From bzhang1998 at gmail.com Fri Nov 3 23:14:43 2006 From: bzhang1998 at gmail.com (Bin Zhang) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2006 14:14:43 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Chinese support? Message-ID: <87285bc20611031414s218d8326o74f20c9d8124f2c6@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I am new to mailman and to this list. I hope someone can help me. I currently have a couple of lists, majority of the members are Chinese from China. So a Chinese interface would be very helpful. mailman website states that Chinese is supported, but I cannot find information regarding to getting the files for Chinese (I am especially interested zh-CN, simplified Chinese). I am running 2.1.5 mailman (installed by the hosting company). Any help as to how I could get started would be greatly appreciated. Bin Zhang -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061103/c8e3b3d4/attachment.html From bartek at kajak.org.pl Sun Nov 5 22:25:45 2006 From: bartek at kajak.org.pl (Bartosz Sawicki) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 22:25:45 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Chinese support? In-Reply-To: <87285bc20611031414s218d8326o74f20c9d8124f2c6@mail.gmail.com> References: <87285bc20611031414s218d8326o74f20c9d8124f2c6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <454E56D9.90806@kajak.org.pl> > I am new to mailman and to this list. I hope someone can help me. I > currently have a couple of lists, majority of the members are Chinese from > China. So a Chinese interface would be very helpful. mailman website > states that Chinese is supported, but I cannot find information > regarding to > getting the files for Chinese (I am especially interested zh-CN, simplified > Chinese). > I am running 2.1.5 mailman (installed by the hosting company). It should be visible on Administration Web Panel -> Language Options. If it is not there, probably your hosting company provide limited version of Mailman, ask them. Cheers BArtek From clytie at riverland.net.au Mon Nov 6 07:41:16 2006 From: clytie at riverland.net.au (Clytie Siddall) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 17:11:16 +1030 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] International Mailman (was: Re: Chinese support? In-Reply-To: <454E56D9.90806@kajak.org.pl> References: <87285bc20611031414s218d8326o74f20c9d8124f2c6@mail.gmail.com> <454E56D9.90806@kajak.org.pl> Message-ID: <1733E9C7-F157-406E-A629-849B517BEC04@riverland.net.au> On 06/11/2006, at 7:55 AM, Bartosz Sawicki wrote: >> I am new to mailman and to this list. I hope someone can help me. I >> currently have a couple of lists, majority of the members are >> Chinese from >> China. So a Chinese interface would be very helpful. mailman >> website >> states that Chinese is supported, but I cannot find information >> regarding to >> getting the files for Chinese (I am especially interested zh-CN, >> simplified >> Chinese). >> I am running 2.1.5 mailman (installed by the hosting company). > > It should be visible on Administration Web Panel -> Language Options. > If it is not there, probably your hosting company provide limited > version of Mailman, ask them. This is a problem for international users everywhere. It is much more usual to click on the Language drop-down menu when signing up for a Mailman list, and to see only "English", than it is to see any other languages. Is there any way we can promote the use of Mailman's internationalized files? Could we perhaps include a para. in the release notes, encouraging admins to enable other languages, to improve access for members of other language communities? from Clytie (vi-VN, Vietnamese free-software translation team / nh?m Vi?t h?a ph?n m?m t? do) http://groups-beta.google.com/group/vi-VN -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061106/e513d2b9/attachment.pgp From amachu.techie at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 12:49:11 2006 From: amachu.techie at gmail.com (amachu techie) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 17:19:11 +0530 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Mailman-i18n Digest, Vol 48, Issue 2 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <26a780560611060349i5e782ed8rd882e61d9f453531@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, Guide me please. I wanna start translating mailman to my language Tamil. Where are the PO files? How do i get them? where should I upload them... Regards, Sri Ramadas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061106/585de44b/attachment.html From Frederic.Lehobey at free.fr Thu Nov 16 09:49:57 2006 From: Frederic.Lehobey at free.fr (Frederic Lehobey) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 09:49:57 +0100 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] i18n workflow (and encodings)? Message-ID: <20061116084957.GA4444@melusine> Hi, I am willing to provide updates to the French translation of mailman. I have already sent a patch? to Pascal George (the head of the French translation team: http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/i18n.html) with respect to the version in trunk, precisely: http://mailman.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/mailman/trunk/mailman/messages/fr/LC_MESSAGES/mailman.po?view=log but he told me trunk was not the proper place to work on and that I was duplicating work. But he has not answered so far to my questions of what was the preferred place. So my question is: which main mailman.po should I take as an authoritative start for future updates? What is the proper workflow for localisation updates? Sorry if it is already explained somewhere and I have not spotted it yet?. I have an other question. In the HTML pages translated, there are many HTML tags like é à and so on... Is it safe to replace them everywhere with their 8 bit counterparts (?, ?, ...)? (It makes the translation handling much more convenient.) If yes, what should be the exact encoding to use for the common mailman.po? (UTF-8, ISO 8859-15, ISO 8859-1?) Thanks for your help, Fr?d?ric Lehobey 1. For the curious: http://lehobey-rennes.dyndns.org/mailman/trunk/ 2. I have read http://mailman.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/mailman/trunk/mailman/README-I18N.en?revision=7463&view=markup and found http://mailman.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/mailman/tags/Release_2_1_9/messages/fr/LC_MESSAGES/mailman.po?view=log From amachu.techie at gmail.com Thu Nov 16 13:36:14 2006 From: amachu.techie at gmail.com (amachu techie) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:06:14 +0530 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Tamil Translation regarding.. Message-ID: <26a780560611160436h20337bf0n52cb5003ae57186e@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I would like to volunteer for Translating mailman to Tamil. My Language is not listed at http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/i18n.html How should i start... I have experience in Localisation of Ubuntu to my mother Tongue, Tamil. Please guide :-) Regards... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061116/6378c46b/attachment.html From clytie at riverland.net.au Sun Nov 19 05:08:37 2006 From: clytie at riverland.net.au (Clytie Siddall) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 14:38:37 +1030 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Tamil Translation regarding.. In-Reply-To: <26a780560611160436h20337bf0n52cb5003ae57186e@mail.gmail.com> References: <26a780560611160436h20337bf0n52cb5003ae57186e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello Amachu :) Sorry I haven't been able to answer this earlier. On 16/11/2006, at 11:06 PM, amachu techie wrote: > Hi, > > I would like to volunteer for Translating mailman to Tamil. Great! Welcome to Mailman. :D > > My Language is not listed at http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/ > i18n.html That's because you're the first person to volunteer to translate it. > > How should i start... I have experience in Localisation of Ubuntu > to my mother Tongue, Tamil. > > Please guide :-) To start with, Amachu, please read our i18n page in the wiki: http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/Internationalization This page includes a link to the list of current languages supported, and a link to our Mailman i18n Howto. Please read all this, and then ask any further questions on this list. I hope the wiki pages answer most of your questions. :) If you're willing to be our Tamil Mailman Language Champion, please give me the information to add your language to our table, and I'll do that right away. :) from Clytie (vi-VN, Vietnamese free-software translation team / nh?m Vi?t h?a ph?n m?m t? do) http://groups-beta.google.com/group/vi-VN -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061119/5dd6872c/attachment.pgp From clytie at riverland.net.au Sun Nov 19 05:16:14 2006 From: clytie at riverland.net.au (Clytie Siddall) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 14:46:14 +1030 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] i18n workflow (and encodings)? In-Reply-To: <20061116084957.GA4444@melusine> References: <20061116084957.GA4444@melusine> Message-ID: <1CFB911D-3C12-4928-B124-C20FADC7AA0E@riverland.net.au> Salut Fr?d?ric :) On 16/11/2006, at 7:19 PM, Frederic Lehobey wrote: > > I am willing to provide updates to the French translation of > mailman. Great! :) > I have already sent a patch? to Pascal George (the head of the > French translation team: > http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/i18n.html) with respect to the > version in trunk, precisely: > > http://mailman.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/mailman/trunk/mailman/ > messages/fr/LC_MESSAGES/mailman.po?view=log > > but he told me trunk was not the proper place to work on and that I > was duplicating work. But he has not answered so far to my questions > of what was the preferred place. > > So my question is: which main mailman.po should I take as an > authoritative start for future updates? What is the proper workflow > for localisation updates? Sorry if it is already explained somewhere > and I have not spotted it yet?. Firstly, please read our i18n page [1] in the wiki. It links to our i18n howto, which I hope will answer some of your questions. If you ask any other questions here, we'll do our best to answer them. However, localization projects work via language teams. It's very important that your language-team leader and you can work things out between you. Perhaps your team needs to set up closer communication, it's own mailing list, RSS contacts or whatever suits it best. > > I have an other question. In the HTML pages translated, there are many > HTML tags like é à and so on... Is it safe to replace > them everywhere with their 8 bit counterparts (?, ?, ...)? (It makes > the translation handling much more convenient.) If yes, what should be > the exact encoding to use for the common mailman.po? (UTF-8, ISO > 8859-15, ISO 8859-1?) UTF8 is the standard encoding for use in i18n everywhere. Please use that. You can replace the entities with their 8-bit counterparts. My language is mostly accented vowels, so I know what a mess an HTML file is when the 8-bit characters have been converted to entities. There is software to convert them back. On OSX I use Unicode Checker. [2] As to branches, TRUNK will be the next release. Optimally, a language team maintains a current translation of the latest released branch, but also works on TRUNK towards the next release. So both are relevant. However, it's up to your language-team leader, how s/he wants to manage the process. In smaller projects, like Mailman, some translators are accustomed to working alone, and may need some prompting to setup a shared i18n working environment. It's worth the effort, because each participant gained is a most valuable resource. So don't go away, Fr?d?ric! We need you. :) from Clytie (vi-VN, Vietnamese free-software translation team / nh?m Vi?t h?a ph?n m?m t? do) http://groups-beta.google.com/group/vi-VN [1] http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/Internationalization [2] http://earthlingsoft.net/ssp/blog/2004/03/unicode_checker_16 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061119/f669a65d/attachment.pgp From clytie at riverland.net.au Sun Nov 19 05:20:56 2006 From: clytie at riverland.net.au (Clytie Siddall) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 14:50:56 +1030 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Updating website Message-ID: <006088FB-624E-496B-8234-09BF2C25295D@riverland.net.au> Hi everyone :) We really need to update the Mailman website so the i18n links point to the wiki. The website pages, especially the language list, are becoming progressively more out-of-date, and confuse prospective translators. Could someone please update those links? I don't think I have write access for the website. from Clytie (vi-VN, Vietnamese free-software translation team / nh?m Vi?t h?a ph?n m?m t? do) http://groups-beta.google.com/group/vi-VN -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061119/c33dc15d/attachment.pgp From barry at python.org Sun Nov 19 22:49:50 2006 From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 16:49:50 -0500 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Updating website In-Reply-To: <006088FB-624E-496B-8234-09BF2C25295D@riverland.net.au> References: <006088FB-624E-496B-8234-09BF2C25295D@riverland.net.au> Message-ID: <6C433759-5946-4647-9856-115E58EA2528@python.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Nov 18, 2006, at 11:20 PM, Clytie Siddall wrote: > Hi everyone :) > > We really need to update the Mailman website so the i18n links > point to the wiki. The website pages, especially the language list, > are becoming progressively more out-of-date, and confuse > prospective translators. > > Could someone please update those links? I don't think I have write > access for the website. Hi Clytie, I think you do have write access to the web pages, but you probably don't have permission to push out the changes. If you /don't/ have write access to the subversion tree, I'm of course happy to give it to you. Let me know. Also, just drop me an email when you have the pages the way you like them and I'll push the pages out to the various websites. Note that you will need ht2html installed, which you should be able to get from the SF project page . The path to this is hardcoded in the Makefile, but it's fairly each to change. For the most part, you'll want to edit the .ht or .h files and then run "make" to generate the .html files. Let me know if you have any problems or questions. - -Barry P.S. If you want me to change the pages, just let me know what you'd like to change. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (Darwin) iQCVAwUBRWDRg3EjvBPtnXfVAQKWdwP/a8NuQwobukVp+VmZz0eXuNur9Sn+TcbR zgpGKL2aKgy3nErbNrhYgLIXPS1hfqizrShx19yuCaj7dnAfJUCd4W/vcyCcc69N i5MTRPEweV/+rIqpfREEhbfVsivSvKMoF56OXMbIhMlNoYvxe27qBsCSwiIAg30E TH4xbJt6dKE= =xA3E -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From amachu.techie at gmail.com Mon Nov 20 04:05:41 2006 From: amachu.techie at gmail.com (amachu techie) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 08:35:41 +0530 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Tamil Translation regarding.. In-Reply-To: <26a780560611191904y298b65bai540f6e7ab509e50d@mail.gmail.com> References: <26a780560611160436h20337bf0n52cb5003ae57186e@mail.gmail.com> <26a780560611191904y298b65bai540f6e7ab509e50d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <26a780560611191905q3e4d6ed8kaa0c408fdc8d7da1@mail.gmail.com> Thanks a lot for your reply. > If you're willing to be our Tamil Mailman Language Champion, please > give me the information to add your language to our table, and I'll > do that right away. :) Yes. I feel great to become the Tamil Mailman Language Champion. The name of my Language is "Tamil", Its Iso-639 code is "tam". and Tamil is spoken by 65-70 million people across the globe. Please guide me further. As to from where do i download files for translation, where do i upload files translated etc., Regards, Sri Ramadoss M IRC: amachu AT freenode Channel: #ubuntu-tam -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061120/edb08ebf/attachment.htm From clytie at riverland.net.au Thu Nov 23 12:35:10 2006 From: clytie at riverland.net.au (Clytie Siddall) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 22:05:10 +1030 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Tamil Translation regarding.. In-Reply-To: <26a780560611191904y298b65bai540f6e7ab509e50d@mail.gmail.com> References: <26a780560611160436h20337bf0n52cb5003ae57186e@mail.gmail.com> <26a780560611191904y298b65bai540f6e7ab509e50d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello again :) On 20/11/2006, at 1:34 PM, amachu techie wrote: > Thanks a lot for your reply. > > > If you're willing to be our Tamil Mailman Language Champion, please > > give me the information to add your language to our table, and I'll > > do that right away. :) > > Yes. I feel great to become the Tamil Mailman Language Champion. > The name of my Language is "Tamil", Its Iso-639 code is "tam". and > Tamil is spoken by 65-70 million people across the globe. I've just added you to our Language table [1], which is also accessible from our Internationalization page at the wiki. [2] > > Please guide me further. As to from where do i download files for > translation, where do i upload files translated etv., Part-way down our Internationalization page [2] is the link to our i18n HowTo [3], which tells you exactly how to get the files and do the job. Please read this carefully, and if you have any further questions after that, ask here on the list. :) from Clytie (vi-VN, Vietnamese free-software translation team / nh?m Vi?t h?a ph?n m?m t? do) http://groups-beta.google.com/group/vi-VN [1] http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/Languages [2] http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/Internationalization [3] http://wiki.list.org/display/DEV/i18nhowto -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061123/f12a3d67/attachment.pgp From nospam001-lists at jankoh.dyndns.org Thu Nov 23 14:18:48 2006 From: nospam001-lists at jankoh.dyndns.org (Jan Kohnert) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 14:18:48 +0100 (CET) Subject: [Mailman-i18n] [Mailman-Users] Mailman and UTF8 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <39402.141.33.55.114.1164287928.squirrel@secure.the-pojs.dyndns.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Mark Sapiro schrieb: > Jan Kohnert wrote: >> >>So I found out, I have to encode the german mailman.po file in UTF-8 and >>then rebuild the *.mo out of it. Now it works, so I can provide this >>version (to large for this list to attach it). (Mailman 2.1.9_rc1). > > > I18n issues like the above are better discussed on the mailman-i18n > list . Agreed, so I'm crossposting this one for References in the I18N list. Followups please on that list. >>But there is one (small) thing left: >>If you look in [1] you will notice one incorrectly displayed character >>(the ---next part---, in German ---n=E4chster Teil--- does not work in >> all >>cases ([1] does not work, [2] does), altough all my editors say, the >>umlaut is correctly declared... > > > It looks like in [1] somehow the utf-8 encoded message got interpreted > as some other character set (maybe iso-8859-1) and then got encoded > again as utf-8 so that instead if the a with umlaut, you see the bytes > of the utf-8 encoding of a with umulaut displayed as characters. > > This may be a scrubber issue of some kind, but I am not sure why it > would occur with only one of two apparently structurally identical > messages from the same poster, but here is a clue. > > I looked at the text file > . > While there are no Content-Type: headers in that file, I can see the > encoding of the Subject: header. It appears that the 'bad' posts are > 'original' posts and are iso-8859-1 encoded by the poster's (you) MUA, > and the 'good' posts are 'replies' and are utf-8 encoded by the MUA. > > Thus it appears that there may be a scrubber issue when the character > set of the incoming message is iso-8859-1 but the i18n translated > canned messages are utf-8. > > What mailman version is this? Leaving your comment completely in heare for reference; as said above, this is v2.1.9. Regards Jan -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFZZ+3ZRp6KEAo/3oRArw/AJ4qn1yjvFmwvYJbZO3e1bgqTadMrgCgsXDO 2sdRW2NP8u6cwQj4GK21/Gw= =peRZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From msapiro at value.net Thu Nov 23 19:39:24 2006 From: msapiro at value.net (Mark Sapiro) Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 10:39:24 -0800 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] [Mailman-Users] Mailman and UTF8 In-Reply-To: <39402.141.33.55.114.1164287928.squirrel@secure.the-pojs.dyndns.org> Message-ID: Jan Kohnert wrote: > >Mark Sapiro schrieb: >> >> Thus it appears that there may be a scrubber issue when the character >> set of the incoming message is iso-8859-1 but the i18n translated >> canned messages are utf-8. >> >> What mailman version is this? > >Leaving your comment completely in heare for reference; as said above, >this is v2.1.9. Sorry, somehow I overlooked your mention of the version in the OP. Anyway, this is definitely a scrubber issue. I see why it occurs, but I'm not yet sure how to fix it. The problem is when the character set of the translation returned by _('-------------- next part --------------\n') is not compatible with the character set of the message being scrubbed, the translation can be garbled. I think we should be using the character set of the list's preferred language rather than the character set of the message in this case, but the process is complicated and I'm not sure how to do it. If you want, you can try the attached scrubber.patch.txt (apply to Mailman/Handlers/Scrubber.py). -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: scrubber.patch.txt Url: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-i18n/attachments/20061123/ad3c9e8a/attachment.txt