From jd-mailman-users at dybdal.dk  Sun Feb  1 00:18:17 2009
From: jd-mailman-users at dybdal.dk (Jesper Dybdal)
Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2009 00:18:17 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Patch for use of Postfix VERP support
In-Reply-To: <bfc33ad70901030729o34661b7dtd1e4f140f6faf31f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <u9atl4phttf96s6hdvn68mu6c8vpfomb6r@nuser.dybdal.dk>
	<bfc33ad70901030707i164055fbg7c45eac850578b47@mail.gmail.com>
	<r10vl4dpp5hdju60b4e9s9vp1jntsh70fj@nuser.dybdal.dk>
	<bfc33ad70901030729o34661b7dtd1e4f140f6faf31f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2sm9o45dc6k9l6bsn1ogj0uhojmlp54mv9@nuser.dybdal.dk>

On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 16:29:19 +0100, Fil <fil at rezo.net> wrote:

[About using Postfix' built-in VERP mechanism with Mailman]

>One thing to note: local addresses such as mine (fil at rezo.net is
>defined in /etc/postfix/virtual as an alias for recifs at gmail.com) will
>be VERPed to test-bounces+recifs=gmail.com and not
>test-bounces+fil=rezo.net

This has now been corrected in Postfix 2.6 Snapshot 20090125: that
version uses the orignal destination address as known by Mailman to
create the VERP'ed sender addresses.
-- 
Jesper Dybdal, Denmark.
http://www.dybdal.dk (in Danish).

From henry at dotrose.com  Sun Feb  1 04:13:15 2009
From: henry at dotrose.com (Henry Hartley)
Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 22:13:15 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Linux Preferred?
In-Reply-To: <1233200094.6681.9.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <497ECE34.1AD2.00BD.0@ccs135.com>
	<1233200094.6681.9.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <4985134B.2070605@dotrose.com>

On Tue, 2009-01-27 at 09:07 -0600, Tim Ferguson wrote:
 > Is there a preferred flavor of Linux that Mailman seems to work and
 > install the best with?  I'm trying Ubuntu, but the apt-get feature is
 > getting hung up on trying to find the repositories and can't, so,
 > until I get that fixed I just thought I'd ask.

At the risk of being different... I run a number of small lists on 
CentOS 5 (based on Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5) and it just worked out of 
the box. It's not bleeding edge but then I get security patches into 2014.

-- 
Henry

From vish.vishvanath at gmail.com  Sun Feb  1 03:44:47 2009
From: vish.vishvanath at gmail.com (Vish Vishvanath)
Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 02:44:47 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Custom key/values in auto-responses
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200901310756120796803b89e8@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200901310756120796803b89e8@msapiro>
Message-ID: <68B95C5E-8093-44FC-90BA-6D03250FCF49@gmail.com>

Thanks Mark for pointing me in the right direction, I'll see what I  
can manage. :)

Vish


On 31 Jan 2009, at 15:56, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> Vish Vishvanath wrote:
>>
>> Running my second install of Mailman, going well, v 2.1.11 on BSD  
>> 7.0,
>> and wondering how to add custom key into welcome messages.
>> Essentially, I need to add a download link into the welcome emailer,
>> but it needs to have the email of the recipient inserted into it -
>> it's a one-time expiring download thank you (of my photographs,
>> actually.)
>
>
> The welcome message is built from the subscribeack.txt template which
> can be edited via the web admin "Edit the public HTML pages and text
> files" link or according to the information in the FAQ at
> <http://wiki.list.org/x/jYA9>.
>
> Normally, the only replacements available for a template without
> modifying the code that uses it are the ones used in the base
> template, but in this case, there is an additional %(user)s
> replacement available which will receive the user's email address.
>
> If you actually wanted to add a custom key/value for this template,
> you'd have to modify the code in the definition of the
> SendSubscribeAck() method in Mailman/Deliverer.py.
>
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb  1 16:34:50 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 07:34:50 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman url points to localhost after ProxyPass
In-Reply-To: <20090131225927.GJ4966@dixongroup.net>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902010734500718d82eb700@msapiro>

Jason Dixon wrote:
>
>So if I load http://www.dixongroup.net/mailman/admin/, it gives me
>results for lists on 127.0.0.1 instead of the hostname.  But all of the
>lists themselves work fine.  And list_lists reports everything correctly
>as you'd expect.
>
>Has anyone overcome this?  Obviously, the desired effect would be that
>Mailman uses HTTP_HOST.  I've messed around with UseCanonicalName on
>both Apache instances but could not get the desired effect.  Any
>suggestions are greatly appreciated.


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/lYA9> for background on this.

Mailman does use HTTP_HOST and falls back to SERVER_NAME if HTTP_HOST
is not set in the environment. How are these set in the environment
passed to the Mailman CGIs?

You can show all lists regardless of host by setting

VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW = Off

in mm_cfg.py.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb  1 16:58:23 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 07:58:23 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Authorization problem
In-Reply-To: <49846069020000BD00014120@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902010758230546d59323b9@msapiro>

Tim Ferguson wrote:

>I've just set up our first Mailman and when trying to create a new mailing list, other than the initial list, I'm receiving the message: Error: You are not authorized to create new mailing lists
>I'm stumped as the only password I've entered so far is the site administrator's password.  Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.


There have been reports like this before, but I'm not sure what the
issue is.

If the password has leading or trailing whitespace, it won't work
because leading and trailing whitespace is stripped from the provided
password before validation.

If that isn't the issue, the web browser or web server must be munging
the CGI data somehow.

As a diagnostic measure, you could find the lines:

    if not ok:
        request_creation(
            doc, cgidata,
            _('You are not authorized to create new mailing lists'))
        return

in Mailman/Cgi/create.py and change the 4th line so they become
something like

    if not ok:
        request_creation(
            doc, cgidata,
            _('Bad password ->%(auth)s<-'))
        return

to see what the create script is seeing for the password (%(auth)s will
be replaced by the password in the error message).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From hansen at rc.org  Mon Feb  2 06:00:08 2009
From: hansen at rc.org (Allan Hansen)
Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 21:00:08 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman crash during global address change
Message-ID: <p06240823c5ac26f61577@[10.0.1.5]>

Dear list developers,

A crash happened when a subscriber attempted to change his address with 'Apply Globaly' check box set.
His subscriptions before the crash was:

List1: old at address.com
List2: new at address.com

The crash happened the moment he attempted to confirm the change on the given web page. He was trying to change the address for List1 from old at address.com to new at address.com.

I had him do the same thing again both with and without setting the 'Apply Globally' box. When the check was set, the crash happened again. When he did not check it, the address change did happen without a crash.

How it possibly can get to this error is beyond me. His new address did not appear in List1 and his old address did not appear in List2 (I checked before I asked him to repeat).

I've detected no adverse effects from this crash, so this message is for your information only. I searched the archives for MMAlreadyAMember, but did not find anything useful.

Thanks,

	Allan

Setup:

Mailman 2.1.9 on Intel iMac  2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo with OS X Server 10.5.6


Traceback:

Feb 01 12:01:43 2009 admin(14357): @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ 
admin(14357): [----- Mailman Version: 2.1.9 -----] 
admin(14357): [----- Traceback ------] 
admin(14357): Traceback (most recent call last):
admin(14357):   File "/usr/share/mailman/scripts/driver", line 101, in run_main
admin(14357):     main()
admin(14357):   File "/BinaryCache/mailman/mailman-126.1~4/Root/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/confirm.py", line 138, in main
admin(14357):   File "/BinaryCache/mailman/mailman-126.1~4/Root/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/confirm.py", line 521, in addrchange_confirm
admin(14357):   File "/BinaryCache/mailman/mailman-126.1~4/Root/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1217, in ProcessConfirmation
admin(14357):   File "/BinaryCache/mailman/mailman-126.1~4/Root/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1150, in ApprovedChangeMemberAddress
admin(14357):   File "/BinaryCache/mailman/mailman-126.1~4/Root/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 251, in changeMemberAddress
admin(14357):   File "/BinaryCache/mailman/mailman-126.1~4/Root/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 175, in addNewMember
admin(14357): MMAlreadyAMember: new at address.com
admin(14357): [----- Python Information -----] 
admin(14357): sys.version     =   2.5.1 (r251:54863, Apr 15 2008, 22:57:26) 
[GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Inc. build 5465)] 
admin(14357): sys.executable  =   /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/Resources/Python.app/Contents/MacOS/Python 
admin(14357): sys.prefix      =   /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5 
admin(14357): sys.exec_prefix =   /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5 
admin(14357): sys.path        =   /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5 
admin(14357): sys.platform    =   darwin 

Allan
-- 
Allan Hansen
P.O Box 2423
Cypress, CA 90630
U.S.A.
hansen at rc.org
+1-714-875-8870

From kirk at strauser.com  Sun Feb  1 16:59:21 2009
From: kirk at strauser.com (Kirk Strauser)
Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 09:59:21 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] I'm getting all password reminder bounces
Message-ID: <5FB3E7CE-AA6F-44EB-9E42-6B97C9BB884C@strauser.com>

I'm using Mailman 2.1.11 with Postfix 2.5.6 on FreeBSD 7.1.  Each  
month (roughly since upgrading from 2.1.10), I've been getting all of  
the monthly password reminder bounce messages in my own inbox.  I've  
set VERP_PASSWORD_REMINDERS = Yes in mm_cfg.py, and confirmed that the  
bounces are coming into Mailman and then being re-sent to me.  Example  
headers:

Received: from kanga.honeypot.net (localhost [IPv6:::1])
	by kanga.honeypot.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3C663BABC
	for <kirk at strauser.com>; Sun,  1 Feb 2009 05:07:14 -0600 (CST)
X-Original-To: mailman-bounces+andrew.may=rcp.co.uk at kanga.honeypot.net
Delivered-To: mailman-bounces+andrew.may=rcp.co.uk at kanga.honeypot.net
Received: by kanga.honeypot.net (Postfix)
	id 485F23BABB; Sun,  1 Feb 2009 05:07:13 -0600 (CST)
Date: Sun,  1 Feb 2009 05:07:13 -0600 (CST)
From: MAILER-DAEMON at kanga.honeypot.net (Mail Delivery System)
Subject: Undelivered Mail Returned to Sender
To: mailman-bounces+foo=example.com at kanga.honeypot.net

At this point, I really don't know what else to look at.  I don't have  
so many users that I can't manually unsubscribe them, but I'd *much*  
prefer to let Mailman handle it.  What debugging or config or other  
information can I provide?
-- 
Kirk Strauser





From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb  2 17:08:03 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:08:03 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] I'm getting all password reminder bounces
In-Reply-To: <5FB3E7CE-AA6F-44EB-9E42-6B97C9BB884C@strauser.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902020808030234ca9a296d@msapiro>

Kirk Strauser wrote:

>I'm using Mailman 2.1.11 with Postfix 2.5.6 on FreeBSD 7.1.  Each  
>month (roughly since upgrading from 2.1.10), I've been getting all of  
>the monthly password reminder bounce messages in my own inbox.  I've  
>set VERP_PASSWORD_REMINDERS = Yes in mm_cfg.py, and confirmed that the  
>bounces are coming into Mailman and then being re-sent to me.


Right. That changed in 2.1.11.


>At this point, I really don't know what else to look at.  I don't have  
>so many users that I can't manually unsubscribe them, but I'd *much*  
>prefer to let Mailman handle it.  What debugging or config or other  
>information can I provide?


The problem is password reminders are sent from the site list. This is
the case because the reminder is for all lists in the domain, not for
a single list.

In the past, the bounce would return to the site list -bounces address
where it would be ignored because the bouncing address was not a
member of the site list.

There were also other issues relating to bounces of list owner
notifications sent from the site list.

Thus, handling of site list bounces changed in 2.1.10 and again in
2.1.11 and now all site list bounces are just sent to the site list
owner.

Regarding password reminders, assuming bounce processing is set
appropriately for the regular lists, what happens is a list member
sets delivery off and ultimately forgets about the list. Then the
member address dies and the monthly password reminder bounces. In the
past, this bounce was effectively ignored, and the reminders continued
to be sent and bounce forever.

Now, at least you see the bounces and the appropriate thing to do is
manually remove them from the list(s) or turn on their list delivery
so the list's bounce processing will remove them. Once you do this for
the initial batch you see after upgrading to 2.1.11+, you will see
very few going forward.

For more information, read the blocks of comments in the definitions of
the __init__() and _dispose() methods in Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb  2 19:05:28 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:05:28 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman crash during global address change
In-Reply-To: <p06240823c5ac26f61577@[10.0.1.5]>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020210052803596ecb8ec3@msapiro>

Allan Hansen wrote:
>
>A crash happened when a subscriber attempted to change his address with 'Apply Globaly' check box set.
>His subscriptions before the crash was:
>
>List1: old at address.com
>List2: new at address.com


This is a bug that was fixed in Mailman 2.1.10.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu  Mon Feb  2 20:57:52 2009
From: Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu (Gary Moore)
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2009 14:57:52 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
Message-ID: <498709F00200006C00015B0A@GW15.hofstra.edu>

My apologies if this has been on the list before.  I have a mailman listserv that I have setup to digest.  The messages are forwarded from our blog to a general resource account which sends them out to the listserv.  When the digest is sent out (see attached), each of the digested messages has a "message scrubbed".  How can I solve this problem.  Thanks in advance.

Gary Moore, CISSP
Assistant Dean for Information Systems
Hofstra University School of Law
Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu
(516) 463-6067

"Bernie would wear colors that crayons 
hadn't even thought of yet.."

D.L Hughley speaking on how he and 
others eagerly awaited the late Bernie Mac's 
stage attire each night.
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From jason at dixongroup.net  Mon Feb  2 17:58:51 2009
From: jason at dixongroup.net (Jason Dixon)
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 11:58:51 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman url points to localhost after ProxyPass
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902010734500718d82eb700@msapiro>
References: <20090131225927.GJ4966@dixongroup.net>
	<PC1870200902010734500718d82eb700@msapiro>
Message-ID: <20090202165851.GP4966@dixongroup.net>

On Sun, Feb 01, 2009 at 07:34:50AM -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Jason Dixon wrote:
> >
> >So if I load http://www.dixongroup.net/mailman/admin/, it gives me
> >results for lists on 127.0.0.1 instead of the hostname.  But all of the
> >lists themselves work fine.  And list_lists reports everything correctly
> >as you'd expect.
> >
> >Has anyone overcome this?  Obviously, the desired effect would be that
> >Mailman uses HTTP_HOST.  I've messed around with UseCanonicalName on
> >both Apache instances but could not get the desired effect.  Any
> >suggestions are greatly appreciated.
> 
> See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/lYA9> for background on this.
> 
> Mailman does use HTTP_HOST and falls back to SERVER_NAME if HTTP_HOST
> is not set in the environment. How are these set in the environment
> passed to the Mailman CGIs?
> 
> You can show all lists regardless of host by setting
> 
> VIRTUAL_HOST_OVERVIEW = Off
> 
> in mm_cfg.py.

I worked around this issue by adding /etc/hosts into the Apache-1.3
chroot and adding the desired hostnames to 127.0.0.1.  I then pointed
the ProxyPass to the host instead of 127.0.0.1.  It works fine and I've
seen no regressions on the rest of the sites sharing the same domain.

Thanks,

-- 
Jason Dixon
DixonGroup Consulting
http://www.dixongroup.net/

From jmciver at lmtribune.com  Tue Feb  3 00:49:31 2009
From: jmciver at lmtribune.com (Jim McIver)
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2009 15:49:31 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman mod list
Message-ID: <4987868B.7020707@lmtribune.com>

I'm a newbie and have just had mailman 2.1 running on Freebsd with 
postfix for a couple of days.

I've found a mod.py that will show users in a list that have the 
moderator bit set.

# mod.py

from Mailman import mm_cfg
import sys

def mod(list):
    for member in list.getMembers():
        if list.getMemberOption(member, mm_cfg.Moderate):
            print member, "is moderated"


How can I modify this to show users "don't" have the moderator bit set?
Search FAQ...no luck.

Regards,
-jm

From lists at mrnaz.com  Tue Feb  3 02:53:01 2009
From: lists at mrnaz.com (Naz)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 12:53:01 +1100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support?
Message-ID: <4987A37D.2000304@mrnaz.com>

I want to set up a mailman site, but I already have a fairly complex 
mail system with one machine handling multiple domains. I am finding it 
a little difficult, as I don't have a huge amount of experience with 
email system admin in general, so would like to ask if anyone knows of a 
company offering commercial mailman support. Alternatively, are there 
any members of the community with experience in this who would like a 
little extra work on the side.

We don't need a huge amount done, basically just setting up a standard 
set of mailing lists, and providing a bit of hand holding. Ordinarily, I 
don't mind RTFMing, but I don't have the time to take off and 
familiarise myself with all the ins and outs of this.

Regards,
- Naz.

-- 
?????? ?????

Web:  www.mrnaz.com
Ph:   +61 400 460 662


From Tlf1 at ccs135.com  Mon Feb  2 14:54:49 2009
From: Tlf1 at ccs135.com (Tim Ferguson)
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2009 07:54:49 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Disallowing Posts
Message-ID: <4986A6C9020000BD00014150@ccs135.com>

Although I could quite possibly overlooked it, is there a way to make a list to where only one person, say the moderator(s), list admin or site admin and post anything to the list?  We like to set up a list for parents to sign up for to receive special notices from school but that they can not reply to OR actually send posts to themselves?  Seems as though I've located an option pretty well for everything else except a "receive-only" mode, but then I'm known to not be able to see the trees for the forest, etc.
 
Thanks!
 
Tim
 
 
 
Tim Ferguson
Director of Technology
Centralia City Schools
Centralia, Illinois 62801
618-532-1907, Ext. 1030
 

From wirelesssilver at gmail.com  Mon Feb  2 11:27:41 2009
From: wirelesssilver at gmail.com (niel mc)
Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 18:27:41 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Need Help
Message-ID: <52ed605c0902020227m4f03cb20j18241fe54a916693@mail.gmail.com>

Hello

Good Evening

I need help on my Mailman server.
My Mailman server is operational and I am using it.
Then I created another Mailman server of a separate computer, so that makes
I have 2 Mailman servers.
I need to migrate the mailing list of my old Mailman server to my new
Mailman server.

Question#1: Is it possible to merge or sync the Mailman mailing list from my
old Mailman server to my new one?
Question#2: If yes, what process or commands that i should execute in order
to do this?

Question#3: Would it be possible that there will be no Mailman interruptions
with merge or sync my Mailing list
                   from my old Mailman server to new one?


I will appreciate any help that I can get from you guys.


Thanks,
Niel

From stephen at xemacs.org  Tue Feb  3 09:47:38 2009
From: stephen at xemacs.org (Stephen J. Turnbull)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 17:47:38 +0900
Subject: [Mailman-Users]  Disallowing Posts
In-Reply-To: <4986A6C9020000BD00014150@ccs135.com>
References: <4986A6C9020000BD00014150@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <877i47hpp1.fsf@xemacs.org>

Tim Ferguson writes:

 > Although I could quite possibly overlooked it, is there a way to
 > make a list to where only one person, say the moderator(s), list
 > admin or site admin and post anything to the list?

Check the FAQ for "announcement list" (or maybe "announce-only" or the
like).

From brian at emwd.com  Tue Feb  3 13:25:48 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 07:25:48 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support?
In-Reply-To: <4987A37D.2000304@mrnaz.com>
References: <4987A37D.2000304@mrnaz.com>
Message-ID: <00bf01c985fa$8d2d3c40$a787b4c0$@com>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: mailman-users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org [mailto:mailman-
> users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Naz
> Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 8:53 PM
> To: mailman-users at python.org
> Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support?
> 
> I want to set up a mailman site, but I already have a fairly complex
> mail system with one machine handling multiple domains. I am finding it
> a little difficult, as I don't have a huge amount of experience with
> email system admin in general, so would like to ask if anyone knows of
> a
> company offering commercial mailman support. Alternatively, are there
> any members of the community with experience in this who would like a
> little extra work on the side.
> 
> 
> Regards,
> - Naz.
> 

Hi Naz:

My company has been offering Mailman services for about 8 years now. Please contact me off list for more information. You can view more detail about our Mailman service at http://www.emwd.com/mailman.html.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"



From faisalanif at hotmail.com  Tue Feb  3 13:53:53 2009
From: faisalanif at hotmail.com (faisal anif)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 14:53:53 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
Message-ID: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>


Dear mailman users..
 
we make class "A" mail servers that will guarantee the delivery of yor messages DIRECTLY to hotmail, yahoo, gmail and all other mail services.. no more messages stuck in the queue because the remote mail servers refuses your mail ..  
 
no matter how big your list is .. we guarantee its immediate delivery ..
 
Note: to avoid spammers.. mass mailing is not allowed directly, there are steps that has to be done first to validate your lists.. we will watch your activities like a hawk, so spammers don't even think of trying..
 
our prices are very cheap also ..
 
reply to my address if interested ..
 
Thanks..
 
 

_________________________________________________________________
Show them the way! Add maps and directions to your party invites. 
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/events.aspx

From brad at python.org  Tue Feb  3 16:29:16 2009
From: brad at python.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 09:29:16 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <498862CC.3070501@python.org>

faisal anif wrote:

> we make class "A" mail servers that will guarantee the delivery of yor
> messages DIRECTLY to hotmail, yahoo, gmail and all other mail services..
> no more messages stuck in the queue because the remote mail servers
> refuses your mail ..
> 
> no matter how big your list is .. we guarantee its immediate delivery ..

Congratulations.  You just got yourself banned from the list because you 
spammed us.

-- 
Brad Knowles <brad at python.org>
Member of the Python.org Postmaster Team & Co-Moderator of the
mailman-users and mailman-developers mailing lists

From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 16:38:07 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 09:38:07 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <498709F00200006C00015B0A@GW15.hofstra.edu>
References: <498709F00200006C00015B0A@GW15.hofstra.edu>
Message-ID: <498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/02/09 13:57, Gary Moore wrote:
> My apologies if this has been on the list before.  I have a mailman 
> listserv that I have setup to digest.  The messages are forwarded 
> from our blog to a general resource account which sends them out to 
> the listserv.  When the digest is sent out (see attached), each of 
> the digested messages has a "message scrubbed".  How can I solve this 
> problem.  Thanks in advance.

I'm just guessing here, but I'm betting that you are sending your digest 
out with the actual messages as MIME attachments rather than textual 
copy in a new message.  (Note:  I think this is a good thing, so keep it 
up.)

However I'm betting that Mailman is seeing the individual messages as 
attachments and is scrubbing them because it does not know about the 
MIME type, or more likely it is not an allowed MIME type.

Go to Content Filtering -> pass_mime_types and make sure that 
multipart/digest, message/rfc822 and possibly text/rfc822-headers are 
included in the list.  message/rfc822 is the standard attachment like 
you would receive if I forwarded a message to you (as an attachment).

(Please refer to section 5.1.5 of RFC 2046 for more information.)

I don't know if this will solve your problem or not, but at least it's a 
direction to look in to.

Please let us know if this solves the problem as if it does, I propose 
that multipart/digest and message/rfc822 get added to the default 
allowed MIME types.



Grant. . . .

From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 16:43:23 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 09:43:23 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Disallowing Posts
In-Reply-To: <4986A6C9020000BD00014150@ccs135.com>
References: <4986A6C9020000BD00014150@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <4988661B.7050109@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/02/09 07:54, Tim Ferguson wrote:
> Although I could quite possibly overlooked it, is there a way to make 
> a list to where only one person, say the moderator(s), list admin or 
> site admin and post anything to the list?  We like to set up a list 
> for parents to sign up for to receive special notices from school but 
> that they can not reply to OR actually send posts to themselves? 
>  Seems as though I've located an option pretty well for everything 
> else except a "receive-only" mode, but then I'm known to not be able 
> to see the trees for the forest, etc.

Yes what you are wanting to do can be done.  I believe Stephen has 
already answered as to the "How".

However I would recommend that /not/ configure your mailing list so that 
""parents (subscribers) reply back to them selves.  Rather I would 
strongly suggest that you send replies back to a public positional 
address (info@ / parents@ / pta@ / etc.) that is used for general 
contact at the school.  That way ""parents (subscribers) can 
conveniently reply and have their replies directed somewhere that is 
capable of correctly handling their reply.  I have found this to be a 
good P.R. move for the clients that I have set it up for.



Grant. . . .

From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 16:48:12 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 09:48:12 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <498862CC.3070501@python.org>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>
	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>
Message-ID: <4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 09:29, Brad Knowles wrote:
> Congratulations.  You just got yourself banned from the list because you 
> spammed us.

*Chuckle*

Hat's off to you Brad.  :)



Grant. . . .

From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk  Tue Feb  3 16:53:48 2009
From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:53:48 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>
	<498862CC.3070501@python.org> <4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>

On Tue, Feb 03, 2009 at 09:48:12AM -0600, Grant Taylor wrote:
> On 02/03/09 09:29, Brad Knowles wrote:
> >Congratulations.  You just got yourself banned from the list because you 
> >spammed us.
> 
> *Chuckle*

It was sending from an hotmail address that amused me, given the rest of
the content.

-- 
``I wouldn't call Civil Service delays `tactics', Minister,'' he replied
  smoothly. ``That would be to mistake lethargy for strategy.''
  (Humphrey Appleby, from `Yes, Minister', Jonathan Lynn and Anthony Jay)

From brian at emwd.com  Tue Feb  3 17:21:22 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 11:21:22 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>
	<4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>
	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>
Message-ID: <012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: mailman-users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org [mailto:mailman-
> users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Adam McGreggor
> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 10:54 AM
> To: Grant Taylor
> Cc: Mail List - Mailman
> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
> 
> On Tue, Feb 03, 2009 at 09:48:12AM -0600, Grant Taylor wrote:
> > On 02/03/09 09:29, Brad Knowles wrote:
> > >Congratulations.  You just got yourself banned from the list because
> you
> > >spammed us.
> >
> > *Chuckle*
> 
> It was sending from an hotmail address that amused me, given the rest
> of
> the content.
> 

Same here. He has also been active on a number of hosting forums posting the
same message.


Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 17:32:56 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 10:32:56 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <4988221A.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>
References: <498709F00200006C00015B0A@GW15.hofstra.edu>
	<498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net>
	<4988221A.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>
Message-ID: <498871B8.7080002@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 09:53, Gary Moore wrote:
> Thanks for the response, I will take a look at the setting on that. 
>  And yes, I will let gladly let everyone know if that solves the 
> problem.

You are welcome, and thank you.

> And I apologize to all of you for the mea culpa yesterday in not 
> saying "mailing list".  I first used that other mailing list software 
> 20 years ago and the term has unfortunately never left my brain.

Ah, so "mailing list" is for you, much like "group ware" is for me.  No 
harm, no foul.



Grant. . . .

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb  3 18:27:16 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 09:27:16 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020309271602659244d259@msapiro>

Grant Taylor wrote:

>On 02/02/09 13:57, Gary Moore wrote:
>> My apologies if this has been on the list before.  I have a mailman 
>> listserv that I have setup to digest.  The messages are forwarded 
>> from our blog to a general resource account which sends them out to 
>> the listserv.  When the digest is sent out (see attached), each of 
>> the digested messages has a "message scrubbed".  How can I solve this 
>> problem.  Thanks in advance.
>
>I'm just guessing here, but I'm betting that you are sending your digest 
>out with the actual messages as MIME attachments rather than textual 
>copy in a new message.  (Note:  I think this is a good thing, so keep it 
>up.)


Yes, that appears to be the issue. The Blog is forwarding the message
to the list as a message/rfc822 part.


>However I'm betting that Mailman is seeing the individual messages as 
>attachments and is scrubbing them because it does not know about the 
>MIME type, or more likely it is not an allowed MIME type.


No. Scrubber is scrubbing the attachments (saving them aside, not
discarding them) because they are not text/plain. and scrubber is
trying to make a flat text/plain message for the 'plain' digest, so it
moves aside any non-text/plain parts.


>Go to Content Filtering -> pass_mime_types and make sure that 
>multipart/digest, message/rfc822 and possibly text/rfc822-headers are 
>included in the list.  message/rfc822 is the standard attachment like 
>you would receive if I forwarded a message to you (as an attachment).
>
>(Please refer to section 5.1.5 of RFC 2046 for more information.)
>
>I don't know if this will solve your problem or not, but at least it's a 
>direction to look in to.


I suspect that content filtering is off here. Content filtering is not
the issue. It is neither helping nor hindering in this case.

A possible solution is to set everyone to receive MIME digests rather
than plain. Depending on the user's MUA's, some will like this better
anyway.

Under Digest options set "When receiving digests, which format is
default?" to MIME and then go through the membership list and uncheck
'plain' for the current members.

The MIME format digest is not scrubbed.


>Please let us know if this solves the problem as if it does, I propose 
>that multipart/digest and message/rfc822 get added to the default 
>allowed MIME types.


As I said. it's not a content filtering issue. If message/rfc822 parts
were being filtered, they wouldn't be there to be scrubbed for the
digest.

message/rfc822 and multipart/digest are not among the defaults for
pass_mime_types. Arguably, message/rfc822 should be, but there are
people who don't want 'attached messages' on their lists.

I definitely don't think multipart/digest should be in the defaults
even though my own mm_cfg.py contains

DEFAULT_PASS_MIME_TYPES = ['multipart',
                           'message/rfc822',
                           'text/plain']

I really don't want people posting entire digests to my lists.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb  3 18:41:06 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 09:41:06 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman mod list
In-Reply-To: <4987868B.7020707@lmtribune.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902030941060015748027d5@msapiro>

Jim McIver wrote:
>
>I've found a mod.py that will show users in a list that have the 
>moderator bit set.
>
># mod.py
>
>from Mailman import mm_cfg
>import sys
>
>def mod(list):
>    for member in list.getMembers():
>        if list.getMemberOption(member, mm_cfg.Moderate):
>            print member, "is moderated"
>
>
>How can I modify this to show users "don't" have the moderator bit set?
>Search FAQ...no luck.


First, I hope you realize that this is a 'withlist' script to be run
via bin/withlist.

To make it show unmoderated members, insert the word not in the
condition and the message

        if not list.getMemberOption(member, mm_cfg.Moderate):
            print member, "is not moderated"

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jbernier at risd.edu  Tue Feb  3 19:15:47 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 13:15:47 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving a List
Message-ID: <s9884396.070@risd.edu>

Mark and others,
 
Thank you very much for your help with this. I have just one more question...
 
The source Mailman for my list to be moved is version 2.1.5. The destination Mailman is version 2.1.9. Is there anything I need to take into consideration with my move?
-Jeff

>>> On 1/30/2009 at 11:47 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
Jeff Bernier wrote:

>I am retiring an older system running Mailman, and I would like to move one of its lists to our shiny new server. I have seen instructions posted for moving all lists from one system to another, but I want to move just one list to the new server already running other lists.
> 
>Can someone tell me how this is done? I have no real experience working with Mailman... so go easy on me.


To move a Mailman 2.1.x list from ones server to another running the
same or later Mailman, move the lists/LISTNAME/config.pck file to the
new server. Create the lists/LISTNAME/ directory with the same
ownership and permissions as the other lists/* directories. Run

  bin/withlist -l -r fix_url LISTNAME

to fix the host_name and web_page_url of the list for the new server.

Move the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox file from the old
server. Create the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/ directory with the
same ownership and permissions as the other archives/private/*.mbox/
directories. Run

  bin/.arch --wipe LISTNAME

to build the pipermail archive.

This assumes you have no held messages or pending requests for the list
on the old server. If you do have these, it is best to deal with them
on the old server before moving.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb  3 19:20:06 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 10:20:06 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Need Help
In-Reply-To: <52ed605c0902020227m4f03cb20j18241fe54a916693@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902031020060859ba93bd61@msapiro>

niel mc wrote:
>
>I need help on my Mailman server.
>My Mailman server is operational and I am using it.
>Then I created another Mailman server of a separate computer, so that makes
>I have 2 Mailman servers.
>I need to migrate the mailing list of my old Mailman server to my new
>Mailman server.
>
>Question#1: Is it possible to merge or sync the Mailman mailing list from my
>old Mailman server to my new one?


If you mean move list1, list2, etc. from the old server to the new
server which hosts lista, listb, etc. so that all lists are now hosted
on the new server, then yes, it can be done fairly easily.

If you mean combine list1 on the old server with list1 on the new
server so that list1 on the new server then has membership and
archives equal to the union of the separate lists, then it is much
more difficult.


>Question#2: If yes, what process or commands that i should execute in order
>to do this?


It depends on which scenario you are trying to accomplish.


>Question#3: Would it be possible that there will be no Mailman interruptions
>with merge or sync my Mailing list
>                   from my old Mailman server to new one?


Again, it depends on which scenario, but in any case, it is not
possible to do completely safely without some down time.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 19:38:46 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 12:38:46 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020309271602659244d259@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009020309271602659244d259@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49888F36.8060703@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 11:27, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Yes, that appears to be the issue. The Blog is forwarding the message 
> to the list as a message/rfc822 part.

*nod*

> I suspect that content filtering is off here. Content filtering is not 
> the issue. It is neither helping nor hindering in this case.

Ok...  I did not know where the proper place to add the additional MIME 
types was.  Seeing as that was the only place that I saw to set allowed 
MIME types / sub-parts, I said there.  Apparently though I had the 
correct idea I had the incorrect location.

> As I said. it's not a content filtering issue. If message/rfc822 parts 
> were being filtered, they wouldn't be there to be scrubbed for the 
> digest.

*nod*  See above.

> message/rfc822 and multipart/digest are not among the defaults for 
> pass_mime_types. Arguably, message/rfc822 should be, but there are 
> people who don't want 'attached messages' on their lists.

I can see both sides of this.

Question:  If a message is passed as a message/rfc822 attachment, what 
happens to it's MIME sub-parts?  Are they filtered too?

> I definitely don't think multipart/digest should be in the defaults 
> even though my own mm_cfg.py contains

> I really don't want people posting entire digests to my lists.

Good point.



Grant. . . .

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb  3 19:48:43 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 10:48:43 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving a List
In-Reply-To: <s9884396.070@risd.edu>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020310484306876a4fb39a@msapiro>

Jeff Bernier wrote:
> 
>Thank you very much for your help with this. I have just one more question...
> 
>The source Mailman for my list to be moved is version 2.1.5. The destination Mailman is version 2.1.9. Is there anything I need to take into consideration with my move?


You will note I said:

>>>> On 1/30/2009 at 11:47 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
>
>To move a Mailman 2.1.x list from ones server to another running the
>same or later Mailman...


There is no problem moving a 2.1.5 config.pck file to a 2.1.9
installation. Mailman will detect that the list config is 'old' and do
the appropriate conversion the first time the list is accessed.

This is also true with moving 2.0.x and even older lists, but there are
some caveats because the file is config.db rather than config.pck.
Basically, if you first create the list on the new host and then move
the config.pck, it will still work, but if you try that with a
config.db, it won't. When you move the config.db, you also have to
remove any existing config.pck or the config.db won't be seen. Then
after the config.db is converted to a new config.pck, the config.db
should be removed.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From fil at rezo.net  Tue Feb  3 20:13:51 2009
From: fil at rezo.net (Fil)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 20:13:51 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>
	<498862CC.3070501@python.org> <4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>
	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>
	<012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>
Message-ID: <bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>

Spam apart, does such a service exist?  A mail relay that works with
major email providers to have the best delivery rates?

-- Fil

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb  3 20:13:58 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 11:13:58 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <49888F36.8060703@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <PC187020090203111358056298c30b6c@msapiro>

Grant Taylor wrote:
>
>Question:  If a message is passed as a message/rfc822 attachment, what 
>happens to it's MIME sub-parts?  Are they filtered too?


Yes. Content filtering works recursively. If any content type part is
filtered, it is removed along with all its sub-parts. If a content
type part is not filtered, we recursively examine its sub-parts to see
if they should pe passed or filtered.

Thus, the intent of my

DEFAULT_PASS_MIME_TYPES = ['multipart',
                           'message/rfc822',
                           'text/plain']

is to accept only text/plain parts, but to accept them no matter how
deeply they may be nested in the original MIME structure. Content
filtering will leave higer level multipart/* and message/rfc822 parts
in the message, but only those which ultimately contain a text/plain
part.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 20:13:17 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 13:13:17 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>
	<4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>	<012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>
	<bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4988974D.9040705@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 13:13, Fil wrote:
> Spam apart, does such a service exist?  A mail relay that works with 
> major email providers to have the best delivery rates?

I believe there are indeed some services that utilize things like 
eStamps where a nominal fee per email is payed to help ensure that the 
message that you are sending is not spam.  Usually such service 
providers have agreements with large email providers indicating that 
they will heavily scrutinize their subscriber base and partially vouch 
for them that they will never send spam more than once, if that before 
they are no longer a subscriber.

So in a way this is sort of like a notary in such as there is a 3rd 
party vouching (if you will) for the sender.



Grant. . . .

From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 20:15:46 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 13:15:46 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090203111358056298c30b6c@msapiro>
References: <PC187020090203111358056298c30b6c@msapiro>
Message-ID: <498897E2.60508@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 13:13, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> is to accept only text/plain parts, but to accept them no matter how
> deeply they may be nested in the original MIME structure. Content
> filtering will leave higer level multipart/* and message/rfc822 parts
> in the message, but only those which ultimately contain a text/plain
> part.

*nod*

So basically any and all parts that are passed through (and not 
scrubbed) have to be in the DEFAULT_PASS_MIME_TYPES list.  If the 
part(s) in question, no matter where they are in the message, are not in 
the list they are scrubbed.



Grant. . . .

From brad at shub-internet.org  Tue Feb  3 20:55:21 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 13:55:21 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>
	<4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>	<012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>
	<bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4988A129.1080900@shub-internet.org>

Fil wrote:

> Spam apart, does such a service exist?  A mail relay that works with
> major email providers to have the best delivery rates?

If you sign up for service with a company like ReturnPath, they have a whole 
list of guidelines that you need to follow in order to be on their 
SenderScoreCertified list.  They also have partnerships with a number of 
large providers, so that anyone on the SenderScoreCertified list gets a big 
improvement in their "spam" score, and thus you are much more likely to be 
able to get through the spam filters to the recipients.

People can still complain about you, you continue to use the existing 
services that you already have, and there aren't any guarantees as to how 
many people you will be able to reach.  However, you will need to stay on 
your toes to keep your lists ultra-clean, otherwise you will have more 
problems than you know what to do with.


Any e-mail service provider that claims to give you guarantees of 
deliverability, etc... are just blowing smoke up your ... nether regions. 
That's a get-rich-quick scheme of the spammers.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From jbernier at risd.edu  Tue Feb  3 21:13:18 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 15:13:18 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving a List
Message-ID: <s9885f32.063@risd.edu>

Mark,
 
I moved my list following instructions you posted to me on 30 Jan. After the move, I attempted to log in as list admin, and received the following:
Bug in Mailman version 2.1.9
We're sorry, we hit a bug!
Please inform the webmaster for this site of this problem. Printing of traceback and other system information has been explicitly inhibited, but the webmaster can find this information in the Mailman error logs. 
Do I need to restart services or something?

 
Jeff


>>> On 1/30/2009 at 11:47 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
Jeff Bernier wrote:

>I am retiring an older system running Mailman, and I would like to move one of its lists to our shiny new server. I have seen instructions posted for moving all lists from one system to another, but I want to move just one list to the new server already running other lists.
> 
>Can someone tell me how this is done? I have no real experience working with Mailman... so go easy on me.


To move a Mailman 2.1.x list from ones server to another running the
same or later Mailman, move the lists/LISTNAME/config.pck file to the
new server. Create the lists/LISTNAME/ directory with the same
ownership and permissions as the other lists/* directories. Run

  bin/withlist -l -r fix_url LISTNAME

to fix the host_name and web_page_url of the list for the new server.

Move the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox file from the old
server. Create the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/ directory with the
same ownership and permissions as the other archives/private/*.mbox/
directories. Run

  bin/.arch --wipe LISTNAME

to build the pipermail archive.

This assumes you have no held messages or pending requests for the list
on the old server. If you do have these, it is best to deal with them
on the old server before moving.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From brian at emwd.com  Tue Feb  3 21:14:36 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:14:36 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <4988974D.9040705@riverviewtech.net>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>	<4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>	<012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>	<bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>
	<4988974D.9040705@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <01e101c9863c$0b09c840$211d58c0$@com>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: mailman-users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org [mailto:mailman-
> users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Grant Taylor
> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 2:13 PM
> To: Mail List - Mailman
> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
> 
> On 02/03/09 13:13, Fil wrote:
> > Spam apart, does such a service exist?  A mail relay that works with
> > major email providers to have the best delivery rates?
> 
> I believe there are indeed some services that utilize things like
> eStamps where a nominal fee per email is payed to help ensure that the
> message that you are sending is not spam.  Usually such service
> providers have agreements with large email providers indicating that
> they will heavily scrutinize their subscriber base and partially vouch
> for them that they will never send spam more than once, if that before
> they are no longer a subscriber.
> 
> So in a way this is sort of like a notary in such as there is a 3rd
> party vouching (if you will) for the sender.
> 
> 
> 
> Grant. . . .

I have never come across such service providers nor have I come across large
ISPs such as Yahoo.com and AOL.com offering such a program to other email
providers. We have simply gotten our servers whitelisted with these large
ISPs and made sure all of our mailman clients are legitimate. So our e-mails
are being delivered quickly without having to resort to some of the rate
limits techniques that some hosts impose on their mailing list clients.


Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"


 


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 21:15:16 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 14:15:16 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <01e101c9863c$0b09c840$211d58c0$@com>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>	<4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>	<012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>	<bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>	<4988974D.9040705@riverviewtech.net>
	<01e101c9863c$0b09c840$211d58c0$@com>
Message-ID: <4988A5D4.6030603@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 14:14, Brian Carpenter wrote:
> I have never come across such service providers nor have I come 
> across large ISPs such as Yahoo.com and AOL.com offering such a 
> program to other email providers. We have simply gotten our servers 
> whitelisted with these large ISPs and made sure all of our mailman 
> clients are legitimate. So our e-mails are being delivered quickly 
> without having to resort to some of the rate limits techniques that 
> some hosts impose on their mailing list clients.

These services (or something closer to what Brad described) do exist. 
However, I think what you have done is probably the more feasible way to 
get your email through more reliably than relying on some 3rd party to 
do some of the leg work for you.  I also think that the appearance of 
you doing the leg work ahead of time and being pro-active in working 
with large hosting providers makes you look better and more likely to be 
legit when you do have the inevitable problem (how ever big or small it is).



Grant. . . .

From brian at emwd.com  Tue Feb  3 21:26:10 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:26:10 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <4988A5D4.6030603@riverviewtech.net>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>	<4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>	<012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>	<bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>	<4988974D.9040705@riverviewtech.net>	<01e101c9863c$0b09c840$211d58c0$@com>
	<4988A5D4.6030603@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <01e801c9863d$a897fdb0$f9c7f910$@com>



> -----Original Message-----
> From: mailman-users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org [mailto:mailman-
> users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Grant Taylor
> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 3:15 PM
> To: Mail List - Mailman
> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
> 
> On 02/03/09 14:14, Brian Carpenter wrote:
> > I have never come across such service providers nor have I come
> > across large ISPs such as Yahoo.com and AOL.com offering such a
> > program to other email providers. We have simply gotten our servers
> > whitelisted with these large ISPs and made sure all of our mailman
> > clients are legitimate. So our e-mails are being delivered quickly
> > without having to resort to some of the rate limits techniques that
> > some hosts impose on their mailing list clients.
> 
> These services (or something closer to what Brad described) do exist.
> However, I think what you have done is probably the more feasible way
> to
> get your email through more reliably than relying on some 3rd party to
> do some of the leg work for you.  I also think that the appearance of
> you doing the leg work ahead of time and being pro-active in working
> with large hosting providers makes you look better and more likely to
> be
> legit when you do have the inevitable problem (how ever big or small it
> is).
> 
> 
> 
> Grant. . . .
> ------------------------------------------------------

Yeah just saw Brad's post after I sent mine.


Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 21:25:27 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 14:25:27 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailing list servers ..
In-Reply-To: <01e801c9863d$a897fdb0$f9c7f910$@com>
References: <BLU144-W1852FCFB23D64A6D043BA8DFC20@phx.gbl>	<498862CC.3070501@python.org>	<4988673C.7070004@riverviewtech.net>	<20090203155348.GN1959@amyl.org.uk>	<012f01c9861b$75eec0f0$61cc42d0$@com>	<bfc33ad70902031113p1293fb20p21fb199d75ed4ffc@mail.gmail.com>	<4988974D.9040705@riverviewtech.net>	<01e101c9863c$0b09c840$211d58c0$@com>	<4988A5D4.6030603@riverviewtech.net>
	<01e801c9863d$a897fdb0$f9c7f910$@com>
Message-ID: <4988A837.2080805@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 14:26, Brian Carpenter wrote:
> Yeah just saw Brad's post after I sent mine.

No harm, no foul.  We are all human and if we are lucky we learn 
something every day.  :}



Grant. . . .

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb  3 21:57:11 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 12:57:11 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving a List
In-Reply-To: <s9885f32.061@risd.edu>
Message-ID: <PC187020090203125711054645550a2d@msapiro>

Jeff Bernier"wrote:
> 
>I moved my list following instructions you posted to me on 30 Jan. After the move, I attempted to log in as list admin, and received the following:
>Bug in Mailman version 2.1.9
>We're sorry, we hit a bug!
>Please inform the webmaster for this site of this problem. Printing of traceback and other system information has been explicitly inhibited, but the webmaster can find this information in the Mailman error logs. 
>Do I need to restart services or something?


Check the ownership and permissions of the config.pck you moved (and
the lists/LISTNAME directory) compared to other lists.

If it's not a permissions issue, what is the complete error report and
traceback from Mailman's error log?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb  3 22:34:59 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 13:34:59 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <498897E2.60508@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020313345900153897ee0a@msapiro>

Grant Taylor wrote:

>On 02/03/09 13:13, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>> is to accept only text/plain parts, but to accept them no matter how
>> deeply they may be nested in the original MIME structure. Content
>> filtering will leave higer level multipart/* and message/rfc822 parts
>> in the message, but only those which ultimately contain a text/plain
>> part.
>
>*nod*
>
>So basically any and all parts that are passed through (and not 
>scrubbed) have to be in the DEFAULT_PASS_MIME_TYPES list.  If the 
>part(s) in question, no matter where they are in the message, are not in 
>the list they are scrubbed.


I think you may be confusing things here, and I may have contributed.
DEFAULT_PASS_MIME_TYPES only sets the default for pass_mime_types when
the list is created. When the list is in use, it is the content of the
list's pass_mime_types that determines what happens.

Also, scrubbed is something different. There are two processes going
on. One is content filtering which determines which parts of a message
are filtered out entirely and which parts are retained for subsequent
processing. The other is 'scrubbing' which processes the content
filtered message for the plain format digest and the archive (and
possibly for all purposes if the list's scrub_nondigest is true).

Scrubbing removes message parts and stores them aside and replaces them
with links to the stored part. Scrubbing will scrub anything which
isn't text/plain. It will examine the contents of multipart/* parts
for elemental sub-parts which will be retained if they are text/plain
with a known character set and otherwise stored aside, but if it
encounters a message/rfc822 part, it scrubs that in it's entirety.

Also, pass_mime_types only comes into play if it is non-empty and the
lists filter_content setting is true. So the correct statement is:

So basically, if content filtering is on and if pass_mime_types is
non-empty, any and all parts that are passed through (and not
filtered) have to be in the pass_mime_types list.  If the part(s) in
question, no matter where they are in the message, are not in the list
they are filtered.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Tue Feb  3 22:40:41 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 15:40:41 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020313345900153897ee0a@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009020313345900153897ee0a@msapiro>
Message-ID: <4988B9D9.4080409@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/03/09 15:34, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> So basically, if content filtering is on and if pass_mime_types is 
> non-empty, any and all parts that are passed through (and not 
> filtered) have to be in the pass_mime_types list.  If the part(s) in 
> question, no matter where they are in the message, are not in the 
> list they are filtered.

*nod* *nod*

Algebra *ALWAYS* was /easier/ when I knew as many variables as possible.  :P



Grant. . . .

From bradley at sixwebsites.com  Tue Feb  3 22:27:32 2009
From: bradley at sixwebsites.com (Bradley Cummins, Member Manager)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 16:27:32 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman, Qmail  -> Large Message Lost
Message-ID: <4988B6C4.60104@sixwebsites.com>

I am running
- Mailman 2.1.9
- Qmail
- CentOs
- MySQLdb module

I have been able to successfully send a mail to my list members, who are 
stored in a MySQL, database.  This worked when there were eight members. 
 Now that I'm trying it on a production level with approx. 200 members 
it doesn't work...or, at least, it hasn't after the first 45 min.

SMTP_MAX_RCPTS = 500

There are currently only 157 members in my list.

/var/qmail/concurrencyremote is 250

/var/qmail/concurrencylocal is 30

Could anyone help me improve this performance?

From Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu  Tue Feb  3 17:02:16 2009
From: Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu (Gary Moore)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 11:02:16 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net>
References: <498709F00200006C00015B0A@GW15.hofstra.edu>
	<498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <49882436.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>

Grant, 
 
I actually just checked and I have the setting edit_filter_content set to "no" and the pass_mime_types was blank.
 
Gary
 
Gary Moore, CISSP
Assistant Dean for Information Systems
Hofstra University School of Law
Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu 
(516) 463-6067

>>> On 2/3/2009 at 10:38 AM, in message <498864DF.3010703 at riverviewtech.net>, Grant Taylor <gtaylor at riverviewtech.net> wrote:
On 02/02/09 13:57, Gary Moore wrote:
> My apologies if this has been on the list before.  I have a mailman 
> listserv that I have setup to digest.  The messages are forwarded 
> from our blog to a general resource account which sends them out to 
> the listserv.  When the digest is sent out (see attached), each of 
> the digested messages has a "message scrubbed".  How can I solve this 
> problem.  Thanks in advance.

I'm just guessing here, but I'm betting that you are sending your digest 
out with the actual messages as MIME attachments rather than textual 
copy in a new message.  (Note:  I think this is a good thing, so keep it 
up.)

However I'm betting that Mailman is seeing the individual messages as 
attachments and is scrubbing them because it does not know about the 
MIME type, or more likely it is not an allowed MIME type.

Go to Content Filtering -> pass_mime_types and make sure that 
multipart/digest, message/rfc822 and possibly text/rfc822-headers are 
included in the list.  message/rfc822 is the standard attachment like 
you would receive if I forwarded a message to you (as an attachment).

(Please refer to section 5.1.5 of RFC 2046 for more information.)

I don't know if this will solve your problem or not, but at least it's a 
direction to look in to.

Please let us know if this solves the problem as if it does, I propose 
that multipart/digest and message/rfc822 get added to the default 
allowed MIME types.



Grant. . . .
------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list
Mailman-Users at python.org 
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users 
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 
Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ 
Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gary.p.moore%40hofstra.edu 

Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9

From Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu  Tue Feb  3 16:53:16 2009
From: Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu (Gary Moore)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 10:53:16 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net>
References: <498709F00200006C00015B0A@GW15.hofstra.edu>
	<498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <4988221A.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>

Grant
 
Thanks for the response, I will take a look at the setting on that.  And yes, I will let gladly let everyone know if that solves the problem. 
 
And I apologize to all of you for the mea culpa yesterday in not saying "mailing list".  I first used that other mailing list software 20 years ago and the term has unfortunately never left my brain.
 
Gary
 
Gary Moore, CISSP
Assistant Dean for Information Systems
Hofstra University School of Law
Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu 
(516) 463-6067

>>> On 2/3/2009 at 10:38 AM, in message <498864DF.3010703 at riverviewtech.net>, Grant Taylor <gtaylor at riverviewtech.net> wrote:
On 02/02/09 13:57, Gary Moore wrote:
> My apologies if this has been on the list before.  I have a mailman 
> listserv that I have setup to digest.  The messages are forwarded 
> from our blog to a general resource account which sends them out to 
> the listserv.  When the digest is sent out (see attached), each of 
> the digested messages has a "message scrubbed".  How can I solve this 
> problem.  Thanks in advance.

I'm just guessing here, but I'm betting that you are sending your digest 
out with the actual messages as MIME attachments rather than textual 
copy in a new message.  (Note:  I think this is a good thing, so keep it 
up.)

However I'm betting that Mailman is seeing the individual messages as 
attachments and is scrubbing them because it does not know about the 
MIME type, or more likely it is not an allowed MIME type.

Go to Content Filtering -> pass_mime_types and make sure that 
multipart/digest, message/rfc822 and possibly text/rfc822-headers are 
included in the list.  message/rfc822 is the standard attachment like 
you would receive if I forwarded a message to you (as an attachment).

(Please refer to section 5.1.5 of RFC 2046 for more information.)

I don't know if this will solve your problem or not, but at least it's a 
direction to look in to.

Please let us know if this solves the problem as if it does, I propose 
that multipart/digest and message/rfc822 get added to the default 
allowed MIME types.



Grant. . . .
------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list
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Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ 
Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/gary.p.moore%40hofstra.edu 

Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9

From Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu  Tue Feb  3 20:35:34 2009
From: Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu (Gary Moore)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 14:35:34 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090203111358056298c30b6c@msapiro>
References: <49888F36.8060703@riverviewtech.net>
	<PC187020090203111358056298c30b6c@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49885633.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>

Guys, thanks for all the help on this.  I am going to try another temporary workaround but I will work on this on my test mailing list (because I need to get the problem eventually resolved) and I will let you all know.
 
Gary
 
Gary Moore, CISSP
Assistant Dean for Information Systems
Hofstra University School of Law
Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu 
(516) 463-6067

>>> On 2/3/2009 at 2:13 PM, in message <PC187020090203111358056298c30b6c at msapiro>, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
Grant Taylor wrote:
>
>Question:  If a message is passed as a message/rfc822 attachment, what 
>happens to it's MIME sub-parts?  Are they filtered too?


Yes. Content filtering works recursively. If any content type part is
filtered, it is removed along with all its sub-parts. If a content
type part is not filtered, we recursively examine its sub-parts to see
if they should pe passed or filtered.

Thus, the intent of my

DEFAULT_PASS_MIME_TYPES = ['multipart',
                           'message/rfc822',
                           'text/plain']

is to accept only text/plain parts, but to accept them no matter how
deeply they may be nested in the original MIME structure. Content
filtering will leave higer level multipart/* and message/rfc822 parts
in the message, but only those which ultimately contain a text/plain
part.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

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Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9

From jmciver at lmtribune.com  Tue Feb  3 19:09:46 2009
From: jmciver at lmtribune.com (Jim McIver)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 10:09:46 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman mod list
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902030941060015748027d5@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902030941060015748027d5@msapiro>
Message-ID: <4988886A.2050907@lmtribune.com>

Thx Mark. That worked.

-jm

Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Jim McIver wrote:
>   
>> I've found a mod.py that will show users in a list that have the 
>> moderator bit set.
>>
>> # mod.py
>>
>>     
> >from Mailman import mm_cfg
>   
>> import sys
>>
>> def mod(list):
>>    for member in list.getMembers():
>>        if list.getMemberOption(member, mm_cfg.Moderate):
>>            print member, "is moderated"
>>
>>
>> How can I modify this to show users "don't" have the moderator bit set?
>> Search FAQ...no luck.
>>     
>
>
> First, I hope you realize that this is a 'withlist' script to be run
> via bin/withlist.
>
> To make it show unmoderated members, insert the word not in the
> condition and the message
>
>         if not list.getMemberOption(member, mm_cfg.Moderate):
>             print member, "is not moderated"
>
>   

From Tlf1 at ccs135.com  Tue Feb  3 19:03:03 2009
From: Tlf1 at ccs135.com (Tim Ferguson)
Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2009 12:03:03 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble Sending Messages
Message-ID: <49883277020000BD00014247@ccs135.com>

I'm having trouble getting messages out to subscribers.  Approval messages, when I approve a new subscriber, are making it to their destination as are messages if a subscriber has been rejected.  When I send a message to the list for an announcement, it is never received and nothing comes back.
 
Any suggestions and/or ideas on where to look would be greatly appreciated.
 
Thanks,
 
Tim
 
 
 
Tim Ferguson
Director of Technology
Centralia City Schools
Centralia, Illinois 62801
618-532-1907, Ext. 1030
 

From mihamina at lab.vectoris.fr  Wed Feb  4 09:48:54 2009
From: mihamina at lab.vectoris.fr (Mihamina Rakotomandimby (R12y))
Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2009 11:48:54 +0300
Subject: [Mailman-Users] bounce, accept,...
Message-ID: <49895676.3040806@lab.vectoris.fr>

Hi,

I received on a list a post by a non member.

I was in a hurry, and I checked 2 "accept" boxes through the web 
interface. The second "accept", was, I think about to accept all the 
future post from that guy, but I dont really remember... sorry.

The problem is now the man can send email to the list wihtout being member.
If he was a member, I would just have discarded him, but he's not!

How to reset that thing? (I dont want to guy to be able to post in the 
list).

Thank you

-- 
Chef de projet chez Vectoris
http://www.google.com/search?q=mihamina+rakotomandimby

From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb  4 16:19:28 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 07:19:28 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman, Qmail  -> Large Message Lost
In-Reply-To: <4988B6C4.60104@sixwebsites.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902040719280125c8f91a99@msapiro>

Bradley Cummins, Member Manager wrote:

>I am running
>- Mailman 2.1.9
>- Qmail
>- CentOs
>- MySQLdb module
>
>I have been able to successfully send a mail to my list members, who are 
>stored in a MySQL, database.  This worked when there were eight members. 
> Now that I'm trying it on a production level with approx. 200 members 
>it doesn't work...or, at least, it hasn't after the first 45 min.
>
>SMTP_MAX_RCPTS = 500
>
>There are currently only 157 members in my list.
>
>/var/qmail/concurrencyremote is 250
>
>/var/qmail/concurrencylocal is 30
>
>Could anyone help me improve this performance?


Look in Mailman's smtp log for a message like

Feb 04 03:30:05 2009 (12244) <message-id> smtp to LISTNAME for 157
recips, completed in n.nnn seconds

where <message-id> is the message-id of your message and LISTNAME is
the name of your list. If that log message is there, mailman has
completed delivery to qmail. If n.nnn seconds is excessively long,
search the FAQ at <> for performance.

If the entire delay is not explained by n.nnn seconds, the delay is in
Qmail's delivery of the mail. If Qmail is delivering directly, this is
a Qmail question. If Qmail is relaying via your ISP, your ISP may be
throttling delivery.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb  4 16:27:51 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 07:27:51 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman, Qmail  -> Large Message Lost
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902040719280125c8f91a99@msapiro>
Message-ID: <PC187020090204072751043790425e28@msapiro>

Mark Sapiro wrote:
>search the FAQ at <> for performance.

Sorry, that should have been

search the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3> for performance.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb  4 16:31:45 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 07:31:45 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble Sending Messages
In-Reply-To: <49883277020000BD00014247@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090204073145064090425eed@msapiro>

Tim Ferguson wrote:

>I'm having trouble getting messages out to subscribers.  Approval messages, when I approve a new subscriber, are making it to their destination as are messages if a subscriber has been rejected.  When I send a message to the list for an announcement, it is never received and nothing comes back.
> 
>Any suggestions and/or ideas on where to look would be greatly appreciated.


See the basic troubleshooting FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/A4E9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb  4 17:07:00 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 08:07:00 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] bounce, accept,...
In-Reply-To: <49895676.3040806@lab.vectoris.fr>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020408070008283fce70fc@msapiro>

Mihamina Rakotomandimby (R12y) wrote:
>
>I was in a hurry, and I checked 2 "accept" boxes through the web 
>interface. The second "accept", was, I think about to accept all the 
>future post from that guy, but I dont really remember... sorry.
>
>The problem is now the man can send email to the list wihtout being member.
>If he was a member, I would just have discarded him, but he's not!
>
>How to reset that thing? (I dont want to guy to be able to post in the 
>list).


Go to the admin Privacy options...->Sender Filters page and remove the
address from accept_these_nonmembers.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jbernier at risd.edu  Wed Feb  4 17:49:33 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2009 11:49:33 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving a List
Message-ID: <s98980f2.060@risd.edu>

Mark,
 
I am now able to send to the list. Mailman's MTA (Postfix) is set to relay mail through our Messaging firewall. It just so happened there was a minor problem there interrupting mail flow from Mailman. That is now fixed.
 
Everything now seems ok with this moved list but for one thing. Messages will not archive. I can see the archive as it was before the move... but new messages will not go to the archive.
 
If I try to rebuild the archive for this list with ./arch --wipe LISTNAME, and then check permissions with the ./check_perms command, I get the following result:
 
directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME
directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/2009-February
directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/2009-January
directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/attachments
directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/attachments/20090129
directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/attachments/20090204
directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/public/LISTNAME

It then instruct me to re-run the check_perms command with the -f flag to fix. It seems to fix the permissions, but messages will still not archive. Ownership of the /private/LISTNAME folder reverts back to root as well.
 
I'm completely stumped.
 
Any ideas?
Jeff
 
 

>>> On 2/3/2009 at 5:11 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
Jeff Bernier wrote:
> 
>Correcting permissions on the file directory you mention took care of it... I am now able to log in as list admin. Thank you.
> 
>I now cannot however, successfully send a message to the list. The MTA accepts the message, but it does not get to the list members.


What is the MTA? What does the MTA log say that it did with the
message? If the MTA uses aliases for delivery to mailman did you do
what needs to be done to create the aliases (maybe just
bin/genaliases, maybe installeng them manually)?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jbernier at risd.edu  Wed Feb  4 21:01:43 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2009 15:01:43 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help
Message-ID: <s989adeb.099@risd.edu>

I was moving a list from one server to another, and following creating directories and moving files, I attempted to run the following command:
 
withlist -l -r fix_url LISTNAME
 
Now I cannot get to my main Mailman page. I see the Bug in Mailman version 2.1.9 message.
 
I can however get to each individual list manager url and login.
 
When I type list_lists at the command line, I get the following in return:
sh-3.2# ./list_lists
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "./list_lists", line 122, in <module>
    main()
  File "./list_lists", line 94, in main
    mlist = MailList.MailList(n, lock=0)
  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 130, in __init__
    self.Load()
  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 629, in Load
    dict, e = self.__load(file)
  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 602, in __load
    dict = loadfunc(fp)
AttributeError: 'str' object has no attribute 'append'
 
What did I do wrong? Any Ideas what this means?
 
Help!
Jeff

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 01:26:08 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 16:26:08 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help
In-Reply-To: <s989adeb.099@risd.edu>
Message-ID: <PC187020090204162608020304eb7293@msapiro>

Jeff Bernier wrote:

>I was moving a list from one server to another, and following creating directories and moving files, I attempted to run the following command:
> 
>withlist -l -r fix_url LISTNAME
> 
>Now I cannot get to my main Mailman page. I see the Bug in Mailman version 2.1.9 message.
> 
>I can however get to each individual list manager url and login.


How about the list you just moved?


>When I type list_lists at the command line, I get the following in return:
>sh-3.2# ./list_lists
>Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "./list_lists", line 122, in <module>
>    main()
>  File "./list_lists", line 94, in main
>    mlist = MailList.MailList(n, lock=0)
>  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 130, in __init__
>    self.Load()
>  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 629, in Load
>    dict, e = self.__load(file)
>  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 602, in __load
>    dict = loadfunc(fp)
>AttributeError: 'str' object has no attribute 'append'
> 
>What did I do wrong? Any Ideas what this means?


Both the above traceback from list_lists and the Bug from the listinfo
overview page say that the lists/LISTNAME/config.pck file is corrupt
for some list. The most likely candidate is the list you just moved,
but if the withlist fix_url worked, that one should be OK.

See the post at
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2008-October/063597.html>
for a way to find out which list has the problem config.pck.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 01:34:30 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 16:34:30 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving a List
In-Reply-To: <s98980f2.058@risd.edu>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902041634300171969d8209@msapiro>

Jeff Bernier wrote:
> 
>Everything now seems ok with this moved list but for one thing. Messages will not archive. I can see the archive as it was before the move... but new messages will not go to the archive.
> 
>If I try to rebuild the archive for this list with ./arch --wipe LISTNAME, and then check permissions with the ./check_perms command, I get the following result:
> 
>directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME
>directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/2009-February
>directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/2009-January
>directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/attachments
>directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/attachments/20090129
>directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME/attachments/20090204
>directory permissions must be 02775: /private/var/mailman/archives/public/LISTNAME
>
>It then instruct me to re-run the check_perms command with the -f flag to fix. It seems to fix the permissions, but messages will still not archive. Ownership of the /private/LISTNAME folder reverts back to root as well.
> 
>I'm completely stumped.



It could be a permissions issue on the
/private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox directory or the
/private/var/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox
file. Check those by comparing to other lists. If this isn't the
answer, what's in Mailman's error log?

Also, be sure archiving is turned on for the list (Archiving
Options->archive on the admin web interface).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From aussiemax at neo.rr.com  Thu Feb  5 15:41:25 2009
From: aussiemax at neo.rr.com (Melinda Gilmore)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 09:41:25 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Permissions problems
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200901210842410281543fdac2@msapiro>
References: <001801c97bce$bf9d3440$3ed79cc0$@rr.com>
	<PC1870200901210842410281543fdac2@msapiro>
Message-ID: <041b01c9879f$d2fa2b10$78ee8130$@rr.com>

Mark,  thanks for the info that did work for that particular error.  But I
keep getting this one, and the number at the end changes.   So I have to
keep adding a file.  Is there some type of numbering system for
config.pck.tmp, is this related to a cron job

IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
'/usr/local/mailman/lists/sis_directors/config.pck.tmp.lists.19678'

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2009 11:43 AM
To: gilmore.126 at osu.edu; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Permissions problems

Melinda Gilmore wrote:

>I continue to get these messages when some cron jobs are running.  I can
see
>that it is a permissions problems.  But I have tried everything by changing
>permissions and it still is having problems.  This particular file that is
>mentioned is not there.


So the user who's crontab ran this does not have permission to create
the file.

Try doing

su - user

where user is the user who's crontab this is, followed by

touch /usr/local/mailman/archives/private/mailman/2007-October.txt.gz


>Someone please help me figure this out.  There has
>to be some little thing I am missing.  I have compared files with others
>that are not getting the message and the permissions are the same.  
>
>Your "cron" job on lists
>/usr/local/bin/python -S /usr/local/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip
>
>produced the following output:
>
>Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/usr/local/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 154, in ?
>    main()
>  File "/usr/local/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 140, in main
>    compress(f)
>  File "/usr/local/mailman/cron/nightly_gzip", line 81, in compress
>    outfp = gzip.open(txtfile+'.gz', 'wb', 6)
>  File "/usr/local/lib/python2.3/gzip.py", line 49, in open
>    return GzipFile(filename, mode, compresslevel)
>  File "/usr/local/lib/python2.3/gzip.py", line 94, in __init__
>    fileobj = self.myfileobj = __builtin__.open(filename, mode or 'rb')
>IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
>'/usr/local/mailman/archives/private/mailman/2007-October.txt.gz'

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From Paul.E.Virgo at nasa.gov  Thu Feb  5 16:17:28 2009
From: Paul.E.Virgo at nasa.gov (Paul E Virgo - ISG)
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 10:17:28 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Turn off Display of Additional Languages
Message-ID: <498B0308.7010005@nasa.gov>

Hello,

Was wondering if there is a way to turn off the display of additional 
language choices within Mailman?
Is this something that can be done via mm_cfg.py? Thanks.

PEV

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Paul E. Virgo
Email/DHCP/DNS Sr. Admin
NASA - Goddard Space Flight Ctr
Greenbelt, MD 20771
(office) 301-286-0788
(fax) 301-286-4424
(cell) 240-393-2952

'Be your best, one day at a time'
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


From dimkar at thessaloniki.gr  Thu Feb  5 09:36:07 2009
From: dimkar at thessaloniki.gr (D. Karapiperis)
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 10:36:07 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] change user attributes from shell
Message-ID: <498AA4F7.2000102@thessaloniki.gr>

Hello

Is there any way from shell to change users e-mail and mod bit of a member?

Thanks in advance

-- 
????????? ??????????? 
????. ??. ????????

???????? ?????????? - ?. ????????????
????? ???????????? -  ?/??? ?????????? & ???????
2310 - 257844 fax 2310 - 244965



From wgoodman at jcvi.org  Wed Feb  4 17:24:27 2009
From: wgoodman at jcvi.org (Goodman, William)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 11:24:27 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
Message-ID: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C056@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>

Hello,
 
After downloading and installing the latest version of mailman-2.1.12rc1
and I'm using Apache-2.2-11 and
Postfix-2.3.3-2.1.el5_2. On CentOS 5.2 (RedhHat) for some reason I can't
understand the CPU usage is
at 96% for mailman. When I do a top I get:
 
top - 11:18:13 up 16:38,  1 user,  load average: 2.78, 2.76, 2.62
Tasks: 122 total,   2 running, 120 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
Cpu(s): 33.4%us,  2.3%sy,  0.0%ni, 64.0%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.1%si,
0.0%st
Mem:   3866536k total,  2471544k used,  1394992k free,   409096k buffers
Swap:  4194296k total,        0k used,  4194296k free,  1435408k cached
 
PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND

4949 mailman   25   0  175m  37m 2760 R   97  1.0 944:03.94 python2.4

4951 mailman   16   0  168m  30m 2828 S   12  0.8 288:29.09 python2.4

4946 mailman   16   0  171m  33m 2752 S    2  0.9  57:05.67 python2.4

11093 postfix   15   0 54512 2848 2228 S    1  0.1   0:00.29 smtpd

14 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   1:02.48 events/0

3935 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   2:42.83 kjournald

6479 root      15   0 88068 3232 2516 S    0  0.1   0:00.17 sshd

10942 postfix   15   0 54212 2624 2064 S    0  0.1   0:00.20 local

11157 postfix   15   0 54252 2360 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.11 cleanup

11172 postfix   16   0 55140 2356 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.10 cleanup

 
When I search for that PID I get this:
 
# ps -ef | grep 4949
mailman   4949  4938 94 Feb03 ?        15:44:50 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s

I've search the archives but I haven't seen an up to date resolution.
Can anyone help.
 
Bill

From wyn_rowlands at ukgateway.net  Wed Feb  4 19:45:21 2009
From: wyn_rowlands at ukgateway.net (Wyn)
Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 18:45:21 -0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAIlncBYYTzZFmqzQas1nFpnigAAAEAAAAGAv7lfX0XBEpBO5xSRMUs8BAAAAAA==@ukgateway.net>

Hello,

Has any one any ideas how to display a real name next to the email address
in Subscriber List

Thanks

Wyn


From jbernier at risd.edu  Thu Feb  5 19:11:01 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 13:11:01 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help
Message-ID: <s98ae588.044@risd.edu>

Mark,
 
No... I cannot get to the moved lists URL. I get the same Bug in Mailman message. I seem to be able to do all the administrative and subscriber tasks with all other lists. the individual lists URLs will work... I just can no longer get to the main Mailman list page at: http://mailman-host-name/mailman/listinfo or: http://mailman-host-name/mailman/admin.
 
Additionally, I don't thing the withlist command was successful for the list I attempted to move. And other Mailman commands seem to fail as well, such as list_lists, and list_admins, producing similar results as what I had forwarded below.
 
I will take a look at the link you noted to try to determine where the fault is. Of course, ultimately, it's my fault.
 
I'm very new to Unix based commands, and Mailman in general, so I really appreciate your patience and assistance here.
 
Regards,
Jeff
 

>>> On 2/4/2009 at 7:26 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
Jeff Bernier wrote:

>I was moving a list from one server to another, and following creating directories and moving files, I attempted to run the following command:
> 
>withlist -l -r fix_url LISTNAME
> 
>Now I cannot get to my main Mailman page. I see the Bug in Mailman version 2.1.9 message.
> 
>I can however get to each individual list manager url and login.


How about the list you just moved?


>When I type list_lists at the command line, I get the following in return:
>sh-3.2# ./list_lists
>Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "./list_lists", line 122, in <module>
>    main()
>  File "./list_lists", line 94, in main
>    mlist = MailList.MailList(n, lock=0)
>  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 130, in __init__
>    self.Load()
>  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 629, in Load
>    dict, e = self.__load(file)
>  File "/usr/share/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 602, in __load
>    dict = loadfunc(fp)
>AttributeError: 'str' object has no attribute 'append'
> 
>What did I do wrong? Any Ideas what this means?


Both the above traceback from list_lists and the Bug from the listinfo
overview page say that the lists/LISTNAME/config.pck file is corrupt
for some list. The most likely candidate is the list you just moved,
but if the withlist fix_url worked, that one should be OK.

See the post at
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2008-October/063597.html>
for a way to find out which list has the problem config.pck.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 19:35:27 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 10:35:27 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help
In-Reply-To: <s98ae588.042@risd.edu>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902051035270000d0b5c4db@msapiro>

Jeff Bernier wrote:

>No... I cannot get to the moved lists URL. I get the same Bug in Mailman
>message. I seem to be able to do all the administrative and subscriber 
>tasks with all other lists. the individual lists URLs will work... I just
>can no longer get to the main Mailman list page at: http://mailman-host-name/mailman/listinfo or: http://mailman-host-name/mailman/admin.



This is because the moved list's liusts/LISTNAME/config.pck file is
corrupt.

The first step is to remove the config.pck. If there is a
config.pck.last, it may be OK. If there is no config.pck.last, or it's
not OK remove all lists/LISTNAME/config.pck* files for this list. Then
the admin and listinfo overviews will work.


>Additionally, I don't thing the withlist command was successful for the 
>list I attempted to move.


This may be the cause of the current problem, or it may be because
there was some problem with the original config.pck that you moved.


>And other Mailman commands seem to fail as well,
>such as list_lists, and list_admins, producing similar results as what I
>had forwarded below.


This is all because of the one corrupt config.pck.


>I will take a look at the link you noted to try to determine where the
>fault is.


You don't need to do that. That is only to identify which list's
config.pck is corrupt, but we know that because you can't get to the
moved list's admin or listinfo pages so it is the config.pck for the
moved list which has the problem.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 19:42:34 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 10:42:34 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] change user attributes from shell
In-Reply-To: <498AA4F7.2000102@thessaloniki.gr>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902051042340312d0b5c61a@msapiro>

D. Karapiperis wrote:
>
>Is there any way from shell to change users e-mail and mod bit of a member?


To change a users address, see

  bin/clone_member --help

To change the mod bit see the withlist script at
<http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/set_mod.py> (mirrored at
<http://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/set_mod.py>).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu  Thu Feb  5 19:42:53 2009
From: Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu (Gary Moore)
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 13:42:53 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <49882436.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>
References: <498709F00200006C00015B0A@GW15.hofstra.edu>
	<498864DF.3010703@riverviewtech.net> <49882436.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>
Message-ID: <498AECDD.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>

So, I reviewed every setting that I can think of which I have listed below that would be involved with the problem that I have on the attachments being scrubbed.
 
filter_content = no
pass_mime_types =blank
pass_filename_extensions=blank
collapse_alternatives=yes
convert_html_to_plaintext=no
nondigestable=no
scrub_nondigest=no
digest_is_default = yes
mime_is_default_digest=mime
 
Still is scrubbing the attachments.  I am stumped.  Any ideas, besides canning our Groupwise e-mail system which we will be come Summer.
 
Thanks for all the suggestions though.  Appreciate the help
 
Gary

>>> On 2/3/2009 at 11:02 AM, in message <49882436.4962.006C.0 at hofstra.edu>, "Gary Moore" <Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu> wrote:
Grant, 

I actually just checked and I have the setting edit_filter_content set to "no" and the pass_mime_types was blank.

Gary

Gary Moore, CISSP
Assistant Dean for Information Systems
Hofstra University School of Law
Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu 
(516) 463-6067

>>> On 2/3/2009 at 10:38 AM, in message <498864DF.3010703 at riverviewtech.net>, Grant Taylor <gtaylor at riverviewtech.net> wrote:
On 02/02/09 13:57, Gary Moore wrote:
> My apologies if this has been on the list before.  I have a mailman 
> listserv that I have setup to digest.  The messages are forwarded 
> from our blog to a general resource account which sends them out to 
> the listserv.  When the digest is sent out (see attached), each of 
> the digested messages has a "message scrubbed".  How can I solve this 
> problem.  Thanks in advance.

I'm just guessing here, but I'm betting that you are sending your digest 
out with the actual messages as MIME attachments rather than textual 
copy in a new message.  (Note:  I think this is a good thing, so keep it 
up.)

However I'm betting that Mailman is seeing the individual messages as 
attachments and is scrubbing them because it does not know about the 
MIME type, or more likely it is not an allowed MIME type.

Go to Content Filtering -> pass_mime_types and make sure that 
multipart/digest, message/rfc822 and possibly text/rfc822-headers are 
included in the list.  message/rfc822 is the standard attachment like 
you would receive if I forwarded a message to you (as an attachment).

(Please refer to section 5.1.5 of RFC 2046 for more information.)

I don't know if this will solve your problem or not, but at least it's a 
direction to look in to.

Please let us know if this solves the problem as if it does, I propose 
that multipart/digest and message/rfc822 get added to the default 
allowed MIME types.



Grant. . . .
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From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 20:05:27 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 11:05:27 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAIlncBYYTzZFmqzQas1nFpnigAAAEAAAAGAv7lfX0XBEpBO5xSRMUs8BAAAAAA==@ukgateway.net>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020511052704063ecbfff1@msapiro>

Wyn wrote:
>
>Has any one any ideas how to display a real name next to the email address
>in Subscriber List


I assume you mean the Subscriber List linked from the list's listinfo
page, i.e. the roster at a URL like
<http://www.example.com/mailman/roster/listname>.

There's no way to include real names on this list without modifying
code, but see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/aYA9> for other ways
to get a list which may include real names.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 20:14:13 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 11:14:13 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C056@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020511141307033ecc010c@msapiro>

Goodman, William wrote:
> 
>After downloading and installing the latest version of mailman-2.1.12rc1
>and I'm using Apache-2.2-11 and
>Postfix-2.3.3-2.1.el5_2. On CentOS 5.2 (RedhHat) for some reason I can't
>understand the CPU usage is
>at 96% for mailman. When I do a top I get:
> 
>top - 11:18:13 up 16:38,  1 user,  load average: 2.78, 2.76, 2.62
>Tasks: 122 total,   2 running, 120 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
>Cpu(s): 33.4%us,  2.3%sy,  0.0%ni, 64.0%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.1%si,
>0.0%st
>Mem:   3866536k total,  2471544k used,  1394992k free,   409096k buffers
>Swap:  4194296k total,        0k used,  4194296k free,  1435408k cached
> 
>PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
>
>4949 mailman   25   0  175m  37m 2760 R   97  1.0 944:03.94 python2.4
>
>4951 mailman   16   0  168m  30m 2828 S   12  0.8 288:29.09 python2.4
>
>4946 mailman   16   0  171m  33m 2752 S    2  0.9  57:05.67 python2.4
>
>11093 postfix   15   0 54512 2848 2228 S    1  0.1   0:00.29 smtpd
>
>14 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   1:02.48 events/0
>
>3935 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   2:42.83 kjournald
>
>6479 root      15   0 88068 3232 2516 S    0  0.1   0:00.17 sshd
>
>10942 postfix   15   0 54212 2624 2064 S    0  0.1   0:00.20 local
>
>11157 postfix   15   0 54252 2360 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.11 cleanup
>
>11172 postfix   16   0 55140 2356 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.10 cleanup
>
> 
>When I search for that PID I get this:
> 
># ps -ef | grep 4949
>mailman   4949  4938 94 Feb03 ?        15:44:50 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s


What release did you upgrade from?

What's in Mailman's logs?

What's in Mailman's qfiles/in/ directory?

What are the other two high cpu runners (pids 4951 and 4946)?

Does Mailman work normally except for this high cpu usage?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 20:22:58 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 11:22:58 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <498AECDD.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020511225808901fc10e34@msapiro>

Gary Moore wrote:

>So, I reviewed every setting that I can think of which I have listed below that would be involved with the problem that I have on the attachments being scrubbed.
> 
>filter_content = no
>pass_mime_types =blank
>pass_filename_extensions=blank
>collapse_alternatives=yes
>convert_html_to_plaintext=no
>nondigestable=no
>scrub_nondigest=no
>digest_is_default = yes
>mime_is_default_digest=mime


So new subscribers are getting mime digests by default, but the
subscribers who are seeing the messape/rfc822 part scrubbed are still
getting plain digests. Uncheck their 'plain' box on the Membership
Management pages and save those changes.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu  Thu Feb  5 20:32:02 2009
From: Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu (Gary Moore)
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 14:32:02 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Question on Digest E-mails
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020511225808901fc10e34@msapiro>
References: <498AECDD.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>
	<PC18702009020511225808901fc10e34@msapiro>
Message-ID: <498AF861.4962.006C.0@hofstra.edu>

Mark, thanks for picking up on that.  Made that change on each of them, that should work.  Thanks so much!
 
Gary
 
Gary Moore, CISSP
Assistant Dean for Information Systems
Hofstra University School of Law
Gary.P.Moore at hofstra.edu 
(516) 463-6067

>>> On 2/5/2009 at 2:22 PM, in message <PC18702009020511225808901fc10e34 at msapiro>, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
Gary Moore wrote:

>So, I reviewed every setting that I can think of which I have listed below that would be involved with the problem that I have on the attachments being scrubbed.
> 
>filter_content = no
>pass_mime_types =blank
>pass_filename_extensions=blank
>collapse_alternatives=yes
>convert_html_to_plaintext=no
>nondigestable=no
>scrub_nondigest=no
>digest_is_default = yes
>mime_is_default_digest=mime


So new subscribers are getting mime digests by default, but the
subscribers who are seeing the messape/rfc822 part scrubbed are still
getting plain digests. Uncheck their 'plain' box on the Membership
Management pages and save those changes.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

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From jbernier at risd.edu  Thu Feb  5 21:10:07 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:10:07 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help
Message-ID: <s98b016f.026@risd.edu>

Mark,
 
You are my new HERO! Hit the bricks Cpt. Marvel. If I were there... I'd kiss you!... Well, maybe not!
 
It all is now working perfectly.... even my moved list.
 
I removed the suspect config.pck file, re-copied over the original good one, then paid much closer attention to file ownership and permissions before re-running the withlist and arch commands again.
 
Thank You... Thank You Mark and others for your help!
 
Jeff
 

>>> On 2/5/2009 at 1:35 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
Jeff Bernier wrote:

>No... I cannot get to the moved lists URL. I get the same Bug in Mailman
>message. I seem to be able to do all the administrative and subscriber 
>tasks with all other lists. the individual lists URLs will work... I just
>can no longer get to the main Mailman list page at: http://mailman ( http://mailman/ )-host-name/mailman/listinfo or: http://mailman ( http://mailman/ )-host-name/mailman/admin.



This is because the moved list's liusts/LISTNAME/config.pck file is
corrupt.

The first step is to remove the config.pck. If there is a
config.pck.last, it may be OK. If there is no config.pck.last, or it's
not OK remove all lists/LISTNAME/config.pck* files for this list. Then
the admin and listinfo overviews will work.


>Additionally, I don't thing the withlist command was successful for the 
>list I attempted to move.


This may be the cause of the current problem, or it may be because
there was some problem with the original config.pck that you moved.


>And other Mailman commands seem to fail as well,
>such as list_lists, and list_admins, producing similar results as what I
>had forwarded below.


This is all because of the one corrupt config.pck.


>I will take a look at the link you noted to try to determine where the
>fault is.


You don't need to do that. That is only to identify which list's
config.pck is corrupt, but we know that because you can't get to the
moved list's admin or listinfo pages so it is the config.pck for the
moved list which has the problem.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 21:28:31 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:28:31 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Turn off Display of Additional Languages
In-Reply-To: <498B0308.7010005@nasa.gov>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020512283109371fc10e48@msapiro>

Paul E Virgo - ISG wrote:
>
>Was wondering if there is a way to turn off the display of additional 
>language choices within Mailman?
>Is this something that can be done via mm_cfg.py? Thanks.


You can remove a specific language with language code xx by putting the
following in mm_cfg.py.

del LC_DESCRIPTIONS['xx']

You can repeat that to remove multiple languages.

You can remove all languages except English by putting the following in
mm_cfg.py.


LC_DESCRIPTIONS.clear()
add_language('en', 'English (USA)', 'us-ascii', 'ltr')

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 21:47:08 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:47:08 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06A@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <PC187020090205124708073494d95d66@msapiro>

Goodman, William wrote:

>What release did you upgrade from?
>>From 2.1.7 to 2.1.12rc1


OK


>What's in Mailman's logs?
[...]
>snipet from error:
>Feb 04 19:13:23 2009 (4759) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 120, in
>_oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 191, in
>_onefile
>    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/ArchRunner.py", line 73, in
>_dispose
>    mlist.ArchiveMail(msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 216,
>in ArchiveMail
>    h.processUnixMailbox(f)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 564,
>in processUnixMailbox
>    m = mbox.next()
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/mailbox.py", line 35, in next
>    return self.factory(_Subfile(self.fp, start, stop))
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 89, in scrubber
>    return mailbox.scrub(msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 109, in scrub
>    return self._scrubber(self._mlist, msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 408,
>in process
>    replace_payload_by_text(msg, sep.join(text), charset)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 170,
>in replace_payload_by_text
>    msg.set_payload(text, charset)
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 218, in set_payload
>    self.set_charset(charset)
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 242, in set_charset
>    raise TypeError(charset)
>TypeError: us-ascii


This is a problem in the 2.1.12rc1 release. See the post at
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.html>
for the fix. There are a couple of other problems too. I will be
releasing 2.1.12rc2 in a day or so.


[...]
>snipet from smtp-failure:
>.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
>refused'), msgid: <20090204222702.7F98420066 at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
>refused'), msgid: <20090204222701.70F4F20070 at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
>refused'), msgid: <20090204222702.9D7D82006D at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')


Your MTA is not accepting connects from Mailman, at least part of the
time. See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/-IA9> for debugging hints
if this is an ongoing problem.

>
>What's in Mailman's qfiles/in/ directory?
>empty
>
>What are the other two high cpu runners (pids 4951 and 4946)?
>Yes that's it.


Yes, but which runners are they?

ps -fwp 4946 4951



>Does Mailman work normally except for this high cpu usage?
>
>First after moving my lists server all basic functions work, however the
>list server is not archiving, even when I select daily.


The not archiving is the issue referred to above. Once you apply the
patch from
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.html>,
you can check that you have no 'old' files in qfiles/shunt and run
bin/unshunt to archive the the messages that were shunted during
archiving.


>This is most likely because users cannot reply because they get bounced
>with:
> 
>Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
>Subject: RE: [Mylist] Test message
>Sent: 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>The following recipient(s) could not be reached:
>
>mylist at jcvi.org on 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>
>The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was
>sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to
>find out the correct address.
>
><EXCHANGE.XXXX.ORG #5.1.1>


This is an MTA issue. Were these list's working before the upgrade?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 21:51:03 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:51:03 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090205124708073494d95d66@msapiro>
Message-ID: <PC187020090205125103082851d74eff@msapiro>

Mark Sapiro wrote:
>
>The not archiving is the issue referred to above. Once you apply the
>patch from
><http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.html>,
>you can check that you have no 'old' files in qfiles/shunt and run
>bin/unshunt to archive the the messages that were shunted during
>archiving.


Note that you will need to restart Mailman after applying the patch and
before running bin/unshunt.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 22:11:01 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 13:11:01 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Permissions problems
In-Reply-To: <041b01c9879f$d2fa2b10$78ee8130$@rr.com>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020513110100461fc10aaf@msapiro>

Melinda Gilmore wrote:

>Mark,  thanks for the info that did work for that particular error.  But I
>keep getting this one, and the number at the end changes.   So I have to
>keep adding a file.


The problem appears to be with the creation of (in this case)
'/usr/local/mailman/lists/sis_directors/config.pck.tmp.lists.19678'


Is there some type of numbering system for
>config.pck.tmp, is this related to a cron job
>
>IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
>'/usr/local/mailman/lists/sis_directors/config.pck.tmp.lists.19678'


The number is the PIP of the process that's trying to update the
config.pck.

config.pck files are not updated directly since if they were, a failure
during the update could leave the file corrupt. They are updated as
follows:

A file is created named config.pck.tmp.host.pid where host is the name
of the host on which the process is running and pid is the process id
of the process. This file is written with the updated data. Then,
config.pck.last is removed, config.pck is renamed to config.pck.last
and finally config.pck.tmp.host.pid is renamed to config.pck.

Thus, except during the update process itself, there are only
config.pck and config.pck.last files. If there are problems creating
config.pck.tmp.host.pid, either the ownership/permissions of the
superordinate directories is not correct or the process doing the
updating is not running in Mailman's group.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From lists at mschuette.name  Thu Feb  5 22:50:29 2009
From: lists at mschuette.name (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Martin_Sch=FCtte?=)
Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 22:50:29 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAIlncBYYTzZFmqzQas1nFpnigAAAEAAAAGAv7lfX0XBEpBO5xSRMUs8BAAAAAA==@ukgateway.net>
References: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAIlncBYYTzZFmqzQas1nFpnigAAAEAAAAGAv7lfX0XBEpBO5xSRMUs8BAAAAAA==@ukgateway.net>
Message-ID: <498B5F25.9050906@mschuette.name>

Wyn schrieb:
> Has any one any ideas how to display a real name next to the email address
> in Subscriber List

I found the required change to be small enough and use the following code:

--- Mailman/HTMLFormatter.py.old        Mon Mar 12 23:25:34 2007
+++ Mailman/HTMLFormatter.py    Mon Mar 12 23:28:38 2007
@@ -94,6 +94,9 @@
                  showing = Utils.ObscureEmail(person, for_text=1)
              else:
                  showing = person
+            realname = Utils.uncanonstr(self.getMemberName(person), lang)
+            if realname:
+                showing += " (%s)" % Utils.websafe(realname)
              got = Link(url, showing)
              if self.getDeliveryStatus(person) <> MemberAdaptor.ENABLED:
                  got = Italic('(', got, ')')

-- 
Martin Sch?tte

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb  5 23:02:38 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 14:02:38 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06D@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902051402380718220270b4@msapiro>

Goodman, William wrote:
>
>Theses are the high cpu grabbers:
>
>mailman   4764  4751 74 Feb04 ?        17:00:03 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s
>
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   4766  4751 22 Feb04 ?        05:08:33 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=OutgoingRunner:0:1 -s
>
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   4760  4751  4 Feb04 ?        01:01:34 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=BounceRunner:0:1 -s 


OK, thanks.


>Also there's a dead like to the patch location you sent me.


Are you trying to go the URL I sent or are you trying to go to the
first of the two lines your MUA split it into?

><http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.h
>tml>,

In any case, here is the patch:

=== modified file 'Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py'
--- Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py        2008-12-01 04:30:43 +0000
+++ Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py        2009-01-12 17:45:14 +0000
@@ -1,4 +1,4 @@
-# Copyright (C) 2001-2008 by the Free Software Foundation, Inc.
+# Copyright (C) 2001-2009 by the Free Software Foundation, Inc.
 #
 # This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
 # modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License
@@ -167,6 +167,9 @@
     # message by a text (scrubbing).
     del msg['content-type']
     del msg['content-transfer-encoding']
+    if isinstance(charset, unicode):
+        # email 3.0.1 (python 2.4) doesn't like unicode
+        charset = charset.encode('us-ascii')
     msg.set_payload(text, charset)

This patch can also be found at
<http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/revision/1160>

Two other patches you may want to apply are at
<http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/revision/1162>
and
<http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/revision/1166>,
but as I said I will be releasing 2.1.12rc2 in a day or two with these
changes.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jeffrey at goldmark.org  Fri Feb  6 15:23:44 2009
From: jeffrey at goldmark.org (Jeffrey Goldberg)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 08:23:44 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Linux Preferred?
In-Reply-To: <4980058B.6090208@shub-internet.org>
References: <497ECE34.1AD2.00BD.0@ccs135.com>
	<4980058B.6090208@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <98E0A8B4-354E-4DEE-8D3F-BCD6E56323D6@goldmark.org>

On Jan 28, 2009, at 1:13 AM, Brad Knowles wrote:

> On another site I help administer, FreeBSD works just fine.  But  
> again, I run the version from our source and not the "ports" version.

I have found that using the FreeBSD ports system installation of  
Mailman is just fine.  When I first started there was a minor problem  
with postfix integration, but I sent of a note to the package  
maintainer and the problem was fixed very quickly.  Anyway, the  
maintainer of the FreeBSD "port" for mailman is very good.

It's been a while since I administered mailman on Redhat and SuSE.   
But I recall that in those cases I didn't use rpms, but just installed  
from the original source.

-j



-- 
Jeffrey Goldberg                        http://www.goldmark.org/jeff/


From b19141 at anl.gov  Fri Feb  6 16:34:15 2009
From: b19141 at anl.gov (Barry Finkel)
Date: Fri,  6 Feb 2009 09:34:15 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Linux Preferred?
In-Reply-To: Mail from 'Jeffrey Goldberg <jeffrey@goldmark.org>'
	dated: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 08:23:44 -0600
Message-ID: <20090206153415.9FAB51767D@britaine.cis.anl.gov>

On Jan 28, 2009, at 1:13 AM, Brad Knowles wrote:

>> On another site I help administer, FreeBSD works just fine.  But  
>> again, I run the version from our source and not the "ports" version.

Jeffrey Goldberg <jeffrey at goldmark.org> replied:

>I have found that using the FreeBSD ports system installation of  
>Mailman is just fine.  When I first started there was a minor problem  
>with postfix integration, but I sent of a note to the package  
>maintainer and the problem was fixed very quickly.  Anyway, the  
>maintainer of the FreeBSD "port" for mailman is very good.
>
>It's been a while since I administered mailman on Redhat and SuSE.   
>But I recall that in those cases I didn't use rpms, but just installed  
>from the original source.

Do you know what changes to the source, if any, were made by FreeBSD?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Barry S. Finkel
Computing and Information Systems Division
Argonne National Laboratory          Phone:    +1 (630) 252-7277
9700 South Cass Avenue               Facsimile:+1 (630) 252-4601
Building 222, Room D209              Internet: BSFinkel at anl.gov
Argonne, IL   60439-4828             IBMMAIL:  I1004994


From guerramx at gmail.com  Thu Feb  5 18:57:16 2009
From: guerramx at gmail.com (Guillermo Guerra)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:57:16 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Windows mobile
Message-ID: <498b3716.03e9300a.6623.ffffc86e@mx.google.com>

I have four mailing lists running under mailman, in all of them users that check their mail with windows mobile messaging complain that they cannot read the messages sent to the list, they see the body of the messages empty and with unreadable attachments..

Anybody with the same issue?

Guillermo Guerra.

From wgoodman at jcvi.org  Thu Feb  5 18:52:07 2009
From: wgoodman at jcvi.org (Goodman, William)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:52:07 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Need help with archiving and the Reply to: fails
Message-ID: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C069@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>

Hello I think these issues are related:
 
First after moving my lists server all basic functions work, however the
list server is not archiving, even when I select daily.
This is most likely because users cannot reply because they get bounced
with:
 
Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
Subject: RE: [Mylist] Test message
Sent: 2/4/2009 6:12 PM

The following recipient(s) could not be reached:

mylist at jcvi.org on 2/4/2009 6:12 PM

The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was
sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to
find out the correct address.

<EXCHANGE.XXXX.ORG #5.1.1>

Also in a previous post I was concern that the mailman python-2.4  using
96% cpu... searching but finding no answers.

Bill

 


From wgoodman at jcvi.org  Thu Feb  5 21:02:24 2009
From: wgoodman at jcvi.org (Goodman, William)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 15:02:24 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020511141307033ecc010c@msapiro>
References: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C056@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
	<PC18702009020511141307033ecc010c@msapiro>
Message-ID: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06A@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>

What release did you upgrade from?
>From 2.1.7 to 2.1.12rc1

What's in Mailman's logs?
snipet from bounce:
Feb 05 13:48:17 2009 (4760) gme_conference: bounce message w/no
discernable addresses:
<200902051848.n15ImFX1011268 at independence.tigr.org>
Feb 05 13:48:17 2009 (4760) gme_conference: forwarding unrecognized,
message-id: <200902051848.n15ImFX1011268 at independence.tigr.org>
snipet from error:
Feb 04 19:13:23 2009 (4759) Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 120, in
_oneloop
    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 191, in
_onefile
    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/ArchRunner.py", line 73, in
_dispose
    mlist.ArchiveMail(msg)
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 216,
in ArchiveMail
    h.processUnixMailbox(f)
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 564,
in processUnixMailbox
    m = mbox.next()
  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/mailbox.py", line 35, in next
    return self.factory(_Subfile(self.fp, start, stop))
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 89, in scrubber
    return mailbox.scrub(msg)
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 109, in scrub
    return self._scrubber(self._mlist, msg)
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 408,
in process
    replace_payload_by_text(msg, sep.join(text), charset)
  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 170,
in replace_payload_by_text
    msg.set_payload(text, charset)
  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 218, in set_payload
    self.set_charset(charset)
  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 242, in set_charset
    raise TypeError(charset)
TypeError: us-ascii
snipet from qrunner:
(pid: 4948, sig: None, sts: 15, class: CommandRunner, slice: 1/1)
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4759) ArchRunner qrunner started.
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4762) CommandRunner qrunner started.
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4760) BounceRunner qrunner started.
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4765) NewsRunner qrunner started.
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4764) IncomingRunner qrunner started.
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4767) VirginRunner qrunner started.
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4766) OutgoingRunner qrunner started.
Feb 04 17:25:24 2009 (4768) RetryRunner qrunner started.
snipet from smtp-failure:
.org>
Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
refused'), msgid: <20090204222702.7F98420066 at lists.jcvi.org>
Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
refused'), msgid: <20090204222701.70F4F20070 at lists.jcvi.org>
Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
refused'), msgid: <20090204222702.9D7D82006D at lists.jcvi.org>
Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org
failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')

The other logs show normal logging nor errors or warnings

What's in Mailman's qfiles/in/ directory?
empty

What are the other two high cpu runners (pids 4951 and 4946)?
Yes that's it.

Does Mailman work normally except for this high cpu usage?

First after moving my lists server all basic functions work, however the
list server is not archiving, even when I select daily.
This is most likely because users cannot reply because they get bounced
with:
 
Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
Subject: RE: [Mylist] Test message
Sent: 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
The following recipient(s) could not be reached:

mylist at jcvi.org on 2/4/2009 6:12 PM

The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was
sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to
find out the correct address.

<EXCHANGE.XXXX.ORG #5.1.1>


-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 2:14 PM
To: Goodman, William; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4 using 96% cpu

Goodman, William wrote:
> 
>After downloading and installing the latest version of 
>mailman-2.1.12rc1 and I'm using Apache-2.2-11 and 
>Postfix-2.3.3-2.1.el5_2. On CentOS 5.2 (RedhHat) for some reason I 
>can't understand the CPU usage is at 96% for mailman. When I do a top I

>get:
> 
>top - 11:18:13 up 16:38,  1 user,  load average: 2.78, 2.76, 2.62
>Tasks: 122 total,   2 running, 120 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
>Cpu(s): 33.4%us,  2.3%sy,  0.0%ni, 64.0%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.1%si, 
>0.0%st
>Mem:   3866536k total,  2471544k used,  1394992k free,   409096k
buffers
>Swap:  4194296k total,        0k used,  4194296k free,  1435408k cached
> 
>PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
>
>4949 mailman   25   0  175m  37m 2760 R   97  1.0 944:03.94 python2.4
>
>4951 mailman   16   0  168m  30m 2828 S   12  0.8 288:29.09 python2.4
>
>4946 mailman   16   0  171m  33m 2752 S    2  0.9  57:05.67 python2.4
>
>11093 postfix   15   0 54512 2848 2228 S    1  0.1   0:00.29 smtpd
>
>14 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   1:02.48 events/0
>
>3935 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   2:42.83 kjournald
>
>6479 root      15   0 88068 3232 2516 S    0  0.1   0:00.17 sshd
>
>10942 postfix   15   0 54212 2624 2064 S    0  0.1   0:00.20 local
>
>11157 postfix   15   0 54252 2360 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.11 cleanup
>
>11172 postfix   16   0 55140 2356 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.10 cleanup
>
> 
>When I search for that PID I get this:
> 
># ps -ef | grep 4949
>mailman   4949  4938 94 Feb03 ?        15:44:50 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s


What release did you upgrade from?

What's in Mailman's logs?

What's in Mailman's qfiles/in/ directory?

What are the other two high cpu runners (pids 4951 and 4946)?

Does Mailman work normally except for this high cpu usage?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From wgoodman at jcvi.org  Thu Feb  5 22:10:12 2009
From: wgoodman at jcvi.org (Goodman, William)
Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 16:10:12 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090205124708073494d95d66@msapiro>
References: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06A@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
	<PC187020090205124708073494d95d66@msapiro>
Message-ID: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06D@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>

Hi Mike,

Theses are the high cpu grabbers:

mailman   4764  4751 74 Feb04 ?        17:00:03 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s

UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
mailman   4766  4751 22 Feb04 ?        05:08:33 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=OutgoingRunner:0:1 -s

UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
mailman   4760  4751  4 Feb04 ?        01:01:34 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=BounceRunner:0:1 -s 

Also there's a dead like to the patch location you sent me.

Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 3:47 PM
To: Goodman, William; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: RE: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4 using 96% cpu

Goodman, William wrote:

>What release did you upgrade from?
>>From 2.1.7 to 2.1.12rc1


OK


>What's in Mailman's logs?
[...]
>snipet from error:
>Feb 04 19:13:23 2009 (4759) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 120, in 
>_oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 191, in 
>_onefile
>    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/ArchRunner.py", line 73, in

>_dispose
>    mlist.ArchiveMail(msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 216, 
>in ArchiveMail
>    h.processUnixMailbox(f)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 564,

>in processUnixMailbox
>    m = mbox.next()
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/mailbox.py", line 35, in next
>    return self.factory(_Subfile(self.fp, start, stop))
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 89, in scrubber
>    return mailbox.scrub(msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 109, in scrub
>    return self._scrubber(self._mlist, msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 408, 
>in process
>    replace_payload_by_text(msg, sep.join(text), charset)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 170, 
>in replace_payload_by_text
>    msg.set_payload(text, charset)
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 218, in
set_payload
>    self.set_charset(charset)
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 242, in
set_charset
>    raise TypeError(charset)
>TypeError: us-ascii


This is a problem in the 2.1.12rc1 release. See the post at
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.h
tml>
for the fix. There are a couple of other problems too. I will be
releasing 2.1.12rc2 in a day or so.


[...]
>snipet from smtp-failure:
>.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused') Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 
>(4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection refused'), msgid: 
><20090204222702.7F98420066 at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused') Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 
>(4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection refused'), msgid: 
><20090204222701.70F4F20070 at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused') Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 
>(4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection refused'), msgid: 
><20090204222702.9D7D82006D at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')


Your MTA is not accepting connects from Mailman, at least part of the
time. See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/-IA9> for debugging hints
if this is an ongoing problem.

>
>What's in Mailman's qfiles/in/ directory?
>empty
>
>What are the other two high cpu runners (pids 4951 and 4946)?
>Yes that's it.


Yes, but which runners are they?

ps -fwp 4946 4951



>Does Mailman work normally except for this high cpu usage?
>
>First after moving my lists server all basic functions work, however 
>the list server is not archiving, even when I select daily.


The not archiving is the issue referred to above. Once you apply the
patch from
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.h
tml>,
you can check that you have no 'old' files in qfiles/shunt and run
bin/unshunt to archive the the messages that were shunted during
archiving.


>This is most likely because users cannot reply because they get bounced
>with:
> 
>Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
>Subject: RE: [Mylist] Test message
>Sent: 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>The following recipient(s) could not be reached:
>
>mylist at jcvi.org on 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>
>The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was 
>sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to

>find out the correct address.
>
><EXCHANGE.XXXX.ORG #5.1.1>


This is an MTA issue. Were these list's working before the upgrade?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From cpz at tuunq.com  Fri Feb  6 18:44:50 2009
From: cpz at tuunq.com (Carl Zwanzig)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 09:44:50 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Linux Preferred?
In-Reply-To: <20090206153415.9FAB51767D@britaine.cis.anl.gov> from Barry Finkel
	at "Feb 6, 2009 09:34:15 am"
Message-ID: <20090206174451.2EDD07AE@mail.tuunq.com>

In a flurry of recycled electrons, Barry Finkel wrote:

> Do you know what changes to the source, if any, were made by FreeBSD?

You can see the entire set at http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/ports/mail/mailman/,
look in the files dir. The reality is that there are very few changes, and
most of them seem to be updating the port, not the mailman code.

z!
whose perferred version of 'linux' is freebsd :-).


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb  6 19:14:21 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 10:14:21 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Windows mobile
In-Reply-To: <498b3716.03e9300a.6623.ffffc86e@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902061014210468bef36fa9@msapiro>

Guillermo Guerra wrote:

>I have four mailing lists running under mailman, in all of them users that check their mail with windows mobile messaging complain that they cannot read the messages sent to the list, they see the body of the messages empty and with unreadable attachments..


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/84A9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb  6 19:26:42 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 10:26:42 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Need help with archiving and the Reply to: fails
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C069@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902061026420531bbcce13d@msapiro>

Goodman, William wrote:

>Hello I think these issues are related:


They aren't.


>First after moving my lists server all basic functions work, however the
>list server is not archiving, even when I select daily.


As mentioned in the 96% cpu thread
at<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2009-February/064978.html>,
this is due to a bug in 2.1.12rc1 for which a patch is available.


>This is most likely because users cannot reply because they get bounced
>with:
> 
>Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
>Subject: RE: [Mylist] Test message
>Sent: 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>
>The following recipient(s) could not be reached:
>
>mylist at jcvi.org on 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>
>The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was
>sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to
>find out the correct address.
>
><EXCHANGE.XXXX.ORG #5.1.1>


And this is an MTA issue.


>Also in a previous post I was concern that the mailman python-2.4  using
>96% cpu... searching but finding no answers.


We are out of phase here because of moderation issues. Are you still
having problems?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From Tlf1 at ccs135.com  Fri Feb  6 19:35:09 2009
From: Tlf1 at ccs135.com (Tim Ferguson)
Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 12:35:09 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Linux Preferred?
In-Reply-To: <20090206174451.2EDD07AE@mail.tuunq.com>
References: <20090206153415.9FAB51767D@britaine.cis.anl.gov> from Barry
	Finkel at "Feb 6,
	2009 09:34:15 am" <20090206174451.2EDD07AE@mail.tuunq.com>
Message-ID: <498C2E7D020000BD00014450@ccs135.com>

Along those lines, and since SuSE was mentioned,I've just installed a SuSE Linux Server 10 and let it install Mailman among other applications.  It reported that the install was a success, but unfortunately I've not found a way to get to Mailman admin or other web interfaces using the "normal" URL's or those that worked in UBuntu.  Any ideas on where I should look, please?
 
Thanks,
 
Tim


>>> On 2/6/2009 at 11:44 AM, Carl Zwanzig <cpz at tuunq.com> wrote:

In a flurry of recycled electrons, Barry Finkel wrote:

> Do you know what changes to the source, if any, were made by FreeBSD?

You can see the entire set at http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/ports/mail/mailman/,
look in the files dir. The reality is that there are very few changes, and
most of them seem to be updating the port, not the mailman code.

z!
whose perferred version of 'linux' is freebsd :-).

------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list
Mailman-Users at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/tlf1%40ccs135.com

Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb  6 19:47:39 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 10:47:39 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Linux Preferred?
In-Reply-To: <498C2E7D020000BD00014450@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902061047390812bbcce253@msapiro>

Tim Ferguson wrote:

>Along those lines, and since SuSE was mentioned,I've just installed a SuSE Linux Server 10 and let it install Mailman among other applications.  It reported that the install was a success, but unfortunately I've not found a way to get to Mailman admin or other web interfaces using the "normal" URL's or those that worked in UBuntu.  Any ideas on where I should look, please?


In your web server configuration.

Some packages install /etc/httpd/conf.d/mailman or similar with the
Apache config directives for Mailman. Ultimately you need the things
discussed at <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node10.html>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk  Fri Feb  6 19:58:37 2009
From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 18:58:37 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Linux Preferred?
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902061047390812bbcce253@msapiro>
References: <498C2E7D020000BD00014450@ccs135.com>
	<PC1870200902061047390812bbcce253@msapiro>
Message-ID: <20090206185837.GQ1959@amyl.org.uk>

On Fri, Feb 06, 2009 at 10:47:39AM -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Tim Ferguson wrote:
>> unfortunately I've not found a way to get to Mailman admin or other
>> web interfaces using the "normal" URL's or those that worked in
>> UBuntu.  Any ideas on where I should look, please?
> 
> In your web server configuration.
> 
> Some packages install /etc/httpd/conf.d/mailman or similar with the
> Apache config directives for Mailman. Ultimately you need the things
> discussed at <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node10.html>.

whereis(1) & sed(1) on the apache config?

From Jan at Bytesmiths.com  Fri Feb  6 20:22:35 2009
From: Jan at Bytesmiths.com (Jan Steinman)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 11:22:35 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <mailman.14.1233918008.25508.mailman-users@python.org>
References: <mailman.14.1233918008.25508.mailman-users@python.org>
Message-ID: <10FCF96D-F723-4989-B693-4FB539F84A9A@Bytesmiths.com>

> From: Martin Sch?tte <lists at mschuette.name>
>
> Wyn schrieb:
>> Has any one any ideas how to display a real name next to the email  
>> address
>> in Subscriber List
>
> I found the required change to be small enough and use the following  
> code:
>
> --- Mailman/HTMLFormatter.py.old        Mon Mar 12 23:25:34 2007
> +++ Mailman/HTMLFormatter.py    Mon Mar 12 23:28:38 2007
> @@ -94,6 +94,9 @@
>                 showing = Utils.ObscureEmail(person, for_text=1)
>             else:
>                 showing = person
> +            realname = Utils.uncanonstr(self.getMemberName(person),  
> lang)
> +            if realname:
> +                showing += " (%s)" % Utils.websafe(realname)
>             got = Link(url, showing)
>             if self.getDeliveryStatus(person) <>  
> MemberAdaptor.ENABLED:
>                 got = Italic('(', got, ')')

Thanks, Martin! I've had several clients ask for this, and haven't had  
the time to track it down.

Mark, any chance of this getting in the regular distribution, perhaps  
controlled by a config switch?

:::: You don't build a new world by pouring yourself into the broken  
molds of the old one. ::::
:::: Jan Steinman, http://www.EcoReality.org ::::



From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb  6 20:39:51 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 11:39:51 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.12rc2 released.
Message-ID: <498C9207.8000405@msapiro.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I am happy to announce the second release candidate of Mailman 2.1.12.

Since 2.1.12rc1 there have been a few bug fixes and updates to the Dutch
and Catalan translations.

Mailman 2.1.12 is a minor bug fix and Python 2.6 compatibility release.

The minimum Python for this release is Python 2.4 and it is compatible
with Python through 2.6. The previous Mailman releases are not
compatible with Python 2.6.

See the release notes at
<https://sourceforge.net/project/shownotes.php?release_id=653108&group_id=103>
for more details.

Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.

For more information, including download links, please see:

http://www.list.org
http://mailman.sf.net
http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman


Note to translators:

The mailman.pot is up to date in this release and has been merged with
the individual message catalogs. If possible, please review your
translations and submit any changes before February 20 if you want to
get them in the 2.1.12 final release.

- --
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32)

iD8DBQFJjJIHVVuXXpU7hpMRAhsnAKDYNDPeP6ySt291ZGZNd/mn7rixCgCg5tXE
URQ7k+s8ISZYUFuAbV7sH3Y=
=RYYi
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb  6 22:18:57 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 13:18:57 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <10FCF96D-F723-4989-B693-4FB539F84A9A@Bytesmiths.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902061318570828bbcce275@msapiro>

Jan Steinman wrote:
>
>Mark, any chance of this getting in the regular distribution, perhaps  
>controlled by a config switch?


I'll put it in 2.2.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From wgoodman at jcvi.org  Fri Feb  6 22:42:43 2009
From: wgoodman at jcvi.org (Goodman, William)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 16:42:43 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06D@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
References: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06A@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG><PC187020090205124708073494d95d66@msapiro>
	<7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C06D@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C07C@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>

Sorry to say Mike this is after applying all patches... but it now
archiving

top - 16:33:18 up 1 day, 23:08,  2 users,  load average: 2.87, 2.24,
1.32
Tasks: 106 total,   3 running, 103 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
Cpu(s): 58.7%us,  3.5%sy,  0.0%ni, 37.4%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.2%si,
0.0%st
Mem:   3866604k total,  1600176k used,  2266428k free,   442080k buffers
Swap:  4194296k total,        4k used,  4194292k free,   373852k cached

  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
 8969 mailman   25   0  150m  12m 2748 R   93  0.3   5:37.84 python2.4
 8971 mailman   16   0  147m 9952 2808 S    9  0.3   1:42.04 python2.4
 8967 mailman   16   0  151m  12m 2748 S    1  0.3   0:20.62 python2.4
    2 root      RT  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   0:06.35 migration/0
10760 postfix   16   0 54212 2624 2064 S    0  0.1   0:00.12 local
10895 postfix   15   0 54252 2356 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.11 cleanup

# ps -fwp 8969
UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
mailman   8969  8965 73 16:25 ?        00:06:43 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s 

# ps -fwp 8971
UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
mailman   8971  8965 22 16:25 ?        00:02:10 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=OutgoingRunner:0:1 -s

# ps -fwp 8967
UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
mailman   8967  8965  4 16:25 ?        00:00:28 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=BounceRunner:0:1 -s

Any other suggestions are welcomed.

Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: mailman-users-bounces+wgoodman=jcvi.org at python.org
[mailto:mailman-users-bounces+wgoodman=jcvi.org at python.org] On Behalf Of
Goodman, William
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 4:10 PM
To: Mark Sapiro; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4 using 96% cpu

Hi Mike,

Theses are the high cpu grabbers:

mailman   4764  4751 74 Feb04 ?        17:00:03 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s

UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
mailman   4766  4751 22 Feb04 ?        05:08:33 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=OutgoingRunner:0:1 -s

UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
mailman   4760  4751  4 Feb04 ?        01:01:34 /usr/bin/python2.4
/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=BounceRunner:0:1 -s 

Also there's a dead like to the patch location you sent me.

Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net]
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 3:47 PM
To: Goodman, William; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: RE: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4 using 96% cpu

Goodman, William wrote:

>What release did you upgrade from?
>>From 2.1.7 to 2.1.12rc1


OK


>What's in Mailman's logs?
[...]
>snipet from error:
>Feb 04 19:13:23 2009 (4759) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 120, in 
>_oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 191, in 
>_onefile
>    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Queue/ArchRunner.py", line 73, in

>_dispose
>    mlist.ArchiveMail(msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 216, 
>in ArchiveMail
>    h.processUnixMailbox(f)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 564,

>in processUnixMailbox
>    m = mbox.next()
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/mailbox.py", line 35, in next
>    return self.factory(_Subfile(self.fp, start, stop))
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 89, in scrubber
>    return mailbox.scrub(msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py", line 109, in scrub
>    return self._scrubber(self._mlist, msg)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 408, 
>in process
>    replace_payload_by_text(msg, sep.join(text), charset)
>  File "/opt/software/mailman/Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py", line 170, 
>in replace_payload_by_text
>    msg.set_payload(text, charset)
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 218, in
set_payload
>    self.set_charset(charset)
>  File "/usr/lib64/python2.4/email/Message.py", line 242, in
set_charset
>    raise TypeError(charset)
>TypeError: us-ascii


This is a problem in the 2.1.12rc1 release. See the post at
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.h
tml>
for the fix. There are a couple of other problems too. I will be
releasing 2.1.12rc2 in a day or so.


[...]
>snipet from smtp-failure:
>.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused') Feb 04 17:27:18 2009
>(4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection refused'), msgid: 
><20090204222702.7F98420066 at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused') Feb 04 17:27:18 2009
>(4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection refused'), msgid: 
><20090204222701.70F4F20070 at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused') Feb 04 17:27:18 2009
>(4766) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection refused'), msgid: 
><20090204222702.9D7D82006D at lists.jcvi.org>
>Feb 04 17:27:18 2009 (4766) delivery to mailman-owner at lists.tigr.org 
>failed with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')


Your MTA is not accepting connects from Mailman, at least part of the
time. See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/-IA9> for debugging hints
if this is an ongoing problem.

>
>What's in Mailman's qfiles/in/ directory?
>empty
>
>What are the other two high cpu runners (pids 4951 and 4946)?
>Yes that's it.


Yes, but which runners are they?

ps -fwp 4946 4951



>Does Mailman work normally except for this high cpu usage?
>
>First after moving my lists server all basic functions work, however 
>the list server is not archiving, even when I select daily.


The not archiving is the issue referred to above. Once you apply the
patch from
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2009-January/000129.h
tml>,
you can check that you have no 'old' files in qfiles/shunt and run
bin/unshunt to archive the the messages that were shunted during
archiving.


>This is most likely because users cannot reply because they get bounced
>with:
> 
>Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
>Subject: RE: [Mylist] Test message
>Sent: 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>The following recipient(s) could not be reached:
>
>mylist at jcvi.org on 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>
>The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was 
>sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to

>find out the correct address.
>
><EXCHANGE.XXXX.ORG #5.1.1>


This is an MTA issue. Were these list's working before the upgrade?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list
Mailman-Users at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Searchable Archives:
http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Unsubscribe:
http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/wgoodman%40jcvi.org

Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb  6 23:19:19 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 14:19:19 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C07C@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020614191901095bbf5c40@msapiro>

Goodman, William wrote:

>Sorry to say Mike this is after applying all patches... but it now
>archiving


OK. That's good.


>top - 16:33:18 up 1 day, 23:08,  2 users,  load average: 2.87, 2.24,
>1.32
>Tasks: 106 total,   3 running, 103 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
>Cpu(s): 58.7%us,  3.5%sy,  0.0%ni, 37.4%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.2%si,
>0.0%st
>Mem:   3866604k total,  1600176k used,  2266428k free,   442080k buffers
>Swap:  4194296k total,        4k used,  4194292k free,   373852k cached
>
>  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
> 8969 mailman   25   0  150m  12m 2748 R   93  0.3   5:37.84 python2.4
> 8971 mailman   16   0  147m 9952 2808 S    9  0.3   1:42.04 python2.4
> 8967 mailman   16   0  151m  12m 2748 S    1  0.3   0:20.62 python2.4
>    2 root      RT  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   0:06.35 migration/0
>10760 postfix   16   0 54212 2624 2064 S    0  0.1   0:00.12 local
>10895 postfix   15   0 54252 2356 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.11 cleanup
>
># ps -fwp 8969
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   8969  8965 73 16:25 ?        00:06:43 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s 
>
># ps -fwp 8971
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   8971  8965 22 16:25 ?        00:02:10 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=OutgoingRunner:0:1 -s
>
># ps -fwp 8967
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   8967  8965  4 16:25 ?        00:00:28 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=BounceRunner:0:1 -s
>
>Any other suggestions are welcomed.


I hope you don't have anything like

QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME = 0

in mm_cfg.py. It's unlikely that that would cause a pattern like this.
More likely would be all runners using aproximately equal CPU.

You could try putting

QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME = seconds(5)

in mm_cfg.py (the default is 1) and restarting Mailman to see if that
changes things. If that doesn't help, you may need to strace the PID
of IncomingRunner to see what it's doing. It should be spending almost
all of it's time waiting for

select(0, NULL, NULL, NULL, {1, 0})

(or maybe

select(0, NULL, NULL, NULL, {5, 0})

if you made the QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME change).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From wgoodman at jcvi.org  Sat Feb  7 00:46:29 2009
From: wgoodman at jcvi.org (Goodman, William)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 18:46:29 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020614191901095bbf5c40@msapiro>
References: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C07C@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
	<PC18702009020614191901095bbf5c40@msapiro>
Message-ID: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C07F@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>

Cool Mike that helped a lot...

I was so frustrated I set it to:

QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME = seconds(10)

That seem to calm it down a bit.

top - 18:38:02 up 56 min,  2 users,  load average: 1.25, 1.20, 1.83
Tasks: 109 total,   1 running, 108 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
Cpu(s): 20.3%us,  0.3%sy,  0.0%ni, 79.2%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.0%si,
0.0%st
Mem:   3866604k total,   494800k used,  3371804k free,   175632k buffers
Swap:  4194296k total,        0k used,  4194296k free,   172108k cached

  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
19021 mailman   25   0  150m  12m 2752 S   41  0.3   1:59.92 python2.4
    8 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   0:03.72 events/0
19797 root      16   0 12584 1068  800 S    0  0.0   0:00.30 top
    1 root      15   0 10324  692  580 S    0  0.0   0:00.40 init

But I still see 99% spikes from time to time. Is there a BOUNCERUNNER
and INCOMINGRUNNER parameter?

Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 5:19 PM
To: Goodman, William; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: RE: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4 using 96% cpu

Goodman, William wrote:

>Sorry to say Mike this is after applying all patches... but it now 
>archiving


OK. That's good.


>top - 16:33:18 up 1 day, 23:08,  2 users,  load average: 2.87, 2.24,
>1.32
>Tasks: 106 total,   3 running, 103 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
>Cpu(s): 58.7%us,  3.5%sy,  0.0%ni, 37.4%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.2%si, 
>0.0%st
>Mem:   3866604k total,  1600176k used,  2266428k free,   442080k
buffers
>Swap:  4194296k total,        4k used,  4194292k free,   373852k cached
>
>  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
> 8969 mailman   25   0  150m  12m 2748 R   93  0.3   5:37.84 python2.4
> 8971 mailman   16   0  147m 9952 2808 S    9  0.3   1:42.04 python2.4
> 8967 mailman   16   0  151m  12m 2748 S    1  0.3   0:20.62 python2.4
>    2 root      RT  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   0:06.35
migration/0
>10760 postfix   16   0 54212 2624 2064 S    0  0.1   0:00.12 local
>10895 postfix   15   0 54252 2356 1820 S    0  0.1   0:00.11 cleanup
>
># ps -fwp 8969
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   8969  8965 73 16:25 ?        00:06:43 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=IncomingRunner:0:1 -s
>
># ps -fwp 8971
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   8971  8965 22 16:25 ?        00:02:10 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=OutgoingRunner:0:1 -s
>
># ps -fwp 8967
>UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
>mailman   8967  8965  4 16:25 ?        00:00:28 /usr/bin/python2.4
>/opt/software/mailman/bin/qrunner --runner=BounceRunner:0:1 -s
>
>Any other suggestions are welcomed.


I hope you don't have anything like

QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME = 0

in mm_cfg.py. It's unlikely that that would cause a pattern like this.
More likely would be all runners using aproximately equal CPU.

You could try putting

QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME = seconds(5)

in mm_cfg.py (the default is 1) and restarting Mailman to see if that
changes things. If that doesn't help, you may need to strace the PID of
IncomingRunner to see what it's doing. It should be spending almost all
of it's time waiting for

select(0, NULL, NULL, NULL, {1, 0})

(or maybe

select(0, NULL, NULL, NULL, {5, 0})

if you made the QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME change).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb  7 02:04:41 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 17:04:41 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C07F@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902061704410640bbcce1a9@msapiro>

Goodman, William wrote:

>Cool Mike that helped a lot...


It's Mark ...


>I was so frustrated I set it to:
>
>QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME = seconds(10)
>
>That seem to calm it down a bit.
>
>top - 18:38:02 up 56 min,  2 users,  load average: 1.25, 1.20, 1.83
>Tasks: 109 total,   1 running, 108 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
>Cpu(s): 20.3%us,  0.3%sy,  0.0%ni, 79.2%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.0%si,
>0.0%st
>Mem:   3866604k total,   494800k used,  3371804k free,   175632k buffers
>Swap:  4194296k total,        0k used,  4194296k free,   172108k cached
>
>  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
>19021 mailman   25   0  150m  12m 2752 S   41  0.3   1:59.92 python2.4
>    8 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   0:03.72 events/0
>19797 root      16   0 12584 1068  800 S    0  0.0   0:00.30 top
>    1 root      15   0 10324  692  580 S    0  0.0   0:00.40 init
>
>But I still see 99% spikes from time to time. Is there a BOUNCERUNNER
>and INCOMINGRUNNER parameter?


QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME applies to all the runners.


I suppose it's possible you are just being bombarded with mail. Perhaps
there is some kind of mail loop.

What's in Mailman's vette log?

What do you see if you stop Mailman and while it is stopped do

ls -aR qfiles/

Do you see any entries? If so, and you do the ls again are there more
entries or the same ones? If there are entries, what's in them (use
bin/show_qfiles to list them)?

Also, as root do

strace -p xxx -o filename

where xxx is the pid of incoming runner. Let it run for 10 or 20
seconds and then stop it with control-C and see what's in the output
(filename).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From Jan at Bytesmiths.com  Sat Feb  7 03:16:24 2009
From: Jan at Bytesmiths.com (Jan Steinman)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 18:16:24 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <mailman.40935.1233968686.3486.mailman-users@python.org>
References: <mailman.40935.1233968686.3486.mailman-users@python.org>
Message-ID: <A1DE771F-010A-461A-B6CB-A1888C054C1F@Bytesmiths.com>

> From: Mark Sapiro <znex at zfncveb.arg>
>
> Jan Steinman wrote:
>>
>> Mark, any chance of this getting in the regular distribution, perhaps
>> controlled by a config switch?
>
> I'll put it in 2.2.

Wow, thanks!

:::: The Earth isn't a pizza. You can't dial up and have one  
delivered! -- Alf ::::
:::: Jan Steinman <http://www.EcoReality.org> ::::



From cain at tfn.net  Sat Feb  7 19:14:53 2009
From: cain at tfn.net (Joseph Cain)
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 13:14:53 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] understanding topics
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0902071309370.32474@freenet.tfn.net>

I am setting up topics on one of our lists and am a bit perplexed about 
the "yes" option that follows.

I have some subscribers that are burned out one reading about one topic 
and would like to be able to exclude receiving any more posts to it. 
Will the following recipe work?

first, I set up a topic that most anyone would want to select, like 
"burglary" or "police" for example since this is a neighborhood list and 
most everyone wants to know about criminal activity.

I then set a few topics including the one they don't want to see any more 
about.

I suggest they check only the burglary topic, but then put "yes" in the
selection that follows.

Is it true then that they will NOT receive posts to the
available topics they do not check, and all others that do not match any 
topic key word, or will it mean they would receive all posts anyway? If 
it is the latter, why does the yes/no option exist?



Joseph Cain	cain at tfn.net
(850) 385-0227 or fax after prior call to setup
http://www.tfn.net/~cain

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb  7 20:06:39 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 11:06:39 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] understanding topics
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0902071309370.32474@freenet.tfn.net>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902071106390171b5706e92@msapiro>

Joseph Cain wrote:

>I am setting up topics on one of our lists and am a bit perplexed about 
>the "yes" option that follows.
>
>I have some subscribers that are burned out one reading about one topic 
>and would like to be able to exclude receiving any more posts to it. 
>Will the following recipe work?
>
>first, I set up a topic that most anyone would want to select, like 
>"burglary" or "police" for example since this is a neighborhood list and 
>most everyone wants to know about criminal activity.
>
>I then set a few topics including the one they don't want to see any more 
>about.
>
>I suggest they check only the burglary topic, but then put "yes" in the
>selection that follows.
>
>Is it true then that they will NOT receive posts to the
>available topics they do not check, and all others that do not match any 
>topic key word, or will it mean they would receive all posts anyway? If 
>it is the latter, why does the yes/no option exist?


It's neither. Under the situation you've described, the user will
receive all messages that match the topics they select and all
messages which don't match any topic. They will not receive messages
which match some topic(s) but not any they selected.

The Yes/No selection simply controls whether they do or don't receive
posts that don't match any topic, if they've selected at least one
topic.

If they select no topics, they receive all posts regardless of the
Yes/No setting.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From E.Schvartz at cmec.ca  Fri Feb  6 19:50:15 2009
From: E.Schvartz at cmec.ca (Eric Schvartz)
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 13:50:15 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] non-delivery notfications
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902061026420531bbcce13d@msapiro>
References: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C069@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
	<PC1870200902061026420531bbcce13d@msapiro>
Message-ID: <74B3E5BE7E41D744A8609272302B25F7043CBF84@cmecexch.secretariat.com>

Hello,

I am new to Mailman (version 2.1.9) -- but used to managing lists in Lyris' ListManager -- and rather non-technical.  

Access to Mailman is provided me by my hosting service, so I do not have control over global configuration parameters, just the configuration of individual lists.

Here is my question:

As a list administrator, I would like to receive non-delivery notifications like the ones below that I saw in an earlier message to this list.  I have tried to figure out how to do this, but without success so far.

Could somebody point me in the right direction? This would be much appreciated.

Best regards.

Eric Schvartz
R?seau des traducteurs et traductrices en ?ducation
Email: e.schvartz at cmec.ca 
http://www.rte-nte.ca/



>Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.
>Subject: RE: [Mylist] Test message
>Sent: 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>
>The following recipient(s) could not be reached:
>
>mylist at jcvi.org on 2/4/2009 6:12 PM
>
>The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was
>sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to
>find out the correct address.
>
><EXCHANGE.XXXX.ORG #5.1.1>

From mail_python_org.shustak at neverbox.com  Sat Feb  7 08:01:27 2009
From: mail_python_org.shustak at neverbox.com (shustak)
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 20:01:27 +1300
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Removing Email Address From Archives
Message-ID: <7DEB2461-12B5-432F-8BBC-B6A07D06A1A6@neverbox.com>

I would like to either remove the posters email address from the  
archives or replace it with the text "reply".

So far my investigation of how to achieve this kind of email address  
removal resulted in the following : http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users at python.org/msg46398.html

> There is no option or setting to do this. You would have to modify the
> code in Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py.

Is this still the case? If editing this file is the best way to go  
about this, has someone release a patch?

I also considered using hypermail or Mhonarc mail archivers rather  
than pipermail. However, I only managed to change the domain part of  
the address to "xxxxxxxxxxxxxx".

If anyone is able to point me to a tutorial or any other resources  
regarding setting up an archive which will not contain the poster  
email address, that would be most helpful.

PS : I am new to configuring a mailman. 

From nmcherla at aim.com  Sat Feb  7 04:46:27 2009
From: nmcherla at aim.com (nmcherla at aim.com)
Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 22:46:27 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman Configuration
Message-ID: <8CB56EDCA6B2CCC-16E4-119E@WEBMAIL-DC03.sysops.aol.com>

Hi,



I am new to mailman and have installed and configured Mailman with
Postfix and SpamAssassin.? Now I am trying to create first Site-wide
Mailing list "mailman".? It is prompting me for email of the person
running the list and not sure what else it would be asking for.? As it
the site wide mailing list , not sure what to enter here. Any
suggestions would be really helpful.? 



?bash-3.2# bin/newlist mailman

Enter the email of the person running the list:


And in my mm_cfg.py file and when i type the URL mymailman.xxx.org it only displays "It works!"? , but if i type the URL as mymailman.xx.org/mailman then only I can see the page.? What am i doing work.




DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'xxx.org'



DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'mymailman.xxx.org'





Thanks


From wyn_rowlands at ukgateway.net  Sat Feb  7 12:43:59 2009
From: wyn_rowlands at ukgateway.net (Wyn)
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 11:43:59 -0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <A1DE771F-010A-461A-B6CB-A1888C054C1F@Bytesmiths.com>
References: <mailman.40935.1233968686.3486.mailman-users@python.org>
	<A1DE771F-010A-461A-B6CB-A1888C054C1F@Bytesmiths.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAIlncBYYTzZFmqzQas1nFpnigAAAEAAAAOzeaq3se7VBjx0a62PKSpMBAAAAAA==@ukgateway.net>

Thanks for this !

One small / big problem, cant find the mailman directory on my host server,
to enable me to find the file that needs editing ?, (and Yes it is
installed) and working

Wyn



From shop at justbrits.com  Sun Feb  8 13:50:05 2009
From: shop at justbrits.com (Ed's Shop)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 06:50:05 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAIlncBYYTzZFmqzQas1nFpnigAAAEAAAAOzeaq3se7VBjx0a62PKSpMBAAAAAA==@ukgateway.net>
Message-ID: <OLECLAFDGBNPEJPOHHIJKEBPCIAA.shop@justbrits.com>

<Thanks for this !
<
<One small / big problem, cant find the mailman directory on my 
<host server, to enable me to find the file that needs editing ?, 
<(and Yes it is installed) and working
<
<Wyn

Wyn, are you in cPanel on your Host Server??  Or something
like it??

Ed

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb  8 16:54:34 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 07:54:34 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] non-delivery notfications
In-Reply-To: <74B3E5BE7E41D744A8609272302B25F7043CBF84@cmecexch.secretariat.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090208075434093705bbfccb@msapiro>

Eric Schvartz wrote:
>
>Access to Mailman is provided me by my hosting service, so I do not have control over global configuration parameters, just the configuration of individual lists.
>
>Here is my question:
>
>As a list administrator, I would like to receive non-delivery notifications like the ones below that I saw in an earlier message to this list.  I have tried to figure out how to do this, but without success so far.


Mailman can be set to automatically process 'bounces' (non-delivery
notices or DSNs) for outgoing mail. Read the description on the admin
Bounce processing page.

If bounce_processing is set to No, bounces will be discarded and you
won't see them and nothing will be done about them.

If you set bounce_processing to Yes and also set at least
bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner and
bounce_notify_owner_on_disable under Notifications to Yes, then you
will receive a copy of every message to the listname-bounces address
(where bounces normally go) that is not recognized by Mailman. This
includes spam to the listname-bounces address and legitimates but
non-standard bounces that Mailman is unable to parse.

You will also receive a notice when a member's delivery is disabled by
bounce processing, and this notice will contain a copy of the bounce
message that triggered the disable.

You will not receive bounces that are recognized and only increment the
user's bounce score but do not reach the threshold for disabling
delivery. In your situation, there's no way to see those. If you want
to see every bounce, you have to set bounce_score_threshold <= 1.0 so
the member's delivery is disabled on the first bounce. Then you will
receive the 'disabled' notice with the triggering bounce, and you can
manually re-enable delivery via the Membership
Management...->Membership List page if you want.

We suggest that you don't do this, but rather set appropriate values
for the parameters (our defaults [5.0, 7, 3, 7] are good for lists
that receive daily or almost daily posts), and let Mailman handle the
bounces.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb  8 17:18:18 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 08:18:18 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman Configuration
In-Reply-To: <8CB56EDCA6B2CCC-16E4-119E@WEBMAIL-DC03.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020808181809217666deab@msapiro>

nmcherla at aim.com wrote:
>
>I am new to mailman and have installed and configured Mailman with
>Postfix and SpamAssassin.? Now I am trying to create first Site-wide
>Mailing list "mailman".? It is prompting me for email of the person
>running the list and not sure what else it would be asking for.? As it
>the site wide mailing list , not sure what to enter here. Any
>suggestions would be really helpful.? 
>
>
>
>?bash-3.2# bin/newlist mailman
>
>Enter the email of the person running the list:


This is the email address of the list owner. In the case of the site
list (mailman list), the list owner would normally be the Mailman site
administrator (you?).


>And in my mm_cfg.py file


??


>and when i type the URL mymailman.xxx.org it only displays "It works!"? , but if i type the URL as mymailman.xx.org/mailman then only I can see the page.? What am i doing work.


You're not doing anything wrong. If you want http://mymailman.xxx.org
to go to the Mailman listinfo overview page, you need to set this up
in your web server. Assuming Apache, the easiest way to do this is add

RedirectMatch ^[/]+$   http://mymailman.xxx.org/mailman/listinfo

to the appropriate section of httpd.conf.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb  8 17:34:36 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 08:34:36 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Display Real Name in Subscriber List
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAIlncBYYTzZFmqzQas1nFpnigAAAEAAAAOzeaq3se7VBjx0a62PKSpMBAAAAAA==@ukgateway.net>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902080834360328f0fba8ec@msapiro>

Wyn wrote:
>
>One small / big problem, cant find the mailman directory on my host server,
>to enable me to find the file that needs editing ?, (and Yes it is
>installed) and working


Try

locate mm_cfg.py

If that doesn't find it, try

find / -print -name mm_cfg.py

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From barry at list.org  Mon Feb  9 00:12:33 2009
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 18:12:33 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER
Message-ID: <FD75378C-AF1C-4C12-A913-4172D9250CFD@list.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Does anybody set USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER to Yes these days?

I'm considering removing the equivalent of this from Mailman 3.0 and  
I'd like to know if that would be a hardship for anyone.  If you don't  
know what this value is (which in Mailman 2 lives in Defaults.py),  
then you probably won't miss its demise in Mailman 3.

This flag controls whether the Sender: header is considered before the  
From: header for purposes of trying to determine the email address of  
the message's author.  At one time in the distant past, this flag was  
added because it was observed that some MTAs put the RFC 2821 MAIL  
FROM value into this header, and this was considered less spoofable  
than the From: header.  I think these assumptions are outdated and  
this workaround is either unnecessary or hurts more than it helps.

BTW, the default value is No, which tells Mailman to use the From:  
header first.  I propose hardwiring that default value.

Let me know if this would cause you pain.

Barry

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From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb  9 00:49:58 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 15:49:58 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER
In-Reply-To: <FD75378C-AF1C-4C12-A913-4172D9250CFD@list.org>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020815495803755323d571@msapiro>

Barry Warsaw wrote:

>Does anybody set USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER to Yes these days?


There are potential issues with this with umbrella lists. Perhaps
Mailman 3 will handle these differently, but here is the issue.

There are two message methods, get_sender() and get_senders().
USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER only affects get_sender(). With
USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER false, get_sender() returns the first address
found in From:, Sender: and unixfrom (envelope sender). With
USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER true, the order is Sender:, From: and unixfrom, so
it doesn't even really do what it claims.

get_senders() returns a list of addresses found in those headers
defined in SENDER_HEADERS. The default searches From:, unixfrom,
Reply-To: and Sender: in that order and returns all addresses found.

The Moderate handler first checks the get_senders() list to see if any
address is a list member. The first hit determines whether the post is
from a moderated member. If there are no hits, Moderate goes on the
search *_these_nonmembers for the one address returned by get_sender()

The potential issue is if you want posts to the umbrella list to be
accepted by the child lists without being held, one technique is to
put the umbrella's listname-bounces address in accept_these_nonmembers
of the children, and this requires USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER to be true in
order to work.

There are other ways to accomplish this that don't require
USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER. E.g. subscribing the umbrella's listname-bounces
address to the child lists with delivery (and password reminders)
disabled; using appropriate @listname entries in
accept_these_nonmembers, or making the umbrella anonymous and putting
the umbrella's posting address in the children's
accept_these_nonmembers.

Some of this is in the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/boA9>.


>I'm considering removing the equivalent of this from Mailman 3.0 and  
>I'd like to know if that would be a hardship for anyone.  If you don't  
>know what this value is (which in Mailman 2 lives in Defaults.py),  
>then you probably won't miss its demise in Mailman 3.
>
>This flag controls whether the Sender: header is considered before the  
>From: header for purposes of trying to determine the email address of  
>the message's author.  At one time in the distant past, this flag was  
>added because it was observed that some MTAs put the RFC 2821 MAIL  
>FROM value into this header, and this was considered less spoofable  
>than the From: header.  I think these assumptions are outdated and  
>this workaround is either unnecessary or hurts more than it helps.


I agree that the use of USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER as an anti-spoof is
outdated, particularly because it doesn't even come into play for the
member/nonmember decision.


>BTW, the default value is No, which tells Mailman to use the From:  
>header first.  I propose hardwiring that default value.
>
>Let me know if this would cause you pain.


I think it will impact some users with umbrella lists depending on how
(or if) umbrella lists are handled in Mailman 3.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From barry at list.org  Mon Feb  9 01:10:07 2009
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 19:10:07 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020815495803755323d571@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009020815495803755323d571@msapiro>
Message-ID: <4785A76E-FB4C-4404-ACE9-A682493B435E@list.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi Mark,

On Feb 8, 2009, at 6:49 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> Barry Warsaw wrote:
>
>> Does anybody set USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER to Yes these days?
>
>
> There are potential issues with this with umbrella lists. Perhaps
> Mailman 3 will handle these differently, but here is the issue.

MM3 should implement the functionality of umbrella lists quite  
differently.  My plan is to use roster composition instead.

> There are two message methods, get_sender() and get_senders().
> USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER only affects get_sender(). With
> USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER false, get_sender() returns the first address
> found in From:, Sender: and unixfrom (envelope sender). With
> USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER true, the order is Sender:, From: and unixfrom, so
> it doesn't even really do what it claims.

Indeed.  Strike one!

BTW, I am thinking about replacing get_sender() with a `sender`  
attribute, which would return the first non-false value from the  
`senders` attribute.  This latter is the new get_senders().  `senders`  
takes its cue from a configurable list of headers (which can include  
the envelope sender) and simply returns a list of all the email  
addresses found in the specified headers.

> The potential issue is if you want posts to the umbrella list to be
> accepted by the child lists without being held, one technique is to
> put the umbrella's listname-bounces address in accept_these_nonmembers
> of the children, and this requires USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER to be true in
> order to work.

Yep.  It's very unfortunate that USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER is a system-wide  
configuration.  Strike two!

> I agree that the use of USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER as an anti-spoof is
> outdated, particularly because it doesn't even come into play for the
> member/nonmember decision.

Strike three. :)

>> BTW, the default value is No, which tells Mailman to use the From:
>> header first.  I propose hardwiring that default value.
>>
>> Let me know if this would cause you pain.
>
> I think it will impact some users with umbrella lists depending on how
> (or if) umbrella lists are handled in Mailman 3.

Cool, thanks for this message.  The use case of composite mailing  
lists is an important driver for separating out the concept of a  
roster in MM3, and I expect that we'll have direct support for this  
without all the nasty workarounds or problems described in the FAQ.   
It's not there yet, but it is planned, and shouldn't need to rely on  
the envelope sender for posting permissions and such.

Barry

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From wgoodman at jcvi.org  Mon Feb  9 15:53:39 2009
From: wgoodman at jcvi.org (Goodman, William)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:53:39 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902061704410640bbcce1a9@msapiro>
References: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C07F@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
	<PC1870200902061704410640bbcce1a9@msapiro>
Message-ID: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C081@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>

I apologize Mark...

This is the output of:

# ls -aR /opt/software/mailman/qfiles/
/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/:
.  ..  archive  bounces  commands  in  news  out  retry  shunt  virgin

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/archive:
.  ..

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/bounces:
.
..
1234190987.539598+fd6c983022fae575bb19abe36c1eb9c9e4d7a896.pck
1234190987.546752+fe6f1ad1df8e2079ccb23fc3cfeeff4fd5441082.pck
1234190987.7204871+3a2c234edd8b221eaca05854a5dfd5162c58f6da.pck
1234190987.960499+c00b2d2522ee0d1246583d41a3323958520da746.pck
1234190988.063931+b4b96d43770f9f37a42f57ad50055c8837b21874.pck
1234190988.3409979+4f2d8e7a9fc7810110611d42fd82f57c167dbc1c.pck
1234190988.366761+dab73d1f6982797f201613fd4b60237b4e01bab3.pck
1234190988.669873+d4e730813b15eb5a7a3c427183808d07fb0b7ca4.pck
1234190988.7999749+9e225d8f549d8f35a9a4255c572ac88f6bd5c845.pck
1234190988.961921+417ad154e340bd2947ed5df80c530ab697d7a17a.pck.tmp

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/commands:
.  ..

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/in:
.
..
1234190978.5258429+b87a7a844ad37ebb49d0724f57432f96a184db71.bak
1234190978.5667651+ed691242dad999eb51ccc8fab3343b6619856592.pck
1234190978.6760139+e4f48d142e1cb482489bebd1027e9b550915dc55.pck
1234190988.577697+6801e46df1e6c7432b7f9e458ef424bf28792659.pck

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/news:
.  ..

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/out:
.   1234190978.3703849+eed96b821c17c2186fc25541469e5ef0c0af6a47.pck
..  1234190978.738651+91bcf5af1bdaac8c799b378c3b1301b10a53252c.bak

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/retry:
.  ..

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/shunt:
.  ..

/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/virgin:
.  .. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 8:05 PM
To: Goodman, William; mailman-users at python.org
Subject: RE: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4 using 96% cpu

Goodman, William wrote:

>Cool Mike that helped a lot...


It's Mark ...


>I was so frustrated I set it to:
>
>QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME = seconds(10)
>
>That seem to calm it down a bit.
>
>top - 18:38:02 up 56 min,  2 users,  load average: 1.25, 1.20, 1.83
>Tasks: 109 total,   1 running, 108 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
>Cpu(s): 20.3%us,  0.3%sy,  0.0%ni, 79.2%id,  0.2%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.0%si, 
>0.0%st
>Mem:   3866604k total,   494800k used,  3371804k free,   175632k
buffers
>Swap:  4194296k total,        0k used,  4194296k free,   172108k cached
>
>  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
>19021 mailman   25   0  150m  12m 2752 S   41  0.3   1:59.92 python2.4
>    8 root      10  -5     0    0    0 S    0  0.0   0:03.72 events/0
>19797 root      16   0 12584 1068  800 S    0  0.0   0:00.30 top
>    1 root      15   0 10324  692  580 S    0  0.0   0:00.40 init
>
>But I still see 99% spikes from time to time. Is there a BOUNCERUNNER 
>and INCOMINGRUNNER parameter?


QRUNNER_SLEEP_TIME applies to all the runners.


I suppose it's possible you are just being bombarded with mail. Perhaps
there is some kind of mail loop.

What's in Mailman's vette log?

What do you see if you stop Mailman and while it is stopped do

ls -aR qfiles/

Do you see any entries? If so, and you do the ls again are there more
entries or the same ones? If there are entries, what's in them (use
bin/show_qfiles to list them)?

Also, as root do

strace -p xxx -o filename

where xxx is the pid of incoming runner. Let it run for 10 or 20 seconds
and then stop it with control-C and see what's in the output (filename).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jeffg at turners.com  Sun Feb  8 19:10:26 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:10:26 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Remove web ref from Help File
Message-ID: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979583BE@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>

Is it possible to remove the web reference from the e-mail help file?  I
have changed the help.txt template, but the one line about your options
after the results line is not in that file.  Is that in the source
somewhere?  Here is an example of the file:

 

The results of your email command are provided below. Attached is your

original message.

 

- Results:

    Ignoring non-text/plain MIME parts

    You can access your personal options via the following url:

    http://xxx/mailman/options/huntads/xxx
<http://lists.turners.com/mailman/options/huntads/jeffg%40turners.com> 

    

    help

    Help for Huntads mailing list:

 

This is email command help for the e-mail list server.

The following describes commands you can send to get information about
and

control your subscription to the e-mail lists.  A command can be in the

subject line or in the body of the message.

 

List specific commands (subscribe, who, etc) should be sent to the

*-request address for the particular list, e.g. for the 'mailman'

list, use 'mailman-request at ...'.

 

About the descriptions - words in "<>"s signify REQUIRED items and

words in "[]" denote OPTIONAL items.  Do not include the "<>"s or

"[]"s when you use the commands.

 


From jeffg at turners.com  Mon Feb  9 04:38:40 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 19:38:40 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce Management
Message-ID: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979583D0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>

When a user reaches the threshold for bouncing, does the e-mail address
get removed from all lists on the server or just the list for which they
were bouncing?

 

Jeff


From pennguin at mac.com  Mon Feb  9 15:50:33 2009
From: pennguin at mac.com (Rob)
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 09:50:33 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Content filtering
Message-ID: <38B363C5-1CA6-4ED3-AD25-BAA322C5F491@mac.com>

Is there any way of having mailman scan message content (not headers)  
and holding a message for review if there is a match in the body of  
the message? We have multiple lists, some of which are specifically  
set up to discuss a particular subject, and users frequently post to  
the wrong list, leading to much confusion and occasional flame-wars. I  
would love to be able to hold those messages and contact the authors  
directly or resend it to the correct list.

Thanks,

-Rob



From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb  9 18:04:04 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:04:04 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu
In-Reply-To: <7F0AA25C9B1706448E8B73DFDD109B3106D1C081@EXCHANGE.TIGR.ORG>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020909040309848e3feb1b@msapiro>

Goodman, William wrote:

>I apologize Mark...


Thanks. No problem.


>This is the output of:
>
># ls -aR /opt/software/mailman/qfiles/
>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/:
>.  ..  archive  bounces  commands  in  news  out  retry  shunt  virgin
>
>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/archive:
>.  ..
>
>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/bounces:
>.
>..
>1234190987.539598+fd6c983022fae575bb19abe36c1eb9c9e4d7a896.pck
>1234190987.546752+fe6f1ad1df8e2079ccb23fc3cfeeff4fd5441082.pck
>1234190987.7204871+3a2c234edd8b221eaca05854a5dfd5162c58f6da.pck
>1234190987.960499+c00b2d2522ee0d1246583d41a3323958520da746.pck
>1234190988.063931+b4b96d43770f9f37a42f57ad50055c8837b21874.pck
>1234190988.3409979+4f2d8e7a9fc7810110611d42fd82f57c167dbc1c.pck
>1234190988.366761+dab73d1f6982797f201613fd4b60237b4e01bab3.pck
>1234190988.669873+d4e730813b15eb5a7a3c427183808d07fb0b7ca4.pck
>1234190988.7999749+9e225d8f549d8f35a9a4255c572ac88f6bd5c845.pck
>1234190988.961921+417ad154e340bd2947ed5df80c530ab697d7a17a.pck.tmp


You are in the process of queueing one bounce, and 9 other bounces have
arrived in the last 1.4 seconds.


>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/commands:
>.  ..
>
>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/in:
>.
>..
>1234190978.5258429+b87a7a844ad37ebb49d0724f57432f96a184db71.bak
>1234190978.5667651+ed691242dad999eb51ccc8fab3343b6619856592.pck
>1234190978.6760139+e4f48d142e1cb482489bebd1027e9b550915dc55.pck
>1234190988.577697+6801e46df1e6c7432b7f9e458ef424bf28792659.pck


You are processing one incoming message and 3 other messages have
arrived within 1 second of that one.


>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/news:
>.  ..
>
>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/out:
>.   1234190978.3703849+eed96b821c17c2186fc25541469e5ef0c0af6a47.pck
>..  1234190978.738651+91bcf5af1bdaac8c799b378c3b1301b10a53252c.bak


You are processing one outgoing message and another is waiting which
from within a fraction of a second.


>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/retry:
>.  ..
>
>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/shunt:
>.  ..
>
>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/virgin:
>.  .. 


It looks to me like you are being hit with massive amounts of spam to
the list's post and bounces address or you have some kind of mail loop
going on which is generating all this mail.

Your high CPU utilization is a result of Mailman doing real work to
handle all this mail.



Mark Sapiro wrote:
>
>Goodman, William wrote:
>
>I suppose it's possible you are just being bombarded with mail. Perhaps
>there is some kind of mail loop.


See above?


>What's in Mailman's vette log?


??


>What do you see if you stop Mailman and while it is stopped do


Stop Mailman. (bin/mailmanctl stop)


>ls -aR qfiles/
>
>Do you see any entries? If so, and you do the ls again are there more
>entries or the same ones? If there are entries, what's in them (use
>bin/show_qfiles to list them)?


Look at the queue entries with bin/show_qfiles. What kinds of messages
do they contain?


>Also, as root do
>
>strace -p xxx -o filename
>
>where xxx is the pid of incoming runner. Let it run for 10 or 20 seconds
>and then stop it with control-C and see what's in the output (filename).


It's not necessary to do the above since I think I know that there is
not actually a problem with Mailman's relinquishing when it doesn't
have anything to do. The problem is it always has something to do.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From fil at rezo.net  Mon Feb  9 18:10:59 2009
From: fil at rezo.net (Fil)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 18:10:59 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce Management
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979583D0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
References: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979583D0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <bfc33ad70902090910r61cc2e84k56003d6cbf711e98@mail.gmail.com>

> When a user reaches the threshold for bouncing, does the e-mail address
> get removed from all lists on the server or just the list for which they
> were bouncing?

It is on a list-per-list basis. Hopefully MM3 will be able to offer a
choice with its database backend, but with the file-based MM2 global
removal would certainly be clumsy to implement

-- Fil

From barry at list.org  Mon Feb  9 18:20:16 2009
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 12:20:16 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce Management
In-Reply-To: <bfc33ad70902090910r61cc2e84k56003d6cbf711e98@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979583D0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
	<bfc33ad70902090910r61cc2e84k56003d6cbf711e98@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E4564648-9CA6-4051-AD36-1C3DB55893DE@list.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Feb 9, 2009, at 12:10 PM, Fil wrote:

>> When a user reaches the threshold for bouncing, does the e-mail  
>> address
>> get removed from all lists on the server or just the list for which  
>> they
>> were bouncing?
>
> It is on a list-per-list basis. Hopefully MM3 will be able to offer a
> choice with its database backend, but with the file-based MM2 global
> removal would certainly be clumsy to implement

Yes, definitely MM3 will have global disables.

Barry

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From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb  9 18:26:10 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:26:10 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Remove web ref from Help File
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979583BE@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020909261006406a6c5cca@msapiro>

Jeff Grossman wrote:

>Is it possible to remove the web reference from the e-mail help file?  I
>have changed the help.txt template, but the one line about your options
>after the results line is not in that file.  Is that in the source
>somewhere?  Here is an example of the file:


If the sender of the 'help' command is a list member, reference to the
member's options page is added by Mailman/Commands/cmd_help.py via the
following code:

    for sender in  msg.get_senders():
        if mlist.isMember(sender):
            memberurl = mlist.GetOptionsURL(sender, absolute=1)
            urlhelp = _(
                'You can access your personal options via the following
url:')
            res.results.append(urlhelp)
            res.results.append(memberurl)
            # Get a blank line in the output.
            res.results.append('')
            break


You could remove that code, comment it out or replace

        if mlist.isMember(sender):

with

        if False:

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb  9 18:33:40 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:33:40 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Content filtering
In-Reply-To: <38B363C5-1CA6-4ED3-AD25-BAA322C5F491@mac.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090209093340084321777a73@msapiro>

Rob wrote:

>Is there any way of having mailman scan message content (not headers)  
>and holding a message for review if there is a match in the body of  
>the message? We have multiple lists, some of which are specifically  
>set up to discuss a particular subject, and users frequently post to  
>the wrong list, leading to much confusion and occasional flame-wars. I  
>would love to be able to hold those messages and contact the authors  
>directly or resend it to the correct list.


There is no configuration facility in Mailman to do this. You would
have to implement a custom handler or equivalent to do this. See the
FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/l4A9> for information on implementing
custom handlers.

A proper implementation would be complex since you would probably want
to implement a new list attribute to specify regexps or the like to
match against the body to hold the message.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From cyndi at norwitz.net  Mon Feb  9 20:19:30 2009
From: cyndi at norwitz.net (Cyndi Norwitz)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 11:19:30 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Auto-response for moderated new subscribes?
Message-ID: <D4271580-6918-46D2-AC58-24F63AF58A2C@norwitz.net>

I looked in the FAQ but could not find anything.

One of the lists I run is advertised to the public but subscriptions  
are moderated (need approval).  The other moderator and I would like  
a way to send out a form letter automatically to people when their  
subscription is pending that lists the basic info we want from them  
and where to send it.

I looked through the list admin commands.  The General page has a  
place for an auto-reply to new subscribers (appended to the regular  
welcome) but nothing for those who are pending.  Then there is the  
Auto-Reply page which has places for auto-responses to anyone mailing  
to -owner or -request.

Using a less busy list with moderated subscriptions, I edited those 2  
sections to send an auto-response (different wording so I could tell  
them apart), saved the page, then I subscribed myself at a previous  
unused address.  I got the moderator request immediately at my  
regular address but have not received an auto-response at the new  
address.  It's been over half an hour.

Am I missing something or does this feature not exist?

I use Mailman through an ISP that does not give root access.  They  
make a few changes to the code, mostly minor.  We use version 2.1.11.

Thanks,
Cyndi


From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb  9 22:03:44 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:03:44 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Auto-response for moderated new subscribes?
In-Reply-To: <D4271580-6918-46D2-AC58-24F63AF58A2C@norwitz.net>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902091303440437454b05e1@msapiro>

Cyndi Norwitz wrote:
>
>I looked through the list admin commands.  The General page has a  
>place for an auto-reply to new subscribers (appended to the regular  
>welcome) but nothing for those who are pending.  Then there is the  
>Auto-Reply page which has places for auto-responses to anyone mailing  
>to -owner or -request.
>
>Using a less busy list with moderated subscriptions, I edited those 2  
>sections to send an auto-response (different wording so I could tell  
>them apart), saved the page, then I subscribed myself at a previous  
>unused address.  I got the moderator request immediately at my  
>regular address but have not received an auto-response at the new  
>address.  It's been over half an hour.
>
>Am I missing something or does this feature not exist?


How did you request subscription? If you requested via the web, the
autoresponder doesn't apply. Also, you will get at most 1 autoresponse
from -request within autoresponse_graceperiod, so if you got one to
this address while testing, you won't get another until the original
graceperiod expires or you set autoresponse_graceperiod to 0.

In short, you can set autorespond_requests to respond once per
graceperiod to the sender of a messsage to the -request (or -subscribe
or -join) address (which may or may not be a subscribe request), but
you can't set a message to be sent to anyone requesting a subscription.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From cyndi at norwitz.net  Mon Feb  9 22:58:57 2009
From: cyndi at norwitz.net (Cyndi Norwitz)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:58:57 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Auto-response for moderated new subscribes?
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902091303440437454b05e1@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902091303440437454b05e1@msapiro>
Message-ID: <D3FD4C84-BE71-4058-AF11-799AA03493D5@norwitz.net>


On Feb 9, 2009, at 1:03 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> Cyndi Norwitz wrote:
>> I looked through the list admin commands.  The General page has a
>> place for an auto-reply to new subscribers (appended to the regular
>> welcome) but nothing for those who are pending.  Then there is the
>> Auto-Reply page which has places for auto-responses to anyone mailing
>> to -owner or -request.
>>
>> Using a less busy list with moderated subscriptions, I edited those 2
>> sections to send an auto-response (different wording so I could tell
>> them apart), saved the page, then I subscribed myself at a previous
>> unused address.  I got the moderator request immediately at my
>> regular address but have not received an auto-response at the new
>> address.  It's been over half an hour.
>>
>> Am I missing something or does this feature not exist?
>
> How did you request subscription? If you requested via the web, the
> autoresponder doesn't apply.

I used the web.  But so will 99.99% of our subscribers.

> Also, you will get at most 1 autoresponse
> from -request within autoresponse_graceperiod, so if you got one to
> this address while testing, you won't get another until the original
> graceperiod expires or you set autoresponse_graceperiod to 0.

I set it to 0 when I set it up.

> In short, you can set autorespond_requests to respond once per
> graceperiod to the sender of a messsage to the -request (or -subscribe
> or -join) address (which may or may not be a subscribe request), but
> you can't set a message to be sent to anyone requesting a  
> subscription.

Bummer.  Thanks for the quick response.

Might this be added to a wish list?  I'm sure a lot of listowners  
with moderation set for subscriptions would love that feature.

Thanks,
Cyndi



From brian at emwd.com  Tue Feb 10 02:03:29 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 20:03:29 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Perplexing HTML formatting issue
Message-ID: <01f401c98b1b$644633b0$2cd29b10$@com>

Hi List:

I have a client who is using us to host his mailman list but he has his main
web site hosted with another provider. He uses a php script to post html
formatted messages to the list from this web site. Last week he moved his
web site to a new hosting provider and now when his script sends messages to
the list, the html formatting is not coming through. He tested the script to
post to one of his e-mail addresses and the formatting came through fine but
when he posts to the list via this php script, the html formatting is lost.
He says he did not change any of his list settings and I looked at them and
they look fine. He has content filtering set to no. Here is what the post
looks like when you view it in an e-mail client:

> From: Client <admin@****.com>
> Date: February 9, 2009 2:36:39 PM EST
> To: ****-news at list.****.com
> Subject: [****-News] Weekly Newsletter (Feb 09, 2009)
> Reply-To: no-reply@****.com
>
> Content-Type: text/html; charset = "utf-8"
>
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
>
>
>
> <body>
>
> <style>
>
> body {
>
> 	font-family : serif;
>
> 	font-size: 10pt;
>
> 	margin: 10px;
>
> 	color: #000000;
>
> 	BACKGROUND: #cedae7 URL(/images/blue_background_color.gif);
>
> 	background-repeat:repeat-x;
>
> }
>
> #page {
>
> 	width: 700px;
>
> 	background-color: #fff;
>
> 	border-style : solid;
>
> 	border-width : 1px 2px 3px 1px;
>
> 	border-color: #423322;
>
> 	padding:2px 2px 20px 2px;	
>
> 	margin-left: auto;
>
> 	margin-right: auto;
>
> }

I can't tell at this moment whether this is a MUA issue or a problem with
his list configuration or an issue with his php script. Any assistance would
be appreciated. Thanks.

Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"




From bernie at fantasyfarm.com  Tue Feb 10 01:30:04 2009
From: bernie at fantasyfarm.com (Bernie Cosell)
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 19:30:04 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription requests with no -subscribe alias
Message-ID: <4990843C.32211.1F6D4098@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>

I've removed the -subscribe alias for one of my lists.  So there's just 
no way to get a message to mailman with 'subscribe LIST' on the command 
line.  But nonetheless, I just got a message from mailman:

    Your authorization is required for a mailing list subscription
    request approval:  ...

How does that happen?  Is there some way to make a subscription request 
happen that doesn't involve using a -subscribe alias?  [obviously yes, 
but I don't know what it is..:o)]

  /Bernie\

-- 
Bernie Cosell                     Fantasy Farm Fibers
mailto:bernie at fantasyfarm.com     Pearisburg, VA
    -->  Too many people, too few sheep  <--       




From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 10 03:00:09 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 18:00:09 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Perplexing HTML formatting issue
In-Reply-To: <01f401c98b1b$644633b0$2cd29b10$@com>
Message-ID: <PC18702009020918000909841b2428e1@msapiro>

Brian Carpenter wrote:
>
>I have a client who is using us to host his mailman list but he has his main
>web site hosted with another provider. He uses a php script to post html
>formatted messages to the list from this web site. Last week he moved his
>web site to a new hosting provider and now when his script sends messages to
>the list, the html formatting is not coming through. He tested the script to
>post to one of his e-mail addresses and the formatting came through fine but
>when he posts to the list via this php script, the html formatting is lost.
>He says he did not change any of his list settings and I looked at them and
>they look fine. He has content filtering set to no. Here is what the post
>looks like when you view it in an e-mail client:
>
>> From: Client <admin@****.com>
>> Date: February 9, 2009 2:36:39 PM EST
>> To: ****-news at list.****.com
>> Subject: [****-News] Weekly Newsletter (Feb 09, 2009)
>> Reply-To: no-reply@****.com
>>
>> Content-Type: text/html; charset = "utf-8"
>>
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit


He's using the php mail() function to create the mail, and he's adding
the Reply-To:, Content-Type: and Content-Transfer-Encoding: headers as
additional_headers, and he believes the documentation which says that
each header should be terminated with "\r\n". This is causing blank
lines to be inserted because both "\r" and "\n" are taken as line
terminators. Thus, in the above, Reply-To: is taken as the last header
and Content-Type: and Content-Transfer-Encoding: become part of the
message.

See the note under additional_headers at
<http://us3.php.net/manual/en/function.mail.php> which says:

Note: If messages are not received, try using a LF (\n) only. Some poor
quality Unix mail transfer agents replace LF by CRLF automatically
(which leads to doubling CR if CRLF is used). This should be a last
resort, as it does not comply with ? RFC 2822.

Aside from the fact that what this note says is totally bogus, at least
in so far as RFC 2822 compliance is concerned, it gives the solution.
Note that it is the php implemantation that is poor quality, not the
MTA. The MTA is doing it's job in converting local OS line endings
into CRLF for transmission over the wire as the RFCs say it should.

I'm convinced this is the problem, and the fix is to use only "\n" as a
line terminator for additional_headers, but if for some reason this
isn't it, please provide a raw message as sent by php.

Note also, that the pear Mail_Mime package is a much more robust way of
creating MIME messages.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 10 03:10:41 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 18:10:41 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscription requests with no -subscribe alias
In-Reply-To: <4990843C.32211.1F6D4098@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902091810410875d22f4554@msapiro>

Bernie Cosell wrote:

>I've removed the -subscribe alias for one of my lists.  So there's just 
>no way to get a message to mailman with 'subscribe LIST' on the command 
>line.  But nonetheless, I just got a message from mailman:
>
>    Your authorization is required for a mailing list subscription
>    request approval:  ...
>
>How does that happen?  Is there some way to make a subscription request 
>happen that doesn't involve using a -subscribe alias?  [obviously yes, 
>but I don't know what it is..:o)]


Four ways:

1) send a subscribe command to the LIST-request address

2) send an email to the LIST-join address

3) fill out and submit the subscribe form on the listinfo page.

4) send the appropriate data from as would be posted by the web
subscribe form as indicated in the FAQ at
<http://wiki.list.org/x/hIA9>.

You may have blocked one or two of these, but have you blocked all four?

Note that unless you have VERP_CONFIRMATIONS = Yes in mm_cfg.py,
disabling the LIST-request address will severely limit your ability to
confirm things by email.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From bernie at fantasyfarm.com  Tue Feb 10 02:52:58 2009
From: bernie at fantasyfarm.com (Bernie Cosell)
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 20:52:58 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tracing a disappearing 'post'
Message-ID: <499097AA.254.1FB926F4@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>

A user on one of the lists here complained that her posts weren't getting 
through.  I looked at the sendmail log and I see her post making it to 
the "| ...mailman  post LIST", but then the message disappeared.  I've 
looked and it is, indeed, not in the list archives.

I do get bounces and approvals [as both list admin and list moderator] 
and I've not gotten anything about this user's submissions, but still 
they appear to vanish.  The list is unmoderated ["Action to take for 
postings from non-members.." is set to Accept].  I have one filter set to 
'hold', and I *have* gotten submissions that got caught by that filter, 
so I know it is working.

What places am I missing that could get a message just to vanish?  [and 
how can I try to make that not happen, or at least log what's happening 
or email me or something]?

Thanks!  /bernie\

-- 
Bernie Cosell                     Fantasy Farm Fibers
mailto:bernie at fantasyfarm.com     Pearisburg, VA
    -->  Too many people, too few sheep  <--       




From brian at emwd.com  Tue Feb 10 03:56:29 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 21:56:29 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Perplexing HTML formatting issue
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020918000909841b2428e1@msapiro>
References: <01f401c98b1b$644633b0$2cd29b10$@com>
	<PC18702009020918000909841b2428e1@msapiro>
Message-ID: <021701c98b2b$2de8dce0$89ba96a0$@com>

> I'm convinced this is the problem, and the fix is to use only "\n" as a
> line terminator for additional_headers, but if for some reason this
> isn't it, please provide a raw message as sent by php.
> 
> Note also, that the pear Mail_Mime package is a much more robust way of
> creating MIME messages.
> 
> --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

Your awesome Mark. I will pass this information on to the client and I will
post the raw message output if it comes to that. Thanks!


Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 10 04:32:55 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 19:32:55 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tracing a disappearing 'post'
In-Reply-To: <499097AA.254.1FB926F4@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902091932550187d06b6eb2@msapiro>

Bernie Cosell wrote:

>A user on one of the lists here complained that her posts weren't getting 
>through.  I looked at the sendmail log and I see her post making it to 
>the "| ...mailman  post LIST", but then the message disappeared.  I've 
>looked and it is, indeed, not in the list archives.
>
>I do get bounces and approvals [as both list admin and list moderator] 
>and I've not gotten anything about this user's submissions, but still 
>they appear to vanish.  The list is unmoderated ["Action to take for 
>postings from non-members.." is set to Accept].  I have one filter set to 
>'hold', and I *have* gotten submissions that got caught by that filter, 
>so I know it is working.
>
>What places am I missing that could get a message just to vanish?  [and 
>how can I try to make that not happen, or at least log what's happening 
>or email me or something]?


If the message was discarded by Mailman, that fact should be logged in
Mailman's vette log.

If it caused some processing exception and was shunted, that fact and a
traceback from the error should be logged in Mailman's error log.

The first step is to check those logs.

Note that given what you've said about the list configuration, I think
the most likely thing is Content filtering is on, text/html is
filtered (not in pass_mime_types) and filter_action is discard so her
text/html post is filtered to empty and discarded.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kop at meme.com  Mon Feb  9 23:35:12 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 16:35:12 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Two lists: same name,
	different domain -- the postfix way
Message-ID: <1234218912l.28754l.2l@mofo>

Hello,

I've been wanting 2 different mailing lists with the same
name, each on a different domain.  This configuration
is not supported in the stock mailman (pre 3.0), but it occurs to
me that there is a workaround when the MTA is postfix.

It's a bit of a kludge, but I think it will work.
I'm interested in what the list thinks.

Note:  I have not tested this.  I've done a little
bit of testing on the outbound mail part, and it
seems to work.  It happens
that the mail architecture in use is forwarding list traffic
to the mailman server, so the inbound translations are
handled by the forwarder and I don't need the
inbound mail part.  I'm running Debian Etch.

First off, FWIW, in debian mailman comes integrated
out of the box with postfix so mailman automatically
maintains all it's aliases.  This is done via a transport map
and postfix-to-mailman.py; any mail sent to the
box's "regular domain" is run through mailman.

The idea is to use postifx's canonical mapping
to re-write the email addresses on all inbound
list traffic to "secondary" domains to add
a "tag" to the user part of the address.  And then
do the reverse to outbound list traffic.  This
is best illustrated by way of example.

Suppose you want 2 lists, foo at example.com and
foo at example.net.  The "regular" domain for the
box is example.com.  Make two lists:
foo and foo-examplenet.

In /etc/postfix/main.cf put the lines:

recipient_canonical_maps = pcre:/etc/postfix/recipient_canonical_domains
sender_canonical_maps = pcre:/etc/postfix/sender_canonical_domains

In /etc/postfix/recipient_canonical_domains put:

/^foo(-.+)?@example.net$/ foo-examplenet${1}@example.com

In /etc/postfix/sender_canonical_domains put:

/^(.*)-examplenet(-(.*))@example.com$/ ${1]${2}@example.net

Mail that comes in as foo at example.net (or e.g.
foo-subscribe at example.net) is readdressed to foo-examplenet at example.com
(or foo-examplenet-subscribe at example.com).  It's then delivered to
mailman's foo-examplenet list just like normal.  Outbound mail sent
from the list comes from foo-examplenet at example.com but
all the addresses are rewritten so as to come from
foo at example.net.

I don't know whether rfc2369 headers are rewritten by
postfix's canonical mapping, I suppose it depends
on whether postfix is rfc2369 aware.  Anyway, that's
simple enough to take care of with header_checks, pcre patterns
like those above, and the REPLACE action.  I think this
would work on both inbound and outbound..., right?

The limitations are you can't have any email addresses
in @example.com that have '-examplenet' in the user
part, and you can't have any foo-.* user names in
@example.net (besides the mailing list.)

This seems a lot more straightforward to setup and
maintain than running multiple instances of mailman,
which is the only other solution I know of.  All
that's needed for maintenance is to add a line
for any new lists to recipient_canonical_domains
and sender_canonical_domains and otherwise everything
works "as it should".  If the "secondary" domains
have no users, only mailing lists, you can construct
a pcre that rewrites all inbound/outbound mail to/from
the domains and there's no work involved when adding
a mailing list.

Regards,

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From jesus.olivan at uab.es  Tue Feb 10 16:00:12 2009
From: jesus.olivan at uab.es (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs_Oliv=E1n?=)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:00:12 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re-allowing attachments
Message-ID: <1234278012.7432.11.camel@kloaca>

Hi!

i'm newbie on mailman and want to reconfigure option for allowing
attachments in all my mailman lists, because former mailman admin
decided to block em. In what config file i can do that and what
parameter i've to change for achieve it?

Thanks in advance!

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 10 17:26:13 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:26:13 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Re-allowing attachments
In-Reply-To: <1234278012.7432.11.camel@kloaca>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021008261308756b898d78@msapiro>

Jes?s Oliv?n wrote:
>
>i'm newbie on mailman and want to reconfigure option for allowing
>attachments in all my mailman lists, because former mailman admin
>decided to block em. In what config file i can do that and what
>parameter i've to change for achieve it?


In the web admin interface under Content filtering set filter_content
to No.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 10 17:51:53 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:51:53 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman python-2.4  using 96% cpu [SOLVED]
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009020909040309848e3feb1b@msapiro>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021008515309212294aa8e@msapiro>

Mark Sapiro wrote:

>Goodman, William wrote:
>
>>This is the output of:
>>
>># ls -aR /opt/software/mailman/qfiles/
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/:
>>.  ..  archive  bounces  commands  in  news  out  retry  shunt  virgin
>>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/archive:
>>.  ..
>>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/bounces:
>>.
>>..
>>1234190987.539598+fd6c983022fae575bb19abe36c1eb9c9e4d7a896.pck
>>1234190987.546752+fe6f1ad1df8e2079ccb23fc3cfeeff4fd5441082.pck
>>1234190987.7204871+3a2c234edd8b221eaca05854a5dfd5162c58f6da.pck
>>1234190987.960499+c00b2d2522ee0d1246583d41a3323958520da746.pck
>>1234190988.063931+b4b96d43770f9f37a42f57ad50055c8837b21874.pck
>>1234190988.3409979+4f2d8e7a9fc7810110611d42fd82f57c167dbc1c.pck
>>1234190988.366761+dab73d1f6982797f201613fd4b60237b4e01bab3.pck
>>1234190988.669873+d4e730813b15eb5a7a3c427183808d07fb0b7ca4.pck
>>1234190988.7999749+9e225d8f549d8f35a9a4255c572ac88f6bd5c845.pck
>>1234190988.961921+417ad154e340bd2947ed5df80c530ab697d7a17a.pck.tmp
>
>
>You are in the process of queueing one bounce, and 9 other bounces have
>arrived in the last 1.4 seconds.
>
>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/commands:
>>.  ..
>>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/in:
>>.
>>..
>>1234190978.5258429+b87a7a844ad37ebb49d0724f57432f96a184db71.bak
>>1234190978.5667651+ed691242dad999eb51ccc8fab3343b6619856592.pck
>>1234190978.6760139+e4f48d142e1cb482489bebd1027e9b550915dc55.pck
>>1234190988.577697+6801e46df1e6c7432b7f9e458ef424bf28792659.pck
>
>
>You are processing one incoming message and 3 other messages have
>arrived within 1 second of that one.
>
>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/news:
>>.  ..
>>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/out:
>>.   1234190978.3703849+eed96b821c17c2186fc25541469e5ef0c0af6a47.pck
>>..  1234190978.738651+91bcf5af1bdaac8c799b378c3b1301b10a53252c.bak
>
>
>You are processing one outgoing message and another is waiting which
>from within a fraction of a second.
>
>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/retry:
>>.  ..
>>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/shunt:
>>.  ..
>>
>>/opt/software/mailman/qfiles/virgin:
>>.  .. 
>
>
>It looks to me like you are being hit with massive amounts of spam to
>the list's post and bounces address or you have some kind of mail loop
>going on which is generating all this mail.
>
>Your high CPU utilization is a result of Mailman doing real work to
>handle all this mail.


After further off-list analysis, it turned out there was a mail loop
involving the mailman-owner address. Here's the OP's description.

This was the case:

I moved the lists server from one hosts to another (which I wouldn't
recommend us less you have no choice)
The original host was using sendmail, the new host is using Postfix
(easy to deal with). When I tarred up
the lists I forgot that mailman is a lists, so the configuration for the
original server could find a valid
email address for the owner, it was looking at the original servers
mailman email address which was a different domain. This cause the
exchange server to send the mail back to the host, then the host would
send it back to
the exchange server and so on ...


-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From bcanty at apsa.org  Tue Feb 10 17:20:51 2009
From: bcanty at apsa.org (Brian Canty)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 11:20:51 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] User Commands
Message-ID: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D2521B@apsaserv.APSA.local>

I was wondering if anyone knows of any command you can use to find out
who is subscribed to all mailman lists.

Similar to the which <email address> command in majordomo?

Thanks in advance.


Brian Canty
Manager Computer Information Services
American Psychoanalytic Association
212-752-0450 x17



From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 10 18:19:01 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 09:19:01 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] User Commands
In-Reply-To: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D2521B@apsaserv.APSA.local>
Message-ID: <PC187020090210091901048447b5fee5@msapiro>

Brian Canty wrote:

>I was wondering if anyone knows of any command you can use to find out
>who is subscribed to all mailman lists.
>
>Similar to the which <email address> command in majordomo?


If you have command line access, see

 bin/find-member --help

A user (but not a list admin) can go to the web user options page and
"List my other subscriptions".

There is no email command for this.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From barry at list.org  Tue Feb 10 21:59:10 2009
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:59:10 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER
In-Reply-To: <EE7D49C55DE2E1CFBAD612CB@lewes.staff.uscs.susx.ac.uk>
References: <FD75378C-AF1C-4C12-A913-4172D9250CFD@list.org>
	<EE7D49C55DE2E1CFBAD612CB@lewes.staff.uscs.susx.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <19699723-90D0-4BC7-B37C-CBF1FDC86B22@list.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Feb 9, 2009, at 5:43 AM, Ian Eiloart wrote:

> I'm not sure whether I do use it, but I think I should.
>
> Most of our list users are in our own domain. That domain certainly  
> is less spoofable in the envelope, because we don't accept mail from  
> our domain unless it's been through our servers. We don't get spam  
> with sussex.ac.uk in the envelope sender domain.
>
> With SPF records now widely published, including by several large  
> free email service providers, it's certainly within the power of  
> sites to validate the envelope sender address of much of their  
> inbound email. Losing this facility now would be a great shame.
>
> I certainly don't see how having the option can do much harm.
>
> It might be worth adding code to support BATV, if it isn't there  
> already.

MM3 does not yet support this.

So, I've landed a branch that gets rid of the MM3 equivalent to  
USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER, but it will still be possible to consider the  
MAIL FROM or Sender addresses in preference to From, if you wanted  
to.  I've implemented a site admin definable header lookup scheme so  
you can define the order that headers are considered.  By default it's  
From:, MAIL FROM, Reply-To, Sender.  This is a global order just like  
U_E_S was.

Barry

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FACgsLbElDIgzCYExy/rsm92g/HG9wQ=
=A0Ue
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From barry at list.org  Tue Feb 10 22:03:08 2009
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:03:08 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Developers] USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER
In-Reply-To: <31B3A5331229151082CFC426@lewes.staff.uscs.susx.ac.uk>
References: <PC18702009020815495803755323d571@msapiro>
	<4785A76E-FB4C-4404-ACE9-A682493B435E@list.org>
	<31B3A5331229151082CFC426@lewes.staff.uscs.susx.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <5DEB9C3D-88AF-4D03-B011-B963F35B4FD0@list.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Feb 9, 2009, at 5:47 AM, Ian Eiloart wrote:

>
>>> I agree that the use of USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER as an anti-spoof is
>>> outdated, particularly because it doesn't even come into play for  
>>> the
>>> member/nonmember decision.
>>
>> Strike three. :)
>>
>
> Our LMTP code is intended to make this decision before the message  
> headers are even seen. Perhaps that makes the whole  
> USE_ENVELOPE_SENDER option redundant.

I think so too.  How's that coming along?

Barry

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=VnvI
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From cmpalmer at metalab.unc.edu  Wed Feb 11 04:51:32 2009
From: cmpalmer at metalab.unc.edu (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Crist=F3bal?= Palmer)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:51:32 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] spam to -owner addresses
Message-ID: <20090211035132.GJ23994@garp.metalab.unc.edu>

Hi folks,

I'm seeing a spike in spam to -owner addresses on the two hosts I
administer.

I'm hoping people can help me change site-wide settings so that I
don't get messages (to -owner addresses) that start something like:

  Spam detection software, running on the system "mailman.example.org",
  has identified this incoming email as possible spam.  The original
  message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't
  spam) or label similar future email.  If you have any questions, see
  the administrator of that system for details.

That last sentence is particularly galling since I _am_ the
administrator for the systems in question and I can't spot where in
the configs to keep mailman from forwarding the spam.

What I've got in my mm_cfg.py:

#-------------------------------------------------------------
# Uncomment if you want to filter mail with SpamAssassin. For
# more information please visit this website:
# http://www.daa.com.au/~james/articles/mailman-spamassassin/
GLOBAL_PIPELINE.insert(1, 'SpamAssassin')
SPAMASSASSIN_HOST = 'localhost:783'
SPAMASSASSIN_DISCARD_SCORE = 6
SPAMASSASSIN_HOLD_SCORE = 7
SPAMASSASSIN_MEMBER_BONUS = 2

Yes, I realize the hold score is higher than the discard score. I
don't want held messages. I just want to discard.

I can send a link to an example message off-list if somebody would
like to help me troubleshoot.

Cheers,
-- 
Crist?bal Palmer
ibiblio.org systems administrator
cdla.unc.edu research assistant

From gherzig at fmed.uba.ar  Tue Feb 10 20:16:17 2009
From: gherzig at fmed.uba.ar (Gerardo Herzig)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:16:17 -0300
Subject: [Mailman-Users] bounce-events-xxxx.pck filling up quickly my disk
Message-ID: <4991D281.3020309@fmed.uba.ar>

Hi all. As my server is getting bocked in hotmail and yahoo, the pickled
file bounce-events grows mega-fast and quickly fills-up the partition.
Can Mailman be configured to "stop writing after some size", or will i
have to doit with some sort of Linux quota system?

Thanks!
Gerardo

From kjell at kejpa.com  Tue Feb 10 14:21:07 2009
From: kjell at kejpa.com (Kjell Hansen)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:21:07 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Secure Connection Failed
Message-ID: <000c01c98b82$6f410030$4dc30090$@com>

Hi all, 
When trying to connect to my mailman webpages I get a message that the
secure connection failed and....
SSL received a record that exceeded the maximum permissible length.
(Error code: ssl_error_rx_record_too_long)
I'm also told to contact the web site owner, which is me...

Any ideas? All help appreciated!
/Kjell


From kop at meme.com  Tue Feb 10 15:01:33 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:01:33 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Two lists: same name,
	different domain -- the postfix way
In-Reply-To: <1234218912l.28754l.2l@mofo> (from kop@meme.com on Mon Feb  9
	16:35:12 2009)
References: <1234218912l.28754l.2l@mofo>
Message-ID: <1234274493l.28754l.9l@mofo>


On 02/09/2009 04:35:12 PM, Karl O. Pinc wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I've been wanting 2 different mailing lists with the same
> name, each on a different domain.

> 
> The idea is to use postifx's canonical mapping
> to re-write the email addresses on all inbound
> list traffic to "secondary" domains to add
> a "tag" to the user part of the address.  And then
> do the reverse to outbound list traffic.

Where this fits into the postfix data flow can be
seen in the diagrams at the Postfix Architecture Overview,
http://www.postfix.org/OVERVIEW.html.  It is the
cleanup(8) daemon that rewrites addresses according to the
canonical mappings.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From kop at meme.com  Tue Feb 10 21:07:23 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:07:23 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] User Commands
In-Reply-To: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D2521B@apsaserv.APSA.local>
	(from bcanty@apsa.org on Tue Feb 10 10:20:51 2009)
References: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D2521B@apsaserv.APSA.local>
Message-ID: <1234296443l.25896l.1l@mofo>


On 02/10/2009 10:20:51 AM, Brian Canty wrote:
> I was wondering if anyone knows of any command you can use to find out
> who is subscribed to all mailman lists.

list_lists | tail -n +2 | awk '{print $1;}' | xargs -n 1 list_members |
sort -u

Gets you all the members of all the lists.

list_lists \
  | tail -n +2 \
  | awk '{print $1;}' \
  | xargs -n 1 bash -c 'list_members $0 | xargs -n 1 echo $0:' \
  | grep foo at example.com \
  | cut -d f 1

Gets you all the lists that foo at example.com is subscribed to.


Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From kop at meme.com  Wed Feb 11 02:28:29 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 19:28:29 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Wiki editing in debian etch
Message-ID: <1234315709l.1843l.2l@mofo>

Hi,

I'm running Debian Etch and simply cannot edit the wiki.
Iceweasel (aka firefox) and konqurer have different problems.

I'll eventually update to Lenny.  In the meantime is there a workaround?

I'm trying to edit:
http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/From+field+displayed+by+Microsoft+Outlook

The postfix solution to the MS Outlook from "by way of" display problem
is to have postfix remove the Sender header.  This is done
by adding something like
"header_checks = regexp:/etc/postfix/header_checks" to
/etc/postfix/main.cf and then putting:

/^Sender: +[^ @]+-bounces@/ IGNORE

into /etc/postfix/header_checks.


Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From brad at shub-internet.org  Wed Feb 11 08:12:11 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 01:12:11 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Secure Connection Failed
In-Reply-To: <000c01c98b82$6f410030$4dc30090$@com>
References: <000c01c98b82$6f410030$4dc30090$@com>
Message-ID: <49927A4B.9020505@shub-internet.org>

on 2/10/09 7:21 AM, Kjell Hansen said:

> When trying to connect to my mailman webpages I get a message that the
> secure connection failed and....
> SSL received a record that exceeded the maximum permissible length.
> (Error code: ssl_error_rx_record_too_long)
> I'm also told to contact the web site owner, which is me...

That sounds like a problem in your web server or in the SSL libraries.

Check all your logs (web server and Mailman alike), and see if you can 
find anything there that might help us narrow this down further.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From brad at shub-internet.org  Wed Feb 11 08:14:37 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 01:14:37 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] bounce-events-xxxx.pck filling up quickly my
 disk
In-Reply-To: <4991D281.3020309@fmed.uba.ar>
References: <4991D281.3020309@fmed.uba.ar>
Message-ID: <49927ADD.1030605@shub-internet.org>

on 2/10/09 1:16 PM, Gerardo Herzig said:

> Hi all. As my server is getting bocked in hotmail and yahoo, the pickled
> file bounce-events grows mega-fast and quickly fills-up the partition.
> Can Mailman be configured to "stop writing after some size", or will i
> have to doit with some sort of Linux quota system?

I'm not aware of any way to do this within Mailman, at least not without 
changing the source code.  But I wouldn't recommend doing a Linux quota 
system either -- that would probably just cause Mailman to lock up 
completely.

You might want to consider a separate monitoring script that runs 
continuously and cleans out any cruft, or maybe slice your queue runners 
for that part of the system so that you can handle the load better.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From brad at shub-internet.org  Wed Feb 11 08:18:15 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 01:18:15 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Wiki editing in debian etch
In-Reply-To: <1234315709l.1843l.2l@mofo>
References: <1234315709l.1843l.2l@mofo>
Message-ID: <49927BB7.5000006@shub-internet.org>

on 2/10/09 7:28 PM, Karl O. Pinc said:

> I'm running Debian Etch and simply cannot edit the wiki.
> Iceweasel (aka firefox) and konqurer have different problems.

What problems are you having with Iceweasel?  Firefox works fine for me 
on all the platforms I've tested, and I'm pretty sure I've used Safari 
and other webkit-based browsers as well.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From kop at meme.com  Wed Feb 11 15:39:11 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 08:39:11 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Wiki editing in debian etch
In-Reply-To: <49927BB7.5000006@shub-internet.org> (from
	brad@shub-internet.org on Wed Feb 11 01:18:15 2009)
References: <1234315709l.1843l.2l@mofo> <49927BB7.5000006@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <1234363151l.1843l.4l@mofo>


On 02/11/2009 01:18:15 AM, Brad Knowles wrote:
> on 2/10/09 7:28 PM, Karl O. Pinc said:
> 
>> I'm running Debian Etch and simply cannot edit the wiki.
>> Iceweasel (aka firefox) and konqurer have different problems.
> 
> What problems are you having with Iceweasel?  Firefox works fine for  
> me on all the platforms I've tested, and I'm pretty sure I've used  
> Safari and other webkit-based browsers as well.

The edit box is 23 characters wide and 2 high.  The  wiki markup
and preview buttons do nothing, although mouseover does
make them change color tone.  The edit box has none of the
little icons above it that show up in konquerer.

This is version 2.0.0.19.  So, old.

I could send a screenshot if you like.

(Konquerer complains that the page you are trying
to edit does not exist.)

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From kop at meme.com  Wed Feb 11 15:41:52 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 08:41:52 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] User Commands
In-Reply-To: <1234296443l.25896l.1l@mofo> (from kop@meme.com on Tue Feb 10
	14:07:23 2009)
References: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D2521B@apsaserv.APSA.local>
	<1234296443l.25896l.1l@mofo>
Message-ID: <1234363312l.1843l.5l@mofo>


On 02/10/2009 02:07:23 PM, Karl O. Pinc wrote:
> 
> On 02/10/2009 10:20:51 AM, Brian Canty wrote:
>> I was wondering if anyone knows of any command you can use to find  
>> out
>> who is subscribed to all mailman lists.

Somehow the "cut" command got mangled.  Should be:

  list_lists \
   | tail -n +2 \
   | awk '{print $1;}' \
   | xargs -n 1 bash -c 'list_members $0 | xargs -n 1 echo $0:' \
   | grep foo at example.com \
   | cut -d : -f 1

> Gets you all the lists that foo at example.com is subscribed to.


Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From Tlf1 at ccs135.com  Wed Feb 11 16:23:25 2009
From: Tlf1 at ccs135.com (Tim Ferguson)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:23:25 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Where to look?
Message-ID: <4992990D020000BD000145B8@ccs135.com>

Where do I need to start looking after Mailman, Apache2, etc. has been successfully installed but none of the Mailman screens can be accessed through a browser?  I've set this up on more than one type of Linux server with the same results.  In addition, I had it set up and working on a SME 7.4 server, but now sending posts to the lists no longer sends them out to the subscribers.  When a new subscriber registers or one unsubscribes those notices do reach the subscriber which has further muddied the waters.
 
Any ideas or suggestions would be appreciated, again.
 
Thanks,
 
Tim
 
 
 
Tim Ferguson
Director of Technology
Centralia City Schools
Centralia, Illinois 62801
618-532-1907, Ext. 1030
 

From jbernier at risd.edu  Wed Feb 11 16:48:35 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 10:48:35 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving Lists... my final challenge
Message-ID: <s992ad22.040@risd.edu>

Hello,
 
As I mentioned in recent posts, I have had to move a Mailman list from one server to another. Thanks to all your help, to Mark in particular, I have accomplished this, and everything is good.
 
I have just one last challenge:
 
The old, soon to be retired server contains older archives for several lists that were re-created or moved to the new system. These new/moved lists are now in use, and have new archives beginning from the move date.
 
Is it possible to take these older archives and move them over to be added to the archives of the current lists on the new system? It is not a must-have, but would be nice.
 
Thanks in advance,
Jeff
 
 
 
 
 
 

Jeff Bernier
Rhode Island School of Design
401.454.6168

From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 11 17:20:03 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 08:20:03 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] spam to -owner addresses
In-Reply-To: <20090211035132.GJ23994@garp.metalab.unc.edu>
References: <20090211035132.GJ23994@garp.metalab.unc.edu>
Message-ID: <4992FAB3.1050207@msapiro.net>

Crist?bal Palmer wrote:
> 
> What I've got in my mm_cfg.py:
> 
> #-------------------------------------------------------------
> # Uncomment if you want to filter mail with SpamAssassin. For
> # more information please visit this website:
> # http://www.daa.com.au/~james/articles/mailman-spamassassin/
> GLOBAL_PIPELINE.insert(1, 'SpamAssassin')

Add your SpamAssassin handler to OWNER_PIPELINE

OWNER_PIPELINE.insert(1, 'SpamAssassin')

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 11 17:37:19 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 08:37:19 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] bounce-events-xxxx.pck filling up quickly my
	disk
In-Reply-To: <4991D281.3020309@fmed.uba.ar>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021108371904848bfe8737@msapiro>

Gerardo Herzig wrote:

>Hi all. As my server is getting bocked in hotmail and yahoo, the pickled
>file bounce-events grows mega-fast and quickly fills-up the partition.
>Can Mailman be configured to "stop writing after some size", or will i
>have to doit with some sort of Linux quota system?


There should never be more than 2 bounce-events-xxxx.pck files, one
where xxxx is the PID of BounceRunner and another where xxxx is the
PID of OutgoingRunner. Any other such files are orphans and can be
removed.

The BounceRunner file queues received DSNs. The OutgoingRunner file
queues outgoing SMTP rejects.

Further, if everything is working as it should be the queued bounces
should be processed and the file removed at intervals determined by
the Defaults.py/mm_cfg.py setting REGISTER_BOUNCES_EVERY which
defaults to 15 minutes.

So what specifically is going wrong in your case?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 11 17:40:50 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 08:40:50 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] User Commands
In-Reply-To: <1234363312l.1843l.5l@mofo>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902110840500734249dbcd0@msapiro>

Karl O. Pinc wrote:
>
>On 02/10/2009 02:07:23 PM, Karl O. Pinc wrote:
>> 
>> On 02/10/2009 10:20:51 AM, Brian Canty wrote:
>>> I was wondering if anyone knows of any command you can use to find  
>>> out
>>> who is subscribed to all mailman lists.
>
>Somehow the "cut" command got mangled.  Should be:
>
>  list_lists \
>   | tail -n +2 \
>   | awk '{print $1;}' \
>   | xargs -n 1 bash -c 'list_members $0 | xargs -n 1 echo $0:' \
>   | grep foo at example.com \
>   | cut -d : -f 1
>
>> Gets you all the lists that foo at example.com is subscribed to.


So does 

  bin/find_member foo at example.com

and much more simply.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 11 17:43:39 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 08:43:39 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] User Commands
In-Reply-To: <1234296443l.25896l.1l@mofo>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902110843390000f2a36de7@msapiro>

Karl O. Pinc wrote:
>
>On 02/10/2009 10:20:51 AM, Brian Canty wrote:
>> I was wondering if anyone knows of any command you can use to find out
>> who is subscribed to all mailman lists.
>
>list_lists | tail -n +2 | awk '{print $1;}' | xargs -n 1 list_members |
>sort -u
>
>Gets you all the members of all the lists.


So does

bin/find_member .

or

bin/find_member @

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 11 18:23:01 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:23:01 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Where to look?
In-Reply-To: <4992990D020000BD000145B8@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021109230102182ed4b35b@msapiro>

Tim Ferguson wrote:

>Where do I need to start looking after Mailman, Apache2, etc. has been successfully installed but none of the Mailman screens can be accessed through a browser?  I've set this up on more than one type of Linux server with the same results.


It would help to know what URL you are trying to get and what response
you get when you try to get it.

See <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node10.html>


>In addition, I had it set up and working on a SME 7.4 server, but now sending posts to the lists no longer sends them out to the subscribers.  When a new subscriber registers or one unsubscribes those notices do reach the subscriber which has further muddied the waters.


Mailman is working OK, but mail to Mailman is not being properly
delivered. See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/A4E9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 11 18:34:24 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:34:24 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving Lists... my final challenge
In-Reply-To: <s992ad22.040@risd.edu>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902110934240062baf56e16@msapiro>

Jeff Bernier wrote:
> 
>Is it possible to take these older archives and move them over to be added to the archives of the current lists on the new system? It is not a must-have, but would be nice.


Get the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox files from the old
server.

Stop Mailman on the new server.

Combine the old archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox files with
the new archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox files, e.g.

  cat old.mbox new.mbox > tmpfile
  cp tmpfile new.mbox

where old.mbox is the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox from
the old server and new.mbox is
archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox on the current server.

Then run

  bin/arch --wipe LISTNAME

to rebuild the pipermail archive on the new server from the
archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox file.

After doing this for each moved list, start Mailman.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jbernier at risd.edu  Wed Feb 11 20:20:13 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:20:13 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Moving Lists... my final challenge
Message-ID: <s992deb1.011@risd.edu>

Thank you Mark,
 
That worked flawlessly. The list members will appreciate seeing all the archive history.
 
Regards,
Jeff

>>> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> 2/11/2009 12:34 PM >>>
Jeff Bernier wrote:
> 
>Is it possible to take these older archives and move them over to be added to the archives of the current lists on the new system? It is not a must-have, but would be nice.


Get the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox files from the old
server.

Stop Mailman on the new server.

Combine the old archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox files with
the new archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox files, e.g.

  cat old.mbox new.mbox > tmpfile
  cp tmpfile new.mbox

where old.mbox is the archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox from
the old server and new.mbox is
archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox on the current server.

Then run

  bin/arch --wipe LISTNAME

to rebuild the pipermail archive on the new server from the
archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox file.

After doing this for each moved list, start Mailman.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 11 21:44:36 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:44:36 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] bounce-events-xxxx.pck filling up quickly my
	disk
In-Reply-To: <71d696421f7713e3bda8bd7260556e30.squirrel@www.webmail.fmed.uba.ar>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902111244360000122bd064@msapiro>

Gerardo Herzig wrote:

>My server is getting spam-blocked in hotmail, yahoo and others, and some
>list have about 40,000 hotmail+yahoo address. So the bounce-events-xxx.pck
>(i guess im talking about the BounceRunner one) grows almost automaticaly
>because of all the yahoo and hotmail emails getting back to my server, to
>the 5 GB limit of /usr/local partition.


If you are saying that it grows to 5 GB within 15 minutes, then shorten
the time between processing to say 5 minutes by putting

REGISTER_BOUNCES_EVERY = minutes(5)

in mm_cfg.py and restarting mailman. If you are saying that
bounce-events-xxxx.pck is not being processed and cleared every 15
minutes, then there is some other problem. Look in Mailman's error and
bounce logs for clues.

On the other hand, it might be more productive to find out why you are
blocked and try to get the blocks removed, or are you blocked for good
reason?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kop at meme.com  Thu Feb 12 05:49:48 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 22:49:48 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] User Commands
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902110840500734249dbcd0@msapiro> (from
	mark@msapiro.net on Wed Feb 11 10:40:50 2009)
References: <1234363312l.1843l.5l@mofo>
	<PC1870200902110840500734249dbcd0@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1234414188l.17086l.3l@mofo>


On 02/11/2009 10:40:50 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Karl O. Pinc wrote:
> >
> >> Gets you all the lists that foo at example.com is subscribed to.
> 
> 
> So does
> 
>   bin/find_member foo at example.com
> 
> and much more simply.

And I'm sure more efficiently too.   My bad.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From fmouse-mailman at fmp.com  Thu Feb 12 18:39:07 2009
From: fmouse-mailman at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley)
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:39:07 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] DomainKey problem with Mailman
Message-ID: <1234460347.15931.57.camel@vishnu.fmp.com>

One of the subscribers to a list I host (Jack McKinney) has been having
a problem with inbound mail from the list getting rejected by his mail
server.  He's tracked it down to a problem with the Sender header field,
which gets re-written by Mailman to the VERP address of the list bounce
processor containing the recipient's address.  This triggers a rejection
by libdomainkeys.

RFC 2822 states as follows:

 The "Sender:" field specifies the
 mailbox of the agent responsible for the actual transmission of the
 message.  For example, if a secretary were to send a message for
 another person, the mailbox of the secretary would appear in the
 "Sender:" field and the mailbox of the actual author would appear in
 the "From:" field. 

So, since Mailman is the "agent responsible for the actual transmission
of the message", re-writing the Sender header doesn't appear to be a
violation of the spec, but there is a problem here.  It appears that
Mailman _should_ either offer the option of preserving the original
poster's Sender header, or should nuke the original poster's
DomainKey-Signature: header.

Or does it appear that libdomainkeys is in error here?

Your thoughts, good people?

-------- Forwarded Message --------
From: Jack McKinney <jackmc at lorentz.com>
Reply-To: jackmc at lorentz.com
To: Lindsay Haisley <fmouse at fmp.com>
Subject: Problem Solved!
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:15:01 -0600

	Well, problem identified, anyway.  This is something that mailman or
courier will have to fix.
	Your mailing list is adding a Sender header.  However, the Sender
header does not represent the message sender, as it should.  It instead
represents the mailing list.  Since the DomainKey in the message is for
one domain (d=brockster.us), and the sender is in a different domain
(Sender: linux-bounces+jackmc=lorentz.com at ctlug.org), it is an error.
	I believe that libdomainkey does this because adding a Sender: header
that is not the _original_ sender is a violation of the RFC (822?).
	When anyone posts from a domain that has DomainKeys to one of the
lists, the list adds a conflicting Sender header, causing anyone parsing
messages at the SMTP port using libdomainkeys to reject the message as
forgery.

-- 
Lindsay Haisley       | "Everything works    |    Accredited
FMP Computer Services |       if you let it" |      by the
512-259-1190          |    (The Roadie)      |   Austin Better
http://www.fmp.com    |                      |  Business Bureau


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 12 18:56:12 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 09:56:12 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] DomainKey problem with Mailman
In-Reply-To: <1234460347.15931.57.camel@vishnu.fmp.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902120956120484ed05efb0@msapiro>

Lindsay Haisley wrote:
>
>So, since Mailman is the "agent responsible for the actual transmission
>of the message", re-writing the Sender header doesn't appear to be a
>violation of the spec, but there is a problem here.  It appears that
>Mailman _should_ either offer the option of preserving the original
>poster's Sender header, or should nuke the original poster's
>DomainKey-Signature: header.


At one point, Mailman unconditionally removed DomainKey-Signature:,
DKIM-Signature: and Authentication-Results: headers from outgoing
mail. As a result of a discussion on Mailman-Developers [1], this
behavior was made conditional based on the setting of
REMOVE_DKIM_HEADERS which defaults to No. If you want them removed, put

REMOVE_DKIM_HEADERS = Yes

in mm_cfg.py.

[1]
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-developers/2007-February/019346.html>
et. seq.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From fmouse-mailman at fmp.com  Thu Feb 12 19:05:27 2009
From: fmouse-mailman at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley)
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:05:27 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] DomainKey problem with Mailman
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902120956120484ed05efb0@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902120956120484ed05efb0@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1234461927.15931.69.camel@vishnu.fmp.com>

On Thu, 2009-02-12 at 09:56 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> REMOVE_DKIM_HEADERS = Yes

So what are the negative implications of doing this?

-- 
Lindsay Haisley       | "Everything works    |    Accredited
FMP Computer Services |       if you let it" |      by the
512-259-1190          |    (The Roadie)      |   Austin Better
http://www.fmp.com    |                      |  Business Bureau


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 12 19:17:04 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:17:04 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] DomainKey problem with Mailman
In-Reply-To: <1234461927.15931.69.camel@vishnu.fmp.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902121017040031ebe1ede3@msapiro>

Lindsay Haisley wrote:

>On Thu, 2009-02-12 at 09:56 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>> REMOVE_DKIM_HEADERS = Yes
>
>So what are the negative implications of doing this?

Read the thread at
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-developers/2007-February/019346.html>
and draw your own conclusions.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 12 21:09:08 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:09:08 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Removing Email Address From Archives
In-Reply-To: <7DEB2461-12B5-432F-8BBC-B6A07D06A1A6@neverbox.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902121209080000b24c6dc8@msapiro>

shustak wrote:
>
>So far my investigation of how to achieve this kind of email address  
>removal resulted in the following : http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users at python.org/msg46398.html
>
>> There is no option or setting to do this. You would have to modify the
>> code in Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py.
>
>Is this still the case?


Yes.


>If editing this file is the best way to go  
>about this, has someone release a patch?


Not as far as I know.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From khillo100 at hotmail.com  Fri Feb 13 12:03:58 2009
From: khillo100 at hotmail.com (Khalil Abbas)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:03:58 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] external mail server
Message-ID: <COL105-W7028440F6C51B62C9314E8FBB80@phx.gbl>


hi,
 
is there a way to configure mailman hosted on a dedicated server to send using an external mail server on another dedicated server e.g. : mail.domain-on-another-server.com?
 
Thanks ..

_________________________________________________________________
Invite your mail contacts to join your friends list with Windows Live Spaces. It's easy!
http://spaces.live.com/spacesapi.aspx?wx_action=create&wx_url=/friends.aspx&mkt=en-us

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 13 17:00:24 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 08:00:24 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] external mail server
In-Reply-To: <COL105-W7028440F6C51B62C9314E8FBB80@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902130800240812d9fa2984@msapiro>

Khalil Abbas wrote:
> 
>is there a way to configure mailman hosted on a dedicated server to send using an external mail server on another dedicated server e.g. : mail.domain-on-another-server.com?


Set SMTPHOST and maybe SMTPPORT in mm_cfg.py.

Note when installing/using any software, it is a good idea to read
through it's configuration file(s) to familiarize yourself with the
available settings. In the case of Mailman, that means reading
Defaults.py.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From cmpalmer at metalab.unc.edu  Thu Feb 12 08:27:30 2009
From: cmpalmer at metalab.unc.edu (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Crist=F3bal?= Palmer)
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 02:27:30 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] spam to -owner addresses
In-Reply-To: <4992FAB3.1050207@msapiro.net>
References: <20090211035132.GJ23994@garp.metalab.unc.edu>
	<4992FAB3.1050207@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <20090212072730.GK23994@garp.metalab.unc.edu>

On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 08:20:03AM -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Add your SpamAssassin handler to OWNER_PIPELINE
> 
> OWNER_PIPELINE.insert(1, 'SpamAssassin')

Thanks! That's the magic I needed.

Cheers,
-- 
Crist?bal Palmer
ibiblio.org systems administrator
cdla.unc.edu research assistant

From gherzig at fmed.uba.ar  Wed Feb 11 20:47:41 2009
From: gherzig at fmed.uba.ar (gherzig at fmed.uba.ar)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:47:41 -0200 (ARST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] bounce-events-xxxx.pck filling up quickly my
 disk
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009021108371904848bfe8737@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009021108371904848bfe8737@msapiro>
Message-ID: <71d696421f7713e3bda8bd7260556e30.squirrel@www.webmail.fmed.uba.ar>

> Gerardo Herzig wrote:
>
>>Hi all. As my server is getting bocked in hotmail and yahoo, the pickled
>>file bounce-events grows mega-fast and quickly fills-up the partition.
>>Can Mailman be configured to "stop writing after some size", or will i
>>have to doit with some sort of Linux quota system?
>
>
> There should never be more than 2 bounce-events-xxxx.pck files, one
> where xxxx is the PID of BounceRunner and another where xxxx is the
> PID of OutgoingRunner. Any other such files are orphans and can be
> removed.
>
> The BounceRunner file queues received DSNs. The OutgoingRunner file
> queues outgoing SMTP rejects.
>
> Further, if everything is working as it should be the queued bounces
> should be processed and the file removed at intervals determined by
> the Defaults.py/mm_cfg.py setting REGISTER_BOUNCES_EVERY which
> defaults to 15 minutes.
>
> So what specifically is going wrong in your case?
>
My server is getting spam-blocked in hotmail, yahoo and others, and some
list have about 40,000 hotmail+yahoo address. So the bounce-events-xxx.pck
(i guess im talking about the BounceRunner one) grows almost automaticaly
because of all the yahoo and hotmail emails getting back to my server, to
the 5 GB limit of /usr/local partition.

Thanks Mark!
Gerardo


From jeffg at turners.com  Thu Feb 12 15:22:40 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 06:22:40 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] A few configuration questions
Message-ID: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979585BD@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>

I just moved over to Mailman from a program called LetterRip Pro on the
Macintosh.  The main reason I moved over was because of the poor bounce
management in LetterRip.  I have a few questions about setup and usage
that I am hoping somebody can help me out with.  I am running 5
announcement/newsletter style lists.  Moderation is turned on because I
don't want anybody to send posts to the lists except for a few people in
my company.  The lists names are:

 

Fishads

Fishads-Text

Huntads

Huntads-Text

News

 

1.      The Fishads and Fishads-Text are identical lists except one is
sent using HTML and the other is sent in plain text.  There is really no
reason for a user to be subscribed to both lists.  Is it possible for me
to set up Mailman so an e-mail address can only be on one of these lists
and not both?

2.      Sometimes I want to send a post to all of the e-mail addresses
in our lists, but I don't want users to get duplicate messages if they
are on multiple lists.  Is there a way to send a post to all of the
unique e-mail addresses between all of the lists?

 

I was sure I had 3 questions, but I can't remember the last one.  I
guess that will be for another e-mail.

 

Thanks for any help you can offer me.


From sgruver at cis.ctc.edu  Wed Feb 11 21:46:21 2009
From: sgruver at cis.ctc.edu (Gruver, Sandi)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:46:21 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] process for preserving archives?
Message-ID: <2937FEC6C48A2444A185846F547A35DA0712032FF5@london.CISI.ctc.edu>

Is there a mailman process for saving off archives?
We want to save/collect all our archives for a period of time before deleting them.
Wondering if there is a mailman process for saving the archives.


Thank you,

S Gruver
Unix system administrator
SBCTC-IT
Bellevue, WA 98004




From shannon at dennistoninc.com  Wed Feb 11 08:37:47 2009
From: shannon at dennistoninc.com (Shannon D. Denniston)
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 02:37:47 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] not metoo broken
Message-ID: <F498A2629C054C55B9AB3015BB8055DB@DEMain>

I have the same settings as the person in:
http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users at python.org/msg35000.html

I am not receiving a copy of messages I send to a list. I am
subscribed under multiple email addresses to this list and all
other addresses receive my message but a copy is not being
sent to the poster of the message. I have "not metoo" un-checked
for all subscribers to the list in question.

I'm running version 2.1.5 of MailMan. Is this feature broken
in this version?


Sincerely,
Shannon D. Denniston, President
Denniston Enterprises, Inc.
http://www.DennistonInc.com
shannon at dennistoninc.com
859.498.4729
Skype: dennistoninc

From brad at shub-internet.org  Fri Feb 13 17:34:14 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 10:34:14 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] process for preserving archives?
In-Reply-To: <2937FEC6C48A2444A185846F547A35DA0712032FF5@london.CISI.ctc.edu>
References: <2937FEC6C48A2444A185846F547A35DA0712032FF5@london.CISI.ctc.edu>
Message-ID: <4995A106.1080102@shub-internet.org>

Gruver, Sandi wrote:

> Is there a mailman process for saving off archives?

Built into Mailman?  No.

> We want to save/collect all our archives for a period of time before deleting them.

The on-disk format is basically just plain files.  So, use the features 
provided by your OS to archive files, whether that's tar, cpio, or whatever.

If you want to archive the raw mbox-format file, make sure that whatever you 
do will preserve the 7th edition mbox format of the file, otherwise the 
archives will be unreadable by Mailman.  IIRC, this is discussed in the FAQ.

> Wondering if there is a mailman process for saving the archives.

Not without modifying the source code, no.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 13 17:52:33 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 08:52:33 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] not metoo broken
In-Reply-To: <F498A2629C054C55B9AB3015BB8055DB@DEMain>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902130852330000fe713aa1@msapiro>

Shannon D. Denniston wrote

>I am not receiving a copy of messages I send to a list. I am
>subscribed under multiple email addresses to this list and all
>other addresses receive my message but a copy is not being
>sent to the poster of the message. I have "not metoo" un-checked
>for all subscribers to the list in question.
>
>I'm running version 2.1.5 of MailMan. Is this feature broken
>in this version?


Not as distributed by the Mailman project.

Is the poster's address at gmail or googlemail? If so, see the FAQ at
<http://wiki.list.org/x/2IA9>.

If not, does the poster's address appear in To: or Cc: of the post
which will prevent a copy being sent from the list if the poster has
'nodups' checked.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Fri Feb 13 18:05:29 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:05:29 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] A few configuration questions
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979585BD@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
References: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979585BD@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <4995A859.3090109@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/12/09 08:22, Jeff Grossman wrote:
> 1.  The Fishads and Fishads-Text are identical lists except one is 
> sent using HTML and the other is sent in plain text.  There is really 
> no reason for a user to be subscribed to both lists.  Is it possible 
> for me to set up Mailman so an e-mail address can only be on one of 
> these lists and not both?

I don't think you will need <list_name> and <list_name>-text with 
Mailman as it has the ability to convert HTML to plain text its self. 
People just need to choose their preference.

> 2.  Sometimes I want to send a post to all of the e-mail addresses in 
> our lists, but I don't want users to get duplicate messages if they 
> are on multiple lists.  Is there a way to send a post to all of the 
> unique e-mail addresses between all of the lists?

This is really an umbrella / regular list question, which is changing in 
Mailman 3, and might be better addressed there.  If you don't want to 
wait, look through the archives to see more information about "umbrella 
lists".

> I was sure I had 3 questions, but I can't remember the last one.  I 
> guess that will be for another e-mail.

Have a caffeinated beverage on me.  ;)

> Thanks for any help you can offer me.

*nod*



Grant. . . .

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 13 18:22:42 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:22:42 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] A few configuration questions
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979585BD@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021309224205461696f18c@msapiro>

Jeff Grossman wrote:
>
>1.      The Fishads and Fishads-Text are identical lists except one is
>sent using HTML and the other is sent in plain text.  There is really no
>reason for a user to be subscribed to both lists.  Is it possible for me
>to set up Mailman so an e-mail address can only be on one of these lists
>and not both?


No.


>2.      Sometimes I want to send a post to all of the e-mail addresses
>in our lists, but I don't want users to get duplicate messages if they
>are on multiple lists.  Is there a way to send a post to all of the
>unique e-mail addresses between all of the lists?


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/TIA9>. It describes scripts that
can be used to create an overall list and it also indicates how
"sibling lists" can be used to do this if you aren't concerned about
digest members.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 13 18:29:28 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:29:28 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] A few configuration questions
In-Reply-To: <4995A859.3090109@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021309292807658aa00059@msapiro>

Grant Taylor 
>
>I don't think you will need <list_name> and <list_name>-text with 
>Mailman as it has the ability to convert HTML to plain text its self. 
>People just need to choose their preference.


Converting HTML to plain text is done as part of content filtering and
it is a list option. It is not something individual members can chose
for themselves.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From dragos at bcu-iasi.ro  Fri Feb 13 20:12:53 2009
From: dragos at bcu-iasi.ro (Dragos Leahu)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 21:12:53 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.9 - Fedora 8 - upgrade
Message-ID: <93D45F2157314432ADC5606E490506E2@bluto>

Hi,

I am running Mailman - mailman-2.1.9-8.2.fc8 (updated) from the distribution - on Fedora 8 (up-to-date), with Sendmail - sendmail-8.14.2-1.fc8. 

1. Which is the best way to upgrade Mailman to a newer version (the latest if possible) without taking any risk? 

2. Another issue: even if I have set Mailman (for a certain list) to receive messages only from the list's members and to automatically discard any other messages (to that list) there still are a very few (2 or 3 in a couple of months) messages (spam actually) that did pass through to the list. What should I do in order to prevent this from ever happening again?

I must say I am a novice administrator of Mailman.

Regards,
Dragos
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From jeffg at turners.com  Sat Feb 14 02:29:12 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:29:12 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
Message-ID: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>

I received a uncaught bounce notification from one of my lists today.
The bounce looks pretty normal, and figured it should have been caught
by the bounce system.  How do I report bounce formats that did not get
caught by the bounce system?

 

Here is the bounce.  I changed the e-mail address.  And, yes the e-mail
address is currently subscribed to the list.

 

Hi. The MTA program at mta6-1.us4.outblaze.com was unable to deliver
your message to the following addresses.

This is a permanent error.

 

<x at x>:

Error 01373: User's Disk Quota Exceeded.

Sorry, your intended recipient has too much mail stored

in his mailbox.

Your message totalled  23 Kbytes.

However a small (< 1Kb) message will be delivered should

you wish to inform your recipient you tried to email.

 


From brad at shub-internet.org  Sat Feb 14 08:27:09 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 01:27:09 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.9 - Fedora 8 - upgrade
In-Reply-To: <93D45F2157314432ADC5606E490506E2@bluto>
References: <93D45F2157314432ADC5606E490506E2@bluto>
Message-ID: <4996724D.8010205@shub-internet.org>

on 2/13/09 1:12 PM, Dragos Leahu said:

> 1. Which is the best way to upgrade Mailman to a newer version (the
> latest if possible) without taking any risk?

All upgrades carry a certain measure of risk.  If you want absolute zero 
risk, then pull the power cord, toss the machine into an old car, and 
then take the old car to be crushed and melted down for scrap metal.

Failing that, the least risky upgrade procedure would probably be to get 
the latest version of the binary package for your platform.  If you want 
to go that route, you need to talk to the people who prepare those 
packages -- we provide only source code.

If you decide to go this direction, then any support questions you have 
that relate to the binary package should first be directed to the 
maintainers of that binary package.

> 2. Another issue: even if I have set Mailman (for a certain list) to
> receive messages only from the list's members and to automatically
> discard any other messages (to that list) there still are a very few
> (2 or 3 in a couple of months) messages (spam actually) that did pass
> through to the list. What should I do in order to prevent this from
> ever happening again?

Go to the FAQ Wiki page at 
<http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Frequently+Asked+Questions> and search 
for "spoof-proof".

> I must say I am a novice administrator of Mailman.

For any question you've got, I'd suggest going first to the FAQ Wiki 
(mentioned above), and see the other documentation at 
<http://www.list.org/docs.html>.  Then search the archives of the list, 
in accordance to FAQ 1.18 at 
<http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030520>.

After doing that, if you still have questions, then feel free to post 
them here.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 14 17:13:09 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:13:09 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021408130909064faa6253@msapiro>

Jeff Grossman wrote:

>I received a uncaught bounce notification from one of my lists today.
>The bounce looks pretty normal, and figured it should have been caught
>by the bounce system.  How do I report bounce formats that did not get
>caught by the bounce system?


You send them to me, but I need the full raw message, not just the
body, because various things in the headers are used to determine
which heuristics to apply to the message.


>Here is the bounce.  I changed the e-mail address.  And, yes the e-mail
>address is currently subscribed to the list.


Whether or not the address is a list member has nothing to do with
recognition. If the bounce is sent to you as unrecognized, Mailman
doesn't know what address bounced. Mailman is saying it couldn't
determine the address. If Mailman had determined the address, and it
wasn't a list member, it would have just ignored the bounce


>Hi. The MTA program at mta6-1.us4.outblaze.com was unable to deliver
>your message to the following addresses.
>
>This is a permanent error.


This has a Qmail flavor to it, but it doesn't comply with
<http://cr.yp.to/proto/qsbmf.txt>.


-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 14 19:49:44 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 10:49:44 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.9 - Fedora 8 - upgrade
In-Reply-To: <4996724D.8010205@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021410494405780e91f1ae@msapiro>

Brad Knowles wrote:

>on 2/13/09 1:12 PM, Dragos Leahu said:
>
>> 1. Which is the best way to upgrade Mailman to a newer version (the
>> latest if possible) without taking any risk?
>
>All upgrades carry a certain measure of risk.  If you want absolute zero 
>risk, then pull the power cord, toss the machine into an old car, and 
>then take the old car to be crushed and melted down for scrap metal.
>
>Failing that, the least risky upgrade procedure would probably be to get 
>the latest version of the binary package for your platform.  If you want 
>to go that route, you need to talk to the people who prepare those 
>packages -- we provide only source code.


If you do want to upgrade from source, the procedure is complicated by
the fact that RedHat's Mailman packages do not store things in the
same places that the source distribution does and it is not possible
to completely match RedHat's locations solely with configure options
like --prefix and --with-var-prefix. See
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-developers/2004-October/017343.html>
for more on this. There is a patch attached to that post which is
against an older (2.1.5 I think) base which you could probably apply
to 2.1.12 and then configure and make to match your existing
installation.

The alternative is to configure and make normally and then move your
existing installation's files to the new locations. If you run
configure with the options --prefix=/usr/lib/mailman and
--with-var-prefix=/var/lib/mailman, much, but not everything, will be
in the right place.

The potential problem with this approach is that if you use SELinux,
you will probably run into security policy issues.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From fil at rezo.net  Sat Feb 14 20:58:43 2009
From: fil at rezo.net (Fil)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 20:58:43 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.9 - Fedora 8 - upgrade
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009021410494405780e91f1ae@msapiro>
References: <4996724D.8010205@shub-internet.org>
	<PC18702009021410494405780e91f1ae@msapiro>
Message-ID: <bfc33ad70902141158w4e92a63cle6d8910ea6b1858a@mail.gmail.com>

> <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-developers/2004-October/017343.html>
> for more on this. There is a patch attached to that post which is
> against an older (2.1.5 I think) base which you could probably apply
> to 2.1.12 and then configure and make to match your existing
> installation.

Could we not include this patch? It would make it easier for many people

-- Fil

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 14 23:41:05 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 14:41:05 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.9 - Fedora 8 - upgrade
In-Reply-To: <bfc33ad70902141158w4e92a63cle6d8910ea6b1858a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902141441050968af4765cd@msapiro>

Fil wrote:

>> <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-developers/2004-October/017343.html>
>> for more on this. There is a patch attached to that post which is
>> against an older (2.1.5 I think) base which you could probably apply
>> to 2.1.12 and then configure and make to match your existing
>> installation.
>
>Could we not include this patch? It would make it easier for many people


I've added it to the contrib/ directory. I don't want to actually apply
it since it isn't applicable in it's present form To Mailman 3, and
applying it to 2.1 or 2.2 would require every one doing a source
upgrade to make significant modifications to their ./configure command
arguments or to move several existing files and directories to be
compatible with their new locations.

I don't think it's worth this disruption to accommodate a few people
who might want to update a RedHat rpm installation from source.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Sun Feb 15 00:56:25 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 17:56:25 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
References: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <49975A29.7020100@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/13/2009 07:29 PM, Jeff Grossman wrote:
> I received a uncaught bounce notification from one of my lists today. 
>  The bounce looks pretty normal, and figured it should have been 
> caught by the bounce system.  How do I report bounce formats that did 
> not get caught by the bounce system?

Though it would be nice for Mailman to recognize this bounce format and 
automatically process it, I am questioning if this particular bounce 
should be acted upon or not.

Seeing as how this bounce was generated because the recipient was over 
quota "User's Disk Quota Exceeded", I wonder what the appropriate thing 
to do is.  This is (IMHO) *very* likely to be a transient / temporary 
error.  As such I'm not sure that I would want to act on this particular 
error.  However if a bunch of these errors happened, then I might want 
to take action.

So I'm not sure if this is where the number of bounces (before something 
is done) comes in to play, or what.  Just something to think about.



Grant. . . .

From khillo100 at hotmail.com  Sun Feb 15 01:11:12 2009
From: khillo100 at hotmail.com (Khalil Abbas)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 00:11:12 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] external mail server
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902130800240812d9fa2984@msapiro>
References: <COL105-W7028440F6C51B62C9314E8FBB80@phx.gbl>
	<PC1870200902130800240812d9fa2984@msapiro>
Message-ID: <COL105-W54E8AB270CA63E640015CFFBB60@phx.gbl>


I'm sorry .. I forgot to say: per list .. I meant : is there a way to set mailman to make each list on the same server to send using external mail servers??
 
for example : I have 5 lists, list1,list2,list3,list4,list5, can mailman make:
 
list1 send to mail.external-server1.com
list2 send to mail.external-server2.com list3 send to mail.external-server3.com list4 send to mail.external-server4.com list5 send to mail.external-server5.com 
 
thanks ..> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 08:00:24 -0800> From: mark at msapiro.net> To: khillo100 at hotmail.com; mailman-users at python.org> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] external mail server> > Khalil Abbas wrote:> > > >is there a way to configure mailman hosted on a dedicated server to send using an external mail server on another dedicated server e.g. : mail.domain-on-another-server.com?> > > Set SMTPHOST and maybe SMTPPORT in mm_cfg.py.> > Note when installing/using any software, it is a good idea to read> through it's configuration file(s) to familiarize yourself with the> available settings. In the case of Mailman, that means reading> Defaults.py.> > -- > Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers,> San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan> 
_________________________________________________________________
More than messages?check out the rest of the Windows Live?.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/

From brad at shub-internet.org  Sun Feb 15 01:39:02 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 18:39:02 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] external mail server
In-Reply-To: <COL105-W54E8AB270CA63E640015CFFBB60@phx.gbl>
References: <COL105-W7028440F6C51B62C9314E8FBB80@phx.gbl>	<PC1870200902130800240812d9fa2984@msapiro>
	<COL105-W54E8AB270CA63E640015CFFBB60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <49976426.2010901@shub-internet.org>

on 2/14/09 6:11 PM, Khalil Abbas said:
> I'm sorry .. I forgot to say: per list .. I meant : is there a way to
> set mailman to make each list on the same server to send using
> external mail servers??

On a per-list basis?  No, not without making source code modifications.

On this issue, you get one global setting that all lists will use.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From khillo100 at hotmail.com  Sun Feb 15 01:42:21 2009
From: khillo100 at hotmail.com (Khalil Abbas)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 00:42:21 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] external mail server
In-Reply-To: <49976426.2010901@shub-internet.org>
References: <COL105-W7028440F6C51B62C9314E8FBB80@phx.gbl>
	<PC1870200902130800240812d9fa2984@msapiro>
	<COL105-W54E8AB270CA63E640015CFFBB60@phx.gbl>
	<49976426.2010901@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <COL105-W27C8BF3F02B6A429E9C2AFBB60@phx.gbl>


are you guys gonna be real pals and do this modification to the source code soon? This would be a great addition to mailman's many great features - I hope this sucking up would work :)))))))))> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 18:39:02 -0600> From: brad at shub-internet.org> To: khillo100 at hotmail.com> CC: mailman-users at python.org> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] external mail server> > on 2/14/09 6:11 PM, Khalil Abbas said:> > I'm sorry .. I forgot to say: per list .. I meant : is there a way to> > set mailman to make each list on the same server to send using> > external mail servers??> > On a per-list basis? No, not without making source code modifications.> > On this issue, you get one global setting that all lists will use.> > -- > Brad Knowles> <brad at shub-internet.org> If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out> LinkedIn Profile: my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at> <http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu> http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks
_________________________________________________________________
Show them the way! Add maps and directions to your party invites. 
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/products/events.aspx

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 01:44:48 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:44:48 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] external mail server
In-Reply-To: <COL105-W54E8AB270CA63E640015CFFBB60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021416444806253be048a1@msapiro>

Khalil Abbas wrote:
>
>I'm sorry .. I forgot to say: per list .. I meant : is there a way to set mailman to make each list on the same server to send using external mail servers??
>
>for example : I have 5 lists, list1,list2,list3,list4,list5, can mailman make:
>
>list1 send to mail.external-server1.com
>list2 send to mail.external-server2.com list3 send to mail.external-server3.com list4 send to mail.external-server4.com list5 send to mail.external-server5.com


Only by modifying the source code or running a separate Mailman
instance for each list.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 01:47:47 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:47:47 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] external mail server
In-Reply-To: <COL105-W27C8BF3F02B6A429E9C2AFBB60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021416474702813be04748@msapiro>

Khalil Abbas wrote:
>
>are you guys gonna be real pals and do this modification to the source code soon? This would be a great addition to mailman's many great features - I hope this sucking up would work :)))))))))


It won't work. The only thing that would work is a strong argument that
this feature would be of significant benefit to a significant portion
of the community.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 02:04:10 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 17:04:10 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <49975A29.7020100@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902141704100609af47646b@msapiro>

Grant Taylor wrote:

>On 02/13/2009 07:29 PM, Jeff Grossman wrote:
>> I received a uncaught bounce notification from one of my lists today. 
>>  The bounce looks pretty normal, and figured it should have been 
>> caught by the bounce system.  How do I report bounce formats that did 
>> not get caught by the bounce system?
>
>Though it would be nice for Mailman to recognize this bounce format and 
>automatically process it, I am questioning if this particular bounce 
>should be acted upon or not.


That question hinges on whether or not the bounce should be considered
a permanent or a temporary failure. The bounce itself says "This is a
permanent error."


>Seeing as how this bounce was generated because the recipient was over 
>quota "User's Disk Quota Exceeded", I wonder what the appropriate thing 
>to do is.  This is (IMHO) *very* likely to be a transient / temporary 
>error.


I disagree. I think it is likely to be an abandoned account, but in any
case, with default bounce processing settings, The user's delivery
won't be disabled until a bounce like this is received on 5 separate
days.


>As such I'm not sure that I would want to act on this particular 
>error.  However if a bunch of these errors happened, then I might want 
>to take action.
>
>So I'm not sure if this is where the number of bounces (before something 
>is done) comes in to play, or what.  Just something to think about.


Exactly.

Also note that the message also said "Your message totalled  23 Kbytes.
However a small (< 1Kb) message will be delivered should
you wish to inform your recipient you tried to email."

So probably when we disable the user's delivery after 5 days of
bounces, the disabled notice we send to the user might be accepted,
and with default settings, the user won't be unsubscribed until 3
weeks and two more notices later.

Granted, this could be a user on an extended vacation (over a month),
but in that case, ultimately unsubscribing the user is easy to reverse
and is small penalty for the user's forgetting to disable list
delivery.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From shop at justbrits.com  Sun Feb 15 02:23:44 2009
From: shop at justbrits.com (Ed's Shop)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 19:23:44 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902141704100609af47646b@msapiro>
Message-ID: <OLECLAFDGBNPEJPOHHIJEEOOCIAA.shop@justbrits.com>

*****
Grant Taylor wrote:

>On 02/13/2009 07:29 PM, Jeff Grossman wrote:
>> I received a uncaught bounce notification from one of my lists today.
>>  The bounce looks pretty normal, and figured it should have been
>> caught by the bounce system.  How do I report bounce formats that did
>> not get caught by the bounce system?
>
>Though it would be nice for Mailman to recognize this bounce format and
>automatically process it, I am questioning if this particular bounce
>should be acted upon or not.


That question hinges on whether or not the bounce should be considered
a permanent or a temporary failure. The bounce itself says "This is a
permanent error."


>Seeing as how this bounce was generated because the recipient was over
>quota "User's Disk Quota Exceeded", I wonder what the appropriate thing
>to do is.  This is (IMHO) *very* likely to be a transient / temporary
>error.


I disagree. I think it is likely to be an abandoned account, but in any
case, with default bounce processing settings, The user's delivery
won't be disabled until a bounce like this is received on 5 separate
days.


>As such I'm not sure that I would want to act on this particular
>error.  However if a bunch of these errors happened, then I might want
>to take action.
>
>So I'm not sure if this is where the number of bounces (before something
>is done) comes in to play, or what.  Just something to think about.


Exactly.

Also note that the message also said "Your message totalled  23 Kbytes.
However a small (< 1Kb) message will be delivered should
you wish to inform your recipient you tried to email."

So probably when we disable the user's delivery after 5 days of
bounces, the disabled notice we send to the user might be accepted,
and with default settings, the user won't be unsubscribed until 3
weeks and two more notices later.

Granted, this could be a user on an extended vacation (over a month),
but in that case, ultimately unsubscribing the user is easy to reverse
and is small penalty for the user's forgetting to disable list
delivery.

--
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

------------------------------------------------------
*****

I have TEN guys on one of my cPanel List that travel a LOT and
(used to -:) ) Forget to either STOP their subscription or UN-sub.

That BOUNCE(s) used to drive me NUTS until I REALLY put my
foot down AFTER contacting each Lister and finding out what-was-what and
then or THIRD occurrence (each) I banned them which
DID 'get their attention' !!! -:)

At the very beginning of the 1st gent causing it, I also was REALLY
'wondering' and was actually going to ask the same sort of thing as
Jeff had.

Investigate, investigate, investigate.   -:)

Ed


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Sun Feb 15 02:32:18 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 19:32:18 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902141704100609af47646b@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902141704100609af47646b@msapiro>
Message-ID: <499770A2.5070705@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/14/2009 07:04 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> That question hinges on whether or not the bounce should be 
> considered a permanent or a temporary failure. The bounce itself says 
> "This is a permanent error."

Agreed.  However I believe the permanent or temporary nature that the 
bounce is speaking of is on the SMTP level, thus the sending server 
should not try to send this given message again.  I think it is a flaw 
to extend this SMTP meaning up to actual future (different) message 
delivery.

> I disagree. I think it is likely to be an abandoned account, but in 
> any case, with default bounce processing settings, The user's 
> delivery won't be disabled until a bounce like this is received on 5 
> separate days.

Possibly.  My experience with my customer shows that people are likely 
to hit their quota over a weekend or a vacation.  When they come back 
the following week (or when ever) and POP all their messages out of 
their box, the /temporary/ error is corrected.  Granted my experience 
may be limited to my customer scope and more than likely does not apply 
to someone like GMail or HotMail or Yahoo.  I guess it depends on the 
customer base.

> So probably when we disable the user's delivery after 5 days of 
> bounces, the disabled notice we send to the user might be accepted, 
> and with default settings, the user won't be unsubscribed until 3 
> weeks and two more notices later.

Agreed... as long as there is not < 23 kB worth of email received in the 
next 3 weeks.  However if the user does not clean out their mail box in 
that time this leads credence to the likely hood that the account is 
abandoned.

> Granted, this could be a user on an extended vacation (over a month), 
> but in that case, ultimately unsubscribing the user is easy to 
> reverse and is small penalty for the user's forgetting to disable 
> list delivery.

True...



Grant. . . .


P.S.  I find it interesting that the bounce is eluding to the amount of 
space remaining in the account.  This is (in my experience) extremely 
unusual.

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 03:08:22 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 18:08:22 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <499770A2.5070705@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902141808220890d5c37150@msapiro>

Grant Taylor wrote:
>
>P.S.  I find it interesting that the bounce is eluding to the amount of 
>space remaining in the account.  This is (in my experience) extremely 
>unusual.


As I read the bounce, it says

Sorry, your intended recipient has too much mail stored
in his mailbox.
Your message totalled  23 Kbytes.
However a small (< 1Kb) message will be delivered should
you wish to inform your recipient you tried to email.

and I interpret that to mean that even though the user is over quota,
the MTA will accept a < 1 KB message to allow you to try to notify the
user of the problem, not that the user is 1 KB below quota.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Sun Feb 15 03:14:34 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 20:14:34 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902141808220890d5c37150@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902141808220890d5c37150@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49977A8A.8000401@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/14/2009 08:08 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> and I interpret that to mean that even though the user is over quota, 
> the MTA will accept a < 1 KB message to allow you to try to notify 
> the user of the problem, not that the user is 1 KB below quota.

*nod*

Hopefully there is a limit to how far over quota the mail box can be 
before the server stops accepting small messages, or it would still be 
possible to DoS the system.



Grant. . . .

From lida_mail at 163.com  Sat Feb 14 14:54:58 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 21:54:58 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Checking installation issues.
Message-ID: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>

Dear Sir,
I have met some difficulties when checking installation. I have google
the issue, and take necessary measurement that I know, but still got the
problem.

How can I fix the problem? Any advice and suggestion is welcomed. Thanks
in advance.


$ bin/check_perms 
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "bin/check_perms", line 391, in ?
    checkarchivedbs()
  File "bin/check_perms", line 252, in checkarchivedbs
    for dir in os.listdir(mm_cfg.PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_FILE_DIR):
OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
'/mnt/hdb2/mailman/archives/private'
[daniel at palfocus mailman]$ bin/check_perms -f
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "bin/check_perms", line 391, in ?
    checkarchivedbs()
  File "bin/check_perms", line 252, in checkarchivedbs
    for dir in os.listdir(mm_cfg.PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_FILE_DIR):
OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
'/mnt/hdb2/mailman/archives/private'

-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From jeffg at turners.com  Sat Feb 14 17:49:00 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:49:00 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] MMDSR Question
Message-ID: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A8@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>

I know the mmdsr program is an unsupported application, but I am hoping
somebody here can help me out.  I have not been able to find any answers
via Google or the mailing list archives.  I have set up all of the
parameters, but the program never finishes running.  When I run it from
the command line, it never returns the command line, just continues
running forever.  Any help would be appreciated.  I am running this on
an OS X 10.3.9 machine.  The temp file that it creates gets as far as:

 

Message held -- Post by non-member (by list):

------------------------------

 

Message held -- Suspicious header (by list):

------------------------------

 

Discarded posting (by list):

------------------------------

 

Bulk/Junk message discarded (by list):

------------------------------

 

Implicit destination (by list):

------------------------------

 

Post to moderated newsgroup (by list):

------------------------------

 

Post to moderated list (by list):

------------------------------

 

Other Errors:

------------------------------

 

 

 


From jeffg at turners.com  Sat Feb 14 18:43:01 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 09:43:01 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Message
Message-ID: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A9@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>

I have started getting the following error message in my log files.  It
appears to be when Mailman receives a bounce for a non-member.

 

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527): Traceback (most recent call last):

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/bin/qrunner", line 278, in ?

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      main()

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/bin/qrunner", line 238, in main

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      qrunner.run()

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 88, in run

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self._cleanup()

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py", line 263, in
_cleanup

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      BounceMixin._cleanup(self)

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py", line 137, in
_cleanup

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self._register_bounces()

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py", line 125, in
_register_bounces

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      mlist.registerBounce(addr, msg,
day=day)Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 167, in registerBounce

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self.setBounceInfo(member, info)

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 362, in
setBounceInfo

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self.__assertIsMember(member)

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 114, in
__assertIsMember

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      raise Errors.NotAMemberError,
member

Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527): Mailman.Errors . NotAMemberError :
x at x


From jeffg at turners.com  Sun Feb 15 01:59:27 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:59:27 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <49975A29.7020100@riverviewtech.net>
References: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A0@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
	<49975A29.7020100@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <bf9fdac7ac2189f8faa57a7cdd694c7d.squirrel@intranet.turners.com>

Grant Taylor wrote:
> On 02/13/2009 07:29 PM, Jeff Grossman wrote:
>> I received a uncaught bounce notification from one of my lists today.
>>  The bounce looks pretty normal, and figured it should have been
>> caught by the bounce system.  How do I report bounce formats that did
>> not get caught by the bounce system?
>
> Though it would be nice for Mailman to recognize this bounce format and
> automatically process it, I am questioning if this particular bounce
> should be acted upon or not.
>
> Seeing as how this bounce was generated because the recipient was over
> quota "User's Disk Quota Exceeded", I wonder what the appropriate thing
> to do is.  This is (IMHO) *very* likely to be a transient / temporary
> error.  As such I'm not sure that I would want to act on this particular
> error.  However if a bunch of these errors happened, then I might want
> to take action.
>
> So I'm not sure if this is where the number of bounces (before something
> is done) comes in to play, or what.  Just something to think about.

Don't temporary failures get a score of 0.5 while a permanent failure gets
a score of 1.0?  So, if that is the case, these temporary failures would
take longer to suspend the account.  I think these should be counted.

Jeff


From brad at shub-internet.org  Sun Feb 15 08:43:29 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 01:43:29 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] MMDSR Question
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A8@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
References: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A8@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <4997C7A1.6090301@shub-internet.org>

on 2/14/09 10:49 AM, Jeff Grossman said:

> I know the mmdsr program is an unsupported application, but I am hoping
> somebody here can help me out.

I'm the original author of mmdsr (now that it's been checked into source 
control, Mark has been the last person to make any changes to it), but 
it's a script I just quickly hacked together.

Nevertheless, I'll try to provide what assistance I can.

>                                 I have not been able to find any answers
> via Google or the mailing list archives.  I have set up all of the
> parameters, but the program never finishes running.  When I run it from
> the command line, it never returns the command line, just continues
> running forever.  Any help would be appreciated.  I am running this on
> an OS X 10.3.9 machine.  The temp file that it creates gets as far as:

I never tried to run the script on a MacOS X machine.  On the Linux and 
FreeBSD machines where I run it (including the server for python.org, 
where this list is hosted), I don't see these kinds of problems.

Have you tried adding a "-vx" option on the first line of the script, so 
that you can see each and every line of the code as it is executed?

> Message held -- Post by non-member (by list):
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
>  
> 
> Message held -- Suspicious header (by list):
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
>  
> 
> Discarded posting (by list):
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
>  
> 
> Bulk/Junk message discarded (by list):
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
>  
> 
> Implicit destination (by list):
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
>  
> 
> Post to moderated newsgroup (by list):
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
>  
> 
> Post to moderated list (by list):
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
>  
> 
> Other Errors:
> 
> ------------------------------

I'm not seeing any output in any of these sections here.  Is that the 
way it actually appears on your end, or did you leave some stuff out?

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From brad at shub-internet.org  Sun Feb 15 08:45:22 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 01:45:22 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <499770A2.5070705@riverviewtech.net>
References: <PC1870200902141704100609af47646b@msapiro>
	<499770A2.5070705@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <4997C812.1040609@shub-internet.org>

on 2/14/09 7:32 PM, Grant Taylor said:

> Agreed.  However I believe the permanent or temporary nature that the 
> bounce is speaking of is on the SMTP level, thus the sending server 
> should not try to send this given message again.  I think it is a flaw 
> to extend this SMTP meaning up to actual future (different) message 
> delivery.

This is an excellent point.  I don't think I could have said it better 
myself.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From lstone19 at stonejongleux.com  Sun Feb 15 15:09:49 2009
From: lstone19 at stonejongleux.com (Larry Stone)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 08:09:49 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] MMDSR Question
In-Reply-To: <4997C7A1.6090301@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <C5BD7E4D.70039%lstone19@stonejongleux.com>

On 2/15/09 1:43 AM, Brad Knowles at brad at shub-internet.org wrote:

 
> I never tried to run the script on a MacOS X machine.  On the Linux and
> FreeBSD machines where I run it (including the server for python.org,
> where this list is hosted), I don't see these kinds of problems.

I have MMDSR running on Mac OS X but as I recall, I made a lot of changes to
it to both make it work and have it do what I wanted it to do. There were
definitely some syntax changes and, I think, some binary file location
differences to be to be accommodated.

-- 
Larry Stone
lstone19 at stonejongleux.com
http://www.stonejongleux.com/



From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 16:41:29 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 07:41:29 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Checking installation issues.
In-Reply-To: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902150741290843db9b6ba8@msapiro>

Daniel.Li wrote:
>
>$ bin/check_perms 
>Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "bin/check_perms", line 391, in ?
>    checkarchivedbs()
>  File "bin/check_perms", line 252, in checkarchivedbs
>    for dir in os.listdir(mm_cfg.PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_FILE_DIR):
>OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
>'/mnt/hdb2/mailman/archives/private'
>[daniel at palfocus mailman]$ bin/check_perms -f
>Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "bin/check_perms", line 391, in ?
>    checkarchivedbs()
>  File "bin/check_perms", line 252, in checkarchivedbs
>    for dir in os.listdir(mm_cfg.PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_FILE_DIR):
>OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
>'/mnt/hdb2/mailman/archives/private'


You have to run check_perms as root.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 17:24:29 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 08:24:29 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Message
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A9@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <PC187020090215082429087570fe3848@msapiro>

Jeff Grossman wrote:

>I have started getting the following error message in my log files.  It
>appears to be when Mailman receives a bounce for a non-member.
>
> 
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527): Traceback (most recent call last):
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/bin/qrunner", line 278, in ?
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      main()
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/bin/qrunner", line 238, in main
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      qrunner.run()
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 88, in run
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self._cleanup()
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py", line 263, in
>_cleanup
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      BounceMixin._cleanup(self)
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py", line 137, in
>_cleanup
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self._register_bounces()
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py", line 125, in
>_register_bounces
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      mlist.registerBounce(addr, msg,
>day=day)Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 167, in registerBounce
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self.setBounceInfo(member, info)
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 362, in
>setBounceInfo
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      self.__assertIsMember(member)
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):   File
>"/Applications/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 114, in
>__assertIsMember
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527):      raise Errors.NotAMemberError,
>member
>
>Feb 13 21:31:25 2009 qrunner(527): Mailman.Errors . NotAMemberError :
>x at x


I don't see how this can happen. If you look at Mailman/Bouncer.py, you
should see

    def registerBounce(self, member, msg, weight=1.0, day=None):
        if not self.isMember(member):
            return

Thus, you should never be getting to the

        self.setBounceInfo(member, info)

later in that method.

Is there something wierd about the member address? There was a bug at
one time that would allow a members address to be stored with
upper-case in the domain, but I don't think even this would cause the
above error.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 17:30:56 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 08:30:56 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <bf9fdac7ac2189f8faa57a7cdd694c7d.squirrel@intranet.turners.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902150830560906a1cc9a42@msapiro>

Jeff Grossman wrote:
>
>Don't temporary failures get a score of 0.5 while a permanent failure gets
>a score of 1.0?  So, if that is the case, these temporary failures would
>take longer to suspend the account.  I think these should be counted.


That's what the documentation says, but in fact, it doesn't work that
way. Bounces which are recognized as 'warnings', e.g. "Unable to
deliver your message for 4 hours, will keep trying ...", are ignored.
All other recognized bounces are given a weight of 1.0.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 17:51:42 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 08:51:42 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] MMDSR Question
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A8@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902150851420593132e287b@msapiro>

Jeff Grossman wrote:

>I know the mmdsr program is an unsupported application, but I am hoping
>somebody here can help me out.  I have not been able to find any answers
>via Google or the mailing list archives.  I have set up all of the
>parameters, but the program never finishes running.  When I run it from
>the command line, it never returns the command line, just continues
>running forever.  Any help would be appreciated.  I am running this on
>an OS X 10.3.9 machine.  The temp file that it creates gets as far as:
>
> 
>
>Message held -- Post by non-member (by list):
>
>------------------------------
>
> 
>
>Message held -- Suspicious header (by list):
>
>------------------------------
>
> 
>
>Discarded posting (by list):
>
>------------------------------
>
> 
>
>Bulk/Junk message discarded (by list):
>
>------------------------------
>
> 
>
>Implicit destination (by list):
>
>------------------------------
>
> 
>
>Post to moderated newsgroup (by list):
>
>------------------------------
>
> 
>
>Post to moderated list (by list):
>
>------------------------------
>
> 
>
>Other Errors:
>
>------------------------------



This says that the script has gotten to this point and has gotten
almost to the end of the 'for' loop because the stuff above is for the
'vette' log which is the last log in $ERR_LOGS.


echo "******************************" >> $TMP
echo "Log File Squawks" >> $TMP
echo "******************************" >> $TMP
echo "" >> $TMP

for LOG in $ERR_LOGS
do
...


So it seems to be hung on the

	    $EGREP -vi '(Post by non-member|suspicious header|message
approved|Discarded posting|bulk message discarded|junk message
discarded|Message has implicit destination|Posting to a moderated
newsgroup|Post to moderated list|Message discarded, msgid)' $TMPLOG |
$SED -e 's/^.* ([0-9]*) //' -e 's/, message-id=<[^> ]*>:/:/' | $SORT |
$UNIQ -c | $SORT -nr >> $TMP 

command which is the next thing after

	    echo "" >> $TMP
	    echo "Other Errors:" >> $TMP
	    echo "------------------------------" >> $TMP

since if it got past that egrep, that's the end of the for loop, and
the next thing is

echo "******************************" >> $TMP
echo "Queue Directory Contents" >> $TMP
echo "******************************" >> $TMP
echo "" >> $TMP

and you don't see that.

You could confirm this by putting

echo "Before EGREP"

and

echo "After EGREP"

around that egrep command and running the script manually. If it is the
egrep, this will display "Before EGREP" but not "After EGREP". If it
displays both, then the problem is that for some reasen, the 

for LOG in $ERR_LOGS

is not terminating.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jeffg at turners.com  Sun Feb 15 18:06:47 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 09:06:47 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] MMDSR Question
In-Reply-To: <4997C7A1.6090301@shub-internet.org>
References: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979586A8@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
	<4997C7A1.6090301@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <62695b74bba6e36bb06cf9a0ad1f2bd8.squirrel@intranet.turners.com>

Brad Knowles wrote:
> on 2/14/09 10:49 AM, Jeff Grossman said:
>>                                 I have not been able to find any answers
>> via Google or the mailing list archives.  I have set up all of the
>> parameters, but the program never finishes running.  When I run it from
>> the command line, it never returns the command line, just continues
>> running forever.  Any help would be appreciated.  I am running this on
>> an OS X 10.3.9 machine.  The temp file that it creates gets as far as:
>
> I never tried to run the script on a MacOS X machine.  On the Linux and
> FreeBSD machines where I run it (including the server for python.org,
> where this list is hosted), I don't see these kinds of problems.
>
> Have you tried adding a "-vx" option on the first line of the script, so
> that you can see each and every line of the code as it is executed?
>
No, I never tried the "-vx" option, actually I don't really know where I
would run that.

But, I did figure out my problem.  I decided to look over the script line
by line.  And, when I came to the line write after the "Other Errors"
section it was cut with a bunch of line feeds.  I removed the line feeds
and now it works correctly.  For some reason pico must be splitting that
line when it saves it.  Here is the line in question:

            $EGREP -vi '(Uncaught runner exception|No such
list|Traceback|shunting)' $TMPLOG | $SED -e 's/^.* ([0-9]*)
//' -e 's/unparseable message.*/unparseable message/' -e
's/preserving file.*/preserving file/' | $SORT | $UNIQ -c |
$SORT -nr >> $TMP

It was cutting the variable $TMPLOG with line feeds.

Thanks for your help.  Everything in regards to MMDSR is now working
correctly.

Jeff


From jeffg at turners.com  Sun Feb 15 18:17:23 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 09:17:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Uncaught Bounce Notification
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902150830560906a1cc9a42@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902150830560906a1cc9a42@msapiro>
Message-ID: <2560cba133c0091b15059cabab3c91d5.squirrel@intranet.turners.com>

Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Jeff Grossman wrote:
>>
>>Don't temporary failures get a score of 0.5 while a permanent failure
>> gets
>>a score of 1.0?  So, if that is the case, these temporary failures would
>>take longer to suspend the account.  I think these should be counted.
>
>
> That's what the documentation says, but in fact, it doesn't work that
> way. Bounces which are recognized as 'warnings', e.g. "Unable to
> deliver your message for 4 hours, will keep trying ...", are ignored.
> All other recognized bounces are given a weight of 1.0.

Oh, thanks for that information.


From lida_mail at 163.com  Sun Feb 15 14:01:26 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:01:26 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Checking installation issues.
In-Reply-To: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
References: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <1234702886.6593.10.camel@daniel-laptop>

Dear All,
just use sudo, them OK. 

:) sorry,I'm new here.

On Sat, 2009-02-14 at 21:54 +0800, Daniel.Li wrote:
> Dear Sir,
> I have met some difficulties when checking installation. I have google
> the issue, and take necessary measurement that I know, but still got the
> problem.
> 
> How can I fix the problem? Any advice and suggestion is welcomed. Thanks
> in advance.
> 
> 
> $ bin/check_perms 
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "bin/check_perms", line 391, in ?
>     checkarchivedbs()
>   File "bin/check_perms", line 252, in checkarchivedbs
>     for dir in os.listdir(mm_cfg.PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_FILE_DIR):
> OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
> '/mnt/hdb2/mailman/archives/private'
> [daniel at palfocus mailman]$ bin/check_perms -f
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "bin/check_perms", line 391, in ?
>     checkarchivedbs()
>   File "bin/check_perms", line 252, in checkarchivedbs
>     for dir in os.listdir(mm_cfg.PRIVATE_ARCHIVE_FILE_DIR):
> OSError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
> '/mnt/hdb2/mailman/archives/private'
> 
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From lida_mail at 163.com  Sun Feb 15 14:00:31 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:00:31 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
References: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>

Dear All,
I'm new to mailman. I have installed mailman-2.1.12rc2 on FC5, with
default settings.

I have read the install guide. But it's really hard for me to understand
how to config sendmail, as it's really a short paragraph.

Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.
Thanks very much.

Daniel





From weiss.steve at verizon.net  Sun Feb 15 20:06:44 2009
From: weiss.steve at verizon.net (Steve Weiss)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 14:06:44 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help!
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAALv/pUYqmb9Il5GIO/hHvAjCgAAAEAAAANuApiLwuPpFrOATCFGbawIBAAAAAA==@verizon.net>

I started using Mailman 2.1.11 via Lunar Pages.  I created a list last
month, and almost a month later to the day, my members are being
automatically unsubscribed en mass.  Is there a setting to be changed so I
don't have to re-enter the list members again?

 

Attached is a copy of the email I received.

 

Thanks, in advance, for your help.

 

Steve Weiss.


From brad at shub-internet.org  Sun Feb 15 23:36:07 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 16:36:07 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>
References: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
	<1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <499898D7.6040303@shub-internet.org>

on 2/15/09 7:00 AM, Daniel.Li said:

> I have read the install guide. But it's really hard for me to understand
> how to config sendmail, as it's really a short paragraph.
> 
> Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.

Unfortunately, sendmail is not a part of Mailman.  We can't really
provide a whole lot of help with it.

I would suggest first using the resources provided by the people who
develop your distribution, because they'll be able to give you specific
instructions that may be unique to the configuration they provide.

After that, try the website at www.sendmail.org.  They have a lot of
documentation and other resources that may be helpful to you.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks




From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 23:43:34 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 14:43:34 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Help!
In-Reply-To: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAALv/pUYqmb9Il5GIO/hHvAjCgAAAEAAAANuApiLwuPpFrOATCFGbawIBAAAAAA==@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902151443340906e57cb7ec@msapiro>

Steve Weiss wrote:

>I started using Mailman 2.1.11 via Lunar Pages.  I created a list last
>month, and almost a month later to the day, my members are being
>automatically unsubscribed en mass.  Is there a setting to be changed so I
>don't have to re-enter the list members again?
>
> 
>
>Attached is a copy of the email I received.


Your attachment was stripped by the list's content filtering, but I'm
guessing you received one or both of a message like this:

This is a Mailman mailing list bounce action notice:

    List:       LISTNAME
    Member:     user at example.com
    Action:     Subscription disabled.
    Reason:     Excessive or fatal bounces.

or like this:

user at example.com has been removed from LISTNAME.


If you only got the first message, the members may still be on the list
with delivery disabled and you can reenable delivery from the
Membership Management pages on the web admin interface.

See the Bounce processing section of the web admin interface for more
information.

Any further analysis or help would require access to Mailman's log
files. Depending on your hosting arrangement, you may or may not have
that.

Not that you shouldn't merely reenable a bouncing address without
understanding why it bounced, and whether it is in fact deliverable.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 23:09:42 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 14:09:42 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Message [SOLVED]
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090215082429087570fe3848@msapiro>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902151409420640a05c242a@msapiro>

An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed...
Name: Bouncer.patch.txt
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20090215/f1c765d4/attachment.txt>

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 15 23:51:19 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 14:51:19 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Message [SOLVED]
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902151409420640a05c242a@msapiro>
Message-ID: <PC187020090215145119078192294620@msapiro>

Mark Sapiro tried to write but fumbled his MUA and sent only the
attachment to the list:

>>I just sent you another e-mail with errors from today.  I am going to
>>gzip up all of the log files and send them over to you.  That way you
>>can see everything and hopefully figure out what is going on.
>
>
>I haven't looked at the logs yet, but I know what the problem is. This
>code has been in use since 2.1.11, but it's wrong. The error only
>occurs if bounce_you_are_disabled_warnings = 0 so the member is
>immediately removed.
>
>What happens is we go through all the steps to remove the bouncing
>member including sending the admin and user notice and we do remove
>the member, but then we try to update the bounce info for the removed
>member and encounter the exception. As a result of the exception, the
>updated list is not saved so the member is still there.
>
>The attached patch should fix it.	

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

-------------- next part --------------
An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed...
Name: Bouncer.patch.txt
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/attachments/20090215/255d42bd/attachment-0001.txt>

From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb 16 00:38:05 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 15:38:05 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <499898D7.6040303@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <PC187020090215153805014092294391@msapiro>

Brad Knowles wrote:

>on 2/15/09 7:00 AM, Daniel.Li said:
>
>> I have read the install guide. But it's really hard for me to understand
>> how to config sendmail, as it's really a short paragraph.
>> 
>> Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.
>
>Unfortunately, sendmail is not a part of Mailman.  We can't really
>provide a whole lot of help with it.


That said, configuring sendmail to work with Mailman consists of only
one or two steps.

1) Add the 10 aliases per Mailman list that are reported to you when
you create the list to /etc/aliases

2) If your sendmail uses smrsh, add the appropriate symlink to the
smrsh directory as discussed at
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node32.html>.

Also see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/B4Au>.

Beyond that, there are ways to automate alias generation for sendmail
if you want. See the above FAQ and the one at
<http://wiki.list.org/x/joA9>.


-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From anroberts2000 at gmail.com  Mon Feb 16 03:37:24 2009
From: anroberts2000 at gmail.com (Adam Roberts)
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:37:24 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pesky, Persistent error messages
Message-ID: <a8ea18930902151837y7b0f8ea1g152b7ab7028030a9@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings all in Mailman-Users world,

I have recently installed and configured (or so it would appear) Mailman
2.1.9 on top of Postfix 2.5 and Ubuntu 8.04.  I am up and running with my
first mailing list but I'm getting an error in my log file that continues to
baffle me.  Granted, it may be something simple, but I'm rather confused and
am turning to the collective wisdom of the Interwebs for answers.

A `tail` from my log file (/var/log/mail.log):

Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 7C4586E0B8: from=<
mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/local[27805]: 7EC056DF47: to=<
mailman at mydomain.com>, orig_to=<mailman>, relay=local, delay=1130,
delays=1130/0.01/0/0.04, dsn=4.3.0, status=deferred (temporary failure.
Command output: local: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail: Permission
denied )
 Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27831]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
Permission denied
Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 756866E0E2: from=<
mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27832]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
Permission denied
Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/local[27812]: 7C4586E0B8: to=<
mailman at mydomain.com>, orig_to=<mailman>, relay=local, delay=10131,
delays=10131/0.02/0/0.04, dsn=4.3.0, status=deferred
(temporary failure. Command output: local: fatal: execvp
/var/lib/mailman/mail: Permission denied )
Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/pickup[24405]: 58EE46E0E9: uid=1002
from=<mailman> Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/cleanup[27841]: 58EE46E0E9:
message-id=<20090216022001.58EE46E0E9 at mydomain.com>
Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 58EE46E0E9: from=<
mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 local[27844]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
Permission denied


and from my error log (/var/log/mail.err):

Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27831]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
Permission denied
Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27832]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
Permission denied
Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27833]: fatal: execvp/var/lib/mailman/mail:
Permission denied
Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 local[27844]: fatal: execvp/var/lib/mailman/mail:
Permission denied


The above error messages repeat themselves with great frequency.  They don't
appear to be having an affect on operations as I can send and receive mail
and my mailing lists are working.

Any help or suggestions are welcomed and most appreciated.


Thanks!
Adam Roberts



-- 
Shameless Self Promotion: http://www.adamnroberts.org

"I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am
saying." -- Oscar Wilde
You can't argue with stupid people.  They just drag you down to their level
and beat you with experience.

From lida_mail at 163.com  Mon Feb 16 00:32:49 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 07:32:49 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <499898D7.6040303@shub-internet.org>
References: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
	<1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>
	<499898D7.6040303@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <1234740769.31388.2.camel@daniel-laptop>

Well, actually, I mean how to configure mailman to send mails by
sendmail.
And my sendmail works find.

On Sun, 2009-02-15 at 16:36 -0600, Brad Knowles wrote:
> on 2/15/09 7:00 AM, Daniel.Li said:
> 
> > I have read the install guide. But it's really hard for me to understand
> > how to config sendmail, as it's really a short paragraph.
> > 
> > Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.
> 
> Unfortunately, sendmail is not a part of Mailman.  We can't really
> provide a whole lot of help with it.
> 
> I would suggest first using the resources provided by the people who
> develop your distribution, because they'll be able to give you specific
> instructions that may be unique to the configuration they provide.
> 
> After that, try the website at www.sendmail.org.  They have a lot of
> documentation and other resources that may be helpful to you.
> 
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From lida_mail at 163.com  Mon Feb 16 00:49:25 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 07:49:25 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090215153805014092294391@msapiro>
References: <PC187020090215153805014092294391@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1234741765.31388.11.camel@daniel-laptop>

On Sun, 2009-02-15 at 15:38 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Brad Knowles wrote:
> 
> >on 2/15/09 7:00 AM, Daniel.Li said:
> >
> >> I have read the install guide. But it's really hard for me to understand
> >> how to config sendmail, as it's really a short paragraph.
> >> 
> >> Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.
> >
> >Unfortunately, sendmail is not a part of Mailman.  We can't really
> >provide a whole lot of help with it.
> 
> 
> That said, configuring sendmail to work with Mailman consists of only
> one or two steps.
> 
> 1) Add the 10 aliases per Mailman list that are reported to you when
> you create the list to /etc/aliases
> 
> 2) If your sendmail uses smrsh, add the appropriate symlink to the
> smrsh directory as discussed at
> <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node32.html>.
> 
> Also see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/B4Au>.
> 
> Beyond that, there are ways to automate alias generation for sendmail
> if you want. See the above FAQ and the one at
> <http://wiki.list.org/x/joA9>.
> 
> 

Thanks, I will try it today and feed back when I have any result. Thanks
again.
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From vancleef at lostwells.net  Mon Feb 16 16:28:21 2009
From: vancleef at lostwells.net (Hank van Cleef)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 08:28:21 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <1234740769.31388.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <200902161528.n1GFSLZe022077@julie.lostwells.net>

The esteemed Daniel.Li has said:
> 
> Well, actually, I mean how to configure mailman to send mails by
> sendmail.
> And my sendmail works find.
> 
I run Mailman on Solaris 10 with sendmail 8.13.4, so will comment as a
Mailman-sendmail admin.

The setup is quite simple.  Make sure that your sendmail will work
properly with a simple MUA (such as elm or mutt) installed on the same
box as Mailman.  

The one major difference between a simple MUA and Mailman is the need
to set up the aliases to pipe incoming mail to Mailman.  These look
like:

mailman:              "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
mailman-admin:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
mailman-bounces:      "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
mailman-confirm:      "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
mailman-join:         "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
mailman-leave:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
mailman-owner:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
mailman-request:      "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
mailman-subscribe:    "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"
mailman-unsubscribe:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mailman"

I believe Mark has already covered this.  You'll need a set of these
for each list you create.  

If you running your Mailman as a virtual host for another domain,
you'll need to add that domain name into local-host-names.

Also set up sendmail to masquerade sender headers properly.  The only
lines in my sendmail .mc files to handle Mailman for a virtual host
are:

MASQUERADE_AS(`mainname.net')dnl
FEATURE(`masquerade_entire_domain')dnl
FEATURE(`limited_masquerade')dnl
LOCAL_DOMAIN(`mainname.net virtualname.com')dnl
MASQUERADE_DOMAIN(`mainname.net')dnl

If you want to use smrsh (recommended), follow the instructions in the
Mailman installation guide.  You'll have to enable smrsh in sendmail
with a line in main.mc.

FEATURE(smrsh, /usr/lib/smrsh)dnl

Except for the need for the alias pipes, Mailman looks like "just
another MUA" to sendmail.  I've included the above sendmail items for
your convenience, but all of them are covered in the sendmail
documentation and/or the O'Reilly "Sendmail" book, often called the
"Bat Book."  

I'll reiterate that, for the most part, if your sendmail installation
works properly with a simple user MUA installed on the same machine,
Mailman should work properly.  Use the simple MUA to debug any
sendmail problems.  

Hank

From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Mon Feb 16 16:52:36 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 09:52:36 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <499898D7.6040303@shub-internet.org>
References: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>	<1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>
	<499898D7.6040303@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <49998BC4.6080603@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/15/09 16:36, Brad Knowles wrote:
> I would suggest first using the resources provided by the people who 
> develop your distribution, because they'll be able to give you 
> specific instructions that may be unique to the configuration they 
> provide.
> 
> After that, try the website at www.sendmail.org.  They have a lot of 
> documentation and other resources that may be helpful to you.

I'll also add that the comp.mail.sendmail news group is a wonderful 
place to ask Sendmail specific (and sometimes related) questions.  Pick 
your preferred Usenet server and connect your preferred NNTP client.  Or 
if need be, drop me a line and I'll add you to my personal 
comp.mail.sendmail NNTP <-> SMTP gateway.



Grant. . . .

From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Mon Feb 16 16:57:00 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 09:57:00 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>
References: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
	<1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <49998CCC.4050204@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/15/09 07:00, Daniel.Li wrote:
> Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.

Both Mark and Hank are correct in what is probably the most common 
method of hooking Mailman to Sendmail.  However there is another option.

I have created a new sub-domain for my mailing lists and have Sendmail 
passing all messages for it off to Mailman via a "mailer" which calls 
the mm-handler script.

Using the mailer method is (in my opinion) quite a bit easier (if you 
can dedicate a (sub)domain to Mailman) in such as you don't have to 
rebuild your aliases when you add / remove mailing lists.



Grant. . . .

From gtaylor at riverviewtech.net  Mon Feb 16 17:02:33 2009
From: gtaylor at riverviewtech.net (Grant Taylor)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 10:02:33 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pesky, Persistent error messages
In-Reply-To: <a8ea18930902151837y7b0f8ea1g152b7ab7028030a9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a8ea18930902151837y7b0f8ea1g152b7ab7028030a9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49998E19.3040304@riverviewtech.net>

On 02/15/09 20:37, Adam Roberts wrote:
> The above error messages repeat themselves with great frequency. 
>  They don't appear to be having an affect on operations as I can send 
> and receive mail and my mailing lists are working.
> 
> Any help or suggestions are welcomed and most appreciated.

I can't say for sure (as I'm a Sendmail user) but I think that the user 
that Postfix is running as (if that is proper Postfix terminology) does 
not have access to or permission to execute your "/var/lib/mailman/mail" 
file.



Grant. . . .

From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb 16 17:34:09 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 08:34:09 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pesky, Persistent error messages
In-Reply-To: <a8ea18930902151837y7b0f8ea1g152b7ab7028030a9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090216083409051500c75dcc@msapiro>

Adam Roberts wrote:
>
>I have recently installed and configured (or so it would appear) Mailman
>2.1.9 on top of Postfix 2.5 and Ubuntu 8.04.  I am up and running with my
>first mailing list but I'm getting an error in my log file that continues to
>baffle me.  Granted, it may be something simple, but I'm rather confused and
>am turning to the collective wisdom of the Interwebs for answers.
>
>A `tail` from my log file (/var/log/mail.log):
>
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 7C4586E0B8: from=<
>mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/local[27805]: 7EC056DF47: to=<
>mailman at mydomain.com>, orig_to=<mailman>, relay=local, delay=1130,
>delays=1130/0.01/0/0.04, dsn=4.3.0, status=deferred (temporary failure.
>Command output: local: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail: Permission
>denied )
> Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27831]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>Permission denied
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 756866E0E2: from=<
>mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27832]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>Permission denied
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/local[27812]: 7C4586E0B8: to=<
>mailman at mydomain.com>, orig_to=<mailman>, relay=local, delay=10131,
>delays=10131/0.02/0/0.04, dsn=4.3.0, status=deferred
>(temporary failure. Command output: local: fatal: execvp
>/var/lib/mailman/mail: Permission denied )
>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/pickup[24405]: 58EE46E0E9: uid=1002
>from=<mailman> Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/cleanup[27841]: 58EE46E0E9:
>message-id=<20090216022001.58EE46E0E9 at mydomain.com>
>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 58EE46E0E9: from=<
>mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 local[27844]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>Permission denied
>
>
>and from my error log (/var/log/mail.err):
>
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27831]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>Permission denied
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27832]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>Permission denied
>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27833]: fatal: execvp/var/lib/mailman/mail:
>Permission denied
>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 local[27844]: fatal: execvp/var/lib/mailman/mail:
>Permission denied
>
>
>The above error messages repeat themselves with great frequency.  They don't
>appear to be having an affect on operations as I can send and receive mail
>and my mailing lists are working.


Where are your Mailman aliases? They may be in Mailman's data/
directory if you have Mailman-Postfix integration or they may have
been manually added in /etc/aliases.

Either way, what is the ownership of the corresponding aliases.db file,
and what is the ownership and permissions on /var/lib/mailman/,
/var/lib/mailman/mail and /var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman (they should
all be group mailman, SETGID and owner, group and world readable and
executable/searchable).

Also note that if you have Mailman aliases in both places (data/aliases
and /etc/aliases), this is wrong. If Mailman-Postfix integration is
putting aliases in data/aliases, there should be no Mailman aliases in
/etc/aliases.

Also, do these errors affect only mail to mailman at mydomain.com, or are
other lists affected too? If it's only mailman at mydomain.com, perhaps
you have aliases for the mailman list only in /etc/aliases and/or they
are wrong. E.g.

mailman:  "|/var/lib/mailman/mail post mailman"

etc. instead of

mailman:  "|/var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb 16 17:43:39 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 08:43:39 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <1234797543.6488.4.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021608433905002cc4381b@msapiro>

Daniel.Li wrote:

>I have tried method below, still can't solve the issue.My steps, see
>below, on FC5.
>

<snip>
All your steps seem correct.


>Is there anything that I lost? I'm confused.


It would help if you told us in detail exactly what the issue is.

Also see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/A4E9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From Alan.Rubin at nt.gov.au  Tue Feb 17 05:24:46 2009
From: Alan.Rubin at nt.gov.au (Alan Rubin)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:54:46 +0930
Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email
Message-ID: <C3732E0A9E242D46A2B2C0CDC1F7134C490A7B@emdpb-e1.prod.main.ntgov>

Hello,


We are running mailman 2.1.10 on Solaris 9 with postfix.  

We have a customer who would like to use a form on a website to
subscribe people to a mailing list.  In theory, the form would email the
details the list-join address of the list.  I have tried following the
instructions from the members' manual:

subscribe [<PASSWORD>] [digest-nodigest] [address=<ADDRESS>]
Subscribe to this mailing list. Your password must be given to
unsubscribe or change your options, but
if you omit the password, one will be generated for you. You may be
periodically reminded of your
password.
The next argument may be either: 'nodigest' or 'digest' (no quotes!). If
you wish to subscribe an address
other than the address you sent this request from, you may specify
'address=<ADDRESS>' (no brackets
around the email address, and no quotes!)

I am testing this process with a test list using the following email:

-----Original Message-----
From: Alan Rubin 
Sent: Tuesday, 17 February 2009 1:46 PM
To: 'test-join at lists.nt.gov.au'
Subject: 

subscribe nodigest address=adam.smith at nt.gov.au


but my attempts keep getting shunted (tried twice, first without a
digest option):


Feb 17 13:46:20 2009 (1046) Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 114, in
_oneloop
    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 185, in
_onefile
    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 241,
in _dispose
    res.do_command('join')
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139,
in do_command
    return handler.process(self, args)
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py", line
74, in process
    if digest is None and password.lower() in ('digest', 'nodigest'):
AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'lower'

Feb 17 13:46:20 2009 (1046) SHUNTING:
1234844179.158844+4d54d8a83f98a957ccff205953e10afbc0a9eecd


Any help?  Am I missing a step?  This is somewhat urgent, if anyone is
still awake in the West.


Regards,

Alan Rubin   
Technician Unix
DCS Midrange Services
Phone: +61 (08) 8999 5111
Fax:      +61 (08) 8999 7493
e-Mail: alan.rubin at nt.gov.au

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 17 05:52:01 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 20:52:01 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email
In-Reply-To: <C3732E0A9E242D46A2B2C0CDC1F7134C490A7B@emdpb-e1.prod.main.ntgov>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902162052010437117ca8f6@msapiro>

Alan Rubin wrote:
>
>We have a customer who would like to use a form on a website to
>subscribe people to a mailing list.  In theory, the form would email the
>details the list-join address of the list.


Unduly complicated. See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/hIA9>.

But, since you ask, read on...


>I have tried following the
>instructions from the members' manual:
>
>subscribe [<PASSWORD>] [digest-nodigest] [address=<ADDRESS>]
>Subscribe to this mailing list. Your password must be given to
>unsubscribe or change your options, but
>if you omit the password, one will be generated for you. You may be
>periodically reminded of your
>password.
>The next argument may be either: 'nodigest' or 'digest' (no quotes!). If
>you wish to subscribe an address
>other than the address you sent this request from, you may specify
>'address=<ADDRESS>' (no brackets
>around the email address, and no quotes!)
>
>I am testing this process with a test list using the following email:
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Alan Rubin 
>Sent: Tuesday, 17 February 2009 1:46 PM
>To: 'test-join at lists.nt.gov.au'
>Subject: 
>
>subscribe nodigest address=adam.smith at nt.gov.au


You can't send a generic subscribe command to to the -join or
-subscribe address. The subject/body of mail to those addresses are
ignored and they just request subscription of the From: address with
generated password and default digest/nodigest.

If you want to send a subscribe command as above in the subject or body
of the mail, you have to send it to the -request address.

But that isn't the reason for the following.


>but my attempts keep getting shunted (tried twice, first without a
>digest option):
>
>
>Feb 17 13:46:20 2009 (1046) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 114, in
>_oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 185, in
>_onefile
>    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 241,
>in _dispose
>    res.do_command('join')
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139,
>in do_command
>    return handler.process(self, args)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py", line
>74, in process
>    if digest is None and password.lower() in ('digest', 'nodigest'):
>AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'lower'
>
>Feb 17 13:46:20 2009 (1046) SHUNTING:
>1234844179.158844+4d54d8a83f98a957ccff205953e10afbc0a9eecd
>
>
>Any help?  Am I missing a step?  This is somewhat urgent, if anyone is
>still awake in the West.


This was a bug in the 2.1.10 release. See
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2008-April/000111.html>
for a patch, but the irony here is if you had sent the mail to
test-request at lists.nt.gov.au, it would have worked and not triggered
the bug.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mihamina at lab.vectoris.fr  Tue Feb 17 06:00:38 2009
From: mihamina at lab.vectoris.fr (Mihamina Rakotomandimby)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 08:00:38 +0300
Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email
In-Reply-To: <C3732E0A9E242D46A2B2C0CDC1F7134C490A7B@emdpb-e1.prod.main.ntgov>
References: <C3732E0A9E242D46A2B2C0CDC1F7134C490A7B@emdpb-e1.prod.main.ntgov>
Message-ID: <499A4476.1090206@lab.vectoris.fr>

Alan Rubin wrote:

>     if digest is None and password.lower() in ('digest', 'nodigest'):
> AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'lower'

In Python, this means mailman is trying to lowercase the password but 
there is nothing to lowercase.


From Alan.Rubin at nt.gov.au  Tue Feb 17 06:33:20 2009
From: Alan.Rubin at nt.gov.au (Alan Rubin)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 15:03:20 +0930
Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email
Message-ID: <C3732E0A9E242D46A2B2C0CDC1F7134C490A80@emdpb-e1.prod.main.ntgov>

Mark,

I applied the patch, used the request address, and my message still gets
shunted.

Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) Uncaught runner exception: 'NoneType' object
has no attribute 'lower'
Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 114, in
_oneloop
    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 185, in
_onefile
    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 239,
in _dispose
    res.process()
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 112,
in process
    stop = self.do_command(cmd, args)
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139,
in do_command
    return handler.process(self, args)
  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py", line
74, in process
    if (digest is None
AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'lower'

Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) SHUNTING:
1234848571.543715+462ea839ccdd63f659aab843129562980c886d3c


Diff on the cmd_subscribe.py new and old:

# diff Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py Mailman/Commands/cmd_sub>
74,75c74
<     if (digest is None
<             and password and password.lower() in ('digest',
'nodigest')):
---
>     if digest is None and password.lower() in ('digest', 'nodigest'):


The web form that you pointed me at should work regardless of this error
with the cmd_subscribe.py utility?

Regards,

Alan Rubin   
Technician Unix
DCS Midrange Services
Phone: +61 (08) 8999 5111
Fax:      +61 (08) 8999 7493
e-Mail: alan.rubin at nt.gov.au

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Tuesday, 17 February 2009 2:22 PM
To: Alan Rubin; Mailman User List
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email

Alan Rubin wrote:
>
>We have a customer who would like to use a form on a website to
>subscribe people to a mailing list.  In theory, the form would email
the
>details the list-join address of the list.


Unduly complicated. See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/hIA9>.

But, since you ask, read on...


>I have tried following the
>instructions from the members' manual:
>
>subscribe [<PASSWORD>] [digest-nodigest] [address=<ADDRESS>]
>Subscribe to this mailing list. Your password must be given to
>unsubscribe or change your options, but
>if you omit the password, one will be generated for you. You may be
>periodically reminded of your
>password.
>The next argument may be either: 'nodigest' or 'digest' (no quotes!).
If
>you wish to subscribe an address
>other than the address you sent this request from, you may specify
>'address=<ADDRESS>' (no brackets
>around the email address, and no quotes!)
>
>I am testing this process with a test list using the following email:
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Alan Rubin 
>Sent: Tuesday, 17 February 2009 1:46 PM
>To: 'test-join at lists.nt.gov.au'
>Subject: 
>
>subscribe nodigest address=adam.smith at nt.gov.au


You can't send a generic subscribe command to to the -join or
-subscribe address. The subject/body of mail to those addresses are
ignored and they just request subscription of the From: address with
generated password and default digest/nodigest.

If you want to send a subscribe command as above in the subject or body
of the mail, you have to send it to the -request address.

But that isn't the reason for the following.


>but my attempts keep getting shunted (tried twice, first without a
>digest option):
>
>
>Feb 17 13:46:20 2009 (1046) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 114, in
>_oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 185, in
>_onefile
>    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 241,
>in _dispose
>    res.do_command('join')
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139,
>in do_command
>    return handler.process(self, args)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py", line
>74, in process
>    if digest is None and password.lower() in ('digest', 'nodigest'):
>AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'lower'
>
>Feb 17 13:46:20 2009 (1046) SHUNTING:
>1234844179.158844+4d54d8a83f98a957ccff205953e10afbc0a9eecd
>
>
>Any help?  Am I missing a step?  This is somewhat urgent, if anyone is
>still awake in the West.


This was a bug in the 2.1.10 release. See
<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-announce/2008-April/000111.htm
l>
for a patch, but the irony here is if you had sent the mail to
test-request at lists.nt.gov.au, it would have worked and not triggered
the bug.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 17 16:58:14 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 07:58:14 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email
In-Reply-To: <C3732E0A9E242D46A2B2C0CDC1F7134C490A80@emdpb-e1.prod.main.ntgov>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021707581407344ca799ec@msapiro>

Alan Rubin wrote:
>
>I applied the patch, used the request address, and my message still gets
>shunted.


Did you restart Mailman after applying the patch?


>
>Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) Uncaught runner exception: 'NoneType' object
>has no attribute 'lower'
>Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 114, in
>_oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 185, in
>_onefile
>    keepqueued =3D self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 239,
>in _dispose
>    res.process()
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 112,
>in process
>    stop =3D self.do_command(cmd, args)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139,
>in do_command
>    return handler.process(self, args)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py", line
>74, in process
>    if (digest is None
>AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'lower'
>
>Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) SHUNTING:
>1234848571.543715+462ea839ccdd63f659aab843129562980c886d3c
>
>
>Diff on the cmd_subscribe.py new and old:
>
># diff Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py Mailman/Commands/cmd_sub>
>74,75c74
><     if (digest is None
><             and password and password.lower() in ('digest',
>'nodigest')):
>---
>>     if digest is None and password.lower() in ('digest', 'nodigest'):


I think the only possible explanation for the above is you didn't
restart Mailman.

Also, even without the patch, if you sent a

  subscribe nodigest address=xxx at example.com

command to the list-request address, it shouldn't trigger that error
unless you also had, e.g., a bare 'subscribe' in the subject. In mails
to -request, both Subject: and body are scanned for commands so if you
mail to -request with "Subject: subscribe" and body

subscribe nodigest address=xxx at example.com

that's two subscribe commands and the plain "subscribe" will trigger
the bug.


>The web form that you pointed me at should work regardless of this error
>with the cmd_subscribe.py utility?


That's correct.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From anroberts2000 at gmail.com  Mon Feb 16 18:33:59 2009
From: anroberts2000 at gmail.com (Adam Roberts)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:33:59 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pesky, Persistent error messages
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090216083409051500c75dcc@msapiro>
References: <a8ea18930902151837y7b0f8ea1g152b7ab7028030a9@mail.gmail.com>
	<PC187020090216083409051500c75dcc@msapiro>
Message-ID: <a8ea18930902160933t25044546m7065de96c4209d56@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks to everyone for the follow-ups.

Mark:

I looked at my aliases file (/etc/aliases) and you're correct.  My
'mailman' aliases were listed as :

> mailman:  "|/var/lib/mailman/mail post mailman"
>
> etc. instead of
>
> mailman:  "|/var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"

Those were the defaults that the installation indicated I should add
for the mailman list.  I didn't think to much of it at the time, but I
installed from the Ubuntu package using apt-get after a failed attempt
from source (really not sure what I was doing wrong, but oh well).  I
guess the Ubuntu package (as usual) follows a different directory
convention that what's expected.

I changed the aliases file, did a `newaliases`, and reloaded Postfix.
Within a few seconds the backed-up messages poured into my inbox and
the error is no long showing in the log file.


Also, Grant, thanks for your suggestion.  I made sure the proper user
had permission on /var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman.  It wasn't until
Mark's email that I put 2 and 2 together.

Thanks everyone!!

Adam Roberts






On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> Adam Roberts wrote:
>>
>>I have recently installed and configured (or so it would appear) Mailman
>>2.1.9 on top of Postfix 2.5 and Ubuntu 8.04.  I am up and running with my
>>first mailing list but I'm getting an error in my log file that continues to
>>baffle me.  Granted, it may be something simple, but I'm rather confused and
>>am turning to the collective wisdom of the Interwebs for answers.
>>
>>A `tail` from my log file (/var/log/mail.log):
>>
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 7C4586E0B8: from=<
>>mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/local[27805]: 7EC056DF47: to=<
>>mailman at mydomain.com>, orig_to=<mailman>, relay=local, delay=1130,
>>delays=1130/0.01/0/0.04, dsn=4.3.0, status=deferred (temporary failure.
>>Command output: local: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail: Permission
>>denied )
>> Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27831]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>>Permission denied
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 756866E0E2: from=<
>>mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27832]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>>Permission denied
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 postfix/local[27812]: 7C4586E0B8: to=<
>>mailman at mydomain.com>, orig_to=<mailman>, relay=local, delay=10131,
>>delays=10131/0.02/0/0.04, dsn=4.3.0, status=deferred
>>(temporary failure. Command output: local: fatal: execvp
>>/var/lib/mailman/mail: Permission denied )
>>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/pickup[24405]: 58EE46E0E9: uid=1002
>>from=<mailman> Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/cleanup[27841]: 58EE46E0E9:
>>message-id=<20090216022001.58EE46E0E9 at mydomain.com>
>>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 postfix/qmgr[15994]: 58EE46E0E9: from=<
>>mailman at mydomain.com>, size=628, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
>>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 local[27844]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>>Permission denied
>>
>>
>>and from my error log (/var/log/mail.err):
>>
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27831]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>>Permission denied
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27832]: fatal: execvp /var/lib/mailman/mail:
>>Permission denied
>>Feb 15 21:18:52 PyHost01 local[27833]: fatal: execvp/var/lib/mailman/mail:
>>Permission denied
>>Feb 15 21:20:01 PyHost01 local[27844]: fatal: execvp/var/lib/mailman/mail:
>>Permission denied
>>
>>
>>The above error messages repeat themselves with great frequency.  They don't
>>appear to be having an affect on operations as I can send and receive mail
>>and my mailing lists are working.
>
>
> Where are your Mailman aliases? They may be in Mailman's data/
> directory if you have Mailman-Postfix integration or they may have
> been manually added in /etc/aliases.
>
> Either way, what is the ownership of the corresponding aliases.db file,
> and what is the ownership and permissions on /var/lib/mailman/,
> /var/lib/mailman/mail and /var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman (they should
> all be group mailman, SETGID and owner, group and world readable and
> executable/searchable).
>
> Also note that if you have Mailman aliases in both places (data/aliases
> and /etc/aliases), this is wrong. If Mailman-Postfix integration is
> putting aliases in data/aliases, there should be no Mailman aliases in
> /etc/aliases.
>
> Also, do these errors affect only mail to mailman at mydomain.com, or are
> other lists affected too? If it's only mailman at mydomain.com, perhaps
> you have aliases for the mailman list only in /etc/aliases and/or they
> are wrong. E.g.
>
> mailman:  "|/var/lib/mailman/mail post mailman"
>
> etc. instead of
>
> mailman:  "|/var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
>
> --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>
>



-- 
Shameless Self Promotion: http://www.adamnroberts.org

"I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of
what I am saying." -- Oscar Wilde
You can't argue with stupid people.  They just drag you down to their
level and beat you with experience.

From frank.elsner at tu-berlin.de  Tue Feb 17 09:06:19 2009
From: frank.elsner at tu-berlin.de (Frank Elsner)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 09:06:19 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Site specific defaults
Message-ID: <E1LZKyB-0005XK-Dy@bronto.tubit.TU-Berlin.DE>


Hi*,

I'm new to mailman, which is in general running at my site.

My question is:

Where to define site scpecific defaults? 
Which file of Defaults.py. MailList.py and mm_cfg.py is best?



Regards, Frank Elsner

From kaerast at qvox.org  Mon Feb 16 17:16:48 2009
From: kaerast at qvox.org (=?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=A6rast?=)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 16:16:48 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error generated by unsubscribe requests
Message-ID: <20090216161648.7681f567@bennet>

Hi,

I've started getting an error message when people try unubscribing from
my lists by emailing the -unsubscribe addresses.  I'm running a
slightly modified version of 2.1.9 (based on the Debian version with
a few modifications of my own)  The following error appears in the error
logs

Feb 16 16:09:48 2009 (22125) Uncaught runner exception: 'str' object
has no attribute 'address' Feb 16 16:09:48 2009 (22125) Traceback (most
recent call last): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py",
line 112, in _oneloop self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 170, in _onefile
    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 243, in
_dispose res.do_command('leave')
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139, in
do_command return handler.process(self, args)
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_unsubscribe.py", line 76,
in process mlist.ConfirmUnsubscription(cpaddr)
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1370, in
ConfirmUnsubscription cookie = self.pend_new(Pending.UNSUBSCRIPTION,
addr) File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py", line 76, in pend_new
    if data[0] == UNSUBSCRIPTION and data[1] == content[0].address:
AttributeError: 'str' object has no attribute 'address'

Feb 16 16:09:48 2009 (22125) SHUNTING:
1234800587.1249299+27b118ff3b62b500de00fd03a570aefcdf1a1ef2


Any ideas how I fix this and let people unsubscribe?

-- 
Alice

From lida_mail at 163.com  Mon Feb 16 16:19:03 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 23:19:03 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <1234741765.31388.11.camel@daniel-laptop>
References: <PC187020090215153805014092294391@msapiro>
	<1234741765.31388.11.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <1234797543.6488.4.camel@daniel-laptop>

Dear Mark,
I have tried method below, still can't solve the issue.My steps, see
below, on FC5.

Step 1:
$ grep smrsh /etc/mail/sendmail.cf
#####  $Id: smrsh.m4,v 8.14 1999/11/18 05:06:23 ca Exp $  #####
Mprog,		P=/usr/sbin/smrsh, F=lsDFMoqeu9, S=EnvFromL/HdrFromL,
R=EnvToL/HdrToL, D=$z:/,
		A=smrsh -c $u

Step 2: NOT found this at the very begining of output.
$ strings /usr/sbin/smrsh | less
/lib/ld-linux.so.2
libdb-4.3.so
_init
_fini
_Jv_RegisterClasses
__gmon_start__
libresolv.so.2
libnsl.so.1
...blablabla......
...................
%s: command too long: %s
command too long: %.40s
/etc/smrsh
/bin:/usr/bin
PATH=
............

Step 3:
$ cd /etc/smrsh
$ ln -s /usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman mailman

Step 4: create a new maillist
$ cd /usr/lib/mailman/
$ bin/newlist mailman

Step 5: add output from step4 to the end of aliases file.
$ subo vi /etc/aliases 
# Daniel added for mailman 2009.02.15
mailman:              "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
mailman-admin:        "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
mailman-bounces:      "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
mailman-confirm:      "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
mailman-join:         "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
mailman-leave:        "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
mailman-owner:        "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
mailman-request:      "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
mailman-subscribe:    "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"
mailman-unsubscribe:  "|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe
mailman"

Is there anything that I lost? I'm confused.


On Mon, 2009-02-16 at 07:49 +0800, Daniel.Li wrote:
> On Sun, 2009-02-15 at 15:38 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> > Brad Knowles wrote:
> > 
> > >on 2/15/09 7:00 AM, Daniel.Li said:
> > >
> > >> I have read the install guide. But it's really hard for me to understand
> > >> how to config sendmail, as it's really a short paragraph.
> > >> 
> > >> Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.
> > >
> > >Unfortunately, sendmail is not a part of Mailman.  We can't really
> > >provide a whole lot of help with it.
> > 
> > 
> > That said, configuring sendmail to work with Mailman consists of only
> > one or two steps.
> > 
> > 1) Add the 10 aliases per Mailman list that are reported to you when
> > you create the list to /etc/aliases
> > 
> > 2) If your sendmail uses smrsh, add the appropriate symlink to the
> > smrsh directory as discussed at
> > <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node32.html>.
> > 
> > Also see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/B4Au>.
> > 
> > Beyond that, there are ways to automate alias generation for sendmail
> > if you want. See the above FAQ and the one at
> > <http://wiki.list.org/x/joA9>.
> > 
> > 
> 
> Thanks, I will try it today and feed back when I have any result. Thanks
> again.
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From lida_mail at 163.com  Mon Feb 16 17:02:00 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 00:02:00 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <200902161528.n1GFSLZe022077@julie.lostwells.net>
References: <200902161528.n1GFSLZe022077@julie.lostwells.net>
Message-ID: <1234800120.6488.17.camel@daniel-laptop>

Dear Hand,
Thanks in advance.
But i'm afraid that I still have some questions about this. Well, I
don't have much experience on this, any help on this is really
appreciated. :)

On Mon, 2009-02-16 at 08:28 -0700, Hank van Cleef wrote:
> I run Mailman on Solaris 10 with sendmail 8.13.4, so will comment as a
> Mailman-sendmail admin.
> 
> The setup is quite simple.  Make sure that your sendmail will work
> properly with a simple MUA (such as elm or mutt) installed on the same
> box as Mailman.  

Yes, It works with a simple MUA.

> 
> The one major difference between a simple MUA and Mailman is the need
> to set up the aliases to pipe incoming mail to Mailman.  These look
> like:
> 
> mailman:              "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
> mailman-admin:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
> mailman-bounces:      "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
> mailman-confirm:      "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
> mailman-join:         "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
> mailman-leave:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
> mailman-owner:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
> mailman-request:      "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
> mailman-subscribe:    "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"
> mailman-unsubscribe:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mailman"
> 
> I believe Mark has already covered this.  You'll need a set of these
> for each list you create.  

Yes. I understand this part. And I have added.
> 
> If you running your Mailman as a virtual host for another domain,
> you'll need to add that domain name into local-host-names.
> 
> Also set up sendmail to masquerade sender headers properly.  The only
> lines in my sendmail .mc files to handle Mailman for a virtual host
> are:
> 
> MASQUERADE_AS(`mainname.net')dnl
> FEATURE(`masquerade_entire_domain')dnl
> FEATURE(`limited_masquerade')dnl
> LOCAL_DOMAIN(`mainname.net virtualname.com')dnl
> MASQUERADE_DOMAIN(`mainname.net')dnl

Well, I didn't know much about this. Maybe it's difficult for me to
understand right away. But my case is as below:
a) I have set up server in local network (192.168.58.*). 
b) My router will dial (PPPoE) to the internet, and get a internet IP. 
c) All ports is pointed to my server on the router. 
d) So palfocus.oicp.net is diverted from Peanut server and jump to my
router's IP address, which is loging though DDNS method. 

> 
> If you want to use smrsh (recommended), follow the instructions in the
> Mailman installation guide.  You'll have to enable smrsh in sendmail
> with a line in main.mc.
> 
> FEATURE(smrsh, /usr/lib/smrsh)dnl
> 

I have found this line in configuration.
But it can't work, see bleow.
$ cat /etc/mail/sendmail.mc 
divert(-1)dnl
dnl #
dnl # This is the sendmail macro config file for m4. If you make changes
to
dnl # /etc/mail/sendmail.mc, you will need to regenerate the
dnl # /etc/mail/sendmail.cf file by confirming that the sendmail-cf
package is
dnl # installed and then performing a
dnl #
dnl #     make -C /etc/mail
dnl #
include(`/usr/share/sendmail-cf/m4/cf.m4')dnl
VERSIONID(`setup for Red Hat Linux')dnl
OSTYPE(`linux')dnl
dnl #
dnl # default logging level is 9, you might want to set it higher to
dnl # debug the configuration
dnl #
dnl define(`confLOG_LEVEL', `9')dnl
dnl #
dnl # Uncomment and edit the following line if your outgoing mail needs
to
dnl # be sent out through an external mail server:
dnl #
dnl define(`SMART_HOST',`smtp.your.provider')
dnl #
define(`confDEF_USER_ID',``8:12'')dnl
dnl define(`confAUTO_REBUILD')dnl
define(`confTO_CONNECT', `1m')dnl
define(`confTRY_NULL_MX_LIST',true)dnl
define(`confDONT_PROBE_INTERFACES',true)dnl
define(`PROCMAIL_MAILER_PATH',`/usr/bin/procmail')dnl
define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/aliases')dnl
define(`STATUS_FILE', `/var/log/mail/statistics')dnl
define(`UUCP_MAILER_MAX', `2000000')dnl
define(`confUSERDB_SPEC', `/etc/mail/userdb.db')dnl
define(`confPRIVACY_FLAGS',
`authwarnings,novrfy,noexpn,restrictqrun')dnl
define(`confAUTH_OPTIONS', `A')dnl
dnl #
dnl # The following allows relaying if the user authenticates, and
disallows
dnl # plaintext authentication (PLAIN/LOGIN) on non-TLS links
dnl #
dnl define(`confAUTH_OPTIONS', `A p')dnl
dnl # 
dnl # PLAIN is the preferred plaintext authentication method and used by
dnl # Mozilla Mail and Evolution, though Outlook Express and other MUAs
do
dnl # use LOGIN. Other mechanisms should be used if the connection is
not
dnl # guaranteed secure.
dnl # Please remember that saslauthd needs to be running for AUTH. 
dnl #
dnl TRUST_AUTH_MECH(`EXTERNAL DIGEST-MD5 CRAM-MD5 LOGIN PLAIN')dnl
dnl define(`confAUTH_MECHANISMS', `EXTERNAL GSSAPI DIGEST-MD5 CRAM-MD5
LOGIN PLAIN')dnl
dnl #
dnl # Rudimentary information on creating certificates for sendmail TLS:
dnl #     cd /usr/share/ssl/certs; make sendmail.pem
dnl # Complete usage:
dnl #     make -C /usr/share/ssl/certs usage
dnl #
dnl define(`confCACERT_PATH',`/etc/pki/tls/certs')dnl
dnl define(`confCACERT',`/etc/pki/tls/certs/ca-bundle.crt')dnl
dnl define(`confSERVER_CERT',`/etc/pki/tls/certs/sendmail.pem')dnl
dnl define(`confSERVER_KEY',`/etc/pki/tls/certs/sendmail.pem')dnl
dnl #
dnl # This allows sendmail to use a keyfile that is shared with
OpenLDAP's
dnl # slapd, which requires the file to be readble by group ldap
dnl #
dnl define(`confDONT_BLAME_SENDMAIL',`groupreadablekeyfile')dnl
dnl #
dnl define(`confTO_QUEUEWARN', `4h')dnl
dnl define(`confTO_QUEUERETURN', `5d')dnl
dnl define(`confQUEUE_LA', `12')dnl
dnl define(`confREFUSE_LA', `18')dnl
define(`confTO_IDENT', `0')dnl
dnl FEATURE(delay_checks)dnl
FEATURE(`no_default_msa',`dnl')dnl
FEATURE(`smrsh',`/usr/sbin/smrsh')dnl
FEATURE(`mailertable',`hash -o /etc/mail/mailertable.db')dnl
FEATURE(`virtusertable',`hash -o /etc/mail/virtusertable.db')dnl
FEATURE(redirect)dnl
FEATURE(always_add_domain)dnl
FEATURE(use_cw_file)dnl
FEATURE(use_ct_file)dnl
dnl #
dnl # The following limits the number of processes sendmail can fork to
accept 
dnl # incoming messages or process its message queues to 12.) sendmail
refuses 
dnl # to accept connections once it has reached its quota of child
processes.
dnl #
dnl define(`confMAX_DAEMON_CHILDREN', 12)dnl
dnl #
dnl # Limits the number of new connections per second. This caps the
overhead 
dnl # incurred due to forking new sendmail processes. May be useful
against 
dnl # DoS attacks or barrages of spam. (As mentioned below, a per-IP
address 
dnl # limit would be useful but is not available as an option at this
writing.)
dnl #
dnl define(`confCONNECTION_RATE_THROTTLE', 3)dnl
dnl #
dnl # The -t option will retry delivery if e.g. the user runs over his
quota.
dnl #
FEATURE(local_procmail,`',`procmail -t -Y -a $h -d $u')dnl
FEATURE(`access_db',`hash -T<TMPF> -o /etc/mail/access.db')dnl
FEATURE(`blacklist_recipients')dnl
EXPOSED_USER(`root')dnl
dnl #
dnl # For using Cyrus-IMAPd as POP3/IMAP server through LMTP delivery
uncomment
dnl # the following 2 definitions and activate below in the MAILER
section the
dnl # cyrusv2 mailer.
dnl #
dnl define(`confLOCAL_MAILER', `cyrusv2')dnl
dnl define(`CYRUSV2_MAILER_ARGS', `FILE /var/lib/imap/socket/lmtp')dnl
dnl #
dnl # The following causes sendmail to only listen on the IPv4 loopback
address
dnl # 127.0.0.1 and not on any other network devices. Remove the
loopback
dnl # address restriction to accept email from the internet or intranet.
dnl #
dnl #
dnl # The following causes sendmail to additionally listen to port 587
for
dnl # mail from MUAs that authenticate. Roaming users who can't reach
their
dnl # preferred sendmail daemon due to port 25 being blocked or
redirected find
dnl # this useful.
dnl #
dnl DAEMON_OPTIONS(`Port=submission, Name=MSA, M=Ea')dnl
dnl #
dnl # The following causes sendmail to additionally listen to port 465,
but
dnl # starting immediately in TLS mode upon connecting. Port 25 or 587
followed
dnl # by STARTTLS is preferred, but roaming clients using Outlook
Express can't
dnl # do STARTTLS on ports other than 25. Mozilla Mail can ONLY use
STARTTLS
dnl # and doesn't support the deprecated smtps; Evolution <1.1.1 uses
smtps
dnl # when SSL is enabled-- STARTTLS support is available in version
1.1.1.
dnl #
dnl # For this to work your OpenSSL certificates must be configured.
dnl #
dnl DAEMON_OPTIONS(`Port=smtps, Name=TLSMTA, M=s')dnl
dnl #
dnl # The following causes sendmail to additionally listen on the IPv6
loopback
dnl # device. Remove the loopback address restriction listen to the
network.
dnl #
dnl DAEMON_OPTIONS(`port=smtp,Addr=::1, Name=MTA-v6, Family=inet6')dnl
dnl #
dnl # enable both ipv6 and ipv4 in sendmail:
dnl #
dnl DAEMON_OPTIONS(`Name=MTA-v4, Family=inet, Name=MTA-v6,
Family=inet6')
dnl #
dnl # We strongly recommend not accepting unresolvable domains if you
want to
dnl # protect yourself from spam. However, the laptop and users on
computers
dnl # that do not have 24x7 DNS do need this.
dnl #
FEATURE(`accept_unresolvable_domains')dnl
dnl #
dnl FEATURE(`relay_based_on_MX')dnl
dnl # 
dnl # Also accept email sent to "localhost.localdomain" as local email.
dnl # 
LOCAL_DOMAIN(`localhost.localdomain')dnl
dnl #
dnl # The following example makes mail from this host and any additional
dnl # specified domains appear to be sent from mydomain.com
dnl #
dnl MASQUERADE_AS(`mydomain.com')dnl
dnl #
dnl # masquerade not just the headers, but the envelope as well
dnl #
dnl FEATURE(masquerade_envelope)dnl
dnl #
dnl # masquerade not just @mydomainalias.com, but @*.mydomainalias.com
as well
dnl #
dnl FEATURE(masquerade_entire_domain)dnl
dnl #
dnl MASQUERADE_DOMAIN(localhost)dnl
dnl MASQUERADE_DOMAIN(localhost.localdomain)dnl
dnl MASQUERADE_DOMAIN(mydomainalias.com)dnl
dnl MASQUERADE_DOMAIN(mydomain.lan)dnl
MAILER(smtp)dnl
MAILER(procmail)dnl
dnl MAILER(cyrusv2)dnl



> Except for the need for the alias pipes, Mailman looks like "just
> another MUA" to sendmail.  I've included the above sendmail items for
> your convenience, but all of them are covered in the sendmail
> documentation and/or the O'Reilly "Sendmail" book, often called the
> "Bat Book."  
> 
> I'll reiterate that, for the most part, if your sendmail installation
> works properly with a simple user MUA installed on the same machine,
> Mailman should work properly.  Use the simple MUA to debug any
> sendmail problems.  
> 
> Hank



Thanks for all your help in advance.
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From lida_mail at 163.com  Mon Feb 16 17:13:28 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 00:13:28 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <49998CCC.4050204@riverviewtech.net>
References: <1234619698.6818.2.camel@daniel-laptop>
	<1234702832.6593.9.camel@daniel-laptop>
	<49998CCC.4050204@riverviewtech.net>
Message-ID: <1234800808.6488.26.camel@daniel-laptop>

On Mon, 2009-02-16 at 09:57 -0600, Grant Taylor wrote:
> On 02/15/09 07:00, Daniel.Li wrote:
> > Can u please simply give me some steps or tips to config sendmail.
> 
> Both Mark and Hank are correct in what is probably the most common 
> method of hooking Mailman to Sendmail.  However there is another option.
> 
> I have created a new sub-domain for my mailing lists and have Sendmail 
> passing all messages for it off to Mailman via a "mailer" which calls 
> the mm-handler script.
> 
> Using the mailer method is (in my opinion) quite a bit easier (if you 
> can dedicate a (sub)domain to Mailman) in such as you don't have to 
> rebuild your aliases when you add / remove mailing lists.
> 

Yeah, I just wanna try simple method that can fixed problem. As I really
lack of experience on this. 

So I will try to write each step down, and hope that can find my
mistakes and probably wrong operations.

FC5 has mailman 2.1.7. Finally, I use rpm remove the 2.1.7, unzip tar
and install version 2.1.12rc2, which I can see on web UI.

and installation path is /usr/lib/mailman, which is originally used by
2.1.7.

I'm now confused on this. BTW, my bugzilla can send mail, and I can also
use this server to send and receive mails. So I do believe that the
sendmail is working correctly. The problem is that I can't find where I
missed when configure the mailman with sendmail support.

Any idea? Appreciated! Thanks.
> 
> 
> Grant. . . .
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list
> Mailman-Users at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/lida_mail%40163.com
> 
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From lida_mail at 163.com  Tue Feb 17 17:33:31 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 00:33:31 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009021608433905002cc4381b@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009021608433905002cc4381b@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1234888411.6406.50.camel@daniel-laptop>

On Mon, 2009-02-16 at 08:43 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> It would help if you told us in detail exactly what the issue is.
> 
> Also see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/A4E9>.
> 

Thanks, I have got this error, see below. Should I re-compile the
mailman. Is there any simple way can fix the problem. Thanks. 

The original message was received at Tue, 17 Feb 2009 23:49:32 +0800
from palfocus.oicp.net [192.168.58.208]
with id n1HFnWTd005618

   ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
"|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
    (reason: 2)
    (expanded from: <mailman-owner at palfocus.oicp.net>)

   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
Group mismatch error.  Mailman expected the mail
wrapper script to be executed as group "mailman", but
the system's mail server executed the mail script as
group "mail".  Try tweaking the mail server to run the
script as group "mailman", or re-run configure, 
providing the command line option `--with-mail-gid=mail'.
554 5.3.0 unknown mailer error 2
550 5.1.1 <maillist_palfocus-bounces at palfocus.oicp.net>... User unknown


-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From manuel.vacelet at gmail.com  Tue Feb 17 12:40:35 2009
From: manuel.vacelet at gmail.com (Manuel Vacelet)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 12:40:35 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mass change user's email address
Message-ID: <cde570730902170340k8625900x6b903f00d8767853@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

I've googled a bit and browsed the FAQ but I didn't find the answer to
my question:
I there a way to mass change emails in all the mailing lists on a given server ?

I'm a mailman site admin and I have a lot of users that had their
email changed following a re-branding of their company
(john.doe at test.com -> john.doe at example.com). I have the map "old email
-> new email" and I'm looking for a way to update the membership of
the lists.

Is there a well known way to do it or do I have to script something
around "add_members / remove_members" ?

Best regards,
Manuel

From brad at shub-internet.org  Tue Feb 17 17:59:29 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:59:29 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Site specific defaults
In-Reply-To: <E1LZKyB-0005XK-Dy@bronto.tubit.TU-Berlin.DE>
References: <E1LZKyB-0005XK-Dy@bronto.tubit.TU-Berlin.DE>
Message-ID: <499AECF1.8010100@shub-internet.org>

Frank Elsner wrote:

> My question is:
> 
> Where to define site scpecific defaults? 
> Which file of Defaults.py. MailList.py and mm_cfg.py is best?

Don't make any changes to Defaults.py, because it will get over-written in 
the next upgrade.  Make all your local changes to mm_cfg.py only.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 17 18:31:52 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 09:31:52 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <1234888411.6406.50.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <PC187020090217093152059320dea945@msapiro>

Daniel.Li wrote:
>
>Thanks, I have got this error, see below. Should I re-compile the
>mailman. Is there any simple way can fix the problem. Thanks. 
>
>The original message was received at Tue, 17 Feb 2009 23:49:32 +0800
>from palfocus.oicp.net [192.168.58.208]
>with id n1HFnWTd005618
>
>   ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
>"|/usr/lib/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
>    (reason: 2)
>    (expanded from: <mailman-owner at palfocus.oicp.net>)
>
>   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
>Group mismatch error.  Mailman expected the mail
>wrapper script to be executed as group "mailman", but
>the system's mail server executed the mail script as
>group "mail".  Try tweaking the mail server to run the
>script as group "mailman", or re-run configure, 
>providing the command line option `--with-mail-gid=mail'.
>554 5.3.0 unknown mailer error 2
>550 5.1.1 <maillist_palfocus-bounces at palfocus.oicp.net>... User unknown


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/tYA9>.

If you installed from source, just rerun configure with the addition of
--with-mail-gid=mail and then "make install". You may also need to do
something with --with-cgi-gid. See all the notes at
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node7.html>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 17 19:11:52 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:11:52 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error generated by unsubscribe requests
In-Reply-To: <20090216161648.7681f567@bennet>
References: <20090216161648.7681f567@bennet>
Message-ID: <499AFDE8.7040909@msapiro.net>

K?rast wrote:
> 
> I've started getting an error message when people try unubscribing from
> my lists by emailing the -unsubscribe addresses.  I'm running a
> slightly modified version of 2.1.9 (based on the Debian version with
> a few modifications of my own)  The following error appears in the error
> logs
> 
> Feb 16 16:09:48 2009 (22125) Uncaught runner exception: 'str' object
> has no attribute 'address' Feb 16 16:09:48 2009 (22125) Traceback (most
> recent call last): File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py",
> line 112, in _oneloop self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>   File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 170, in _onefile
>     keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>   File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 243, in
> _dispose res.do_command('leave')
>   File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139, in
> do_command return handler.process(self, args)
>   File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_unsubscribe.py", line 76,
> in process mlist.ConfirmUnsubscription(cpaddr)
>   File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 1370, in
> ConfirmUnsubscription cookie = self.pend_new(Pending.UNSUBSCRIPTION,
> addr) File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py", line 76, in pend_new
>     if data[0] == UNSUBSCRIPTION and data[1] == content[0].address:
> AttributeError: 'str' object has no attribute 'address'
> 
> Feb 16 16:09:48 2009 (22125) SHUNTING:
> 1234800587.1249299+27b118ff3b62b500de00fd03a570aefcdf1a1ef2
> 
> 
> Any ideas how I fix this and let people unsubscribe?


The offending statement that throws the exception is line 76 in
/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py

     if data[0] == UNSUBSCRIPTION and data[1] == content[0].address:

This is not in the source distribution. If this is a Debian patch,
contact Debian. If this is one of your "few modifications", fix it.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 17 19:23:46 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:23:46 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mass change user's email address
In-Reply-To: <cde570730902170340k8625900x6b903f00d8767853@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902171023460109d5df791b@msapiro>

Manuel Vacelet wrote:
>
>I've googled a bit and browsed the FAQ but I didn't find the answer to
>my question:
>I there a way to mass change emails in all the mailing lists on a given server ?


Yes, but only one address at a time.


>I'm a mailman site admin and I have a lot of users that had their
>email changed following a re-branding of their company
>(john.doe at test.com -> john.doe at example.com). I have the map "old email
>-> new email" and I'm looking for a way to update the membership of
>the lists.
>
>Is there a well known way to do it or do I have to script something
>around "add_members / remove_members" ?


You have to script it, but use bin/clone_member which will just change
the address without changing any other settings.

bin/clone_member --admin --remove old_addr new_addr

will change old_addr to new_addr on all lists including owner and
moderator addresses.

See bin/clone_member --help

You still have to script it to run the command once for each old/new
pair, but clone_member is the command to use.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jbernier at risd.edu  Tue Feb 17 19:54:58 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:54:58 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] global search for member
Message-ID: <s99ac1bd.090@risd.edu>

Good day all,
 
Is there an easy way to search all my Mailman lists for a particular member?
 
Jeff
 
 
 

Jeff Bernier
E-mail Administrator
Rhode Island School of Design
401.454.6168

From jbernier at risd.edu  Tue Feb 17 20:07:48 2009
From: jbernier at risd.edu (Jeff Bernier)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 14:07:48 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] global search for member
Message-ID: <s99ac4c4.066@risd.edu>

Never mind... I just found the find_member command. It was right next to the "find_command" command.
 
Sorry to waste bandwidth.
 
Jeff

>>> "Jeff Bernier" <jbernier at risd.edu> 2/17/2009 1:54 PM >>>
Good day all,

Is there an easy way to search all my Mailman lists for a particular member?

Jeff




Jeff Bernier
E-mail Administrator
Rhode Island School of Design
401.454.6168
------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list
Mailman-Users at python.org 
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users 
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 
Searchable Archives: http://www.mail ( http://www.mail/ )-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/jbernier%40risd.edu 

Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9

From Alan.Rubin at nt.gov.au  Tue Feb 17 23:14:33 2009
From: Alan.Rubin at nt.gov.au (Alan Rubin)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 07:44:33 +0930
Subject: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email
Message-ID: <C3732E0A9E242D46A2B2C0CDC1F7134C490A86@emdpb-e1.prod.main.ntgov>

Mark,

Nope, I didn't realise that a restart was required.  I just restarted it
and it seems to work fine now. Thanks for the help, once again.

Regards,

Alan Rubin   
Technician Unix
DCS Midrange Services
Phone: +61 (08) 8999 5111
Fax:      +61 (08) 8999 7493
e-Mail: alan.rubin at nt.gov.au

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Sapiro [mailto:mark at msapiro.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, 18 February 2009 1:28 AM
To: Alan Rubin; Mailman User List
Subject: RE: [Mailman-Users] subscribing by email

Alan Rubin wrote:
>
>I applied the patch, used the request address, and my message still
gets
>shunted.


Did you restart Mailman after applying the patch?


>
>Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) Uncaught runner exception: 'NoneType'
object
>has no attribute 'lower'
>Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 114, in
>_oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 185, in
>_onefile
>    keepqueued =3D self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 239,
>in _dispose
>    res.process()
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 112,
>in process
>    stop =3D self.do_command(cmd, args)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/CommandRunner.py", line 139,
>in do_command
>    return handler.process(self, args)
>  File "/export/home/mailman/Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py", line
>74, in process
>    if (digest is None
>AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'lower'
>
>Feb 17 14:59:32 2009 (1046) SHUNTING:
>1234848571.543715+462ea839ccdd63f659aab843129562980c886d3c
>
>
>Diff on the cmd_subscribe.py new and old:
>
># diff Mailman/Commands/cmd_subscribe.py Mailman/Commands/cmd_sub>
>74,75c74
><     if (digest is None
><             and password and password.lower() in ('digest',
>'nodigest')):
>---
>>     if digest is None and password.lower() in ('digest', 'nodigest'):


I think the only possible explanation for the above is you didn't
restart Mailman.

Also, even without the patch, if you sent a

  subscribe nodigest address=xxx at example.com

command to the list-request address, it shouldn't trigger that error
unless you also had, e.g., a bare 'subscribe' in the subject. In mails
to -request, both Subject: and body are scanned for commands so if you
mail to -request with "Subject: subscribe" and body

subscribe nodigest address=xxx at example.com

that's two subscribe commands and the plain "subscribe" will trigger
the bug.


>The web form that you pointed me at should work regardless of this
error
>with the cmd_subscribe.py utility?


That's correct.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From lida_mail at 163.com  Wed Feb 18 13:38:45 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 20:38:45 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How to config sendmail on FC5
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090217093152059320dea945@msapiro>
References: <PC187020090217093152059320dea945@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1234960725.6432.23.camel@daniel-laptop>

Dear All,
I have got mailman worked, well, it's really ....
Thanks for all your help, especially Mark Sapiro.

The root cause in my configurations:
a) in my /etc/hosts file.
It should be set to something like this

127.0.0.1 palfocus.oicp.net localhost

b)configure with the option "--with-mail-gid=mail"
reason: http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node7.html 

c)Cron/mailmanctl
http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/4.78+Troubleshooting-+No+mail+going+out
+to+lists+members 

For your eyes only :)

-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From bernie at fantasyfarm.com  Wed Feb 18 16:50:43 2009
From: bernie at fantasyfarm.com (Bernie Cosell)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 10:50:43 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tracing a disappearing 'post'
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902091932550187d06b6eb2@msapiro>
References: <499097AA.254.1FB926F4@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>,
	<PC1870200902091932550187d06b6eb2@msapiro>
Message-ID: <499BE803.7961.1F57107A@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>

On 9 Feb 2009 at 19:32, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> Bernie Cosell wrote:
> 
> >A user on one of the lists here complained that her posts weren't getting 
> >through.  I looked at the sendmail log and I see her post making it to 
> >the "| ...mailman  post LIST", but then the message disappeared.  I've 
> >looked and it is, indeed, not in the list archives.

> If the message was discarded by Mailman, that fact should be logged in
> Mailman's vette log.

At the moment, I can't *find* the vette log..:o).  I see the calls in the 
code to syslog('vette',...) and from what I can tell the syslog is 
running -- the sysadmin tells me that it is running rsyslog with the 
simple rule:
   *.*    @MAINLOGSYSTEM
and other logging from that system seems to work, but I can't find any 
mailman stuff...   Still looking..:o)

BUT:

> Note that given what you've said about the list configuration, I think
> the most likely thing is Content filtering is on, text/html is
> filtered (not in pass_mime_types) and filter_action is discard so her
> text/html post is filtered to empty and discarded.

that solved it!  The problem was that the user had some sort of AVG email 
scanner that in the course of munging the MIME machinery to include a 
"Scanned and found virus-free" section [what a useless, stupid bit of 
software *THAT* is!] it totally hosed the format.  Having them undo the 
email scanning fixed the problem.

  /Bernie\

-- 
Bernie Cosell                     Fantasy Farm Fibers
mailto:bernie at fantasyfarm.com     Pearisburg, VA
    -->  Too many people, too few sheep  <--       




From brad at shub-internet.org  Wed Feb 18 17:00:00 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 10:00:00 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tracing a disappearing 'post'
In-Reply-To: <499BE803.7961.1F57107A@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>
References: <499097AA.254.1FB926F4@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>,
	<PC1870200902091932550187d06b6eb2@msapiro>
	<499BE803.7961.1F57107A@bernie.fantasyfarm.com>
Message-ID: <499C3080.6030802@shub-internet.org>

Bernie Cosell wrote:

> At the moment, I can't *find* the vette log..:o).  I see the calls in the 
> code to syslog('vette',...) and from what I can tell the syslog is 
> running -- the sysadmin tells me that it is running rsyslog with the 
> simple rule:
>    *.*    @MAINLOGSYSTEM
> and other logging from that system seems to work, but I can't find any 
> mailman stuff...   Still looking..:o)

It's not sent to the syslog you and I would recognize.  It's using the 
internal Python routine to log that data directly to a file.

Look in /usr/local/mailman/logs, or /var/mailman/logs, or wherever your 
platform puts them.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From elhijo.mgl at gmail.com  Tue Feb 17 17:59:51 2009
From: elhijo.mgl at gmail.com (David LEROUX)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 17:59:51 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] users in multiple lists
Message-ID: <499AED07.6010209@gmail.com>

Hi all,

I'm a new mailman administrator, first time using it and wondering a few 
things.
First one is that we manage a bunch of lists, in which same users may be 
in different one
The result is if we send mails to, for example, three different lists 
with a common user in those lists, this user receive 3 mails, normal...
But I wonder if there's a way to make that this user receive the mail 
only once.
As I'm typing this mail, I'm thinking that it could be a postfix issue 
more than a mailman issue

Thank you for your answers, and be sure to see me again soon ;)

-- 
David Leroux




From manuel.vacelet at gmail.com  Tue Feb 17 20:27:15 2009
From: manuel.vacelet at gmail.com (Manuel Vacelet)
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 20:27:15 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mass change user's email address
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902171023460109d5df791b@msapiro>
References: <cde570730902170340k8625900x6b903f00d8767853@mail.gmail.com>
	<PC1870200902171023460109d5df791b@msapiro>
Message-ID: <cde570730902171127r46c5bb6fi78040a890c17a403@mail.gmail.com>

Hum it's just what I need, perfect !

It happens to be the only mailman command I didn't carefully study
because I though it wouldn't be useful in my context (based on it's
name) :)

Many thanks to both of you,
Cheers,
Manuel

On Tue, Feb 17, 2009 at 7:23 PM, Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> Manuel Vacelet wrote:
>>
>>I've googled a bit and browsed the FAQ but I didn't find the answer to
>>my question:
>>I there a way to mass change emails in all the mailing lists on a given server ?
>
>
> Yes, but only one address at a time.
>
>
>>I'm a mailman site admin and I have a lot of users that had their
>>email changed following a re-branding of their company
>>(john.doe at test.com -> john.doe at example.com). I have the map "old email
>>-> new email" and I'm looking for a way to update the membership of
>>the lists.
>>
>>Is there a well known way to do it or do I have to script something
>>around "add_members / remove_members" ?
>
>
> You have to script it, but use bin/clone_member which will just change
> the address without changing any other settings.
>
> bin/clone_member --admin --remove old_addr new_addr
>
> will change old_addr to new_addr on all lists including owner and
> moderator addresses.
>
> See bin/clone_member --help
>
> You still have to script it to run the command once for each old/new
> pair, but clone_member is the command to use.
>
> --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>
>

From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 18 17:54:35 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 08:54:35 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] users in multiple lists
In-Reply-To: <499AED07.6010209@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902180854350125a954b560@msapiro>

David LEROUX wrote:
>
>I'm a new mailman administrator, first time using it and wondering a few 
>things.
>First one is that we manage a bunch of lists, in which same users may be 
>in different one
>The result is if we send mails to, for example, three different lists 
>with a common user in those lists, this user receive 3 mails, normal...
>But I wonder if there's a way to make that this user receive the mail 
>only once.


If your Mailman is 2.1.10 or later, you can use the Non-digest options
-> regular_exclude_lists option to at least partially accomplish this.

With two lists, say lista and listb this is straightforward. You put
listb at example.com in lista's regular_exclude_lists. Then any post
which is addressed to both lista and listb will be delivered from
listb to all its members and from lista to only those lista members
who aren't listb members.

You could also do it the other way around, but do not put both
listb at example.com in lista's regular_exclude_lists and
lista at example.com in listb's regular_exclude_lists. If you do, members
of both lists will not receive any posts addressed to both lists.

Thus, it gets tricky with three or more lists. Say you have lista,
listb and listc. If you put listb at example.com and listc at example.com in
lista's regular_exclude_lists, and listc at example.com in listb's
regular_exclude_lists, then a post addressed to all three lists will
be sent from listc to all its members, from listb to those members who
aren't members of listc, and from lista to those members who aren't
members of listb or listc, and this works so everyone receives just
one copy. Likewise, if a post is addressed to just lista and listb, it
will be sent from listb to all its members and from lista to its
members who aren't members of listb, and again, every member of lista
and listb receives just one copy.

I think this generalizes to any number of lists, but you need to be
carful how you set it up because if you have even one pair of lists
that are mutually in each other's regular_exclude_lists, then members
of both those lists will not receive a post addressed to both lists
from either list.

Also, this affects only regular delivery, not digest delivery. Digests
always contain all list posts.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 18 19:00:08 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 10:00:08 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error generated by unsubscribe requests
In-Reply-To: <20090218161523.353ca0e6@bennet>
References: <20090216161648.7681f567@bennet>	<499AFDE8.7040909@msapiro.net>
	<20090218161523.353ca0e6@bennet>
Message-ID: <499C4CA8.1060507@msapiro.net>

K?rast wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:11:52 -0800
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:
> 
> 
>> The offending statement that throws the exception is line 76 in
>> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py
>>
>>      if data[0] == UNSUBSCRIPTION and data[1] == content[0].address:
>>
> 
> Indeed it is, though I was hoping for some explanation of what 'content'
> actually is in order to debug it properly.
> 
>> This is not in the source distribution. If this is a Debian patch,
>> contact Debian. If this is one of your "few modifications", fix it.
>>
> 
> It's part of the indymedia patch to stop subscription spam.  Since I've
> never had any subscription spam on other list servers, and I don't
> understand how the patch works, I've simply disabled it.


OK. Just because I'm curious and compulsive, I looked at the patch at
<http://lists.indymedia.org/patches/imc-37-stop-subscription-spam.patch>.

If this is an example of the quality of the indymedia patches, I
wouldn't touch any of them.

What this part of the patch is apparently trying to do is avoid pending
another SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE request when there is already one
pending for the address. There are many things wrong with this patch.
The statement

if data[0] in (SUBSCRIPTION, UNSUBSCRIPTION) and data[1].address ==
content[0].address:

assumes that both data[1] and content[0] are instances of the UserDesc
class. data[1] is the first or only data item for the already pending
request and content[0] is the first or only data item for the current
(to be pended) request. These are only UserDesc instances if the request
type is SUBSCRIPTION. What the data are depends on the request type.

In the above, if data[0] is UNSUBSCRIPTION, data[1] is a string (the
address) so data[1].address throws an exception, and the current request
could be any of SUBSCRIPTION, UNSUBSCRIPTION, CHANGE_OF_ADDRESS,
HELD_MESSAGE, RE_ENABLE or PROBE_BOUNCE and only if it is SUBSCRIPTION
will content[0].address not throw an exception.

Besides all the above technical flaws with horrible symptoms, i.e.,
trying to pend anything but a SUBSCRIPTION request if there are any
pending SUBSCRIPTION requests throws an uncaught exception; trying to
pend any request at all if there is a pending UNSUBSCRIPTION request
throws an uncaught exception, the patch has bad consequences for the user.

Even if the technical difficulties were overcome, the consequence of
this patch is if I try to subscribe or unsubscribe and somehow lose the
confirmation email, I can't successfully try again until the first
request expires (default 3 days).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From ciprian.cosma at me.com  Thu Feb 19 09:32:23 2009
From: ciprian.cosma at me.com (Ciprian Matei COSMA)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 10:32:23 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] spam issues
Message-ID: <713CEEA9-5F8F-4027-830A-53201B52B5AF@me.com>

Hello all,

I just started a mailing list using mailman and it seems that most of  
the emails sent get in spam at gmail and yahoo.
Are there some setyoings that need to be done in order to avoid this  
( most of may subscribers are yahoo and gmail).

Thanks,

Ciprian

From elhijo.mgl at gmail.com  Thu Feb 19 13:15:19 2009
From: elhijo.mgl at gmail.com (David LEROUX)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 13:15:19 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] users in multiple lists
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902180854350125a954b560@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902180854350125a954b560@msapiro>
Message-ID: <499D4D57.2030107@gmail.com>

Thank you
It works just well :)
Maybe a bit tricky to use with a lot of lists...

Mark Sapiro wrote:
> David LEROUX wrote:
>   
>> I'm a new mailman administrator, first time using it and wondering a few 
>> things.
>> First one is that we manage a bunch of lists, in which same users may be 
>> in different one
>> The result is if we send mails to, for example, three different lists 
>> with a common user in those lists, this user receive 3 mails, normal...
>> But I wonder if there's a way to make that this user receive the mail 
>> only once.
>>     
>
>
> If your Mailman is 2.1.10 or later, you can use the Non-digest options
> -> regular_exclude_lists option to at least partially accomplish this.
>
> With two lists, say lista and listb this is straightforward. You put
> listb at example.com in lista's regular_exclude_lists. Then any post
> which is addressed to both lista and listb will be delivered from
> listb to all its members and from lista to only those lista members
> who aren't listb members.
>
> You could also do it the other way around, but do not put both
> listb at example.com in lista's regular_exclude_lists and
> lista at example.com in listb's regular_exclude_lists. If you do, members
> of both lists will not receive any posts addressed to both lists.
>
> Thus, it gets tricky with three or more lists. Say you have lista,
> listb and listc. If you put listb at example.com and listc at example.com in
> lista's regular_exclude_lists, and listc at example.com in listb's
> regular_exclude_lists, then a post addressed to all three lists will
> be sent from listc to all its members, from listb to those members who
> aren't members of listc, and from lista to those members who aren't
> members of listb or listc, and this works so everyone receives just
> one copy. Likewise, if a post is addressed to just lista and listb, it
> will be sent from listb to all its members and from lista to its
> members who aren't members of listb, and again, every member of lista
> and listb receives just one copy.
>
> I think this generalizes to any number of lists, but you need to be
> carful how you set it up because if you have even one pair of lists
> that are mutually in each other's regular_exclude_lists, then members
> of both those lists will not receive a post addressed to both lists
> from either list.
>
> Also, this affects only regular delivery, not digest delivery. Digests
> always contain all list posts.
>
>   

-- 
David Leroux

Mac Guff Ligne
6 rue dela cavalerie
75015 Paris

01.53.58.46.46 poste 310


From kaerast at qvox.org  Wed Feb 18 17:11:41 2009
From: kaerast at qvox.org (=?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=A6rast?=)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 16:11:41 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] users in multiple lists
In-Reply-To: <499AED07.6010209@gmail.com>
References: <499AED07.6010209@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20090218161141.0ebb83d9@bennet>

On Tue, 17 Feb 2009 17:59:51 +0100
David LEROUX <elhijo.mgl at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> I'm a new mailman administrator, first time using it and wondering a
> few things.
> First one is that we manage a bunch of lists, in which same users may
> be in different one
> The result is if we send mails to, for example, three different lists 
> with a common user in those lists, this user receive 3 mails,
> normal... But I wonder if there's a way to make that this user
> receive the mail only once.


In 2.1.10 (released April last year) a new Sibling List feature was
added which will handle this.  The changelog reports:

"Added a new 'sibling list' feature to exclude members of
another list from receiving a post from this list if the
other list is in the To: or Cc: of the post or to include
members of the other list if that list is not in the To: or
Cc: of the post (Patch ID 1347962)."

From the web admin gui, it's under 'Non-digest options' where you will
see two options:

* Other mailing lists on this site whose members are excluded from the
regular (non-digest) delivery if those list addresses appear in To: or
Cc: header.

* Other mailing lists on this site whose members are included in the
regular (non-digest) delivery if those list addresses don't appear in
To: or Cc: header.

It's quite easy to add as a patch to earlier versions if you need to (I
added it to 2.1.9 quite recently).

-- 
Alice

From kaerast at qvox.org  Wed Feb 18 17:15:23 2009
From: kaerast at qvox.org (=?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=A6rast?=)
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 16:15:23 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error generated by unsubscribe requests
In-Reply-To: <499AFDE8.7040909@msapiro.net>
References: <20090216161648.7681f567@bennet>
	<499AFDE8.7040909@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <20090218161523.353ca0e6@bennet>

On Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:11:52 -0800
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net> wrote:


> The offending statement that throws the exception is line 76 in
> /usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py
> 
>      if data[0] == UNSUBSCRIPTION and data[1] == content[0].address:
> 

Indeed it is, though I was hoping for some explanation of what 'content'
actually is in order to debug it properly.

> This is not in the source distribution. If this is a Debian patch,
> contact Debian. If this is one of your "few modifications", fix it.
> 

It's part of the indymedia patch to stop subscription spam.  Since I've
never had any subscription spam on other list servers, and I don't
understand how the patch works, I've simply disabled it.

-- 
Alice

From lists at mrnaz.com  Thu Feb 19 06:35:33 2009
From: lists at mrnaz.com (Naz)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 16:35:33 +1100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support / hosting for mailman
Message-ID: <499CEFA5.4020109@mrnaz.com>

We are looking for a company to either help us deploy mailman or perhaps 
host our mailman for us. Are there any companies that provide commercial 
mailman services?

Perhaps a "Commercial Support" link list on the mailman web site would 
be good idea?

Thanks,
- Naz.

-- 
?????? ?????

Web:  www.mrnaz.com
Ph:   +61 400 460 662


From brian at emwd.com  Thu Feb 19 16:42:43 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 10:42:43 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support / hosting for mailman
In-Reply-To: <499CEFA5.4020109@mrnaz.com>
References: <499CEFA5.4020109@mrnaz.com>
Message-ID: <00ef01c992a8$b62970e0$227c52a0$@com>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: mailman-users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org [mailto:mailman-
> users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Naz
> Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2009 12:36 AM
> To: Mail List - Mailman
> Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support / hosting for mailman
> 
> We are looking for a company to either help us deploy mailman or
> perhaps
> host our mailman for us. Are there any companies that provide
> commercial
> mailman services?
> 
> Perhaps a "Commercial Support" link list on the mailman web site would
> be good idea?
> 
> Thanks,
> - Naz.
> 
> --
> ?????? ?????
> 
> Web:  www.mrnaz.com
> Ph:   +61 400 460 662

Hi Naz:

I responded to your previous request earlier on this list but here is my response again:

" Hi Naz:

My company has been offering Mailman services for about 8 years now. Please contact me off list for more information. You can view more detail about our Mailman service at http://www.emwd.com/mailman.html."

You also contacted us via our contact form and I responded but you never got back to me. Please let me know if I can be of further assistance.

Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 19 16:45:59 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 07:45:59 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] spam issues
In-Reply-To: <713CEEA9-5F8F-4027-830A-53201B52B5AF@me.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090219074559082864efd4f7@msapiro>

Ciprian Matei COSMA wrote:
>
>I just started a mailing list using mailman and it seems that most of  
>the emails sent get in spam at gmail and yahoo.
>Are there some setyoings that need to be done in order to avoid this  
>( most of may subscribers are yahoo and gmail).


Your subscribers may individually be able to whitelist your list with
their service.

For other info, see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/4oA9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From brian at emwd.com  Thu Feb 19 16:56:53 2009
From: brian at emwd.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 10:56:53 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] spam issues
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090219074559082864efd4f7@msapiro>
References: <713CEEA9-5F8F-4027-830A-53201B52B5AF@me.com>
	<PC187020090219074559082864efd4f7@msapiro>
Message-ID: <00fb01c992aa$b0fb61d0$12f22570$@com>

 -----Original Message-----
> From: mailman-users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org [mailto:mailman-
> users-bounces+brian=emwd.com at python.org] On Behalf Of Mark Sapiro
> Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2009 10:46 AM
> To: Ciprian Matei COSMA; mailman-users at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] spam issues
> 
> Ciprian Matei COSMA wrote:
> >
> >I just started a mailing list using mailman and it seems that most of
> >the emails sent get in spam at gmail and yahoo.
> >Are there some setyoings that need to be done in order to avoid this
> >( most of may subscribers are yahoo and gmail).
> 
> 
> Your subscribers may individually be able to whitelist your list with
> their service.
> 
> For other info, see the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/4oA9>.
> 
> --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> 

There also has seems to be a change in Yahoo's policy regarding whitelisting
ISP servers. I have been able to get several servers easily whitelisted with
them recently. Before the process took months, now they are getting back to
me in less than 24 hours saying my servers have been whitelisted and I have
confirmed that. Getting whitelisted with Yahoo may prevent your messages
from landing in the bulk mail folder of Yahoo's mail users.

Here is the form that Yahoo had me use in case anyone is interested:

######################################################################
We are providing the following information for your future reference. 
Please submit add/change information in the following format per 
dedicated IP Address/Client:

Examples: 

Remove: 

   IP Address: xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx 
   Server Domain Name: server_name.domain.com 

Add the following addresses and companies: 

   IP Address: xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx 
   Mail Server Domain Name: server_name.domain.com 
   Client Company Name: company_name 
   Client Company URL: www.web_domain_name 

Notes: dedicated client/domain server, Company billing server, request 
probation monitoring Spam/feedback 

Please include administrator information with each request: 

   Your name: 
   Title: 
   Whitelisted Company Name: 
   Contact Email: postmaster at example.net 

Please send information to: 

   mail-abuse-bulk at cc.yahoo-inc.com 

For assistance with delivery issues to Yahoo! Mail, please visit: 

   http://postmaster.yahoo.com/
######################################################################

Hope that helps!


Regards,
Brian
--------------------------------------
EMWD.com -  'Powered by Techies'
Blog.emwd.com - "Curious comments from a web hosting techie"





From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 19 17:02:32 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 08:02:32 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support / hosting for mailman
In-Reply-To: <499CEFA5.4020109@mrnaz.com>
Message-ID: <PC18702009021908023208288a112b1c@msapiro>

Naz wrote:
>
>Perhaps a "Commercial Support" link list on the mailman web site would 
>be good idea?


Both "Mailman hosting services" and "Mailman consulting services" are
prominently linked from the Community space on the Mailman wiki. This
in turn is linked directly from the "Community(wiki)" link on the top
nav bar on the web site and indirectly linked from the "Wiki (exit)"
link on the left nav bar.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kaerast at qvox.org  Thu Feb 19 17:06:25 2009
From: kaerast at qvox.org (=?UTF-8?Q?K=C3=A6rast?=)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 16:06:25 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] spam issues
In-Reply-To: <713CEEA9-5F8F-4027-830A-53201B52B5AF@me.com>
References: <713CEEA9-5F8F-4027-830A-53201B52B5AF@me.com>
Message-ID: <20090219160625.02fb372e@bennet>

On Thu, 19 Feb 2009 10:32:23 +0200
Ciprian Matei COSMA <ciprian.cosma at me.com> wrote:

> Hello all,
> 
> I just started a mailing list using mailman and it seems that most
> of the emails sent get in spam at gmail and yahoo.
> Are there some setyoings that need to be done in order to avoid this  
> ( most of may subscribers are yahoo and gmail).
> 

If msn/hotmail is also affected then join the msn postmaster reporting
scheme <http://postmaster.msn.com/Services.aspx>

In a very rough order the things you need to do are:

Get copies of the headers of the emails as received at gmail/yahoo to
see if there is anything obvious (there won't be, but other
providers do add headers to explain why an email is considered spam)

Use http://www.blacklistalert.org/ to see if your mail server is
blacklisted anywhere, and if it is fix it (either by going through the
delisting process or by using an smtp smarthost if you should be)

Make sure you have correct reverse dns set up for your mail server.

Set up SPF for your domain (correctly, setting it up incorrectly can
make things much worse)

Don't send spammy emails

Don't use Base 64 encoding

Don't sign people up with permission

Ensure there is an obvious way for people to unsubscribe from your
email lists


-- 
Alice

From brad at shub-internet.org  Thu Feb 19 17:21:51 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 10:21:51 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Commercial support / hosting for mailman
In-Reply-To: <499CEFA5.4020109@mrnaz.com>
References: <499CEFA5.4020109@mrnaz.com>
Message-ID: <499D871F.8010706@shub-internet.org>

Naz wrote:
> We are looking for a company to either help us deploy mailman or perhaps 
> host our mailman for us. Are there any companies that provide commercial 
> mailman services?

Yes.

> Perhaps a "Commercial Support" link list on the mailman web site would 
> be good idea?

You mean like FAQ 1.17 at 
<http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030519>?

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From Tlf1 at ccs135.com  Thu Feb 19 22:55:32 2009
From: Tlf1 at ccs135.com (Tim Ferguson)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 15:55:32 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] John Viega?
Message-ID: <499D80F4020000BD000147D6@ccs135.com>

 
I hate to keep bothering this list about this, but I'm determined to not only get Mailman up and running, but up and running and stable for a long time to boot.  I've completely wiped out the SuSE Linux 10 box I have here and reinstalled everything from the ground up.  This particular install, I went ahead and let SuSE install it's "version" of Mailman, Apache2, Python, GCC, etc. and supposedly everything was a success.
 
When I browse to the domain name for this server, I get "It Works!", like I should. When I try to access Mailman, I get the "object not found" error.  When I attempt to create a new list via "root" and a terminal window, the list is created AND I actually get an e-mail at the account I entered when creating the list.  When I click on any of the links in the e-mail to access that list's "admin" page, still the "object not found" errors.  When I stop and start Apache2, no problem.  When I start Mailman, I get the warning that the Apache2 webinterface for Mailman has not been activated, but Mailman continues to load.
 
However, when I was configuring SuSE to install Mailman via one of it's packages, I noticed that "John Viega <mailman-users at python.org> " was the author.  Is this in reference to authoring the program or the package for SuSE?   Is there a specific order in which this package should be installed, i.e., Apache2, Mailman, Python, in that order, or does it matter?  Something's getting left out and I've not been able to trace it down, but installing Mailman via a package did nothing for Apache2 which I also installed via a package and it worked.
 
I've tried all the different TID's and FAQs for the "webinterface not activated error" without luck.  Any other ideas or suggestions would be appreciated.
 
 
Tim Ferguson
Director of Technology
Centralia City Schools
Centralia, Illinois 62801
618-532-1907, Ext. 1030
 

From barry at list.org  Thu Feb 19 23:16:48 2009
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 17:16:48 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] John Viega?
In-Reply-To: <499D80F4020000BD000147D6@ccs135.com>
References: <499D80F4020000BD000147D6@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <E00A7BB0-16F3-4521-A415-5474749709A7@list.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Feb 19, 2009, at 4:55 PM, Tim Ferguson wrote:

> However, when I was configuring SuSE to install Mailman via one of  
> it's packages, I noticed that "John Viega <mailman-users at python.org>  
> " was the author.  Is this in reference to authoring the program or  
> the package for SuSE?   Is there a specific order in which this  
> package should be installed, i.e., Apache2, Mailman, Python, in that  
> order, or does it matter?  Something's getting left out and I've not  
> been able to trace it down, but installing Mailman via a package did  
> nothing for Apache2 which I also installed via a package and it  
> worked.

I have no idea what that author tag means.  John was the original  
author of Mailman some at least 13 years ago.  John's still around (I  
worked for him at a previous job in fact :) but hasn't really had  
anything to do with Mailman in about a decade.

Barry

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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (Darwin)

iEYEARECAAYFAkmd2lEACgkQ2YZpQepbvXGHlgCfYPY+Q1zX09nJtUy0K0L11/FY
VgIAn1CDwWxMFrHpAZeoXbsMYZ3OYML1
=uR4N
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 19 23:25:09 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 14:25:09 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] John Viega?
In-Reply-To: <499D80F4020000BD000147D6@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902191425090453c897f64e@msapiro>

Tim Ferguson wrote:
> 
>I hate to keep bothering this list about this, but I'm determined to not only get Mailman up and running, but up and running and stable for a long time to boot.  I've completely wiped out the SuSE Linux 10 box I have here and reinstalled everything from the ground up.  This particular install, I went ahead and let SuSE install it's "version" of Mailman, Apache2, Python, GCC, etc. and supposedly everything was a success.


If you want help from this list, we can be much more helpful if you
install Mailman from source rather than from a package.


>When I browse to the domain name for this server, I get "It Works!", like I should. When I try to access Mailman, I get the "object not found" error.


You do not have the appropriate ScriptAlias directive for Mailman's
CGIs in your Apache config.


>When I attempt to create a new list via "root" and a terminal window, the list is created AND I actually get an e-mail at the account I entered when creating the list.  When I click on any of the links in the e-mail to access that list's "admin" page, still the "object not found" errors.  When I stop and start Apache2, no problem.  When I start Mailman, I get the warning that the Apache2 webinterface for Mailman has not been activated, but Mailman continues to load.


This warning is a SuSEism.


>However, when I was configuring SuSE to install Mailman via one of it's packages, I noticed that "John Viega <mailman-users at python.org> " was the author.  Is this in reference to authoring the program or the package for SuSE?


John Viega is the original author of Mailman and has not been actively
involved with Mailman for years.


>Is there a specific order in which this package should be installed, i.e., Apache2, Mailman, Python, in that order, or does it matter?  


This is a SuSE question.


>Something's getting left out and I've not been able to trace it down, but installing Mailman via a package did nothing for Apache2 which I also installed via a package and it worked.
> 
>I've tried all the different TID's and FAQs for the "webinterface not activated error" without luck.  Any other ideas or suggestions would be appreciated.


Get help from a SuSE list, or remove all the SuSE Mailman package,
install Mailman from source and get help from us, or try to figure out
what SuSE incantation is required to activate the Mailman web
interface,

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From fmouse-mailman at fmp.com  Thu Feb 19 23:42:42 2009
From: fmouse-mailman at fmp.com (Lindsay Haisley)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 16:42:42 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] John Viega?
In-Reply-To: <499D80F4020000BD000147D6@ccs135.com>
References: <499D80F4020000BD000147D6@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <1235083362.6092.66.camel@vishnu.fmp.com>

On Thu, 2009-02-19 at 15:55 -0600, Tim Ferguson wrote:
> I've tried all the different TID's and FAQs for the "webinterface not
> activated error" without luck.  Any other ideas or suggestions would
> be appreciated.

It sounds as if you're using a SuSE high-level interface to set up and
test for the presence of, and correct configuration of Mailman.
Generally a somewhat more hands-on approach is required in order to get
Mailman set up right.  Check ~mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py and see if your
domain is listed in an add_virtualhost call.  Do you have apache set up
so that the the mailman directory is a proper alias?  This generally
requires something like:

        ScriptAlias /mailman/ "/usr/lib64/mailman/cgi-bin/"
        <Directory "/usr/lib64/mailman/cgi-bin/">
                AllowOverride None
                Options ExecCGI FollowSymLinks
                Order allow,deny
                Allow from all
        </Directory>

plus a couple of other configuration stanzas somewhere in apache's
config file inclusion tree.

The above example is from Gentoo Linux, but something similar will need
to be set up by any distribution which implements Mailman.

-- 
Lindsay Haisley       | "Never expect the people who caused a problem
FMP Computer Services |  to solve it." (Albert Einstein)
512-259-1190          |        
http://www.fmp.com    |


From jeffg at turners.com  Fri Feb 20 03:13:07 2009
From: jeffg at turners.com (Jeff Grossman)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 18:13:07 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Residual Bounce Received
Message-ID: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979A757E@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>

What does residual bounce received mean in the bounce log file?

 

Jeff


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 20 03:32:53 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 18:32:53 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Residual Bounce Received
In-Reply-To: <A05D18ED823F7348B124F8F9729E0D979A757E@hq-srv-ex-01.turners.local>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902191832530890eca3f06f@msapiro>

Jeff Grossman wrote:

>What does residual bounce received mean in the bounce log file?

It means that the user's delivery was disabled by bounce processing and
subsequent to that a bounce was received for that user.

This could be because the bounces for that user aren't returned until
after some delay, but most of the time it's a bounce of the disabled
warning sent to the user.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jknowlton at vp44.com  Thu Feb 19 23:57:20 2009
From: jknowlton at vp44.com (Jack Knowlton)
Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2009 23:57:20 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman not updating the archives
Message-ID: <28e234b44fe9b3b47b7c0989b4e7cb17.squirrel@webmail.vp44.net>

Hi.
I posted on this list sometime ago regarding a problem happening after I
moved a mailman installation.
I thought that the problem had been fixed but today I went to check the
archives and noticed they stopped at the same time I moved the mailman
files.
This is the last entry in my error log:

Feb 19 12:08:39 2009 (17573) SHUNTING:
1235041717.338851+bdcc479aac14874fbec763cf0e1022c45bc65d1e
Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) Uncaught runner exception: [Errno 13]
Permission denied: '/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html'
Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 120, in _oneloop
    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 191, in _onefile
    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/ArchRunner.py", line 73, in _dispose
    mlist.ArchiveMail(msg)
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 215, in
ArchiveMail
    h.close()
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 324, in close
    self.write_TOC()
  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 1097, in
write_TOC
    toc = open(os.path.join(self.basedir, 'index.html'), 'w')
IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
'/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html'

Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) SHUNTING:
1235045618.2635429+2b370b4b48cfad3b14f5744a3e408e220ec4079c


And the permissions on "index.html" are:

dell-srv2:~# ls -alh /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html
-rw-r--r-- 1 root list 9.8K 2009-01-18 12:27
/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html


I ran several times check_perms -f and it says all is fixed.

-JK


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 20 18:11:59 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 09:11:59 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman not updating the archives
In-Reply-To: <28e234b44fe9b3b47b7c0989b4e7cb17.squirrel@webmail.vp44.net>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022009115900158ea0664a@msapiro>

Jack Knowlton wrote:

>I posted on this list sometime ago regarding a problem happening after I
>moved a mailman installation.
>I thought that the problem had been fixed but today I went to check the
>archives and noticed they stopped at the same time I moved the mailman
>files.
>This is the last entry in my error log:
>
>Feb 19 12:08:39 2009 (17573) SHUNTING:
>1235041717.338851+bdcc479aac14874fbec763cf0e1022c45bc65d1e
>Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) Uncaught runner exception: [Errno 13]
>Permission denied: '/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html'
>Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 120, in _oneloop
>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 191, in _onefile
>    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/ArchRunner.py", line 73, in _dispose
>    mlist.ArchiveMail(msg)
>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 215, in
>ArchiveMail
>    h.close()
>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 324, in close
>    self.write_TOC()
>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 1097, in
>write_TOC
>    toc = open(os.path.join(self.basedir, 'index.html'), 'w')
>IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
>'/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html'
>
>Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) SHUNTING:
>1235045618.2635429+2b370b4b48cfad3b14f5744a3e408e220ec4079c
>
>
>And the permissions on "index.html" are:
>
>dell-srv2:~# ls -alh /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html
>-rw-r--r-- 1 root list 9.8K 2009-01-18 12:27
>/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html
>
>
>I ran several times check_perms -f and it says all is fixed.


check_perms is lying (actually, there are many files, as opposed to
directories, that check_perms doesn't check). The above file and all
files in /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/ excluding those in
/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/*/database/ need to be group
writable.

Once you fix these permissions, you could run bin/unshunt to add the
shunted messages to the archive, but there is an issue in that the
messages have been successfully added to
/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist.mbox/mylist.mbox, and
unshunting will add them again.

Rather than trying to fix archive permissions, I suggest you verify
that /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist.mbox/mylist.mbox
contains all the lists posts from inception to date, and mayby verify
there are no stray "From " lines in message bodies with bin/cleanarch,
and then stop Mailman and rebuild the archive with

 bin/arch --wipe listname

and then start Mailman. This way, the pipermail archive will be
completely rebuilt with correct permissions.

This is one reason why I always recommend when moving lists to just
move the LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox file and build the archive on the
new machine with bin/arch.

Note if you do this, remove the shunted messages from qfiles/shunt/ so
they don't accidently get unshunted in the future.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From lida_mail at 163.com  Sat Feb 21 02:25:29 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:25:29 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] visit archives failed with 404 NOT found error!
Message-ID: <1235179529.6316.8.camel@daniel-laptop>

Dear All,
I met another problem, when I try to visit archives.
It shows, see http://palfocus.oicp.net/pipermail/maillist_palfocus/ 
"The requested URL /pipermail/maillist_palfocus/ was not found on this
server."

So I googled some articles, and set proper direction.
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2006-July/052302.html 

And change the folder attribute:
[daniel at palfocus mailman]$ vdir
total 72
drwxrwsr-x  4 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 archives
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 bin
drwxrwsrwx  2 apache mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 cgi-bin
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 cron
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 20:35 data
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 icons
drwxrwsr-x  4 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:20 lists
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 20 23:55 locks
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 20 23:55 logs
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 mail
drwxrwsr-x 11 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 Mailman
drwxrwsr-x 37 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 messages
drwxrwsr-x  6 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 pythonlib
drwxrwsr-x 11 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:20 qfiles
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:13 scripts
drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 spam
drwxrwsr-x 38 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 templates
drwxrwsr-x  4 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 tests


But still can't access the right page.


Any ideas? Thanks
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 21 02:40:02 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 17:40:02 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] visit archives failed with 404 NOT found error!
In-Reply-To: <1235179529.6316.8.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <PC187020090220174002039068395ac8@msapiro>

Daniel.Li wrote:

>I met another problem, when I try to visit archives.
>It shows, see http://palfocus.oicp.net/pipermail/maillist_palfocus/ 
>"The requested URL /pipermail/maillist_palfocus/ was not found on this
>server."


Do you have the appropriate

Alias /pipermail/

directive pointing to your archives/public/ directory in your Apache
config and do you have "options +FollowSymlinks" on that directory?
See <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node10.html>.

Does the list in question have public archives?


>So I googled some articles, and set proper direction.
>http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2006-July/052302.html 
>
>And change the folder attribute:


What attribute on what directory?


>[daniel at palfocus mailman]$ vdir
>total 72
>drwxrwsr-x  4 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 archives
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 bin
>drwxrwsrwx  2 apache mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 cgi-bin
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 cron
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 20:35 data
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 icons
>drwxrwsr-x  4 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:20 lists
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 20 23:55 locks
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 20 23:55 logs
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 mail
>drwxrwsr-x 11 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 Mailman
>drwxrwsr-x 37 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 messages
>drwxrwsr-x  6 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 pythonlib
>drwxrwsr-x 11 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:20 qfiles
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:13 scripts
>drwxrwsr-x  2 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 spam
>drwxrwsr-x 38 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 templates
>drwxrwsr-x  4 root   mailman 4096 Feb 18 08:12 tests
>
>
>But still can't access the right page.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From lida_mail at 163.com  Sat Feb 21 02:58:18 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:58:18 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] visit archives failed with 404 NOT found error!
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090220174002039068395ac8@msapiro>
References: <PC187020090220174002039068395ac8@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1235181499.6458.6.camel@daniel-laptop>

On Fri, 2009-02-20 at 17:40 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Do you have the appropriate
> 
> Alias /pipermail/

Thanks.

After re-check /etc/httpd/conf.d/mailman.conf 
, I found that I only noticed redirection and forgot to change
pipermail, as I use --prefix=/usr/lib/mailman/ to install the mailman


> Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/
> <Directory /var/lib/mailman/archives/public>
>     Options Indexes MultiViews FollowSymLinks
>     AllowOverride None
>     Order allow,deny
>     Allow from all
> </Directory>

should change to 
Alias /pipermail/ /usr/lib/mailman/archives/public/
<Directory /var/lib/mailman/archives/public>
    Options Indexes MultiViews FollowSymLinks
    AllowOverride None
    Order allow,deny
    Allow from all
</Directory>

-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 21 04:02:33 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:02:33 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] visit archives failed with 404 NOT found error!
In-Reply-To: <1235181499.6458.6.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902201902330750b40270cf@msapiro>

Daniel.Li wrote:
>
>After re-check /etc/httpd/conf.d/mailman.conf 
>, I found that I only noticed redirection and forgot to change
>pipermail, as I use --prefix=/usr/lib/mailman/ to install the mailman
>
>
>> Alias /pipermail/ /var/lib/mailman/archives/public/
>> <Directory /var/lib/mailman/archives/public>
>>     Options Indexes MultiViews FollowSymLinks
>>     AllowOverride None
>>     Order allow,deny
>>     Allow from all
>> </Directory>
>
>should change to 
>Alias /pipermail/ /usr/lib/mailman/archives/public/
><Directory /var/lib/mailman/archives/public>


And change this one too.


>    Options Indexes MultiViews FollowSymLinks
>    AllowOverride None
>    Order allow,deny
>    Allow from all
></Directory>

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From lida_mail at 163.com  Sat Feb 21 04:18:20 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:18:20 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] visit archives failed with 404 NOT found error!
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902201902330750b40270cf@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902201902330750b40270cf@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1235186300.6458.8.camel@daniel-laptop>

On Fri, 2009-02-20 at 19:02 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> >should change to 
> >Alias /pipermail/ /usr/lib/mailman/archives/public/
> ><Directory /var/lib/mailman/archives/public>
> 
> 
> And change this one too.

Well, I'm so careless. Thanks.
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From shop at justbrits.com  Sat Feb 21 05:13:26 2009
From: shop at justbrits.com (Ed's Shop)
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 22:13:26 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] visit archives failed with 404 NOT found error!
In-Reply-To: <1235186300.6458.8.camel@daniel-laptop>
Message-ID: <OLECLAFDGBNPEJPOHHIJGELNCJAA.shop@justbrits.com>

<<Well, I'm so careless.>>

NOT in MHO Daniel !!

BECAUSE you are dealing with brand new (to YOU) software
program and doing so in a SECOND language !!

I would say that overall, you are doing a great job of it and making
SURE that ALL functions of said software (MailMan, in this case)
work perfectly PRIOR to 'inviting would-be users' to utilize it is
VERY good practice !!

Regards & best wishes with your NEW site & endevour !!!

Ed
Please visit my site at:		www.justbrits.com



From lida_mail at 163.com  Sat Feb 21 05:37:07 2009
From: lida_mail at 163.com (Daniel.Li)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 12:37:07 +0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] visit archives failed with 404 NOT found error!
In-Reply-To: <OLECLAFDGBNPEJPOHHIJGELNCJAA.shop@justbrits.com>
References: <OLECLAFDGBNPEJPOHHIJGELNCJAA.shop@justbrits.com>
Message-ID: <1235191027.6268.1.camel@daniel-laptop>

On Fri, 2009-02-20 at 22:13 -0600, Ed's Shop wrote:
> NOT in MHO Daniel !!
> 
> BECAUSE you are dealing with brand new (to YOU) software
> program and doing so in a SECOND language !!
> 
> I would say that overall, you are doing a great job of it and making
> SURE that ALL functions of said software (MailMan, in this case)
> work perfectly PRIOR to 'inviting would-be users' to utilize it is
> VERY good practice !!
> 
> Regards & best wishes with your NEW site & endevour !!!

Thanks very much.
> 
> Ed
> Please visit my site at:                www.justbrits.com

BTW, I can't visit above links, see below response:
Network Time out               

The server at www.justbrits.com is taking too long to respond.

The requested site did not respond to a connection request and the
browser has stopped waiting for a reply.

    * Could the server be experiencing high demand or a temporary
outage?  Try again later.
    * Are you unable to browse other sites? Check the computer's network
connection.
    * Is your computer or network protected by a firewall or proxy?
Incorrect settings can interfere with Web browsing.
    * Still having trouble? Consult your network administrator or
Internet provider for assistance.
> 
-- 
Daniel.Li <lida_mail at 163.com>
PALFocus (http://palfocus.oicp.net)



From admin at gunah.eu  Fri Feb 20 11:02:11 2009
From: admin at gunah.eu (Mathis)
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 11:02:11 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] chaning webinterface port
Message-ID: <499E7FA3.5050509@gunah.eu>

Hello there

i have installed mailman and configure the mailinglists, but i would 
enter the Webinterface on http://list.DOMAIN.TLD:8080 and i have to 
change the running lists

so i have changed the config:
/etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py
DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/'

./withlist -l -r fix_url LIST -u lists.DOMAIN.TLD:8080

and then the email address from the list is: LIST at lists.DOMAIN.TLD:8080 
- o.O

so sorry for my english :-(

greetz
Mathis

From edward.harvey at lyricsemiconductor.com  Fri Feb 20 18:48:35 2009
From: edward.harvey at lyricsemiconductor.com (Edward Ned Harvey)
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 12:48:35 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How could this happen? - Post to moderated list
Message-ID: <D387F9D7BD934FC0869ACD9104BC220E@lyricsemi.hdq>

I have a list, with the following values:
    accept_these_nonmembers
        ^((^.*@lyricsemi.com)|(^.*@lyricsemiconductor.com)|(^.*@lyricsemiconductors.com))
        Should accept all messages from anyone in my domain, regardless of whether or not the poster is subscribed.

Members:
       Includes joe.user at lyricsemiconductor.com

However, Joe User posted a message to the list, and he got the auto response "Awaiting moderator approval" and "Reason: Post to moderated list."

I noticed just now - When I look at the membership status, Joe User has the checkbox next to his name, under the "mod" column.  Does this imply that he is being forcefully moderated?  How could that checkbox have gotten set?  I am the moderator, and I don't want him moderated, and I never set that box explicitly for him.

Obviously I got past the problem this time by simply accepting his message.  But I'd like to know what caused it so I can avoid future issues.

Thanks...

From brad at shub-internet.org  Sat Feb 21 08:00:40 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 01:00:40 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How could this happen? - Post to moderated list
In-Reply-To: <D387F9D7BD934FC0869ACD9104BC220E@lyricsemi.hdq>
References: <D387F9D7BD934FC0869ACD9104BC220E@lyricsemi.hdq>
Message-ID: <499FA698.2030407@shub-internet.org>

on 2/20/09 11:48 AM, Edward Ned Harvey said:

> I noticed just now - When I look at the membership status, Joe User
> has the checkbox next to his name, under the "mod" column.  Does this
> imply that he is being forcefully moderated?

Yup.

>                                               How could that checkbox
> have gotten set?  I am the moderator, and I don't want him moderated,
> and I never set that box explicitly for him.

There is a "default moderation" check box that can be selected at the 
time the list is created, or can be applied to all new subscribers after 
it is selected.

For example, this option is now turned on for all new members of this 
mailing list, so everyone has to go through the moderation process at 
least once or twice (proving they're a real human being and also proving 
that they can post relatively on-topic messages and that they're 
probably not a spammer).  Once you've posted to the list a couple of 
times, I usually remember to clear your moderation checkbox, and all 
future posts will bypass the moderation process.

Maybe you selected this checkbox and didn't know it, or maybe you didn't 
understand what it was.  Or maybe the checkbox was selected by someone 
else who was involved in the list administration.


Your choices are to do as I do, by individually clearing the moderation 
checkbox for those users you want to allow, or you can de-select the 
checkbox that applies default moderation to all new members.  Selecting 
or de-selecting that checkbox won't affect any current members, but it 
will affect new subscribers after that change is made.


Another option that's available is to use "emergency moderation" for all 
posts to the list, which forces everyone to always go through the 
moderation process for each and every post.  This is usually only used 
in dire circumstances, such as when some sort of mail loop has managed 
to get past the extensive defenses that Mailman has, or there is a 
massive flame war, etc....

> Obviously I got past the problem this time by simply accepting his
> message.  But I'd like to know what caused it so I can avoid future
> issues.

Most likely the default moderation issue.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 21 16:45:42 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 07:45:42 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] chaning webinterface port
In-Reply-To: <499E7FA3.5050509@gunah.eu>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902210745420390c1cdb070@msapiro>

Mathis wrote:
>
>i have installed mailman and configure the mailinglists, but i would 
>enter the Webinterface on http://list.DOMAIN.TLD:8080 and i have to 
>change the running lists
>
>so i have changed the config:
>/etc/mailman/mm_cfg.py
>DEFAULT_URL_PATTERN = 'http://%s:8080/cgi-bin/mailman/'
>
>./withlist -l -r fix_url LIST -u lists.DOMAIN.TLD:8080


Your fix_url is wrong: If you have the proper values for
DEFAULT_URL_HOST and DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST, you don't need the -u option
at all.

./withlist -l -r fix_url LIST

or to do all lists at once

./withlist -l -a -r fix_url

If for some reason, you actually do need the -u option, specify just
the host name, not the port.

./withlist -l -r fix_url LIST -u lists.DOMAIN.TLD

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 21 17:01:00 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 08:01:00 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman not updating the archives
In-Reply-To: <b6b6623a8011839c1d8787f5926a102f.squirrel@webmail.vp44.net>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022108010008598dfa86db@msapiro>

Jack Knowlton wrote:
>
>That looks like a great solution, but I can't find neither the "cleanarch"
>nor the "arch" binary. (I installed mailman from debian apt)


According to <http://packages.debian.org/lenny/i386/mailman/filelist>,
they are in /usr/lib/mailman/bin/.

If they're not there, try

locate cleanarch

or

find / -print -name cleanarch.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From edward.harvey at lyricsemiconductor.com  Sat Feb 21 22:37:16 2009
From: edward.harvey at lyricsemiconductor.com (Edward Ned Harvey)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 16:37:16 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How could this happen? - Post to moderated list
References: <D387F9D7BD934FC0869ACD9104BC220E@lyricsemi.hdq>
	<499FA698.2030407@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <06B3FBA2A7754500AAE72452B19C5C48@carmel>

>>                                               How could that checkbox
>> have gotten set?
>
> There is a "default moderation" check box that can be selected at the time 
> the list is created, or can be applied to all new subscribers after it is 
> selected.

It is conceivable, although unlikely, that the user became "moderated" early 
on, if he subscribed in the very beginning of the history of the list, 
before I disabled the default moderated checkbox.  It is also conceivable, 
but unlikely, that somebody other than myself could have set this user's 
"moderate" bit accidentally.  The list admin does in fact use a password 
that users other than myself know.

Is there any other way for this user's "moderate" bit to have gotten set?
Perhaps -

I know at one point, he mailed the list with an attachment that was too 
large, so that message got held.  Does this ever set (and leave set) the 
moderate bit?

Thanks again... 


From brad at shub-internet.org  Sun Feb 22 00:42:59 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 17:42:59 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How could this happen? - Post to moderated list
In-Reply-To: <06B3FBA2A7754500AAE72452B19C5C48@carmel>
References: <D387F9D7BD934FC0869ACD9104BC220E@lyricsemi.hdq>	<499FA698.2030407@shub-internet.org>
	<06B3FBA2A7754500AAE72452B19C5C48@carmel>
Message-ID: <49A09183.9000902@shub-internet.org>

on 2/21/09 3:37 PM, Edward Ned Harvey said:

> Is there any other way for this user's "moderate" bit to have gotten set?

Unlikely.

> I know at one point, he mailed the list with an attachment that was too 
> large, so that message got held.  Does this ever set (and leave set) the 
> moderate bit?

That would cause the one message to be held, but it wouldn't change the 
moderation bit for that user.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Sun Feb 22 01:25:29 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 16:25:29 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] How could this happen? - Post to moderated list
In-Reply-To: <06B3FBA2A7754500AAE72452B19C5C48@carmel>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022116252909689c680665@msapiro>

Edward Ned Harvey wrote:
>
>I know at one point, he mailed the list with an attachment that was too 
>large, so that message got held.  Does this ever set (and leave set) the 
>moderate bit?


As Brad said, no.

But, assuming you have not rearranged GLOBAL_PIPELINE, this says at the
time of that post, the user was not moderated, otherwise the post
would have been held as "post from moderated member" rather than as
"too big".

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jknowlton at vp44.com  Sat Feb 21 10:01:03 2009
From: jknowlton at vp44.com (Jack Knowlton)
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:01:03 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman not updating the archives
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009022009115900158ea0664a@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009022009115900158ea0664a@msapiro>
Message-ID: <b6b6623a8011839c1d8787f5926a102f.squirrel@webmail.vp44.net>

On Fri, February 20, 2009 6:11 pm, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Jack Knowlton wrote:
>
>>I posted on this list sometime ago regarding a problem happening after I
>>moved a mailman installation.
>>I thought that the problem had been fixed but today I went to check the
>>archives and noticed they stopped at the same time I moved the mailman
>>files.
>>This is the last entry in my error log:
>>
>>Feb 19 12:08:39 2009 (17573) SHUNTING:
>>1235041717.338851+bdcc479aac14874fbec763cf0e1022c45bc65d1e
>>Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) Uncaught runner exception: [Errno 13]
>>Permission denied: '/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html'
>>Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) Traceback (most recent call last):
>>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 120, in _oneloop
>>    self._onefile(msg, msgdata)
>>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 191, in _onefile
>>    keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata)
>>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Queue/ArchRunner.py", line 73, in
>> _dispose
>>    mlist.ArchiveMail(msg)
>>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/Archiver.py", line 215, in
>>ArchiveMail
>>    h.close()
>>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/pipermail.py", line 324, in
>> close
>>    self.write_TOC()
>>  File "/usr/lib/mailman/Mailman/Archiver/HyperArch.py", line 1097, in
>>write_TOC
>>    toc = open(os.path.join(self.basedir, 'index.html'), 'w')
>>IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied:
>>'/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html'
>>
>>Feb 19 13:13:42 2009 (17573) SHUNTING:
>>1235045618.2635429+2b370b4b48cfad3b14f5744a3e408e220ec4079c
>>
>>
>>And the permissions on "index.html" are:
>>
>>dell-srv2:~# ls -alh /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html
>>-rw-r--r-- 1 root list 9.8K 2009-01-18 12:27
>>/var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist/index.html
>>
>>
>>I ran several times check_perms -f and it says all is fixed.
>
>
> check_perms is lying (actually, there are many files, as opposed to
> directories, that check_perms doesn't check). The above file and all
> files in /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/ excluding those in
> /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/*/database/ need to be group
> writable.
>
> Once you fix these permissions, you could run bin/unshunt to add the
> shunted messages to the archive, but there is an issue in that the
> messages have been successfully added to
> /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist.mbox/mylist.mbox, and
> unshunting will add them again.
>
> Rather than trying to fix archive permissions, I suggest you verify
> that /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/mylist.mbox/mylist.mbox
> contains all the lists posts from inception to date, and mayby verify
> there are no stray "From " lines in message bodies with bin/cleanarch,
> and then stop Mailman and rebuild the archive with
>
>  bin/arch --wipe listname
>
> and then start Mailman. This way, the pipermail archive will be
> completely rebuilt with correct permissions.
>
> This is one reason why I always recommend when moving lists to just
> move the LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox file and build the archive on the
> new machine with bin/arch.
>
> Note if you do this, remove the shunted messages from qfiles/shunt/ so
> they don't accidently get unshunted in the future.
>

That looks like a great solution, but I can't find neither the "cleanarch"
nor the "arch" binary. (I installed mailman from debian apt)

-JK


From Tlf1 at ccs135.com  Mon Feb 23 00:36:42 2009
From: Tlf1 at ccs135.com (Tim Ferguson)
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 17:36:42 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Question
Message-ID: <49A18D2A020000BD00014876@ccs135.com>

Now that I have Mailman up and running and the initial site list, mailman, created, why am I getting the error below when attempting to create a new list?
 
Thanks,
Tim
 
Error: You are not authorized to create new mailing lists
 
 
Tim Ferguson
Director of Technology
Centralia City Schools
Centralia, Illinois 62801
618-532-1907, Ext. 1030
 

From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb 23 00:51:24 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 15:51:24 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Error Question
In-Reply-To: <49A18D2A020000BD00014876@ccs135.com>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022215512403901110e61e@msapiro>

Tim Ferguson wrote:

>Now that I have Mailman up and running and the initial site list, mailman, created, why am I getting the error below when attempting to create a new list?
> 
>Thanks,
>Tim
> 
>Error: You are not authorized to create new mailing lists


The most likely reason is the password you are providing at the bottom
of the web create form is not the Mailman site password or the special
list creator password. See "bin/mmsitepass --help" for how to
set/change these.

Note that this is NOT the admin password for the site list.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From schlaber at gmx.at  Sun Feb 22 22:08:57 2009
From: schlaber at gmx.at (Bernd)
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:08:57 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] charset problems when subscribing with python script
Message-ID: <1235336937.7840.16.camel@taylor>

Hello,

I doesn't have access to the add_members script and so I am writing a
python script which uses http requests to subscribe new members.

But if I am posting a new member with an name, which includes "German
Umlaute" I see only weird characters in the admin-interface.

If I post "B?rbel R?ssel" the admin-interface shows me the following
name: "B??rbel R??ssel"
I am using the German language setting, so I use ISO-8559-1 charset. If
I switch my browser to UTF-8 the name is correct in the admin-interface.

The strange thing for me is, that the name is correct if I subscribe the
member in the admin-interface manually. I don't know what's the
different between my python script and the manuell subscription. 

To Post to my mailman-server I use this recipe
(http://code.activestate.com/recipes/146306/) to generate the
multipart/form-data POST

I looked into the Mailman source code and found the Util.canonstr
method. At the end it changes the string to an unicode string. So the
name is stored as unicode, isn't it? But why is there a difference if I
display the manuell inserted name and the automatic inserted name??

~ Bernd



From s.u.n at free.Fr  Mon Feb 23 11:27:19 2009
From: s.u.n at free.Fr (S/U/N)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 11:27:19 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] SMTP queue stalled
Message-ID: <49A27A07.4000404@free.Fr>

Hello everybody!
I'm using mailman for a while now, but all-of-a-sudden, after adding one
mailing list, the mail queue stalls
What are the most obvious reasons for that problem to appear?

- I tried to restart mailman via mailmanctl > no change

Thanks for any helpful hint.


From bcanty at apsa.org  Mon Feb 23 18:01:40 2009
From: bcanty at apsa.org (Brian Canty)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 12:01:40 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem receiving copy of posts
Message-ID: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D25347@apsaserv.APSA.local>

I have a user who has a gmail email address and everytime he posts to
one of the mailman lists I use he does not get a copy of it.  Is there
something that I missed during setup that causes this?  I have the
option checked to receive a post for posters, is there something else.
Also is this a known issue with gmail?

Thanks in advance.


Brian Canty
Manager Computer Information Services
American Psychoanalytic Association
212-752-0450 x17



From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk  Mon Feb 23 18:04:37 2009
From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:04:37 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem receiving copy of posts
In-Reply-To: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D25347@apsaserv.APSA.local>
References: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D25347@apsaserv.APSA.local>
Message-ID: <20090223170437.GU6339@amyl.org.uk>

On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 12:01:40PM -0500, Brian Canty wrote:
> I have a user who has a gmail email address and everytime he posts to
> one of the mailman lists I use he does not get a copy of it.  Is there

    http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=6588&topic=13272

> something that I missed during setup that causes this?  I have the
> option checked to receive a post for posters, is there something else.
> Also is this a known issue with gmail?

Yes. I believe they call it a "feature".

-- 
``Political language... is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder
  respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind.''
  (Orwell, from `Politics and the English Language')

From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb 23 18:29:09 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 09:29:09 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] SMTP queue stalled
In-Reply-To: <49A27A07.4000404@free.Fr>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022309290905464d69b1eb@msapiro>

S/U/N wrote:

>Hello everybody!
>I'm using mailman for a while now, but all-of-a-sudden, after adding one
>mailing list, the mail queue stalls
>What are the most obvious reasons for that problem to appear?
>
>- I tried to restart mailman via mailmanctl > no change


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/A4E9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb 23 18:32:25 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 09:32:25 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Problem receiving copy of posts
In-Reply-To: <6B3A7025196C1A49AABB0E6C80AD5AE2D25347@apsaserv.APSA.local>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022309322505784d69b21b@msapiro>

Brian Canty wrote:

>I have a user who has a gmail email address and everytime he posts to
>one of the mailman lists I use he does not get a copy of it.  Is there
>something that I missed during setup that causes this?  I have the
>option checked to receive a post for posters, is there something else.
>Also is this a known issue with gmail?


Yes, this is gmail "feature". See the FAQ at
<http://wiki.list.org/x/2IA9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Mon Feb 23 18:58:21 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 09:58:21 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] charset problems when subscribing with python
	script
In-Reply-To: <1235336937.7840.16.camel@taylor>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022309582106870880f084@msapiro>

Bernd wrote:
>
>I doesn't have access to the add_members script and so I am writing a
>python script which uses http requests to subscribe new members.
>
>But if I am posting a new member with an name, which includes "German
>Umlaute" I see only weird characters in the admin-interface.
>
>If I post "B?rbel R?ssel" the admin-interface shows me the following
>name: "B??rbel R??ssel"
>I am using the German language setting, so I use ISO-8559-1 charset. If
>I switch my browser to UTF-8 the name is correct in the admin-interface.


It appears that what may be happening is due to a character set
mismatch somewhere. It looks like when "B?rbel R?ssel" is converted to
unicode it is actually encoded as utf-8 but is converted as if it were
iso-8859-1 encoded.


>The strange thing for me is, that the name is correct if I subscribe the
>member in the admin-interface manually. I don't know what's the
>different between my python script and the manuell subscription. 


I suspect the post data from your script is utf-8 encoded and not
iso-8859-1 encoded.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 24 00:25:07 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 15:25:07 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.12 final released.
Message-ID: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

I am happy to announce the final release of Mailman 2.1.12.

Since 2.1.12rc2 there have been a few bug fixes, the Polish translation
has been updated and a couple of items have been added to the contrib
directory.

Mailman 2.1.12 is a minor bug fix and Python 2.6 compatibility release.

The minimum Python for this release is Python 2.4 and it is compatible
with Python through 2.6. The previous Mailman releases are not
compatible with Python 2.6.

See the release notes at
<https://sourceforge.net/project/shownotes.php?release_id=653108&group_id=103>
for more details.

Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.

For more information, including download links, please see:

http://www.list.org
http://mailman.sf.net
http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman

- --
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32)

iD8DBQFJozBSVVuXXpU7hpMRAgBNAJ0SNpRHqlmRCHcW0L7f/Gxw+7Ro/QCgrfoA
qMml0XJorulAaRiCi03e7OY=
=fTrb
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From barry at list.org  Tue Feb 24 00:54:01 2009
From: barry at list.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:54:01 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Announce] Mailman 2.1.12 final
	released.
In-Reply-To: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
References: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <AC63326F-75F1-467A-8B0A-2C53D065C7A4@list.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Feb 23, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> I am happy to announce the final release of Mailman 2.1.12.

Thanks Mark!
Barry

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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (Darwin)

iEYEARECAAYFAkmjNxkACgkQ2YZpQepbvXGYQACaAwH7Cqr+5IOOgVTKTB7lsp74
kuoAoJPb7wiytOPmoTJwP1rBVlES496U
=qD0Q
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From shop at justbrits.com  Tue Feb 24 03:01:11 2009
From: shop at justbrits.com (Ed's Shop)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 20:01:11 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] [Mailman-Announce] Mailman 2.1.12 finalreleased.
In-Reply-To: <AC63326F-75F1-467A-8B0A-2C53D065C7A4@list.org>
Message-ID: <OLECLAFDGBNPEJPOHHIJCECPCKAA.shop@justbrits.com>

<<On Feb 23, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> I am happy to announce the final release of Mailman 2.1.12.>>

Thanks AND Congrats, Mark !!!

Ed



From s.u.n at free.Fr  Mon Feb 23 17:55:18 2009
From: s.u.n at free.Fr (S/U/N)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:55:18 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] SMTP queue stalled
In-Reply-To: <49A27A07.4000404@free.Fr>
References: <49A27A07.4000404@free.Fr>
Message-ID: <49A2D4F6.9080904@free.Fr>

S/U/N a ?crit :
> Hello everybody!
> I'm using mailman for a while now, but all-of-a-sudden, after adding one
> mailing list, the mail queue stalls
> What are the most obvious reasons for that problem to appear?
>
> - I tried to restart mailman via mailmanctl > no change
>
> Thanks for any helpful hint.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list
> Mailman-Users at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/s.u.n%40free.fr
>
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
>
>
>   
HDYD again...
I'm self-responding until I adresses the issue.
My smtp queue is not stalled.
Unreachable domains smtp or obsolete emails adress are bouncing eternaly
I configured the bounce handling very low ( 0.5 bounce rate +
immediately unsubscribe )
However it seems that qmail got stucked for 48 hours bouncing ( until I
clean the queue )
I thought that with such a sensitive bounce management setting, queue
had been cleaned automatically in less time...
Could someone please give me an advice on that?
thanks

From tyler at beloit.edu  Mon Feb 23 18:26:27 2009
From: tyler at beloit.edu (Tim Tyler)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 11:26:27 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] RECALL is creating infinite loop?
Message-ID: <026e01c995db$dbd537d0$937fa770$@edu>

Mailman experts,

 We are running Mailman version 2.1.10 on a Centos 5.2 system.  Recently a
user sent a RECALL command to one of our lists to retract a message.  This
seems to have created an infinite loop relating to bounces.

 

  For some reason something got corrupted, probably related to the Message
ID as shown from one of the log entries below:  

 

Feb 23 11:00:00 2009 (12635) forwarding unrecognized, message-id:
<!~!UENERkVCMDkAAQACALoAAAAAAAAAOKG7EAXlEBqhuwgAKypWwgAAbXNwc3QuZGxsAAAAAABO
SVRB+b+4AQCqADfZbgAAAABDADoAXABEAG8AYwB1AG0AZQBuAHQAcwAgAGEAbgBkACAAUwBlAHQA
dABpAG4AZwBzAFwAZABvAG0AawBlAGsAXABEAGUAcwBrAHQAbwBwAFwAMgAwADAANgAtADAANwBc
AE0AYQBpAGwAXABPAHUAdABsAG8AbwBrAC4AcABzAHQAAAAYAAAAAAAAADxQoBwV+EpCpSL/ibME
zfjCgAAAGAAAAAAAAAA8UKAcFfhKQqUi/4mzBM34RFBLAAAAAAAQAAAAmKK2hHaUmk2V0Gy86is0
y0IAAABbQU5OT1VOQ0VdIEJ1Y2NhbmVlciBXb21lbidzIFNvY2NlciBhbmQgU29mdGJhbGwgIktp
ZHMgTmlnaHQgT3V0IgA=@beloit.edu>

 

 

 

I get one of these bounce messages about every 10 minutes or so.    This is
not a pending message.  So what might be going wrong and how do I clean up
the list so that the request stops bouncing?  Is there some file I can empty
out?

 

 Tim Tyler

Network Engineer

Beloit College

 


From vidapura at eircom.net  Mon Feb 23 18:31:58 2009
From: vidapura at eircom.net (vidapura)
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:58 -0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] SMTP queue stalled
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009022309290905464d69b1eb@msapiro>
References: <49A27A07.4000404@free.Fr>
	<PC18702009022309290905464d69b1eb@msapiro>
Message-ID: <4DAA6F854D37442C91C48A18C21395E2@broadreachpj>

I sent a mail to this list yesterday but I don't hink it got anywhere...
Did anyone get THIS email?
Thanks
Vida


From brad at shub-internet.org  Tue Feb 24 09:35:19 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 02:35:19 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] SMTP queue stalled
In-Reply-To: <49A2D4F6.9080904@free.Fr>
References: <49A27A07.4000404@free.Fr> <49A2D4F6.9080904@free.Fr>
Message-ID: <49A3B147.209@shub-internet.org>

on 2/23/09 10:55 AM, S/U/N said:

> However it seems that qmail got stucked for 48 hours bouncing ( until I
> clean the queue )
> I thought that with such a sensitive bounce management setting, queue
> had been cleaned automatically in less time...
> Could someone please give me an advice on that?

If you have problems with qmail, you're most likely to get answers to 
your questions using their FAQs, asking for help on their mailing 
list(s), etc....

We will try to help you with any Mailman-specific problems there are, 
but most of us don't run or know anything about qmail.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From james at thereidsonline.com  Tue Feb 24 10:52:55 2009
From: james at thereidsonline.com (James Reid)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:52:55 +1100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Is it possible to delay messages?
In-Reply-To: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
References: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <008401c99665$ace2fc70$06a8f550$@com>

Hi Everyone,

I have a list that I ran for a number of years "un-moderated"

However, a few months ago the list went through a bit of turmoil, and as a
result I had to turn moderation "on".

The mere fact that the list is now moderated has acted as a deterrent to
those who were causing problems, and as a result the list is now running
smoothly again.

I'm also finding that moderating the list is taking up too much of my time
(even if it means simply approving messages to go out).

What I would like to now do is move to a sort of half-way ground of
permitting many members to send messages out un-moderated again.  However,
I'd like to give the impression that the list is still fully moderated by
creating an automated delay for all un-moderated subscribers (possibly even
2-3 hours, though a random interval would be even better) between when their
messages are received and when they are sent out to the list.

I'm using a combination of postfix and mailman... can anyone give me a
suggestion of how I could create a delay somewhere?

Thanks!
James.


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 24 16:40:42 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 07:40:42 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] RECALL is creating infinite loop?
In-Reply-To: <026e01c995db$dbd537d0$937fa770$@edu>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022407404205788511616c@msapiro>

Tim Tyler wrote:
>
> We are running Mailman version 2.1.10 on a Centos 5.2 system.  Recently a
>user sent a RECALL command to one of our lists to retract a message.  This
>seems to have created an infinite loop relating to bounces.
>
> 
>
>  For some reason something got corrupted, probably related to the Message
>ID as shown from one of the log entries below:  
>
> 
>
>Feb 23 11:00:00 2009 (12635) forwarding unrecognized, message-id:
><!~!UENERkVCMDkAAQACALoAAAAAAAAAOKG7EAXlEBqhuwgAKypWwgAAbXNwc3QuZGxsAAAAAABO
>SVRB+b+4AQCqADfZbgAAAABDADoAXABEAG8AYwB1AG0AZQBuAHQAcwAgAGEAbgBkACAAUwBlAHQA
>dABpAG4AZwBzAFwAZABvAG0AawBlAGsAXABEAGUAcwBrAHQAbwBwAFwAMgAwADAANgAtADAANwBc
>AE0AYQBpAGwAXABPAHUAdABsAG8AbwBrAC4AcABzAHQAAAAYAAAAAAAAADxQoBwV+EpCpSL/ibME
>zfjCgAAAGAAAAAAAAAA8UKAcFfhKQqUi/4mzBM34RFBLAAAAAAAQAAAAmKK2hHaUmk2V0Gy86is0
>y0IAAABbQU5OT1VOQ0VdIEJ1Y2NhbmVlciBXb21lbidzIFNvY2NlciBhbmQgU29mdGJhbGwgIktp
>ZHMgTmlnaHQgT3V0IgA=@beloit.edu>
>
> 
>
> 
>
> 
>
>I get one of these bounce messages about every 10 minutes or so.    This is
>not a pending message.  So what might be going wrong and how do I clean up
>the list so that the request stops bouncing?  Is there some file I can empty
>out?


Each one of these is a new message sent to the LISTNAM-bounces address
and forwarded to the list owner as an unrecognized bounce. I'm only
guessing, and this doesn't make much sense, but RECALL is an nntp
command so somehow some news server is repeatedly sending this command
to the list until it gets a response. Maybe it will eventually give up?

If this is really a loop involving Mailman, you could turn off
bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner, and that should stop it, but I
doubt this is the issue.

Check your MTA log and see where these messages are coming from.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 24 16:56:17 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 07:56:17 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Is it possible to delay messages?
In-Reply-To: <008401c99665$ace2fc70$06a8f550$@com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090224075617018785115fcc@msapiro>

James Reid wrote:
>
>What I would like to now do is move to a sort of half-way ground of
>permitting many members to send messages out un-moderated again.  However,
>I'd like to give the impression that the list is still fully moderated by
>creating an automated delay for all un-moderated subscribers (possibly even
>2-3 hours, though a random interval would be even better) between when their
>messages are received and when they are sent out to the list.
>
>I'm using a combination of postfix and mailman... can anyone give me a
>suggestion of how I could create a delay somewhere?


You'd have to do it in Postfix. Mailman has no facility for this. You
might for example be able to use header_checks to identify a message
to, but not from the list and HOLD it, and then run some periodic cron
that would release messages from the HOLD queue.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kjohnson at pcc.edu  Tue Feb 24 17:54:44 2009
From: kjohnson at pcc.edu (Kirke Johnson)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:54:44 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] RECALL is creating infinite loop?
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009022407404205788511616c@msapiro>
References: <026e01c995db$dbd537d0$937fa770$@edu>
	<PC18702009022407404205788511616c@msapiro>
Message-ID: <200902241654.n1OGsT87005110@mailout.pcc.edu>

Mark, I believe the RECALL command is an Outlook/Exchange horror that 
does not play well with many "normal" email systems.

http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA010917601033.aspx

At 07:40 AM 2/24/2009, you wrote:

>Each one of these is a new message sent to the LISTNAM-bounces address
>and forwarded to the list owner as an unrecognized bounce. I'm only
>guessing, and this doesn't make much sense, but RECALL is an nntp
>command so somehow some news server is repeatedly sending this command
>to the list until it gets a response. Maybe it will eventually give up?
>
>If this is really a loop involving Mailman, you could turn off
>bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner, and that should stop it, but I
>doubt this is the issue.
>
>Check your MTA log and see where these messages are coming from.
>
>--
>Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
>San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>
>------------------------------------------------------
>Mailman-Users mailing list
>Mailman-Users at python.org
>http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
>Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
>Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
>Unsubscribe: 
>http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/kjohnson%40pcc.edu
>
>Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Kirke Johnson                               Internet: kjohnson at pcc.edu
Email Administrator, TSS , Sylvania Campus      http://www.pcc.edu/
Portland Community College, Portland, OR, USA     (503) 977-4368 


From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 24 19:06:55 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:06:55 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] RECALL is creating infinite loop?
In-Reply-To: <200902241654.n1OGsT87005110@mailout.pcc.edu>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902241006550718cc6a0245@Notebook>

Kirke Johnson wrote:

>Mark, I believe the RECALL command is an Outlook/Exchange horror that 
>does not play well with many "normal" email systems.
>
>http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA010917601033.aspx


That makes much more sense. Thanks for the info.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From drew.tenenholz at isid.org  Tue Feb 24 19:45:39 2009
From: drew.tenenholz at isid.org (Drew Tenenholz)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:45:39 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble with moderator password
Message-ID: <p0624081fc5c9ee3b5b6a@[192.168.201.101]>

Guys --

Any idea on why I cannot seem to set/reset the moderator password for my list?

Running 2.1.11 on a Mac OS XServe (10.5.5) with which I had the help 
of a UNIX savvy person, documentation, and this list, to repackage 
the default Apple installation of mailman into a standard (and 
upgradable) installation a few weeks ago.

I was able to run the check_perms script (got a lot of errors about 
the archives & attachment folders) and fix them, but the problem 
seems to still persist.

Right now, I'm having to answer the moderation requests, since the 
list moderators cannot seem to login.  What are your ideas?

Sincerely,
Drew Tenenholz

P.S.  It seems to me that running /bin/change_pw is NOT what I want to do.

From mark at msapiro.net  Tue Feb 24 20:10:09 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:10:09 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Trouble with moderator password
In-Reply-To: <p0624081fc5c9ee3b5b6a@[192.168.201.101]>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902241110090765ff802046@Notebook>

Drew Tenenholz wrote:
>
>Any idea on why I cannot seem to set/reset the moderator password for my list?


Note that the moderator password can only be used to log in to the
admindb interface and not to the admin interface.

What happens if you go to the list admin passwords section and set a
new moderator password? does it work? What response do you get?


>P.S.  It seems to me that running /bin/change_pw is NOT what I want to do.


Correct. bin/change_pw changes only the list admin password, not the
moderator password.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From steve at marmot.org  Wed Feb 25 00:40:13 2009
From: steve at marmot.org (Steve Lindemann)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:40:13 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] can I resend new list creation welcome message?
Message-ID: <49A4855D.1020703@marmot.org>

I've had several occasions where list admins have "lost" the initial 
welcome message they received when I created a new list for them.  Is 
there a way to resend that new list created message?

I've reviewed the docs and searched the archives (and google) and if 
it's there I missed it.  Thanks!
-- 
Steve Lindemann                         __
Network Administrator                  //\\  ASCII Ribbon Campaign
Marmot Library Network, Inc.           \\//  against HTML/RTF email,
http://www.marmot.org                  //\\  vCards & M$ attachments
+1.970.242.3331 x116


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 25 01:46:07 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:46:07 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] can I resend new list creation welcome message?
In-Reply-To: <49A4855D.1020703@marmot.org>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902241646070203f4e48352@msapiro>

Steve Lindemann wrote:

>I've had several occasions where list admins have "lost" the initial 
>welcome message they received when I created a new list for them.  Is 
>there a way to resend that new list created message?


Mailman can't resend the list created email with the password. You can
recreate the mail or even make a script to do it from the newlist.txt
template, but you can't get the password because it's encrypted.

The following withlist script will resend the mail with a password of
"Not Available". The other difference between this and the original
mail is if there is now more than one owner, only the first owner in
the list will get the mail.

If, as I suspect, the real reason for wanting this is to inform the
owner of the password, this script could be modified to set a new list
admin password and report that. I'm not including that capability
below because the implementation depends on the Mailman version.


---------------------------------------------------------------------
"""Resend the list created mail for a list without the password.

Save this as bin/remail.py

Run via

bin/withlist -r remail LISTNAME
"""

from Mailman import Message
from Mailman import Utils
from Mailman.i18n import _
from Mailman.i18n import set_language

def remail(mlist):
    set_language(mlist.preferred_language)
    siteowner = Utils.get_site_email(mlist.host_name, 'owner')
    listname = mlist._internal_name
    owner = mlist.owner[0]
    text = Utils.maketext(
        'newlist.txt',
        {'listname'    : listname,
         'password'    : 'Not Available',
         'admin_url'   : mlist.GetScriptURL('admin', absolute=1),
         'listinfo_url': mlist.GetScriptURL('listinfo', absolute=1),
         'requestaddr' : mlist.GetRequestEmail(),
         'siteowner'   : siteowner,
         }, mlist=mlist)
    msg = Message.UserNotification(
        owner, siteowner,
        _('Your new mailing list: %(listname)s'),
        text, mlist.preferred_language)
    msg.send(mlist)
---------------------------------------------------------------------

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk  Wed Feb 25 04:37:54 2009
From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 03:37:54 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] can I resend new list creation welcome message?
In-Reply-To: <49A4855D.1020703@marmot.org>
References: <49A4855D.1020703@marmot.org>
Message-ID: <20090225033754.GC6339@amyl.org.uk>

(sending from my sub'd address this time)

On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 04:40:13PM -0700, Steve Lindemann wrote:
> I've had several occasions where list admins have "lost" the initial 
> welcome message they received when I created a new list for them.  Is 
> there a way to resend that new list created message?

Looks as though it's not directly possible (having seen Mark's post,
too), but a work-around might be to send the list-creation mails over
to (a) another list, so you can filch the mails from the archive, and
bounce on to -owner, (b) your own mail-system and bounce them along, (c)
save the passwords on a wiki/text-file or something else..

Or, if being moody: "you should have kept the mail, shouldn't you."

change_pw may also be of use. (which is what *I* tend to use)


-- 
``... a difficulty for every solution'' (Samuel, on the Civil Service)

From Ralf.Hildebrandt at charite.de  Wed Feb 25 07:33:39 2009
From: Ralf.Hildebrandt at charite.de (Ralf Hildebrandt)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 07:33:39 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] can I resend new list creation welcome message?
In-Reply-To: <49A4855D.1020703@marmot.org>
References: <49A4855D.1020703@marmot.org>
Message-ID: <20090225063339.GC10301@charite.de>

* Steve Lindemann <steve at marmot.org>:

> I've had several occasions where list admins have "lost" the initial  
> welcome message they received when I created a new list for them.  Is  
> there a way to resend that new list created message?

Welcome to the club. Awaiting the answer :)

-- 
Ralf Hildebrandt                                Ralf.Hildebrandt at charite.de
Charite - Universit?tsmedizin Berlin            Tel.  +49 (0)30-450 570-155
Gesch?ftsbereich IT | Abt. Netzwerk             Fax.  +49 (0)30-450 570-962
Hindenburgdamm 30 | 12200 Berlin

From brad at shub-internet.org  Wed Feb 25 18:24:42 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:24:42 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] can I resend new list creation welcome message?
In-Reply-To: <20090225063339.GC10301@charite.de>
References: <49A4855D.1020703@marmot.org> <20090225063339.GC10301@charite.de>
Message-ID: <49A57EDA.9080007@shub-internet.org>

Ralf Hildebrandt wrote:
> * Steve Lindemann <steve at marmot.org>:
> 
>> I've had several occasions where list admins have "lost" the initial  
>> welcome message they received when I created a new list for them.  Is  
>> there a way to resend that new list created message?
> 
> Welcome to the club. Awaiting the answer :)

Ironically, I've never had this problem.  I didn't even know it was a 
problem you could have.

I've had listowners forget their password and ask for a reset, which I did 
and gave the new password to them and told them to change it ASAP, but 
that's different.


It never once occurred to me that someone might want to re-send that 
original list creation message.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From steve at marmot.org  Wed Feb 25 19:29:57 2009
From: steve at marmot.org (Steve Lindemann)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:29:57 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] can I resend new list creation welcome message?
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902241646070203f4e48352@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902241646070203f4e48352@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A58E25.8000100@marmot.org>

Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Steve Lindemann wrote:
> 
>> I've had several occasions where list admins have "lost" the initial 
>> welcome message they received when I created a new list for them.  Is 
>> there a way to resend that new list created message?
> 
> Mailman can't resend the list created email with the password. You can
> recreate the mail or even make a script to do it from the newlist.txt
> template, but you can't get the password because it's encrypted.

Thank you Mark!  I don't really need the password in the message (nice 
to have, but not needed).  I can always deal with that separately if I 
have to.  Since most of the lists on my server only have one admin the 
other limitation shouldn't be an issue and I can always change which 
email address is listed first for the admin.  This will also be handy 
when the admin role for a list changes hands.
--
Steve Lindemann                         __
Network Administrator                  //\\  ASCII Ribbon Campaign
Marmot Library Network, Inc.           \\//  against HTML/RTF email,
http://www.marmot.org                  //\\  vCards & M$ attachments
+1.970.242.3331 x116




From khillo100 at hotmail.com  Wed Feb 25 23:06:43 2009
From: khillo100 at hotmail.com (Khalil Abbas)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 22:06:43 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce Score..
Message-ID: <COL105-W215BA8DA9373FE435012C4FBAC0@phx.gbl>


hello ..

 

how can I know what the current bouce score is for each of my members??

 

Thanks..

 

_________________________________________________________________
News, entertainment and everything you care about at Live.com. Get it now!
http://www.live.com/getstarted.aspx

From glueck at igroup.de  Tue Feb 24 15:35:03 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (Oliver Glueck)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:35:03 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
Message-ID: <49A40597.7020009@igroup.de>

Hello,

at first: sorry for my bad English, German is my preferred language and 
I'm not a
Linux guru.

I'm not sure about my malman installation.
I will show at first some facts:

- LAN: our LAN domain is "intern.company.de"
- the mail server in the LAN:  mail.intern.company.de
- on mail.intern.company.de is running open xchange on an UCS (unvention 
corporate server, a debian)

- our external domain is:  company.com  -> an email address is 
<name>@company.com
  and .. at company.de on the same server.

- the internal open xchange has so three mail domains : 
intern.company.de, company.com and company.de
- fetchmail is polling the emails from the external mail server

- mailman is installed on the open xchange server 'mail.intern.company.de'

My first mailing list is  (after mailman) 'about-dummy'.
And /etc/postfix/virtual contains:
about-dummy at company.com   about-dummy
about-dummy at company.de      about-dummy
about-dummy at intern.company.de   about-dummy

My first try to receive an email from an external address to this list 
is failed, because
I have to add 'about-dummy at localhost'  in  virtual. After this entry, 
the email
was received.
But why .. at localhost? I saw this in the log file, unknown mailbox 
about-dummy at localhost.

For mailman I have no Idea about virtual_alias or virtual domains.
Only these two lines
 IMAGE_LOGOS = '/icons/'
 MTA = 'Postfix'
I have added to mm_cfg.py. Is this ok?

And in postfix?
Here a short cutout from main.cf:
---snip---
myhostname = mail.intern.company.de
mydomain = intern.company.de
myorigin = /etc/mailname
smtp_helo_name = mail.intern.company.de
append_dot_mydomain = no
masquerade_domains = $mydomain
masquerade_exceptions = root
transport_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/transport, ldap:ldaptransport
mydestination = $myhostname.$mydomain, localhost.$mydomain, $mydomain, 
localhost, $transport_maps
mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8
relay_domains = $mydestination
relayhost = www.company.de
canonical_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/canonical
virtual_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/virtual, ldap:ldapgroups, 
ldap:ldapdistlist, ldap:ldapvirtual, ldap:ldapsharedfolderlocal
relocated_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/relocated
alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases,hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases
---snap--- and many LDAP entries from the open xchange installation.

Is main.cf ok?
I'm not sure.
How looks the right configuration files?

Many thanks and greeting
Oliver from Germany


From glueck at igroup.de  Wed Feb 25 15:25:52 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (Oliver Glueck)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 15:25:52 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why host_name and not domain?
Message-ID: <49A554F0.1030205@igroup.de>

Hello,

why I get as a subscriber a hostname and not an right email address?

I think, it is not good to answer with e.g.
"Willkommen auf der Mailingliste %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s!"
Why host_name??? host_name is not the domain! host_name is only
the FQDN of the Server, but no domain.

This welcome email to the subscriber is going out of our LAN
and the subscriber see the internal server name of mailman!!

And a mailing list isn't a 'name -at- Servername' but
'name -at- domain' !!

Not:  name at mail.intern.company.de
Right: name at company.com  !!

How can I configure mailman???

I need help.

Thanks a lot,
Oliver

From matt at nipltd.com  Wed Feb 25 10:36:28 2009
From: matt at nipltd.com (Matt Hoskins)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 09:36:28 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Backscatter spam via the "-request" address
Message-ID: <1235554588.23033.13.camel@matth.private.nipltd.com.private.nipltd.com>

Recently I've noticed spammers have started spamming the "-request"
address on a couple of mailing lists I host. I don't know if this is
deliberate or just they've somehow picked up the -request addresses via
address collection mechanisms.

Anyway the result is "The results of your email commands" mails going to
people who never sent a message to the list with a copy of the original
spam attached. From looking at the code I see that newer versions of
mailman than the one I'm running don't include the original message in
the response to help the backscatter problem (so I've hacked the code on
the copy I've got to do the same).

The lists I run aren't open to people subscribing themselves - they have
to be added by the list administrator. To that end there's no need on my
server for the "-request" auto responder to reply to non-members. So to
my mind the following two options on a per-list basis would be useful to
me:

  1) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply if
there were no valid commands included in the message (the spammers
aren't spamming with valid commands at the moment)
  2) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply to
non-members

There may be reasons why both those options are a bad idea or are
unworkable, but I thought I'd punt them out there in case anyone else
found them useful :).

Regards,
Matt



From pennguin at mac.com  Tue Feb 24 17:39:54 2009
From: pennguin at mac.com (Rob)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:39:54 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce messages to list moderator?
Message-ID: <129349B9-DC78-4536-ADD7-97D55E922460@mac.com>

We have an announce-only list (all members are moderated, moderated  
postings are rejected). There is a single list moderator and a single  
list administrator.

For an unknown reason, bounce messages are being sent to both the  
administrator and moderator e-mail addresses. This is not typical  
behavior for any of our other lists.

I've attached headers from a recent bounce below. Any advice on why  
this is happening is much appreciated.

-Rob

Return-Path: <mailman-bounces at acvr.org>
Received: from murder ([unix socket])
	 by acvr.org (Cyrus v2.3.8-OS X Server 10.5:	9C31) with LMTPA;
	 Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:09:31 -0500
X-Sieve: CMU Sieve 2.3
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
	by acvr.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4ED890212A
	for <treasurer at acvr.org>; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:09:30 -0500 (EST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at acvr.org
Received: from acvr.org ([127.0.0.1])
	by localhost (xserve.petrad.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024)
	with ESMTP id 3oNS6-ofbrCr for <treasurer at acvr.org>;
	Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:09:30 -0500 (EST)
Received: from xserve.petrad.com (localhost [127.0.0.1])
	by acvr.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0B38902093
	for <treasurer at acvr.org>; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:09:27 -0500 (EST)
X-Original-To: announcements-owner at acvr.org
Delivered-To: announcements-owner at acvr.org
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
	by acvr.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 422F6902049
	for <announcements-owner at acvr.org>;
	Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:09:26 -0500 (EST)
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Subject: Bounce action notification
From: mailman at acvr.org
To: announcements-owner at acvr.org
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1347886839=="
Message-ID: <mailman.17.1235491751.325.announcements at acvr.org>
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--===============1347886839==
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MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

This is a Mailman mailing list bounce action notice:

    List:       Announcements
    Member:     axonman at rad.usuhs.mil
    Action:     Subscription disabled.
    Reason:     Excessive or fatal bounces.



The triggering bounce notice is attached below.

Questions? Contact the Mailman site administrator at mailman at acvr.org.

--===============1347886839==
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This is a MIME-encapsulated message.

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This is the mail system at host acvr.org.

I'm sorry to have to inform you that your message could not
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For further assistance, please send mail to postmaster.

If you do so, please include this problem report. You can
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                   The mail system

<axonman at rad.usuhs.mil>: host rad.usuhs.edu[151.200.170.182] said: 554  
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denied



From pyz at brama.com  Wed Feb 25 13:53:30 2009
From: pyz at brama.com (Max Pyziur)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 07:53:30 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to open list admin page
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.60.0902250753120.27782@brama.com>



Greetings,

I've been using mailman since about 2004; currently, I am running version 
2.1.5. We have about ten different lists on our server.

Everything has been functioning well until today (quite a record).

We have one list with several thousand emails. We wanted to see if we could 
find and remove those email addresses that have gotten stale or invalid. 
Consequently, we adjusted the bounce processing settings.

Now, we can't log in to that particular list's admin page (all other lists do 
no have this problem). After typing the password and hitting enter, the web 
browser appears to be authenticating, but after an extensive period shows a 
message to the effect "Internal Server Error."

It seems that this would indicate some sort of corrupted file or data.

Any suggestions on how to remedy this?

Much thanks.

Max Pyziur
pyz at brama.com

From s.u.n at free.Fr  Tue Feb 24 10:21:18 2009
From: s.u.n at free.Fr (S/U/N)
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:21:18 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.12 final released.
In-Reply-To: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
References: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <49A3BC0E.9030303@free.Fr>

Champagne!

                        *
                         *
        *       *       []
         _*    *_       ||
        |*|    |*|     |* |
        |_|    |_|     |__|
        \*/    \*/     | *|
        _|_    _|_     |__|






Mark Sapiro a ?crit :
> I am happy to announce the final release of Mailman 2.1.12.
>
> Since 2.1.12rc2 there have been a few bug fixes, the Polish translation
> has been updated and a couple of items have been added to the contrib
> directory.
>
> Mailman 2.1.12 is a minor bug fix and Python 2.6 compatibility release.
>
> The minimum Python for this release is Python 2.4 and it is compatible
> with Python through 2.6. The previous Mailman releases are not
> compatible with Python 2.6.
>
> See the release notes at
> <https://sourceforge.net/project/shownotes.php?release_id=653108&group_id=103>
> for more details.
>
> Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
> e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
> SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.
>
> For more information, including download links, please see:
>
> http://www.list.org
> http://mailman.sf.net
> http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
>
------------------------------------------------------
Mailman-Users mailing list
Mailman-Users at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
Unsubscribe:
http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/s.u.n%40free.fr

Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9





From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 25 23:33:13 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 14:33:13 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce Score..
In-Reply-To: <COL105-W215BA8DA9373FE435012C4FBAC0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902251433130640c98a834d@msapiro>

Khalil Abbas wrote:
>
>how can I know what the current bouce score is for each of my members??


See <http://www.msapiro.net/scripts/get_bounce_info.py> (mirrored at
<http://fog.ccsf.edu/~msapiro/scripts/get_bounce_info.py>).

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 25 23:40:48 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 14:40:48 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce messages to list moderator?
In-Reply-To: <129349B9-DC78-4536-ADD7-97D55E922460@mac.com>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902251440480937a7208299@msapiro>

Rob wrote:
>
>For an unknown reason, bounce messages are being sent to both the  
>administrator and moderator e-mail addresses. This is not typical  
>behavior for any of our other lists.
>
>I've attached headers from a recent bounce below. Any advice on why  
>this is happening is much appreciated.


The message is the notification to the owners/moderators of a member
who's delivery is disabled by bounce. This notice is sent becaues
bounce_notify_owner_on_disable is set to Yes.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From brad at shub-internet.org  Wed Feb 25 23:48:46 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 16:48:46 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Backscatter spam via the "-request" address
In-Reply-To: <1235554588.23033.13.camel@matth.private.nipltd.com.private.nipltd.com>
References: <1235554588.23033.13.camel@matth.private.nipltd.com.private.nipltd.com>
Message-ID: <49A5CACE.7020007@shub-internet.org>

Matt Hoskins wrote:

> Recently I've noticed spammers have started spamming the "-request"
> address on a couple of mailing lists I host. I don't know if this is
> deliberate or just they've somehow picked up the -request addresses via
> address collection mechanisms.

They send lots of spam ot *-owner, *-request, postmaster, webmaster, etc.... 
  They know that these addresses exist on most sites, and will accept mail 
from most any address.  This drives up their deliverability numbers, so that 
they can claim that they deliver to billions of addresses per second, and 
sell their services to people than want to send spam.

It's a known problem, and it's never going to go away.  It's only ever going 
to get worse.

>   1) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply if
> there were no valid commands included in the message (the spammers
> aren't spamming with valid commands at the moment)

That sounds like a really good idea.

>   2) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply to
> non-members

Not so sure about this one, but it might also be an idea to consider.


However, I'm not a Mailman developer, so I can't really speak to how easy it 
would be to add such features.  That might be a discussion to have over on 
the mailman-developers list.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Wed Feb 25 23:52:57 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 14:52:57 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Unable to open list admin page
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.60.0902250753120.27782@brama.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090225145257010987a5ee66@msapiro>

Max Pyziur wrote:
>
>We have one list with several thousand emails. We wanted to see if we could 
>find and remove those email addresses that have gotten stale or invalid. 
>Consequently, we adjusted the bounce processing settings.
>
>Now, we can't log in to that particular list's admin page (all other lists do 
>no have this problem). After typing the password and hitting enter, the web 
>browser appears to be authenticating, but after an extensive period shows a 
>message to the effect "Internal Server Error."
>
>It seems that this would indicate some sort of corrupted file or data.


Can you go to the listinfo page for the list, or do you get the came
error?

What is the error message in the web server logs. If it is "premature
end of script headers", the CGI is timing out before issuing any
output.

The issue could be a corrupt lists/LISTNAME/config.pck, but I think it
is more likely a stale lock. See the FAQ at
<http://wiki.list.org/x/noA9>. If you find a stale lock, check
Mailman's locks and error logs for clues as to what may have caused
this.

Note that in 2.1.5, there is a potential issue with reducing
bounce_score_threshold in that cron/disabled doesn't check if bounce
info is stale so, e.g, if a member has stale bounce info with a score
of 3.0 and you reduce bounce_score_threshold from something greater
than 3 to something <= 3, the next time cron/disabled runs, that
member's delivery will be disabled. This was fixed in 2.1.10.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From brad at shub-internet.org  Wed Feb 25 23:53:17 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 16:53:17 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.12 final released.
In-Reply-To: <49A3BC0E.9030303@free.Fr>
References: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net> <49A3BC0E.9030303@free.Fr>
Message-ID: <49A5CBDD.3070007@shub-internet.org>

S/U/N wrote:

> Champagne!

I prefer Ch?teau d'Yquem.  Vintage 1811, SVP.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 00:01:09 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 15:01:09 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Backscatter spam via the "-request" address
In-Reply-To: <49A5CACE.7020007@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902251501090562129b41bb@msapiro>

Brad Knowles wrote:

>Matt Hoskins wrote:
>
>>   1) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply if
>> there were no valid commands included in the message (the spammers
>> aren't spamming with valid commands at the moment)
>
>That sounds like a really good idea.
>
>>   2) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply to
>> non-members
>
>Not so sure about this one, but it might also be an idea to consider.
>
>
>However, I'm not a Mailman developer, so I can't really speak to how easy it 
>would be to add such features.  That might be a discussion to have over on 
>the mailman-developers list.


Speaking as a developer, we are aware of the spam
reflection/backscatter issues with Mailman, and we want to address
them. Steps will be taken in Mailman 2.2 to at least reduce this
problem.

Thanks for your ideas, and as Brad suggests, if you want to follow up
on mailman-developers at python.org or submit further suggestions, we'd
be happy to get them.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 00:09:42 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 15:09:42 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why host_name and not domain?
In-Reply-To: <49A554F0.1030205@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902251509420968ccb81732@msapiro>

Oliver Glueck wrote:
>
>why I get as a subscriber a hostname and not an right email address?


Because your Mailman installation is misconfigured.


>I think, it is not good to answer with e.g.
>"Willkommen auf der Mailingliste %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s!"
>Why host_name??? host_name is not the domain! host_name is only
>the FQDN of the Server, but no domain.


host_name should be the email domain for this list. If it isn't, then
at least when the list was created, things like DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST
and/or the VIRTUAL_HOSTS dictionary were not properly configured.


>This welcome email to the subscriber is going out of our LAN
>and the subscriber see the internal server name of mailman!!
>
>And a mailing list isn't a 'name -at- Servername' but
>'name -at- domain' !!
>
>Not:  name at mail.intern.company.de
>Right: name at company.com  !!
>
>How can I configure mailman???


DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'the domain you want the world to see in web URLs'
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'company.com'
VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()
add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)

in mm_cfg.py.

Then restart mailman and run

bin/withlist -a -l -r fix_url

to fix your lists.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 00:28:51 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 15:28:51 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <49A40597.7020009@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902251528510609646ae794@msapiro>

Oliver Glueck wrote:
>
>I'm not sure about my malman installation.
>I will show at first some facts:
>
>- LAN: our LAN domain is "intern.company.de"
>- the mail server in the LAN:  mail.intern.company.de
>- on mail.intern.company.de is running open xchange on an UCS (unvention 
>corporate server, a debian)
>
>- our external domain is:  company.com  -> an email address is 
><name>@company.com
>  and .. at company.de on the same server.
>
>- the internal open xchange has so three mail domains : 
>intern.company.de, company.com and company.de
>- fetchmail is polling the emails from the external mail server
>
>- mailman is installed on the open xchange server 'mail.intern.company.de'
>
>My first mailing list is  (after mailman) 'about-dummy'.
>And /etc/postfix/virtual contains:
>about-dummy at company.com   about-dummy
>about-dummy at company.de      about-dummy
>about-dummy at intern.company.de   about-dummy


These things shouldn't be in /etc/postfix/virtual.


>My first try to receive an email from an external address to this list 
>is failed, because
>I have to add 'about-dummy at localhost'  in  virtual. After this entry, 
>the email
>was received.
>But why .. at localhost? I saw this in the log file, unknown mailbox 
>about-dummy at localhost.


This is not a Mailman issue. This is probably fetchmail that is
delivering the message to about-dummy at localhost.


>For mailman I have no Idea about virtual_alias or virtual domains.
>Only these two lines
> IMAGE_LOGOS = '/icons/'
> MTA = 'Postfix'
>I have added to mm_cfg.py. Is this ok?



With MTA = 'Postfix'. Mailman will maintain both aliases in
/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases and virtual maps (if necessary?) in
/usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman, but you have issues that will
probably preclude this from working.

If fetchmail is going to deliver to addresses like

LISTNAME at localhost
LISTNAME-bounces at localhost
etc,

and localhost is in mydestination as it appears to be, you only need
aliases and not virtual maps.

Thus both what you have in mm_cfg.py and what you have in main.cf looks
OK.


If you have mail being given to Postfix for LISTNAME at company.com, you
can add

POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['company.com']

in mm_cfg.py and, assuming the list's email domain is company.com (see
my reply to your other post), Mailman will generate virtual maps like

LISTNAME at company.com           LISTNAME
LISTNAME-bounces at company.com   LISTNAME-bounces
etc,

in /usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman and you need to add
hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman to virtual_maps in
main.cf.

If you actually need multiple domains for the same list in the virtual
maps, Mailman won't do that automatically.


>And in postfix?
>Here a short cutout from main.cf:
>---snip---
>myhostname = mail.intern.company.de
>mydomain = intern.company.de
>myorigin = /etc/mailname
>smtp_helo_name = mail.intern.company.de
>append_dot_mydomain = no
>masquerade_domains = $mydomain
>masquerade_exceptions = root
>transport_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/transport, ldap:ldaptransport
>mydestination = $myhostname.$mydomain, localhost.$mydomain, $mydomain, 
>localhost, $transport_maps
>mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8
>relay_domains = $mydestination
>relayhost = www.company.de
>canonical_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/canonical
>virtual_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/virtual, ldap:ldapgroups, 
>ldap:ldapdistlist, ldap:ldapvirtual, ldap:ldapsharedfolderlocal
>relocated_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/relocated
>alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases,hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
>alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases
>---snap--- and many LDAP entries from the open xchange installation.


-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 00:32:49 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 15:32:49 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.12 final released.
In-Reply-To: <49A3BC0E.9030303@free.Fr>
Message-ID: <PC187020090225153249070305ec61f0@msapiro>

S/U/N wrote:

>Champagne!
>
>                        *
>                         *
>        *       *       []
>         _*    *_       ||
>        |*|    |*|     |* |
>        |_|    |_|     |__|
>        \*/    \*/     | *|
>        _|_    _|_     |__|
>


Merci!

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 01:41:25 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 16:41:25 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce messages to list moderator?
In-Reply-To: <F354816D-633B-4272-9530-A8F82D1B2E64@mac.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090225164125056287a5f00b@msapiro>

Rob wrote:

>So, "owner" = "administrator(s)" & "moderators"? Can bounces be sent  
>only to the administrator? My list moderators don't need to get bounce  
>notices.


The list has attributes 'owner' and 'moderator', each of which is a
list of zero or more addresses, although having zero addresses in
'owner' is not a good idea.

Most owner notifications are actually sent to LISTNAME-owner which in
turn is resent to all the owner AND moderator addresses.

Some notices use the Message.OwnerNotification class directly which has
the ability to exclude moderators, but I think the only notice that
goes to owners only and not moderators is the forward of an
unrecognized bounce.

So the answer is if bounce_unrecognized_goes_to_list_owner is Yes,
those notices go only to the 'owner' addresses and not to 'moderator'
addresses, but the bounce_notify_owner_on_disable notices and the
bounce_notify_owner_on_removal notices go to both 'owner' and
'moderator' addresses and changing this would require source code
modifications.

Granted, the terminology, documentation and results are not consistent,
but that's the way it works.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kop at meme.com  Thu Feb 26 05:28:06 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 22:28:06 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
Message-ID: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo>

Hi,

I'm wondering if there's a way to set the address
that mailman binds to when sending SMTP.
Here's the background:

I'm using postfix as a MTA.  When postfix receives
mail containing addresses that have no @domain
part, and the mail is sent from the local box,
it automatically adds @whateverthelocaldomainis
to the end of all header and envelope addresses.

This causes a problem with mailman, because
mailman is sending mail from the local box
any addresses that come in without @domain
on the end (for whatever reason) gets rewritten
when mailman re-sends the mail to the list.

There's various ways around the problem,
ways to keep postfix from re-writing the addresses.
I think the simplest would be if I could
control the address from which mailman sends
it's mail, say if mailman binds to 127.0.0.2
instead of 127.0.0.1 when it sends it's mail.
But I don't see a knob I can frob to control
this.  (Postfix seems to prefer to base it's
address re-writing decision on the IP of
the SMTP client.)

At the moment I happen to be running
Debian etch, which has a 2.1 based
mailman version.  I soon hope to be
running something newer.

Thanks.


Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From brad at shub-internet.org  Thu Feb 26 06:07:46 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:07:46 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo>
References: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo>
Message-ID: <49A623A2.4060604@shub-internet.org>

on 2/25/09 10:28 PM, Karl O. Pinc said:

> This causes a problem with mailman, because
> mailman is sending mail from the local box
> any addresses that come in without @domain
> on the end (for whatever reason) gets rewritten
> when mailman re-sends the mail to the list.

This is a problem to fix in your MTA, before the message ever gets to 
Mailman.  Your MTA should be ensuring that all addresses are properly 
fully qualified, either when it reads the message from the sender, or 
after the sender has sent the message and it does internal processing.

This really isn't a problem that can be solved from within Mailman.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From kop at meme.com  Thu Feb 26 06:53:05 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 23:53:05 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <49A623A2.4060604@shub-internet.org> (from
	brad@shub-internet.org on Wed Feb 25 23:07:46 2009)
References: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo> <49A623A2.4060604@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <1235627585l.26018l.7l@mofo>


On 02/25/2009 11:07:46 PM, Brad Knowles wrote:
> on 2/25/09 10:28 PM, Karl O. Pinc said:
> 
>> This causes a problem with mailman, because
>> mailman is sending mail from the local box
>> any addresses that come in without @domain
>> on the end (for whatever reason) gets rewritten
>> when mailman re-sends the mail to the list.
> 
> This is a problem to fix in your MTA, before the message ever gets to  
> Mailman.  Your MTA should be ensuring that all addresses are properly  
> fully qualified, either when it reads the message from the sender, or  
> after the sender has sent the message and it does internal processing.
> 
> This really isn't a problem that can be solved from within Mailman.

I agree, but the problem is that an MTA shouldn't be re-writing
addresses in mail that it receives from external sources,
that is, the Internet.  Mail sent from a _local_ source
should be re-written by the MTA to be properly fully qualified.
So, I need to figure out how to pretend that mail re-sent
by Mailman is mail that is, effectively, from an external
source.   That means Mailman needs to do something different
so the MTA can distinguish the mail Mailman sends from "
regular" mail sent locally from the box.

Or do you think that an MTA should re-write all addresses
and fully qualify them with the local domain,
regardless of whether the mail was received from
the Internet for delivery to a local user?
I don't mean to put words in your mouth but that
seems to be the only alternative.

Somebody else out there is mis-behaving and I've
got to deal with the consequences.

It would be easiest to tell the Postfix MTA
that the mail that Mailman sends is not of local
origin if Mailman could be set to bind to a
particular IP when sending mail via SMTP.

Thanks for the reply.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From brad at shub-internet.org  Thu Feb 26 07:29:33 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 00:29:33 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <1235627585l.26018l.7l@mofo>
References: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo>	<49A623A2.4060604@shub-internet.org>
	<1235627585l.26018l.7l@mofo>
Message-ID: <49A636CD.500@shub-internet.org>

on 2/25/09 11:53 PM, Karl O. Pinc said:

> Or do you think that an MTA should re-write all addresses
> and fully qualify them with the local domain,
> regardless of whether the mail was received from
> the Internet for delivery to a local user?
> I don't mean to put words in your mouth but that
> seems to be the only alternative.

That's not the only solution to this problem, but most of the time it is 
the simplest and easiest to implement.  If you always use 
fully-qualified names across the board, then there can't ever be any 
question of whether or not something belongs in one place or another.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From kop at meme.com  Thu Feb 26 08:25:39 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 01:25:39 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <49A636CD.500@shub-internet.org> (from brad@shub-internet.org
	on Thu Feb 26 00:29:33 2009)
References: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo>
	<49A623A2.4060604@shub-internet.org> <1235627585l.26018l.7l@mofo>
	<49A636CD.500@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <1235633139l.26018l.8l@mofo>


On 02/26/2009 12:29:33 AM, Brad Knowles wrote:
> on 2/25/09 11:53 PM, Karl O. Pinc said:
> 
>> Or do you think that an MTA should re-write all addresses
>> and fully qualify them with the local domain,
>> regardless of whether the mail was received from
>> the Internet for delivery to a local user?
>> I don't mean to put words in your mouth but that
>> seems to be the only alternative.
> 
> That's not the only solution to this problem, but most of the time it  
> is the simplest and easiest to implement.  If you always use  
> fully-qualified names across the board, then there can't ever be any  
> question of whether or not something belongs in one place or another.

Tacking my domain name on somebody else's email address
puts it in the wrong place.  Better to leave it alone.
The Postfix author seem to agree.  Postfix has
changed so that the default is to rewrites only the mail sent
by local users.  For the rationale and further detail see:
http://www.postfix.org/ADDRESS_REWRITING_README.html#william

You are correct, there is no right answer.  I am able to
configure Postfis so that Mailman mail is not rewritten,
but it would be more straightforward if Mailman
had another knob to frob.  I will see what happens
and if there are too many problems then I'll
change the rewriting rules.

(I'd tend to favor bouncing such incoming email.  But
given the application that's not an option.)

Thank you for the input. It has been helpful.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

P.S.  FYI.  I'm pretty confidant it's Microsoft
software that's causing this headache, although
I couldn't say whether it's Outlook or Exchange.

From glueck at igroup.de  Thu Feb 26 12:50:43 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (Oliver Glueck)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 12:50:43 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902251528510609646ae794@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902251528510609646ae794@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A68213.9030501@igroup.de>

Hi Mark,

thanks.
I have done all changes, but If I sent an email to a list,
I get an error message, because 'user unknown':

Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: Nachricht 
about-dummy at www.company.de:1 von 1 wird gelesen (2783 Bytes) 
(Log-Meldung unvollst?ndig)
Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1 
<about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in 
local recipient table

Why??

How can tell the server mail, that about-dummy at localhost exists, without use
postfix/virtual?

Oliver


Mark Sapiro schrieb:
> Oliver Glueck wrote:
>   
>> I'm not sure about my malman installation.
>> I will show at first some facts:
>>
>> - LAN: our LAN domain is "intern.company.de"
>> - the mail server in the LAN:  mail.intern.company.de
>> - on mail.intern.company.de is running open xchange on an UCS (unvention 
>> corporate server, a debian)
>>
>> - our external domain is:  company.com  -> an email address is 
>> <name>@company.com
>>  and .. at company.de on the same server.
>>
>> - the internal open xchange has so three mail domains : 
>> intern.company.de, company.com and company.de
>> - fetchmail is polling the emails from the external mail server
>>
>> - mailman is installed on the open xchange server 'mail.intern.company.de'
>>
>> My first mailing list is  (after mailman) 'about-dummy'.
>> And /etc/postfix/virtual contains:
>> about-dummy at company.com   about-dummy
>> about-dummy at company.de      about-dummy
>> about-dummy at intern.company.de   about-dummy
>>     
>
>
> These things shouldn't be in /etc/postfix/virtual.
>
>
>   
>> My first try to receive an email from an external address to this list 
>> is failed, because
>> I have to add 'about-dummy at localhost'  in  virtual. After this entry, 
>> the email
>> was received.
>> But why .. at localhost? I saw this in the log file, unknown mailbox 
>> about-dummy at localhost.
>>     
>
>
> This is not a Mailman issue. This is probably fetchmail that is
> delivering the message to about-dummy at localhost.
>
>
>   
>> For mailman I have no Idea about virtual_alias or virtual domains.
>> Only these two lines
>> IMAGE_LOGOS = '/icons/'
>> MTA = 'Postfix'
>> I have added to mm_cfg.py. Is this ok?
>>     
>
>
>
> With MTA = 'Postfix'. Mailman will maintain both aliases in
> /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases and virtual maps (if necessary?) in
> /usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman, but you have issues that will
> probably preclude this from working.
>
> If fetchmail is going to deliver to addresses like
>
> LISTNAME at localhost
> LISTNAME-bounces at localhost
> etc,
>
> and localhost is in mydestination as it appears to be, you only need
> aliases and not virtual maps.
>
> Thus both what you have in mm_cfg.py and what you have in main.cf looks
> OK.
>
>
> If you have mail being given to Postfix for LISTNAME at company.com, you
> can add
>
> POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['company.com']
>
> in mm_cfg.py and, assuming the list's email domain is company.com (see
> my reply to your other post), Mailman will generate virtual maps like
>
> LISTNAME at company.com           LISTNAME
> LISTNAME-bounces at company.com   LISTNAME-bounces
> etc,
>
> in /usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman and you need to add
> hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman to virtual_maps in
> main.cf.
>
> If you actually need multiple domains for the same list in the virtual
> maps, Mailman won't do that automatically.
>
>
>   
>> And in postfix?
>> Here a short cutout from main.cf:
>> ---snip---
>> myhostname = mail.intern.company.de
>> mydomain = intern.company.de
>> myorigin = /etc/mailname
>> smtp_helo_name = mail.intern.company.de
>> append_dot_mydomain = no
>> masquerade_domains = $mydomain
>> masquerade_exceptions = root
>> transport_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/transport, ldap:ldaptransport
>> mydestination = $myhostname.$mydomain, localhost.$mydomain, $mydomain, 
>> localhost, $transport_maps
>> mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8
>> relay_domains = $mydestination
>> relayhost = www.company.de
>> canonical_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/canonical
>> virtual_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/virtual, ldap:ldapgroups, 
>> ldap:ldapdistlist, ldap:ldapvirtual, ldap:ldapsharedfolderlocal
>> relocated_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/relocated
>> alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases,hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
>> alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases
>> ---snap--- and many LDAP entries from the open xchange installation.
>>     
>
>
>   


From incib at itu.edu.tr  Thu Feb 26 13:48:57 2009
From: incib at itu.edu.tr (=?iso-8859-9?Q?Burcu_=DDnci?=)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 14:48:57 +0200
Subject: [Mailman-Users] give time between posts
Message-ID: <36B8BA36D6C81E40B04421644ACF26DA011C6667@cmiex1.cmi.itu.edu.tr>

Hi,

 

? have a list of about 30000 members and SMTP_MAX_RCPTS is set to 20 . i want to give some time between every 20 post of my lists so that i can slow down the post.can i have a chance to do this and give some time ?

 

Thanks,

 

Burcu ?nci


From brad at shub-internet.org  Thu Feb 26 15:04:28 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 08:04:28 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <1235633139l.26018l.8l@mofo>
References: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo>	<49A623A2.4060604@shub-internet.org>
	<1235627585l.26018l.7l@mofo>	<49A636CD.500@shub-internet.org>
	<1235633139l.26018l.8l@mofo>
Message-ID: <49A6A16C.4050006@shub-internet.org>

on 2/26/09 1:25 AM, Karl O. Pinc said:

> Tacking my domain name on somebody else's email address
> puts it in the wrong place.  Better to leave it alone.

If it's from some other domain, then it should already be fully 
qualified before you get it -- that's required by the RFCs.

You should reject all e-mail that is not fully qualified if it comes 
from a non-local machine or domain.  Then you can safely add the local 
domain to any unqualified addresses that remain.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From brad at shub-internet.org  Thu Feb 26 15:06:12 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 08:06:12 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] give time between posts
In-Reply-To: <36B8BA36D6C81E40B04421644ACF26DA011C6667@cmiex1.cmi.itu.edu.tr>
References: <36B8BA36D6C81E40B04421644ACF26DA011C6667@cmiex1.cmi.itu.edu.tr>
Message-ID: <49A6A1D4.6040604@shub-internet.org>

on 2/26/09 6:48 AM, Burcu ?nci said:

> ? have a list of about 30000 members and SMTP_MAX_RCPTS is set to 20
> . i want to give some time between every 20 post of my lists so that
> i can slow down the post.can i have a chance to do this and give some
> time ?

Go to the FAQ Wiki at 
<http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Frequently+Asked+Questions> and search 
for "rate limit".

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From georgebannerman at gmail.com  Wed Feb 25 23:29:57 2009
From: georgebannerman at gmail.com (george bannerman)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 17:29:57 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tricky admin_immed_notify problem
Message-ID: <2393b4e00902251429r2a0af135xa8658fa641f7d94d@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all--

I've got a tricky problem on my mailman server.  Right now, I have
admin_immed_notify set to yes, but I'm not getting notifications when there
are emails to approve.  I'm also not getting the once-a-day "# list
moderator request(s) waiting" either.  "Forward messages (individually) to:"
doesn't work.  They all mysteriously stopped last Friday.

I'm running Exim version 4.50 #1, Mailman 2.1.5,  Python 2.3.5, and Linux
version 2.6.16.13-xenU (Red Hat 4.0.2-8 running on Xen).

I rebooted the server ("have you tried turning it off and turning it on
again?") and the restarted the exim daemon and ran check_perms, to no avail.

I can email listname-owner (and it goes through), I can send email from the
server, and list emails go out to the lists just fine.  It only appears to
be the administrator notifications and the forward messages individually to
that are affected.

I looked at FAQ 4.73:

http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/4.73+How+do+I+debug+smtp-failure+problems+-+delivery+to+user-example.com+failed+with+code+-1-+and+Low+level+smtp+error-

I can telnet into my SMTP port and send mail.
I looked at the MTA logs and they seem fine.  (They're below.)
I'm not running Python 2.4, so I can't do the error log trick

I looked at FAQ 6.14:

http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030722

I don't get any errors when I run the two python scripts interactively as
the mailman user.

Here's what I'm getting in /var/lib/mailman/logs/smtp-failure:

Feb 25 13:54:52 2009 (1052) delivery to administrator at example.com failed
with code -1: Connection unexpectedly closed
Feb 25 14:32:49 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
refused'), msgid: <msgid at list.example.com>
Feb 25 14:32:49 2009 (1052) delivery to administrator at example.com failed
with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
Feb 25 14:34:02 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
refused'), msgid: <msgid at www.example.org>
Feb 25 14:34:02 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: please run connect()
first, msgid: <msgid at www.example.org>
--
Feb 25 14:35:55 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
refused'), msgid: <msgid at list.example.com>
Feb 25 14:35:55 2009 (1052) delivery to administrator at example.com failed
with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')

Here's what's in /var/log/exim4/mainlog:

2009-02-25 17:17:10 1LcS3p-0003iA-Ek =>
administrator at example.comR=dnslookup T=remote_smtp H=
ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com [209.85.217.8]
2009-02-25 17:17:10 1LcS3p-0003iA-Ek Completed
2009-02-25 17:17:24 1LcS46-0003iH-Cj =>
administrator at example.comR=dnslookup T=remote_smtp H=
ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com [209.85.217.8]
2009-02-25 17:17:24 1LcS46-0003iH-Cj Completed

(These are for a different message, but are representative.)

There doesn't seem to be anything in rejectlog.

I've tried changing the list administrator to a different email address by a
different provider, but that doesn't seem to change anything.

Help?

Best,

george

From georgebannerman at gmail.com  Thu Feb 26 00:50:21 2009
From: georgebannerman at gmail.com (george bannerman)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 18:50:21 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tricky admin_immed_notify problem
In-Reply-To: <2393b4e00902251429r2a0af135xa8658fa641f7d94d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <2393b4e00902251429r2a0af135xa8658fa641f7d94d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2393b4e00902251550p693f247fi6f4fa1be9158c6c3@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all--

Ummm... strangely, this appears to be working again.  Not sure why, but I'm
happy!

george

On Wed, Feb 25, 2009 at 5:29 PM, george bannerman <georgebannerman at gmail.com
> wrote:

> Hi all--
>
> I've got a tricky problem on my mailman server.  Right now, I have
> admin_immed_notify set to yes, but I'm not getting notifications when there
> are emails to approve.  I'm also not getting the once-a-day "# list
> moderator request(s) waiting" either.  "Forward messages (individually) to:"
> doesn't work.  They all mysteriously stopped last Friday.
>
> I'm running Exim version 4.50 #1, Mailman 2.1.5,  Python 2.3.5, and Linux
> version 2.6.16.13-xenU (Red Hat 4.0.2-8 running on Xen).
>
> I rebooted the server ("have you tried turning it off and turning it on
> again?") and the restarted the exim daemon and ran check_perms, to no avail.
>
> I can email listname-owner (and it goes through), I can send email from the
> server, and list emails go out to the lists just fine.  It only appears to
> be the administrator notifications and the forward messages individually to
> that are affected.
>
> I looked at FAQ 4.73:
>
>
> http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/4.73+How+do+I+debug+smtp-failure+problems+-+delivery+to+user-example.com+failed+with+code+-1-+and+Low+level+smtp+error-
>
> I can telnet into my SMTP port and send mail.
> I looked at the MTA logs and they seem fine.  (They're below.)
> I'm not running Python 2.4, so I can't do the error log trick
>
> I looked at FAQ 6.14:
>
> http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030722
>
> I don't get any errors when I run the two python scripts interactively as
> the mailman user.
>
> Here's what I'm getting in /var/lib/mailman/logs/smtp-failure:
>
> Feb 25 13:54:52 2009 (1052) delivery to administrator at example.com failed
> with code -1: Connection unexpectedly closed
> Feb 25 14:32:49 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
> refused'), msgid: <msgid at list.example.com>
> Feb 25 14:32:49 2009 (1052) delivery to administrator at example.com failed
> with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
> Feb 25 14:34:02 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
> refused'), msgid: <msgid at www.example.org>
> Feb 25 14:34:02 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: please run connect()
> first, msgid: <msgid at www.example.org>
> --
> Feb 25 14:35:55 2009 (1052) Low level smtp error: (111, 'Connection
> refused'), msgid: <msgid at list.example.com>
> Feb 25 14:35:55 2009 (1052) delivery to administrator at example.com failed
> with code -1: (111, 'Connection refused')
>
> Here's what's in /var/log/exim4/mainlog:
>
> 2009-02-25 17:17:10 1LcS3p-0003iA-Ek => administrator at example.comR=dnslookup T=remote_smtp H=
> ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com [209.85.217.8]
> 2009-02-25 17:17:10 1LcS3p-0003iA-Ek Completed
> 2009-02-25 17:17:24 1LcS46-0003iH-Cj => administrator at example.comR=dnslookup T=remote_smtp H=
> ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com [209.85.217.8]
> 2009-02-25 17:17:24 1LcS46-0003iH-Cj Completed
>
> (These are for a different message, but are representative.)
>
> There doesn't seem to be anything in rejectlog.
>
> I've tried changing the list administrator to a different email address by
> a different provider, but that doesn't seem to change anything.
>
> Help?
>
> Best,
>
> george
>

From pennguin at mac.com  Thu Feb 26 00:05:13 2009
From: pennguin at mac.com (Rob)
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 18:05:13 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bounce messages to list moderator?
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902251440480937a7208299@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902251440480937a7208299@msapiro>
Message-ID: <F354816D-633B-4272-9530-A8F82D1B2E64@mac.com>

So, "owner" = "administrator(s)" & "moderators"? Can bounces be sent  
only to the administrator? My list moderators don't need to get bounce  
notices.

Thanks,

-Rob


On Feb 25, 2009, at 5:40 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> Rob wrote:
>>
>> For an unknown reason, bounce messages are being sent to both the
>> administrator and moderator e-mail addresses. This is not typical
>> behavior for any of our other lists.
>>
>> I've attached headers from a recent bounce below. Any advice on why
>> this is happening is much appreciated.
>
>
> The message is the notification to the owners/moderators of a member
> who's delivery is disabled by bounce. This notice is sent becaues
> bounce_notify_owner_on_disable is set to Yes.
>
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>


From sysadmin at ettimadai.amrita.edu  Thu Feb 26 13:15:40 2009
From: sysadmin at ettimadai.amrita.edu (amritasysadmin)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 04:15:40 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users]  Mailman max_size_limit not working
Message-ID: <22199507.post@talk.nabble.com>


I have a Mailman 2.1.9 installation on RHEL v5

I have a list with max_size_limit set to 1.  However, the mails which are
more than 1KB also gets held for approval.  Mailman is not rejecting the
mails which are over 1KB.

Can you please help ?

Sree
-- 
View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Mailman-max_size_limit-not-working-tp22199507p22199507.html
Sent from the Mailman - Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 16:13:51 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 07:13:51 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <1235622486l.26018l.4l@mofo>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022607135105006b967867@msapiro>

Karl O. Pinc wrote:
>
>There's various ways around the problem,
>ways to keep postfix from re-writing the addresses.
>I think the simplest would be if I could
>control the address from which mailman sends
>it's mail, say if mailman binds to 127.0.0.2
>instead of 127.0.0.1 when it sends it's mail.
>But I don't see a knob I can frob to control
>this.


SMTPHOST and SMTPPORT in mm_cfg.py.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 16:27:44 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 07:27:44 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <49A68213.9030501@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022607274406871b30f91b@msapiro>

Oliver Glueck wrote:
>
>thanks.
>I have done all changes, but If I sent an email to a list,
>I get an error message, because 'user unknown':
>
>Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: Nachricht
>about-dummy at www.company.de:1 von 1 wird gelesen (2783 Bytes)
>(Log-Meldung unvollst?ndig)
>Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1
><about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in
>local recipient table
>
>Why??
>
>How can tell the server mail, that about-dummy at localhost exists, without use
>postfix/virtual?


It looks like fetchmail is trying to deliver to Postfix and Postfix is
replying

550 5.1.1 <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User
unknown in local recipient table


This has nothing to do with virtual maps because it is looking locally
for the address. It says there is no local alias for about-dummy.

Have you reloaded Postfix since you added
hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases to alias_maps in main.cf?

Are the aliases actually in /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases and is
/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases.db up to date? If not, try running
Mailman's bin/genaliases.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 16:40:51 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 07:40:51 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman max_size_limit not working
In-Reply-To: <22199507.post@talk.nabble.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090226074051001589473002@msapiro>

amritasysadmin wrote:
>
>I have a list with max_size_limit set to 1.  However, the mails which are
>more than 1KB also gets held for approval.  Mailman is not rejecting the
>mails which are over 1KB.


And it's not supposed to. Messages which exceed max_message_size (not
max_size_limit) are held, not discarded or rejected.

Also, if for example, the message is a post from a moderated member,
the message will be dealt with according to member_moderation_action
regardless of how big it is because membership and moderation are
considered before the various miscellaneous holds.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From brad at shub-internet.org  Thu Feb 26 16:41:40 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 09:41:40 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009022607135105006b967867@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009022607135105006b967867@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A6B834.5070104@shub-internet.org>

Mark Sapiro wrote:

> SMTPHOST and SMTPPORT in mm_cfg.py.

That controls where you send to, but not what address Mailman binds to when 
it sends to that host/port.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 16:52:52 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 07:52:52 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <49A6B834.5070104@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902260752520250894730ee@msapiro>

Brad Knowles wrote:

>Mark Sapiro wrote:
>
>> SMTPHOST and SMTPPORT in mm_cfg.py.
>
>That controls where you send to, but not what address Mailman binds to when 
>it sends to that host/port.


Right. I misread the OP. It said "I think the simplest would be if I
could control the address from which mailman sends it's mail, say if
mailman binds to 127.0.0.2 instead of 127.0.0.1 when it sends it's
mail."

I read that as "... control the address to which mailman sends ...",
thinking  that Karl would then change Postfix behavior based on the IP
the mail arrives at.

However, I too am puzzled as to why there are unqualified non-local
addresses to deal with at all.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kop at meme.com  Thu Feb 26 17:45:20 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:45:20 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <49A6B834.5070104@shub-internet.org> (from
	brad@shub-internet.org on Thu Feb 26 09:41:40 2009)
References: <PC18702009022607135105006b967867@msapiro>
	<49A6B834.5070104@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <1235666720l.30728l.0l@mofo>


On 02/26/2009 09:41:40 AM, Brad Knowles wrote:
> Mark Sapiro wrote:
> 
>> SMTPHOST and SMTPPORT in mm_cfg.py.
> 
> That controls where you send to, but not what address Mailman binds  
> to when it sends to that host/port.

As it turns out I set SMTPHOST to 127.0.0.2, and instead of
the usual smtp line in /etc/postfix/master.cf I've these 3 lines:


mypublicip:smtp   inet  n       -       -       -       -       smtpd
127.0.0.1:smtp      inet  n       -       -       -       -       smtpd
127.0.0.2:smtp      inet  n       -       -       -       -       smtpd  
-o
local_header_rewrite_clients=permit_tls_clientcerts -o  
relay_clientcerts=

The latter prevents address rewriting by requiring tls
authentication for rewriting and then preventing any
such authentication.

This is clunky.  Postfix is much happier when such
"bad" address rewriting is triggered by the client's
IP.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From kop at meme.com  Thu Feb 26 17:47:56 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:47:56 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Setting a bind address for SMTP delivery
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902260752520250894730ee@msapiro> (from
	mark@msapiro.net on Thu Feb 26 09:52:52 2009)
References: <49A6B834.5070104@shub-internet.org>
	<PC1870200902260752520250894730ee@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1235666876l.30728l.1l@mofo>


On 02/26/2009 09:52:52 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> 
> However, I too am puzzled as to why there are unqualified non-local
> addresses to deal with at all.

Because the whole point of this particular application
of mailman is to receive and distribute mail from
a system over which I have no control that
is breaking the rules.

A Microsoft based system wouldn't you know.


Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From glueck at igroup.de  Thu Feb 26 18:01:49 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (Oliver Glueck)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:01:49 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009022607274406871b30f91b@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009022607274406871b30f91b@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A6CAFD.6000204@igroup.de>



Mark Sapiro schrieb:
> Oliver Glueck wrote:
>   
>> thanks.
>> I have done all changes, but If I sent an email to a list,
>> I get an error message, because 'user unknown':
>>
>> Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: Nachricht
>> about-dummy at www.company.de:1 von 1 wird gelesen (2783 Bytes)
>> (Log-Meldung unvollst?ndig)
>> Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1
>> <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in
>> local recipient table
>>
>> Why??
>>
>> How can tell the server mail, that about-dummy at localhost exists, without use
>> postfix/virtual?
>>     
>
>
> It looks like fetchmail is trying to deliver to Postfix and Postfix is
> replying
>
> 550 5.1.1 <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User
> unknown in local recipient table
>
>
> This has nothing to do with virtual maps because it is looking locally
> for the address. It says there is no local alias for about-dummy.
>
> Have you reloaded Postfix since you added
> hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases to alias_maps in main.cf?
>   
Yes. And actually make a reboot!
> Are the aliases actually in /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases and is
> /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases.db up to date? If not, try running
> Mailman's bin/genaliases.
>   
I've done this!
How have to look the mailman/data/aliases ?
I have this entries:
...
# STANZA START: mailman
# CREATED: Thu Feb 26 16:55:35 2009
mailman:             "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
mailman-admin:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
mailman-bounces:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
mailman-confirm:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
mailman-join:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
mailman-leave:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
mailman-owner:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
mailman-request:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
mailman-subscribe:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"
mailman-unsubscribe: "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mailman"
# STANZA END: mailman

# STANZA START: about-dummy
# CREATED: Thu Feb 26 16:55:35 2009
about-dummy:             "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post about-dummy"
about-dummy-admin:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin 
about-dummy"
about-dummy-bounces:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces 
about-dummy"
about-dummy-confirm:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm 
about-dummy"
about-dummy-join:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join about-dummy"
about-dummy-leave:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave 
about-dummy"
about-dummy-owner:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner 
about-dummy"
about-dummy-request:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request 
about-dummy"
about-dummy-subscribe:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe 
about-dummy"
about-dummy-unsubscribe: "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe 
about-dummy"
# STANZA END: about-dummy

:-/ It dosn't work.
Perhaps, the open xchange configuration makes problems? But open xchange 
is here not
the mailing list - who has open xchange AND mailman installed?

Oliver


From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 18:17:06 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 09:17:06 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <49A6CAFD.6000204@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022609170609060482f150@msapiro>

Oliver Glueck wrote:
>
>Mark Sapiro schrieb:
>>
>> It looks like fetchmail is trying to deliver to Postfix and Postfix is
>> replying
>>
>> 550 5.1.1 <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User
>> unknown in local recipient table
>>
>>
>> This has nothing to do with virtual maps because it is looking locally
>> for the address. It says there is no local alias for about-dummy.
>>
>> Have you reloaded Postfix since you added
>> hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases to alias_maps in main.cf?
>> 
>Yes. And actually make a reboot!


OK.


>> Are the aliases actually in /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases and is
>> /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases.db up to date? If not, try running
>> Mailman's bin/genaliases.
>>
>I've done this!
>How have to look the mailman/data/aliases ?
>I have this entries:
>...
># STANZA START: mailman
># CREATED: Thu Feb 26 16:55:35 2009
>mailman:             "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
>mailman-admin:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
>mailman-bounces:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
>mailman-confirm:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
>mailman-join:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
>mailman-leave:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
>mailman-owner:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
>mailman-request:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
>mailman-subscribe:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"=
>
>mailman-unsubscribe: "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mailma=
>n"
># STANZA END: mailman
>
># STANZA START: about-dummy
># CREATED: Thu Feb 26 16:55:35 2009
>about-dummy:             "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post about-dum=
>my"
>about-dummy-admin:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin=20
>about-dummy"
>about-dummy-bounces:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces=20
>about-dummy"
>about-dummy-confirm:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm=20
>about-dummy"
>about-dummy-join:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join about-dum=
>my"
>about-dummy-leave:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave=20
>about-dummy"
>about-dummy-owner:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner=20
>about-dummy"
>about-dummy-request:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request=20
>about-dummy"
>about-dummy-subscribe:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe=20
>about-dummy"
>about-dummy-unsubscribe: "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe=20
>about-dummy"
># STANZA END: about-dummy
>
>:-/ It dosn't work.


What are ownership and permissions of /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
and /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases.db?

What are the Postfix log entries corresponding to the 

Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1
<about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in
local recipient table

fetchmail entry?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From glueck at igroup.de  Thu Feb 26 18:41:53 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (Oliver Glueck)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:41:53 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009022609170609060482f150@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009022609170609060482f150@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A6D461.7090505@igroup.de>



Mark Sapiro schrieb:
> Oliver Glueck wrote:
>   
>> Mark Sapiro schrieb:
>>     
>>> It looks like fetchmail is trying to deliver to Postfix and Postfix is
>>> replying
>>>
>>> 550 5.1.1 <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User
>>> unknown in local recipient table
>>>
>>>
>>> This has nothing to do with virtual maps because it is looking locally
>>> for the address. It says there is no local alias for about-dummy.
>>>
>>> Have you reloaded Postfix since you added
>>> hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/aliases to alias_maps in main.cf?
>>>
>>>       
>> Yes. And actually make a reboot!
>>     
>
>
> OK.
>
>
>   
>>> Are the aliases actually in /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases and is
>>> /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases.db up to date? If not, try running
>>> Mailman's bin/genaliases.
>>>
>>>       
>> I've done this!
>> How have to look the mailman/data/aliases ?
>> I have this entries:
>> ...
>> # STANZA START: mailman
>> # CREATED: Thu Feb 26 16:55:35 2009
>> mailman:             "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
>> mailman-admin:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
>> mailman-bounces:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
>> mailman-confirm:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
>> mailman-join:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
>> mailman-leave:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
>> mailman-owner:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
>> mailman-request:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
>> mailman-subscribe:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"=
>>
>> mailman-unsubscribe: "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mailma=
>> n"
>> # STANZA END: mailman
>>
>> # STANZA START: about-dummy
>> # CREATED: Thu Feb 26 16:55:35 2009
>> about-dummy:             "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post about-dum=
>> my"
>> about-dummy-admin:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin=20
>> about-dummy"
>> about-dummy-bounces:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces=20
>> about-dummy"
>> about-dummy-confirm:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm=20
>> about-dummy"
>> about-dummy-join:        "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join about-dum=
>> my"
>> about-dummy-leave:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave=20
>> about-dummy"
>> about-dummy-owner:       "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner=20
>> about-dummy"
>> about-dummy-request:     "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request=20
>> about-dummy"
>> about-dummy-subscribe:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe=20
>> about-dummy"
>> about-dummy-unsubscribe: "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe=20
>> about-dummy"
>> # STANZA END: about-dummy
>>
>> :-/ It dosn't work.
>>     
>
>
> What are ownership and permissions of /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
> and /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases.db?
>   
-rw-rw----  1 mailman mailman  1973 2009-02-26 18:05 aliases
-rw-rw----  1 mailman mailman 12288 2009-02-26 18:05 aliases.db
> What are the Postfix log entries corresponding to the 
>
> Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1
> <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in
> local recipient table
>
> fetchmail entry?
>
>   
/var/log/mail.err :
Feb 26 18:20:01 mail fetchmail[32117]: Nachricht 
about-dummy at company.com@www.company.de:1 von 1 wird gelesen (2126 Bytes) 
(Log-Meldung unvollst?ndig)
Feb 26 18:20:01 mail fetchmail[32117]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1 
<about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in 
local recipient table

/var/log/mail.log :
Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: accepted connection
Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: lmtp connection preauth'd as 
postman
Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: 
verify_user(mail.intern.company.de!user.administrator) failed: Mailbox 
does not exist
Feb 26 18:20:02 mail postfix/lmtp[32529]: 56B0B97C2A0: 
to=<administrator at mail.intern.company.de>, 
relay=mail.intern.company.de[/var/run/cyrus/socket/lmtp], delay=0.28, 
delays=0.13/0.01/0.05/0.09, dsn=5.1.1, status=bounced (host 
mail.intern.company.de[/var/run/cyrus/socket/lmtp] said: 550-Mailbox 
unknown.  Either there is no mailbox associated with this 550-name or 
you do not have authorization to see it. 550 5.1.1 User unknown (in 
reply to RCPT TO command))

/etc/fetchmailrc:
set postmaster "Administrator"
set bouncemail
set no spambounce
set properties ""
set daemon 180
 poll www.company.de with proto POP3
  user "about-dummy at company.com"   there with password "secret" is 
"about-dummy" here ;

Here I tried
about-dummy / is here about-dummy
about-dummy / is here about-dummy at testingtech.com
-> same error.

*grmpf*
and now?

Bye
Oliver



From mark at msapiro.net  Thu Feb 26 19:00:30 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:00:30 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <49A6D461.7090505@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <PC187020090226100030092146a67177@msapiro>

Oliver Glueck wrote:
>
>Mark Sapiro schrieb:
>>
>> What are the Postfix log entries corresponding to the 
>>
>> Feb 26 12:37:13 mail fetchmail[6236]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1
>> <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in
>> local recipient table
>>
>> fetchmail entry?
>>
>>   
>/var/log/mail.err :
>Feb 26 18:20:01 mail fetchmail[32117]: Nachricht 
>about-dummy at company.com@www.company.de:1 von 1 wird gelesen (2126 Bytes) 
>(Log-Meldung unvollst?ndig)
>Feb 26 18:20:01 mail fetchmail[32117]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1 
><about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in 
>local recipient table


Presumably this message results from fetchmail's attempt to deliver the
mail via SMTP to port 25 on the fetchmail machine, but I see nothing
in the Postfix log that relates to this delivery. Either you're not
showing it to me or fetchmail isn't delivering via this path.

Note that the cyrus and postfix entries below are from an attempt to
deliver to administrator at mail.intern.company.de, not to
about-dummy at localhost. Also, fetchmail is reporting the failure at
18:20:01, so any postfix log entries related to this should be at that
time or earlier, not at 18:20:02.


>/var/log/mail.log :
>Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: accepted connection
>Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: lmtp connection preauth'd as 
>postman
>Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: 
>verify_user(mail.intern.company.de!user.administrator) failed: Mailbox 
>does not exist
>Feb 26 18:20:02 mail postfix/lmtp[32529]: 56B0B97C2A0: 
>to=<administrator at mail.intern.company.de>, 
>relay=mail.intern.company.de[/var/run/cyrus/socket/lmtp], delay=0.28, 
>delays=0.13/0.01/0.05/0.09, dsn=5.1.1, status=bounced (host 
>mail.intern.company.de[/var/run/cyrus/socket/lmtp] said: 550-Mailbox 
>unknown.  Either there is no mailbox associated with this 550-name or 
>you do not have authorization to see it. 550 5.1.1 User unknown (in 
>reply to RCPT TO command))
>
>/etc/fetchmailrc:
>set postmaster "Administrator"
>set bouncemail
>set no spambounce
>set properties ""
>set daemon 180
> poll www.company.de with proto POP3
>  user "about-dummy at company.com"   there with password "secret" is 
>"about-dummy" here ;
>
>Here I tried
>about-dummy / is here about-dummy
>about-dummy / is here about-dummy at testingtech.com
>-> same error.
>
>*grmpf*
>and now?
>
>Bye
>Oliver
>

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kop at meme.com  Fri Feb 27 00:19:33 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 17:19:33 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090226100030092146a67177@msapiro> (from
	mark@msapiro.net on Thu Feb 26 12:00:30 2009)
References: <49A6D461.7090505@igroup.de>
	<PC187020090226100030092146a67177@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1235690373l.26566l.0l@mofo>

Oliver Glueck's first post has the right config parameter,
but it still wouldn't hurt to verify what postfix
think's it's alias maps are:

# postconf | grep ^alias_maps
alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases              
hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/aliases

Likewise, in the "verify assumptions" category, it
would not hurt to see that postmap has the alias
entry:

# postmap -q about-dummy hash:/var/lib/mailman/data/aliases
"|/var/lib/mailman/mail/mailman post about-dummy"

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From savoy at uleth.ca  Fri Feb 27 00:31:38 2009
From: savoy at uleth.ca (Savoy, Jim)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:31:38 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tricky admin_immed_notify problem
In-Reply-To: <2393b4e00902251429r2a0af135xa8658fa641f7d94d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <2393b4e00902251429r2a0af135xa8658fa641f7d94d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <366860B666E21241A76B26156DC56E0BD42A97@EXCHCL2.uleth.ca>

>George Bannerman wrote:

>I've got a tricky problem on my mailman server.  Right now, I have
admin_immed_notify set to yes, but I'm not getting notifications when
there
are emails to approve.  I'm also not getting the once-a-day "# list
moderator request(s) waiting" either.  "Forward messages (individually)
to:"
doesn't work.  They all mysteriously stopped last Friday.

>I'm running Exim version 4.50 #1, Mailman 2.1.5,  Python 2.3.5, and
Linux
version 2.6.16.13-xenU (Red Hat 4.0.2-8 running on Xen).


Reading this reminded me that I have a similar problem. All of our lists
are set by default to be admin_immed_notify=yes, but the list owners
only
get a message when something new arrives (that is put on hold). They
never
get a daily reminder about the queued-up stuff. Is this a known problem
for
v2.1.5 (we will be upgrading to v2.1.12 this summer). I have no idea how
long
this has been going on, and only remembered it because I own one of the
lists
and realized that I only get the one warning.

Thanks!

PS Our set-up:

RedHat Enterprise Linux AS release 4 (Nahant Update 6)
Python 2.3
Exim 4.69
Mailman v2.1.5




From johnj at external.umass.edu  Thu Feb 26 19:11:42 2009
From: johnj at external.umass.edu (John Jackson)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:11:42 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.61.0902261153430.18847@blueman>

Hi All:

Me:

  Solaris 10
  Postfix 2.4.6
  Mailman 2.1.12rc2
  Python 2.4.4
  postfix-to-mailman-2.1.py

I have: (2) domain names for the same host, of the form:

   namexxx.department.domain.tld (has an A and MX record)
   nameyyy.department.domain.tld (has a CNAME and MX record)

What I originally hoped for was to host some Mailman lists on my server 
and still have a handful of user accounts on the server be able to receive 
email directly.  Both the lists and the local users would have the same 
email address after the @, like so:

      listone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
      listtwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld

      userone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
      usertwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld

After studying things for a while it seemed clear that maybe Mailman is 
not supposed to do that, and that I'd need to add a level to the domain 
name for Mailman to take over for it's lists, like this?

      listone at lists.namexxx.department.domain.tld
              ^^^^^
      userone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
      usertwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld

But...

..adding that additional level ('lists') puts me at five levels.  I'm 
trying to keep things as simple looking as can for my users.  So, I 
thought what I could do instead is create a second host name for Mailman 
to use, like this:

      listone at nameyyy.department.domain.tld
      listtwo at nameyyy.department.domain.tld

      userone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
      usertwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld

My 'pain' is coming from frustration and confusion trying to learn Postfix 
and Mailman well enough to figure out whether I can do any of this or not.

I've been mucking around in the configs of both and trying to follow 
examples and suggestions in the documentation and from information found 
by sifting through them Internets with Google ;)

Do any of you have a take on it you would be kind enough to share with me? 
Thanks very much, for any/all help or advice, comments, etc.

-John

_________________________________________________________________________
Home: 413-549-7524   Work: 413-545-4326   Cell: 413-530-5445  Amherst, MA
Email: johnj at external.umass.edu  Web: http://www.umass.edu/rso/outingclub

From mccannam at videotron.ca  Thu Feb 26 18:57:25 2009
From: mccannam at videotron.ca (Mark McCanna)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 12:57:25 -0500
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscribe results page - problem editing html
Message-ID: <02f201c9983b$ae8f0230$6400a8c0@POE>

Hi, I am setting up a mailing list with mailman version 2.1.11.cp3 and I am having some difficulty changing the html on the;

Subscribe results page

At the end of the page I want to add links to go back to a page;

<a href="www.lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/members/news.html">Back to News</a>

But mailman changes the link when you click on it and sends them to the page below, which doesn't exist.

http://lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/mailman/subscribe/www.lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/members/news.html


So the user gets an error.

I did read the documentation and I searched the FAQ. I found something about it in 2002 but the archive only shows the question and not the answer and I couldn't go back to earlier messages beyond 2008.

My ISP doesn't know the answer and have directed me here. 

Really sorry if this has been answered 5000 times but I can't find the answer.

thanks for any help. Mark


From brad at shub-internet.org  Fri Feb 27 01:01:34 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:01:34 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscribe results page - problem editing html
In-Reply-To: <02f201c9983b$ae8f0230$6400a8c0@POE>
References: <02f201c9983b$ae8f0230$6400a8c0@POE>
Message-ID: <49A72D5E.6030004@shub-internet.org>

Mark McCanna wrote:

> Hi, I am setting up a mailing list with mailman version 2.1.11.cp3 and I
> am having some difficulty changing the html on the;

First off, you're using cPanel.  See FAQ 6.11 at 
<http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Mailman+and+CPanel>.


Second, Mailman scrubs all stuff that you type in via the web interface, so 
that you don't get any security violations as a result of stuff accidentally 
being misinterpreted as HTML.  Not all HTML is scrubbed out, but certain 
parts of HTML are.  So, there are some things you just can't customize from 
the web interface.

If you had privileged access to the shell on the machine where the list was 
hosted, you could go in and copy the appropriate template file to a suitable 
location and then edit it with a text editor (like "vi", "emacs", or 
"pico"), and save that file with all your HTML stuff intact.

However, since you're using CPanel, you almost certainly don't have access 
to the command-line on that server.  In that case, you'll need to talk to 
the CPanel administrators of that system and see if you can get their help 
to do what you need.

If you do have privileged access to the command-line shell on that system, 
then search the archives and the FAQ wiki for "template".

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 01:02:19 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:02:19 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Tricky admin_immed_notify problem
In-Reply-To: <366860B666E21241A76B26156DC56E0BD42A97@EXCHCL2.uleth.ca>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902261602190640381d97d3@msapiro>

Savoy, Jim wrote:
>
>Reading this reminded me that I have a similar problem. All of our lists
>are set by default to be admin_immed_notify=yes, but the list owners
>only
>get a message when something new arrives (that is put on hold). They
>never
>get a daily reminder about the queued-up stuff. Is this a known problem
>for
>v2.1.5 (we will be upgrading to v2.1.12 this summer). I have no idea how
>long
>this has been going on, and only remembered it because I own one of the
>lists
>and realized that I only get the one warning.


The daily summary is sent by cron/checkdbs.

Does mailman have a crontab? Does it have an entry to run cron/checkdbs
daily? Is crond running?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk  Fri Feb 27 01:01:39 2009
From: adam-mailman at amyl.org.uk (Adam McGreggor)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 00:01:39 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscribe results page - problem editing html
In-Reply-To: <02f201c9983b$ae8f0230$6400a8c0@POE>
References: <02f201c9983b$ae8f0230$6400a8c0@POE>
Message-ID: <20090227000138.GO6339@amyl.org.uk>

On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 12:57:25PM -0500, Mark McCanna wrote:
> Hi, I am setting up a mailing list with mailman version 2.1.11.cp3 and I am having some difficulty changing the html on the;
> 
> Subscribe results page
> 
> At the end of the page I want to add links to go back to a page;
> 
> <a href="www.lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/members/news.html">Back to News</a>
         ^^^^^^ 
Therein lies your problem:

  - <a href="www.lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/members/news.html">Back to News</a>
  + <a href="http://www.lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/members/news.html">Back to News</a>

HTML aspect, not Mailman.

-- 
``Large increases in cost with questionable increases in performance
  can be tolerated only in racehorses and fancy women.'' (Lord Kelvin)

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 01:05:50 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:05:50 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Subscribe results page - problem editing html
In-Reply-To: <02f201c9983b$ae8f0230$6400a8c0@POE>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902261605500609381d97d3@msapiro>

Mark McCanna wrote:

>Hi, I am setting up a mailing list with mailman version 2.1.11.cp3 and I am having some difficulty changing the html on the;
>
>Subscribe results page
>
>At the end of the page I want to add links to go back to a page;
>
><a href="www.lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/members/news.html">Back to News</a>


Try making this an absolute rather than a relative URL. I.e.
<a
href="http://www.lakeshorechamberorchestra.ca/members/news.html">Back
to News</a>

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 01:15:41 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:15:41 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.61.0902261153430.18847@blueman>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022616154102658cbab572@msapiro>

John Jackson 
>
>  Solaris 10
>  Postfix 2.4.6
>  Mailman 2.1.12rc2
>  Python 2.4.4
>  postfix-to-mailman-2.1.py


Don't use postfix-to-mailman-2.1.py. There is no need, and it just
makes your situation more complex.


>I have: (2) domain names for the same host, of the form:
>
>   namexxx.department.domain.tld (has an A and MX record)
>   nameyyy.department.domain.tld (has a CNAME and MX record)
>
>What I originally hoped for was to host some Mailman lists on my server 
>and still have a handful of user accounts on the server be able to receive 
>email directly.  Both the lists and the local users would have the same 
>email address after the @, like so:
>
>      listone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
>      listtwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld
>
>      userone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
>      usertwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld


No problem.


<snip>


The whole point of postfix_to_mailman is to avoid requiring aliases,
but this doesn't work if you have both lists and local users in the
same domain. Mailman has a pretty good facility for automatically
maintaining list aliases for Postfix. See
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node13.html> for how to set it
up. That's all you need to do.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From brad at shub-internet.org  Fri Feb 27 01:17:33 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:17:33 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.61.0902261153430.18847@blueman>
References: <Pine.GSO.4.61.0902261153430.18847@blueman>
Message-ID: <49A7311D.4010606@shub-internet.org>

John Jackson wrote:

> I have: (2) domain names for the same host, of the form:
> 
>   namexxx.department.domain.tld (has an A and MX record)
>   nameyyy.department.domain.tld (has a CNAME and MX record)

First off, you can't mix CNAMEs and MX records.  That is prohibited by the 
RFCs, and most nameservers will refuse to load the entire zone if there is a 
single error like this.

Moreover, with regards to mail, things don't work as you would expect with 
CNAMEs.  Host names get re-written and all.

With regards to mail, you really, really need to stick to just pure A and MX 
records.  You can have some TXT or other info records, but for the basic 
types of records, stick to just A and MX.

> What I originally hoped for was to host some Mailman lists on my server 
> and still have a handful of user accounts on the server be able to 
> receive email directly.  Both the lists and the local users would have 
> the same email address after the @, like so:
> 
>      listone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
>      listtwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld
> 
>      userone at namexxx.department.domain.tld
>      usertwo at namexxx.department.domain.tld

You can do that, but I don't think you can do it with 
postfix-to-mailman-2.1.py.  Take a look at the installation instructions at 
<http://www.list.org/mailman-install/>, especially the postfix-specific 
stuff at <http://www.list.org/mailman-install/node12.html>.

> My 'pain' is coming from frustration and confusion trying to learn 
> Postfix and Mailman well enough to figure out whether I can do any of 
> this or not.

Both Mailman and postfix have online documentation (see 
<http://www.list.org/docs.html/> and 
<http://www.postfix.org/documentation.html>, respectively), as well as FAQs 
(see <http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Frequently+Asked+Questions> and 
<http://www.postfix.org/docs.html>, respectively).

We also have an overall wiki page at <http://wiki.list.org/>, and a 
documents section underneath that (see <http://wiki.list.org/display/DOC/Home>).

Both groups also have mailing lists to support their software (see 
<http://www.list.org/lists.html> and <http://www.postfix.org/lists.html>, 
respectively).  You can find out how to search our archives via the 
instructions in FAQ 1.18 at 
<http://wiki.list.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=4030520>, and there are 
links to the searchable archives of the postfix-* mailing lists at that same 
URL listed above.

> I've been mucking around in the configs of both and trying to follow 
> examples and suggestions in the documentation and from information found 
> by sifting through them Internets with Google ;)

These are the primary places to search, and we try to provide good links to 
other documents that we find online that have helpful information.

However, when you're dealing with two different pieces of software and 
trying to figure out how you can interface them, it can be difficult to get 
enough documentation in single place.  I find that I learn mostly by 
trial-and-error, with various documents sitting in front of me.

> Do any of you have a take on it you would be kind enough to share with 
> me? Thanks very much, for any/all help or advice, comments, etc.

I think the problem is that there is too much documentation, and it's hard 
to know where to start.  I believe the term is "information overload".


Anyway, if you've got any questions that are not answered by the various 
sources listed above, please feel free to come back and tell us what you've 
searched for and what you've found so far, and what your problems are. 
We'll try to provide whatever help we can.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From hammond at txcorp.com  Fri Feb 27 01:25:59 2009
From: hammond at txcorp.com (Anne M. Hammond)
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 17:25:59 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] one list not sending to members
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0902261635540.30059@volt.txcorp.com>

I recently created a list with 20 members, but the list is not
sending out to the members.

Other lists on this server are working fine.  This is mailman 2.1.9.

I stopped OutgoingRunner with SIGTERM, sent a post and posted a message
to the list, and dumped the database;

[root at ice httpd]# /usr/lib/mailman/bin/dumpdb 
/var/lib/mailman/lists/extremeintegration/pending.pck
[----- start pickle file -----]
<----- start object 1 ----->
{   '01a907bef54583bc21f0e71251a6c9d4487b9b84': ('H', 1),
     '46199d354ea07e1ae152d9351a2b2d0426011528': ('H', 3),
     'e57f046e3de424b7f2baf780da63e1f1a1d08880': ('H', 2),
     'evictions': {   '01a907bef54583bc21f0e71251a6c9d4487b9b84': 
1235939067.2983739,
                      '46199d354ea07e1ae152d9351a2b2d0426011528': 
1235950453.2800391,
                      'e57f046e3de424b7f2baf780da63e1f1a1d08880': 
1235947591.233825},
     'version': 2}
[----- end pickle file -----]

So I don't see anything here that is pending.

The list is not moderated.  All email should be sent automatically
to the 20 members.



From glueck at igroup.de  Fri Feb 27 09:51:51 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (Oliver Glueck)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 09:51:51 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090226100030092146a67177@msapiro>
References: <PC187020090226100030092146a67177@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A7A9A7.2070007@igroup.de>

ok, here comes some log files, attached as logs-about-dummy.txt

The entry with user.administrator mailbox does not exists...I have changed
in fetchmailrc the set postmaster to 'set postmaster "oxadmin"'

I think, the problem is open xchange: I don't know, where I have to
configure the special files. Not really.

In /etc/postfix/main.cf you can read:
# Warning: This file is auto-generated and might be overwritten by
#          univention-config-registry.
#          Please edit the files in the following directory instead:
# Warnung: Diese Datei wurde automatisch generiert und kann durch
#          univention-config-registry ueberschrieben werden.
#          Bitte bearbeiten Sie an Stelle dessen die Dateien in
#          folgendem Verzeichnis:
#
#       /etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/master.cf.d

But the name of the folder 
"/etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/master.cf.d"
is not clear, because I will edit the main.cf, not master..
The content of /etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/master.cf.d :
ls -al /etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/master.cf.d
insgesamt 20
drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2009-02-26 17:05 .
drwxr-xr-x 5 root root 4096 2009-02-26 12:01 ..
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 3263 2008-11-03 14:21 10_services
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1035 2008-11-08 01:51 30_antivir
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1091 2008-11-03 14:21 60_ox

And /etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/main.cf.d/ :
ls -al /etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/main.cf.d/
insgesamt 32
drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2009-02-27 08:53 .
drwxr-xr-x 5 root root 4096 2009-02-26 12:01 ..
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 3167 2008-11-03 14:21 10_general
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root  403 2009-02-26 12:10 30_maps
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 2939 2008-11-03 14:21 40_ldap
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root  200 2008-11-03 14:21 50_ox
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root  625 2008-11-03 14:21 60_tls
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root  531 2009-02-26 12:12 80_delivery

In 30_maps I have add the alias_maps....but it doesn't work
and the same result is, If I add this in etc/postfix/main.cf

Sorry for the long log file.
But I need help :-(
Remember: If I add entries about-dummy at ....in postfix/virtual,
it works! But I don't have to do it so.

@Karl:
postconf..don't show me the mailman aliases, only the default.
(with configured 30_maps in 
/etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/main.cf.d/
After I added this lines in postfix/main.cf postconf shows me the
right entry, but it doesn't work.

Oliver

Mark Sapiro schrieb:
> ...
>
>
> Presumably this message results from fetchmail's attempt to deliver the
> mail via SMTP to port 25 on the fetchmail machine, but I see nothing
> in the Postfix log that relates to this delivery. Either you're not
> showing it to me or fetchmail isn't delivering via this path.
>
> Note that the cyrus and postfix entries below are from an attempt to
> deliver to administrator at mail.intern.company.de, not to
> about-dummy at localhost. Also, fetchmail is reporting the failure at
> 18:20:01, so any postfix log entries related to this should be at that
> time or earlier, not at 18:20:02.
>
>
>   
>> /var/log/mail.log :
>> Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: accepted connection
>> Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: lmtp connection preauth'd as 
>> postman
>> Feb 26 18:20:02 mail cyrus/lmtpunix[32530]: 
>> verify_user(mail.intern.company.de!user.administrator) failed: Mailbox 
>> does not exist
>> Feb 26 18:20:02 mail postfix/lmtp[32529]: 56B0B97C2A0: 
>> to=<administrator at mail.intern.company.de>, 
>> relay=mail.intern.company.de[/var/run/cyrus/socket/lmtp], delay=0.28, 
>> delays=0.13/0.01/0.05/0.09, dsn=5.1.1, status=bounced (host 
>> mail.intern.company.de[/var/run/cyrus/socket/lmtp] said: 550-Mailbox 
>> unknown.  Either there is no mailbox associated with this 550-name or 
>> you do not have authorization to see it. 550 5.1.1 User unknown (in 
>> reply to RCPT TO command))
>>
>> /etc/fetchmailrc:
>> set postmaster "Administrator"
>> set bouncemail
>> set no spambounce
>> set properties ""
>> set daemon 180
>> poll www.company.de with proto POP3
>>  user "about-dummy at company.com"   there with password "secret" is 
>> "about-dummy" here ;
>>
>> Here I tried
>> about-dummy / is here about-dummy
>> about-dummy / is here about-dummy at testingtech.com
>> -> same error.
>>
>> *grmpf*
>> and now?
>>
>> Bye
>> Oliver
>>
>>     
>
>   
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From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 16:21:55 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 07:21:55 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] one list not sending to members
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0902261635540.30059@volt.txcorp.com>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022707215506401b153737@msapiro>

Anne M. Hammond wrote:

>I recently created a list with 20 members, but the list is not
>sending out to the members.
>
>Other lists on this server are working fine.  This is mailman 2.1.9.
>
>I stopped OutgoingRunner with SIGTERM, sent a post and posted a message
>to the list, and dumped the database;
>
>[root at ice httpd]# /usr/lib/mailman/bin/dumpdb 
>/var/lib/mailman/lists/extremeintegration/pending.pck
>[----- start pickle file -----]
><----- start object 1 ----->
>{   '01a907bef54583bc21f0e71251a6c9d4487b9b84': ('H', 1),
>     '46199d354ea07e1ae152d9351a2b2d0426011528': ('H', 3),
>     'e57f046e3de424b7f2baf780da63e1f1a1d08880': ('H', 2),
>     'evictions': {   '01a907bef54583bc21f0e71251a6c9d4487b9b84': 
>1235939067.2983739,
>                      '46199d354ea07e1ae152d9351a2b2d0426011528': 
>1235950453.2800391,
>                      'e57f046e3de424b7f2baf780da63e1f1a1d08880': 
>1235947591.233825},
>     'version': 2}
>[----- end pickle file -----]
>
>So I don't see anything here that is pending.


The pending.pck database has nothing to do with a post that might be
delivered except that OutgoingRunner is not running. Such a post would
be an entry in qfiles/out/. pending.pck is information about various
requests like subscriptions, held messages, etc. that are waiting
confirmation. The three entries above are three held messages. You can
find these messages in data/heldmsg-extremeintegration-nnn.pck files
and in the admindb interface for the extremeintegration list.

Do the posts get archived?

What's in Mailman's vette log?

What's in the list's admindb interface?

The FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/A4E9> may help.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 17:14:32 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 08:14:32 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <49A7A9A7.2070007@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022708143208437223062b@msapiro>

Oliver Glueck wrote:

>I think, the problem is open xchange: I don't know, where I have to
>configure the special files. Not really.


Could be. But, these are not Mailman questions, and while I do know
something about Postfix and a bit about fetchmail and can try to help
with that, These questions might better be answered elsewhere.


<snip>
>Sorry for the long log file.
>But I need help :-(
>Remember: If I add entries about-dummy at ....in postfix/virtual,
>it works! But I don't have to do it so.

>Feb 27 08:48:07 mail postfix/smtpd[31884]: connect from localhost[127.0.0.1]
>Feb 27 08:48:07 mail postfix/smtpd[31884]: NOQUEUE: reject: RCPT from localhost[127.0.0.1]: 550 5.1.1 <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in local recipient table; from=glueck at company.com> to=<about-dummy at localhost> proto=ESMTP helo=<mail.intern.company.de>


OK. Here Postfix has received the connect from fetchmail and rejected
the mail for <about-dummy at localhost> because "User unknown in local
recipient table".


>Feb 27 08:48:07 mail fetchmail[32117]: Nachricht about-dummy at company.com@www.company.de:1 von 1 wird gelesen (2791 Bytes) (Log-Meldung unvollst?ndig)
>Feb 27 08:48:07 mail fetchmail[32117]: SMTP-Fehler: 550 5.1.1 <about-dummy at localhost>: Recipient address rejected: User unknown in local recipient table


And here fetchmail reports the reject.

You say if you have entries for about-dummy at ... in postfix/virtual, it
works. Do these look like

about-dummy at localhost  about-dummy


If so, it appears that without this, Postfix is not treating
about-dummy at localhost as the local address about-dummy, even though it
says it's looking for a local recipient.

You could try telling fetchmail

user "about-dummy at company.com"   there with password "secret" is
"about-dummy at company.com" here ;

Then you could put

POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['company.com']

in mm_cfg.py to make Mailman-Postfix integration create virtual-mailman
with entries like

about-dummy at company.com   about-dummy

Then you also add hash:/usr/local/mailman/data/virtual-mailman to
virtual_alias_maps and company.com to virtual_alias_domains in main.cf.

Either that, or perhaps you can make fetchmail deliver to just
about-dummy instead of about-dummy at localhost.

I don't really understand why it isn't working as it is if Postfix is
actually seeing the Mailman aliases. 

You could try putting a

about-dummy:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post about-dummy"

alias in /etc/aliases and running "newaliases" and see if that works.
It probably won't "work", but it may deliver to Mailman and return a
group mismatch error. If so, then postfix is not seeing the Mailman
aliases in usr/local/mailman/data/aliases(.db) for some reason.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From glueck at igroup.de  Fri Feb 27 17:24:23 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (Oliver Glueck)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 17:24:23 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why host_name and not domain?
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902251509420968ccb81732@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902251509420968ccb81732@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A813B7.70104@igroup.de>

I want to edit the list and create a new list over the
webinterface.
But I can't see the "list admin overview page"! I see no lists!
No 'mailman' and no 'about-dummy'.

Why I cant see the list? (After I tried to send and deliver emails
over the list.)

Before I changed the configuration (see bottom and inline),
the webinterface works fine. And all lists I have seen.

And:
If I create a new list, I get the message:
"Error: Unknown virtual host: mail.intern.company.de"

Oops!?!?!? Whats now wrong?

Oh, I see a new email abot the problem :-) ...

Mark Sapiro schrieb:
> Oliver Glueck wrote:
>   
>> why I get as a subscriber a hostname and not an right email address?
>>     
>
>
> Because your Mailman installation is misconfigured.
>
>
>   
>> I think, it is not good to answer with e.g.
>> "Willkommen auf der Mailingliste %(real_name)s@%(host_name)s!"
>> Why host_name??? host_name is not the domain! host_name is only
>> the FQDN of the Server, but no domain.
>>     
>
>
> host_name should be the email domain for this list. If it isn't, then
> at least when the list was created, things like DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST
> and/or the VIRTUAL_HOSTS dictionary were not properly configured.
>
>
>   
>> This welcome email to the subscriber is going out of our LAN
>> and the subscriber see the internal server name of mailman!!
>>
>> And a mailing list isn't a 'name -at- Servername' but
>> 'name -at- domain' !!
>>
>> Not:  name at mail.intern.company.de
>> Right: name at company.com  !!
>>
>> How can I configure mailman???
>>     
>
>
> DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'the domain you want the world to see in web URLs'
> DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'company.com'
> VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()
> add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
>
> in mm_cfg.py.
>
> Then restart mailman and run
>
> bin/withlist -a -l -r fix_url
>
> to fix your lists.
>
>   

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 17:32:14 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 08:32:14 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why host_name and not domain?
In-Reply-To: <49A813B7.70104@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902270832140156433a6e6a@msapiro>

Oliver Glueck wrote:

>I want to edit the list and create a new list over the
>webinterface.
>But I can't see the "list admin overview page"! I see no lists!
>No 'mailman' and no 'about-dummy'.
>
>Why I cant see the list? (After I tried to send and deliver emails
>over the list.)
>
>Before I changed the configuration (see bottom and inline),
>the webinterface works fine. And all lists I have seen.
>
>And:
>If I create a new list, I get the message:
>"Error: Unknown virtual host: mail.intern.company.de"


See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/lYA9>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From kop at meme.com  Fri Feb 27 18:00:15 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:00:15 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] mailman installation and domains - confused
In-Reply-To: <49A7A9A7.2070007@igroup.de> (from glueck@igroup.de on Fri Feb
	27 02:51:51 2009)
References: <PC187020090226100030092146a67177@msapiro>
	<49A7A9A7.2070007@igroup.de>
Message-ID: <1235754015l.5760l.0l@mofo>


On 02/27/2009 02:51:51 AM, Oliver Glueck wrote:
> @Karl:
> postconf..don't show me the mailman aliases, only the default.
> (with configured 30_maps in  
> /etc/univention/templates/files/etc/postfix/main.cf.d/
> After I added this lines in postfix/main.cf postconf shows me the
> right entry, but it doesn't work.

So the next step is using postmap -q to check that the
entry has gotten into the hash db.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From kop at meme.com  Fri Feb 27 18:10:12 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:10:12 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <49A7311D.4010606@shub-internet.org> (from
	brad@shub-internet.org on Thu Feb 26 18:17:33 2009)
References: <Pine.GSO.4.61.0902261153430.18847@blueman>
	<49A7311D.4010606@shub-internet.org>
Message-ID: <1235754612l.5760l.1l@mofo>


On 02/26/2009 06:17:33 PM, Brad Knowles wrote:


> I think the problem is that there is too much documentation, and it's  
> hard to know where to start.  I believe the term is "information  
> overload".

I don't suppose there's an IRC channel related to mailman?
I sometimes find that the low latency of IRC makes it a lot
easier to clear up my mis-conceptions and set me
on track to reading the right docs and so forth.
I used to use mailing lists exclusively but
now think that chat has it's place.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 18:21:30 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 09:21:30 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <1235754612l.5760l.1l@mofo>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902270921300609fca9823f@msapiro>

Karl O. Pinc wrote:
>
>I don't suppose there's an IRC channel related to mailman?


See the bottom of the page at <http://www.list.org/devs.html>.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From brad at shub-internet.org  Fri Feb 27 18:22:47 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:22:47 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <1235754612l.5760l.1l@mofo>
References: <Pine.GSO.4.61.0902261153430.18847@blueman>	<49A7311D.4010606@shub-internet.org>
	<1235754612l.5760l.1l@mofo>
Message-ID: <49A82167.3020802@shub-internet.org>

Karl O. Pinc wrote:

> I don't suppose there's an IRC channel related to mailman?

Not that I'm personally familiar with, no.

> I sometimes find that the low latency of IRC makes it a lot
> easier to clear up my mis-conceptions and set me
> on track to reading the right docs and so forth.

Agreed.  IRC is very good for those kinds of things.  We use it whenever 
we're doing maintenance on the python.org systems that needs broad coordination.

I've been in some organizations where it's used to hold virtual board 
meetings, or where there are board members who are physically present and 
one of them acts as a gateway to IRC for those folks who can't be there in 
person.

> I used to use mailing lists exclusively but
> now think that chat has it's place.

Yup.

If you find or create a mailman-users channel somewhere, please let us know 
so that we can put it into the FAQ, or feel free to put it there yourself.

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From brad at shub-internet.org  Fri Feb 27 18:28:39 2009
From: brad at shub-internet.org (Brad Knowles)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:28:39 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902270921300609fca9823f@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902270921300609fca9823f@msapiro>
Message-ID: <49A822C7.1030809@shub-internet.org>

Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Karl O. Pinc wrote:
>> I don't suppose there's an IRC channel related to mailman?
> 
> See the bottom of the page at <http://www.list.org/devs.html>.

D'oh!

/facepalm

-- 
Brad Knowles
<brad at shub-internet.org>        If you like Jazz/R&B guitar, check out
LinkedIn Profile:                 my friend bigsbytracks on YouTube at
<http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>    http://preview.tinyurl.com/bigsbytracks

From kop at meme.com  Fri Feb 27 19:02:17 2009
From: kop at meme.com (Karl O. Pinc)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 12:02:17 -0600
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902270921300609fca9823f@msapiro> (from
	mark@msapiro.net on Fri Feb 27 11:21:30 2009)
References: <1235754612l.5760l.1l@mofo>
	<PC1870200902270921300609fca9823f@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1235757737l.9679l.0l@mofo>


On 02/27/2009 11:21:30 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Karl O. Pinc wrote:
> >
> >I don't suppose there's an IRC channel related to mailman?
> 
> 
> See the bottom of the page at <http://www.list.org/devs.html>.

That would be #mailman on irc.freenode.net.

Does it make sense to ask user questions there too?
The topic message indicates it's a generic mailman
channel.

I'm the one who's using browsers that are too old
to edit the wiki so either somebody else will
have to do it or I'll have to try to remember
after I upgrade.

Karl <kop at meme.com>
Free Software:  "You don't pay back, you pay forward."
                  -- Robert A. Heinlein

From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 19:19:31 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:19:31 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Pain, seeking Mailman/Postfix wisdom
In-Reply-To: <1235757737l.9679l.0l@mofo>
Message-ID: <PC1870200902271019310171dcb1144a@msapiro>

Karl O. Pinc wrote:
>
>That would be #mailman on irc.freenode.net.
>
>Does it make sense to ask user questions there too?


Yes.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jrc at clshost.com  Fri Feb 27 19:27:10 2009
From: jrc at clshost.com (J.R. Constance)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:27:10 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug in Mailman error on ListInfo Page
Message-ID: <54838635-1573-4707-AA74-384C1F3D6D12@clshost.com>

Hi,

I have suddenly begun getting an error on the ListInfo page for all of  
my Mailman mailing lists. This is fairly recent. The lists function  
normally (as in, emails sent to the list address are sent to the  
subscribers) but nobody can subscribe through the listinfo page.

Yes, I know this is version 2.1.11.cp3 and I will probably end up  
having to ask over in the CPanel forums but I am hoping that someone  
(Mark) can give me a clue from the traceback below what direction I  
should go to start figuring this out so when I do go to Cpanel I have  
somewhere to start.

Thanks,

J.R.

J.R. Constance
Rodric Consulting, LLC
jrc at rodricon.com
Phone:  720.339.3646



Feb 19 09:51:10 2009 admin(10019):  
@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
admin(10019): [----- Mailman Version: 2.1.11.cp3 -----]
admin(10019): [----- Traceback ------]
admin(10019): Traceback (most recent call last):
admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/scripts/ 
driver", line 101, in run_main
admin(10019):     main()
admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/ 
subscribe.py", line 96, in main
admin(10019):     process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata, language)
admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/ 
subscribe.py", line 176, in process_form
admin(10019):     mlist.AddMember(userdesc, remote)
admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/ 
MailList.py", line 894, in AddMember
admin(10019):     cookie = self.pend_new(Pending.SUBSCRIPTION, userdesc)
admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/ 
Pending.py", line 65, in pend_new
admin(10019):     db = self.__load()
admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/ 
Pending.py", line 95, in __load
admin(10019):     return cPickle.load(fp)
admin(10019): EOFError
admin(10019): [----- Python Information -----]
admin(10019): sys.version     =   2.4.3 (#1, Oct 26 2006, 22:27:18)
[GCC 3.4.6 20060404 (Red Hat 3.4.6-3)]
admin(10019): sys.executable  =   /usr/local/bin/python2.4
admin(10019): sys.prefix      =   /usr/local
admin(10019): sys.exec_prefix =   /usr/local
admin(10019): sys.path        =   /usr/local
admin(10019): sys.platform    =   linux2
admin(10019): [----- Environment Variables -----]
admin(10019): 	HTTP_REFERER: http://ascls-lists.org/mailman/listinfo/listname_ascls-lists.org
admin(10019): 	SERVER_SOFTWARE: Apache/2.0.63 (Unix) mod_ssl/2.0.63  
OpenSSL/0.9.7a mod_auth_passthrough/2.1 mod_bwlimited/1.4 FrontPage/ 
5.0.2.2635 PHP/5.2.5
admin(10019): 	SCRIPT_NAME: /mailman/subscribe
admin(10019): 	SERVER_SIGNATURE: <address>Apache/2.0.63 (Unix) mod_ssl/ 
2.0.63 OpenSSL/0.9.7a mod_auth_passthrough/2.1 mod_bwlimited/1.4  
FrontPage/5.0.2.2635 PHP/5.2.5 Server at ascls-lists.org Port 80</ 
address>
admin(10019):
admin(10019): 	REQUEST_METHOD: POST
admin(10019): 	HTTP_KEEP_ALIVE: 300
admin(10019): 	SERVER_PROTOCOL: HTTP/1.1
admin(10019): 	QUERY_STRING:
admin(10019): 	CONTENT_LENGTH: 94
admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET: ISO-8859-1,utf-8;q=0.7,*;q=0.7
admin(10019): 	HTTP_USER_AGENT: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS  
X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.8.0.6) Gecko/20060728 Firefox/1.5.0.6 Mnenhy/ 
0.7.4.666
admin(10019): 	HTTP_CONNECTION: keep-alive
admin(10019): 	SERVER_NAME: ascls-lists.org
admin(10019): 	REMOTE_ADDR: 65.89.84.2
admin(10019): 	PATH_TRANSLATED: /home/ascls-li/public_html/ 
listname_ascls-lists.org
admin(10019): 	SERVER_PORT: 80
admin(10019): 	SERVER_ADDR: 72.249.28.134
admin(10019): 	DOCUMENT_ROOT: /home/ascls-li/public_html
admin(10019): 	PYTHONPATH: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman
admin(10019): 	SCRIPT_FILENAME: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/cgi- 
bin/subscribe
admin(10019): 	SERVER_ADMIN: webmaster at ascls-lists.org
admin(10019): 	HTTP_HOST: ascls-lists.org
admin(10019): 	REQUEST_URI: /mailman/subscribe/listname_ascls-lists.org
admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT: text/html,application/xhtml 
+xml,application/xml;q=0.9,*/*;q=0.8
admin(10019): 	GATEWAY_INTERFACE: CGI/1.1
admin(10019): 	REMOTE_PORT: 6338
admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE: en-us,en;q=0.5
admin(10019): 	CONTENT_TYPE: application/x-www-form-urlencoded
admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING: gzip,deflate
admin(10019): 	PATH_INFO: /listname_ascls-lists.org






From mark at msapiro.net  Fri Feb 27 21:17:55 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 12:17:55 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug in Mailman error on ListInfo Page
In-Reply-To: <54838635-1573-4707-AA74-384C1F3D6D12@clshost.com>
Message-ID: <PC187020090227121755050096b18d2b@msapiro>

J.R. Constance wrote:
>
>I have suddenly begun getting an error on the ListInfo page for all of  
>my Mailman mailing lists. This is fairly recent. The lists function  
>normally (as in, emails sent to the list address are sent to the  
>subscribers) but nobody can subscribe through the listinfo page.


The error below is from an attempted subscribe (i.e. clicking the
subscribe button) from the listinfo page for the list whose name you
apparently replaced with 'listname' in a few places below.

The problem is the subscribe request can't be added to the pending
database because the
usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/lists/listname_ascls-lists.org/pending.pck
file is corrupt. You can just remove that file, although you will lose
the confirmation data for other requests, but it's probably lost
anyway.

Is this the problem you're having?

I note that I can go to the overview at
<http://ascls-lists.org/mailman/listinfo/> and to the listinfo for the
two public lists on that page without problem.



>Feb 19 09:51:10 2009 admin(10019):  
>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
>admin(10019): [----- Mailman Version: 2.1.11.cp3 -----]
>admin(10019): [----- Traceback ------]
>admin(10019): Traceback (most recent call last):
>admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/scripts/ 
>driver", line 101, in run_main
>admin(10019):     main()
>admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/ 
>subscribe.py", line 96, in main
>admin(10019):     process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata, language)
>admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/ 
>subscribe.py", line 176, in process_form
>admin(10019):     mlist.AddMember(userdesc, remote)
>admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/ 
>MailList.py", line 894, in AddMember
>admin(10019):     cookie = self.pend_new(Pending.SUBSCRIPTION, userdesc)
>admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/ 
>Pending.py", line 65, in pend_new
>admin(10019):     db = self.__load()
>admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/ 
>Pending.py", line 95, in __load
>admin(10019):     return cPickle.load(fp)
>admin(10019): EOFError
>admin(10019): [----- Python Information -----]
>admin(10019): sys.version     =   2.4.3 (#1, Oct 26 2006, 22:27:18)
>[GCC 3.4.6 20060404 (Red Hat 3.4.6-3)]
>admin(10019): sys.executable  =   /usr/local/bin/python2.4
>admin(10019): sys.prefix      =   /usr/local
>admin(10019): sys.exec_prefix =   /usr/local
>admin(10019): sys.path        =   /usr/local
>admin(10019): sys.platform    =   linux2
>admin(10019): [----- Environment Variables -----]
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_REFERER: http://ascls-lists.org/mailman/listinfo/listname_ascls-lists.org
>admin(10019): 	SERVER_SOFTWARE: Apache/2.0.63 (Unix) mod_ssl/2.0.63  
>OpenSSL/0.9.7a mod_auth_passthrough/2.1 mod_bwlimited/1.4 FrontPage/ 
>5.0.2.2635 PHP/5.2.5
>admin(10019): 	SCRIPT_NAME: /mailman/subscribe
>admin(10019): 	SERVER_SIGNATURE: <address>Apache/2.0.63 (Unix) mod_ssl/ 
>2.0.63 OpenSSL/0.9.7a mod_auth_passthrough/2.1 mod_bwlimited/1.4  
>FrontPage/5.0.2.2635 PHP/5.2.5 Server at ascls-lists.org Port 80</ 
>address>
>admin(10019):
>admin(10019): 	REQUEST_METHOD: POST
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_KEEP_ALIVE: 300
>admin(10019): 	SERVER_PROTOCOL: HTTP/1.1
>admin(10019): 	QUERY_STRING:
>admin(10019): 	CONTENT_LENGTH: 94
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET: ISO-8859-1,utf-8;q=0.7,*;q=0.7
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_USER_AGENT: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS  
>X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.8.0.6) Gecko/20060728 Firefox/1.5.0.6 Mnenhy/ 
>0.7.4.666
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_CONNECTION: keep-alive
>admin(10019): 	SERVER_NAME: ascls-lists.org
>admin(10019): 	REMOTE_ADDR: 65.89.84.2
>admin(10019): 	PATH_TRANSLATED: /home/ascls-li/public_html/ 
>listname_ascls-lists.org
>admin(10019): 	SERVER_PORT: 80
>admin(10019): 	SERVER_ADDR: 72.249.28.134
>admin(10019): 	DOCUMENT_ROOT: /home/ascls-li/public_html
>admin(10019): 	PYTHONPATH: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman
>admin(10019): 	SCRIPT_FILENAME: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/cgi- 
>bin/subscribe
>admin(10019): 	SERVER_ADMIN: webmaster at ascls-lists.org
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_HOST: ascls-lists.org
>admin(10019): 	REQUEST_URI: /mailman/subscribe/listname_ascls-lists.org
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT: text/html,application/xhtml 
>+xml,application/xml;q=0.9,*/*;q=0.8
>admin(10019): 	GATEWAY_INTERFACE: CGI/1.1
>admin(10019): 	REMOTE_PORT: 6338
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE: en-us,en;q=0.5
>admin(10019): 	CONTENT_TYPE: application/x-www-form-urlencoded
>admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING: gzip,deflate
>admin(10019): 	PATH_INFO: /listname_ascls-lists.org

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From jrc at clshost.com  Fri Feb 27 22:08:46 2009
From: jrc at clshost.com (J.R. Constance)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 14:08:46 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Bug in Mailman error on ListInfo Page
In-Reply-To: <PC187020090227121755050096b18d2b@msapiro>
References: <PC187020090227121755050096b18d2b@msapiro>
Message-ID: <119BA2E2-050B-4AEB-8E1B-0FB0FF6B93D3@clshost.com>

Thanks Mark, that fixed the problem.

The pending.pck file had a date of Sep 2007 with a file size of zero.

And yes, I did change that list address. Always feel kind of queasy  
about giving out that much info for one of my lists to a public  
mailing list.

By the way, visiting the listinfo pages was not the problem. Only  
subscribing from them.

J.R.

On Feb 27, 2009, at 1:17 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> J.R. Constance wrote:
>>
>> I have suddenly begun getting an error on the ListInfo page for all  
>> of
>> my Mailman mailing lists. This is fairly recent. The lists function
>> normally (as in, emails sent to the list address are sent to the
>> subscribers) but nobody can subscribe through the listinfo page.
>
>
> The error below is from an attempted subscribe (i.e. clicking the
> subscribe button) from the listinfo page for the list whose name you
> apparently replaced with 'listname' in a few places below.
>
> The problem is the subscribe request can't be added to the pending
> database because the
> usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/lists/listname_ascls-lists.org/ 
> pending.pck
> file is corrupt. You can just remove that file, although you will lose
> the confirmation data for other requests, but it's probably lost
> anyway.
>
> Is this the problem you're having?
>
> I note that I can go to the overview at
> <http://ascls-lists.org/mailman/listinfo/> and to the listinfo for the
> two public lists on that page without problem.
>
>
>
>> Feb 19 09:51:10 2009 admin(10019):
>> @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
>> admin(10019): [----- Mailman Version: 2.1.11.cp3 -----]
>> admin(10019): [----- Traceback ------]
>> admin(10019): Traceback (most recent call last):
>> admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/scripts/
>> driver", line 101, in run_main
>> admin(10019):     main()
>> admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/
>> subscribe.py", line 96, in main
>> admin(10019):     process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata, language)
>> admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/
>> subscribe.py", line 176, in process_form
>> admin(10019):     mlist.AddMember(userdesc, remote)
>> admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/
>> MailList.py", line 894, in AddMember
>> admin(10019):     cookie = self.pend_new(Pending.SUBSCRIPTION,  
>> userdesc)
>> admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/
>> Pending.py", line 65, in pend_new
>> admin(10019):     db = self.__load()
>> admin(10019):   File "/usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/Mailman/
>> Pending.py", line 95, in __load
>> admin(10019):     return cPickle.load(fp)
>> admin(10019): EOFError
>> admin(10019): [----- Python Information -----]
>> admin(10019): sys.version     =   2.4.3 (#1, Oct 26 2006, 22:27:18)
>> [GCC 3.4.6 20060404 (Red Hat 3.4.6-3)]
>> admin(10019): sys.executable  =   /usr/local/bin/python2.4
>> admin(10019): sys.prefix      =   /usr/local
>> admin(10019): sys.exec_prefix =   /usr/local
>> admin(10019): sys.path        =   /usr/local
>> admin(10019): sys.platform    =   linux2
>> admin(10019): [----- Environment Variables -----]
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_REFERER: http://ascls-lists.org/mailman/listinfo/listname_ascls-lists.org
>> admin(10019): 	SERVER_SOFTWARE: Apache/2.0.63 (Unix) mod_ssl/2.0.63
>> OpenSSL/0.9.7a mod_auth_passthrough/2.1 mod_bwlimited/1.4 FrontPage/
>> 5.0.2.2635 PHP/5.2.5
>> admin(10019): 	SCRIPT_NAME: /mailman/subscribe
>> admin(10019): 	SERVER_SIGNATURE: <address>Apache/2.0.63 (Unix)  
>> mod_ssl/
>> 2.0.63 OpenSSL/0.9.7a mod_auth_passthrough/2.1 mod_bwlimited/1.4
>> FrontPage/5.0.2.2635 PHP/5.2.5 Server at ascls-lists.org Port 80</
>> address>
>> admin(10019):
>> admin(10019): 	REQUEST_METHOD: POST
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_KEEP_ALIVE: 300
>> admin(10019): 	SERVER_PROTOCOL: HTTP/1.1
>> admin(10019): 	QUERY_STRING:
>> admin(10019): 	CONTENT_LENGTH: 94
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_CHARSET: ISO-8859-1,utf-8;q=0.7,*;q=0.7
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_USER_AGENT: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS
>> X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.8.0.6) Gecko/20060728 Firefox/1.5.0.6 Mnenhy/
>> 0.7.4.666
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_CONNECTION: keep-alive
>> admin(10019): 	SERVER_NAME: ascls-lists.org
>> admin(10019): 	REMOTE_ADDR: 65.89.84.2
>> admin(10019): 	PATH_TRANSLATED: /home/ascls-li/public_html/
>> listname_ascls-lists.org
>> admin(10019): 	SERVER_PORT: 80
>> admin(10019): 	SERVER_ADDR: 72.249.28.134
>> admin(10019): 	DOCUMENT_ROOT: /home/ascls-li/public_html
>> admin(10019): 	PYTHONPATH: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman
>> admin(10019): 	SCRIPT_FILENAME: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/ 
>> cgi-
>> bin/subscribe
>> admin(10019): 	SERVER_ADMIN: webmaster at ascls-lists.org
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_HOST: ascls-lists.org
>> admin(10019): 	REQUEST_URI: /mailman/subscribe/listname_ascls- 
>> lists.org
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT: text/html,application/xhtml
>> +xml,application/xml;q=0.9,*/*;q=0.8
>> admin(10019): 	GATEWAY_INTERFACE: CGI/1.1
>> admin(10019): 	REMOTE_PORT: 6338
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_LANGUAGE: en-us,en;q=0.5
>> admin(10019): 	CONTENT_TYPE: application/x-www-form-urlencoded
>> admin(10019): 	HTTP_ACCEPT_ENCODING: gzip,deflate
>> admin(10019): 	PATH_INFO: /listname_ascls-lists.org
>
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>


From glueck at igroup.de  Sat Feb 28 14:40:10 2009
From: glueck at igroup.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Oliver_Gl=FCck?=)
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 14:40:10 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why host_name and not domain?
References: <PC1870200902270832140156433a6e6a@msapiro>
Message-ID: <C2F85CEEB1AC4047B3F21D7AE7B53200@sirius>

Hi,

it is terrible.
And every pages are in English and my English is not good. :-(

I can't understand about VIRTUAL_HOSTS and add_virtualhost.

Now, I can reach the listinfo-page, but I can't create a list, because I get 
the
error 'unknown virtual host: short-servername'

Hint: mailman installed with defaults: ./configure, make..

In my mm_cfg.py now:
---snip---
MTA = 'Postfix'
DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'short-servername.intern.company.de'
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'company.com'
VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear ()
add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST , DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST )
POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['company.com', 'company.de']
---snap---
With this entries I can see the listinfo but not create -> unknown virtual 
host...

I have tried in mm.., added:
VIRTUAL_HOSTS = { 'www.company.com': 'company.com', 'www.company.de': 
'company.de' }
But I get an syntax error, marker at '}'

How looks a functional configuration? With:
Mailserver = mailmanserver :  name.intern.company.de
Maildomain = company.com , company.de and the local domain intern.company.de 
because the server is in
this domain
I don't need to reach the mailman-web from the internet! Only from the 
intranet (LAN)
But mails from the mailman to members have to show 'list at company.com'  and 
no other links,
because they don't have to reach the internal server from the internet. 
(www.company.com/mailman/listinfo
has not to work! It will not be forwarded!)

Oh yeah, sorry.



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Sapiro" <mark at msapiro.net>
To: "Oliver Glueck" <glueck at igroup.de>
Cc: <mailman-users at python.org>
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2009 5:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Why host_name and not domain?


> Oliver Glueck wrote:
>
>>I want to edit the list and create a new list over the
>>webinterface.
>>But I can't see the "list admin overview page"! I see no lists!
>>No 'mailman' and no 'about-dummy'.
>>
>>Why I cant see the list? (After I tried to send and deliver emails
>>over the list.)
>>
>>Before I changed the configuration (see bottom and inline),
>>the webinterface works fine. And all lists I have seen.
>>
>>And:
>>If I create a new list, I get the message:
>>"Error: Unknown virtual host: mail.intern.company.de"
>
>
> See the FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/lYA9>.
>
> -- 
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
> San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
>
> 


From rpyne at kinfolk.org  Sat Feb 28 16:18:20 2009
From: rpyne at kinfolk.org (rpyne at kinfolk.org)
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 08:18:20 -0700
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Mailman 2.1.12 final released.
In-Reply-To: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
References: <49A33053.5090702@msapiro.net>
Message-ID: <49A8F34C.31683.72E8F72@rpyne.kinfolk.org>

A HUGE THANK
        YOU!


On 23 Feb 2009 at 15:25, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> I am happy to announce the final release of Mailman 2.1.12.
> 
> Since 2.1.12rc2 there have been a few bug fixes, the Polish
> translation has been updated and a couple of items have been added to
> the contrib directory.
> 
> Mailman 2.1.12 is a minor bug fix and Python 2.6 compatibility
> release.
> 
> The minimum Python for this release is Python 2.4 and it is compatible
> with Python through 2.6. The previous Mailman releases are not
> compatible with Python 2.6.
> 
> See the release notes at
> <https://sourceforge.net/project/shownotes.php?release_id=653108&group
> _id=103> for more details.
> 
> Mailman is free software for managing email mailing lists and
> e-newsletters. Mailman is used for all the python.org and
> SourceForge.net mailing lists, as well as at hundreds of other sites.
> 
> For more information, including download links, please see:
> 
> http://www.list.org
> http://mailman.sf.net
> http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman
> 
> - --
> Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers, San
> Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32)
> 
> iD8DBQFJozBSVVuXXpU7hpMRAgBNAJ0SNpRHqlmRCHcW0L7f/Gxw+7Ro/QCgrfoA
> qMml0XJorulAaRiCi03e7OY=
> =fTrb
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Mailman-Users mailing list
> Mailman-Users at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Searchable Archives:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe:
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/rpyne%40kinfolk.o
> rg
> 
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9



From mark at msapiro.net  Sat Feb 28 16:58:59 2009
From: mark at msapiro.net (Mark Sapiro)
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 07:58:59 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Why host_name and not domain?
In-Reply-To: <C2F85CEEB1AC4047B3F21D7AE7B53200@sirius>
Message-ID: <PC18702009022807585901871e18feb6@msapiro>

Oliver Gl?ck wrote:
>
>it is terrible.
>And every pages are in English and my English is not good. :-(


I'm sorry, but it's much better than my German :(


>I can't understand about VIRTUAL_HOSTS and add_virtualhost.


I don't think you need to, but see below:


>Now, I can reach the listinfo-page, but I can't create a list, because I get 
>the
>error 'unknown virtual host: short-servername'


Did you run

bin/withlist -l -a -r fix_url

after changing mm_cfg.py?


>Hint: mailman installed with defaults: ./configure, make..
>
>In my mm_cfg.py now:
>---snip---
>MTA = 'Postfix'
>DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'short-servername.intern.company.de'
>DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'company.com'
>VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear ()


This clears the VIRTUAL_HOSTS dictionary.


>add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST , DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST )


This adds an entry to the VIRTUAL_HOSTS dictionary with key = the value
of DEFAULT_URL_HOST and value = the value of DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST. I.e.

{'short-servername.intern.company.de': 'company.com'}


>POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['company.com', 'company.de']


Since with the above settings, all lists will be created with email
host = 'company.com', the 'company.de' entry above is irrelevant.


>---snap---
>With this entries I can see the listinfo but not create -> unknown virtual 
>host...


That says the POST action URL on the create page doesn't have
'short-servername.intern.company.de' as it's host name, but if you
went to the listinfo page with this host name and saw the list, I
don't understand why.


>I have tried in mm.., added:
>VIRTUAL_HOSTS = { 'www.company.com': 'company.com', 'www.company.de': 
>'company.de' }
>But I get an syntax error, marker at '}'


I don't know why you get a syntax error unless there was something in
what you added that isn't above, BUT do not do this. If yopu want to
add additional entries to VIRTUAL_HOSTS, use add_virtualhost() as in

add_virtualhost('www.company.com', 'company.com')
add_virtualhost('www.company.de', 'company.de')


>How looks a functional configuration? With:
>Mailserver = mailmanserver :  name.intern.company.de
>Maildomain = company.com , company.de and the local domain intern.company.de 
>because the server is in
>this domain
>I don't need to reach the mailman-web from the internet! Only from the 
>intranet (LAN)


So your list members don't go to ther web user options page or to the
listinfo page?


>But mails from the mailman to members have to show 'list at company.com'  and 
>no other links,


So DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'company.com'


>because they don't have to reach the internal server from the internet. 
>(www.company.com/mailman/listinfo
>has not to work! It will not be forwarded!)


It seems like the following should work

MTA = 'Postfix'
DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'short-servername.intern.company.de'
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'company.com'
VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear ()
add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST , DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST )
POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['company.com']

as long as you always access the web interface via
http://short-servername.intern.company.de/... URLs, but these URLs
will also be visible in the headers of list posts unless you set
include_rfc2369_headers to No.


-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark at msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan


From mwelch at redwoodalliance.org  Sat Feb 28 19:14:36 2009
From: mwelch at redwoodalliance.org (Michael Welch)
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 10:14:36 -0800
Subject: [Mailman-Users] password sends
Message-ID: <20090228182036.67E2E5F5B1@friskymail-a1.g.dreamhost.com>

What is supposed to happen when a non-listmember tries to get a password reminder from the member options page?

I tried it myself after trying to figure out if a member was using the wrong email address, and the web page said, "A reminder of your password has been emailed to you."

But nothing ever arrived. I tried this with two different non-subscribed addresses that do not have spam filters on them. I do not have access to logs to answer more questions, this is a DreamHost implementation.

I also discovered that one of my four lists doesn't even send out the passwords to subscribed members after saying the reminders were sent. I tried this on my own subscribed name and it failed. If folks can tell me what might be wrong here as well, I will pass it on to DreamHost tech support which has been quite responsive in the past.

Version 2.1.11

- - - - - - - - - - - -
Michael Welch, volunteer
Redwood Alliance
PO Box 293
Arcata, CA 95518
707-822-7884
mwelch at redwoodalliance.org
www.redwoodalliance.org


From hammond at txcorp.com  Sat Feb 28 21:00:11 2009
From: hammond at txcorp.com (Anne M. Hammond)
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 13:00:11 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Mailman-Users] one list not sending to members
In-Reply-To: <PC18702009022707215506401b153737@msapiro>
References: <PC18702009022707215506401b153737@msapiro>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0902271058420.441@volt.txcorp.com>

On Fri, 27 Feb 2009, Mark Sapiro wrote:

> Anne M. Hammond wrote:
>
>> I recently created a list with 20 members, but the list is not
>> sending out to the members.
>>
>> Other lists on this server are working fine.  This is mailman 2.1.9.
>>
>> I stopped OutgoingRunner with SIGTERM, sent a post and posted a message
>> to the list, and dumped the database;
>>
>> [root at ice httpd]# /usr/lib/mailman/bin/dumpdb
>> /var/lib/mailman/lists/extremeintegration/pending.pck
>> [----- start pickle file -----]
>> <----- start object 1 ----->
>> {   '01a907bef54583bc21f0e71251a6c9d4487b9b84': ('H', 1),
>>     '46199d354ea07e1ae152d9351a2b2d0426011528': ('H', 3),
>>     'e57f046e3de424b7f2baf780da63e1f1a1d08880': ('H', 2),
>>     'evictions': {   '01a907bef54583bc21f0e71251a6c9d4487b9b84':
>> 1235939067.2983739,
>>                      '46199d354ea07e1ae152d9351a2b2d0426011528':
>> 1235950453.2800391,
>>                      'e57f046e3de424b7f2baf780da63e1f1a1d08880':
>> 1235947591.233825},
>>     'version': 2}
>> [----- end pickle file -----]
>>
>> So I don't see anything here that is pending.
>
>
> The pending.pck database has nothing to do with a post that might be
> delivered except that OutgoingRunner is not running. Such a post would
> be an entry in qfiles/out/. pending.pck is information about various
> requests like subscriptions, held messages, etc. that are waiting
> confirmation. The three entries above are three held messages. You can
> find these messages in data/heldmsg-extremeintegration-nnn.pck files
> and in the admindb interface for the extremeintegration list.
>
> Do the posts get archived?
>
> What's in Mailman's vette log?
>
> What's in the list's admindb interface?
>
> The FAQ at <http://wiki.list.org/x/A4E9> may help.
>
>

Thanks so much.  I did look at the FAQ before posting.

The posts are archived.

The message is not in /var/log/mailman/vette.

The web interface does not show any pending messages.

To track the message, I looked in:

/var/log/mailman/post:
Feb 27 00:54:41 2009 (16639) post to extremeintegration from 
poster at lab.gov, size=5526, 
message-id=<BB5CEB80-5EDE-4520-BA7E-CE770B365B1C at lab.gov>, success

smtp:

Feb 27 00:54:41 2009 (16639) 
<BB5CEB80-5EDE-4520-BA7E-CE770B365B1C at lab.gov> smtp to extremeintegration 
for 2 recips, completed in 0.165 seconds

(I understand this to mean that there are 2 recipients, not the 20 
list members.)

When I look at /var/log/maillog, there is a message to me and the sender:

Feb 27 00:54:41 ice sendmail[20462]: n1R7sfXn020462: 
from=<extremeintegration-bounces at corp.com>, size=5527,
   class=0, nrcpts=1, msgid=<BB5CEB80-5EDE-4520-BA7E-CE770B365B1C at lab.gov>,
   proto=ESMTP, daemon=MTA, relay=localhost.localdomain
   [127.0.0.1]
Feb 27 00:54:41 ice sendmail[20462]: n1R7sfXo020462:
   from=<extremeintegration-bounces at corp.com>, size=5527,
   class=0, nrcpts=1, msgid=<BB5CEB80-5EDE-4520-BA7E-CE770B365B1C at lab.gov>,
   proto=ESMTP, daemon=MTA, relay=localhost.localdomain
   [127.0.0.1]
Feb 27 00:54:41 ice sendmail[20464]: n1R7sfXn020462:
   to=<hammond at corp.com>, delay=00:00:00, xdelay=00:00:00,
   mailer=esmtp, pri=125527, relay=mail.corp.com. [64.240.154.180],
   dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent (n1R7sfTT004092 Message accepted for delivery)
Feb 27 00:54:42 ice sendmail[20466]: n1R7sfXo020462: to=<poster at lab.gov>,
   delay=00:00:01, xdelay=00:00:01, mailer=esmtp, pri=125527,
   relay=incoming.lab.gov. [128.115.249.90], dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent
   (ok:  Message 86878739 accepted)

From matt at nipltd.com  Fri Feb 27 09:58:26 2009
From: matt at nipltd.com (Matt Hoskins)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 08:58:26 +0000
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Backscatter spam via the "-request" address
In-Reply-To: <PC1870200902251501090562129b41bb@msapiro>
References: <PC1870200902251501090562129b41bb@msapiro>
Message-ID: <1235725106.13776.3.camel@matth.private.nipltd.com.private.nipltd.com>

On Wed, 2009-02-25 at 15:01 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> Brad Knowles wrote:
> 
> >Matt Hoskins wrote:
> >
> >>   1) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply if
> >> there were no valid commands included in the message (the spammers
> >> aren't spamming with valid commands at the moment)
> >
> >That sounds like a really good idea.
> >
> >>   2) Be able to configure the "-request" auto responder to not reply to
> >> non-members
> >
> >Not so sure about this one, but it might also be an idea to consider.
> >
> >
> Speaking as a developer, we are aware of the spam
> reflection/backscatter issues with Mailman, and we want to address
> them. Steps will be taken in Mailman 2.2 to at least reduce this
> problem.
> 
> Thanks for your ideas, and as Brad suggests, if you want to follow up
> on mailman-developers at python.org or submit further suggestions, we'd
> be happy to get them.

Thanks for the reply - reassuring to know 2.2 is going to improve the
situation :). If any further ideas spring to mind I'll be sure to post
'em.

Matt



From t.singbartl at bis-school.com  Fri Feb 27 10:13:57 2009
From: t.singbartl at bis-school.com (Singbartl, Thomas)
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:13:57 +0100
Subject: [Mailman-Users] Extract list members from unaccessible domain
Message-ID: <F3330111A1B9BB479FEE51E5F89966100100B2A7@errol.admin.bis-school.com>

Hi there,
due to my own  stupidity I lost my domain as it expired and someone else grabbed it immediately.
I have one particular mailing list, that I want to recover and move it to my new domain. I only need email adresses.
I already contacted my provider who hosts mailman, but with no backend access for me. They send me the zipped folder of that list, which is pretty useless. 
I read 3.62. How do I extract a list of my list's members (subscribers)? of the FAQ, but this only works if the domain still exists. 
What do I have to tell my provider to send me to get the e-mail adresses (the list still exists and is configured on their server).
 
Appreciate any help!
Thanks,
Thomas
 
________________________________


Thomas Singbartl 

IT Manager


Bavarian International School e.V.
A Community of Learners
Hauptstr. 1 - 85778 Haimhausen - Germany 

Phone: +49 (0)8133 917 -132 | Fax: +49 (0)8133 917 -279
t.singbartl at bis-school.com | www.bis-school.com <http://www.bis-school.com/>  

Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts M?nchen VR13209