From iztok.stotl at guest.arnes.si Thu May 1 10:56:13 2003 From: iztok.stotl at guest.arnes.si (Iztok Stotl) Date: Thu May 1 03:51:51 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Slovenian translation Message-ID: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> Hello girlz and boyzz ... I want to start a slovenian translation of Mailman ... I have some problems starting ... I have read the manual 'How to start' from Simone, but I have some question about encoding of the .po file. Which encoding should I use ? I wanted to use ISO-8859-2 but then the msgfmt complained first and I couldn't force it to make the right .mo file (such that could display chars correct the page ;) I got only strange chars instead our local chars ... The source of the HTML (mailman page displayed in the browser) shows that encoding is set OK in the HTML (iso-8859-2) ... Should I use UTF-8 instead ? Why doesnt KBabel offer me to save the .po file in my encoding , only UTF-8 is to choose ? Iztok From martin at v.loewis.de Thu May 1 11:20:36 2003 From: martin at v.loewis.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Martin_v=2E_L=F6wis=22?=) Date: Thu May 1 04:20:47 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Slovenian translation In-Reply-To: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> References: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> Message-ID: <3EB0D8D4.5060808@v.loewis.de> Iztok Stotl wrote: > Which encoding should I use ? > > I wanted to use ISO-8859-2 but then the msgfmt complained first and I > couldn't force it to make the right .mo file (such that could display > chars correct the page ;) ISO-8859-2 should work fine. How precisely did msgfmt complain? And what precisely is the PO header that you have been using? > Why doesnt KBabel offer me to save the .po file in my encoding , only > UTF-8 is to choose ? I'm not a KBabel user, but if KBabel indeed behaves that way, that would be a bug. I use Emacs po-mode. Regards, Martin From james at daa.com.au Thu May 1 17:42:21 2003 From: james at daa.com.au (James Henstridge) Date: Thu May 1 04:43:15 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Slovenian translation In-Reply-To: <3EB0D8D4.5060808@v.loewis.de> References: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> <3EB0D8D4.5060808@v.loewis.de> Message-ID: <3EB0DDED.7030002@daa.com.au> Martin v. L?wis wrote: >> Why doesnt KBabel offer me to save the .po file in my encoding , only >> UTF-8 is to choose ? > > > I'm not a KBabel user, but if KBabel indeed behaves that way, that would > be a bug. I use Emacs po-mode. It probably saves in UTF-8 because KDE uses uses unicode internally (by having the catalog in UTF-8, gettext won't need to do a codeset conversion during translation). From the documentation, it sounds like you can set a preference to leave the text encoding unchanged when saving. This might help. James. -- Email: james@daa.com.au WWW: http://www.daa.com.au/~james/ From barry at python.org Thu May 1 17:07:21 2003 From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Thu May 1 12:07:22 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Slovenian translation In-Reply-To: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> References: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> Message-ID: <1051805208.24341.28.camel@barry> On Thu, 2003-05-01 at 03:56, Iztok Stotl wrote: > I wanted to use ISO-8859-2 but then the msgfmt complained first and I > couldn't force it to make the right .mo file (such that could display > chars correct the page ;) Take a look at the Polish, Czech, or Hungarian .po files. All use iso-8859-2 also. You'll need to make sure you have a header like Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 In the empty-string msgstr (gettext convention for providing catalog metadata). And be sure to send me any translations you make when they're ready! -Barry From iztok.stotl at guest.arnes.si Fri May 2 10:30:02 2003 From: iztok.stotl at guest.arnes.si (Iztok Stotl) Date: Fri May 2 03:25:42 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Slovenian translation In-Reply-To: <3EB0D8D4.5060808@v.loewis.de> References: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> <3EB0D8D4.5060808@v.loewis.de> Message-ID: <3EB21E7A.4050701@guest.arnes.si> Thank you for your answers ;) I managed to convince KBabel to work with iso-8859-2 ;)) I have translated the first 250 pieces... Now I have the problem that some things get translated and some don't ... For example ... On the listinfo page ... The whole page get translated except "GNU is not unix", "Powered by Python" and "trasfered my Mailman version ..." I have translated them in the .po file ??? And the texts in the archive don't translate at all ?? In Defaults.py I have : Default language = 'en' Add language 'sl' .... iso-8859-2 and in mm_....py where I should put my personal settings I have : Default language = 'sl' Is this correct ? Iztok (Slovenia) From martin at v.loewis.de Fri May 2 08:55:35 2003 From: martin at v.loewis.de (Martin v. =?iso-8859-15?q?L=F6wis?=) Date: Fri May 2 03:55:36 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Slovenian translation In-Reply-To: <3EB21E7A.4050701@guest.arnes.si> References: <3EB0D31D.4000908@guest.arnes.si> <3EB0D8D4.5060808@v.loewis.de> <3EB21E7A.4050701@guest.arnes.si> Message-ID: Iztok Stotl writes: > The whole page get translated except "GNU is not unix", "Powered by > Python" and "trasfered my Mailman version ..." > > I have translated them in the .po file ??? It's your choice. I would leave "GNU is not unix" untranslated. If you can find something equally punching like "Powered by Python" in Slovenian, feel free to use that; in German, "Angetrieben durch Python" doesn't sound quite convincing. > And the texts in the archive don't translate at all ?? You mean, the messages themselves? Certainly not - you can only translate the user interface, there is no way to automatically translate the messages that people have sent to the mailing list. Notice that the navigational aspects of the pipermail archive are generated HTML, so they don't change when the user changes the language. If you want the list archive in a different language, you have to regenerate the entire archive. Regards, Martin From Oliver.Egginger at dvz.fh-giessen.de Fri May 9 09:36:07 2003 From: Oliver.Egginger at dvz.fh-giessen.de (Oliver Egginger) Date: Fri May 9 04:36:09 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] German diction of email Message-ID: <1052469353.10737.43.camel@chaos.dvz.fh-giessen.de> Helo, in the german translation of mailman the dictions "e-mail", "Email" and other translations of the english word email are not correct. Email, for example, is the german word for enamel and have nothing to do with "E-Mail", which would be an accurate translation of the english word email. All german standard works suggest "E-Mail". According to this the german term for email address is "E-Mail-Adresse" and not "e-mail-Adresse" like you wrote. (See the german confirm message of this list for example.) The wrong translations are unfortunately in common use but I think you should set a good example. Also I like to thank you very much for translating this great software (mailman) into the german language. - oliver -- Oliver Egginger Giessen-Friedberg University of Applied Sciences Wiesenstrasse 14 35390 Giessen Tel. +49 641 309-1283 Fax +49 641 309-1288 From martin at v.loewis.de Fri May 9 10:39:31 2003 From: martin at v.loewis.de (Martin v. =?iso-8859-15?q?L=F6wis?=) Date: Fri May 9 05:39:33 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] German diction of email In-Reply-To: <1052469353.10737.43.camel@chaos.dvz.fh-giessen.de> References: <1052469353.10737.43.camel@chaos.dvz.fh-giessen.de> Message-ID: Oliver Egginger writes: > The wrong translations are unfortunately in common use but I think > you should set a good example. Hi Oliver, I agree this is a desirable change. AFAICT, the German translation was by Peer Heinlein (p.heinlein@jpberlin.de, CC'ed). Unless Peer gives a reason why this change shouldn't be made, I'd encourage you to produce a systematic patch to all HTML templates and messages.po that carries out this change (use diff -c to produce such a patch). > Also I like to thank you very much for translating this great software > (mailman) into the german language. Das ist wohl vor allem Peers Verdienst. Wie bei jedem ?bersetzungsprojekt stellen die Softwareautoren nur die Infrastruktur bereit; die eigentlichen ?bersetzungen kommen von Freiwilligen aus aller Welt. Diese Leute sind dann oft auch die Einzigen, die Lob oder Kritik an der ?bersetzung w?rdigen k?nnen: die eigentlichen Entwickler sprechen die Sprache ja gar nicht. Ciao, Martin From p.heinlein at jpberlin.de Fri May 9 13:23:47 2003 From: p.heinlein at jpberlin.de (Peer Heinlein) Date: Fri May 9 06:23:54 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] German diction of email In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200305091223.47322.p.heinlein@jpberlin.de> Am Freitag, 9. Mai 2003 11:39 schrieben Sie: > I agree this is a desirable change. AFAICT, the German translation was > by Peer Heinlein (p.heinlein@jpberlin.de, CC'ed). Unless Peer gives a > reason why this change shouldn't be made, I'd encourage you to produce > a systematic patch to all HTML templates and messages.po that carries > out this change (use diff -c to produce such a patch). I startet taking care of the translation last december and there has been a lot of untranslated and wrong translated stuff. I finished translating all the untranslated stuff and started some days ago cleaning up all the wrong stuff. It seems that in the past somebody used a computer program to translate Mailman. :-) There`s really a lot of ugly stuff and grammar in it. On my list is also the standardisation of the translation for "email" and "mailing list". I`ll do this in the next days. Peer From barry at python.org Fri May 9 09:36:01 2003 From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Fri May 9 08:36:35 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] German diction of email In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Friday, May 9, 2003, at 05:39 AM, Martin v. L?wis wrote: > I agree this is a desirable change. AFAICT, the German translation was > by Peer Heinlein (p.heinlein@jpberlin.de, CC'ed). Unless Peer gives a > reason why this change shouldn't be made, I'd encourage you to produce > a systematic patch to all HTML templates and messages.po that carries > out this change (use diff -c to produce such a patch). If Martin and Peer don't mind, please send the patch to them and they can feel free to just install it (if possible, on the trunk and the 2.1 maint branch -- I just gave you checkin privs Martin :). Otherwise, if you send the patch to me, unified diffs (diff -u) are preferred. Cheers, -Barry From tkikuchi at is.kochi-u.ac.jp Tue May 13 17:40:22 2003 From: tkikuchi at is.kochi-u.ac.jp (Tokio Kikuchi) Date: Tue May 13 03:42:19 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Re: [Mailman-Users] two errors causing shunting. References: <3EBEE092.8060901@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <20030512073135.GC27240@dawning.com.cn> Message-ID: <3EC0A166.9070506@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> Hi, chinese users. I was playing on the ChineseCodecs and made a tar ball suitable for including in the mailman distribution. http://mm.tkikuchi.net/ChineseCodecs-1.1.0p.tar.gz Place it in the $(sourcedir)/misc and you will have to rewite Makefile.in and paths.py.in then configure and make install. Rewriting is rather easy because there are ja and ko entries. Please test if it works for you. Cheers, clay@dawning.com.cn wrote: > On Mon, May 12, 2003 at 08:45:22AM +0900, Tokio Kikuchi wrote: > >>Hi, >> >>Sumeet wrote: >> >>>I have two errors that cause most of my shunting with a stock mailman >>>2.1.2 and Python 2.2.2 both compiled on Red Hat 9 w/ stock 2.4.20-8 >>>kernel. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. They are: >>> >> -- Tokio Kikuchi, tkikuchi@ is.kochi-u.ac.jp http://weather.is.kochi-u.ac.jp/ From barry at python.org Tue May 13 14:06:28 2003 From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Tue May 13 09:06:31 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Re: [Mailman-Users] two errors causing shunting. In-Reply-To: <3EC0A166.9070506@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> References: <3EBEE092.8060901@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <20030512073135.GC27240@dawning.com.cn> <3EC0A166.9070506@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> Message-ID: <1052831142.15814.14.camel@anthem> On Tue, 2003-05-13 at 03:40, Tokio Kikuchi wrote: > Hi, chinese users. > > I was playing on the ChineseCodecs and made a tar ball suitable > for including in the mailman distribution. > http://mm.tkikuchi.net/ChineseCodecs-1.1.0p.tar.gz > Place it in the $(sourcedir)/misc and you will have to rewite > Makefile.in and paths.py.in then configure and make install. > Rewriting is rather easy because there are ja and ko entries. > > Please test if it works for you. Should we include this in the standard distro? Are the Chinese translations even good enough to claim Chinese support? I have the feeling that they've languished for quite a while (unfortunately). -Barry From barry at python.org Tue May 13 15:25:07 2003 From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Tue May 13 10:25:08 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Re: [Mailman-Users] two errors causing shunting. In-Reply-To: <20030513133405.GJ11389@dawning.com.cn> References: <3EBEE092.8060901@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <20030512073135.GC27240@dawning.com.cn> <3EC0A166.9070506@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <1052831142.15814.14.camel@anthem> <20030513133405.GJ11389@dawning.com.cn> Message-ID: <1052835867.1222.3.camel@barry> On Tue, 2003-05-13 at 09:34, clay@dawning.com.cn wrote: > I've tried the Chinese translation(GB) coming with MM2.1.2, and it's > a bit partial, the web interfaces are a mixture of both Chinese and > English. > > I did see on www.list.org i18n pages that someone is heading up the > Simplified Chinese translation. If he's stopped for some reason, I'd > be rather happy to pick up his work and go on maintaining both the > codecs and translations of Simplified Chinese. That would be great Isaac. I haven't seen any updates to Chinese in a long time, so anything you can provide would be appreciated. I'm Cc'ing Max Yu who is currently mentioned as the Chinese champion to see if he's still interested in helping out. -Barry From clay at dawning.com.cn Tue May 13 22:34:05 2003 From: clay at dawning.com.cn (clay@dawning.com.cn) Date: Tue May 13 10:27:11 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Re: [Mailman-Users] two errors causing shunting. In-Reply-To: <1052831142.15814.14.camel@anthem> References: <3EBEE092.8060901@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <20030512073135.GC27240@dawning.com.cn> <3EC0A166.9070506@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <1052831142.15814.14.camel@anthem> Message-ID: <20030513133405.GJ11389@dawning.com.cn> On Tue, May 13, 2003 at 09:05:42AM -0400, Barry Warsaw wrote: > On Tue, 2003-05-13 at 03:40, Tokio Kikuchi wrote: > > Hi, chinese users. > > > > I was playing on the ChineseCodecs and made a tar ball suitable > > for including in the mailman distribution. > > http://mm.tkikuchi.net/ChineseCodecs-1.1.0p.tar.gz > > Place it in the $(sourcedir)/misc and you will have to rewite > > Makefile.in and paths.py.in then configure and make install. > > Rewriting is rather easy because there are ja and ko entries. > > > > Please test if it works for you. > > Should we include this in the standard distro? Are the Chinese > translations even good enough to claim Chinese support? I have the > feeling that they've languished for quite a while (unfortunately). > > -Barry > I've tried the Chinese translation(GB) coming with MM2.1.2, and it's a bit partial, the web interfaces are a mixture of both Chinese and English. I did see on www.list.org i18n pages that someone is heading up the Simplified Chinese translation. If he's stopped for some reason, I'd be rather happy to pick up his work and go on maintaining both the codecs and translations of Simplified Chinese. -Isaac -- Isaac Claymore /"\ ASCII Ribbon Campaign Dawning Inc. \ / Respect for open standards Beijing, China X No HTML/RTF in email http://www.dawning.com.cn / \ No M$ Word docs in email From christophe at eitic.info Tue May 13 17:31:27 2003 From: christophe at eitic.info (Christophe) Date: Tue May 13 10:32:41 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] contribution =?iso-8859-1?q?=E0_la_traduction_en_fran=E7ais?= Message-ID: <3EC101BF.6030909@eitic.info> Bonjour, En tant qu'utilisateur de "mailman", j'ai remarqu? que la traduction fran?aise n'?tait pas compl?te et parfois imparfaite. Je me propose donc de contribuer, si vous le souhaitez, ? poursuivre avec vous la traduction de "mailman". Je vous remercie par avance de m'indiquer la marche ? suivre. Cordialement. C.Boutet From martin at v.loewis.de Tue May 13 16:22:02 2003 From: martin at v.loewis.de (Martin v. =?iso-8859-15?q?L=F6wis?=) Date: Tue May 13 11:22:03 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] contribution =?iso-8859-1?q?=E0?= la traduction en =?iso-8859-1?q?fran=E7ais?= In-Reply-To: <3EC101BF.6030909@eitic.info> References: <3EC101BF.6030909@eitic.info> Message-ID: Christophe writes: > Je me propose donc de contribuer, si vous le souhaitez, ? poursuivre > avec vous la traduction de "mailman". > > Je vous remercie par avance de m'indiquer la marche ? suivre. Dear Christophe, AFAICT, Ousmane Wilane (wilane@yahoo.com, CC'ed) is currently championing the French translation. Contributions are certainly welcome. Unless Ousmane suggests otherwise, I'd encourage you to produce a patch (diff -u) for the message catalog and the templates. If you have any questions on the technicalities, don't hesitate to ask. A+, Martin From max.yu at turbolinux.com.cn Wed May 14 10:41:45 2003 From: max.yu at turbolinux.com.cn (Max Yu) Date: Tue May 13 23:33:14 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Re: [Mailman-Users] two errors causing shunting. In-Reply-To: <1052835867.1222.3.camel@barry> References: <3EBEE092.8060901@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <20030512073135.GC27240@dawning.com.cn> <3EC0A166.9070506@is.kochi-u.ac.jp> <1052831142.15814.14.camel@anthem> <20030513133405.GJ11389@dawning.com.cn> <1052835867.1222.3.camel@barry> Message-ID: <3EC19ED9.3050208@turbolinux.com.cn> Isaac, it will be great if you can take over both the Chinese simplified(GB) and Chinese traditional(Big5) translation work. Thanks! Best Regards Max Barry Warsaw wrote: >On Tue, 2003-05-13 at 09:34, clay@dawning.com.cn wrote: > > > >>I've tried the Chinese translation(GB) coming with MM2.1.2, and it's >>a bit partial, the web interfaces are a mixture of both Chinese and >>English. >> >>I did see on www.list.org i18n pages that someone is heading up the >>Simplified Chinese translation. If he's stopped for some reason, I'd >>be rather happy to pick up his work and go on maintaining both the >>codecs and translations of Simplified Chinese. >> >> > >That would be great Isaac. I haven't seen any updates to Chinese in a >long time, so anything you can provide would be appreciated. I'm Cc'ing >Max Yu who is currently mentioned as the Chinese champion to see if he's >still interested in helping out. > >-Barry > > > From george at lyon.inserm.fr Wed May 14 10:12:38 2003 From: george at lyon.inserm.fr (george) Date: Wed May 14 03:12:48 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] french translation In-Reply-To: References: <3EC101BF.6030909@eitic.info> Message-ID: <3EC1EC66.7040704@lyon.inserm.fr> Martin v. L?wis a ?crit: > Christophe writes: > > >>Je me propose donc de contribuer, si vous le souhaitez, ? poursuivre >>avec vous la traduction de "mailman". >> >>Je vous remercie par avance de m'indiquer la marche ? suivre. > > > Dear Christophe, > > AFAICT, Ousmane Wilane (wilane@yahoo.com, CC'ed) is currently > championing the French translation. Contributions are certainly > welcome. Unless Ousmane suggests otherwise, I'd encourage you to > produce a patch (diff -u) for the message catalog and the templates. > If you have any questions on the technicalities, don't hesitate to > ask. > > A+, > Martin > > > _______________________________________________ > Mailman-i18n mailing list > Mailman-i18n@python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-i18n > Hi everybody, Ousmane is actually too busy (he's a father now !) to head up the french translation team, we hope he will be back soon ;-) For the french translation effort, whe have a specific list hosted by Fil at http://listes.rezo.net/mailman/listinfo/mailman-fr -- Pascal GEORGE From tehlers at freenet.de Wed May 21 23:35:29 2003 From: tehlers at freenet.de (Torsten Ehlers) Date: Thu May 22 09:15:53 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Changing the default language Message-ID: <3ECBE311.4060300@freenet.de> Hi, I'm sorry to ask a question like this in this list, but there's no information about it on the website. At http://www.list.org/i18n.html it says that Mailman can be set to different languages, such as German. Unfortunately, there's absolutely no hint how this can be done. Can anybody tell me how to achieve this or where to find documentation about it, please? Thanks a lot! Torsten From barry at python.org Thu May 22 10:19:14 2003 From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw) Date: Thu May 22 09:20:19 2003 Subject: [Mailman-i18n] Changing the default language In-Reply-To: <3ECBE311.4060300@freenet.de> Message-ID: On Wednesday, May 21, 2003, at 04:35 PM, Torsten Ehlers wrote: > I'm sorry to ask a question like this in this list, but there's no > information about it on the website. At http://www.list.org/i18n.html > it says that Mailman can be set to different languages, such as > German. Unfortunately, there's absolutely no hint how this can be > done. Can anybody tell me how to achieve this or where to find > documentation about it, please? Change DEFAULT_SERVER_LANGUAGE in mm_cfg.py See Defaults.py for details (but don't edit this file!) -Barry