here it is in line: # Show how much email sent through a mailman mail list # Copyright (c) Alain Williams January 2009 # This program is free software and is licenced under the GPL: http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html # This should be run in a directory like: # /var/spool/mailman/bray/archives/private/chat # Note that this needs write access to the directory since it creates a temporary # directory. echo "Columns: month number-of-messages total-message-size" Months="January February March April May June July August September October November December" FilesTot=0 # Work out starting year, look for something like: 2004-December startYear=$( ls | perl -wlne '$year = $1 if(/^(\d\d\d\d)-/ and ( !defined($year) or $1 < $year)); END {print $year }' ) endYear=$( date '+%Y' ) for year in $( seq $startYear $endYear ) do echo "Year $year" YearTot=0 for month in $Months do [[ ! -d $year-$month ]] && printf "$year $month\tnone\n" && continue cd $year-$month || exit mkdir x || exit ln [0-9]* x cd x || exit files=$( ls -f | wc -l ) (( FilesTot += files )) (( YearTot += files )) printf "$year $month\t$files\t$( du -h | cut -f 1 )\n" cd .. || exit rm -rf x cd .. || exit done echo "Total for year $year: $YearTot" done echo "Emails total $FilesTot" -- Alain Williams Linux/GNU Consultant - Mail systems, Web sites, Networking, Programmer, IT Lecturer. +44 (0) 787 668 0256 http://www.phcomp.co.uk/ Parliament Hill Computers Ltd. Registration Information: http://www.phcomp.co.uk/contact.php #include From joemailgroups at gmail.com Fri Feb 7 18:42:48 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 09:42:48 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting. Message-ID: <827010C7-D09D-451A-91A9-2148939C156A@gmail.com> Hello, everyone. A while ago I posted a question to this group about some problems I had been experiencing with my server and was recommended several Mailman hosting services by some of the members who replied to my original post either here or privately. I have decided to follow this advice in order to save the time and effort it has become for me to maintain my server and the Mailman software up-to-date. What has been your experience with hosting services ? Have you had any problems and what should I watch out for ? Are there any hosting services you would recommend ? Thank you in advance for your responses. Joe. From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 7 20:02:03 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 11:02:03 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Changing existing real_name & host_name In-Reply-To: <000001cf23d0$f32ac570$d9805050$@gmail.com> References: <000001cf23d0$f32ac570$d9805050$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <52F52DAB.4040906@msapiro.net> On 02/06/2014 10:50 PM, dsl225 at gmail.com wrote: > > I already edited most instances of previous brand name and what is left are > the real_name & host_name entries. > > Is there a guided howto for doing so or is it simpler than it appears? For changing real_name see the FAQ at . For host_name, seer Mailman's bin/fix_url.py -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 7 20:33:05 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 11:33:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail list statistics In-Reply-To: <20140207173336.GA14262@phcomp.co.uk> References: <20140207172321.GZ14262@phcomp.co.uk> <20140207173336.GA14262@phcomp.co.uk> Message-ID: <52F534F1.10508@msapiro.net> On 02/07/2014 09:33 AM, Alain Williams wrote: >> >> The script is attached and I am happy for this to become part of mailman or put >> into an associated library. >> >> You need to run it in the list's archive directory. > > Drat, this list does not allow attachments, so here it is in line: Actually, it does but only of MIME type text/plain or text/x-diff. I have attached a revision. Changes include: - It only needs read access to Mailman's archives. - It can run from anywhere. Granted the total-message-size is a bit off because it includes the various index files, but it's close in most cases, and since it includes all the html boiler plate, it isn't that accurate to begin with. I can add this to the contrib directory in the distribution. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan -------------- next part -------------- # Show how much email sent through a mailman mail list # Copyright (c) Alain Williams January 2009 # This program is free software and is licenced under the GPL: http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html # Usage: /path/to/script LISTNAME # Note: this only works if the list's archive_volume_frequency is monthly. # Also, the total message size for the month includes the index files. # Set the path to Mailman's private archives directory. # Adjust for your installation. ARCHIVES="/usr/local/mailman/archives/private" # cd to the list cd $ARCHIVES/$1 || exit echo "Columns: month number-of-messages total-message-size" Months="January February March April May June July August September October November December" FilesTot=0 # Work out starting year, look for something like: 2004-December startYear=$( ls | perl -wlne '$year = $1 if(/^(\d\d\d\d)-/ and ( !defined($year) or $1 < $year)); END {print $year }' ) endYear=$( date '+%Y' ) for year in $( seq $startYear $endYear ) do echo "Year $year" YearTot=0 for month in $Months do [[ ! -d $year-$month ]] && printf "$year $month\tnone\n" && continue cd $year-$month || exit files=$( ls -f [0-9]* | wc -l ) (( FilesTot += files )) (( YearTot += files )) printf "$year $month\t$files\t$( du -h | cut -f 1 )\n" cd .. || exit done echo "Total for year $year: $YearTot" done echo "Emails total $FilesTot" From fholson at cohousing.org Fri Feb 7 21:41:34 2014 From: fholson at cohousing.org (Fred H Olson) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 14:41:34 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sub. Invitation digest option In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 Mark Sapiro wrote: >If you follow the web link to the confirm page in the invitation email, >it includes a 'digests' radio button selection if the user actually has >a choice, i.e. the list is both digestable and nondigestable. Curious, that is not what I get. I experimented again on a list I just keep around for testing. I confirmed that it allows digest and regular (default). See http://justcomm.org/temp/Screenshot1.png and http://justcomm.org/temp/Screenshot2.png I invited a test address (alias of my regular address) and followed the link in the Verify message but did not see a digest option. See: http://justcomm.org/temp/Screenshot1.png The Welcome message does offer a URL to change to digest (which interestingly did not require me to log it - maybe I was still logged in from verifying? ) See: http://justcomm.org/temp/Screenshot1.png Fred -- Fred H. Olson Minneapolis,MN 55411 USA (near north Mpls) Email: fholson at cohousing.org 612-588-9532 My Link Pg: http://fholson.cohousing.org My org: Communications for Justice -- Free, superior listserv's w/o ads From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 7 22:24:10 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 13:24:10 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sub. Invitation digest option In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52F54EFA.6090406@msapiro.net> On 02/07/2014 12:41 PM, Fred H Olson wrote: > > I invited a test address (alias of my regular address) and > followed the link in the Verify message but did not see a > digest option. See: > http://justcomm.org/temp/Screenshot1.png I think you mean http://justcomm.org/temp/Screenshot3.png. What Mailman version is this? Could it be Mailman 2.0.x? My confirmation page looks like , and I think it has looked more or less like that since the beginning of 2.1. > The Welcome message does offer a URL to change to digest > (which interestingly did not require me to log it - maybe I was > still logged in from verifying? ) Yes, if you still had the cookie from logging in as the admin, you wouldn't be required to log in, but you might be restricted from making global changes. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From joemailgroups at gmail.com Sat Feb 8 16:42:00 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 07:42:00 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about web and mail hosting in Mailman. Message-ID: <6D8E4131-45D3-4863-BC3A-FBB307119857@gmail.com> Hello, everyone. I am transferred the website of my Mailman related domain to a third party hosting service but plant to host the Mailman list itself with a different service. I have been told that Mailman can not reside in one server while the website associated with the domain it uses resides in another. In my case the domain.com website is hosted by one service while the Mailman list and a few e-mail associated with the domain (info at domain.com and admin at domain.com) are hosted by another service (by service I mean different servers in different geographical locations). I have been told that this solution is not possible as I will not be able to access Mailman administrative interface through my browser (as in www.domain.com/mailman/admin) since the website will be in a different server and not the one where Mailman is located. Is this true or is possible to have this type of configuration with mailman lists and website hosted by different servers ? Thank you in advance, Joe. From gkasica at netwrx1.com Fri Feb 7 22:59:29 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2014 21:59:29 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists Message-ID: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Hello: Currently I've got Postfix running with virtual domains with a MySQL database and am trying to get Mailman to do so as well. I can get one domain to work mailtest at netwrx1.org but anything else is failing as below. Can someone assist? I've loaded the aliases as shown in to mysql and the snip of the mm_cfg.py is below as well. I've looked at varius on line FAQs and other references but am still stuck - have bounced all the relevant iitems postfix and mailman. Thanks in advance, I'm sure its something simple I'm missing. George Error: ===== Feb 7 15:09:29 eagle postfix/smtpd[5953]: Anonymous TLS connection established from mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com[207.46.163.235]: TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits) Feb 7 15:09:55 eagle magicspam-postfix[5957]: Checking exemption lists... Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle magicspam-postfix[5958]: Checking exemption lists... Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle postgrey[16312]: action=pass, reason=triplet found, client_name=mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com, client_address=207.46.163.235, sender=gkasica at netwrx1.com, recipient=skunk-works at netwrx1.org Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle postgrey[16312]: action=pass, reason=triplet found, client_name=mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com, client_address=207.46.163.235, sender=gkasica at netwrx1.com, recipient=skunk-works at netwrx1.org Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle postfix/smtpd[5953]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com[207.46.163.235]: 550 5.1.1 : Recipient address rejected: User unknown in virtual mailbox table; from= to= proto=ESMTP helo= Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle postfix/smtpd[5953]: disconnect from mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com[207.46.163.235] Aliases ====== INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES ('skunkworks at netwrx1.org','skunkworks at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-admin at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-admin at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-bounces at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-bounces at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-confirm at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-confirm at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-join at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-join at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-leave at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-leave at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-owner at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-owner at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-request at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-request at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunkworks-subscribe at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-subscribe at lists.netwrx1.org' ), ('skunkworks-unsubscribe at netwrx1.org','skunkworks-unsubscribe at lists.netwrx1. org'); /etc/mm_cfg.py ============= #------------------------------------------------------------- # Default domain for email addresses of newly created MLs DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'netwrx1.org' #------------------------------------------------------------- # Default host for web interface of newly created MLs DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'eagle.netwrx1.org' #------------------------------------------------------------- VIRTUAL_HOSTS = {'netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabetes.ne t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'} # Required when setting any of its arguments. #add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST) add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.com','netwrx1.com') add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.net','netwrx1.net') add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.org','netwrx1.org') add_virtualhost('www.mke-skywarn.org','mke-skywarn.org') add_virtualhost('www.petdiabetes.net','petdiabetes.net') add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.biz','skywarn.biz') add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.tv','skywarn.tv') add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.us','skywarn.us') add_virtualhost('www.twmbfelinerescue.org','twmbfelinerescue.org') POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabetes.ne t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'] --- ===[George R. Kasica]=== +1 262 677 0766 georgek at netwrx1.com +1 206 374 6482 FAX http://www.netwrx1.com/georgek Jackson, WI USA gkasica at netwrx1.com ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._ `6_ 6 ) `-. ( ).`-.__.`) (_Y_.)' ._ ) `._ `. ``-..-' _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,' (il),-'' (li),' ((!.-' From mark at msapiro.net Sat Feb 8 19:20:50 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 10:20:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> On 02/07/2014 01:59 PM, George Kasica wrote:> Hello: > > Currently I've got Postfix running with virtual domains with a MySQL > database and am trying to get Mailman to do so as well. > > I can get one domain to work mailtest at netwrx1.org but anything else is > failing as below. Can someone assist? I've loaded the aliases as shown in to > mysql and the snip of the mm_cfg.py is below as well. > I've looked at varius on line FAQs and other references but am still stuck - > have bounced all the relevant iitems postfix and mailman. ... > Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle postfix/smtpd[5953]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from > mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com[207.46.163.235]: 550 5.1.1 > : Recipient address rejected: User unknown in > virtual mailbox table; from= > to= proto=ESMTP > helo= ... > Aliases > ====== > INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES > ('skunkworks at netwrx1.org','skunkworks at lists.netwrx1.org'), skunk-works or skunkworks? Is that the problem? > /etc/mm_cfg.py > ============= ... > VIRTUAL_HOSTS = > {'netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabetes.ne > t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'} The above is wrong! VIRTUAL_HOSTS is a python dictionary with keys = URL hosts and values = the corresponding email hosts. (The above syntax creates something entirely different.) It is maintained by add_virtualhost directives as below. It should never be assigned a value in mm_cfg.py because this creates an entity mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOSTS distinct from Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS, but the add_virtualhost directives still maintain Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS which is not referenced in Mailman. The only direct reference th VIRTUAL_HOSTS that should ever be in mm_cfg.py is VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear() if needed to remove the default entry set in Defaults.py if it is erroneous, and if needed, it must be VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear() and not VIRTUAL_HOSTS = {} to avoid creating mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOSTS distinct from Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS. > # Required when setting any of its arguments. > #add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST) > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.com','netwrx1.com') > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.net','netwrx1.net') > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.org','netwrx1.org') > add_virtualhost('www.mke-skywarn.org','mke-skywarn.org') > add_virtualhost('www.petdiabetes.net','petdiabetes.net') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.biz','skywarn.biz') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.tv','skywarn.tv') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.us','skywarn.us') > add_virtualhost('www.twmbfelinerescue.org','twmbfelinerescue.org') > > POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = > ['netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabetes.ne > t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'] This does nothing if you don't also have MTA = 'Postfix' to cause Mailman to generate data/aliases and data/virtual-mailman to be referenced by Postfix. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Sat Feb 8 19:29:30 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 10:29:30 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about web and mail hosting in Mailman. In-Reply-To: <6D8E4131-45D3-4863-BC3A-FBB307119857@gmail.com> References: <6D8E4131-45D3-4863-BC3A-FBB307119857@gmail.com> Message-ID: <52F6778A.8090705@msapiro.net> On 02/08/2014 07:42 AM, Joe wrote: > > I have been told that this solution is not possible as I will not be able to access Mailman administrative interface through my browser (as in www.domain.com/mailman/admin) since the website will be in a different server and not the one where Mailman is located. That is correct. > Is this true or is possible to have this type of configuration with mailman lists and website hosted by different servers ? What you need is to have the MX for the email domain of the lists and the web domain of the lists be the same server or at least servers that can share the Mailman file system via NFS or some other file sharing manager. In your case, if the lists are addressed as LISTNAME at example.com with the MX for example.com being the Mailman host, you will need to have a domain for the web interface, e.g. http://lists.example.com/mailman/..., which also resolves to the Mailman host. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From Richard at Damon-Family.org Sat Feb 8 22:42:54 2014 From: Richard at Damon-Family.org (Richard Damon) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 16:42:54 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about web and mail hosting in Mailman. In-Reply-To: <6D8E4131-45D3-4863-BC3A-FBB307119857@gmail.com> References: <6D8E4131-45D3-4863-BC3A-FBB307119857@gmail.com> Message-ID: <52F6A4DE.7070204@Damon-Family.org> On 2/8/14, 10:42 AM, Joe wrote: > Hello, everyone. > > I am transferred the website of my Mailman related domain to a third party hosting service but plant to host the Mailman list itself with a different service. I have been told that Mailman can not reside in one server while the website associated with the domain it uses resides in another. In my case the domain.com website is hosted by one service while the Mailman list and a few e-mail associated with the domain (info at domain.com and admin at domain.com) are hosted by another service (by service I mean different servers in different geographical locations). > > I have been told that this solution is not possible as I will not be able to access Mailman administrative interface through my browser (as in www.domain.com/mailman/admin) since the website will be in a different server and not the one where Mailman is located. > > Is this true or is possible to have this type of configuration with mailman lists and website hosted by different servers ? > > Thank you in advance, > > Joe. You should be able to place the interface at something list http://lists.example.com/mailman/admin Because the mailman interface code resides with the mail processing code, and they need to share data, they really need to be on the same machine. They do NOT need to be on the same domain. I have a mailman list running on a shared mailing-list host, but the lists email address reference a domain that is hosted on a different machine, the domains are different. -- Richard Damon From gkasica at netwrx1.com Sat Feb 8 23:39:25 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 22:39:25 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Mark Thanks, sorry on the idiot mistake - OK...I can't read :) Too many hours in front of the screen.... I corrected the aliases and other items you mentioned here and actually deleted and remade the list completely. No more not found errors in the logs BUT.... I can send out messages to the list and they don't show as bouncing in the logs below but I also don't ever see them come back to the list here.... I'm set for get received notice here in outlook So I see it got there Your message has been delivered to the following groups: skunk-works at netwrx1.org Subject: Test Message Feb 8 16:12:34 eagle postgrey[16312]: action=pass, reason=triplet found, client_name=mail-bn1lp0149.outbound.protection.outlook.com, client_address=207.46.163. 149, sender=gkasica at netwrx1.com, recipient=skunk-works at netwrx1.org Feb 8 16:12:34 eagle postgrey[16312]: action=pass, reason=triplet found, client_name=mail-bn1lp0149.outbound.protection.outlook.com, client_address=207.46.163. 149, sender=gkasica at netwrx1.com, recipient=skunk-works at netwrx1.org Feb 8 16:12:37 eagle postfix/pipe[21348]: 44236121652: to=, orig_to=, relay=spamassassin, delay=30, delays=27/0.01/0/3.1, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via spamassassin service) Feb 8 16:12:38 eagle postfix/pipe[21355]: B85CD121CCD: to=, relay=mailman, delay=0.54, delays=0.19/0.01/0/0.35, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via mailman service) Looking at the mailman logs the only one with any activity at the time I sent a test message is one called vette # cat vette Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Can you assist? George -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 12:21 PM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/07/2014 01:59 PM, George Kasica wrote:> Hello: > > Currently I've got Postfix running with virtual domains with a MySQL > database and am trying to get Mailman to do so as well. > > I can get one domain to work mailtest at netwrx1.org but anything else is > failing as below. Can someone assist? I've loaded the aliases as shown > in to mysql and the snip of the mm_cfg.py is below as well. > I've looked at varius on line FAQs and other references but am still > stuck - have bounced all the relevant iitems postfix and mailman. ... > Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle postfix/smtpd[5953]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from > mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com[207.46.163.235]: 550 > 5.1.1 > : Recipient address rejected: User unknown in > virtual mailbox table; from= > to= proto=ESMTP > helo= ... > Aliases > ====== > INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES > ('skunkworks at netwrx1.org','skunkworks at lists.netwrx1.org'), skunk-works or skunkworks? Is that the problem? > /etc/mm_cfg.py > ============= ... > VIRTUAL_HOSTS = > {'netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabe > tes.ne > t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'} The above is wrong! VIRTUAL_HOSTS is a python dictionary with keys = URL hosts and values = the corresponding email hosts. (The above syntax creates something entirely different.) It is maintained by add_virtualhost directives as below. It should never be assigned a value in mm_cfg.py because this creates an entity mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOSTS distinct from Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS, but the add_virtualhost directives still maintain Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS which is not referenced in Mailman. The only direct reference th VIRTUAL_HOSTS that should ever be in mm_cfg.py is VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear() if needed to remove the default entry set in Defaults.py if it is erroneous, and if needed, it must be VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear() and not VIRTUAL_HOSTS = {} to avoid creating mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOSTS distinct from Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS. > # Required when setting any of its arguments. > #add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST) > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.com','netwrx1.com') > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.net','netwrx1.net') > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.org','netwrx1.org') > add_virtualhost('www.mke-skywarn.org','mke-skywarn.org') > add_virtualhost('www.petdiabetes.net','petdiabetes.net') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.biz','skywarn.biz') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.tv','skywarn.tv') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.us','skywarn.us') > add_virtualhost('www.twmbfelinerescue.org','twmbfelinerescue.org') > > POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = > ['netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabe > tes.ne > t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'] This does nothing if you don't also have MTA = 'Postfix' to cause Mailman to generate data/aliases and data/virtual-mailman to be referenced by Postfix. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From gkasica at netwrx1.com Sat Feb 8 23:44:04 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 22:44:04 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: The ODD part is I have a list here set up as mailtest and its working fine. I don't see any differences in setup. -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of George Kasica Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 4:39 PM To: Mark Sapiro; mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists Mark Thanks, sorry on the idiot mistake - OK...I can't read :) Too many hours in front of the screen.... I corrected the aliases and other items you mentioned here and actually deleted and remade the list completely. No more not found errors in the logs BUT.... I can send out messages to the list and they don't show as bouncing in the logs below but I also don't ever see them come back to the list here.... I'm set for get received notice here in outlook So I see it got there Your message has been delivered to the following groups: skunk-works at netwrx1.org Subject: Test Message Feb 8 16:12:34 eagle postgrey[16312]: action=pass, reason=triplet found, client_name=mail-bn1lp0149.outbound.protection.outlook.com, client_address=207.46.163. 149, sender=gkasica at netwrx1.com, recipient=skunk-works at netwrx1.org Feb 8 16:12:34 eagle postgrey[16312]: action=pass, reason=triplet found, client_name=mail-bn1lp0149.outbound.protection.outlook.com, client_address=207.46.163. 149, sender=gkasica at netwrx1.com, recipient=skunk-works at netwrx1.org Feb 8 16:12:37 eagle postfix/pipe[21348]: 44236121652: to=, orig_to=, relay=spamassassin, delay=30, delays=27/0.01/0/3.1, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via spamassassin service) Feb 8 16:12:38 eagle postfix/pipe[21355]: B85CD121CCD: to=, relay=mailman, delay=0.54, delays=0.19/0.01/0/0.35, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via mailman service) Looking at the mailman logs the only one with any activity at the time I sent a test message is one called vette # cat vette Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Can you assist? George -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 12:21 PM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/07/2014 01:59 PM, George Kasica wrote:> Hello: > > Currently I've got Postfix running with virtual domains with a MySQL > database and am trying to get Mailman to do so as well. > > I can get one domain to work mailtest at netwrx1.org but anything else is > failing as below. Can someone assist? I've loaded the aliases as shown > in to mysql and the snip of the mm_cfg.py is below as well. > I've looked at varius on line FAQs and other references but am still > stuck - have bounced all the relevant iitems postfix and mailman. ... > Feb 7 15:09:56 eagle postfix/smtpd[5953]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from > mail-by2lp0235.outbound.protection.outlook.com[207.46.163.235]: 550 > 5.1.1 > : Recipient address rejected: User unknown in > virtual mailbox table; from= > to= proto=ESMTP > helo= ... > Aliases > ====== > INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES > ('skunkworks at netwrx1.org','skunkworks at lists.netwrx1.org'), skunk-works or skunkworks? Is that the problem? > /etc/mm_cfg.py > ============= ... > VIRTUAL_HOSTS = > {'netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabe > tes.ne > t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'} The above is wrong! VIRTUAL_HOSTS is a python dictionary with keys = URL hosts and values = the corresponding email hosts. (The above syntax creates something entirely different.) It is maintained by add_virtualhost directives as below. It should never be assigned a value in mm_cfg.py because this creates an entity mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOSTS distinct from Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS, but the add_virtualhost directives still maintain Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS which is not referenced in Mailman. The only direct reference th VIRTUAL_HOSTS that should ever be in mm_cfg.py is VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear() if needed to remove the default entry set in Defaults.py if it is erroneous, and if needed, it must be VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear() and not VIRTUAL_HOSTS = {} to avoid creating mm_cfg.VIRTUAL_HOSTS distinct from Defaults.VIRTUAL_HOSTS. > # Required when setting any of its arguments. > #add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST) > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.com','netwrx1.com') > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.net','netwrx1.net') > add_virtualhost('www.netwrx1.org','netwrx1.org') > add_virtualhost('www.mke-skywarn.org','mke-skywarn.org') > add_virtualhost('www.petdiabetes.net','petdiabetes.net') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.biz','skywarn.biz') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.tv','skywarn.tv') > add_virtualhost('www.skywarn.us','skywarn.us') > add_virtualhost('www.twmbfelinerescue.org','twmbfelinerescue.org') > > POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = > ['netwrx1.com','netwrx1.net','netwrx1.org','mke-skywarn.org','petdiabe > tes.ne > t','skywarn.biz','skywarn.tv','skywarn.us','twmbfelinerescue.org'] This does nothing if you don't also have MTA = 'Postfix' to cause Mailman to generate data/aliases and data/virtual-mailman to be referenced by Postfix. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 9 00:16:36 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 15:16:36 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52F6BAD4.7030106@msapiro.net> On 02/08/2014 02:39 PM, George Kasica wrote: > > I can send out messages to the list and they don't show as bouncing in the > logs below but I also don't ever see them come back to the list here.... ... > Feb 8 16:12:38 eagle postfix/pipe[21355]: B85CD121CCD: > to=, relay=mailman, delay=0.54, > delays=0.19/0.01/0/0.35, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via mailman > service) What is the 'mailman' service in Postfix (definition in master.cf). If it is postfix_to_mailman.py, see the FAQ at . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 9 00:24:05 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 15:24:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> On 02/08/2014 02:44 PM, George Kasica wrote: > The ODD part is I have a list here set up as mailtest and its working fine. > I don't see any differences in setup. Is there a postfix transport maps entry affecting one of these lists/domains and not the other? -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Sun Feb 9 00:29:30 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 23:29:30 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> This is all the setup doc told me to add: /etc/postfix# cat transport lists.netwrx1.org mailman: This s the other list INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES ('mailtest at netwrx1.org','mailtest at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-admin at netwrx1.org','mailtest-admin at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-bounces at netwrx1.org','mailtest-bounces at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-confirm at netwrx1.org','mailtest-confirm at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-join at netwrx1.org','mailtest-join at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-leave at netwrx1.org','mailtest-leave at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-owner at netwrx1.org','mailtest-owner at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-request at netwrx1.org','mailtest-request at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-subscribe at netwrx1.org','mailtest-subscribe at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-unsubscribe at netwrx1.org','mailtest-unsubscribe at lists.netwrx1.org' ); Here is skunk-works: INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES ('mailtest at netwrx1.org','mailtest at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-admin at netwrx1.org','mailtest-admin at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-bounces at netwrx1.org','mailtest-bounces at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-confirm at netwrx1.org','mailtest-confirm at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-join at netwrx1.org','mailtest-join at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-leave at netwrx1.org','mailtest-leave at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-owner at netwrx1.org','mailtest-owner at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-request at netwrx1.org','mailtest-request at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-subscribe at netwrx1.org','mailtest-subscribe at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('mailtest-unsubscribe at netwrx1.org','mailtest-unsubscribe at lists.netwrx1.org' ); -----Original Message----- From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 5:24 PM To: George Kasica; mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/08/2014 02:44 PM, George Kasica wrote: > The ODD part is I have a list here set up as mailtest and its working fine. > I don't see any differences in setup. Is there a postfix transport maps entry affecting one of these lists/domains and not the other? -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 9 01:43:29 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2014 16:43:29 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> On 02/08/2014 03:29 PM, George Kasica wrote: > This is all the setup doc told me to add: > > /etc/postfix# cat transport > lists.netwrx1.org mailman: > > This s the other list > > INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES > ('mailtest at netwrx1.org','mailtest at lists.netwrx1.org'), ... I don't know why there'd be a difference between the lists. When you mail to the mailtest list, does the Postfix log entry look similar to > Feb 8 16:12:38 eagle postfix/pipe[21355]: B85CD121CCD: > to=, relay=mailman, delay=0.54, > delays=0.19/0.01/0/0.35, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via mailman > service) In any case, see the FAQ at . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Sun Feb 9 01:33:58 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2014 00:33:58 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <52F6BAD4.7030106@msapiro.net> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BAD4.7030106@msapiro.net> Message-ID: Mark: Here it is: mailman unix - n n - - pipe flags=FR user=list argv=/usr/lib/mailman/bin/postfix-to-mailman.py ${nexthop} ${user} Which points to /usr/lib/mailman/bin/postfix-to-mailman.py -> /etc/mailman/postfix-to-mailman.py* Based on a quick look at the FAQ you point to below, would I be better off not using the postfx-to-mailman.py and going with what is in section 6.1.1 Integrating Postfix and Mailman? And if so how would I do that with MySQL as a backend as this seems to be designed for hash.db files and aliases not MySQL Sorry, I'm not a Postfix or Mailman expert I'm coming from a exim/majordomo environment. George -----Original Message----- From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2014 5:17 PM To: George Kasica; mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/08/2014 02:39 PM, George Kasica wrote: > > I can send out messages to the list and they don't show as bouncing in > the logs below but I also don't ever see them come back to the list here.... ... > Feb 8 16:12:38 eagle postfix/pipe[21355]: B85CD121CCD: > to=, relay=mailman, delay=0.54, > delays=0.19/0.01/0/0.35, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via mailman > service) What is the 'mailman' service in Postfix (definition in master.cf). If it is postfix_to_mailman.py, see the FAQ at . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From joemailgroups at gmail.com Sun Feb 9 03:18:10 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 18:18:10 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about administrative panel. Message-ID: Hello, everyone. I am having problems accessing the the Mass Subscription panel in Mailman's administrative interface. I currently host 8 lists but this is only happening to one of them. As I try to access the Mass Subscription window or panel at www.domain.com/mailman/admin/list1/members/add my browser states it can't find the server. It does work for all other 7 lists I host. Any idea why this is happening and how I can fix it ? Thank you in advance. Joe. From holden_cgaux at outlook.com Sat Feb 8 22:21:08 2014 From: holden_cgaux at outlook.com (David Holden) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2014 15:21:08 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] what happens when you duplicate a name in Mailman? Message-ID: Looked through for an answer to this and couldn't find it elsewhere. If I add an email address to Mailman that's already on the list, will Mailman duplicate it, or will it do something else? joe at domain is already on the list joe at domain is added by me (but is already on the list, remember?) Does "joe" now get two messages from the list, or will the list just send me an error message saying, 'hey dummy, that's a duplicate'. I've been tasked with adding a bulk of addresses to the list but it would be easier not to sort my list of people already on it. I would like to take and just add everyone, including some who are probably already on it. From a data entry perspective, it will be time consuming to sift and sort those already on it. Clear as mud? -- Cheers, David M. Holden From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 9 17:02:08 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 08:02:08 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] what happens when you duplicate a name in Mailman? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52F7A680.6040703@msapiro.net> On 02/08/2014 01:21 PM, David Holden wrote: > > joe at domain is already on the list > joe at domain is added by me (but is already on the list, remember?) This attempt fails because joe is already a member. > Does "joe" now get two messages from the list, or will the list just > send me an error message saying, 'hey dummy, that's a duplicate'. The latter. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 9 17:20:50 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 08:20:50 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about administrative panel. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52F7AAE2.4060400@msapiro.net> On 02/08/2014 06:18 PM, Joe wrote: > > I currently host 8 lists but this is only happening to one of them. As I try to access the Mass Subscription window or panel at www.domain.com/mailman/admin/list1/members/add my browser states it can't find the server. It does work for all other 7 lists I host. Reading between the lines and guessing at the problem, I think the web_page_url setting for the problem list has the wrong host name. See the FAQ at . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 9 17:53:13 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 08:53:13 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> On 02/08/2014 05:24 PM, George Kasica wrote: > Here you go sent to mailtest at netwrx1.org gets me > > Feb 8 19:11:41 eagle postfix/pipe[25088]: 30CEE121CDE: > to=, relay=mailman, delay=0.51, > delays=0.15/0.01/0/0.35, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via mailman > service) > > > And a short time later I have a message in my inbox (and 4 other users test > IDs do as well) So the 'mailman' service can deliver to mailtest at lists.netwrx1.org, but not to skunk-works at lists.netwrx1.org. If this service is postfix_to_mailman.py (You never confirmed that it was or wasn't), the only way this can happen is if the $var-prefix/lists/skunk-works/ directory doesn't exist, but then postfix_to_mailman should fail with an error message the would be in the Postfix log message. Therefore, it appears that the problem is not in the delivery of posts to skunk-works at lists.netwrx1.org, but rather in the processing/delivery of the post by Mailman. Check Mailman's logs. Also, are there any list members that would receive the post (Mailman's 'bin/list_members --regular --nomail=enabled skunk-works' will tell you). If the only eligible recipient is you, is your 'not metoo' setting off? > From what I'm reading in the FAQ this is not a supported method by Mailman > but I'm not seeing where its pointing me to any help in getting this > working. Would I be better off with the official Postfix -> Mailman > integration mentioned and if so how would I do this in the current MySQL > environment or would I need to start over? Starting from zero concerns me a > bit as this is currently handing mail traffic just not lists. > > Currently the Postfix/Mailman setup is set for MySQL simply because that's > the FAQ I followed but this is a VERY small environment...would I be better > served to go the route of hash.db tables and rebuild this to work that way? If you want help from this list, we are best able to help you if you configure Postfix to use hashes for Postfix's alias_maps and virtual_alias_maps for Mailman list addresses as discussed at and . I don't think this is necessarily incompatible with using MySQL for other addresses. > (I'm not a huge MySQL fan personally for this it seems like overkill) We're > talking 10 lists with maybe 1000 users total between them and about the same > number of virtual domains to handle mail. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Sun Feb 9 18:50:16 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2014 17:50:16 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Mark: Answers to questions below: As to your comment about using hashes for mailman...I'm thinking that might be the best course, and for postfix in general, this s a REALLY small installation as I mentioned and very low traffic realistically. We're not running YahooGroups here :) Yes, it uses is postfix_to_mailman.py thought I had that in the other message. The directory /var/lib/mailman/lists/skunk-works does exist Error ==== is empty Post ==== Jan 31 02:42:41 2014 (13402) post to mailtest from gkasica at netwrx1.com, size=15798, message-id=<1ed525c0d0004e7e8e015c332b0c1cbe at BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outl ook.com>, success Qrunner ======= Feb 08 15:22:01 2014 (20887) IncomingRunner qrunner started. Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20891) RetryRunner qrunner started. Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20884) ArchRunner qrunner started. Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20890) VirginRunner qrunner started. Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20886) CommandRunner qrunner started. Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20889) OutgoingRunner qrunner started. Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20888) NewsRunner qrunner started. Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20885) BounceRunner qrunner started. Smtp ==== Feb 08 15:24:41 2014 (20889) smtp to skunk-works for 1 recips, completed in 0.162 seconds Feb 08 15:45:34 2014 (20889) smtp to skunk-works for 1 recips, completed in 0.085 seconds Feb 08 15:45:35 2014 (20889) smtp to skunk-works for 1 recips, completed in 0.099 seconds Vette ===== Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Feb 08 16:52:49 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: <8b7df489fa54454e9c854e3441103899 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> I'm set to receive postings: cd /var/lib/mailman/bin ./list_members --regular --nomail=enabled skunk-works gkasica at netwrx1.com Not-meetoo is NOT checked -----Original Message----- From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2014 10:53 AM To: George Kasica Cc: Mailman Users Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/08/2014 05:24 PM, George Kasica wrote: > Here you go sent to mailtest at netwrx1.org gets me > > Feb 8 19:11:41 eagle postfix/pipe[25088]: 30CEE121CDE: > to=, relay=mailman, delay=0.51, > delays=0.15/0.01/0/0.35, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (delivered via mailman > service) > > > And a short time later I have a message in my inbox (and 4 other users > test IDs do as well) So the 'mailman' service can deliver to mailtest at lists.netwrx1.org, but not to skunk-works at lists.netwrx1.org. If this service is postfix_to_mailman.py (You never confirmed that it was or wasn't), the only way this can happen is if the $var-prefix/lists/skunk-works/ directory doesn't exist, but then postfix_to_mailman should fail with an error message the would be in the Postfix log message. Therefore, it appears that the problem is not in the delivery of posts to skunk-works at lists.netwrx1.org, but rather in the processing/delivery of the post by Mailman. Check Mailman's logs. Also, are there any list members that would receive the post (Mailman's 'bin/list_members --regular --nomail=enabled skunk-works' will tell you). If the only eligible recipient is you, is your 'not metoo' setting off? > From what I'm reading in the FAQ this is not a supported method by > Mailman but I'm not seeing where its pointing me to any help in > getting this working. Would I be better off with the official Postfix > -> Mailman integration mentioned and if so how would I do this in the > current MySQL environment or would I need to start over? Starting from > zero concerns me a bit as this is currently handing mail traffic just not lists. > > Currently the Postfix/Mailman setup is set for MySQL simply because > that's the FAQ I followed but this is a VERY small environment...would > I be better served to go the route of hash.db tables and rebuild this to work that way? If you want help from this list, we are best able to help you if you configure Postfix to use hashes for Postfix's alias_maps and virtual_alias_maps for Mailman list addresses as discussed at and . I don't think this is necessarily incompatible with using MySQL for other addresses. > (I'm not a huge MySQL fan personally for this it seems like overkill) > We're talking 10 lists with maybe 1000 users total between them and > about the same number of virtual domains to handle mail. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 9 19:04:59 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 10:04:59 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52F7C34B.4040400@msapiro.net> On 02/09/2014 09:50 AM, George Kasica wrote: > Mark: > > Answers to questions below: > > As to your comment about using hashes for mailman...I'm thinking that might > be the best course, and for postfix in general, this s a REALLY small > installation as I mentioned and very low traffic realistically. We're not > running YahooGroups here :) Although the setup you're using seems to work, at least for Postfix's delivery. > Yes, it uses is postfix_to_mailman.py thought I had that in the other > message. > > The directory /var/lib/mailman/lists/skunk-works does exist > > Error > ==== > is empty > > Post > ==== > Jan 31 02:42:41 2014 (13402) post to mailtest from gkasica at netwrx1.com, > size=15798, > message-id=<1ed525c0d0004e7e8e015c332b0c1cbe at BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outl > ook.com>, success OK. The post log is written at outgoing smtp time so the absence of a skunk-works entry doesn't mean the post didn't reach Mailman. > Qrunner > ======= > Feb 08 15:22:01 2014 (20887) IncomingRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20891) RetryRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20884) ArchRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20890) VirginRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20886) CommandRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20889) OutgoingRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20888) NewsRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20885) BounceRunner qrunner started. > > Smtp > ==== > Feb 08 15:24:41 2014 (20889) > smtp to skunk-works for > 1 recips, completed in 0.162 seconds > Feb 08 15:45:34 2014 (20889) > smtp to skunk-works for > 1 recips, completed in 0.085 seconds > Feb 08 15:45:35 2014 (20889) > smtp to skunk-works for > 1 recips, completed in 0.099 seconds These are Mailman notifications about something to do with the skunk-works list. Did you receive them? What did they say? Why are there no entries for the sucessful post to mailtest? Too long ago? > Vette > ===== > Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: > <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> > Feb 08 16:52:49 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: > <8b7df489fa54454e9c854e3441103899 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Are these your posts? Check your outgoing mail folder for the message ids. Check the list's Content filtering -> filter_action. It could be discarding the message. Also check the Privacy options... -> Sender filters actions. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Sun Feb 9 19:18:19 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2014 18:18:19 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <52F7C34B.4040400@msapiro.net> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F7C34B.4040400@msapiro.net> Message-ID: See below -----Original Message----- From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2014 12:05 PM To: George Kasica Cc: Mailman Users Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/09/2014 09:50 AM, George Kasica wrote: > Mark: > > Answers to questions below: > > As to your comment about using hashes for mailman...I'm thinking that > might be the best course, and for postfix in general, this s a REALLY > small installation as I mentioned and very low traffic realistically. > We're not running YahooGroups here :) Although the setup you're using seems to work, at least for Postfix's delivery. Correct Everything but mailman is working virtual domain wise. > Yes, it uses is postfix_to_mailman.py thought I had that in the other > message. > > The directory /var/lib/mailman/lists/skunk-works does exist > > Error > ==== > is empty > > Post > ==== > Jan 31 02:42:41 2014 (13402) post to mailtest from > gkasica at netwrx1.com, size=15798, > message-id=<1ed525c0d0004e7e8e015c332b0c1cbe at BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.pro > d.outl > ook.com>, success OK. The post log is written at outgoing smtp time so the absence of a skunk-works entry doesn't mean the post didn't reach Mailman. OK > Qrunner > ======= > Feb 08 15:22:01 2014 (20887) IncomingRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20891) RetryRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20884) ArchRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20890) VirginRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20886) CommandRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20889) OutgoingRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20888) NewsRunner qrunner started. > Feb 08 15:22:02 2014 (20885) BounceRunner qrunner started. > > Smtp > ==== > Feb 08 15:24:41 2014 (20889) > smtp to > skunk-works for > 1 recips, completed in 0.162 seconds > Feb 08 15:45:34 2014 (20889) > smtp to > skunk-works for > 1 recips, completed in 0.085 seconds > Feb 08 15:45:35 2014 (20889) > smtp to > skunk-works for > 1 recips, completed in 0.099 seconds These are Mailman notifications about something to do with the skunk-works list. Did you receive them? What did they say? No those were test messages I sent but never received Why are there no entries for the sucessful post to mailtest? Too long ago? No clue - this is a log from yesterday and its complete to current day and time > Vette > ===== > Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: > <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.c > om> Feb 08 16:52:49 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: > <8b7df489fa54454e9c854e3441103899 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.c > om> Are these your posts? Check your outgoing mail folder for the message ids. Check the list's Content filtering -> filter_action. It could be discarding the message. Also check the Privacy options... -> Sender filters actions. Yes those are posts from me. Nothing skunk-works related is sitting in the outbound postfix queue What am I looking for on content filtering settings? And Privacy and Sender Filters. I don't recall changing from defaults. Here is what it is: Content Filter -> Filter Action is Discard Privacy Options -> Sender Filters Nothing is held or moderated -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 10 01:00:31 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 16:00:31 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F7C34B.4040400@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52F8169F.3010203@msapiro.net> On 02/09/2014 10:18 AM, George Kasica wrote: > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] >> Vette >> ===== >> Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: >> <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.c >> om> Feb 08 16:52:49 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: >> <8b7df489fa54454e9c854e3441103899 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.c >> om> > > > Are these your posts? Check your outgoing mail folder for the message ids. > Check the list's Content filtering -> filter_action. It could be discarding > the message. Also check the Privacy options... -> Sender filters actions. > > Yes those are posts from me. > Nothing skunk-works related is sitting in the outbound postfix queue > > What am I looking for on content filtering settings? And Privacy and Sender > Filters. I don't recall changing from defaults. > > Here is what it is: > Content Filter -> Filter Action is Discard > Privacy Options -> Sender Filters Nothing is held or moderated Your messages are being automatically discarded by Mailman. There are only 5 ways this can happen. 1) The post is from a moderated member and member_moderation_action is Discard. 2) The post is from a non-member and either the non-member is in discard_these_nonmembers or generic_nonmember_action is discard. The above settings are found in Privacy options... -> Sender filters. 3) A header in the post matches a Spam Filter Rule in Privacy options... -> Spam filters -> header_filter_rules with a Discard action. 4) Content filtering -> filter_content is Yes, the post is empty after content filtering and filter_action is Discard. 5) Non-digest options -> scrub_nondigest is Yes, ARCHIVE_HTML_SANITIZER is set to 0 in mm_cfg.py and the post is non-multipart with MIME type text/html. In your case, 4) is most likely, Either the post is text/html and you don't accept text/html or the post is multipart/related and you don't accept multipart/related or all multipart types. Set filter_action to Reject and see what happens. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 10 01:43:53 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 16:43:53 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F7C34B.4040400@msapiro.net> <52F8169F.3010203@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52F820C9.3070601@msapiro.net> On 02/09/2014 04:29 PM, George Kasica wrote: > > SO what should I be setting here to allow Text only or convert to text only? In pass_mime_types set multipart message/rfc822 text/plain text/html Also set both collapse_alternatives and convert_html_to_plaintext to Yes. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Mon Feb 10 01:29:11 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 00:29:11 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: <52F8169F.3010203@msapiro.net> References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F7C34B.4040400@msapiro.net> <52F8169F.3010203@msapiro.net> Message-ID: OK...Got a bounce back: The message's content type was not explicitly allowed Odd since I'm using outlook2013 and I've set it to what is supposed to be Text... SO what should I be setting here to allow Text only or convert to text only? George -----Original Message----- From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2014 6:01 PM To: George Kasica Cc: Mailman Users Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/09/2014 10:18 AM, George Kasica wrote: > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] >> Vette >> ===== >> Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: >> <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook. >> c >> om> Feb 08 16:52:49 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: >> <8b7df489fa54454e9c854e3441103899 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook. >> c >> om> > > > Are these your posts? Check your outgoing mail folder for the message ids. > Check the list's Content filtering -> filter_action. It could be > discarding the message. Also check the Privacy options... -> Sender filters actions. > > Yes those are posts from me. > Nothing skunk-works related is sitting in the outbound postfix queue > > What am I looking for on content filtering settings? And Privacy and > Sender Filters. I don't recall changing from defaults. > > Here is what it is: > Content Filter -> Filter Action is Discard Privacy Options -> Sender > Filters Nothing is held or moderated Your messages are being automatically discarded by Mailman. There are only 5 ways this can happen. 1) The post is from a moderated member and member_moderation_action is Discard. 2) The post is from a non-member and either the non-member is in discard_these_nonmembers or generic_nonmember_action is discard. The above settings are found in Privacy options... -> Sender filters. 3) A header in the post matches a Spam Filter Rule in Privacy options... -> Spam filters -> header_filter_rules with a Discard action. 4) Content filtering -> filter_content is Yes, the post is empty after content filtering and filter_action is Discard. 5) Non-digest options -> scrub_nondigest is Yes, ARCHIVE_HTML_SANITIZER is set to 0 in mm_cfg.py and the post is non-multipart with MIME type text/html. In your case, 4) is most likely, Either the post is text/html and you don't accept text/html or the post is multipart/related and you don't accept multipart/related or all multipart types. Set filter_action to Reject and see what happens. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From joemailgroups at gmail.com Mon Feb 10 02:06:07 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2014 17:06:07 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Consultant for hire with Mailman and OS X Server experience. Message-ID: Hello, everyone. I am in need of a consultant to help me with my server. I need someone with knowledge of both Mailman and OS X Server to connect remotely in order to install and configure Mailman on my system. Anyone interested please contact me off list. Thank you in advance. Joe. From gkasica at netwrx1.com Mon Feb 10 02:31:06 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 01:31:06 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists In-Reply-To: References: <93905a5b4517474f945219724972d5fc@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F67582.7000308@msapiro.net> <3a300145d95941068541a9509d1b4e77@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6BC95.7020508@msapiro.net> <8f8e64636001416e8a9ab8ce041230d8@BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F6CF31.2050800@msapiro.net> <52F7B279.1040503@msapiro.net> <733b08664a8b4c9ca24155715a675bb3@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F7C34B.4040400@msapiro.net> <52F8169F.3010203@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <55939c53076249cabbb08ceb7a29e699@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> We are running from what I can see thanks to a tremendous amount of help from Mark Sapiro. Thank you very much to all. Turned out to be content filtering issues. George Kasica -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of George Kasica Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2014 6:29 PM To: Mark Sapiro Cc: Mailman Users Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists OK...Got a bounce back: The message's content type was not explicitly allowed Odd since I'm using outlook2013 and I've set it to what is supposed to be Text... SO what should I be setting here to allow Text only or convert to text only? George -----Original Message----- From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2014 6:01 PM To: George Kasica Cc: Mailman Users Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Help needed Mailman, Postfix with MySQL and Virtual Domain Lists On 02/09/2014 10:18 AM, George Kasica wrote: > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] >> Vette >> ===== >> Feb 08 16:12:39 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: >> <8ec65c559e294241ba9cb4bfa98b6d75 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook. >> c >> om> Feb 08 16:52:49 2014 (20887) Message discarded, msgid: >> <8b7df489fa54454e9c854e3441103899 at BN1PR05MB188.namprd05.prod.outlook. >> c >> om> > > > Are these your posts? Check your outgoing mail folder for the message ids. > Check the list's Content filtering -> filter_action. It could be > discarding the message. Also check the Privacy options... -> Sender filters actions. > > Yes those are posts from me. > Nothing skunk-works related is sitting in the outbound postfix queue > > What am I looking for on content filtering settings? And Privacy and > Sender Filters. I don't recall changing from defaults. > > Here is what it is: > Content Filter -> Filter Action is Discard Privacy Options -> Sender > Filters Nothing is held or moderated Your messages are being automatically discarded by Mailman. There are only 5 ways this can happen. 1) The post is from a moderated member and member_moderation_action is Discard. 2) The post is from a non-member and either the non-member is in discard_these_nonmembers or generic_nonmember_action is discard. The above settings are found in Privacy options... -> Sender filters. 3) A header in the post matches a Spam Filter Rule in Privacy options... -> Spam filters -> header_filter_rules with a Discard action. 4) Content filtering -> filter_content is Yes, the post is empty after content filtering and filter_action is Discard. 5) Non-digest options -> scrub_nondigest is Yes, ARCHIVE_HTML_SANITIZER is set to 0 in mm_cfg.py and the post is non-multipart with MIME type text/html. In your case, 4) is most likely, Either the post is text/html and you don't accept text/html or the post is multipart/related and you don't accept multipart/related or all multipart types. Set filter_action to Reject and see what happens. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From geek at uniserve.com Mon Feb 10 01:49:58 2014 From: geek at uniserve.com (Dave Stevens) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2014 16:49:58 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] missing mailman archive Message-ID: <20140209164958.75426oi3iaeyfbjq@webmail.uniserve.com> I've got a Centos install and used virtualmin to set up the mailman service - it was included in the default install and worked fine. The server hosts about ten domains, providing web pages and mail, including lists with mailman. For one domain only the mail isn't being archived. Attachments to mails are. I find this pretty weird and have looked around but to no avail - clicking through on the usual footer link on list mails leads correctly to a folder for attachments but no mail bodies. As far as I can see the options are specified correctly to archive mail, but it isn't happening. I don't know where to look. Ideas? Dave -- Advertising is the rattling of a stick inside a swill bucket - George Orwell From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 10 19:26:27 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 10:26:27 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] missing mailman archive In-Reply-To: <20140209164958.75426oi3iaeyfbjq@webmail.uniserve.com> References: <20140209164958.75426oi3iaeyfbjq@webmail.uniserve.com> Message-ID: <52F919D3.7010009@msapiro.net> On 02/09/2014 04:49 PM, Dave Stevens wrote: > > For one domain only the mail isn't being archived. Attachments to mails > are. I find this pretty weird and have looked around but to no avail - > clicking through on the usual footer link on list mails leads correctly > to a folder for attachments but no mail bodies. What is the archive URL? Is it a public 'pipermail' link? If so, what is Mailman's archives/public/LISTNAME for this list. It should be a symlink to archives/private/LISTNAME. If it is a directory rather than a symlink, remove it - Mailman will create the symlink as needed. Otherwise, look at Mailman's logs, particularly 'error'. Also, there should be an archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox file which is a cumulative mbox containg the full archive, and an archives/private/LISTNAME/ directory containing the html archives. Is that all there? Is there a permissions issue? What does Mailman's bin/check_perms say? -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Mon Feb 10 19:18:08 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 18:18:08 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Getting both regular mail & Digest at same e-mail address Message-ID: <0c53a86f89464ddc99f513cd3ec6fc3c@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Fast question: Is there any way to get both the regular list mail AND the Digests at the same email address and if so how would I got about setting that up.looking for it on line has proved elusive. George --- ===[George R. Kasica]=== +1 262 677 0766 georgek at netwrx1.com +1 206 374 6482 FAX http://www.netwrx1.com/georgek Jackson, WI USA gkasica at netwrx1.com ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._ `6_ 6 ) `-. ( ).`-.__.`) (_Y_.)' ._ ) `._ `. ``-..-' _..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,' (il),-'' (li),' ((!.-' From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 10 20:09:10 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 11:09:10 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Getting both regular mail & Digest at same e-mail address In-Reply-To: <0c53a86f89464ddc99f513cd3ec6fc3c@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> References: <0c53a86f89464ddc99f513cd3ec6fc3c@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52F923D6.7010708@msapiro.net> On 02/10/2014 10:18 AM, George Kasica wrote: > > Is there any way to get both the regular list mail AND the Digests at the > same email address and if so how would I got about setting that up.looking > for it on line has proved elusive. Short answer - No. For Mailman 2.1 at least, this requires two subscriptions which must have distinct email addresses, however mail to these two addresses might end up in the same mailbox, either via forwarding or multiple names that deliver to the same host, e.g. mark at example.com and mark at mail.example.com. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From jimpop at gmail.com Mon Feb 10 20:27:05 2014 From: jimpop at gmail.com (Jim Popovitch) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:27:05 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Getting both regular mail & Digest at same e-mail address In-Reply-To: <52F923D6.7010708@msapiro.net> References: <0c53a86f89464ddc99f513cd3ec6fc3c@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F923D6.7010708@msapiro.net> Message-ID: On Mon, Feb 10, 2014 at 2:09 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/10/2014 10:18 AM, George Kasica wrote: >> >> Is there any way to get both the regular list mail AND the Digests at the >> same email address and if so how would I got about setting that up.looking >> for it on line has proved elusive. > > > Short answer - No. > > For Mailman 2.1 at least, this requires two subscriptions which must > have distinct email addresses, however mail to these two addresses might > end up in the same mailbox, either via forwarding or multiple names that > deliver to the same host, e.g. mark at example.com and mark at mail.example.com. Another possibility is using an email address tag (aka Sub-Addressing, see RFC 5233): gkasica+normal at netwrx1.com gkasica+digest at netwrx1.com Most MTAs support this, -Jim P. From gkasica at netwrx1.com Mon Feb 10 20:15:16 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:15:16 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Getting both regular mail & Digest at same e-mail address In-Reply-To: <52F923D6.7010708@msapiro.net> References: <0c53a86f89464ddc99f513cd3ec6fc3c@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F923D6.7010708@msapiro.net> Message-ID: OK. Suspected as much and as a possible work around but thought I'd ask for the users that were wondering. George -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 1:09 PM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Getting both regular mail & Digest at same e-mail address On 02/10/2014 10:18 AM, George Kasica wrote: > > Is there any way to get both the regular list mail AND the Digests at > the same email address and if so how would I got about setting that > up.looking for it on line has proved elusive. Short answer - No. For Mailman 2.1 at least, this requires two subscriptions which must have distinct email addresses, however mail to these two addresses might end up in the same mailbox, either via forwarding or multiple names that deliver to the same host, e.g. mark at example.com and mark at mail.example.com. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From gkasica at netwrx1.com Mon Feb 10 20:33:05 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 19:33:05 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Getting both regular mail & Digest at same e-mail address In-Reply-To: References: <0c53a86f89464ddc99f513cd3ec6fc3c@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <52F923D6.7010708@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <09ae1bb3c27c49f4b2a0a0022f94ac74@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Interesting Idea - will need to investigate this -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Jim Popovitch Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 1:27 PM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Getting both regular mail & Digest at same e-mail address On Mon, Feb 10, 2014 at 2:09 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/10/2014 10:18 AM, George Kasica wrote: >> >> Is there any way to get both the regular list mail AND the Digests at >> the same email address and if so how would I got about setting that >> up.looking for it on line has proved elusive. > > > Short answer - No. > > For Mailman 2.1 at least, this requires two subscriptions which must > have distinct email addresses, however mail to these two addresses > might end up in the same mailbox, either via forwarding or multiple > names that deliver to the same host, e.g. mark at example.com and mark at mail.example.com. Another possibility is using an email address tag (aka Sub-Addressing, see RFC 5233): gkasica+normal at netwrx1.com gkasica+digest at netwrx1.com Most MTAs support this, -Jim P. ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From gkasica at netwrx1.com Tue Feb 11 01:29:21 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 00:29:21 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Manually setting digest version and/or number and other questions Message-ID: I've got an existing list that I just moved to mailman and I'm seeing the digests start over obviously at v1 n1. Is there any way to set those values somehow so I don't end up duplicating things? Also related to that when a user lipoma at the archive by date, thread, etc. all the mail is there. If he downloads the compressed file he's telling me it only has about 4-5 messages. Haven't had time to Investigate that one for sure yet but was curious what the archive process is like. Is it run once a day or?? Lastly is there a way to scrub either email or user name out of the digest/archive process to prevent harvesting? Thanks again. Sorry for the dumb questions. George --- George R. Kasica Sent from my iPhone5 From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 11 02:13:39 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 17:13:39 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Manually setting digest version and/or number and other questions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52F97943.9010307@msapiro.net> On 02/10/2014 04:29 PM, George Kasica wrote: > I've got an existing list that I just moved to mailman and I'm seeing the digests start over obviously at v1 n1. Is there any way to set those values somehow so I don't end up duplicating things? Use bin/withlist or bin/config_list or the script at to set the list's volume attribute to the desired volume and the list's next_digest_number to the desired number. > Also related to that when a user lipoma at the archive by date, thread, etc. all the mail is there. If he downloads the compressed file he's telling me it only has about 4-5 messages. Haven't had time to > Investigate that one for sure yet but was curious what the archive process is like. Is it run once a day or?? When the .txt.gz files are updated depends on the setting of GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES (default = No) and the running by cron of Mailman's cron/nightly_gzip. If GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES is set to yes in mm_cfg.py, the archives/private/LISTNAME/.txt file will be gzipped with every list post. This is very inefficient. Our official advice in Defaults.py is # Set this to Yes to enable gzipping of the downloadable archive .txt file. # Note that this is /extremely/ inefficient, so an alternative is to just # collect the messages in the associated .txt file and run a cron job every # night to generate the txt.gz file. See cron/nightly_gzip for details. GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES = No My recommendation is to remove the cron/nightly_gzip entry from Mailman's crontab, and remove all the archives/private/LISTNAME/.txt.gz files. Then the archive index will link to the .txt files which are always up to date. This actually saves space because the .txt.gz files are in addition to the .txt files which are always there. The only possible saving with the .gz files is in the serving of a smaller file from the web, but some web servers will decompress the file before sending it anyway, and the saving if any is minimal. > Lastly is there a way to scrub either email or user name out of the digest/archive process to prevent harvesting? Why are digest's a concern more than posts? The only control is ARCHIVER_OBSCURES_EMAILADDRS which only replaces '@' with ' at ' in the archives and which is Yes by default anyway. If you or your users are really concerned about harvesting, a better solution is to make the archive private so it is only accessible to list members. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Tue Feb 11 05:46:53 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 04:46:53 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Manually setting digest version and/or number and other questions In-Reply-To: <52F97943.9010307@msapiro.net> References: <52F97943.9010307@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <6402acfe4d8c41a095c50d73a0add21e@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Excellent info. Will go through this and make some changes. Thanks!! -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 7:14 PM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Manually setting digest version and/or number and other questions On 02/10/2014 04:29 PM, George Kasica wrote: > I've got an existing list that I just moved to mailman and I'm seeing the digests start over obviously at v1 n1. Is there any way to set those values somehow so I don't end up duplicating things? Use bin/withlist or bin/config_list or the script at to set the list's volume attribute to the desired volume and the list's next_digest_number to the desired number. > Also related to that when a user lipoma at the archive by date, > thread, etc. all the mail is there. If he downloads the compressed file he's telling me it only has about 4-5 messages. Haven't had time to Investigate that one for sure yet but was curious what the archive process is like. Is it run once a day or?? When the .txt.gz files are updated depends on the setting of GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES (default = No) and the running by cron of Mailman's cron/nightly_gzip. If GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES is set to yes in mm_cfg.py, the archives/private/LISTNAME/.txt file will be gzipped with every list post. This is very inefficient. Our official advice in Defaults.py is # Set this to Yes to enable gzipping of the downloadable archive .txt file. # Note that this is /extremely/ inefficient, so an alternative is to just # collect the messages in the associated .txt file and run a cron job every # night to generate the txt.gz file. See cron/nightly_gzip for details. GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES = No My recommendation is to remove the cron/nightly_gzip entry from Mailman's crontab, and remove all the archives/private/LISTNAME/.txt.gz files. Then the archive index will link to the .txt files which are always up to date. This actually saves space because the .txt.gz files are in addition to the .txt files which are always there. The only possible saving with the .gz files is in the serving of a smaller file from the web, but some web servers will decompress the file before sending it anyway, and the saving if any is minimal. > Lastly is there a way to scrub either email or user name out of the digest/archive process to prevent harvesting? Why are digest's a concern more than posts? The only control is ARCHIVER_OBSCURES_EMAILADDRS which only replaces '@' with ' at ' in the archives and which is Yes by default anyway. If you or your users are really concerned about harvesting, a better solution is to make the archive private so it is only accessible to list members. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From gkasica at netwrx1.com Tue Feb 11 06:39:46 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 05:39:46 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Manually setting digest version and/or number and other questions In-Reply-To: <52F97943.9010307@msapiro.net> References: <52F97943.9010307@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <3bcc0c90e1374fca8dba91b24fb785f1@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> I actually found the method to use bin/withlist here so that's OK. How does your script work exactly? Where do I find what I use for variables and what they are now? Almost looks like config_list might be better. Changes made but one question - on the web based Archives page I still see an entry for the gzipp'd version but it now goes nowhere and throws a page not found. How do I get rid of that: Archive View by: Downloadable version 2014: [ Thread ] [ Subject ] [ Author ] [ Date ] [ Gzip'd Text 2 KB ] The requested URL /pipermail/skunk-works/2014.txt.gz was not found on this server. George -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 7:14 PM To: mailman-users at python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Manually setting digest version and/or number and other questions On 02/10/2014 04:29 PM, George Kasica wrote: > I've got an existing list that I just moved to mailman and I'm seeing the digests start over obviously at v1 n1. Is there any way to set those values somehow so I don't end up duplicating things? Use bin/withlist or bin/config_list or the script at to set the list's volume attribute to the desired volume and the list's next_digest_number to the desired number. > Also related to that when a user lipoma at the archive by date, > thread, etc. all the mail is there. If he downloads the compressed file he's telling me it only has about 4-5 messages. Haven't had time to Investigate that one for sure yet but was curious what the archive process is like. Is it run once a day or?? When the .txt.gz files are updated depends on the setting of GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES (default = No) and the running by cron of Mailman's cron/nightly_gzip. If GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES is set to yes in mm_cfg.py, the archives/private/LISTNAME/.txt file will be gzipped with every list post. This is very inefficient. Our official advice in Defaults.py is # Set this to Yes to enable gzipping of the downloadable archive .txt file. # Note that this is /extremely/ inefficient, so an alternative is to just # collect the messages in the associated .txt file and run a cron job every # night to generate the txt.gz file. See cron/nightly_gzip for details. GZIP_ARCHIVE_TXT_FILES = No My recommendation is to remove the cron/nightly_gzip entry from Mailman's crontab, and remove all the archives/private/LISTNAME/.txt.gz files. Then the archive index will link to the .txt files which are always up to date. This actually saves space because the .txt.gz files are in addition to the .txt files which are always there. The only possible saving with the .gz files is in the serving of a smaller file from the web, but some web servers will decompress the file before sending it anyway, and the saving if any is minimal. > Lastly is there a way to scrub either email or user name out of the digest/archive process to prevent harvesting? Why are digest's a concern more than posts? The only control is ARCHIVER_OBSCURES_EMAILADDRS which only replaces '@' with ' at ' in the archives and which is Yes by default anyway. If you or your users are really concerned about harvesting, a better solution is to make the archive private so it is only accessible to list members. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From malte.forkel at berlin.de Tue Feb 11 11:48:40 2014 From: malte.forkel at berlin.de (Malte Forkel) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 11:48:40 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Access message by URL based upon message ID? Message-ID: Hello, Does mailman offer an option to provide access to messages in archive by a URL based upon the message's ID? The reason I'm asking is similar to the rationale provided in [1]: I'm reading a mailing list originally maintained by mailman and redistributed by gmane.org using an NTTP client and I'm looking for a easy way to reference interesting messages in my wiki. So far, I have found a proposal for stable URLs by Barry Warsaw [2] and a related thread on this very list [2]. Unfortunately, the mail archive does not seem to offer the message-id based service mentioned in that thread anymore. Gmane still does, but the served page does not provide any links to other messages in the thread. Thanks, Malte [1] https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/tools-discuss/current/msg03400.html [2] http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/Stable+URLs [3] https://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2013-May/075144.html From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 11 17:49:48 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 08:49:48 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Access message by URL based upon message ID? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52FA54AC.6020408@msapiro.net> On 02/11/2014 02:48 AM, Malte Forkel wrote: > > Does mailman offer an option to provide access to messages in archive by > a URL based upon the message's ID? Mailman 2.1's pipermail archive has no such capability. The Hyperkitty archiver which is currently planned as the default archiver for Mailman 3 will have this or an equivalent 'stable URL' capability. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Tue Feb 11 18:16:29 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 17:16:29 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Adding list with new domain. Which alias set would I use Message-ID: Currently have mailman working here with Postfix and MySQL and in the transport it has /etc/postfix/transport lists.netwrx1.org mailman: I have a couple lists under the netwrx1.org domain here that are working well and aliases look like the below but they are all under the netwrx1.org setup: INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES ('skunk-works at netwrx1.org','skunk-works at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-admin at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-admin at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-bounces at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-bounces at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-confirm at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-confirm at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-join at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-join at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-leave at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-leave at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-owner at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-owner at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-request at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-request at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-subscribe at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-subscribe at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('skunk-works-unsubscribe at netwrx1.org','skunk-works-unsubscribe at lists.netwrx1.org'); I want to add a couple lists with their own domains...would the aliases look something like: INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES ('muffin at petdiabetes.net','muffin at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-admin at petdiabetes.net','muffin-admin at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-bounces at petdiabetes.net','muffin-bounces at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-confirm at petdiabetes.net','muffin-confirm at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-join at petdiabetes.net','muffin-join at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-leave at petdiabetes.net','muffin-leave at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-owner at petdiabetes.net','muffin-owner at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-request at petdiabetes.net','muffin-request at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-subscribe at petdiabetes.net','muffin-subscribe at lists.netwrx1.org'), ('muffin-unsubscribe at petdiabetes.net','muffin-unsubscribe at lists.netwrx1.org'); OR would they be like this with the lists own domain and would I need to do anything to transport or another setting?? INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES ('muffin at petdiabetes.net','muffin at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-admin at petdiabetes.net','muffin-admin at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-bounces at petdiabetes.net','muffin-bounces at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-confirm at petdiabetes.net','muffin-confirm at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-join at petdiabetes.net','muffin-join at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-leave at petdiabetes.net','muffin-leave at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-owner at petdiabetes.net','muffin-owner at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-request at petdiabetes.net','muffin-request at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-subscribe at petdiabetes.net','muffin-subscribe at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ('muffin-unsubscribe at petdiabetes.net','muffin-unsubscribe at lists.petdiabetes.net'); Thanks, I'm slowly getting the hang of this, George From fholson at cohousing.org Tue Feb 11 21:40:44 2014 From: fholson at cohousing.org (Fred H Olson) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 14:40:44 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sub. Invitation digest option In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 07 Feb 2014 Mark Sapiro wrote >What Mailman version is this? Could it be Mailman 2.0.x? My confirmation >page looks like , and I >think it has looked more or less like that since the beginning of 2.1. I wrote to my isp where the Mailman I use runs and got the explanation below: >We're using the current 2.1 series, so that's not the cause of what >you're seeing. > >Rather, this is our fault: we've always had a custom "patch" to Mailman >that suppressed the digest option on the confirmation page, because in >the very early years of our service, customers told us it was "too >confusing". Their full reply is below including discussion of tradeoffs. I continue to be more pleased with their support than I have been with any other service I can think of. Sorry for the confusion. Fred -- Fred H. Olson Minneapolis,MN 55411 USA (near north Mpls) Email: fholson at cohousing.org 612-588-9532 My Link Pg: http://fholson.cohousing.org My org: Communications for Justice -- Free, superior listserv's w/o ads Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 13:26:52 From: Tiger Technologies Fred H Olson wrote: >I have not been able to find the current Mailman version number >installed at Tigertech. Thank you for writing! We're sorry to hear you're having trouble. We're using the current 2.1 series, so that's not the cause of what you're seeing. Rather, this is our fault: we've always had a custom "patch" to Mailman that suppressed the digest option on the confirmation page, because in the very early years of our service, customers told us it was "too confusing". Specifically, customers complained that if we were going to force people to confirm their subscriptions, we needed to make it as simple as possible, with no options, for subscribers who "don't know what they're doing". So that's why it's like that. We haven't received any complaints about the omission of that option before. We'd be hesitant to add it back in globally, both because of the potential complaints about "more complicated subscriptions", and because (to be self-serving) we don't like digest mode much: when people use it, they often complain to us about exactly the kind of thing you were mentioning in the thread (in particular, poor quoting and incorrect subject line in replies). In these days of easy filtering into folders of mail programs, digest mode seems like something of an anachronism. But all that said, I can certainly understand how someone would disagree with this. Let us know if you feel strongly about it, and we'll see if we can come up with some solution that allows it to work for specific lists. And of course, we also apologize for the frustration this caused you. We can see that it would be very puzzling.... -- Robert Mathews, Tiger Technologies Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 14:06:22 From: Tiger Technologies To: Fred H Olson Fred H Olson wrote: >As usual, thanks for your informative response. You're welcome -- glad we could explain it, at least. >For now just knowing how it is set up is enough. I'll think on it. Okay -- do let us know. As I said, I can see how someone would think that it's annoying to take away this feature, and I don't want it to sound like we'd think you're wrong to ask. >Can I post your reply or excerpts to the mailman-users list? Sure thing. I suspect people will say "it's wrong for them to remove useful Mailman features", and I can see their point. In our defense, all I could really say is that our average customer is considerably less tech savvy than your subscribers or the people on the Mailman list, and people really did say things like "I run a list for retired people, and when they see the question about digest mode they just stop because they don't know what to do, so I can't get them to verify the subscription". Ah well. Don't hesitate to let us know if there is anything else we can do. Thank you again! -- Robert Mathews, Tiger Technologies From jdanield at free.fr Tue Feb 11 23:07:33 2014 From: jdanield at free.fr (jdd) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 23:07:33 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Sub. Invitation digest option In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52FA9F25.5060502@free.fr> Le 11/02/2014 21:40, Fred H Olson a ?crit : > Their full reply is below including discussion of tradeoffs. impressive, that's service! jdd -- http://www.dodin.org From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 11 23:17:51 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 14:17:51 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Manually setting digest version and/or number and other questions In-Reply-To: <3bcc0c90e1374fca8dba91b24fb785f1@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> References: <52F97943.9010307@msapiro.net> <3bcc0c90e1374fca8dba91b24fb785f1@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Message-ID: <52FAA18F.60303@msapiro.net> On 02/10/2014 09:39 PM, George Kasica wrote: > > How does your script work exactly? Where do I find what I use for variables > and what they are now? Almost looks like config_list might be better. My script is just a front end to config_list so you can to something like /path/to/set_attributes volume=25 next_digest_number=1 LISTNAME instead of putting lines like volume=25 next_digest_number=1 in a file and running bin/config_list -i /path/to/file LISTNAME As far as what you can use for variables and what they currently are, you could do bin/dumpdb lists/LISTNAME/config.pck to see what's there, most of which is viewable, settable via the web admin interface. In order to understand what the meaning of any list attribute is, if it's in the web admin UI, it's described there, otherwise, you have to look at code. E.g., grep -r next_digest_number /path/to/mailman/ to find the modules that reference it, and then look at those modules. > Changes made but one question - on the web based Archives page I still see > an entry for the gzipp'd version but it now goes nowhere and throws a page > not found. How do I get rid of that: The next time the page is updated by Mailman which I think will happen with the next post to the list, or if not, with the next post in a new period (month), Mailman will correct those links. In the mean time, you can edit archives/private/LISTNAME/index.html and just remove the '.gz' from the hrefs. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From jdanield at free.fr Tue Feb 11 23:18:20 2014 From: jdanield at free.fr (jdd) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 23:18:20 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] banning email Message-ID: <52FAA1AC.8010501@free.fr> Hello, a korean lotery keep subscribing to one of my lists. I'm advised and unsubscribe asap, but it keeps coming. How can I prevent an email from subscribing? thanks jdd -- http://www.dodin.org From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 11 23:32:37 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 14:32:37 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Adding list with new domain. Which alias set would I use In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52FAA505.3060603@msapiro.net> On 02/11/2014 09:16 AM, George Kasica wrote: > Currently have mailman working here with Postfix and MySQL and in the > transport it has > > > /etc/postfix/transport > lists.netwrx1.org mailman: > > I have a couple lists under the netwrx1.org domain here that are working > well and aliases look like the below but they are all under the > netwrx1.org setup: > > INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES > ('skunk-works at netwrx1.org','skunk-works at lists.netwrx1.org'), ... > > I want to add a couple lists with their own domains...would the aliases > look something like: > > INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES > ('muffin at petdiabetes.net','muffin at lists.netwrx1.org'), ... > > OR would they be like this with the lists own domain and would I need to > do anything to transport or another setting?? > > INSERT INTO aliases (mail,destination) VALUES > ('muffin at petdiabetes.net','muffin at lists.petdiabetes.net'), ... Based on what I can glean from your prior posts, the above are not Postfix aliases, but rather Postfix virtual domain mappings. I.e. the first set map list addresses in the virtual netwrx1.org domain of the form skunk-works at netwrx1.org into addresses in the real lists.netwrx1.org domain of the form skunk-works at lists.netwrx1.org. Then the transport mapping lists.netwrx1.org mailman: Tells postfix to deliver mail to the lists.netwrx1.org domain via the mailman transport which is postfix_to_mailman.py. Assuming the above is correct, you can do either of your suggested mappings for the muffin at petdiabetes.net list with the addition that mappings like ('muffin at petdiabetes.net','muffin at lists.petdiabetes.net') also require an additional lists.petdiabetes.net mailman: entry in the transport table with the caveat that as with all postfix_to_mailman domains, the domain cannot have user addresses that aren't Mailman lists. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 11 23:36:30 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 14:36:30 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] banning email In-Reply-To: <52FAA1AC.8010501@free.fr> References: <52FAA1AC.8010501@free.fr> Message-ID: <52FAA5EE.40208@msapiro.net> On 02/11/2014 02:18 PM, jdd wrote: > > a korean lotery keep subscribing to one of my lists. I'm advised and > unsubscribe asap, but it keeps coming. How can I prevent an email from > subscribing? Add it to the web admin Privacy options... -> Subscription rules -> ban_list. Read the info at the (Details for ban_list) link for details of the entry format. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From jdanield at free.fr Wed Feb 12 09:04:05 2014 From: jdanield at free.fr (jdd) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 09:04:05 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] banning email In-Reply-To: <52FAA5EE.40208@msapiro.net> References: <52FAA1AC.8010501@free.fr> <52FAA5EE.40208@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52FB2AF5.4050003@free.fr> Le 11/02/2014 23:36, Mark Sapiro a ?crit : > On 02/11/2014 02:18 PM, jdd wrote: >> >> a korean lotery keep subscribing to one of my lists. I'm advised and >> unsubscribe asap, but it keeps coming. How can I prevent an email from >> subscribing? > > > Add it to the web admin Privacy options... -> Subscription rules -> ban_list. > Read the info at the (Details for ban_list) link for details of the entry format. > ok, found, thanks jdd -- http://www.dodin.org From richard at KarmannGhia.org Wed Feb 12 16:51:37 2014 From: richard at KarmannGhia.org (Richard) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 07:51:37 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Command-line to the rescue? Message-ID: Hi All, For those who don't care about background, skip ahead to "DISCARD" below! This past fall / winter, a series of old-hardware-finally-died events cascaded into a bloody mess with our network and - never mind the underlying details - I ended up with one remaining network problem I have yet to solve, and in the mean time, it's making my administration of Mailman lists a royal pain in the butt. In short, there's a bug in the firewall / routing software on my firewall gateway box which is preventing me from getting to my own internal systems' external IP addresses via a web browser. Other people can get to those systems using their normal IP addresses (from the outside), but I can't (from the inside). However, the external systems don't administer Mailman anyway - two servers do pass-through to an internal server that does it on the same system that does email processing. SO, I _can_ get to that system via internal IP, and if I set up my /etc/hosts file correctly, the virtual domain hosting part works fine, too, so I have access to mailman administration from the inside, sort of! HOWEVER, that system paints an external domain name, so all the pass through works through the external servers. This means the URLs are wrong for internal access and therefore if you try it SOME administration tasks fail because it tries to hit features using the external naming - which presently isn't working from the inside due to the routing problem! Doah! ...ONE of those key administration tasks that doesn't work is the management of "pending moderator requests." And, using the mail reply option isn't sufficient because we no longer have all the original administrator emails to reply to! DISCARD So... /usr/lib/mailman/bin/discard to the rescue? All 'discard -h' says is: Discard held messages. Usage: discard [options] file ... Options: --help / -h Print this help message and exit. --quiet / -q Don't print status messages. Um... Obvious question: What goes in the file? I'd also have expected it to present me with an option to specify which list? A "from" email address? And what if I want to accept or reject instead of discard? Is there a different utility I should be looking at? BTW, it's mailman 2.1.14-12, and I'm pretty sure it's the youngest version that will run on that particular box. Thanks, Richard From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 12 16:58:57 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 07:58:57 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Command-line to the rescue? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52FB9A41.7000308@msapiro.net> On 02/12/2014 07:51 AM, Richard wrote: > > ...ONE of those key administration tasks that > doesn't work is the management of "pending moderator requests." > > And, using the mail reply option isn't sufficient because we no longer > have all the original administrator emails to reply to! > > DISCARD > > So... /usr/lib/mailman/bin/discard to the rescue? > > All 'discard -h' says is: > > Discard held messages. > > Usage: > discard [options] file ... > > Options: > --help / -h > Print this help message and exit. > > --quiet / -q > Don't print status messages. > > Um... Obvious question: What goes in the file? The held message file(s) which are in Mailman's data/directory with names like heldmsg-LISTNAME-nnnn.* > I'd also have expected it to present me with an option to specify which > list? A "from" email address? And what if I want to accept or reject > instead of discard? > > Is there a different utility I should be looking at? See . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From richard at KarmannGhia.org Wed Feb 12 17:53:14 2014 From: richard at KarmannGhia.org (Richard) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 08:53:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Command-line to the rescue? In-Reply-To: <52FB9A41.7000308@msapiro.net> References: <52FB9A41.7000308@msapiro.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 12 Feb 2014, Mark Sapiro wrote: >> >> So... /usr/lib/mailman/bin/discard to the rescue? >> >> All 'discard -h' says is: >> >> Discard held messages. >> >> Usage: >> discard [options] file ... >> >> Options: >> --help / -h >> Print this help message and exit. >> >> --quiet / -q >> Don't print status messages. >> >> Um... Obvious question: What goes in the file? > > > The held message file(s) which are in Mailman's data/directory with names > like heldmsg-LISTNAME-nnnn.* > > >> I'd also have expected it to present me with an option to specify which >> list? A "from" email address? And what if I want to accept or reject >> instead of discard? >> >> Is there a different utility I should be looking at? > > > See . PERFECT! THANK YOU SO MUCH! In fact this is a MUCH better way to manage pending moderator requests than the web interface! YAY! Just curious: This seems an obvious "enhancement" to younger versions - is it safe to assume this script is now a part of the standard distribution? (Or should I be mindful to save this script whenever I finally upgrade?) Regards, Richard From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 12 18:04:25 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 09:04:25 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Command-line to the rescue? In-Reply-To: References: <52FB9A41.7000308@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <52FBA999.5040102@msapiro.net> On 02/12/2014 08:53 AM, Richard wrote: > > Just curious: This seems an obvious "enhancement" to younger versions - > is it safe to assume this script is now a part of the standard > distribution? (Or should I be mindful to save this script whenever I > finally upgrade?) This and many other scripts are on my web site at (mirrored at ). They could be put in the contrib/ directory in the distribution tarball, but I have never done that so for now they are just on my sites. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From joemailgroups at gmail.com Wed Feb 12 21:55:58 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 12:55:58 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about moderation notices. Message-ID: <69E0903B-9B48-42C5-B6AA-E923656AC685@gmail.com> Hello, everyone. I have a question about moderation. There are a few members in my lists I wish to moderate at least for a while. I understand that by moderating their posts I will be given the opportunity to review each message they attempt to post and either approve it or reject it if the content is questionable. Is this true ? In regards to this moderation, I have read somewhere that subscribers may or may not receive a notification every time their messages are held for moderation. I can't seem to find this setting now. Is there a way to turn off this setting so that subscribers don't receive notifications every time their messages are held for moderation ? Is this setting individual (can be set individually and independently for every subscribers) or is it a global setting for the entire list ? Thank you in advance, Joe. From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 13 00:58:35 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 15:58:35 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about moderation notices. In-Reply-To: <69E0903B-9B48-42C5-B6AA-E923656AC685@gmail.com> References: <69E0903B-9B48-42C5-B6AA-E923656AC685@gmail.com> Message-ID: <52FC0AAB.9010001@msapiro.net> On 02/12/2014 12:55 PM, Joe wrote: > > There are a few members in my lists I wish to moderate at least for a while. I understand that by moderating their posts I will be given the opportunity to review each message they attempt to post and either approve it or reject it if the content is questionable. Is this true ? Yes. > In regards to this moderation, I have read somewhere that subscribers may or may not receive a notification every time their messages are held for moderation. I can't seem to find this setting now. > > Is there a way to turn off this setting so that subscribers don't receive notifications every time their messages are held for moderation ? Is this setting individual (can be set individually and independently for every subscribers) or is it a global setting for the entire list ? See Privacy options... ->Sender filters -> member_moderation_action. The action you want is Hold. When the post is held, the member will or will not be notified per the setting General Options -> respond_to_post_requests. This setting applies to all posts to the list which are held for any reason, not just moderation. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From andrew at hodgsonfamily.org Wed Feb 12 23:56:49 2014 From: andrew at hodgsonfamily.org (Andrew Hodgson) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 22:56:49 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Integrating Mailman database with Drupal Message-ID: <967c8cd28a964fadac64cc27be7ae76c@AMSPR04MB034.eurprd04.prod.outlook.com> Hi, One of the lists I have ran for a few years now is looking to go to a web based forum hosted on Drupal with mail list features. Before dropping Mailman entirely, I wanted to know if there was a reason to tie up the subscriber database with the Mailman account? This is the main reason they are looking to move to the new system. If the system was on the same host as Drupal, I could probably do it with the scripts, but it is likely the systems would be separated. Thanks. Andrew. From pshute at nuw.org.au Thu Feb 13 03:11:52 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2014 13:11:52 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moderation history Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DC@nuwvicms1> Our users are moderated on subscribing, and then unmoderated after a probation period. Some are moderated again for bad behaviour, then unmoderated for a period, then moderated again, etc. In making decisions about who to unmoderate, it would be useful to see the user's history. I.e. when they subscribed, when they were unmoderated, etc. At the moment we can't even tell why someone is moderated, and the only history I've got is the subscription alert emails I save. On top of that we have many users who unsubscribe instead of turning off mail delivery when they go on holidays, so they become moderated again when they resubscribe. Does mailman keep a record of this stuff? Peter Shute From Richard at Damon-Family.org Thu Feb 13 04:44:49 2014 From: Richard at Damon-Family.org (Richard Damon) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 22:44:49 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moderation history In-Reply-To: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DC@nuwvicms1> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DC@nuwvicms1> Message-ID: <52FC3FB1.9020009@Damon-Family.org> On 2/12/14, 9:11 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > Our users are moderated on subscribing, and then unmoderated after a probation period. Some are moderated again for bad behaviour, then unmoderated for a period, then moderated again, etc. > > In making decisions about who to unmoderate, it would be useful to see the user's history. I.e. when they subscribed, when they were unmoderated, etc. At the moment we can't even tell why someone is moderated, and the only history I've got is the subscription alert emails I save. > > On top of that we have many users who unsubscribe instead of turning off mail delivery when they go on holidays, so they become moderated again when they resubscribe. > > Does mailman keep a record of this stuff? > > Peter Shute > To my knowledge, mailman does not keep track of this. I have the list software send me notices of messages held for moderation and file them in a folder sorted by subject. When I get a new notice I can see previous messages about the person. If you put a person on moderation, you could send yourself a message with that same subject, recording why they were put on moderation. -- Richard Damon From pshute at nuw.org.au Thu Feb 13 05:01:09 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2014 15:01:09 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moderation history In-Reply-To: <52FC3FB1.9020009@Damon-Family.org> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DC@nuwvicms1> <52FC3FB1.9020009@Damon-Family.org> Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DE@nuwvicms1> Richard Damon wrote: > > Our users are moderated on subscribing, and then > unmoderated after a probation period. Some are moderated > again for bad behaviour, then unmoderated for a period, then > moderated again, etc. > > > > In making decisions about who to unmoderate, it would be > useful to see the user's history. I.e. when they subscribed, > when they were unmoderated, etc. At the moment we can't even > tell why someone is moderated, and the only history I've got > is the subscription alert emails I save. > > > > On top of that we have many users who unsubscribe instead > of turning off mail delivery when they go on holidays, so > they become moderated again when they resubscribe. > > > > Does mailman keep a record of this stuff? > > > > Peter Shute > > > To my knowledge, mailman does not keep track of this. I have > the list software send me notices of messages held for > moderation and file them in a folder sorted by subject. When > I get a new notice I can see previous messages about the > person. If you put a person on moderation, you could send > yourself a message with that same subject, recording why they > were put on moderation. Thanks for that. It ought to be reasonably easy for mailman to log the moderation and unmoderation of list members, and subscription events. I wonder if anyone else would find that useful. It would need to let moderators log a reason for moderation and unmoderation. We are already using the notices as a sort of history, but because there are several moderators, it can become haphazard, especially when using mobile devices that don't have access to the archive of notices, so a central log would be more convenient. The idea of an email to ourselves about reasons for moderation is good, if we remember to do it. Peter Shute From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 13 07:39:33 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 22:39:33 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moderation history In-Reply-To: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DE@nuwvicms1> References: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DC@nuwvicms1> <52FC3FB1.9020009@Damon-Family.org> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B33DE@nuwvicms1> Message-ID: <52FC68A5.6000904@msapiro.net> On 02/12/2014 08:01 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > > Thanks for that. It ought to be reasonably easy for mailman to log the moderation and unmoderation of list members, and subscription events. I wonder if anyone else would find that useful. It would need to let moderators log a reason for moderation and unmoderation. Mailman logs subscription and unsubscription events in the 'subscribe' log and it logs posts held for moderation and approvals, rejections and discards in the 'vette' log. Mailman does not log changes in a members moderation status. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Thu Feb 13 18:45:02 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2014 17:45:02 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Where are mailman Digests stored and for how long? Message-ID: Just curious - coming from a majordomo world where you could determine where digests would go and then keep old ones "on file" as it were. Does mailman offer anything similar? Where do the digests it creates get stored, in what form and for how long? Thanks, George From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 13 19:45:40 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2014 10:45:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Where are mailman Digests stored and for how long? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52FD12D4.9060004@msapiro.net> On 02/13/2014 09:45 AM, George Kasica wrote: > > Does mailman offer anything similar? Where do the digests it creates get stored, in what form and for how long? Messages for digests are accumulated in lists/LISTNAME/digest.mbox. That file is removed when the digest is sent. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mpn at icabs.co.zw Fri Feb 14 16:31:51 2014 From: mpn at icabs.co.zw (MP Netsai) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2014 17:31:51 +0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] moderation problem Message-ID: Dear All, I have a baffling problem, and I hope you can send point me in the right direction. I have a server which runs some package which sends mail to a list that I manage. My problem is that every time I have to have it moderated even after I have placed the full address in the filters to "accept_these_nonmembers". I have even tried the wildcard "^.*$" and I have even set "generic_nonmember_action" to "Accept". What could I be missing or doing wrong? Thanks, Nets. From daniel at noflag.org.uk Fri Feb 14 13:13:12 2014 From: daniel at noflag.org.uk (daniel) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2014 18:43:12 +0630 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Disabling privacy alert notifications Message-ID: <52FE0858.1000609@noflag.org.uk> Hello, all. We are having problems with list administrators whose clients receive privacy alert notifications upon being re-subscribed to a mailing list. The notifications are problematic, because the administrator regularly adds people to the mailing list who have, for example, signed a petition, and such people get these messages, often many times. For example: http://pastebin.com/P2pB66JS. How could we go about disabling such notifications for the customer? Thanks in advance, Daniel > Subject: Mailman privacy alert > Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2014 10:31:47 +0000 > From: -bounces at lists. > To: @ > > > An attempt was made to subscribe your address to the mailing list > . You are already subscribed to this > mailing list. > > Note that the list membership is not public, so it is possible that a bad > person was trying to probe the list for its membership. This would be a > privacy violation if we let them do this, but we didn't. > > If you submitted the subscription request and forgot that you were already > subscribed to the list, then you can ignore this message. If you > suspect that > an attempt is being made to covertly discover whether you are a member > of this > list, and you are worried about your privacy, then feel free to send a > message > to the list administrator at -owner at lists.. From incoming-pythonlists at rjl.com Thu Feb 13 20:15:47 2014 From: incoming-pythonlists at rjl.com (Natu) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2014 12:15:47 -0700 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman with DKIM Message-ID: <52FD19E3.1090602@rjl.com> I am having some problems with yahoo and google throttling and blocking my mailserver. My understanding is that these guys are friendlier to mailservers that include DKIM signatures. I am running mailman-2.1.9-6 which removes the DKIM signatures. I am aware of the problem created when mailman adds headers/footers to the message. Is this behaviour any different in more recent versions? Are there any workable solutions out there to get mailman to be able to pass the message through with the original senders DKIM signature, without breaking the signature? Thank You, Natu From pflynn at ucc.ie Fri Feb 14 14:00:43 2014 From: pflynn at ucc.ie (Peter Flynn) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2014 13:00:43 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] LDAP for list owners/editors/managers Message-ID: <52FE137B.3000605@ucc.ie> I am investigating moving off LISTSERV to MailMan, as the LDAP-enabled version of LISTSERV is beyond out budget. Does MailMan support LDAP auth for the identities of list owners, editors, and managers (excuse my ignorance of MailMan terminology) but NOT for list members (subscribers). In other words, most of our lists are open to anyone to join, so members must not be restricted to in-house people; but lists can only be owned and run by an employee of the organisation (someone who appears in our identity management system). ///Peter -- Peter Flynn | Electronic Publishing Unit | IT Services | University College Cork | Phone +353 21 490 2609 | Email pflynn at ucc.ie | Web www.ucc.ie From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 14 17:50:05 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2014 08:50:05 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] moderation problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52FE493D.3040707@msapiro.net> On 02/14/2014 07:31 AM, MP Netsai wrote: > > My problem is that every time I have to have it moderated even after I > have placed the full address in the filters to "accept_these_nonmembers". > I have even tried the wildcard "^.*$" and I have even set > "generic_nonmember_action" to "Accept". What could I be missing or doing > wrong? What is the 'reason' why the message is held for moderation? -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 14 18:08:18 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2014 09:08:18 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] LDAP for list owners/editors/managers In-Reply-To: <52FE137B.3000605@ucc.ie> References: <52FE137B.3000605@ucc.ie> Message-ID: <52FE4D82.9090109@msapiro.net> On 02/14/2014 05:00 AM, Peter Flynn wrote: > > Does MailMan support LDAP auth for the identities of list owners, > editors, and managers (excuse my ignorance of MailMan terminology) but > NOT for list members (subscribers). No. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 14 18:14:33 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2014 09:14:33 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Disabling privacy alert notifications In-Reply-To: <52FE0858.1000609@noflag.org.uk> References: <52FE0858.1000609@noflag.org.uk> Message-ID: <52FE4EF9.6030705@msapiro.net> On 02/14/2014 04:13 AM, daniel wrote: > Hello, all. > > We are having problems with list administrators whose clients receive > privacy alert notifications upon being re-subscribed to a mailing list. ... > How could we go about disabling such notifications for the customer? The administrator should attempt to invite/subscribe the users via the list admin Membership Management... -> Mass Subscription page rather than the 'subscribe' CGI or email 'subscribe' command which are intended for end users. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 14 18:23:28 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2014 09:23:28 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman with DKIM In-Reply-To: <52FD19E3.1090602@rjl.com> References: <52FD19E3.1090602@rjl.com> Message-ID: <52FE5110.8090102@msapiro.net> On 02/13/2014 11:15 AM, Natu wrote: > > I am running mailman-2.1.9-6 which removes the DKIM signatures. I am > aware of the problem created when mailman adds headers/footers to the > message. Is this behaviour any different in more recent versions? Beginning in Mailman 2.1.10, removal of incoming DKIM headers is controlled by an mm_cfg.py setting REMOVE_DKIM_HEADERS which defaults to No. > Are there any workable solutions out there to get mailman to be able to > pass the message through with the original senders DKIM signature, > without breaking the signature? Use Mailman 2.1.10+ and ensure msg_header, msg_footer and subject_prefix are empty. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Sun Feb 16 19:36:03 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2014 18:36:03 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Line length and wrapping Message-ID: <360480C6-C87B-41B9-994D-D997588D59EA@netwrx1.onmicrosoft.com> Does mailman enforce and sort of maximum line length in a message and if so at what point will it wrap - this is with content filtering off. Lastly is there a way to set this value or what are the maximum and minimums? Seeing what looks like wrapping at 73 characters which is an odd number to me and causing some issues for one of my list admins so I'm trying to come up with info and answers. Thanks, George --- George R. Kasica Sent from my iPhone5 From mark at msapiro.net Sun Feb 16 22:33:16 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2014 13:33:16 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Line length and wrapping In-Reply-To: <360480C6-C87B-41B9-994D-D997588D59EA@netwrx1.onmicrosoft.com> References: <360480C6-C87B-41B9-994D-D997588D59EA@netwrx1.onmicrosoft.com> Message-ID: <53012E9C.8030209@msapiro.net> On 02/16/2014 10:36 AM, George Kasica wrote: > Does mailman enforce and sort of maximum line length in a message and if so at what point will it wrap - this is with content filtering off. Where are you seeing this wrapping? Any wrapping done by Mailman will be done by the underlying Python email package. I can't think offhand of anywhere where text in message bodies will be wrapped except versions prior to 2.1.10 which didn't recognize/honor a format=flowed parameter in a Content-Type: header which could result messages apparently being wrapped inappropriately when msg_header and/or msg_footer are addes to a text/plain body or when attachments are scrubbed. Certain headers will be folded in many cases. Most commonly this is the Subject: header and folding occurs during the addition of subject_prefix, but Mailman will also manipulate certain other headers such as Cc: and these also will be subject to folding. > Lastly is there a way to set this value or what are the maximum and minimums? Seeing what looks like wrapping at 73 characters which is an odd number to me and causing some issues for one of my list admins so I'm trying to come up with info and answers. See section 2.1.1 of RFC2822 and/or RFC5322, both of which say in part There are two limits that this standard places on the number of characters in a line. Each line of characters MUST be no more than 998 characters, and SHOULD be no more than 78 characters, excluding the CRLF. This is the rationale for folding 'long' headers, but without knowing exactly what you're seeing, I can't offer any advice about controlling it. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From pflynn at ucc.ie Mon Feb 17 10:32:06 2014 From: pflynn at ucc.ie (Peter Flynn) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2014 09:32:06 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] LDAP for list owners/editors/managers In-Reply-To: <52FE4D82.9090109@msapiro.net> References: <52FE137B.3000605@ucc.ie> <52FE4D82.9090109@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <5301D716.2050608@ucc.ie> On 14/02/14 17:08, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/14/2014 05:00 AM, Peter Flynn wrote: >> >> Does MailMan support LDAP auth for the identities of list owners, >> editors, and managers (excuse my ignorance of MailMan terminology) but >> NOT for list members (subscribers). > > > No. So if LDAP is implemented, it would be true that only people in the LDAP directory can join lists, right? ///Peter -- Peter Flynn | Electronic Publishing Unit | IT Services | University College Cork | Phone +353 21 490 2609 | Email pflynn at ucc.ie | Web www.ucc.ie From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 17 18:09:38 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2014 09:09:38 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] LDAP for list owners/editors/managers In-Reply-To: <5301D716.2050608@ucc.ie> References: <52FE137B.3000605@ucc.ie> <52FE4D82.9090109@msapiro.net> <5301D716.2050608@ucc.ie> Message-ID: <53024252.8010704@msapiro.net> On 02/17/2014 01:32 AM, Peter Flynn wrote: > > So if LDAP is implemented, it would be true that only people in the LDAP > directory can join lists, right? There is an LDAP MemberAdaptor at . The purpose of this MemberAdaptor is to use an LDAP database as the source of the list membership. The documentation of that module says in part: This module implements LDAP search-based mailing lists, similar to those in Netscape SuiteSpot. That is, the membership of the mailing list is defined by the results of a search against an LDAP directory. This is a read-only interface. I.e., you can't add members to the list via Mailman. This third-party module is the only LDAP support for Mailman of which I am aware. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From joemailgroups at gmail.com Tue Feb 18 19:28:44 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 10:28:44 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. Message-ID: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> Hello, everyone. In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a message from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services that utilize a cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad arrangement and one that doesn't provide me full control of my lists. Since I am not an IT specialist I don't know what a cPanel is or how this can be a problem. Can any of you enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, why can this be a problem and how would it not allow me full control of my lists ? In addition, what problems should I expect to encounter in hosting my lists with an outside Mailman hosting service ? Thank you in advance, Joe. From joemailgroups at gmail.com Tue Feb 18 19:50:41 2014 From: joemailgroups at gmail.com (Joe) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 10:50:41 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. In-Reply-To: <396101cf2cd8$600dd0f0$202972d0$@emwd.com> References: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> <396101cf2cd8$600dd0f0$202972d0$@emwd.com> Message-ID: Hi, Brian. Thanks for your reply. I will be calling you soon. I will not disclose the name or e-mail of the IT specialist but his private message to me expressed his concern over the use of cPanel as a tool for the management of Mailman. Here is an excerpt from the e-mail I received: Joe, unless you have COMPLETE "List Control", DON'T do it ! ! ! If you think you HATE the "baby sitting" of current set-up, you don't know/fully understand the full meaning of HATE ! ! ! For over a decade I have prayed to "Hit the Lottery" as very FIRST thing I would do is pay for Dedicated Server so I could have FULL control without the "Baby Sitting" of cPanel ! ! ! Since I am not an IT specialist I have to ask myself, why would he feel so strongly about this ? What problems should I expect to encounter ? Thank you, Joseph. On February 18, 2014, at 10:36 AM, Brian Carpenter wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users- >> bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Joe >> Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2014 1:29 PM >> To: mailman-users at python.org Users >> Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. >> >> Hello, everyone. >> >> In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a message >> from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services that utilize > a >> cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad arrangement and one > that >> doesn't provide me full control of my lists. Since I am not an IT > specialist I >> don't know what a cPanel is or how this can be a problem. Can any of you >> enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, why can this be a problem and how would > it >> not allow me full control of my lists ? >> >> In addition, what problems should I expect to encounter in hosting my > lists >> with an outside Mailman hosting service ? >> >> Thank you in advance, >> >> Joe. >> ------------------------------------------------------ >> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users >> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 >> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 >> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman- >> users%40python.org/ >> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman- >> users/brian%40emwd.com > > Hi Joe: > > I think we discussed your mailman needs a couple of times over the phone. > > cPanel is a webhosting control panel that is very popular (for good reason) > among web hosting companies and it includes the use of mailman. > > cPanel is typically used within a shared hosting environment and I believe > it has done a lot in getting mailman into the hands of many list users. > Because of the nature of a shared hosting environment, typical mailman users > would not have access to the mailman server itself in order to make any > customizations such as searchable archives, etc. However my company hosts > over a 1000 mailman lists on our cPanel servers and our list clients are > very happy with the arrangement. But YMMV. > > If you have not required backend access before to your mailman server then I > would think you will not have any problems utilizing a cPanel enabled > mailman service. I would be interested in hearing some details of your IT > specialist's reservations of cPanel and mailman. > > Brian Carpenter > EMWD.com > > Providing Cloud Services and more for over 15 years. > > T: 336.755.0685 > E: brian at emwd.com > www.emwd.com > From brian at emwd.com Tue Feb 18 19:36:44 2014 From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 13:36:44 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. In-Reply-To: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> References: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> Message-ID: <396101cf2cd8$600dd0f0$202972d0$@emwd.com> > -----Original Message----- > From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users- > bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Joe > Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2014 1:29 PM > To: mailman-users at python.org Users > Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. > > Hello, everyone. > > In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a message > from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services that utilize a > cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad arrangement and one that > doesn't provide me full control of my lists. Since I am not an IT specialist I > don't know what a cPanel is or how this can be a problem. Can any of you > enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, why can this be a problem and how would it > not allow me full control of my lists ? > > In addition, what problems should I expect to encounter in hosting my lists > with an outside Mailman hosting service ? > > Thank you in advance, > > Joe. > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman- > users%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman- > users/brian%40emwd.com Hi Joe: I think we discussed your mailman needs a couple of times over the phone. cPanel is a webhosting control panel that is very popular (for good reason) among web hosting companies and it includes the use of mailman. cPanel is typically used within a shared hosting environment and I believe it has done a lot in getting mailman into the hands of many list users. Because of the nature of a shared hosting environment, typical mailman users would not have access to the mailman server itself in order to make any customizations such as searchable archives, etc. However my company hosts over a 1000 mailman lists on our cPanel servers and our list clients are very happy with the arrangement. But YMMV. If you have not required backend access before to your mailman server then I would think you will not have any problems utilizing a cPanel enabled mailman service. I would be interested in hearing some details of your IT specialist's reservations of cPanel and mailman. Brian Carpenter EMWD.com Providing Cloud Services and more for over 15 years. T: 336.755.0685 E: brian at emwd.com www.emwd.com From andrew at hodgsonfamily.org Wed Feb 19 00:07:05 2014 From: andrew at hodgsonfamily.org (Andrew Hodgson) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 23:07:05 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. In-Reply-To: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> References: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> Message-ID: Joe wrote: >In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a message from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services that utilize a cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad arrangement and one that >doesn't provide me full control of my lists. Since I am not an IT specialist I don't know what a cPanel is or how this can be a problem. Can any of you enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, why can this be a problem and how would it >not allow me full control of my lists ? I run Mailman lists for several charities running my own Mailman compiled from source with some modifications. I do the work on the backend and if there are problems, I get support from myself or the list if I am stuck. I manage other Linux systems and so it isn't a problem for me. I don't want to pay the license to run CPanel on the servers, and that is the choice I made. The CPanel system is a web based control panel which allows you to host amongst other things, a fully working Mailman setup. Whilst the CPanel implementation is not standard as per the stock Mailman setup, it is arguably one of the most widely used versions of Mailman, and without it, I think Mailman would be far less used today. I feel there is nothing wrong with the CPanel installation for most users, who want to create, manage and remove lists from their hosting domains. Where the issue comes is with support, as only a CPanel specialist or CPanel themselves can really support the installation, as the Mailman community don't know fully what has been done to the installation to make it work with the CPanel environment. It could also be possible for someone who is used to a stock Mailman installation to break the integration if they just go ahead and change stuff without forethought to the CPanel integration. I myself am subscribed to several very high traffic lists who run Mailman under CPanel, and they have no issues at all that I know of. My advice would be to look at the providers you have available, if some are using CPanel and you feel comfortable with the support they are offering, and the service fits your requirements, then don't let the fact they are using CPanel put you off. It sounds like you would probably call out to someone else to support the system if it goes wrong anyhow. If you have more bespoke requirements, and the CPanel integration wouldn't meet these (after talking to people on this list or companies who use CPanel), then go with a more tailored solution. Thanks. Andrew. From gkasica at netwrx1.com Wed Feb 19 01:09:40 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 00:09:40 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. In-Reply-To: References: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> <396101cf2cd8$600dd0f0$202972d0$@emwd.com> Message-ID: <41df9bf6d9e9434aac09c61693d187e5@BL2PR05MB177.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Joe: I am an IT Specialist (29 years) and new to Mailman as you can see by my posts here lately, I run many things under cPanel via a large hosting provider but chose to run Mailman here on my 2 local Linux Servers (Ubuntu) - I'm not sure why he feels so strongly, if the provider had a good support structure and prices (I'm paying $15/month for unlimited space/bandwidth - email me privately for the provider) plus I run my own 2 local servers here with mailman on them for several charitable/non-profit groups. As to an IT Specialist needing to hit the lottery for his own dedicated server - um...they don't cost that much to build both of these here are probably about $1K each or less with RAID Disks, redundant power supplies etc. Heck, if you just need to host a few lists give me a yell and we can talk. George -----Original Message----- From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+gkasica=netwrx1.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Joe Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2014 12:51 PM To: Brian Carpenter Cc: 'mailman-users at python.org Users' Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. Hi, Brian. Thanks for your reply. I will be calling you soon. I will not disclose the name or e-mail of the IT specialist but his private message to me expressed his concern over the use of cPanel as a tool for the management of Mailman. Here is an excerpt from the e-mail I received: Joe, unless you have COMPLETE "List Control", DON'T do it ! ! ! If you think you HATE the "baby sitting" of current set-up, you don't know/fully understand the full meaning of HATE ! ! ! For over a decade I have prayed to "Hit the Lottery" as very FIRST thing I would do is pay for Dedicated Server so I could have FULL control without the "Baby Sitting" of cPanel ! ! ! Since I am not an IT specialist I have to ask myself, why would he feel so strongly about this ? What problems should I expect to encounter ? Thank you, Joseph. On February 18, 2014, at 10:36 AM, Brian Carpenter wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users- >> bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Joe >> Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2014 1:29 PM >> To: mailman-users at python.org Users >> Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. >> >> Hello, everyone. >> >> In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a >> message from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services >> that utilize > a >> cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad arrangement and >> one > that >> doesn't provide me full control of my lists. Since I am not an IT > specialist I >> don't know what a cPanel is or how this can be a problem. Can any of >> you enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, why can this be a problem and >> how would > it >> not allow me full control of my lists ? >> >> In addition, what problems should I expect to encounter in hosting my > lists >> with an outside Mailman hosting service ? >> >> Thank you in advance, >> >> Joe. >> ------------------------------------------------------ >> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users >> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: >> http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman- >> users%40python.org/ >> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman- >> users/brian%40emwd.com > > Hi Joe: > > I think we discussed your mailman needs a couple of times over the phone. > > cPanel is a webhosting control panel that is very popular (for good > reason) among web hosting companies and it includes the use of mailman. > > cPanel is typically used within a shared hosting environment and I > believe it has done a lot in getting mailman into the hands of many list users. > Because of the nature of a shared hosting environment, typical mailman > users would not have access to the mailman server itself in order to > make any customizations such as searchable archives, etc. However my > company hosts over a 1000 mailman lists on our cPanel servers and our > list clients are very happy with the arrangement. But YMMV. > > If you have not required backend access before to your mailman server > then I would think you will not have any problems utilizing a cPanel > enabled mailman service. I would be interested in hearing some details > of your IT specialist's reservations of cPanel and mailman. > > Brian Carpenter > EMWD.com > > Providing Cloud Services and more for over 15 years. > > T: 336.755.0685 > E: brian at emwd.com > www.emwd.com > ------------------------------------------------------ Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gkasica%40netwrx1.com From stephen at xemacs.org Wed Feb 19 13:47:21 2014 From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 21:47:21 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. In-Reply-To: References: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> <396101cf2cd8$600dd0f0$202972d0$@emwd.com> Message-ID: <87eh2zw9pi.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Joe writes: > Since I am not an IT specialist I have to ask myself, why would he > feel so strongly about this ? Just because. What more reason does anyone need? I personally strongly disliked cPanel for a long time because they and their customers (the host services, not the users) dumped some of their support on us. Inadvertantly, I'm sure, but I don't cut vendors who don't publish derivative source much slack. (Just a disclaimer of personal bias, you needn't sympathize with me. Anyway, more recently they have been trying to work out how to be better citizens in the Mailman community. :-) > What problems should I expect to encounter ? Something that you need to think about, at least long enough to read the whole point: 1. Mailman sometimes gets wedged (at least, it has done so in the past, I'm not promising it will ever happen again, much less happen to you :-). When it does, often somebody needs to access the message queues directly, which you can't do without shell access (and probably shouldn't be able to do on a shared installation because you could trash somebody else's mail). This could indeed happen to you. Suppose it does -- I'll bet Brian's company will get it resolved withing hours in 99% of the rare cases when it does happen. (Ask him for actual details, I have no relation to or even real knowledge of his company -- I just like him because he's friendly and occasionally answers question here even if they don't seem like a way to attract a customer. :-) Would something that happens on the average once in ten years to a given list, that takes 24 hours or less to resolve, put your organization out of business? If yes, cPanel is out, otherwise, why not? I suspect your IT specialist buddy is a bit OCD about these things, and a one-hour delay would be enough to get him spelling in all caps. ;-) As a non-specialist, the following probably do *not* apply to you, but for completeness: 2. In high-volume situations, many admins prefer to use withlist, a command line script, for mass moderation. No shell access, no can do. This also can happen to you, if your list attracts specific attention from a bad guy. 3. If you have many lists, and need to make a configuration change to each of those lists, again withlist is your friend. 4. Certain customizations to the website require changing Mailman code because the page in question is fully-software generated (no template at all). 5. Custom Handlers can be added to the post processing pipeline, but only if you have access to the code. I have two special-purpose Handlers that I use for my own lists, and a third, used to integrate SpamAssassin with Mailman, is quite popular. (This is not the preferred way to use SpamAssassin, but it works for a lot of Mailman site admins.) There may be others I can't recall offhand, but they're similar. I think you can see that these are probably not major concerns for you. For most non-technical users cPanel is a good way to go. From farokh at mcfsoftware.com Wed Feb 19 14:56:22 2014 From: farokh at mcfsoftware.com (Farokh Irani) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 08:56:22 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. In-Reply-To: <87eh2zw9pi.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> <396101cf2cd8$600dd0f0$202972d0$@emwd.com> <87eh2zw9pi.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Message-ID: <5304B806.1030605@mcfsoftware.com> These days there's no excuse not to simply provide each person a virtual host, which is what I do. The only "disadvantage" is that you need to have enough machine to host them, which these days is not hard to do. There is no longer the need to use something like cPanel to split a machine up for multiple hosts. I provide virtual hosts to my clients with full access so they can do whatever they need on their machine and I don't have to worry about them affecting anyone else, and I can customize the VMs to suit specific needs (ie disk space, RAM, etc). I can even limit bandwidth etc., if necessary. Farokh ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- MCF Software...simply dependably engineered For all your computer and networking needs including hosting solutions for every need. Phone: 845-735-0210 Cell: 914-262-1594 > Stephen J. Turnbull > February 19, 2014 07:47 > Joe writes: > > > Since I am not an IT specialist I have to ask myself, why would he > > feel so strongly about this ? > > Just because. What more reason does anyone need? > > I personally strongly disliked cPanel for a long time because they and > their customers (the host services, not the users) dumped some of > their support on us. Inadvertantly, I'm sure, but I don't cut vendors > who don't publish derivative source much slack. (Just a disclaimer > of personal bias, you needn't sympathize with me. Anyway, more > recently they have been trying to work out how to be better citizens > in the Mailman community. :-) > > > What problems should I expect to encounter ? > > Something that you need to think about, at least long enough to read > the whole point: > > 1. Mailman sometimes gets wedged (at least, it has done so in the > past, I'm not promising it will ever happen again, much less > happen to you :-). When it does, often somebody needs to access > the message queues directly, which you can't do without shell > access (and probably shouldn't be able to do on a shared > installation because you could trash somebody else's mail). This > could indeed happen to you. Suppose it does -- I'll bet Brian's > company will get it resolved withing hours in 99% of the rare > cases when it does happen. (Ask him for actual details, I have no > relation to or even real knowledge of his company -- I just like > him because he's friendly and occasionally answers question here > even if they don't seem like a way to attract a customer. :-) > > Would something that happens on the average once in ten years to a > given list, that takes 24 hours or less to resolve, put your > organization out of business? If yes, cPanel is out, otherwise, > why not? > > I suspect your IT specialist buddy is a bit OCD about these things, > and a one-hour delay would be enough to get him spelling in all caps. ;-) > > As a non-specialist, the following probably do *not* apply to you, but > for completeness: > > 2. In high-volume situations, many admins prefer to use withlist, a > command line script, for mass moderation. No shell access, no can > do. This also can happen to you, if your list attracts specific > attention from a bad guy. > > 3. If you have many lists, and need to make a configuration change > to each of those lists, again withlist is your friend. > > 4. Certain customizations to the website require changing Mailman > code because the page in question is fully-software generated (no > template at all). > > 5. Custom Handlers can be added to the post processing pipeline, but > only if you have access to the code. I have two special-purpose > Handlers that I use for my own lists, and a third, used to > integrate SpamAssassin with Mailman, is quite popular. (This is > not the preferred way to use SpamAssassin, but it works for a lot > of Mailman site admins.) > > There may be others I can't recall offhand, but they're similar. I > think you can see that these are probably not major concerns for you. > For most non-technical users cPanel is a good way to go. > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > Searchable Archives: > http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/farokh%40mcfsoftware.com > Joe > February 18, 2014 13:50 > Hi, Brian. > > Thanks for your reply. I will be calling you soon. > > I will not disclose the name or e-mail of the IT specialist but his > private message to me expressed his concern over the use of cPanel as > a tool for the management of Mailman. > > Here is an excerpt from the e-mail I received: > > > Joe, unless you have COMPLETE "List Control", DON'T do it ! ! ! > > If you think you HATE the "baby sitting" of current set-up, you don't > know/fully understand > the full meaning of HATE ! ! ! > > For over a decade I have prayed to "Hit the Lottery" as very FIRST > thing I would do is pay > for Dedicated Server so I could have FULL control without the "Baby > Sitting" of cPanel ! ! ! > > > Since I am not an IT specialist I have to ask myself, why would he > feel so strongly about this ? What problems should I expect to encounter ? > > Thank you, > > Joseph. > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > Searchable Archives: > http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/farokh%40mcfsoftware.com > Brian Carpenter > February 18, 2014 13:36 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Mailman-Users [mailto:mailman-users- >> bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Joe >> Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2014 1:29 PM >> To: mailman-users at python.org Users >> Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. >> >> Hello, everyone. >> >> In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a message >> from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services that utilize > a >> cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad arrangement and one > that >> doesn't provide me full control of my lists. Since I am not an IT > specialist I >> don't know what a cPanel is or how this can be a problem. Can any of you >> enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, why can this be a problem and how would > it >> not allow me full control of my lists ? >> >> In addition, what problems should I expect to encounter in hosting my > lists >> with an outside Mailman hosting service ? >> >> Thank you in advance, >> >> Joe. >> ------------------------------------------------------ >> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users >> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 >> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 >> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman- >> users%40python.org/ >> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman- >> users/brian%40emwd.com > > Hi Joe: > > I think we discussed your mailman needs a couple of times over the phone. > > cPanel is a webhosting control panel that is very popular (for good reason) > among web hosting companies and it includes the use of mailman. > > cPanel is typically used within a shared hosting environment and I believe > it has done a lot in getting mailman into the hands of many list users. > Because of the nature of a shared hosting environment, typical mailman users > would not have access to the mailman server itself in order to make any > customizations such as searchable archives, etc. However my company hosts > over a 1000 mailman lists on our cPanel servers and our list clients are > very happy with the arrangement. But YMMV. > > If you have not required backend access before to your mailman server then I > would think you will not have any problems utilizing a cPanel enabled > mailman service. I would be interested in hearing some details of your IT > specialist's reservations of cPanel and mailman. > > Brian Carpenter > EMWD.com > > Providing Cloud Services and more for over 15 years. > > T: 336.755.0685 > E: brian at emwd.com > www.emwd.com > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/farokh%40mcfsoftware.com > Joe > February 18, 2014 13:28 > Hello, everyone. > > In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a > message from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services > that utilize a cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad > arrangement and one that doesn't provide me full control of my lists. > Since I am not an IT specialist I don't know what a cPanel is or how > this can be a problem. Can any of you enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, > why can this be a problem and how would it not allow me full control > of my lists ? > > In addition, what problems should I expect to encounter in hosting my > lists with an outside Mailman hosting service ? > > Thank you in advance, > > Joe. > ------------------------------------------------------ > Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users at python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > Searchable Archives: > http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/farokh%40mcfsoftware.com From s.cislaghi at gmail.com Wed Feb 19 10:04:50 2014 From: s.cislaghi at gmail.com (Stefano Cislaghi) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 10:04:50 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman web interface with apache 2.4 Message-ID: Hi, I've just installed Ubuntu 13.10 with apache 2.4. Here, mailman is working but I'm getting stuck with the webinterface. He're providing anytime 403 forbidden, logging: AH01630: client denied by server configuration: /usr/lib/mailman/cgi-bin Digging into changelog of apache 2.4 I discoved that entries: Order Allow, Deny Allow from all are no more current and must be replaced by 'Require all granted'. Doing so didn't solve the issue, but error log changed as: AH01797: client denied by server configuration: /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/admin Here my current mailman.conf in apache2 sites: ScriptAlias /cgi-bin/mailman/ /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/ Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/ Alias /images/mailman/ /usr/share/images/mailman/ AllowOverride None Options ExecCGI AddHandler cgi-script .cgi Require all granted Options FollowSymlinks AllowOverride None Require all granted AllowOverride None Require all granted Does anyone already hit this issue and solved? Seems to be something relalted to security options into apache 2.4 and cgi execution. thanks Ste From srinivasb at gmail.com Wed Feb 19 03:56:17 2014 From: srinivasb at gmail.com (Srinivas B.) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 20:56:17 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail 2.1.12: We're sorry, we hit a bug! Message-ID: Hi Environment: Mailman 2.1.12 on Amazon Linux 2012 with Python 2.6.9 and Virtualmin 4.0.5 GPL All our lists are under Emergency moderation. When a moderator goes to process held-messages and select "Preserve messages for the site administrator", then we see the following error: Bug in Mailman version 2.1.12 We're sorry, we hit a bug! Please inform the webmaster for this site of this problem. Printing of traceback and other system information has been explicitly inhibited, but the webmaster can find this information in the Mailman error logs. And then we see the following in /var/log/mailman/error file: Feb 18 21:42:26 2014 admin(10273): @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ admin(10273): [----- Mailman Version: 2.1.12 -----] admin(10273): [----- Traceback ------] admin(10273): Traceback (most recent call last): admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in run_main admin(10273): main() admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 165, in main admin(10273): process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata) admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 716, in process_form admin(10273): forward, forwardaddr) admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 167, in HandleRequest admin(10273): forward, addr) admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 244, in __handlepost admin(10273): msg = cPickle.load(fp) admin(10273): ValueError: could not convert string to float Not selecting the checkbox titled: Preserve messages for site-administrator, is processing the emails just fine and there are no issues. Any insights on how to fix this error? PS: Trying to search for the text "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" on http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/, results in a ModPython/Lucene exception... Looks like "single-quote" is throwing off the search interface... -Srinivas From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 19 16:52:34 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 07:52:34 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail 2.1.12: We're sorry, we hit a bug! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5304D342.3010108@msapiro.net> On 02/18/2014 06:56 PM, Srinivas B. wrote: > > Environment: Mailman 2.1.12 on Amazon Linux 2012 with Python 2.6.9 and > Virtualmin 4.0.5 GPL > > All our lists are under Emergency moderation. > When a moderator goes to process held-messages and select "Preserve > messages for the site administrator", then we see the following error: ... > And then we see the following in /var/log/mailman/error file: > > Feb 18 21:42:26 2014 admin(10273): > @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ > admin(10273): [----- Mailman Version: 2.1.12 -----] > admin(10273): [----- Traceback ------] > admin(10273): Traceback (most recent call last): > admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in > run_main > admin(10273): main() > admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 165, > in main > admin(10273): process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata) > admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 716, > in process_form > admin(10273): forward, forwardaddr) > admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 167, in > HandleRequest > admin(10273): forward, addr) > admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 244, in > __handlepost > admin(10273): msg = cPickle.load(fp) > admin(10273): ValueError: could not convert string to float > > > Not selecting the checkbox titled: Preserve messages for > site-administrator, is processing the emails just fine and there are no > issues. > > Any insights on how to fix this error? It looks like this might be an actual bug. There is an incompatibility between Mailman 2.1.12 and Python 2.6.x in this area, but not right there. At lines 205 and 254 in your version of ListAdmin.py, g(msg, 1) needs to be changed to g.flatten(msg, 1). However, that doesn't cause what you're seeing. Do you have HOLD_MESSAGES_AS_PICKLES = No in mm_cfg.py. If so, I think there is a bug with this. Unfortunately, I'm traveling this week and it will take be a while to investigate/fix this. In the mean time, if that is the issue, you can remove that from mm_cfg.py if you don't need it for other reasons. > PS: Trying to search for the text "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" on > http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/, results in a > ModPython/Lucene exception... Looks like "single-quote" is throwing off the > search interface... That is a mail-archive.com issue. You could search Google for inurl:mailman-users site:mail.python.org "We're sorry, we hit a bug!" but that returns over 5000 hits, most if not all of which are not relevant. It's much better to search with something like inurl:mailman-users site:mail.python.org "ValueError: could not convert string to float" which returns only 8 hits, including a couple from 2003 and 2004 which indicate this is an old bug. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Wed Feb 19 16:57:17 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 07:57:17 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman web interface with apache 2.4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5304D45D.4020402@msapiro.net> On 02/19/2014 01:04 AM, Stefano Cislaghi wrote: > > Digging into changelog of apache 2.4 I discoved that entries: > > Order Allow, Deny > Allow from all > > are no more current and must be replaced by 'Require all granted'. Doing > so didn't solve the issue, but error log changed as: > > AH01797: client denied by server configuration: > /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/admin > > Here my current mailman.conf in apache2 sites: > > ScriptAlias /cgi-bin/mailman/ /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/ > Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/ > Alias /images/mailman/ /usr/share/images/mailman/ > > AllowOverride None > Options ExecCGI > AddHandler cgi-script .cgi > Require all granted > > > Options FollowSymlinks > AllowOverride None > Require all granted > > > AllowOverride None > Require all granted > > > > Does anyone already hit this issue and solved? Seems to be something > relalted to security options into apache 2.4 and cgi execution. I hit the same issue when upgrading from Ubuntu 13.04 to 13.10. These mailman.conf settings work for me. ScriptAlias /mailman/ /var/MM/21/cgi-bin/ Alias /pipermail/ /var/MM/21/archives/public/ AllowOverride None Options ExecCGI Order Deny,Allow Allow from all Require all granted Options +FollowSymLinks Order allow,deny Allow from all Require all granted -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From s.cislaghi at gmail.com Wed Feb 19 16:59:08 2014 From: s.cislaghi at gmail.com (Stefano Cislaghi) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 16:59:08 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman web interface with apache 2.4 In-Reply-To: <5304D45D.4020402@msapiro.net> References: <5304D45D.4020402@msapiro.net> Message-ID: Hi, I've solved few minutes ago. The issue was rather stupid. CGID wasn't enabled and must be manually enabled in apache. Doing so solved the issue. Thanks Ste On 19 February 2014 16:57, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/19/2014 01:04 AM, Stefano Cislaghi wrote: > > > > Digging into changelog of apache 2.4 I discoved that entries: > > > > Order Allow, Deny > > Allow from all > > > > are no more current and must be replaced by 'Require all granted'. Doing > > so didn't solve the issue, but error log changed as: > > > > AH01797: client denied by server configuration: > > /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/admin > > > > Here my current mailman.conf in apache2 sites: > > > > ScriptAlias /cgi-bin/mailman/ /usr/lib/cgi-bin/mailman/ > > Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/ > > Alias /images/mailman/ /usr/share/images/mailman/ > > > > AllowOverride None > > Options ExecCGI > > AddHandler cgi-script .cgi > > Require all granted > > > > > > Options FollowSymlinks > > AllowOverride None > > Require all granted > > > > > > AllowOverride None > > Require all granted > > > > > > > > Does anyone already hit this issue and solved? Seems to be something > > relalted to security options into apache 2.4 and cgi execution. > > > I hit the same issue when upgrading from Ubuntu 13.04 to 13.10. These > mailman.conf settings work for me. > > ScriptAlias /mailman/ /var/MM/21/cgi-bin/ > Alias /pipermail/ /var/MM/21/archives/public/ > > > AllowOverride None > Options ExecCGI > Order Deny,Allow > Allow from all > Require all granted > > > > Options +FollowSymLinks > Order allow,deny > Allow from all > Require all granted > > > > -- > Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, > San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan > From vancleef at lostwells.net Wed Feb 19 18:54:28 2014 From: vancleef at lostwells.net (Hank van Cleef) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 10:54:28 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question about Mailman hosting service. In-Reply-To: <4E924B47-E1B5-43BC-963E-45B788FDD396@gmail.com> Message-ID: <201402191754.s1JHsSpj013546@joanne.lostwells.net> The esteemed Joe has said: > > Hello, everyone. > > In my attempt to find a Mailman hosting service I have received a message from one IT specialist advising me to avoid hosting services that utilize a cPanel. According to this specialist this is a bad arrangement and one that doesn't provide me full control of my lists. Since I am not an IT specialist I don't know what a cPanel is or how this can be a problem. Can any of you enlighten me ? What is a cPanel, why can this be a problem and how would it not allow me full control of my lists ? > > In addition, what problems should I expect to encounter in hosting my lists with an outside Mailman hosting service ? > Joe, I'm going to comment on meeting your needs from my own direct experience. Just by way of introduction, let me say that I don't consider myself an "IT specialist," though there are times when I've had to do until a real one comes along. Instead, I'm a hardware engineer who first worked with digital systems in the 1950's, and learned software on the side. You've heard of the DEC PDP-1. I worked on that team. Fast forward 43 years until I retired at 67 in 2001. Most of that time, I worked on teams who didn't go to school to "learn that stuff," because we were too busy inventing it. (Later some of those schools hired us to teach what we'd invented). A couple of years after I retired (and moved into a small Rocky Mt. ranch community), the local dialup service developed wireless radio link services, and when they learned that I was a potential customer and had Sun servers with Solaris available (and the skills to use them), I was part of their development. My setup here is as "my own ISP" using them as my upstream feed. About a year after we got that up and running, a mail list I was on fell apart because of sociological conflict. I agreed to set up Mailman needed resources to host his domain name, and received the needed data from the last host site, which was also Mailman. I downloaded the Mailman and Python sources, built them, and installed Mailman using the existing Solaris sendmail and apache builds in the Solaris distribution. Some of the Mailman web pages got customized for sociological reasons, which meant that I had to maintain a non-standard configuration. Our assumption at the time was that the list would operate for 3-5 years and sail off into the sunset. That's not what happened. We solved the sociological problems, and at eight years, the list was more active than ever. It was time to for me to get out of the hosting "sideline," and find a commercial provider. Before starting that search, I did a stock build of Mailman, uncustomized, and moved my lists to that, to see if there was any more need for the customization. There was none, and we found a commercial service that was running stock Mailman with the HtDig search engine, which we needed. Sent them a dump of the subscriber base, the configuration files we were using, and many gigabytes of mbox files, and they've run the list for a good three years now. I'll identify them in private e-mail if you wish. What was my actual "need" for full access to the installation? So far as Mailman itself was concerned, "virtually none" was the answer. It was convenient to be able to read the log files, but that generally was to monitor activity involving Sendmail and its control files. I don't know about cPanel itself. But I think you want to consider what your objectives are. I think you are saying you want to set up a mail list, but don't want to try to turn into a systems administration wizard in the process. My experience is this: you don't need to, if you're hosted on a good system with competent sysadmins. Hank From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 20 04:31:01 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 19:31:01 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mail 2.1.12: We're sorry, we hit a bug! In-Reply-To: <5304D342.3010108@msapiro.net> References: <5304D342.3010108@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <530576F5.9040603@msapiro.net> Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/18/2014 06:56 PM, Srinivas B. wrote: >> ... >> >> Feb 18 21:42:26 2014 admin(10273): >> @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ >> admin(10273): [----- Mailman Version: 2.1.12 -----] >> admin(10273): [----- Traceback ------] >> admin(10273): Traceback (most recent call last): >> admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/scripts/driver", line 112, in >> run_main >> admin(10273): main() >> admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 165, >> in main >> admin(10273): process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata) >> admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/admindb.py", line 716, >> in process_form >> admin(10273): forward, forwardaddr) >> admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 167, in >> HandleRequest >> admin(10273): forward, addr) >> admin(10273): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/ListAdmin.py", line 244, in >> __handlepost >> admin(10273): msg = cPickle.load(fp) >> admin(10273): ValueError: could not convert string to float >> >> >> Not selecting the checkbox titled: Preserve messages for >> site-administrator, is processing the emails just fine and there are no >> issues. >> >> Any insights on how to fix this error? It turns out that for many years it has not been possible to preserve messages for the site-administrator if HOLD_MESSAGES_AS_PICKLES = No. This is now reported at and fixed at . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From s.cislaghi at gmail.com Wed Feb 19 21:44:32 2014 From: s.cislaghi at gmail.com (Stefano Cislaghi) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2014 21:44:32 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and postfix virtual user trouble Message-ID: Hello, I'm configuring mailman and postfix with virtual domain support. The problem is that everytime I send an email to mylist at lists.anotherdom.net I got a reply error from postfix as <*mylist at mydomain.io >* (expanded from < mylist at lists.anotherdom.net>): User unknown in virtual alias table I do not understand why the list is traduced to mydomain.io that is not configured anywhere. My mm_cfg.py is: MAILMAN_SITE_LIST = 'mailman' DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s/cgi-bin/mailman/' IMAGE_LOGOS = '/images/mailman/' DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'myhost.mydomain.io' DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'myhost.mydomain.io' add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST) DEFAULT_SERVER_LANGUAGE = 'en' DEFAULT_SEND_REMINDERS = 0 MTA='Postfix' POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.anotherdom.net'] Here my main.cf configuration: http://pastebin.com/zNf9Lyn7 I see that virtual-mailman just translate: mylist at lists.anotherdom.net mylist And probably here postfix try to treat it as local address. However in /var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman is present mylist: "|/var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mylist" Any idea? thanks Ste From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 20 14:24:58 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 05:24:58 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and postfix virtual user trouble In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5306022A.1020401@msapiro.net> On 02/19/2014 12:44 PM, Stefano Cislaghi wrote: > > I see that virtual-mailman just translate: > > mylist at lists.anotherdom.net mylist Yes. > And probably here postfix try to treat it as local address. However > in /var/lib/mailman/data/virtual-mailman is present You mean /var/lib/mailman/data/aliases? > mylist: "|/var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mylist" Here's an issue. From main.cf: mydestination = localhost, localhost.localdomain mydomain = mydomain.io You need to have mydomain.io in mydestination, either by mydestination = localhost, localhost.localdomain, $mydomain or mydestination = localhost, localhost.localdomain, mydomain.io Hoever, I'm concerned about the implication of mailman_destination_recipient_limit = 1 What's in /etc/postfix/transport? If there is a 'mailman' transport entry for the lists.anotherdom.net domain and this transport is defined in master.cf as postfix_to_mailman.py, see the FAQ at , and probably just remove the 'mailman' entry from /etc/postfix/transport and removemailman_destination_recipient_limit from main.cf. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From gkasica at netwrx1.com Thu Feb 20 14:57:05 2014 From: gkasica at netwrx1.com (George Kasica) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 13:57:05 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and postfix virtual user trouble In-Reply-To: <5306022A.1020401@msapiro.net> References: <5306022A.1020401@msapiro.net> Message-ID: Quick question what does this parameter do exactly? mailman_destination_recipient_limit = 1 From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 20 15:09:20 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 06:09:20 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman and postfix virtual user trouble In-Reply-To: References: <5306022A.1020401@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <53060C90.5060308@msapiro.net> On 02/20/2014 05:57 AM, George Kasica wrote: > Quick question what does this parameter do exactly? > > mailman_destination_recipient_limit = 1 See . In this case, it ensures that if one message is addressed to more than one address served by the 'mailman' transport, that the message is delivered separately to the mailman transport for each address. It should be used if and only if there is a postfix_to_mailman.py or similar 'mailman' transport. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From fmouse-mailman at fmp.com Thu Feb 20 18:11:29 2014 From: fmouse-mailman at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 11:11:29 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! Message-ID: <1392916289.65474.28.camel@pudina.fmp.com> I'm running Mailman 2.1.15 on a Ubuntu server, feeding into Courier MTA, running Python 2.7.3. I track security updates and install them promptly when they're issued by Ubuntu. Yesterday I updated the Linux kernel from 3.2.0-58-generic (x86_64) to 3.2.0-59-generic and Mailman quit working. List posts made it through to the archives, and were apparently queued within Mailman, but wouldn't go out. The mail server was working OK for non-list email. Today I backed out the kernel update and posts to lists sent yesterday and today are going out without problems. I can find nothing in the Mailman logs, or in the mail server logs, indicating a problem. This is the first time I've ever had a problem with a server kernel update breaking something related to mail. Has anyone else seen this problem? Does anyone have any insight into how to address it? -- Lindsay Haisley | "Everything works if you let it" FMP Computer Services | 512-259-1190 | --- The Roadie http://www.fmp.com | From fmouse at fmp.com Thu Feb 20 19:07:53 2014 From: fmouse at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 12:07:53 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! Message-ID: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> I'm running Mailman 2.1.15 on a Ubuntu server, feeding into Courier MTA, running Python 2.7.3. I track security updates and install them promptly when they're issued by Ubuntu. Yesterday I updated the Linux kernel from 3.2.0-58-generic (x86_64) to 3.2.0-59-generic and Mailman quit working. List posts made it through to the archives, and were apparently queued within Mailman, but wouldn't go out. The mail server was working OK for non-list email. Today I backed out the kernel update and posts to lists sent yesterday and today are going out without problems. I can find nothing in the Mailman logs, or in the mail server logs, indicating a problem. This is the first time I've ever had a problem with a server kernel update breaking something related to mail. Has anyone else seen this problem? Does anyone have any insight into how to address it? -- Lindsay Haisley | "Everything works if you let it" FMP Computer Services | 512-259-1190 | --- The Roadie http://www.fmp.com | From mark at msapiro.net Thu Feb 20 19:37:45 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 10:37:45 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> Message-ID: <53064B79.4070604@msapiro.net> On 02/20/2014 10:07 AM, Lindsay Haisley wrote: > I'm running Mailman 2.1.15 on a Ubuntu server, feeding into Courier MTA, > running Python 2.7.3. I track security updates and install them > promptly when they're issued by Ubuntu. Yesterday I updated the Linux > kernel from 3.2.0-58-generic (x86_64) to 3.2.0-59-generic and Mailman > quit working. List posts made it through to the archives, and were > apparently queued within Mailman, but wouldn't go out. The mail server > was working OK for non-list email. Today I backed out the kernel update > and posts to lists sent yesterday and today are going out without > problems. What's in Mailman's 'post' and 'smtp' logs for these messages. Are they timestamped before or after you backed out the update. If before, they were queued in the MTA. If after, they were in Mailman's 'out' queue. If the latter, what's in Mailman's 'qrunner' log related to OutgoingRunner. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From barry at list.org Thu Feb 20 20:39:20 2014 From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 14:39:20 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> Message-ID: <20140220143920.04e14993@anarchist.wooz.org> On Feb 20, 2014, at 12:07 PM, Lindsay Haisley wrote: >I'm running Mailman 2.1.15 on a Ubuntu server, feeding into Courier MTA, >running Python 2.7.3. I track security updates and install them >promptly when they're issued by Ubuntu. Yesterday I updated the Linux >kernel from 3.2.0-58-generic (x86_64) to 3.2.0-59-generic and Mailman >quit working. List posts made it through to the archives, and were >apparently queued within Mailman, but wouldn't go out. The mail server >was working OK for non-list email. Today I backed out the kernel update >and posts to lists sent yesterday and today are going out without >problems. I'm really quite surprised about this. From the kernel version numbers, I'm guessing you're running Ubuntu 12.04 LTS? I have my personal Mailman server running on that OS, and just performed a kernel update. I'm about to reboot it into the new kernel, so I'll send a test message out and see if it works. Very odd that a kernel update alone would cause the problem. Can you send mail normally (i.e. outside of Mailman) and connect to your port 25? I guess the one difference between our setups is that I use Postfix. -Barry From fmouse at fmp.com Thu Feb 20 23:04:28 2014 From: fmouse at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 16:04:28 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <53064B79.4070604@msapiro.net> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <53064B79.4070604@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <1392933868.65474.48.camel@pudina.fmp.com> On Thu, 2014-02-20 at 10:37 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/20/2014 10:07 AM, Lindsay Haisley wrote: > > I'm running Mailman 2.1.15 on a Ubuntu server, feeding into Courier MTA, > > running Python 2.7.3. I track security updates and install them > > promptly when they're issued by Ubuntu. Yesterday I updated the Linux > > kernel from 3.2.0-58-generic (x86_64) to 3.2.0-59-generic and Mailman > > quit working. List posts made it through to the archives, and were > > apparently queued within Mailman, but wouldn't go out. The mail server > > was working OK for non-list email. Today I backed out the kernel update > > and posts to lists sent yesterday and today are going out without > > problems. > > > What's in Mailman's 'post' and 'smtp' logs for these messages. Are they > timestamped before or after you backed out the update. If before, they > were queued in the MTA. If after, they were in Mailman's 'out' queue. They weren't in the MTA's queue. Looking at the count of messages in the MTA queue was how I determined that list posts weren't being delivered to the MTA by Mailman. I restarted qrunner and it didn't make any difference. The mail queue had like 67 messages in it. This would go up to 68 or 69 at time and then fall back down again - normal behavior. I could send and receive mail. All indications are that the MTA was working normally. Mailman lists run from several hundred to a couple of thousand subscribers and if someone posts to a list the MTA mail queue shoots up to hundreds of messages with VERP sender addresses shown in the queue summary, and then works its way back down. > If the latter, what's in Mailman's 'qrunner' log related to OutgoingRunner. Here's a sampling of the qrunner log from the wee hours, before I started poking at the problem to try to fix it: Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2447) IncomingRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2447) IncomingRunner qrunner exiting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2445) BounceRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2445) BounceRunner qrunner exiting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2446) CommandRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2446) CommandRunner qrunner exiting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2451) RetryRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master watcher caught SIGINT. Restarting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2444) ArchRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2444) ArchRunner qrunner exiting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2448) NewsRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2450) VirginRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2449) OutgoingRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2451) RetryRunner qrunner exiting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2448) NewsRunner qrunner exiting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2450) VirginRunner qrunner exiting. Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit (pid: 2445, sig: None, sts: 2, class: BounceRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit (pid: 2446, sig: None, sts: 2, class: CommandRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit (pid: 2451, sig: None, sts: 2, class: RetryRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit (pid: 2448, sig: None, sts: 2, class: NewsRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit (pid: 2444, sig: None, sts: 2, class: ArchRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit (pid: 2447, sig: None, sts: 2, class: IncomingRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] FWIW, another very strange thing happened after the kernel upgrade, totally unrelated to mail. I run bind9 on the same server, and it provides recursive DNS for all our in-house boxes coming from our LAN through our VPN to our server. This has been working fine for some time, but after the kernel upgrade it quit working. The bind9 config specifies that if there's no ACL in the bind config then bind listens on ALL interfaces. There was an interface ACL for IPv6 but none for v4. After the upgrade, bind no longer worked for us as our recursive server UNLESS I provided an v4 interface ACL, which I did, and it started working again. Go figure. -- Lindsay Haisley | "Everything works if you let it" FMP Computer Services | 512-259-1190 | --- The Roadie http://www.fmp.com | From fmouse at fmp.com Thu Feb 20 23:45:28 2014 From: fmouse at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 16:45:28 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <20140220143920.04e14993@anarchist.wooz.org> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <20140220143920.04e14993@anarchist.wooz.org> Message-ID: <1392936328.65474.64.camel@pudina.fmp.com> On Thu, 2014-02-20 at 14:39 -0500, Barry Warsaw wrote: > >I'm running Mailman 2.1.15 on a Ubuntu server, feeding into Courier MTA, > >running Python 2.7.3. I track security updates and install them > >promptly when they're issued by Ubuntu. Yesterday I updated the Linux > >kernel from 3.2.0-58-generic (x86_64) to 3.2.0-59-generic and Mailman > >quit working. List posts made it through to the archives, and were > >apparently queued within Mailman, but wouldn't go out. The mail server > >was working OK for non-list email. Today I backed out the kernel update > >and posts to lists sent yesterday and today are going out without > >problems. > > I'm really quite surprised about this. From the kernel version numbers, I'm > guessing you're running Ubuntu 12.04 LTS? I have my personal Mailman server > running on that OS, and just performed a kernel update. I'm about to reboot > it into the new kernel, so I'll send a test message out and see if it works. > Very odd that a kernel update alone would cause the problem. Can you send > mail normally (i.e. outside of Mailman) and connect to your port 25? I guess > the one difference between our setups is that I use Postfix. I'm very surprised too!! I've never seen this kind of thing before. There are several pieces in the mix, including spamd running on mail inbound to Mailman. I'm using James Henstridge's relatively old (10 years) SpamAssassin.py module inserted into the processing of inbound list mail via GLOBAL_PIPELINE.insert and OWNER_PIPELINE.insert. These have worked well up to this point. The fact that the inbound list mails showed up in the Mailman list archives tells me that this is working OK. As it was, no sooner had the box come up with the previous kernel than the MTA's queue took off like a frightened duck! There were over 4000 messages in it (all legit, via a customer with a large list who was desperate to get a list email out and had tried sending it several times) within a couple of minutes. My instinct says that there's some subtle change to kernel IPC that's causing this. -- Lindsay Haisley | "Everything works if you let it" FMP Computer Services | 512-259-1190 | --- The Roadie http://www.fmp.com | From fmouse at fmp.com Fri Feb 21 00:00:33 2014 From: fmouse at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 17:00:33 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <20140220143920.04e14993@anarchist.wooz.org> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <20140220143920.04e14993@anarchist.wooz.org> Message-ID: <1392937233.65474.73.camel@pudina.fmp.com> On Thu, 2014-02-20 at 14:39 -0500, Barry Warsaw wrote: > I'm really quite surprised about this. From the kernel version numbers, I'm > guessing you're running Ubuntu 12.04 LTS? You are correct about the Ubuntu release on the box. My next step would be to reinstall the new kernel version and test this issue in a controlled way, but before I do so I'd like to have some diagnostic code or configs in place which will track and log the intimate details of the relationship between Mailman and the MTA. Any suggestions will be appreciated! I'm also going to post to the very active courier-users list and see if anyone else is having this or similar problems. -- Lindsay Haisley | "Everything works if you let it" FMP Computer Services | 512-259-1190 | --- The Roadie http://www.fmp.com | From tom.browder at gmail.com Fri Feb 21 04:09:39 2014 From: tom.browder at gmail.com (Tom Browder) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2014 22:09:39 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MM 3 and OSCON 2014 Message-ID: Two questions: 1. What is the definitive link for the MM 3 branch for wannabe users (I haven't been able to find such on the wiki yet, but I know it's there)? 2. Is MM going to have a presence at O'reilly's OSCON 2014 in July? Thanks. Best regards, -Tom From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 21 14:56:09 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 05:56:09 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <1392933868.65474.48.camel@pudina.fmp.com> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <53064B79.4070604@msapiro.net> <1392933868.65474.48.camel@pudina.fmp.com> Message-ID: <53075AF9.3090408@msapiro.net> On 02/20/2014 02:04 PM, Lindsay Haisley wrote: > > Here's a sampling of the qrunner log from the wee hours, before I > started poking at the problem to try to fix it: > > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2447) IncomingRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2447) IncomingRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2445) BounceRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2445) BounceRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2446) CommandRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2446) CommandRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2451) RetryRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master watcher caught SIGINT. Restarting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2444) ArchRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2444) ArchRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2448) NewsRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2450) VirginRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2449) OutgoingRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2451) RetryRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2448) NewsRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2450) VirginRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit > (pid: 2445, sig: None, sts: 2, class: BounceRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit > (pid: 2446, sig: None, sts: 2, class: CommandRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit > (pid: 2451, sig: None, sts: 2, class: RetryRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit > (pid: 2448, sig: None, sts: 2, class: NewsRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit > (pid: 2444, sig: None, sts: 2, class: ArchRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit > (pid: 2447, sig: None, sts: 2, class: IncomingRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] OK, From what you report here and elsewhere, it appears the issue was with OutgoingRunner not processing Mailman's 'out' queue. If the above log excerpt (appears to be from a mailmanctl restart) is complete, you will note that there are three entries for most runners, e,g. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2447) IncomingRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2447) IncomingRunner qrunner exiting. > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2443) Master qrunner detected subprocess exit > (pid: 2447, sig: None, sts: 2, class: IncomingRunner, slice: 1/1) [restarting] But there is only one for OutgoingRunner > Feb 20 03:22:02 2014 (2449) OutgoingRunner qrunner caught SIGINT. Stopping. suggesting that it was hung and never terminated. Had it been me at that point, I would have stopped Mailman and made sure it was completely stopped per the FAQ at , and then started it to see if that fixed the problem. If the out queue were still not being processed, I would try to trace the OutgoingRunner process to see where it was hung. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 21 17:15:26 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 08:15:26 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MM 3 and OSCON 2014 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <53077B9E.1080303@msapiro.net> On 02/20/2014 07:09 PM, Tom Browder wrote: > Two questions: > > 1. What is the definitive link for the MM 3 branch for wannabe users > (I haven't been able to find such on the wiki yet, but I know it's > there)? I'm not sure what you're looking for, but maybe , aka . > 2. Is MM going to have a presence at O'reilly's OSCON 2014 in July? I don't plan to be there, but others may. There will be a number of us at PyCon in April . -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From barry at list.org Fri Feb 21 17:39:31 2014 From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 11:39:31 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MM 3 and OSCON 2014 In-Reply-To: <53077B9E.1080303@msapiro.net> References: <53077B9E.1080303@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <20140221113931.02477607@anarchist.wooz.org> On Feb 21, 2014, at 08:15 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote: >> 2. Is MM going to have a presence at O'reilly's OSCON 2014 in July? > >I don't plan to be there, but others may. There will be a number of us >at PyCon in April . I won't be at OSCON either. We'll be sprinting on Mailman 3.0 at Pycon. I want to emphasize two things at the sprint: working on Postorius and Hyperkitty, and porting MM3 to Python 3. But we can work on other things if you have an interest. AFAICT, the sprint page is not up yet though. Please come and join us! -Barry From andy at andyjeffries.co.uk Fri Feb 21 17:07:23 2014 From: andy at andyjeffries.co.uk (Andy Jeffries) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 16:07:23 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with messages held in Moderator Queue Message-ID: I run a mailman (2.1.14-3ubuntu0.1) mailing list for a client. There are currently 14 emails stuck in the moderator queue. We've tried over and over again to choose to Discard them and click on Submit. Every time, the HTTP request POSTs to /cgi-bin/mailman/admindb/mailing-list-name-here, which 301 redirects to the same URL and the GET request loads exactly the same as before (i.e. it didn't remove any of the stuck emails). I've had a look at the filesystem and the /var/lib/mailman/lists/mailing-list-name-here/request.pck file's timestamp gets updated. That file (and the ones named /var/lib/mailman/data/heldmsg-mailing-list-name-here-10.pck) are owned by the "list" group which has "www-data" as a member (Nginx operates as www-data). Can anyone suggest what I should try next to get the web interface working? I know they can be deleted via a command line script, but I'm assuming if I do that, I'm going to be always doing this and I want the client to be able to do it themselves via the web interface. Many thanks, Andy From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 21 19:42:00 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 10:42:00 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem with messages held in Moderator Queue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <53079DF8.8090005@msapiro.net> On 02/21/2014 08:07 AM, Andy Jeffries wrote: > > Every time, the HTTP request POSTs to > /cgi-bin/mailman/admindb/mailing-list-name-here, which 301 redirects to the > same URL and the GET request loads exactly the same as before (i.e. it > didn't remove any of the stuck emails). That's the issue. The redirect is losing the POST data. See the FAQ at (3rd paragraph). > Can anyone suggest what I should try next to get the web interface working? Fix your web server to not redirect. If this is a redirect from http to https, see paragraph 2 of the above FAQ. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From fmouse at fmp.com Fri Feb 21 22:03:01 2014 From: fmouse at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 15:03:01 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <53075AF9.3090408@msapiro.net> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <53064B79.4070604@msapiro.net> <1392933868.65474.48.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <53075AF9.3090408@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <1393016581.65474.130.camel@pudina.fmp.com> On Fri, 2014-02-21 at 05:56 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote: > OK, From what you report here and elsewhere, it appears the issue was > with OutgoingRunner not processing Mailman's 'out' queue. If the above > log excerpt (appears to be from a mailmanctl restart) is complete, you > will note that there are three entries for most runners, e,g. > Well I can't reproduce the Mailman list problem today. I (re)updated the kernel version to 3.2.0-59-generic x86_64 and everything seems to be working OK. The only obvious change is the aforementioned issue with the bind9 name server daemon which requires an explicit IPv4 network interface ACL instead of defaulting to receiving on ALL interfaces if the IPv4 ACL is absent in the config. I didn't update bind, so this is kernel dependent. It's possible that some features of v4 and v6 address handling have been merged (there's an IPv6 interface ACL in the bind9 config). It's also possible that attempts at name resolution hung up Mailman's qrunner. If it won't break, I can't fix it :-S Thanks for your time and attention. > -- Lindsay Haisley | "Everything works if you let it" FMP Computer Services | 512-259-1190 | --- The Roadie http://www.fmp.com | From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 21 23:50:12 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 14:50:12 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Kernel update breaks Mailman!! In-Reply-To: <1393016581.65474.130.camel@pudina.fmp.com> References: <1392919673.65474.31.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <53064B79.4070604@msapiro.net> <1392933868.65474.48.camel@pudina.fmp.com> <53075AF9.3090408@msapiro.net> <1393016581.65474.130.camel@pudina.fmp.com> Message-ID: <5307D824.9010703@msapiro.net> On 02/21/2014 01:03 PM, Lindsay Haisley wrote: > It's also possible that attempts at name resolution hung up > Mailman's qrunner. That's a possibility, but the only name OutgoingRunner looks up is the value of SMTPHOST which in a more or less default Mailman is 'localhost' which should be resolved through /etc/hosts. It is also possible that OutgoingRunner got wedged for some transient reason unrelated to the kernel upgrade. > If it won't break, I can't fix it :-S True ... -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From stephen at xemacs.org Sat Feb 22 04:43:28 2014 From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2014 12:43:28 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MM 3 and OSCON 2014 In-Reply-To: <53077B9E.1080303@msapiro.net> References: <53077B9E.1080303@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <871tyvx15r.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Mark Sapiro writes: > > 1. What is the definitive link for the MM 3 branch for wannabe users > > (I haven't been able to find such on the wiki yet, but I know it's > > there)? > > > I'm not sure what you're looking for, but maybe > , > aka . Note that that page is NOT up-to-date. Get the Mailman sources (including Postorius and HyperKitty) and read the installation instructions with the sources. Postorius and HyperKitty may not be very different, but Mailman core now uses a completely different framework for setup. From pshute at nuw.org.au Mon Feb 24 19:20:38 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 05:20:38 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Message order on the moderation page Message-ID: Messages held for moderation are listed in sender order rather than chronological order. Can that be changed? Peter Shute Sent from my iPad From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 24 20:03:40 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2014 11:03:40 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Message order on the moderation page In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <530B978C.40903@msapiro.net> On 02/24/2014 10:20 AM, Peter Shute wrote: > Messages held for moderation are listed in sender order rather than chronological order. Can that be changed? Beginning in Mailman 2.1.16, there is a DISPLAY_HELD_SUMMARY_SORT_BUTTONS setting. The documentation of this setting from Defaults.py is # Shall the admindb held message summary display the grouping and sorting # option radio buttons? Set this in mm_cfg.py to one of the following: # SSENDER -> Default to grouped and sorted by sender. # SSENDERTIME -> Default to grouped by sender and sorted by time. # STIME -> Default to ungrouped and sorted by time. DISPLAY_HELD_SUMMARY_SORT_BUTTONS = No This controls whether or not the buttons are displayed and what the default button is. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From pshute at nuw.org.au Mon Feb 24 22:31:33 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 08:31:33 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Message order on the moderation page In-Reply-To: <530B978C.40903@msapiro.net> References: <530B978C.40903@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B34A6@nuwvicms1> Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/24/2014 10:20 AM, Peter Shute wrote: > > Messages held for moderation are listed in sender order > rather than chronological order. Can that be changed? > > Beginning in Mailman 2.1.16, there is a > DISPLAY_HELD_SUMMARY_SORT_BUTTONS setting. > > The documentation of this setting from Defaults.py is > > # Shall the admindb held message summary display the grouping > and sorting # option radio buttons? Set this in mm_cfg.py to > one of the following: > # SSENDER -> Default to grouped and sorted by sender. > # SSENDERTIME -> Default to grouped by sender and sorted by time. > # STIME -> Default to ungrouped and sorted by time. > DISPLAY_HELD_SUMMARY_SORT_BUTTONS = No > > This controls whether or not the buttons are displayed and > what the default button is. Thanks for that. Unfortunately we're on 2.1.15. I assume that if we're using a cpanel installation, we need to ask someone to make this change for us? Peter Shute From mark at msapiro.net Mon Feb 24 22:51:51 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2014 13:51:51 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Message order on the moderation page In-Reply-To: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B34A6@nuwvicms1> References: <530B978C.40903@msapiro.net> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B34A6@nuwvicms1> Message-ID: <530BBEF7.4030908@msapiro.net> On 02/24/2014 01:31 PM, Peter Shute wrote: > > Thanks for that. Unfortunately we're on 2.1.15. I assume that if we're using a cpanel installation, we need to ask someone to make this change for us? Two things would need to be done. 1) your host would have to upgrade its cPanel installation to one that includes Mailman 2.1.16 or later assuming there is such a thing [*], and 2) the host would need to put something like DISPLAY_HELD_SUMMARY_SORT_BUTTONS = STIME in its /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py, assuming cPanel hasn't somehow disabled or changed the feature. [*] if the host is really cooperative, they could install the changes at and to implement the feature in 2.1.15. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From barry at list.org Mon Feb 24 23:59:23 2014 From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2014 17:59:23 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] GNU Mailman sprinting at Pycon 2014 Message-ID: <20140224175923.3c31e32d@limelight.wooz.org> Hello sprinters! Once again, the GNU Mailman project will be sprinting at Pycon, this time the 2014 conference in Montreal. I've created a placeholder page for adding ideas about what you would like to work on, as well as our priorities. We'll be filling out details over the next few weeks, but feel free to start discussing ideas here. http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/PyCon+2014+Sprint Cheers, -Barry -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 819 bytes Desc: not available URL: From pshute at nuw.org.au Tue Feb 25 01:55:28 2014 From: pshute at nuw.org.au (Peter Shute) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 11:55:28 +1100 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Message order on the moderation page In-Reply-To: <530BBEF7.4030908@msapiro.net> References: <530B978C.40903@msapiro.net> <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B34A6@nuwvicms1> <530BBEF7.4030908@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <150CDAA93B99944998130F5B1C4A2F1F45271B34B4@nuwvicms1> Mark Sapiro wrote: > > Thanks for that. Unfortunately we're on 2.1.15. I assume > that if we're using a cpanel installation, we need to ask > someone to make this change for us? > > > Two things would need to be done. > > 1) your host would have to upgrade its cPanel installation to > one that includes Mailman 2.1.16 or later assuming there is > such a thing [*], and > > 2) the host would need to put something like > > DISPLAY_HELD_SUMMARY_SORT_BUTTONS = STIME > > in its /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py, > assuming cPanel hasn't somehow disabled or changed the feature. > > [*] if the host is really cooperative, they could install the > changes at > > and > > to implement the feature in 2.1.15. Thanks, I'll make inquiries. Peter Shute From mike.young at nd.edu Tue Feb 25 15:15:50 2014 From: mike.young at nd.edu (Michael Young) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 09:15:50 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribe w/o confirmation? Message-ID: (Context: running MM 2.1.12, works great...) I know why allowing subscriptions without either a confirmation email or a moderator approval is a Dangerous Thing, but is there a way to get MM to allow it? Our list subscriptions are mostly generated by our lab/tool management software in response to a user getting qualified to use a piece of equipment, and I don't want users to have a choice in this case - they get subscribed, period. (They can later unsubscribe of course, but that means they have to actually do something :) Does this make any sense? Thanks... -- Michael P. Young (574) 631-3268 (office) Nanofabrication Specialist (574) 631-4393 (fax) Department of Electrical Engineering (765) 412-6728 (cell) University of Notre Dame mike.young at nd.edu B-38 Stinson-Remick Hall Notre Dame, IN 46556-5637 From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 25 18:21:32 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 09:21:32 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribe w/o confirmation? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <530CD11C.8060506@msapiro.net> On 02/25/2014 06:15 AM, Michael Young wrote: > > I know why allowing subscriptions without either a confirmation email > or a moderator approval is a Dangerous Thing, but is there a way to > get MM to allow it? For user subscriptions, you need to set Privacy options... -> Subscription rules -> subscribe_policy to None. If the None radio button doesn't appear, you need to set ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE = Yes in mm_cfg.py. Alternatively, you can set the list's subscribe_policy to zero using withlist or config_list. > Our list subscriptions are mostly generated by > our lab/tool management software in response to a user getting > qualified to use a piece of equipment, and I don't want users to have > a choice in this case - they get subscribed, period. (They can later > unsubscribe of course, but that means they have to actually do > something :) Depending on how the lab/tool management software actually subscribes the users, the above may not be needed or even work. Obviously, whatever you are doing now results in a confirmation request, but there are other ways. See the FAQ at , and/or the archived post at Or the software could just generate an input file for Mailman's bin/add_members which could be invoked either directly by the software or via a wrapper like the members.c wrapper attached to the above FAQ if necessary for permissions, or the add_members process could be just run periodically by cron. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From tim at yingtong.co.uk Tue Feb 25 18:28:29 2014 From: tim at yingtong.co.uk (Tim Walter) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 17:28:29 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription moderation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, hope I haven?t missed anything obvious. I have set subscription to need approval but when I go to the website and ?reject? a spurious subscription it reports, that an email has been sent to the address informing them of the rejection. Is it possible to configure silent rejection of subscription requests as most of those I reject are prospective spammers BW TIm From tim at yingtong.co.uk Tue Feb 25 18:27:38 2014 From: tim at yingtong.co.uk (Tim Walter) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 17:27:38 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription moderation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, hope I haven?t missed anything obvious. I have set subscription to need approval but when I go to the website and ?reject? a spurious subscription it reports, that an email has been sent to the address informing them of the rejection. Is it possible to configure silent rejection of subscription requests as most of those I reject are prospective spammers BW TIm From mark at msapiro.net Tue Feb 25 18:37:46 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 09:37:46 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription moderation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <530CD4EA.7020504@msapiro.net> On 02/25/2014 09:27 AM, Tim Walter wrote: > > I have set subscription to need approval but when I go to the website and ?reject? a spurious subscription it reports, that an email has been sent to the address informing them of the rejection. > > Is it possible to configure silent rejection of subscription requests as most of those I reject are prospective spammers If you don't want the notice to be sent, "discard" the request instead of "reject"ing it. That's the difference between "discard" and "reject". -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From tom.browder at gmail.com Tue Feb 25 22:43:55 2014 From: tom.browder at gmail.com (Tom Browder) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 16:43:55 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MM3 Test "" Hangs Message-ID: i have started investigating MM3 for my new, remote server and branched from lp:mailman, lp:postorius, and lp:hyperkitty. I started in the MM3 branch directory and followed instructions in src/mailman/docs/START.rst. I got the virtualenv ready to go and, in the local mailman branch directory, I executed: $ node2 -v All tests chug along nicely until: /usr/local/src/0-mailman3/src/mailman/rest/docs/membership.rst ... and it hangs longer than I think it should. After a the last few trace-back lines are: File "/home/virtualenvs/mm3/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/storm-0.20-py2.7-linux-i686.egg/storm/database.py", line 374, in raw_execute self._run_execution(raw_cursor, args, params, statement) File "/home/virtualenvs/mm3/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/storm-0.20-py2.7-linux-i686.egg/storm/database.py", line 388, in _run_execution self._check_disconnect(raw_cursor.execute, *args) File "/home/virtualenvs/mm3/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/storm-0.20-py2.7-linux-i686.egg/storm/database.py", line 454, in _check_disconnect return function(*args, **kwargs) sqlite3.OperationalError: database is locked Note I am running the MM3 installation, via ssh, on a remote host running Debian 7, 32-bit. (Note also postfix is running.) I have no idea what to do next, and help or ideas would be greatly appreciated. Best regards, -Tom From stephen at xemacs.org Wed Feb 26 06:45:53 2014 From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2014 14:45:53 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MM3 Test "" Hangs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <87sir6toj2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Tom Browder writes: We really appreciate your efforts to test the betas of Mailman 3. But please do be aware that although there are sites already successfully using Mailman 3 in production, the development team doesn't recommend use of any of the components (core, Postorius, HyperKitty) in production yet. > I have no idea what to do next, Nothing. :-) I've already Cc'd (and set Reply-To to) mailman-developers, which is a more appropriate place for this report. (Many Mailman-Users are not interested in MM3 yet, while Mailman-Developers are by definition, as MM2 is basically end-of-life. Also, some relevant developers may read mailman-developers more frequently than they read mailman-users.) Actually, I do have a couple of ideas. First, you should always report the whole error trace (if you think that's ugly in an email, attach it as a file). In this particular case, I suspect that the problem is in the test before the one that caused the Exception, which failed leaving the database locked. It would be very helpful to identify that test, which would probably be the *first* frame in the trace. Second, you should look in the server's logs to see if there were any errors that might have caused the incomplete transaction. > and help or ideas would be greatly appreciated. If you have no idea, then reporting to the developers is the best you can do. Use "Mailman Developers" or report via Launchpad. Pretty clearly what's happened is that some previous test locked the database (probably anything that accesses the database does so at least long enough to read the whole record), and either (1) that test failed to unlock the database, (2) the test framework failed to unlock the database, or (3) the tests were improperly sequenced in some way and the database didn't get unlocked. It's quite possible that this failure could never be replicated in actual use, as tests often mock up some component that would normally ensure that any pending transaction gets discarded and the database unlocked. Unfortunately I don't have an up-to-date test installation (it's on my list for early next week), and looking at the test file doesn't tell me anything. Perhaps Barry has an idea for a fix, or a workaround. And there's probably a way to skip that test, but I don't know nose very well. Steve Original report follows: > i have started investigating MM3 for my new, remote server and > branched from lp:mailman, lp:postorius, and lp:hyperkitty. > > I started in the MM3 branch directory and followed instructions in > src/mailman/docs/START.rst. > > I got the virtualenv ready to go and, in the local mailman branch > directory, I executed: > > $ node2 -v > > All tests chug along nicely until: > > /usr/local/src/0-mailman3/src/mailman/rest/docs/membership.rst ... > > and it hangs longer than I think it should. After a the last > few trace-back lines are: > > File "/home/virtualenvs/mm3/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/storm-0.20-py2.7-linux-i686.egg/storm/database.py", > line 374, in raw_execute > self._run_execution(raw_cursor, args, params, statement) > File "/home/virtualenvs/mm3/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/storm-0.20-py2.7-linux-i686.egg/storm/database.py", > line 388, in _run_execution > self._check_disconnect(raw_cursor.execute, *args) > File "/home/virtualenvs/mm3/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/storm-0.20-py2.7-linux-i686.egg/storm/database.py", > line 454, in _check_disconnect > return function(*args, **kwargs) > sqlite3.OperationalError: database is locked > > Note I am running the MM3 installation, via ssh, on a remote host > running Debian 7, 32-bit. (Note also postfix is running.) From tom.browder at gmail.com Wed Feb 26 12:16:22 2014 From: tom.browder at gmail.com (Tom Browder) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2014 06:16:22 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] MM3 Test "" Hangs In-Reply-To: <87sir6toj2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <87sir6toj2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Message-ID: On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:45 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > Tom Browder writes: ... > Actually, I do have a couple of ideas. First, you should always > report the whole error trace (if you think that's ugly in an email, ... Thanks, Steve, for the good advice. -Tom From tom.browder at gmail.com Wed Feb 26 12:18:16 2014 From: tom.browder at gmail.com (Tom Browder) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2014 06:18:16 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] MM3 Test "" Hangs In-Reply-To: References: <87sir6toj2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Message-ID: On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 3:13 AM, Nicolas Karageuzian wrote: > I encountered db lock using sqlite with mailman3 and tools. > Switching to postgres avoid the db locking states. > Maybe you should explore that way. I'll try that. > Hyperkitty moved to github so the lp ref is quite out of date for this > resource. I thought so--that't why I was asking for definitive, easy-to-find links on the wiki. Thanks, Nicolas. -Tom From barry at list.org Wed Feb 26 15:50:23 2014 From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2014 09:50:23 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] MM3 Test "" Hangs In-Reply-To: <87sir6toj2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <87sir6toj2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Message-ID: <20140226095023.17d985b4@limelight.wooz.org> On Feb 26, 2014, at 02:45 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > > I have no idea what to do next, This is clearly a bug, although I think it's relatively recent, so it might be worth seeing if earlier revisions avoid the problem. Yes, I can reproduce it. The interesting thing is that the test is in rest/docs/membership.rst so these are multiprocess related bugs. Typically when this happens (and it will only be with the default SQLite database, as observed by others), it's a bug in the test, not necessarily a bug in the core. Tests which involve multiple processes, as the REST tests do (i.e. the foreground testing process and a background runner process) have to be careful to release the database lock when they expect background processes to access the database. Releasing the lock means calling .commit() or .abort() at the appropriate time. The thing to keep in mind is that with Storm, even doing an operation that results in a database query opens a transaction and thus acquires the lock. In the context of membership.rst, what this probably means is that somewhere in the doctest there's a database query with a missing explicit .commit() or .abort() before the background REST runner process executes. Tracing through the doctest to find out exactly where it hangs usually helps isolate where the missing commit/abort should go. Of course, it's possible that there's a missing commit/abort in the core, but I rather doubt it, since that's pretty well tied into the REST runner's HTTP transaction machinery, and other REST tests don't exhibit the hang. Tom, if you're up for debugging it, that would be great. If not, no worries. The test suite hangs for me, so I'll find some time this weekend to take a look. -Barry From stephen at xemacs.org Wed Feb 26 17:52:58 2014 From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2014 01:52:58 +0900 Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] MM3 Test "" Hangs In-Reply-To: <20140226095023.17d985b4@limelight.wooz.org> References: <87sir6toj2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <20140226095023.17d985b4@limelight.wooz.org> Message-ID: <87bnxtu87p.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Guys, please take care to delete the mailman-users address if you're using reply-to-all on this thread. Progress on MM3 is undoubtedly of interest to MM-users, but the gory details of broken tests probably is not.... Reply-to-munging-still-considered-harmful-ly y'rs P.S. Maybe I should revive the "optimal default reply algorithm" proto-RFC? From s7r at sky-ip.org Thu Feb 27 20:01:53 2014 From: s7r at sky-ip.org (s7r) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2014 21:01:53 +0200 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman list questions about password and bounces-back for invalid emails Message-ID: <530F8BA1.6010403@sky-ip.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, I have 2 simple questions about mailman mail lists: 1). I can see there is an option to receive monthly reminder of password, and the password is sent in plain text. Is the password in plain text visible to the mail list owner / administrator? Or mailman stores a secure hash of the password like sha-256 or ripemd-160? If the password is stored in hash format, how come I can receive it monthly in plain text? 2). If an email address works for some time but becomes suddenly invalid (e.g. server down, domain cancelled, etc.) and when messages are being sent to that address they bounce back with permanent failure, will mailman remove these email addresses automatically? If yes, after how many attempts of sending? What if the email address server is just down for a day or something. Thank you! - -- s7r at sky-ip.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (MingW32) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTD4uhAAoJEIN/pSyBJlsRsKQH/ROdvGA5V8lL723yC+sP4ZZB w/DEalwQ0Em7JFnfgjG+Pzic5g+65+3vXEmG5SNXGk3IFjuo5Nlpd5N5Jdiw+62A kEr4YRTRl8jb1JxDidmiksV/Czu31kTsJmKB3YcXHCu6e3jQrXVCTJF0CD3b+yoR zWfv8RUtpY9XhEkmSk0pBJXXd2nFyLEuipkYL09VB6TGQWPMam+BWkoW+YFM6tCQ 8h8kzhvzZRSTVf7VIZ8GFYwK2T/rBZb43aXSWKSh7YKqvDxoa8RxdzGA83UK/oXQ zVpY/CiJU+hX344F1m6A5knTFcepJY8aRgXpvhOKkAuCs5Fy8m4FujIA9xIsJTM= =s8Lp -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From mike.young at nd.edu Fri Feb 28 01:02:28 2014 From: mike.young at nd.edu (mike young) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2014 19:02:28 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribe w/o confirmation? In-Reply-To: <530CD11C.8060506@msapiro.net> References: <530CD11C.8060506@msapiro.net> Message-ID: <530FD214.6060208@nd.edu> Worked like a charm. Thank you, Mark. --Mike On 2/25/2014 12:21 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote: > On 02/25/2014 06:15 AM, Michael Young wrote: >> I know why allowing subscriptions without either a confirmation email >> or a moderator approval is a Dangerous Thing, but is there a way to >> get MM to allow it? > > For user subscriptions, you need to set Privacy options... -> > Subscription rules -> subscribe_policy to None. If the None radio button > doesn't appear, you need to set > > ALLOW_OPEN_SUBSCRIBE = Yes > > in mm_cfg.py. Alternatively, you can set the list's subscribe_policy to > zero using withlist or config_list. > > >> Our list subscriptions are mostly generated by >> our lab/tool management software in response to a user getting >> qualified to use a piece of equipment, and I don't want users to have >> a choice in this case - they get subscribed, period. (They can later >> unsubscribe of course, but that means they have to actually do >> something :) > > Depending on how the lab/tool management software actually subscribes > the users, the above may not be needed or even work. Obviously, whatever > you are doing now results in a confirmation request, but there are other > ways. See the FAQ at , and/or the archived > post at > > > Or the software could just generate an input file for Mailman's > bin/add_members which could be invoked either directly by the software > or via a wrapper like the members.c wrapper attached to the above FAQ if > necessary for permissions, or the add_members process could be just run > periodically by cron. > -- Michael P. Young (574) 631-3268 (office) Nanofabrication Specialist (574) 631-4393 (fax) Department of Electrical Engineering (765) 412-6728 (cell) University of Notre Dame mike.young at nd.edu B-38 Stinson-Remick Hall Notre Dame, IN 46556-5637 From mark at msapiro.net Fri Feb 28 01:18:27 2014 From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2014 16:18:27 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman list questions about password and bounces-back for invalid emails In-Reply-To: <530F8BA1.6010403@sky-ip.org> References: <530F8BA1.6010403@sky-ip.org> Message-ID: <530FD5D3.7000508@msapiro.net> On 02/27/2014 11:01 AM, s7r wrote: > > I have 2 simple questions about mailman mail lists: > > 1). I can see there is an option to receive monthly reminder of > password, and the password is sent in plain text. Is the password in > plain text visible to the mail list owner / administrator? Or mailman > stores a secure hash of the password like sha-256 or ripemd-160? If > the password is stored in hash format, how come I can receive it > monthly in plain text? List member passwords, as opposed to list owner, list moderator and site passwords, are stored in plain text, but there is no UI for the list owner to see them. The site admins can always see them by dumping the list's config.pck file with Mailman's bin/dumpdb. > 2). If an email address works for some time but becomes suddenly > invalid (e.g. server down, domain cancelled, etc.) and when messages > are being sent to that address they bounce back with permanent > failure, will mailman remove these email addresses automatically? If > yes, after how many attempts of sending? What if the email address > server is just down for a day or something. See the list's web admin Bounce processing page for the settings that control this and their documention (ignore what it says about "soft bounces" - all failures are scored as 1.0). -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan From bsfinkel at att.net Fri Feb 28 17:11:22 2014 From: bsfinkel at att.net (Barry S. Finkel) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2014 10:11:22 -0600 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman list questions about password and bounces-back for invalid emails In-Reply-To: <530F8BA1.6010403@sky-ip.org> References: <530F8BA1.6010403@sky-ip.org> Message-ID: <5310B52A.10608@att.net> On 2/27/2014 1:01 PM, s7r wrote: > Hi, > > I have 2 simple questions about mailman mail lists: > > 1). I can see there is an option to receive monthly reminder of > password, and the password is sent in plain text. Is the password in > plain text visible to the mail list owner / administrator? Or mailman > stores a secure hash of the password like sha-256 or ripemd-160? If > the password is stored in hash format, how come I can receive it > monthly in plain text? > > > 2). If an email address works for some time but becomes suddenly > invalid (e.g. server down, domain cancelled, etc.) and when messages > are being sent to that address they bounce back with permanent > failure, will mailman remove these email addresses automatically? If > yes, after how many attempts of sending? What if the email address > server is just down for a day or something. > > Thank you! > > - -- > s7r at sky-ip.org The answer to 2) is contained in the bounce score values that have been set for the list. Each subscriber has a bounce score of 0. For each bounce, the bounce score is updated by 1, but only one bounce a day increases the score. When the score reaches the pre-set limit (default 5), the subscriber is set to NOMAIL (due to bounces). Then once per week, an e-mail is sent to the subscriber telling him/her that the list subscription has been disabled. If there is no response after the third notification, then the subscriber is unsubscribed. Only the last bounce message is sent to the list owner. The list owner controls the bounce parameters. When I was in charge of a Mailman system, I ran a bounce report every morning so that I could see all bounce scores > 0 for all lists on the server. I had lists built from external sources (i.e., an HR Database), and I needed to know what addresses in the HR Database were bad. This report came from Mark Sapiro's collection of useful Mailman programs. As for passwords, I disabled the monthly password reminders. Many of my lists were auto-subscribe lists (from HR), and the subscriber almost never needed his/her password. I do not remember a case where a subscriber needed assistance with a list password. --Barry Finkel From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk Fri Feb 28 18:21:09 2014 From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2014 17:21:09 +0000 Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman list questions about password and bounces-back for invalid emails In-Reply-To: <5310B52A.10608@att.net> References: <530F8BA1.6010403@sky-ip.org> <5310B52A.10608@att.net> Message-ID: <20140228172109.GY10820@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 10:11:22AM -0600, Barry S. Finkel wrote: > As for passwords, I disabled the monthly password reminders. > Many of my lists were auto-subscribe lists (from HR), and the > subscriber almost never needed his/her password. I do not remember > a case where a subscriber needed assistance with a list password. +1. When setting up a new Mailman (2) instance, one of the things I do is to remove that line from the crontab. If users want a password reset, they can trigger it themselves. I've never known anyone to think "oh, I had a mail on the 1st, I'll check that?". -- "How can you make good ideas sound so bad?" "I'm an engineer." -- Scott Adams