[IronPython] Python Pages -- web application stack (like django, rails, ...)

Thu Jun 12 20:47:02 CEST 2008

Integration between Silverlight and web frameworks for IronRuby and IronPython is definitely an awesome thing. John and I showed this stuff with Rails at RailsConf (we're working on getting that announced; let me know if you interested in it and I can send stuff your way), and Dino did something with Django at the past PyCon.

~js

> -----Original Message-----
> From: users-bounces at lists.ironpython.com [mailto:users-
> bounces at lists.ironpython.com] On Behalf Of Michael Foord
> Sent: Thursday, June 12, 2008 2:41 AM
> To: Discussion of IronPython
> Subject: Re: [IronPython] Python Pages -- web application stack (like
> django, rails, ...)
>
> The Silverlight integration is a *great* idea - but there really are a
> lot of Python web frameworks and template languages out there. I'm
> afraid realistically you're unlikely to get more than a handful of
> users
> - but if you enjoy coding it then there is no reason to stop.
>
> You might have more people *using* your code if you build good
> Silverlight support for one of the other web frameworks though.
>
> Web frameworks:
>
> Django
> Turbogears
> Pylons
> PSP (Python Server Pages - with Python as a templating language I
> believe)
> Karrigell
> web.py
> CherrPy (really an application server)
> Zope and Plone
> Webware
> Twisted and Nevow
> Quixote or Asyncore
> Spyce (also uses Python as a templating language)
> Porcupine
> Skunkweb
>
> There are also plenty of templating languages:
>
> Stan (used by Nevow)
> Genshi
> Cheetah
> Mako
> ZPT (Zope)
> SimpleTal (another Zope one)
> Kid
> Django template language
> PTL (Python templating language used by Quixote)
> Clearsilver (written in C with bindings for many languages)
> PyMeld
>
> Actually I disagree that yours uses Python - it uses something that
> looks a bit like Python...
>
> I've never found indentation to be a problem in templating with Python.
> I (of course) have my own templating system that uses unadorned Python
> in templates - and I use it for rest2web (generate static html pages
> for
> a website from text source and templates) and Firedrop2 (Python blog
> client). You can see the templating system documented here:
>
> http://www.voidspace.org.uk/python/rest2web/templating.html
>
> All the best,
>
> Michael Foord
> http://www.ironpythoninaction.com/
>
>
>
> Jonathan Slenders wrote:
> >
> >
> > 2008/6/12 Jonathan Slenders <jonathan at slenders.be
> > <mailto:jonathan at slenders.be>>:
> >
> >
> >
> >     2008/6/12 Tim Roberts <timr at probo.com <mailto:timr at probo.com>>:
> >
> >         On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 01:09:01 +0200, "Jonathan Slenders"
> >         <jonathan at slenders.be <mailto:jonathan at slenders.be>>
> >
> >             I'm working on a web application framework in Python, and
> >             just uploaded the
> >             first release.
> >
> >             Now I quote from my own README. What it actually does is:
> >
> >             - Provide an easy way to embed Python code into HTML,
> >             similar to PHP, JPS
> >             and other server side languages.
> >             - Make reusing HTML very easy. It uses concepts like
> >             master pages and
> >              including of other pages as a control. This is a very
> >             rich template
> >              mechanism.
> >             ...
> >
> >
> >
> >         May I ask what motivated you to create this from scratch?
> >          There are a number of excellent Python web application
> >         frameworks available today, several of which have syntax and
> >         functionality almost exactly like yours.
> >
> >         I'm not trying to say you shouldn't do such a thing, but
> >         people in the world at large already complain there are too
> >         many web frameworks for Python.  I'm just wondering why you
> >         didn't choose one of the existing frameworks that was close
> to
> >         what you wanted, and become a contributor to that.  Was there
> >         something you thought was fundamentally missing from the
> others?
> >
> >
> >     Dear Tim,
> >
> >     You should know that I've been working on this project for about
> a
> >     year and a half. Apart from Django, I didn't know even one
> >     framework that I liked during this development. (Actually, at the
> >     start I didn't know about Django, later on I did and realised it
> >     was good but had my reasons not to use it. I'm not going to
> >     discuss it now.)
> >
> >     All that time it's just been the back-end for my personal web
> site
> >     - I had never the intend to publish it. But the framework became
> >     gradually more and more extensive and since a half year I
> realized
> >     that it was well designed and could compete with others.
> >     Some of my best friends are very active Django users, and when I
> >     showed my framework, they also said that it was pretty similar to
> >     that.
> >
> >     If you know that many Python web frameworks, I'd really like to
> >     hear about it. (I've seen several, yes, but some were very
> >     outdated and and not maintained anymore)
> >     Because I don't know much of them it's hard to say what I missed.
> >     But what I wanted was:
> >
> >     - query parameters should be available as variables, but they
> >     shouldn't be unpacked by default as was in PHP years ago (I want
> >     to declare the variables that should be accepted)
> >     - It *should* work perfectly well without database. (at the start
> >     of this project, my hosting had no database)
> >     - code should be reusable with master pages like ASP.net does
> >     - when a master page is stored in another directory than the
> url's
> >     ("<a href=...".) should be rewritten in a way so that they are
> >     always reusable to the page from where the are generated
> >     - form input fields should be available as objects.
> >
> >     Again, I didn't know any framework that does all this. Django
> >     needs a database (not?) and the others which I found were crap,
> >     sorry....
> >
> >     Jonathan
> >
> >
> >
> > OK, I have to take my word back. Django can run without database. But
> > still, it's totally different, it has a custom template language,
> > while I'm actually using Python itself als template language. Pylons
> > -- what I just found -- also seems to have a custom (and thus
> limited)
> > template language. I think this is unique, isn't it?
> >
> >
> >
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