From adityaatluri.py at gmail.com  Sun Sep  1 17:20:25 2013
From: adityaatluri.py at gmail.com (Aditya Atluri)
Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 20:50:25 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Feedback on Pycon
Message-ID: <CABV65zC7ZD=0Z15+2ZUUMpEa4JjW=KE_pU-GkAVD7QZnzfefYQ@mail.gmail.com>

I have one word. Awesome. The time management is the best thing you
managed. Food is delicious. A hundred thumbs up for all organisers and
volunteers. Thank you

Aditya Avinash Atluri,
Sent from HTC One S.
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From abdulmuneer at gmail.com  Sun Sep  1 17:38:38 2013
From: abdulmuneer at gmail.com (Abdul Muneer)
Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 21:08:38 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] This Pycon was Awesome!!!
Message-ID: <CAMJTfg=2H9K-nupBNYyLXfNqqoqr+0GvLwn_TDRF+7sKD+TSKA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,
This was a fantastic edition of Pycon India!! Thank you all for pulling it
off. It was a complete improvement in all aspects when compared to last
year. The organizers have taken all the feedback from previous years and
ensured improvement.

Quality of the talks, the venue and the facilities - there is no area that
was not improved over the previous years. We may not be absolutely perfect
yet (especially regarding quality of a few talks), but we have come a long
way.

We even had novel initiatives like Python Month and Panel Discussion this
year which stood out. I also think limiting the number of tracks helped in
better coordination and arrangement. Having dedicated workshops also helped.

All organizers and volunteers, take a bow. Heartfelt thanks to you all.
Regards,
Abdul Muneer

--
Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>
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From scorpion032 at gmail.com  Sun Sep  1 20:18:07 2013
From: scorpion032 at gmail.com (Lakshman Prasad)
Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 23:48:07 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] This Pycon was Awesome!!!
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfg=2H9K-nupBNYyLXfNqqoqr+0GvLwn_TDRF+7sKD+TSKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMJTfg=2H9K-nupBNYyLXfNqqoqr+0GvLwn_TDRF+7sKD+TSKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALXpfWqULvko5hcyM2zrRb_H-yw=wGpqLzPnKyhGTF-pwmqd8g@mail.gmail.com>

+1

I feel very similar! Great job for pulling off an awesome event!


On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 9:08 PM, Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi All,
> This was a fantastic edition of Pycon India!! Thank you all for pulling it
> off. It was a complete improvement in all aspects when compared to last
> year. The organizers have taken all the feedback from previous years and
> ensured improvement.
>
> Quality of the talks, the venue and the facilities - there is no area that
> was not improved over the previous years. We may not be absolutely perfect
> yet (especially regarding quality of a few talks), but we have come a long
> way.
>
> We even had novel initiatives like Python Month and Panel Discussion this
> year which stood out. I also think limiting the number of tracks helped in
> better coordination and arrangement. Having dedicated workshops also helped.
>
> All organizers and volunteers, take a bow. Heartfelt thanks to you all.
> Regards,
> Abdul Muneer
>
> --
> Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>
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From anilkumar.tammineni at gmail.com  Mon Sep  2 04:59:23 2013
From: anilkumar.tammineni at gmail.com (Anil Kumar Chowdary)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 08:29:23 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] This Pycon was Awesome!!!
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfg=2H9K-nupBNYyLXfNqqoqr+0GvLwn_TDRF+7sKD+TSKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMJTfg=2H9K-nupBNYyLXfNqqoqr+0GvLwn_TDRF+7sKD+TSKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFHszfGf5rti666VE0iVuk7XD8wWAaS4Ce7VFrCRAYsWBjAcBA@mail.gmail.com>

+1
2nd of the conference rocks :)




2013/9/1 Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com>

> Hi All,
> This was a fantastic edition of Pycon India!! Thank you all for pulling it
> off. It was a complete improvement in all aspects when compared to last
> year. The organizers have taken all the feedback from previous years and
> ensured improvement.
>
> Quality of the talks, the venue and the facilities - there is no area that
> was not improved over the previous years. We may not be absolutely perfect
> yet (especially regarding quality of a few talks), but we have come a long
> way.
>
> We even had novel initiatives like Python Month and Panel Discussion this
> year which stood out. I also think limiting the number of tracks helped in
> better coordination and arrangement. Having dedicated workshops also helped.
>
> All organizers and volunteers, take a bow. Heartfelt thanks to you all.
> Regards,
> Abdul Muneer
>
> --
> Follow me on Twitter: @abdulmuneer <http://twitter.com/#%21/abdulmuneer>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Mon Sep  2 08:42:50 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2013 12:12:50 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Points to ponder
Message-ID: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>


First of all, Congratulations to everyone involved in running this. The
conference was a definite improvement over the past few years.

Here are some points I have that we should consider. 

1. We need more "heads" that decide all details of each activity. Just
   like Vishal headed the a/v thing. I'm saying this because for things
   like open spaces, there were issues like opening up the one on top, A/C
   in audi 3 etc. These are decisions that Anand and Vijay shouldn't
   have to bother about. There should be one guy in charge of this and
   that's that. It will make management much more smooth. 

2. We have to keep a note of FAQs people ask. I'm emphasising the "F" in
   FAQ. One example. Lots of people got confused about the workshop
   tickets and having to pay separately for them. We should really call
   them "Python workshops before PyCon India" or something similar and have
   maybe even have a separate doattend page for them. Anything to make them
   distinct from the main conference registrations.

3. We need to make the conference more woman friendly. It was better
   than last time but female participants especially from outside
   Bangalore asked about things like accomodation, travel etc. These are
   important and we need to have something in place for them. I'd very
   much like organisations like pyladies to take a more active role in
   matters like this.

4. We need to have way more time for the CFP and for talk
   selection. This time was much better and I think we hit a decent
   method. Now, we just need to scale it up.

5. Let's open up a small lightning talk registration online before the
   event starts? Might get more interesting people. 

6. More work on panels. 

Thanks.

-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From benignbala at gmail.com  Mon Sep  2 08:54:37 2013
From: benignbala at gmail.com (Balachandran Sivakumar)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 12:24:37 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] This Pycon was Awesome!!!
In-Reply-To: <CAMJTfg=2H9K-nupBNYyLXfNqqoqr+0GvLwn_TDRF+7sKD+TSKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMJTfg=2H9K-nupBNYyLXfNqqoqr+0GvLwn_TDRF+7sKD+TSKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMbkTgK4+FHaE15X3GQVHNT3+JnQtjL9Ap-rLFMe6Oqe9eZ7Cg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi  all,

On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 9:08 PM, Abdul Muneer <abdulmuneer at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi All,
> This was a fantastic edition of Pycon India!! Thank you all for pulling it
> off. It was a complete improvement in all aspects when compared to last
> year. The organizers have taken all the feedback from previous years and

    Exactly what I wanted to say :) Everything was managed really
well. Specifically, the venue was excellent. The acoustics a lot lot
better than what we had last year. A big thanks and congrats to the
organisers and volunteers for their efforts and dedication.

>
> We even had novel initiatives like Python Month and Panel Discussion this
> year which stood out. I also think limiting the number of tracks helped in
> better coordination and arrangement. Having dedicated workshops also helped.
>

          The Panel discussion was a very good addition. We probably
have to have the discussions on planning it in much wider problems and
try to have a panel discussion on the most pertinent issue emerging
from those discussions. Thanks again for the initiative and organising
it. Separating out the workshops was good. And lot of the presenters,
if not all, were people who had prior experience in presenting to a
non-trivial sized audience.

          The venue, food, and organising - everything has improved
infinitely. In all, a very nice PyCon. Thanks


-- 
Thank you
Balachandran Sivakumar

Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
                                                             - Swami Vivekananda

Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/

From palakmathur at gmail.com  Mon Sep  2 09:22:33 2013
From: palakmathur at gmail.com (Palak Mathur)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 02:22:33 -0500
Subject: [Inpycon] Points to ponder
In-Reply-To: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAFtxF+dgV3hJg-os4Kj9mV1Hq09KUhHJ4oyBYm8up=3Ua3PH0w@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 1:42 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> 2. We have to keep a note of FAQs people ask. I'm emphasising the "F" in
>    FAQ. One example. Lots of people got confused about the workshop
>    tickets and having to pay separately for them. We should really call
>    them "Python workshops before PyCon India" or something similar and have
>    maybe even have a separate doattend page for them. Anything to make them
>    distinct from the main conference registrations.
>

I had created a FAQ page for PyCon India 2012. I think most of the
questions can be reused.
Just check the answers if they incorporate the current scenario or not.


Regards,
Palak Mathur
http://palakmathur.in <http://palakmathur.github.com/>
http://aatmiyata.wordpress.com
http://palakclicks.wordpress.com
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From palakmathur at gmail.com  Mon Sep  2 09:23:28 2013
From: palakmathur at gmail.com (Palak Mathur)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 02:23:28 -0500
Subject: [Inpycon] Points to ponder
In-Reply-To: <CAFtxF+dgV3hJg-os4Kj9mV1Hq09KUhHJ4oyBYm8up=3Ua3PH0w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFtxF+dgV3hJg-os4Kj9mV1Hq09KUhHJ4oyBYm8up=3Ua3PH0w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFtxF+f-s+8BbXrn3ooWgDXGpY+_vmw5J-j1Y6Ffhk=QndXTSw@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 2:22 AM, Palak Mathur <palakmathur at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 1:42 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
>
>> 2. We have to keep a note of FAQs people ask. I'm emphasising the "F" in
>>    FAQ. One example. Lots of people got confused about the workshop
>>    tickets and having to pay separately for them. We should really call
>>    them "Python workshops before PyCon India" or something similar and
>> have
>>    maybe even have a separate doattend page for them. Anything to make
>> them
>>    distinct from the main conference registrations.
>>
>
> I had created a FAQ page for PyCon India 2012. I think most of the
> questions can be reused.
> Just check the answers if they incorporate the current scenario or not.
>

Link to the 2012 FAQs:- http://in.pycon.org/2012/faqs
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From kinitrupti at yahoo.co.in  Mon Sep  2 12:04:18 2013
From: kinitrupti at yahoo.co.in (trupti kini)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 18:04:18 +0800 (SGT)
Subject: [Inpycon] Points to ponder
In-Reply-To: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1378116258.93286.YahooMailNeo@web192205.mail.sg3.yahoo.com>



>3. We need to make the conference more woman friendly. It was better
>???than last time but female participants especially from outside
>???Bangalore asked about things like accomodation, travel etc. These are
>???important and we need to have something in place for them. I'd very
>???much like organisations like pyladies to take a more active role in
>???matters like this.


Yes this will really help as I had raised this question but ya could manage the accomodation at the last moment. Yes this was the first PyCon I attended and it was really well organised. Will soon write a blog and come with the link here


>5. Let's open up a small lightning talk registration online before the
>???event starts? Might get more interesting people. 
>

Yes looking forward to listen or might present next time.

>6. More work on panels.?
I agree

>
>Thanks.
>
>-- 
>Cordially,
>Noufal
>http://nibrahim.net.in

From dhruvbaldawa at gmail.com  Mon Sep  2 14:07:40 2013
From: dhruvbaldawa at gmail.com (Dhruv Baldawa)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 17:37:40 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] [gsoc-india] Re: A BoF session about Google Summer of
 Code at PyConIndia tomorrow
In-Reply-To: <6181efe9-01ff-4e1b-a822-4fde54efcbfd@googlegroups.com>
References: <CABfQQTzeSL3vJTbFzOtX+CVh=31g_2OsQ_VNU62Tm7ML8WY6PA@mail.gmail.com>
 <6181efe9-01ff-4e1b-a822-4fde54efcbfd@googlegroups.com>
Message-ID: <CAC5Hnji26sSho81KHyyWruvq-bsX5pd-dPPt405=KnaK+7gwyw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
It was awesome meeting everyone at PyCon. Sarup, can you make the
spreadsheet you created earlier public ? Everyone can add/update their
details accordingly.

--
Dhruv Baldawa
(http://www.dhruvb.com)


On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 5:09 PM, Anuj Deshpande <anujdeshpande92 at gmail.com>wrote:

> Could we have the group photo posted here ?
>
>
> On Saturday, August 31, 2013 11:55:18 PM UTC+5:30, Amber Jain wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> I hope that everyone who was a PyCon India today enjoyed it a lot (like I
>> did).
>>
>> I'm a Google Summer of Code 2012 intern. I met over a dozen fellow
>> GSoCers at PyCon India today. I'm sure that there are other ex-GSoC interns
>> roaming around at PyConIndia's venue. Dhananjay (another ex-GSoCer)
>> suggested to do a BoF [1] session to talk about GSoC. All current/past GSoC
>> interns/mentors (as well as those who are interested in applying to GSoC in
>> future) are invited. I guess this will be the first time GSoC interns from
>> different years and from different states of India will be together at one
>> place.
>>
>> Please note, afaik, you can only attend PyCon India if you purchased a
>> ticket from http://in.pycon.org/2013/.  I'm sorry but we can't do
>> anything about this. Please make sure that you have a PyCon India ticket
>> before you plan to attend this event.
>>
>> Date: September 1, 2013
>> Time: 12:15pm
>> Venue: PyCon India Open Space (Auditorium 3 at NIMHANS Convention Center:
>> https://maps.google.com/maps?**q=NIMHANS+convention+centre+**
>> bangalore&t=m&z=13<https://maps.google.com/maps?q=NIMHANS+convention+centre+bangalore&t=m&z=13>
>> ).
>>
>> See you there!
>>
>>
>> [0] http://www.google-melange.com/**gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013<http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/homepage/google/gsoc2013>
>> [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Birds_of_a_feather_%**28computing%29<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birds_of_a_feather_%28computing%29>
>>
>> --
>> Amber Jain
>> i.ambe... at gmail.com
>> http://amberj.devio.us/
>>
>  --
>
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Google Summer of Code - Indian Community" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to gsoc-india+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/gsoc-india.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
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From sbanskota08 at gmail.com  Mon Sep  2 14:36:48 2013
From: sbanskota08 at gmail.com (Sarup Banskota)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 18:06:48 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] [gsoc-india] Re: A BoF session about Google Summer of
 Code at PyConIndia tomorrow
In-Reply-To: <CAC5Hnji26sSho81KHyyWruvq-bsX5pd-dPPt405=KnaK+7gwyw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABfQQTzeSL3vJTbFzOtX+CVh=31g_2OsQ_VNU62Tm7ML8WY6PA@mail.gmail.com>
 <6181efe9-01ff-4e1b-a822-4fde54efcbfd@googlegroups.com>
 <CAC5Hnji26sSho81KHyyWruvq-bsX5pd-dPPt405=KnaK+7gwyw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABfbgvtMWcfMo+TS5Qz4D0w_GZ1onB32p_ecXFYtkLU0D-wKDg@mail.gmail.com>

>
> Hi,
> It was awesome meeting everyone at PyCon. Sarup, can you make the
> spreadsheet you created earlier public ? Everyone can add/update their
> details accordingly.
>

Done!
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From modi.konark at gmail.com  Mon Sep  2 16:02:05 2013
From: modi.konark at gmail.com (konark modi)
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 19:32:05 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Points to ponder
In-Reply-To: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAPhs5j_ExSc+gV=txnOQtXOOgn778A1Uy_aAkMY05THMBmapJA@mail.gmail.com>

Was an amazing conference, I have had one of the best experiences of being
part as a volunteer and work with a great and super awesome team which I
would cherish for long.

Was looking forward for some insights from the organizing team on :

1. Which are the areas of bottle neck during the initial planning because
of which kind of get delayed in starting , if we could help reduce those
bottle necks, involve more people probably we can start with lot of things
early.

2. Kiran had given a useful suggestion on maintain a hand-book via PyCon
git repo, to push all check-lists. (I'll be doing that for all the
templates used for volunteering purposes.)

3. If we start early we can break the tasks into chunks and let focused
groups work on them, otherwise we end up having same people work on lot of
different things, which makes it tough on them.

Will update as and when have more ideas.

Regards
Konark


On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 12:12 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

>
> First of all, Congratulations to everyone involved in running this. The
> conference was a definite improvement over the past few years.
>
> Here are some points I have that we should consider.
>
> 1. We need more "heads" that decide all details of each activity. Just
>    like Vishal headed the a/v thing. I'm saying this because for things
>    like open spaces, there were issues like opening up the one on top, A/C
>    in audi 3 etc. These are decisions that Anand and Vijay shouldn't
>    have to bother about. There should be one guy in charge of this and
>    that's that. It will make management much more smooth.
>
> 2. We have to keep a note of FAQs people ask. I'm emphasising the "F" in
>    FAQ. One example. Lots of people got confused about the workshop
>    tickets and having to pay separately for them. We should really call
>    them "Python workshops before PyCon India" or something similar and have
>    maybe even have a separate doattend page for them. Anything to make them
>    distinct from the main conference registrations.
>
> 3. We need to make the conference more woman friendly. It was better
>    than last time but female participants especially from outside
>    Bangalore asked about things like accomodation, travel etc. These are
>    important and we need to have something in place for them. I'd very
>    much like organisations like pyladies to take a more active role in
>    matters like this.
>
> 4. We need to have way more time for the CFP and for talk
>    selection. This time was much better and I think we hit a decent
>    method. Now, we just need to scale it up.
>
> 5. Let's open up a small lightning talk registration online before the
>    event starts? Might get more interesting people.
>
> 6. More work on panels.
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
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From me at bibhas.in  Tue Sep  3 06:41:04 2013
From: me at bibhas.in (Bibhas)
Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2013 10:11:04 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Points to ponder
In-Reply-To: <CAPhs5j_ExSc+gV=txnOQtXOOgn778A1Uy_aAkMY05THMBmapJA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAPhs5j_ExSc+gV=txnOQtXOOgn778A1Uy_aAkMY05THMBmapJA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <bc988f4e-d1e9-4710-b537-5ec71c4c4e3a@email.android.com>



konark modi <modi.konark at gmail.com> wrote:
>Was an amazing conference, I have had one of the best experiences of
>being
>part as a volunteer and work with a great and super awesome team which
>I
>would cherish for long.
>
>Was looking forward for some insights from the organizing team on :
>
>1. Which are the areas of bottle neck during the initial planning
>because
>of which kind of get delayed in starting , if we could help reduce
>those
>bottle necks, involve more people probably we can start with lot of
>things
>early.
>
>2. Kiran had given a useful suggestion on maintain a hand-book via
>PyCon
>git repo, to push all check-lists. (I'll be doing that for all the
>templates used for volunteering purposes.)
>

We thought of doing it last year, called it PyCon handbook but it got lost in discussions. I think we should start as soon as possible with this, before our memories betray us. 

>3. If we start early we can break the tasks into chunks and let focused
>groups work on them, otherwise we end up having same people work on lot
>of
>different things, which makes it tough on them.
>
>Will update as and when have more ideas.
>
>Regards
>Konark
>
>
>On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 12:12 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
><noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
>
>>
>> First of all, Congratulations to everyone involved in running this.
>The
>> conference was a definite improvement over the past few years.
>>
>> Here are some points I have that we should consider.
>>
>> 1. We need more "heads" that decide all details of each activity.
>Just
>>    like Vishal headed the a/v thing. I'm saying this because for
>things
>>    like open spaces, there were issues like opening up the one on
>top, A/C
>>    in audi 3 etc. These are decisions that Anand and Vijay shouldn't
>>    have to bother about. There should be one guy in charge of this
>and
>>    that's that. It will make management much more smooth.
>>
>> 2. We have to keep a note of FAQs people ask. I'm emphasising the "F"
>in
>>    FAQ. One example. Lots of people got confused about the workshop
>>    tickets and having to pay separately for them. We should really
>call
>>    them "Python workshops before PyCon India" or something similar
>and have
>>    maybe even have a separate doattend page for them. Anything to
>make them
>>    distinct from the main conference registrations.
>>
>> 3. We need to make the conference more woman friendly. It was better
>>    than last time but female participants especially from outside
>>    Bangalore asked about things like accomodation, travel etc. These
>are
>>    important and we need to have something in place for them. I'd
>very
>>    much like organisations like pyladies to take a more active role
>in
>>    matters like this.
>>
>> 4. We need to have way more time for the CFP and for talk
>>    selection. This time was much better and I think we hit a decent
>>    method. Now, we just need to scale it up.
>>
>> 5. Let's open up a small lightning talk registration online before
>the
>>    event starts? Might get more interesting people.
>>
>> 6. More work on panels.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> --
>> Cordially,
>> Noufal
>> http://nibrahim.net.in
>> _______________________________________________
>> Inpycon mailing list
>> Inpycon at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>Inpycon mailing list
>Inpycon at python.org
>http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon

-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

From dhruvbaldawa at gmail.com  Tue Sep  3 12:23:24 2013
From: dhruvbaldawa at gmail.com (Dhruv Baldawa)
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 15:53:24 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Points to ponder
In-Reply-To: <bc988f4e-d1e9-4710-b537-5ec71c4c4e3a@email.android.com>
References: <8761ujg1w5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAPhs5j_ExSc+gV=txnOQtXOOgn778A1Uy_aAkMY05THMBmapJA@mail.gmail.com>
 <bc988f4e-d1e9-4710-b537-5ec71c4c4e3a@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <CAC5Hnjgb8Rpg=Jqa31WeO3LV1GBs9HdbzoNT2gUDLN752XJkag@mail.gmail.com>

Someone had created it last year. I think Anand C.
https://github.com/pythonindia/pyconindia-handbook

--
Dhruv Baldawa
(http://www.dhruvb.com)


On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 10:11 AM, Bibhas <me at bibhas.in> wrote:

>
>
> konark modi <modi.konark at gmail.com> wrote:
> >Was an amazing conference, I have had one of the best experiences of
> >being
> >part as a volunteer and work with a great and super awesome team which
> >I
> >would cherish for long.
> >
> >Was looking forward for some insights from the organizing team on :
> >
> >1. Which are the areas of bottle neck during the initial planning
> >because
> >of which kind of get delayed in starting , if we could help reduce
> >those
> >bottle necks, involve more people probably we can start with lot of
> >things
> >early.
> >
> >2. Kiran had given a useful suggestion on maintain a hand-book via
> >PyCon
> >git repo, to push all check-lists. (I'll be doing that for all the
> >templates used for volunteering purposes.)
> >
>
> We thought of doing it last year, called it PyCon handbook but it got lost
> in discussions. I think we should start as soon as possible with this,
> before our memories betray us.
>
> >3. If we start early we can break the tasks into chunks and let focused
> >groups work on them, otherwise we end up having same people work on lot
> >of
> >different things, which makes it tough on them.
> >
> >Will update as and when have more ideas.
> >
> >Regards
> >Konark
> >
> >
> >On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 12:12 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
> ><noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> First of all, Congratulations to everyone involved in running this.
> >The
> >> conference was a definite improvement over the past few years.
> >>
> >> Here are some points I have that we should consider.
> >>
> >> 1. We need more "heads" that decide all details of each activity.
> >Just
> >>    like Vishal headed the a/v thing. I'm saying this because for
> >things
> >>    like open spaces, there were issues like opening up the one on
> >top, A/C
> >>    in audi 3 etc. These are decisions that Anand and Vijay shouldn't
> >>    have to bother about. There should be one guy in charge of this
> >and
> >>    that's that. It will make management much more smooth.
> >>
> >> 2. We have to keep a note of FAQs people ask. I'm emphasising the "F"
> >in
> >>    FAQ. One example. Lots of people got confused about the workshop
> >>    tickets and having to pay separately for them. We should really
> >call
> >>    them "Python workshops before PyCon India" or something similar
> >and have
> >>    maybe even have a separate doattend page for them. Anything to
> >make them
> >>    distinct from the main conference registrations.
> >>
> >> 3. We need to make the conference more woman friendly. It was better
> >>    than last time but female participants especially from outside
> >>    Bangalore asked about things like accomodation, travel etc. These
> >are
> >>    important and we need to have something in place for them. I'd
> >very
> >>    much like organisations like pyladies to take a more active role
> >in
> >>    matters like this.
> >>
> >> 4. We need to have way more time for the CFP and for talk
> >>    selection. This time was much better and I think we hit a decent
> >>    method. Now, we just need to scale it up.
> >>
> >> 5. Let's open up a small lightning talk registration online before
> >the
> >>    event starts? Might get more interesting people.
> >>
> >> 6. More work on panels.
> >>
> >> Thanks.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Cordially,
> >> Noufal
> >> http://nibrahim.net.in
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Inpycon mailing list
> >> Inpycon at python.org
> >> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
> >>
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Inpycon mailing list
> >Inpycon at python.org
> >http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
> --
> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
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From anandology at gmail.com  Fri Sep  6 13:36:56 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 17:06:56 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everyone,

We did a good job of recording and processing videos this year. The best
videos we had so far at any PyCon India. Thanks to HasGeek for their
support and video volunteers without whom this wouldn't be possible.

There were 21 talks, 2 keynotes and one panel discussion, a total of 24
sessions.

The video of one talk, "Scaling Telephony with Python: The Plivo Learnings"
by Nishad Musthafa was corrupted and we couldn't recover it.

I've processed all other videos and uploaded 11 of them to youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6GW05BfqWIdsaaV35jcHWPWTI-DAw6Yn

Remaining 12, I've given to Vishal for uploading. They will be uploaded in
next couple of days.

Anand
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From vinayakh at gmail.com  Fri Sep  6 13:45:15 2013
From: vinayakh at gmail.com (Vinayak Hegde)
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 17:15:15 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKe6YvNZtCMc5X3cHWtmC5EZR63auuDmFJ-Q8d+bD8EgUixWzA@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 5:06 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

>
> Hello everyone,
>
> We did a good job of recording and processing videos this year. The best
> videos we had so far at any PyCon India. Thanks to HasGeek for their
> support and video volunteers without whom this wouldn't be possible.
>
> There were 21 talks, 2 keynotes and one panel discussion, a total of 24
> sessions.
>
> The video of one talk, "Scaling Telephony with Python: The Plivo
> Learnings" by Nishad Musthafa was corrupted and we couldn't recover it.
>
> I've processed all other videos and uploaded 11 of them to youtube.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6GW05BfqWIdsaaV35jcHWPWTI-DAw6Yn
>
> Remaining 12, I've given to Vishal for uploading. They will be uploaded in
> next couple of days.
>

Thanks Anand (and other volunteers). Can these be put up on pyvideos. You
can submit a conference here - http://pyvideo.org/suggestions/videos

A lot more people will have access to that and the complete list can be
imported as RSS using that.

-- Vinayak
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From anandpillai at letterboxes.org  Fri Sep  6 13:45:54 2013
From: anandpillai at letterboxes.org (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2013 17:15:54 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5229C072.1010304@letterboxes.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Friday 06 September 2013 05:06 PM, Anand Chitipothu wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> 
> We did a good job of recording and processing videos this year. The
> best videos we had so far at any PyCon India. Thanks to HasGeek for
> their support and video volunteers without whom this wouldn't be
> possible.
> 
> There were 21 talks, 2 keynotes and one panel discussion, a total
> of 24 sessions.
> 
> The video of one talk, "Scaling Telephony with Python: The Plivo
> Learnings" by Nishad Musthafa was corrupted and we couldn't recover
> it.
> 
> I've processed all other videos and uploaded 11 of them to
> youtube.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6GW05BfqWIdsaaV35jcHWPWTI-DAw6Yn
>
>  Remaining 12, I've given to Vishal for uploading. They will be
> uploaded in next couple of days.

What about workshops ? Is it covered in this list ?

> 
> Anand
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Inpycon mailing
> list Inpycon at python.org 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
> 


- -- 
Regards,

- --Anand

-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Architect/Consultant
anandpillai at letterboxes.org

Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
Kindly update your address books.

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From anandology at gmail.com  Fri Sep  6 14:02:20 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 17:32:20 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <CAKe6YvNZtCMc5X3cHWtmC5EZR63auuDmFJ-Q8d+bD8EgUixWzA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKe6YvNZtCMc5X3cHWtmC5EZR63auuDmFJ-Q8d+bD8EgUixWzA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFzDXYL+mHiYbqL+ythZEs09rKno75DF4fWDQ8K5-RPVcw@mail.gmail.com>

> Thanks Anand (and other volunteers). Can these be put up on pyvideos. You
> can submit a conference here - http://pyvideo.org/suggestions/videos
>
> A lot more people will have access to that and the complete list can be
> imported as RSS using that.
>

That was my plan too. But I don't think I'll be able to able to work on it
now. Already spent 3 days on processing videos. Can someone please take
care of this?

Anand
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From anandology at gmail.com  Fri Sep  6 13:52:07 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 17:22:07 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <5229C072.1010304@letterboxes.org>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <5229C072.1010304@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFwZS9t1dSy=bqG2zVGBG_PVJLb26uj3ReR53cPVhq4a6g@mail.gmail.com>

> What about workshops ? Is it covered in this list ?
>

We managed to record only 2 workshop sessions. Haven't processed them yet.

Our initial plan was to use the workshops for test run and identify all
issues with the recording and that helped us a lot in identifying and
correcting the issues.

Anand
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From modi.konark at gmail.com  Fri Sep  6 15:28:52 2013
From: modi.konark at gmail.com (konark modi)
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 18:58:52 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFwZS9t1dSy=bqG2zVGBG_PVJLb26uj3ReR53cPVhq4a6g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <5229C072.1010304@letterboxes.org>
 <CAC7wXFwZS9t1dSy=bqG2zVGBG_PVJLb26uj3ReR53cPVhq4a6g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPhs5j97tBU7=ikT+tbQWz_EZkJKt=YDQyMXvn_Hg3ax=3CBAw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,

Although not much aware what the process is for uploading the videos to
PyVideo.org, but once all the videos are up on the you tube channel, I can
take it up and give it a try.

Regards
Konark


On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 5:22 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

>
> What about workshops ? Is it covered in this list ?
>>
>
> We managed to record only 2 workshop sessions. Haven't processed them yet.
>
> Our initial plan was to use the workshops for test run and identify all
> issues with the recording and that helped us a lot in identifying and
> correcting the issues.
>
> Anand
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Fri Sep  6 16:40:09 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2013 20:10:09 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <5229C072.1010304@letterboxes.org> (Anand B. Pillai's message of
 "Fri, 06 Sep 2013 17:15:54 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <5229C072.1010304@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <87hadyqaie.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> writes:


[...]

>>  Remaining 12, I've given to Vishal for uploading. They will be
>> uploaded in next couple of days.
>
> What about workshops ? Is it covered in this list ?

Were they recorded at all?

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From vinayakh at gmail.com  Fri Sep  6 20:43:23 2013
From: vinayakh at gmail.com (Vinayak Hegde)
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 00:13:23 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFzDXYL+mHiYbqL+ythZEs09rKno75DF4fWDQ8K5-RPVcw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKe6YvNZtCMc5X3cHWtmC5EZR63auuDmFJ-Q8d+bD8EgUixWzA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFzDXYL+mHiYbqL+ythZEs09rKno75DF4fWDQ8K5-RPVcw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKe6YvPUtY=DtUUa-9LKCgRfNm-doeS9KbotRMS91KNbQNoukw@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 5:32 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

>
>
> Thanks Anand (and other volunteers). Can these be put up on pyvideos. You
>> can submit a conference here - http://pyvideo.org/suggestions/videos
>>
>> A lot more people will have access to that and the complete list can be
>> imported as RSS using that.
>>
>
> That was my plan too. But I don't think I'll be able to able to work on it
> now. Already spent 3 days on processing videos. Can someone please take
> care of this?
>

I can help with this. Can someone notify me when all the videos have been
uploaded and added to a playlist. I will add the submission to the pyvideos
site.

-- Vinayak
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From nigelbabu at gmail.com  Sun Sep  8 10:30:55 2013
From: nigelbabu at gmail.com (Nigel Babu)
Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 14:00:55 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Suggestions for the next PyCon
Message-ID: <20130908083053.GA28353@gmail.com>

Hi there,

PyCon was great and congratulations to the organizers and volunteers. I want
to bring up a few things I thought we should think of doing before I forget.

* Actually conference being on Friday and Saturday.
This is probably a bit debatable. We'd have people needing to take a day off
from work or college on Friday to attend. But the advantage is that people get
a day off to recover instead of heading back to work or college directly on
Monday.

* Schedule printed on a sheet small enough to carry.
We had a large pouch for the ID card. If the schedule was printed small enough
to fit in there, that'd have been incredibly useful. I know this is challenging
enough with last minute changes, but just a thought.

* Schedule stuck outside the halls and in the common areas.
I only noticed the schedule outside the main auditorium. It'd have been nice to
have it displayed near the second one as well.

* A separate page on the website with a very lightweight schedule.
I'm thinking on the lines of a text file. Conference internet can be a little
unspectacular. It'd be nice to be able to see the schedule even on slow
internet.

Nigel.
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From anandology at gmail.com  Sun Sep 22 12:27:38 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2013 15:57:38 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Just came across this blog post by Jesse Noller explaining why everybody
pays for PyCon.

http://jessenoller.com/blog/2011/05/25/pycon-everybody-pays

At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they have to pay
for the conference. I think we should make this point very clear from the
beginning.

Also, at the end of that post, there is a section on percentage splits of
the total costs. It'll be nice to see similar split for PyCon India 2013
expenses.

Anand
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From sree at mahiti.org  Mon Sep 23 05:28:48 2013
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 08:58:48 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD=RLAis9BJqUMY4bVT5npp_vTzd-CsHM0G-TkP1UErG--vATA@mail.gmail.com>

On 22 September 2013 15:57, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com> wrote:

> At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they have to pay
> for the conference. I think we should make this point very clear from the
> beginning.


I think we should not make speaker pay the registration fees. Thats the
least we can do you make them feel welcome to the venue. If they have
already paid, we should offer them refunds. Its up to them to choose not to.

- sree
- sree


-- 
Sreekanth S Rameshaiah
Executive Director
Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
Bangalore, India - 560043
Phone:  +91 80 4905 8444
Mobile:  +91 98455 12611
www.mahiti.org
www.mahiti-infotech.com
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From foss.mailinglists at gmail.com  Mon Sep 23 07:09:30 2013
From: foss.mailinglists at gmail.com (sankarshan)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 10:39:30 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 3:57 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com> wrote:

> http://jessenoller.com/blog/2011/05/25/pycon-everybody-pays

this states:

"So, how does "everybody pays" play into this? In two ways. First, it
helps hedge our risk, institutionally speaking. PyCon had a good/bad
year in 2009 - good for the attendees, but horrendously bad
financially. We made various commitments in 2008 just as the markets
were peaking, and we lost a lot of money when everything went south.
Since then, it has been our budget policy to make sure that our
revenues will cover our hard costs even if there is a 15% dip in
attendance and a 35% dip in sponsorship.

Second, you may have guessed that the "everybody pays" policy allows
us to pad the financial aid budget. This has the direct benefit of
bringing more people to the conference, increasing the diversity of
people attending, getting a larger proportion of the community
together, etc."

> At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they have to pay
> for the conference. I think we should make this point very clear from the
> beginning.

In light of the above quote, why were speakers upset that they have to pay?


-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay
<https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>

From anandpillai at letterboxes.org  Mon Sep 23 10:13:18 2013
From: anandpillai at letterboxes.org (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 13:43:18 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Monday 23 September 2013 10:39 AM, sankarshan wrote:
> On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 3:57 PM, Anand Chitipothu
> <anandology at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> http://jessenoller.com/blog/2011/05/25/pycon-everybody-pays
> 
> this states:
> 
> "So, how does "everybody pays" play into this? In two ways. First,
> it helps hedge our risk, institutionally speaking. PyCon had a
> good/bad year in 2009 - good for the attendees, but horrendously
> bad financially. We made various commitments in 2008 just as the
> markets were peaking, and we lost a lot of money when everything
> went south. Since then, it has been our budget policy to make sure
> that our revenues will cover our hard costs even if there is a 15%
> dip in attendance and a 35% dip in sponsorship.
> 
> Second, you may have guessed that the "everybody pays" policy
> allows us to pad the financial aid budget. This has the direct
> benefit of bringing more people to the conference, increasing the
> diversity of people attending, getting a larger proportion of the
> community together, etc."
> 
>> At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they
>> have to pay for the conference. I think we should make this point
>> very clear from the beginning.
> 
> In light of the above quote, why were speakers upset that they have
> to pay?

This article was written a while ago but was highlighted recently
when there were a few tweets about it. Also we don't officially
follow PSF policy blindly and make our own policies.

I think as we were not clear and forthright on this as PSF
was, there was a thinking that speakers need not pay. We have had
some discussions in the past on such lines, so to me it
is not surprising that there was such a feeling.

Please note that PSSI is an independent organization with its
own policies - we definitely use PSF policies as guidelines and
references but don't automatically subscribe to them. I hope
this is very clear.

> 
> 


- -- 
Regards,

- --Anand

-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Architect/Consultant
anandpillai at letterboxes.org

Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
Kindly update your address books.

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From sree at mahiti.org  Mon Sep 23 10:15:00 2013
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 13:45:00 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
 <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <CAD=RLAhQjD2u0t+F0Ey0eCw8hQAPFG15sFxF8veLpdZ+pYAtGg@mail.gmail.com>

On 23 September 2013 13:43, Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>wrote:

> Please note that PSSI is an independent organization with its
> own policies - we definitely use PSF policies as guidelines and
> references but don't automatically subscribe to them. I hope
> this is very clear.
>

+1. We should have policies that map to our local context.
- sree
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Mon Sep 23 10:15:33 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 13:45:33 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org> (Anand B. Pillai's message of
 "Mon, 23 Sep 2013 13:43:18 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
 <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <87siwwuf6i.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> writes:


[...]

> This article was written a while ago but was highlighted recently when
> there were a few tweets about it. Also we don't officially follow PSF
> policy blindly and make our own policies.
>
> I think as we were not clear and forthright on this as PSF was, there
> was a thinking that speakers need not pay. We have had some
> discussions in the past on such lines, so to me it is not surprising
> that there was such a feeling.
>
> Please note that PSSI is an independent organization with its own
> policies - we definitely use PSF policies as guidelines and references
> but don't automatically subscribe to them. I hope this is very clear.

Agreed. 

I do, however, like the "everyone pays" policy. It keeps the management
simple and the whole affair clear and transparent.


[...]



-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From anandology at gmail.com  Mon Sep 23 10:39:02 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 14:09:02 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87siwwuf6i.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
 <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org> <87siwwuf6i.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFyecoVw7zn+D9p=5XXae2tGnHs0CZciZa+C7rUoDzgJ+g@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > This article was written a while ago but was highlighted recently when
> > there were a few tweets about it. Also we don't officially follow PSF
> > policy blindly and make our own policies.
> >
> > I think as we were not clear and forthright on this as PSF was, there
> > was a thinking that speakers need not pay. We have had some
> > discussions in the past on such lines, so to me it is not surprising
> > that there was such a feeling.
> >
> > Please note that PSSI is an independent organization with its own
> > policies - we definitely use PSF policies as guidelines and references
> > but don't automatically subscribe to them. I hope this is very clear.
>
> Agreed.
>
> I do, however, like the "everyone pays" policy. It keeps the management
> simple and the whole affair clear and transparent.
>

I too think "everyone pays" is a nice policy. It really brings out the
community sprit, everyone is equal at the conference. organizers, speakers
and volunteers are not privileged.

Anand
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From lifeofnavin at gmail.com  Mon Sep 23 12:31:20 2013
From: lifeofnavin at gmail.com (Navin Pai)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:01:20 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
Message-ID: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>

> Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 14:09:02 +0530
> From: Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>
> To: Mailing list for the PyCon India conference <inpycon at python.org>
> Subject: Re: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
> Message-ID:
>         <CAC7wXFyecoVw7zn+D9p=
> 5XXae2tGnHs0CZciZa+C7rUoDzgJ+g at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in
> >wrote:
>
> > Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> writes:
> >
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > > This article was written a while ago but was highlighted recently when
> > > there were a few tweets about it. Also we don't officially follow PSF
> > > policy blindly and make our own policies.
> > >
> > > I think as we were not clear and forthright on this as PSF was, there
> > > was a thinking that speakers need not pay. We have had some
> > > discussions in the past on such lines, so to me it is not surprising
> > > that there was such a feeling.
> > >
> > > Please note that PSSI is an independent organization with its own
> > > policies - we definitely use PSF policies as guidelines and references
> > > but don't automatically subscribe to them. I hope this is very clear.
> >
> > Agreed.
> >
> > I do, however, like the "everyone pays" policy. It keeps the management
> > simple and the whole affair clear and transparent.
> >
>
> I too think "everyone pays" is a nice policy. It really brings out the
> community sprit, everyone is equal at the conference. organizers, speakers
> and volunteers are not privileged.
>
> Anand
>

+1 to that Anand. But somewhere, I understand the sentiment of not having
speakers pay. Especially when we have student speakers, for whom money is
tight. I remember a couple conferences which gave speakers free entry,
which
enabled me, then in my UG years to speak and learn at conferences which I
doubt I'd have been able to even attend, given the costs, otherwise.

Then again, as the article mentions, that's more suitable for corporate
oriented confs. There is probably a better way, such as student discounts,
to tackle the issue better.

Would love to have more thoughts on this...

Thanks
Navin "M at dMAx" Pai
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Mon Sep 23 12:35:32 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:05:32 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>
 (Navin Pai's message of "Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:01:20 +0530")
References: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87hadbvn9n.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Navin Pai <lifeofnavin at gmail.com> writes:


[...]

> +1 to that Anand. But somewhere, I understand the sentiment of not
> having speakers pay. Especially when we have student speakers, for
> whom money is tight. I remember a couple conferences which gave
> speakers free entry, which enabled me, then in my UG years to speak
> and learn at conferences which I doubt I'd have been able to even
> attend, given the costs, otherwise.

This is better served by some kind of student scholarships. If there are
too many requests, we can prioritise student speakers. 


> Then again, as the article mentions, that's more suitable for
> corporate oriented confs. There is probably a better way, such as
> student discounts, to tackle the issue better.

Exactly. 
[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From anandpillai at letterboxes.org  Mon Sep 23 12:52:14 2013
From: anandpillai at letterboxes.org (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:22:14 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87hadbvn9n.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <87hadbvn9n.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <52401D5E.8020001@letterboxes.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Monday 23 September 2013 04:05 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote:
> Navin Pai <lifeofnavin at gmail.com> writes:
> 
> 
> [...]
> 
>> +1 to that Anand. But somewhere, I understand the sentiment of
>> not having speakers pay. Especially when we have student
>> speakers, for whom money is tight. I remember a couple
>> conferences which gave speakers free entry, which enabled me,
>> then in my UG years to speak and learn at conferences which I
>> doubt I'd have been able to even attend, given the costs,
>> otherwise.
> 
> This is better served by some kind of student scholarships. If
> there are too many requests, we can prioritise student speakers.

In my mind, we do need to offer some kind of rebate for those in
need.

The simplest way to do this would be to waive off registration
amount for speakers who cannot afford to spend it - say student
speakers for example. This can be done by announcing financial aid
for attendees with priority to speakers/students (hence higher for
speaker students) and doing this much before we announce registrations.

Financial aid would be limited of course and done on a first
cum first serve basis for the deserving.
> 
> 
>> Then again, as the article mentions, that's more suitable for 
>> corporate oriented confs. There is probably a better way, such
>> as student discounts, to tackle the issue better.

I would rather call it as general financial support than student
specific discount.

Hence though "everyone pays" as a general rule, the "deserving
can be exempt" as well.

> Exactly. [...]
> 
> 


- -- 
Regards,

- --Anand

-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Architect/Consultant
anandpillai at letterboxes.org

Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
Kindly update your address books.

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From sree at mahiti.org  Mon Sep 23 13:24:54 2013
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:54:54 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD=RLAg20xyXmpMJg4-X1nrxWj=RYt7NHaKB92NC=TyBLPdazw@mail.gmail.com>

On 23 September 2013 16:01, Navin Pai <lifeofnavin at gmail.com> wrote:

> Then again, as the article mentions, that's more suitable for corporate
> oriented confs. There is probably a better way, such as student discounts,
> to tackle the issue better.
>
> Would love to have more thoughts on this...
>

We should have a field in task submission form where the speaker can
request for discount in registration.
 - sree
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From kushaldas at gmail.com  Mon Sep 23 15:00:03 2013
From: kushaldas at gmail.com (Kushal Das)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 18:30:03 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87siwwuf6i.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
 <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org>
 <87siwwuf6i.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAAzeMbwS1NnKsk+6pVAqVzC4A5ULYbK897vOCEHjmiTm7iNHcw@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>
> Agreed.
>
> I do, however, like the "everyone pays" policy. It keeps the management
> simple and the whole affair clear and transparent.
My vote will also go to the "everyone pays" policy.

Kushal
-- 
http://fedoraproject.org
http://kushaldas.in

From mehul.n.ved at gmail.com  Mon Sep 23 15:12:34 2013
From: mehul.n.ved at gmail.com (Mehul Ved)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 18:42:34 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAAzeMbwS1NnKsk+6pVAqVzC4A5ULYbK897vOCEHjmiTm7iNHcw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
 <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org> <87siwwuf6i.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAAzeMbwS1NnKsk+6pVAqVzC4A5ULYbK897vOCEHjmiTm7iNHcw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADTL0oaaf-MeC1-Om=VnfcEGHDAOn05PqKcCbA19hGZ_FHKYPg@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 6:30 PM, Kushal Das <kushaldas at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>>
>> Agreed.
>>
>> I do, however, like the "everyone pays" policy. It keeps the management
>> simple and the whole affair clear and transparent.
> My vote will also go to the "everyone pays" policy.

+1 on everyone pays policy.
And +1 to deserving attendees getting scholarship, with first
preference given to speakers.
As has been discussed before, this will also ensure a clear
distinction on what attendees are paying for and what sponsors are
paying for.

From baiju.m.mail at gmail.com  Mon Sep 23 21:54:29 2013
From: baiju.m.mail at gmail.com (Baiju M)
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 01:24:29 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAAzeMbwS1NnKsk+6pVAqVzC4A5ULYbK897vOCEHjmiTm7iNHcw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
 <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org> <87siwwuf6i.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAAzeMbwS1NnKsk+6pVAqVzC4A5ULYbK897vOCEHjmiTm7iNHcw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN8ZCbz7FypXs5HX+=Op7UVe2a1E5diNkgh8JoEXt9sjbJ3tjw@mail.gmail.com>

+1 for "everyone pays"

On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 6:30 PM, Kushal Das <kushaldas at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>>
>> Agreed.
>>
>> I do, however, like the "everyone pays" policy. It keeps the management
>> simple and the whole affair clear and transparent.
> My vote will also go to the "everyone pays" policy.
>
> Kushal
> --
> http://fedoraproject.org
> http://kushaldas.in
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon

From gautham5678 at gmail.com  Tue Sep 24 06:05:32 2013
From: gautham5678 at gmail.com (Gautam)
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 09:35:32 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANVncn7Z3Gpwmyf3MxiC3v--HR8hnjGpyCdb6oSef5uDCo=u+Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAEopHme4__A3RvtyXuER25=_QTSa4o7WC1ZgJjDKVLEbDTuPtw@mail.gmail.com>

I agree with the everyone pays policy. This works really well because
the cost of a ticket is quite nominal at 1k.
I think most students can come up with that. Offering student
discounts is an option though.

On 23 September 2013 16:01, Navin Pai <lifeofnavin at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 14:09:02 +0530
>> From: Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>
>> To: Mailing list for the PyCon India conference <inpycon at python.org>
>> Subject: Re: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
>> Message-ID:
>>
>> <CAC7wXFyecoVw7zn+D9p=5XXae2tGnHs0CZciZa+C7rUoDzgJ+g at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
>> <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
>>
>> > Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> writes:
>> >
>> >
>> > [...]
>> >
>> > > This article was written a while ago but was highlighted recently when
>> > > there were a few tweets about it. Also we don't officially follow PSF
>> > > policy blindly and make our own policies.
>> > >
>> > > I think as we were not clear and forthright on this as PSF was, there
>> > > was a thinking that speakers need not pay. We have had some
>> > > discussions in the past on such lines, so to me it is not surprising
>> > > that there was such a feeling.
>> > >
>> > > Please note that PSSI is an independent organization with its own
>> > > policies - we definitely use PSF policies as guidelines and references
>> > > but don't automatically subscribe to them. I hope this is very clear.
>> >
>> > Agreed.
>> >
>> > I do, however, like the "everyone pays" policy. It keeps the management
>> > simple and the whole affair clear and transparent.
>> >
>>
>> I too think "everyone pays" is a nice policy. It really brings out the
>> community sprit, everyone is equal at the conference. organizers, speakers
>> and volunteers are not privileged.
>>
>> Anand
>
>
> +1 to that Anand. But somewhere, I understand the sentiment of not having
> speakers pay. Especially when we have student speakers, for whom money is
> tight. I remember a couple conferences which gave speakers free entry, which
> enabled me, then in my UG years to speak and learn at conferences which I
> doubt I'd have been able to even attend, given the costs, otherwise.
>
> Then again, as the article mentions, that's more suitable for corporate
> oriented confs. There is probably a better way, such as student discounts,
> to tackle the issue better.
>
> Would love to have more thoughts on this...
>
> Thanks
> Navin "M at dMAx" Pai
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>

From foss.mailinglists at gmail.com  Tue Sep 24 07:55:09 2013
From: foss.mailinglists at gmail.com (sankarshan)
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 11:25:09 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zccmKBQ7vUHQkfzTSdk3qTQ+eiXDGbmgLU_ZsiMRKffA@mail.gmail.com>
 <523FF81E.4030205@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <CAKQ+-3z0YaVHA2zoz0-q0Pk-jPtYyaEQ1TN7UhaBLyowTV9LpA@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 1:43 PM, Anand B Pillai
<anandpillai at letterboxes.org> wrote:
> Please note that PSSI is an independent organization with its
> own policies - we definitely use PSF policies as guidelines and
> references but don't automatically subscribe to them. I hope
> this is very clear.

I wasn't suggesting otherwise. The rationale for why I like "everyone
pays" is that payment is linked with generating a pass and, hence the
logistics of participants (and, lunch etc) are all kept aligned.
Deserving candidates can be identified via a well defined policy that
is defined and in place. The refund for the ticket can be included in
the financial aid provided.


-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay
<https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>

From jace at pobox.com  Thu Sep 26 06:30:06 2013
From: jace at pobox.com (Kiran Jonnalagadda)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 10:00:06 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 3:57 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they have to pay
> for the conference. I think we should make this point very clear from the
> beginning.
>

I was the keynote speaker and I bought a ticket too.

Kiran


-- 
Kiran Jonnalagadda
http://jace.zaiki.in
http://hasgeek.com
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 06:36:02 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 10:06:02 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 (Kiran Jonnalagadda's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 10:00:06 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com> writes:

> On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 3:57 PM, Anand Chitipothu
> <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they have
>> to pay for the conference. I think we should make this point very
>> clear from the beginning.
>>
>
> I was the keynote speaker and I bought a ticket too.

I imagine you did that since it's similar to hasgeek policy.

Were you made aware from the site or anything else that you would have
to pay even though you're a speaker?

[...]



-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From jace at pobox.com  Thu Sep 26 07:46:29 2013
From: jace at pobox.com (Kiran Jonnalagadda)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:16:29 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 10:06 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> > I was the keynote speaker and I bought a ticket too.
>
> I imagine you did that since it's similar to hasgeek policy.


> Were you made aware from the site or anything else that you would have
> to pay even though you're a speaker?
>

HasGeek policy is free tickets for speakers and crew. I bought a ticket
because I knew it was PyCon policy -- I bought a ticket even last year
despite volunteering.

Kiran

-- 
Kiran Jonnalagadda
http://jace.zaiki.in
http://hasgeek.com
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 07:48:55 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:18:55 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 (Kiran Jonnalagadda's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:16:29 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com> writes:


[...]

> HasGeek policy is free tickets for speakers and crew. 

I wasn't aware of that. 

> I bought a ticket because I knew it was PyCon policy -- I bought a
> ticket even last year despite volunteering.

There's still gap in the communication. Anand told me about one or two
speakers who were annoyed that they had to pay even though their talks
were selected.


[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 08:02:53 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:32:53 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > HasGeek policy is free tickets for speakers and crew.
>
> I wasn't aware of that.
>
> > I bought a ticket because I knew it was PyCon policy -- I bought a
> > ticket even last year despite volunteering.
>
> <snip>

> There's still gap in the communication. Anand told me about one or two
> speakers who were annoyed that they had to pay even though their talks
> were selected.
>
</snip>

>
>
> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>


Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?

Is it because sponsorship money not sufficient? Is there any blog/mail
provides description/info about the overall expenditure of the event?

If money is real issue please get a new sponsorship model in place which
handles entry fee payments for speakers and volunteers specifically.

When most of the volunteers are students & some speakers as well. Some of
them are coming from other part of country & planning stay/food on their
own. Can we not do best by giving them entry to the event?

Comparing an Indian event with event in US  & following with same footprint
does not go well here.

An event with focus on Indian crowd should be handled in Indian way.

Thanks,

-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 08:06:25 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:36:25 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:32:53 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:


[...]


> Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?
>
> Is it because sponsorship money not sufficient? Is there any blog/mail
> provides description/info about the overall expenditure of the event?
>
> If money is real issue please get a new sponsorship model in place which
> handles entry fee payments for speakers and volunteers specifically.

The main idea is that we don't want to dependent on sponsor money too
much to take care of the conference. I don't think we're tight any more
so other options to subsidise this are available.

> When most of the volunteers are students & some speakers as well. Some
> of them are coming from other part of country & planning stay/food on
> their own. Can we not do best by giving them entry to the event?

We can do better by giving them some kind of student scholarships as was
brought up earlier. 


[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 08:15:40 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:45:40 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:36 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
>
> > Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?
> >
> > Is it because sponsorship money not sufficient? Is there any blog/mail
> > provides description/info about the overall expenditure of the event?
> >
> > If money is real issue please get a new sponsorship model in place which
> > handles entry fee payments for speakers and volunteers specifically.
>
> The main idea is that we don't want to dependent on sponsor money too
> much to take care of the conference. I don't think we're tight any more
> so other options to subsidise this are available.
>

Well then simply make it more welcoming & if a speaker or volunteers  wants
to pay for ticket let them do it else make it free for others. Why wasting
so much time on this?

>
> > When most of the volunteers are students & some speakers as well. Some
> > of them are coming from other part of country & planning stay/food on
> > their own. Can we not do best by giving them entry to the event?
>
> We can do better by giving them some kind of student scholarships as was
> brought up earlier.
>
>
> Well this is something different from entry ticket, the scholarship should
not be restricted to speakers & volunteer students.

Both the things are separate and needs to be addressed in specific way.

Are we going to give a student 800RS entry ticket for event and call it
scholarship?




 [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 08:24:09 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:54:09 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 11:45:40 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:


[...]


> Well then simply make it more welcoming & if a speaker or volunteers
> wants to pay for ticket let them do it else make it free for
> others. Why wasting so much time on this?

First of all, it's not "wasting" time. It's something that's undecided
and which has become a topic of discussion. Secondly, it's a matter of
policy. People ask questions and there needs to be something that's
previously discussed, agreed upon and published that you can simply
point to rather than handle individual queries.

There are always freeloaders who carry a box from the door to a room and
then ask for a volunteer badge just to avoid paying a ticket. There are
also volunteers (like most of the serious ones) who actually bought a
ticket.

There are also other issues like speakers not being announced till late
in the day season when the early bird tickets are sold out. If they wait
till then, they will have to pay full price if their talks are not
selected. 


[...]

> Well this is something different from entry ticket, the scholarship
> should not be restricted to speakers & volunteer students.

I'm still not sure about who the "scholarship" (for want of a better
term) should be applicable to. I'm not sure if it should be applicable
for everyone. I'm also reasonably sure, though, that students,
especially outstation ones, should be given priority over the others.

> Both the things are separate and needs to be addressed in specific
> way.

I think I see your point. Correct me if I'm wrong but You're proposing
waiving the ticket fee for speakers and volunteers as a sign of
friendliness rather than financial assistance. I never thought of it
that way.

> Are we going to give a student 800RS entry ticket for event and call
> it scholarship?

Don't know. We've not yet reached implementation. This is just design.


[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 08:38:40 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:08:40 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:54 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
>
> > Well then simply make it more welcoming & if a speaker or volunteers
> > wants to pay for ticket let them do it else make it free for
> > others. Why wasting so much time on this?
>
> First of all, it's not "wasting" time. It's something that's undecided
> and which has become a topic of discussion. Secondly, it's a matter of
> policy. People ask questions and there needs to be something that's
> previously discussed, agreed upon and published that you can simply
> point to rather than handle individual queries.
>

Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.
Don`t blindly follow policies of other country things work differently here.


>
> There are always freeloaders who carry a box from the door to a room and
> then ask for a volunteer badge just to avoid paying a ticket. There are
> also volunteers (like most of the serious ones) who actually bought a
> ticket.
>
> Are you saying to be a serious volunteer you need to pay for entry ticket?

Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.

There are also other issues like speakers not being announced till late
> in the day season when the early bird tickets are sold out. If they wait
> till then, they will have to pay full price if their talks are not
> selected.
>
> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?

>
> [...]
>
> > Well this is something different from entry ticket, the scholarship
> > should not be restricted to speakers & volunteer students.
>
> I'm still not sure about who the "scholarship" (for want of a better
> term) should be applicable to. I'm not sure if it should be applicable
> for everyone. I'm also reasonably sure, though, that students,
> especially outstation ones, should be given priority over the others.
>
> And i doubt it will work out.

> > Both the things are separate and needs to be addressed in specific
> > way.
>
> I think I see your point. Correct me if I'm wrong but You're proposing
> waiving the ticket fee for speakers and volunteers as a sign of
> friendliness rather than financial assistance. I never thought of it
> that way.
>
> Well you yourself said money is not the reason for charging.
Friendliness is one of the things including 100 others.


>  > Are we going to give a student 800RS entry ticket for event and call
> > it scholarship?
>
> Don't know. We've not yet reached implementation. This is just design.
>
> Well if its entry fee weaver don`t call it scholarship.



>
> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 08:48:06 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:18:06 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:08:40 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:


[...]

> Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.  Don`t blindly
> follow policies of other country things work differently here.

As somone who's been involved in organising this for a while, I'm not
"blindly" following anything. I genuinely think "everyone pays" is a
good idea regardless of who came up with it. 

Also, we're not looking to generate profit but an event does have
costs. We want to cover those in a way that allows us freedom to conduct
the event as we wish.

To illustrate with an extreme case, if a sponsor said that they'd pay us
a crore for branding the conference with their name and giving them the
contact information of all the participation, we'd be able to to give
free entry to every delegate and do everything in style but we'd say no.

[...]

> Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.

The devil is in the details. 

If you have concrete suggestions on how to identify and weed out
freeloaders without destroying the volunteer base, please post them
here. Or better yet, pick up the job of volunteer coordinator. After
all, advice is cheap.


>> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?

Very very difficult. Like I said, the devil is in the details.


[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 08:56:57 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:26:57 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>

Noufal,

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:18 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.  Don`t blindly
> > follow policies of other country things work differently here.
>
> As somone who's been involved in organising this for a while, I'm not
> "blindly" following anything. I genuinely think "everyone pays" is a
> good idea regardless of who came up with it.
>
> Well its "YOU" not community. That is why someone raised the issue.

> Also, we're not looking to generate profit but an event does have
> costs. We want to cover those in a way that allows us freedom to conduct
> the event as we wish.
>
> Is there a financial details about overall conference expenditure? This
will help everyone understand how difficult it will be if we start giving
free entry to speakers and volunteers.


> To illustrate with an extreme case, if a sponsor said that they'd pay us
> a crore for branding the conference with their name and giving them the
> contact information of all the participation, we'd be able to to give
> free entry to every delegate and do everything in style but we'd say no.
>

Well define a solid WHAT YOU WILL GET IF YOU SPONSOR RULE

>
> [...]
>
> > Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.
>
> The devil is in the details.
>
> If you have concrete suggestions on how to identify and weed out
> freeloaders without destroying the volunteer base, please post them
> here. Or better yet, pick up the job of volunteer coordinator. After
> all, advice is cheap.
>

Great i will be volunteer coordinator for next event on condition the entry
fee will be free for them. :)

>
>
> >> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?
>
> Very very difficult. Like I said, the devil is in the details.
>

Why? Is the event not run by a society? How difficult it is to issue
cheques?


>
>
> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 09:05:47 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:35:47 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:26:57 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>


I'm stepping out of this thread. Real life calls.

Your point about being welcoming against the financial part is a good
takeaway. Thanks.

-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From anandpillai at letterboxes.org  Thu Sep 26 09:10:54 2013
From: anandpillai at letterboxes.org (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:40:54 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thursday 26 September 2013 12:18 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote:
> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
> 
> 
> [...]
> 
>> Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.  Don`t
>> blindly follow policies of other country things work differently
>> here.

I generally agree with this principle of not blindly following
American policy here. I think I did mention it ealier when
this discussion opened saying PSSI frames its own policies.

We do need to frame local policies keeping in mind the Indian ethos.

> 
> As somone who's been involved in organising this for a while, I'm
> not "blindly" following anything. I genuinely think "everyone pays"
> is a good idea regardless of who came up with it.
> 
> Also, we're not looking to generate profit but an event does have 
> costs. We want to cover those in a way that allows us freedom to
> conduct the event as we wish.
> 
> To illustrate with an extreme case, if a sponsor said that they'd
> pay us a crore for branding the conference with their name and
> giving them the contact information of all the participation, we'd
> be able to to give free entry to every delegate and do everything
> in style but we'd say no.
> 
> [...]
> 
>> Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.

It is probably not a good idea to give free entry to volunteers.
I kind of agree with the "Everybody pays" policy here.  Though
I think volunteers should not pay the full price but should
get some benefit of tiered pricing.

I would rather suggest to reserve a certain section of early bird
tickets for volunteers and co-ordinators instead. For example
if the early bird ticket volume size is "N" it should be made
rather N + V where V is the volunteer/co-ordinator population
size. Keep this as a separate early bird category.

We can identify volunteers using their email IDs early on
and only allow those email addresses to book from this slot.

This might be a way to avoid freeloaders.

> 
> The devil is in the details.
> 
> If you have concrete suggestions on how to identify and weed out 
> freeloaders without destroying the volunteer base, please post
> them here. Or better yet, pick up the job of volunteer coordinator.
> After all, advice is cheap.
> 
> 
>>> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?
> 
> Very very difficult. Like I said, the devil is in the details.

A way to solve this would again be to ask speakers to pay up
front and then refund the speakers who gave talks at the end of
the conference. Again something not too easy with the details
but possibly a way to identify speakers might be when they
register - I think PyCon US does this - You can register
as a regular attendee or a speaker.

I think we need to tweak the "Everybody pays policy" to suit
our local expectations.

> 
> 
> [...]
> 
> 


- -- 
Regards,

- --Anand

-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Architect/Consultant
anandpillai at letterboxes.org

Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
Kindly update your address books.

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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 09:11:07 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:41:07 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
 <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2wD-V=1mcW7oK-up1MpHpcvg_7+-x6Bzd30eyakFHyRw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:35 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

>
> I'm stepping out of this thread. Real life calls.
>
Ya in other words I & organizers will do it in our way. People from
community should stop discussing about it.

>
> Your point about being welcoming against the financial part is a good
> takeaway. Thanks.
>
>  Only if anyone writes.

>  --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 09:14:52 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:44:52 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain> <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM00y2iCDjDLeEgvKEqLdL=mogxHeG5Cm-YK4ENAbkR=-w@mail.gmail.com>

Anand,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Anand B Pillai <
anandpillai at letterboxes.org> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Thursday 26 September 2013 12:18 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote:
> > atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
> >
> >
> > [...]
> >
> >> Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.  Don`t
> >> blindly follow policies of other country things work differently
> >> here.
>
> I generally agree with this principle of not blindly following
> American policy here. I think I did mention it ealier when
> this discussion opened saying PSSI frames its own policies.
>
> We do need to frame local policies keeping in mind the Indian ethos.
>
> >
> > As somone who's been involved in organising this for a while, I'm
> > not "blindly" following anything. I genuinely think "everyone pays"
> > is a good idea regardless of who came up with it.
> >
> > Also, we're not looking to generate profit but an event does have
> > costs. We want to cover those in a way that allows us freedom to
> > conduct the event as we wish.
> >
> > To illustrate with an extreme case, if a sponsor said that they'd
> > pay us a crore for branding the conference with their name and
> > giving them the contact information of all the participation, we'd
> > be able to to give free entry to every delegate and do everything
> > in style but we'd say no.
> >
> > [...]
> >
> >> Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.
>
> It is probably not a good idea to give free entry to volunteers.
> I kind of agree with the "Everybody pays" policy here.  Though
> I think volunteers should not pay the full price but should
> get some benefit of tiered pricing.
>
> I would rather suggest to reserve a certain section of early bird
> tickets for volunteers and co-ordinators instead. For example
> if the early bird ticket volume size is "N" it should be made
> rather N + V where V is the volunteer/co-ordinator population
> size. Keep this as a separate early bird category.
>
> We can identify volunteers using their email IDs early on
> and only allow those email addresses to book from this slot.
>
> This might be a way to avoid freeloaders.
>
> >
> > The devil is in the details.
> >
> > If you have concrete suggestions on how to identify and weed out
> > freeloaders without destroying the volunteer base, please post
> > them here. Or better yet, pick up the job of volunteer coordinator.
> > After all, advice is cheap.
> >
> >
> >>> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?
> >
> > Very very difficult. Like I said, the devil is in the details.
>
> A way to solve this would again be to ask speakers to pay up
> front and then refund the speakers who gave talks at the end of
> the conference. Again something not too easy with the details
> but possibly a way to identify speakers might be when they
> register - I think PyCon US does this - You can register
> as a regular attendee or a speaker.
>
> I think we need to tweak the "Everybody pays policy" to suit
> our local expectations.
>
> Is any takers for this?
I doubt.


> >
> >
> > [...]
> >
> >
>
>
> - --
> Regards,
>
> - --Anand
>
> -
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Software Architect/Consultant
> anandpillai at letterboxes.org
>
> Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
> Kindly update your address books.
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/
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> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From jace at pobox.com  Thu Sep 26 09:34:55 2013
From: jace at pobox.com (Kiran Jonnalagadda)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:04:55 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:32 AM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:

> An event with focus on Indian crowd should be handled in Indian way.
>

I actually think PyCon charging everyone including speakers is a good idea.
We're mixing up multiple concerns here, so let me try to separate them:

*1. The notion that students need subsidy because they can't afford
commercial rates.*

Any conference the size of PyCon India charging < Rs 2000 per day is not at
a commercial rate. It's not even at a sustainable rate. For comparison,
here are some commercially priced events:

Agile India 2014: Rs 10,000 *per day*
http://booking.agilefaqs.com/agile-india-2014

UX India 2013: Rs 10,000
http://2013.ux-india.org/pricedetails

JSConf Asia in Manila: PHP 19,500, SGD 560, ~INR 28,000
http://2013.jsconf.asia/
The Phillippine peso used to be 1:1 with the Indian rupee until a couple
years ago and the purchasing power parity is the same, so it's the
equivalent of spending 28k on a ticket in India.

With prices like these, subsidies make sense. PyCon India tickets sold at
Rs 800 and complaining about that is honestly shameful. Nobody who has the
time and inclination to attend PyCon India is so poor they can't afford Rs
800 on a ticket. None of these people will complain that the restaurant
they had lunch at did not sponsor it.

*2. Speakers and crew are paying with their time and effort, so taking
their cash is charging them extra.*

This is a valid point, but a double edged sword. When you give someone free
entry and a speaker badge, you mark them as special and above the crowd.
The speaker-audience divide encourages formality, where speakers are
announced in advance, their names and talk blurbs are used to sell tickets,
and schedules are fixed and adhered to.

What you lose is spontaneity. You can't have an open session where anyone
may speak up because the audience will see it as a gap in the schedule, not
an opportunity for them to step up and speak (unless it's a single track
event and there is nowhere else to go for that period).

You can't fix this by selecting flash talks in advance because those
speakers will expect free tickets too, and free tickets are not free for
the organizers. The per-head costs still have to be paid for.

Spontaneity is good for a community. Class divisions are not.

*3. PyCon has sponsor money anyway, so why should individuals pay?*

First of all, all money isn't the same. Sponsor money is not a donation.
Sponsors expect their pound of flesh. If you want to see what a
sponsor-paid event looks like, look at Directi's HTTPX conference:

http://bigrockhttpx.net/
http://bigrockhttpx.net/mumbai
http://bigrockhttpx.net/delhi

These events were free for attendees, but it's incredibly hard to tell
which session is led by an independent community member and which by a
sponsor representative. For what's labeled as a "definite event", is there
anything on the schedule that looks like someone who's pushing the
boundaries and is there to reveal their work to the world? (Not dissing
Directi, it is their first attempt and they'll no doubt improve with each
iteration.)

PyCon has an independent voice because it doesn't have to worry about
sponsor expectations (one of: recruitment, selling their product, or
finding new clients). When you give up participant money and become
dependent on sponsor money, you also make the transition from serving
participants to instead selling participants to sponsors -- and nobody is
interested in students who have neither money nor well developed skills, so
a sponsor-subsidised student-friendly event is actually self-defeating.

PyCon's independence depends on people paying for their tickets. There is
no way around this.

Second, there is sponsor money coming in anyway, from sponsors who manage
to benefit without demanding too much. IMHO, this money should not be spent
on PyCon itself. It should be directed towards supporting the growth of the
Python community *beyond* PyCon.

*4. Management overheads.*

The more twists you add to the story, the more overhead you'll have in
explaining this to people. Is your ticket free or not? If you buy a ticket
and your talk is selected, will your ticket be refunded or not? If you
didn't buy a ticket and didn't get selected, can you get a discount code to
buy at the early bird price since you proposed to speak back then? What if
you spoke in an open session? Do you get a refund? Carrying cash is
difficult, can you pay by card at the venue? Can PyCon also cover your
travel and stay since you are a poor student?

Answering questions is a full-time job, sometimes even requiring two
people. Simple rules go a long way towards eliminating such hidden costs.

My 2b.

Kiran

-- 
Kiran Jonnalagadda
http://jace.zaiki.in
http://hasgeek.com
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From foss.mailinglists at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 09:48:11 2013
From: foss.mailinglists at gmail.com (sankarshan)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:18:11 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
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 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain> <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <CAKQ+-3zp0OOhFGNvrfXS6n9gGJ8dRt1MEqUDf2Z4mmjN2RVXYQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Anand B Pillai
<anandpillai at letterboxes.org> wrote:
> I generally agree with this principle of not blindly following
> American policy here. I think I did mention it ealier when
> this discussion opened saying PSSI frames its own policies.
>
> We do need to frame local policies keeping in mind the Indian ethos.

Is the total number of tickets sold linked with any other pieces? For
example, does the number of tickets sold relate to the head-count for
lunch/coffee/swags etc.

I had earlier suggested that "Everyone pays" and, if individuals are
identified as worthy of a "financial aid", the aid package could
include the cost of the ticket as well. That would allow you to have a
definite head-count and also keep the aid pieces well documented.

I am unfamiliar with how the number of tickets sold is relevant in the
conference. So it is entirely possible that my above explanation is
misplaced and inane.

And, I am somewhat puzzled in the thread - is the question that the
students are unable to bear the entire expense ie.
tickets+travel+lodging? Merely subsidizing a ticket will then not help
by much. And, perhaps be counter productive.


-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay
<https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>

From me at bibhas.in  Thu Sep 26 09:42:07 2013
From: me at bibhas.in (BibhasD)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:12:07 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5243E54F.2000705@bibhas.in>

I agree to what Noufal and Kiran just said.

I have been attending the event for 3 years now and have been a
volunteer for 2 of them. And I'm also from outside Bangalore, and was a
student when I started. We volunteer because we want to. That's the
whole point of volunteering at the first place. Not because we might get
free stuffs. And I'm pretty sure if someone can travel thousand km to
attend the event, can pay Rs.800 for a ticket.

I personally like the idea of everybody paying. That means we're not
giving anyone special treatment just because they are speakers and
volunteers. Maybe We can make a financial aid program for speakers who
*really needs it*, not *wants it*, but that should be the boundary of
it. I really dont know why those speakers wanted free tickets.

And about the freeloaders(which is kind of vague term), making the entry
free would invite even more of them. And I *really* don't want it to
happen. It adds a lot more headache than it should take care of.

Thanks
Bibhas

On Thursday 26 September 2013 12:26 PM, atul jha wrote:
> Noufal,
>
> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:18 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
>
>> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>> Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.  Don`t blindly
>>> follow policies of other country things work differently here.
>> As somone who's been involved in organising this for a while, I'm not
>> "blindly" following anything. I genuinely think "everyone pays" is a
>> good idea regardless of who came up with it.
>>
>> Well its "YOU" not community. That is why someone raised the issue.
>> Also, we're not looking to generate profit but an event does have
>> costs. We want to cover those in a way that allows us freedom to conduct
>> the event as we wish.
>>
>> Is there a financial details about overall conference expenditure? This
> will help everyone understand how difficult it will be if we start giving
> free entry to speakers and volunteers.
>
>
>> To illustrate with an extreme case, if a sponsor said that they'd pay us
>> a crore for branding the conference with their name and giving them the
>> contact information of all the participation, we'd be able to to give
>> free entry to every delegate and do everything in style but we'd say no.
>>
> Well define a solid WHAT YOU WILL GET IF YOU SPONSOR RULE
>
>> [...]
>>
>>> Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.
>> The devil is in the details.
>>
>> If you have concrete suggestions on how to identify and weed out
>> freeloaders without destroying the volunteer base, please post them
>> here. Or better yet, pick up the job of volunteer coordinator. After
>> all, advice is cheap.
>>
> Great i will be volunteer coordinator for next event on condition the entry
> fee will be free for them. :)
>
>>
>>>> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?
>> Very very difficult. Like I said, the devil is in the details.
>>
> Why? Is the event not run by a society? How difficult it is to issue
> cheques?
>
>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cordially,
>> Noufal
>> http://nibrahim.net.in
>>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon

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From foss.mailinglists at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 09:49:58 2013
From: foss.mailinglists at gmail.com (sankarshan)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:19:58 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2wD-V=1mcW7oK-up1MpHpcvg_7+-x6Bzd30eyakFHyRw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
 <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2wD-V=1mcW7oK-up1MpHpcvg_7+-x6Bzd30eyakFHyRw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKQ+-3zOgew3p7Yjr7u5Lc60CoMpRTd6fTCPh1uH90gTSU13nw@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:41 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Ya in other words I & organizers will do it in our way. People from
> community should stop discussing about it.

I'd request that you not make such assumptions and nor attempt to draw
conclusions that are not supported from the original email. You have
participated in a discussion and, have been participating. However,
there also needs to be a proposal which can be discussed.


-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay
<https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>

From sree at mahiti.org  Thu Sep 26 09:51:51 2013
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:21:51 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM00y2iCDjDLeEgvKEqLdL=mogxHeG5Cm-YK4ENAbkR=-w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain> <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>
 <CANwwdM00y2iCDjDLeEgvKEqLdL=mogxHeG5Cm-YK4ENAbkR=-w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD=RLAgv9+o0rpxJfWNUC4Uf=MN7v0RmFK8tGApo6mRwrkxRbA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
We are compiling the expenses and income. It will be made public. We are
yet to receive few sponsorship fees and finish left out payouts (
specifically to those who conducted the workshop).

There is no organisers vs community here. Every one is welcome to come
together to create this event and make this a great experience.

There is always a call for volunteers and every year some one stands up
runs the event.

Requesting all to focus on issues at hand and not translate every thread
into a personal attack.

- sree






On 26 September 2013 12:44, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Anand,
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Anand B Pillai <
> anandpillai at letterboxes.org> wrote:
>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> On Thursday 26 September 2013 12:18 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote:
>> > atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>> >
>> >
>> > [...]
>> >
>> >> Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.  Don`t
>> >> blindly follow policies of other country things work differently
>> >> here.
>>
>> I generally agree with this principle of not blindly following
>> American policy here. I think I did mention it ealier when
>> this discussion opened saying PSSI frames its own policies.
>>
>> We do need to frame local policies keeping in mind the Indian ethos.
>>
>> >
>> > As somone who's been involved in organising this for a while, I'm
>> > not "blindly" following anything. I genuinely think "everyone pays"
>> > is a good idea regardless of who came up with it.
>> >
>> > Also, we're not looking to generate profit but an event does have
>> > costs. We want to cover those in a way that allows us freedom to
>> > conduct the event as we wish.
>> >
>> > To illustrate with an extreme case, if a sponsor said that they'd
>> > pay us a crore for branding the conference with their name and
>> > giving them the contact information of all the participation, we'd
>> > be able to to give free entry to every delegate and do everything
>> > in style but we'd say no.
>> >
>> > [...]
>> >
>> >> Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.
>>
>> It is probably not a good idea to give free entry to volunteers.
>> I kind of agree with the "Everybody pays" policy here.  Though
>> I think volunteers should not pay the full price but should
>> get some benefit of tiered pricing.
>>
>> I would rather suggest to reserve a certain section of early bird
>> tickets for volunteers and co-ordinators instead. For example
>> if the early bird ticket volume size is "N" it should be made
>> rather N + V where V is the volunteer/co-ordinator population
>> size. Keep this as a separate early bird category.
>>
>> We can identify volunteers using their email IDs early on
>> and only allow those email addresses to book from this slot.
>>
>> This might be a way to avoid freeloaders.
>>
>> >
>> > The devil is in the details.
>> >
>> > If you have concrete suggestions on how to identify and weed out
>> > freeloaders without destroying the volunteer base, please post
>> > them here. Or better yet, pick up the job of volunteer coordinator.
>> > After all, advice is cheap.
>> >
>> >
>> >>> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?
>> >
>> > Very very difficult. Like I said, the devil is in the details.
>>
>> A way to solve this would again be to ask speakers to pay up
>> front and then refund the speakers who gave talks at the end of
>> the conference. Again something not too easy with the details
>> but possibly a way to identify speakers might be when they
>> register - I think PyCon US does this - You can register
>> as a regular attendee or a speaker.
>>
>> I think we need to tweak the "Everybody pays policy" to suit
>> our local expectations.
>>
>> Is any takers for this?
> I doubt.
>
>
>>  >
>> >
>> > [...]
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> - --
>> Regards,
>>
>> - --Anand
>>
>> -
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Software Architect/Consultant
>> anandpillai at letterboxes.org
>>
>> Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
>> Kindly update your address books.
>>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux)
>> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/
>>
>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJSQ93+AAoJEMTxYeOp9eaosFQH/3PYdRKRj1hrUHCQUZXrLcpC
>> 8n0NMEY3Btp5JTFJdA7565SB7a4v//AbMpivItxdQODj4Hp1+wVKddz/pmUK3OZw
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>> =m6LP
>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>> _______________________________________________
>> Inpycon mailing list
>> Inpycon at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Atul
>
> www.atuljha.com
>
> irc(freenode) : koolhead17
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>


-- 
Sreekanth S Rameshaiah
Executive Director
Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
Bangalore, India - 560043
Phone:  +91 80 4905 8444
Mobile:  +91 98455 12611
www.mahiti.org
www.mahiti-infotech.com
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 09:54:52 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:24:52 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAKQ+-3zOgew3p7Yjr7u5Lc60CoMpRTd6fTCPh1uH90gTSU13nw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
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 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
 <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2wD-V=1mcW7oK-up1MpHpcvg_7+-x6Bzd30eyakFHyRw@mail.gmail.com>
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Message-ID: <CANwwdM3b4ouAJO4K-gpF7gwUn0emu_9me-oiDOVo+4CyDaPLPA@mail.gmail.com>

Sankarshan,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 1:19 PM, sankarshan <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:41 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Ya in other words I & organizers will do it in our way. People from
> > community should stop discussing about it.
>
> I'd request that you not make such assumptions and nor attempt to draw
> conclusions that are not supported from the original email. You have
> participated in a discussion and, have been participating. However,
> there also needs to be a proposal which can be discussed.
>
> I would hope the discussion this time leads to a correct/right conclusion
instead going to a cold box & we wake up again next year months before the
event.

--
> sankarshan mukhopadhyay
> <https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 09:57:25 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:27:25 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAKQ+-3zp0OOhFGNvrfXS6n9gGJ8dRt1MEqUDf2Z4mmjN2RVXYQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
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 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain> <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>
 <CAKQ+-3zp0OOhFGNvrfXS6n9gGJ8dRt1MEqUDf2Z4mmjN2RVXYQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2ak8wz29GqRQzyFtPOZ2mw3g3yDNYPX-EuwSoOgceP=Q@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 1:18 PM, sankarshan <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Anand B Pillai
> <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> wrote:
> > I generally agree with this principle of not blindly following
> > American policy here. I think I did mention it ealier when
> > this discussion opened saying PSSI frames its own policies.
> >
> > We do need to frame local policies keeping in mind the Indian ethos.
>
> Is the total number of tickets sold linked with any other pieces? For
> example, does the number of tickets sold relate to the head-count for
> lunch/coffee/swags etc.
>
> I had earlier suggested that "Everyone pays" and, if individuals are
> identified as worthy of a "financial aid", the aid package could
> include the cost of the ticket as well. That would allow you to have a
> definite head-count and also keep the aid pieces well documented.
>
> I am unfamiliar with how the number of tickets sold is relevant in the
> conference. So it is entirely possible that my above explanation is
> misplaced and inane.
>
> And, I am somewhat puzzled in the thread - is the question that the
> students are unable to bear the entire expense ie.
> tickets+travel+lodging? Merely subsidizing a ticket will then not help
> by much. And, perhaps be counter productive.
>
>
> Totally.
Don`t restrict the "SCHOLARSHIP" to mare entry fees.
Help those who requires the Aid to participate in the event.
Everyone pays should not be mandatory thrown to everyone.




> --
> sankarshan mukhopadhyay
> <https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From anandpillai at letterboxes.org  Thu Sep 26 10:11:58 2013
From: anandpillai at letterboxes.org (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:41:58 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM3b4ouAJO4K-gpF7gwUn0emu_9me-oiDOVo+4CyDaPLPA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
 <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <CAKQ+-3zOgew3p7Yjr7u5Lc60CoMpRTd6fTCPh1uH90gTSU13nw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3b4ouAJO4K-gpF7gwUn0emu_9me-oiDOVo+4CyDaPLPA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5243EC4E.3010406@letterboxes.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thursday 26 September 2013 01:24 PM, atul jha wrote:
> Sankarshan,
> 
> 
> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 1:19 PM, sankarshan
> <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:
> 
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:41 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> Ya in other words I & organizers will do it in our way. People
>>> from community should stop discussing about it.
>> 
>> I'd request that you not make such assumptions and nor attempt to
>> draw conclusions that are not supported from the original email.
>> You have participated in a discussion and, have been
>> participating. However, there also needs to be a proposal which
>> can be discussed.
>> 
>> I would hope the discussion this time leads to a correct/right
>> conclusion
> instead going to a cold box & we wake up again next year months
> before the event.

+1

Shouldn't do that. That is one thing should start happening more
in this list. We should try and conclude discussions with some kind
of summary of the general direction of the discussion that can
be applied for next year's PyCon.

Otherwise this is all just academic - right ?

> 
> --
>> sankarshan mukhopadhyay <https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan> 
>> _______________________________________________ Inpycon mailing
>> list Inpycon at python.org 
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Inpycon mailing
> list Inpycon at python.org 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
> 


- -- 
Regards,

- --Anand

-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Architect/Consultant
anandpillai at letterboxes.org

Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
Kindly update your address books.

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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 10:18:11 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:48:11 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAD=RLAgv9+o0rpxJfWNUC4Uf=MN7v0RmFK8tGApo6mRwrkxRbA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
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 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain> <5243DDFE.5080108@letterboxes.org>
 <CANwwdM00y2iCDjDLeEgvKEqLdL=mogxHeG5Cm-YK4ENAbkR=-w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAD=RLAgv9+o0rpxJfWNUC4Uf=MN7v0RmFK8tGApo6mRwrkxRbA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM3dPSXbePSNasqFfaiMUyW0YSuwFbKfcXO2UbL-CfDnVw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 1:21 PM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah <sree at mahiti.org>wrote:

> Hi,
> We are compiling the expenses and income. It will be made public. We are
> yet to receive few sponsorship fees and finish left out payouts (
> specifically to those who conducted the workshop).
>
> Awesome.

> There is no organisers vs community here. Every one is welcome to come
> together to create this event and make this a great experience.
>
> Great

> There is always a call for volunteers and every year some one stands up
> runs the event.
>
> We know that.


> Requesting all to focus on issues at hand and not translate every thread
> into a personal attack.
>
> Indeed. I would hope everyone here represents community not an individual
& not push/throw his personal opinion but whats is good for overall
community.


- sree
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 26 September 2013 12:44, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Anand,
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Anand B Pillai <
>> anandpillai at letterboxes.org> wrote:
>>
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>
>>> On Thursday 26 September 2013 12:18 PM, Noufal Ibrahim wrote:
>>> > atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > [...]
>>> >
>>> >> Pycon is a community event not a event for profit.  Don`t
>>> >> blindly follow policies of other country things work differently
>>> >> here.
>>>
>>> I generally agree with this principle of not blindly following
>>> American policy here. I think I did mention it ealier when
>>> this discussion opened saying PSSI frames its own policies.
>>>
>>> We do need to frame local policies keeping in mind the Indian ethos.
>>>
>>> >
>>> > As somone who's been involved in organising this for a while, I'm
>>> > not "blindly" following anything. I genuinely think "everyone pays"
>>> > is a good idea regardless of who came up with it.
>>> >
>>> > Also, we're not looking to generate profit but an event does have
>>> > costs. We want to cover those in a way that allows us freedom to
>>> > conduct the event as we wish.
>>> >
>>> > To illustrate with an extreme case, if a sponsor said that they'd
>>> > pay us a crore for branding the conference with their name and
>>> > giving them the contact information of all the participation, we'd
>>> > be able to to give free entry to every delegate and do everything
>>> > in style but we'd say no.
>>> >
>>> > [...]
>>> >
>>> >> Its organizers responsibility to not select freeloaders.
>>>
>>> It is probably not a good idea to give free entry to volunteers.
>>> I kind of agree with the "Everybody pays" policy here.  Though
>>> I think volunteers should not pay the full price but should
>>> get some benefit of tiered pricing.
>>>
>>> I would rather suggest to reserve a certain section of early bird
>>> tickets for volunteers and co-ordinators instead. For example
>>> if the early bird ticket volume size is "N" it should be made
>>> rather N + V where V is the volunteer/co-ordinator population
>>> size. Keep this as a separate early bird category.
>>>
>>> We can identify volunteers using their email IDs early on
>>> and only allow those email addresses to book from this slot.
>>>
>>> This might be a way to avoid freeloaders.
>>>
>>> >
>>> > The devil is in the details.
>>> >
>>> > If you have concrete suggestions on how to identify and weed out
>>> > freeloaders without destroying the volunteer base, please post
>>> > them here. Or better yet, pick up the job of volunteer coordinator.
>>> > After all, advice is cheap.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>> How difficult is it to pay cheques to speakers in that case?
>>> >
>>> > Very very difficult. Like I said, the devil is in the details.
>>>
>>> A way to solve this would again be to ask speakers to pay up
>>> front and then refund the speakers who gave talks at the end of
>>> the conference. Again something not too easy with the details
>>> but possibly a way to identify speakers might be when they
>>> register - I think PyCon US does this - You can register
>>> as a regular attendee or a speaker.
>>>
>>> I think we need to tweak the "Everybody pays policy" to suit
>>> our local expectations.
>>>
>>> Is any takers for this?
>> I doubt.
>>
>>
>>>  >
>>> >
>>> > [...]
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> - --
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> - --Anand
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Software Architect/Consultant
>>> anandpillai at letterboxes.org
>>>
>>> Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
>>> Kindly update your address books.
>>>
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>> Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux)
>>> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/
>>>
>>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJSQ93+AAoJEMTxYeOp9eaosFQH/3PYdRKRj1hrUHCQUZXrLcpC
>>> 8n0NMEY3Btp5JTFJdA7565SB7a4v//AbMpivItxdQODj4Hp1+wVKddz/pmUK3OZw
>>> VhjkWHJFZ8wr7mEwej0559ZF18F7NbJTj0clz+ZeFXa3txvJyH5up88o5Rpa5SOo
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>>> =m6LP
>>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Inpycon mailing list
>>> Inpycon at python.org
>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Atul
>>
>> www.atuljha.com
>>
>> irc(freenode) : koolhead17
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Inpycon mailing list
>> Inpycon at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Sreekanth S Rameshaiah
> Executive Director
> Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
> Bangalore, India - 560043
> Phone:  +91 80 4905 8444
> Mobile:  +91 98455 12611
> www.mahiti.org
> www.mahiti-infotech.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>


-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From sschivu at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 26 10:25:16 2013
From: sschivu at yahoo.com (Srikanth Chivukula)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 01:25:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Inpycon] unsubscribe me.
In-Reply-To: <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1380183916.50375.YahooMailNeo@web121603.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

kindly unsubscribe me from this list....


?
Srikanth Chivukula


________________________________
 From: Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com>
To: Mailing list for the PyCon India conference <inpycon at python.org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2013 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
 


On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 3:57 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com> wrote:

At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they have to pay for the conference. I think we should make this point very clear from the beginning.
I was the keynote speaker and I bought a ticket too.

Kiran



-- 
Kiran Jonnalagadda
http://jace.zaiki.in
http://hasgeek.com
_______________________________________________
Inpycon mailing list
Inpycon at python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
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From sschivu at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 26 10:25:16 2013
From: sschivu at yahoo.com (Srikanth Chivukula)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 01:25:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Inpycon] unsubscribe me.
In-Reply-To: <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1380183916.50375.YahooMailNeo@web121603.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

kindly unsubscribe me from this list....


?
Srikanth Chivukula


________________________________
 From: Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com>
To: Mailing list for the PyCon India conference <inpycon at python.org> 
Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2013 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
 


On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 3:57 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com> wrote:

At this year's PyCon India, some speakers were upset that they have to pay for the conference. I think we should make this point very clear from the beginning.
I was the keynote speaker and I bought a ticket too.

Kiran



-- 
Kiran Jonnalagadda
http://jace.zaiki.in
http://hasgeek.com
_______________________________________________
Inpycon mailing list
Inpycon at python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 10:48:24 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:18:24 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <5243EC4E.3010406@letterboxes.org> (Anand B. Pillai's message of
 "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 13:41:58 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
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 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
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 <CAKQ+-3zOgew3p7Yjr7u5Lc60CoMpRTd6fTCPh1uH90gTSU13nw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3b4ouAJO4K-gpF7gwUn0emu_9me-oiDOVo+4CyDaPLPA@mail.gmail.com>
 <5243EC4E.3010406@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <87k3i4ezon.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> writes:


[...]

> Shouldn't do that. That is one thing should start happening more in
> this list. We should try and conclude discussions with some kind of
> summary of the general direction of the discussion that can be applied
> for next year's PyCon.
>
> Otherwise this is all just academic - right ?

[...]

My reading of the situation is that the actual people who did the work
are tired and want to take a well deserved break and not much action
takes place.

The talkers get vocal with feedback and suggestions but end up having no
time or interest to do any actual work.


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 10:55:54 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:25:54 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87k3i4ezon.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
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 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <CAKQ+-3zOgew3p7Yjr7u5Lc60CoMpRTd6fTCPh1uH90gTSU13nw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3b4ouAJO4K-gpF7gwUn0emu_9me-oiDOVo+4CyDaPLPA@mail.gmail.com>
 <5243EC4E.3010406@letterboxes.org> <87k3i4ezon.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2aG2yZDazMQ099gM5mWjxf_P908wM+jETvJHKC0V0E7A@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 2:18 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > Shouldn't do that. That is one thing should start happening more in
> > this list. We should try and conclude discussions with some kind of
> > summary of the general direction of the discussion that can be applied
> > for next year's PyCon.
> >
> > Otherwise this is all just academic - right ?
>
> [...]
>
> My reading of the situation is that the actual people who did the work
> are tired and want to take a well deserved break and not much action
> takes place.
>
> <snip>

> The talkers get vocal with feedback and suggestions but end up having no
> time or interest to do any actual work.
>
>
> </snip>

Are you saying those who are having conversation here have no actual
interest in work?



--
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 10:57:47 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:27:47 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2aG2yZDazMQ099gM5mWjxf_P908wM+jETvJHKC0V0E7A@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:25:54 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM31muW2zFw-8a-rDEpUQ1jUp=33+hQDe17oh7pCYVyO1A@mail.gmail.com>
 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
 <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2wD-V=1mcW7oK-up1MpHpcvg_7+-x6Bzd30eyakFHyRw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zOgew3p7Yjr7u5Lc60CoMpRTd6fTCPh1uH90gTSU13nw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3b4ouAJO4K-gpF7gwUn0emu_9me-oiDOVo+4CyDaPLPA@mail.gmail.com>
 <5243EC4E.3010406@letterboxes.org>
 <87k3i4ezon.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2aG2yZDazMQ099gM5mWjxf_P908wM+jETvJHKC0V0E7A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87a9j0ez90.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:


[...]

> Are you saying those who are having conversation here have no actual
> interest in work?

[...]

No I'm not.


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 11:04:35 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:34:35 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87a9j0ez90.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87a9j0i0bi.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <874n98hzhy.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2=i-onRYvOBB8zVB98bD9fTwiN-bHqej4O-nzMqM4hqQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87wqm4gjtl.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1goGAP2ok6Zt=fdaGQ1GiwDLVkkT+FonYhCQo5MkdmFw@mail.gmail.com>
 <877ge4gj04.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2wD-V=1mcW7oK-up1MpHpcvg_7+-x6Bzd30eyakFHyRw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3zOgew3p7Yjr7u5Lc60CoMpRTd6fTCPh1uH90gTSU13nw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3b4ouAJO4K-gpF7gwUn0emu_9me-oiDOVo+4CyDaPLPA@mail.gmail.com>
 <5243EC4E.3010406@letterboxes.org> <87k3i4ezon.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2aG2yZDazMQ099gM5mWjxf_P908wM+jETvJHKC0V0E7A@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9j0ez90.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM1k2ApOPXq3+F2FxZC1NFmP8jASiDEyQ2L4B6T6YCpFkw@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 2:27 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > Are you saying those who are having conversation here have no actual
> > interest in work?
>
> [...]
>
> <snip>

> No I'm not.
>
> </snip>

Good for community then. We are open for discussion even when some of us
are vacation..



> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From vinayakh at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 11:59:07 2013
From: vinayakh at gmail.com (Vinayak Hegde)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:29:07 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKe6YvP90vWqk96aSDEQPGz37PySiSvFi7XzAQVJr2HUrCvwOg@mail.gmail.com>

+1 Kiran has said it better than I could.
+1 to Everyone pays.
+100 to the fact almost all money from sponsors should be redirected
towards sponsoring non-Pycon or allied activities such as running satellite
events in other cities, sponsoring Python Month (or similar activities) or
running code sprints (talk is cheap, show us the code). The conference
should not depend on the sponsor for the long-term health of the community.

I would add to the two points that Kiran has made :

1. Value

See the amount of value that you get from being a participant, speaker or
volunteer. You connect with other like-minded people and work with them.
You learn something new or ways of doing things better (something that can
be monetized by doing a job better or raising your skills or just the joy
of hacking). Now factor in the fact that you will be eating food at the
venue (breakfast + lunch + tea).

As a speaker, you get to talk about what you learn and generally the
off-stage conversations are good. You also get recognition from the
community and  put it on your resume. Also there used to be a
speaker/volunteer party (not sure if this happened this year since I was
neither).

If you think that INR 800 is not good enough for it (honestly even students
can afford this - the cost of two movies or two meals in a good
restaurant), maybe you should not come to the event. Don't think of it as a
cost, think of it as vote from a community member for things worth doing.

2. Management overheads

All the sane opinions that I have heard on this thread are from people who
have actually run an event. All of the people running the events have lives
and day-jobs. Time spent on the event is time away from job / family / kids
/ other hobbies / side projects. So time is at a premium. By saying that
you should have special rules for categories of people (which require human
interface to deal with), you are dissing them by implicitly assuming that
their time is less valuable than the participants. It is actually the other
way round. The only difference is that these people are motivated to make a
difference.

IMNSHO, there should be just two categories of tickets
1. Early geek tickets - So that money is paid upfront to fund things that
need upfront capex such as video equipment / RFID cards / Venue booking
cost etc. This should be capped at some %age of venue capacity (such as
30%). Maybe these have a small discount say 10%.
2. Normal tickets - Rest of the tickets.

No refunds but allow people to transfer tickets amongst themselves without
involvement from conf organisers. No on-the-spot registration. Pay only by
card / Debit card etc. This might seem controversial but in today day and
age it is possible to find someone with a card who can pay for you.

Keep it Simple Stupid.

-- Vinayak



On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:32 AM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> An event with focus on Indian crowd should be handled in Indian way.
>>
>
> I actually think PyCon charging everyone including speakers is a good
> idea. We're mixing up multiple concerns here, so let me try to separate
> them:
>
> *1. The notion that students need subsidy because they can't afford
> commercial rates.*
>
> Any conference the size of PyCon India charging < Rs 2000 per day is not
> at a commercial rate. It's not even at a sustainable rate. For comparison,
> here are some commercially priced events:
>
> Agile India 2014: Rs 10,000 *per day*
> http://booking.agilefaqs.com/agile-india-2014
>
> UX India 2013: Rs 10,000
> http://2013.ux-india.org/pricedetails
>
> JSConf Asia in Manila: PHP 19,500, SGD 560, ~INR 28,000
> http://2013.jsconf.asia/
> The Phillippine peso used to be 1:1 with the Indian rupee until a couple
> years ago and the purchasing power parity is the same, so it's the
> equivalent of spending 28k on a ticket in India.
>
> With prices like these, subsidies make sense. PyCon India tickets sold at
> Rs 800 and complaining about that is honestly shameful. Nobody who has the
> time and inclination to attend PyCon India is so poor they can't afford Rs
> 800 on a ticket. None of these people will complain that the restaurant
> they had lunch at did not sponsor it.
>
> *2. Speakers and crew are paying with their time and effort, so taking
> their cash is charging them extra.*
>
> This is a valid point, but a double edged sword. When you give someone
> free entry and a speaker badge, you mark them as special and above the
> crowd. The speaker-audience divide encourages formality, where speakers are
> announced in advance, their names and talk blurbs are used to sell tickets,
> and schedules are fixed and adhered to.
>
> What you lose is spontaneity. You can't have an open session where anyone
> may speak up because the audience will see it as a gap in the schedule, not
> an opportunity for them to step up and speak (unless it's a single track
> event and there is nowhere else to go for that period).
>
> You can't fix this by selecting flash talks in advance because those
> speakers will expect free tickets too, and free tickets are not free for
> the organizers. The per-head costs still have to be paid for.
>
> Spontaneity is good for a community. Class divisions are not.
>
> *3. PyCon has sponsor money anyway, so why should individuals pay?*
>
> First of all, all money isn't the same. Sponsor money is not a donation.
> Sponsors expect their pound of flesh. If you want to see what a
> sponsor-paid event looks like, look at Directi's HTTPX conference:
>
> http://bigrockhttpx.net/
> http://bigrockhttpx.net/mumbai
> http://bigrockhttpx.net/delhi
>
> These events were free for attendees, but it's incredibly hard to tell
> which session is led by an independent community member and which by a
> sponsor representative. For what's labeled as a "definite event", is there
> anything on the schedule that looks like someone who's pushing the
> boundaries and is there to reveal their work to the world? (Not dissing
> Directi, it is their first attempt and they'll no doubt improve with each
> iteration.)
>
> PyCon has an independent voice because it doesn't have to worry about
> sponsor expectations (one of: recruitment, selling their product, or
> finding new clients). When you give up participant money and become
> dependent on sponsor money, you also make the transition from serving
> participants to instead selling participants to sponsors -- and nobody is
> interested in students who have neither money nor well developed skills, so
> a sponsor-subsidised student-friendly event is actually self-defeating.
>
> PyCon's independence depends on people paying for their tickets. There is
> no way around this.
>
> Second, there is sponsor money coming in anyway, from sponsors who manage
> to benefit without demanding too much. IMHO, this money should not be spent
> on PyCon itself. It should be directed towards supporting the growth of the
> Python community *beyond* PyCon.
>
> *4. Management overheads.*
>
> The more twists you add to the story, the more overhead you'll have in
> explaining this to people. Is your ticket free or not? If you buy a ticket
> and your talk is selected, will your ticket be refunded or not? If you
> didn't buy a ticket and didn't get selected, can you get a discount code to
> buy at the early bird price since you proposed to speak back then? What if
> you spoke in an open session? Do you get a refund? Carrying cash is
> difficult, can you pay by card at the venue? Can PyCon also cover your
> travel and stay since you are a poor student?
>
> Answering questions is a full-time job, sometimes even requiring two
> people. Simple rules go a long way towards eliminating such hidden costs.
>
> My 2b.
>
> Kiran
>
> --
> Kiran Jonnalagadda
> http://jace.zaiki.in
> http://hasgeek.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>
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From kiran.daredevil at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 12:03:12 2013
From: kiran.daredevil at gmail.com (Kiran Gangadharan)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:33:12 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
Message-ID: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Kiran Jonnalagadda has clearly mentioned as to why "Everybody pays" policy
works and why we should move ahead with this. Instead of just debating more
and more over this, why not create a simple poll using google forms or
something, and see what majority of the people think instead of polluting
the mailing lists with all sorts of arguments ?

Cheers,
Kiran Gangadharan
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 12:23:37 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:53:37 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 (Kiran Gangadharan's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:33:12 +0530")
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Kiran Gangadharan <kiran.daredevil at gmail.com> writes:


[...]

> why not create a simple poll using google forms or something, and see
> what majority of the people think instead of polluting the mailing
> lists with all sorts of arguments ?

Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the best way to
make imporant functional decisions. We "argue" constructively and then
come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't pollution, it's the purpose of the
list.

I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about the
conference to influence how we run it. Do you?

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 12:53:48 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:23:48 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> Kiran Gangadharan <kiran.daredevil at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > why not create a simple poll using google forms or something, and see
> > what majority of the people think instead of polluting the mailing
> > lists with all sorts of arguments ?
>
> <snip>

> Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the best way to
> make imporant functional decisions. We "argue" constructively and then
> come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't pollution, it's the purpose of the
> list.
>
>  </snip>
Hmm. So you suggesting closed door discussion and then throwing it out loud
& claiming it community wants it?

<snip>

> I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about the
> conference to influence how we run it. Do you?
>
> </snip>
How welcoming are you for advise from someone who wants to help?

As Kiran mentioned, its good idea we should conduct a poll & have everyones
voice heard, instead of sitting inside a close door and deciding what and
how for all.

If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing enough to let us
in so we can be there for next event?





> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From foss.mailinglists at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 13:02:41 2013
From: foss.mailinglists at gmail.com (sankarshan)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:32:41 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:23 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>
> wrote:

>> Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the best way to
>> make imporant functional decisions. We "argue" constructively and then
>> come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't pollution, it's the purpose of the
>> list.
>>
>  </snip>
> Hmm. So you suggesting closed door discussion and then throwing it out loud
> & claiming it community wants it?

No. I don't think he did mention that. And, your statement is an
interpretation of what he wrote. I would like to default to believe
that the event organization which constitutes members from PSSI (and,
some how are members of PSF) have the best interests of the Python
community in India in their hearts. I sense this thread calling that
into question. I do not believe that is healthy.

To be able to make changes one needs to participate. Atul, perhaps you
need to explore how you can participate in the PyCon India process for
the 2014 edition and, thereafter drive the changes you like to see.

PSSI has a fiduciary duty to the Python community in India. I do not
seem them shirking that role.

> <snip>
>>
>> I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about the
>> conference to influence how we run it. Do you?
>>
> </snip>
> How welcoming are you for advise from someone who wants to help?

Creating a poll is one step to helping. The next step is to be able to
devise means of assessing the outcome of the poll and, also being able
to have ownership of the changes. Ownership and execution requires
participation. I think Noufal has earlier alluded to the requirement
of individuals stepping up to participate and contribute and not just
stay at the first step.

> As Kiran mentioned, its good idea we should conduct a poll & have everyones
> voice heard, instead of sitting inside a close door and deciding what and
> how for all.
>
> If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing enough to let us
> in so we can be there for next event?

I think this is a dangerous assumption to make. I do not see Noufal
or, the PSSI gating/preventing anyone to stand up and be counted. If
you have specific instances where you feel that your contributions
have been actively prevented by the organization or, individuals, I
would suggest seeking redress within the PSSI. That would require to
be addressed.



-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay
<https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 13:09:37 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:39:37 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM1bLNbmnRmm6-j-OGuzP+bEArhy72WbRxJhq3L8yCreOA@mail.gmail.com>

 Sankarshan,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:32 PM, sankarshan <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:23 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>
> > wrote:
>
> >> Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the best way to
> >> make imporant functional decisions. We "argue" constructively and then
> >> come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't pollution, it's the purpose of the
> >> list.
> >>
> >  </snip>
> > Hmm. So you suggesting closed door discussion and then throwing it out
> loud
> > & claiming it community wants it?
>
> No. I don't think he did mention that. And, your statement is an
> interpretation of what he wrote. I would like to default to believe
> that the event organization which constitutes members from PSSI (and,
> some how are members of PSF) have the best interests of the Python
> community in India in their hearts. I sense this thread calling that
> into question. I do not believe that is healthy.
>
> To be able to make changes one needs to participate. Atul, perhaps you
> need to explore how you can participate in the PyCon India process for
> the 2014 edition and, thereafter drive the changes you like to see.
>
> PSSI has a fiduciary duty to the Python community in India. I do not
> seem them shirking that role.
>
> > <snip>
> >>
> >> I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about the
> >> conference to influence how we run it. Do you?
> >>
> > </snip>
> > How welcoming are you for advise from someone who wants to help?
>
> Creating a poll is one step to helping. The next step is to be able to
> devise means of assessing the outcome of the poll and, also being able
> to have ownership of the changes. Ownership and execution requires
> participation. I think Noufal has earlier alluded to the requirement
> of individuals stepping up to participate and contribute and not just
> stay at the first step.
>
> > As Kiran mentioned, its good idea we should conduct a poll & have
> everyones
> > voice heard, instead of sitting inside a close door and deciding what and
> > how for all.
> >
> > If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing enough to let
> us
> > in so we can be there for next event?
>
> I think this is a dangerous assumption to make. I do not see Noufal
> or, the PSSI gating/preventing anyone to stand up and be counted. If
> you have specific instances where you feel that your contributions
> have been actively prevented by the organization or, individuals, I
> would suggest seeking redress within the PSSI. That would require to
> be addressed.
>
>
> Every single reply of Naufel was as if i have done something really bad by
letting my voice in here.

All his mails have been totally unwelcoming, which is the reason for
outburst. If you are calling yourself an organizer or what not for
community you need to have guts to hear everyone & not stereotyping.








>
> --
> sankarshan mukhopadhyay
> <https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From sree at mahiti.org  Thu Sep 26 13:08:29 2013
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:38:29 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD=RLAiH1uwEit2ifkk4mUdar5TuKgeSVHHf-wQYD=_3Wiq+QA@mail.gmail.com>

On 26 September 2013 16:32, sankarshan <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com> wrote:

> > If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing enough to let
> us
> > in so we can be there for next event?
>
> I think this is a dangerous assumption to make. I do not see Noufal
> or, the PSSI gating/preventing anyone to stand up and be counted. If
> you have specific instances where you feel that your contributions
> have been actively prevented by the organization or, individuals, I
> would suggest seeking redress within the PSSI. That would require to
> be addressed.


Its a community event. No one else has to "do anything to let you in".
Please watch threads that discuss the organising of the conference, come
and pick up task that works for you and help the community run the event.
- sree
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 13:21:26 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:51:26 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAD=RLAiH1uwEit2ifkk4mUdar5TuKgeSVHHf-wQYD=_3Wiq+QA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAD=RLAiH1uwEit2ifkk4mUdar5TuKgeSVHHf-wQYD=_3Wiq+QA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM3cXVpbZ2YYzc=KRjtifAsiwLhxS3Y9eWOFTeERRc3YNg@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:38 PM, Sreekanth S Rameshaiah <sree at mahiti.org>wrote:

>
> On 26 September 2013 16:32, sankarshan <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> > If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing enough to let
>> us
>> > in so we can be there for next event?
>>
>> I think this is a dangerous assumption to make. I do not see Noufal
>> or, the PSSI gating/preventing anyone to stand up and be counted. If
>> you have specific instances where you feel that your contributions
>> have been actively prevented by the organization or, individuals, I
>> would suggest seeking redress within the PSSI. That would require to
>> be addressed.
>
>
> Its a community event. No one else has to "do anything to let you in".
> Please watch threads that discuss the organising of the conference, come
> and pick up task that works for you and help the community run the event.
> - sree
>

I doubt everyone in team thinks same way otherwise this would not have come
this far.


>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>


-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From kiran.daredevil at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 13:26:33 2013
From: kiran.daredevil at gmail.com (Kiran Gangadharan)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:56:33 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAJHdgAQT6482Ud_S49UZ4ZAv8vkqJiYbnjby=pAxvF=niiPaHA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Right, I agree. You'd never know who voted for what. And yes, we want
opinions from people who matter. So I guess, debating it here is the best
option. Thanks for pointing it out.

Cheers,
Kiran



On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> Kiran Gangadharan <kiran.daredevil at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > why not create a simple poll using google forms or something, and see
> > what majority of the people think instead of polluting the mailing
> > lists with all sorts of arguments ?
>
> Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the best way to
> make imporant functional decisions. We "argue" constructively and then
> come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't pollution, it's the purpose of the
> list.
>
> I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about the
> conference to influence how we run it. Do you?
>
> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
>



-- 
Kiran Gangadharan
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 13:44:15 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:14:15 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM3cXVpbZ2YYzc=KRjtifAsiwLhxS3Y9eWOFTeERRc3YNg@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:51:26 +0530")
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAD=RLAiH1uwEit2ifkk4mUdar5TuKgeSVHHf-wQYD=_3Wiq+QA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3cXVpbZ2YYzc=KRjtifAsiwLhxS3Y9eWOFTeERRc3YNg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8738orerjk.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:


[...]
> I doubt everyone in team thinks same way otherwise this would not have
> come this far.
[...]

This is getting pointlessly tiresome. 

Most of the people *do* think this way and that's why PyCon India has
been conducted for 5 years now and has grown into a big event. People
pitch in when there's a call for volunteers and help out.

If you're accusing me or someone else on the list about something, come
clean and say exactly what the problem is.

If you think I and a few others run a secret cabal here that pulls
strings and runs PyCon India while blackballing the general community,
say so.

If you're dissatisfied with the way something is being organised, or see
some kind of scope for improvement, specify exactly what and pitch in at
any time. Knowing how short handed we always are, no one here refuses
help.

If you expect everyone to accept your (rather naive) recommendations
without questioning them, I'm sorry, that's not going to happen. People
who've been on this list for a while know who are doing all the work and
whose suggestions are backed by action.

The bottom line is if you have something constructive to say, do so. If
you have time to pitch in, do so. If you want to criticise something
about the conference or PSSI work, do so. If, on the other hand, all
you're interested in is hurling accusations at people and making a
ruckus, just don't.

-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 13:47:05 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:17:05 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAJHdgAQT6482Ud_S49UZ4ZAv8vkqJiYbnjby=pAxvF=niiPaHA@mail.gmail.com>
 (Kiran Gangadharan's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 16:56:33 +0530")
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAJHdgAQT6482Ud_S49UZ4ZAv8vkqJiYbnjby=pAxvF=niiPaHA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87vc1ndcue.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Kiran Gangadharan <kiran.daredevil at gmail.com> writes:

> Hi,
>
> Right, I agree. You'd never know who voted for what. And yes, we want
> opinions from people who matter. So I guess, debating it here is the best
> option. Thanks for pointing it out.

You're welcome. :)

We tried the "vote for everything" approach back in 2009 and it failed
miserably. I mentioned this when I presented my "Road to PyCon India"
during the maiden conference. The slides are at
http://nibrahim.net.in/journal/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/road-to-pycon.pdf

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From anandpillai at letterboxes.org  Thu Sep 26 13:49:42 2013
From: anandpillai at letterboxes.org (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:19:42 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM1bLNbmnRmm6-j-OGuzP+bEArhy72WbRxJhq3L8yCreOA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM1bLNbmnRmm6-j-OGuzP+bEArhy72WbRxJhq3L8yCreOA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <52441F56.3080201@letterboxes.org>

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On Thursday 26 September 2013 04:39 PM, atul jha wrote:
> Sankarshan,
> 
> 
> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:32 PM, sankarshan
> <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:
> 
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:23 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
>>> <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>> 
>>>> Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the
>>>> best way to make imporant functional decisions. We "argue"
>>>> constructively and then come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't
>>>> pollution, it's the purpose of the list.
>>>> 
>>> </snip> Hmm. So you suggesting closed door discussion and then
>>> throwing it out
>> loud
>>> & claiming it community wants it?
>> 
>> No. I don't think he did mention that. And, your statement is an 
>> interpretation of what he wrote. I would like to default to
>> believe that the event organization which constitutes members
>> from PSSI (and, some how are members of PSF) have the best
>> interests of the Python community in India in their hearts. I
>> sense this thread calling that into question. I do not believe
>> that is healthy.
>> 
>> To be able to make changes one needs to participate. Atul,
>> perhaps you need to explore how you can participate in the PyCon
>> India process for the 2014 edition and, thereafter drive the
>> changes you like to see.
>> 
>> PSSI has a fiduciary duty to the Python community in India. I do
>> not seem them shirking that role.
>> 
>>> <snip>
>>>> 
>>>> I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about
>>>> the conference to influence how we run it. Do you?
>>>> 
>>> </snip> How welcoming are you for advise from someone who wants
>>> to help?
>> 
>> Creating a poll is one step to helping. The next step is to be
>> able to devise means of assessing the outcome of the poll and,
>> also being able to have ownership of the changes. Ownership and
>> execution requires participation. I think Noufal has earlier
>> alluded to the requirement of individuals stepping up to
>> participate and contribute and not just stay at the first step.
>> 
>>> As Kiran mentioned, its good idea we should conduct a poll &
>>> have
>> everyones
>>> voice heard, instead of sitting inside a close door and
>>> deciding what and how for all.
>>> 
>>> If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing
>>> enough to let
>> us
>>> in so we can be there for next event?
>> 
>> I think this is a dangerous assumption to make. I do not see
>> Noufal or, the PSSI gating/preventing anyone to stand up and be
>> counted. If you have specific instances where you feel that your
>> contributions have been actively prevented by the organization
>> or, individuals, I would suggest seeking redress within the PSSI.
>> That would require to be addressed.
>> 
>> 
>> Every single reply of Naufel was as if i have done something
>> really bad by
> letting my voice in here.
> 

This kind of arguments are not productive. Let us stick to your
original point and not digress.

Noufal or me or anyone for that matter is not running the conference
as a personal show or something. It is a community conference driven
by a number of people, almost all equal. However as you know democracy
is not flat but it is tiered. You do need people at different levels
and hierarchies to drive things forward. Otherwise things just wouldn't
work and democracy would becomes a very noisy and unproductive
anarchy.

To further qualify my point, you wouldn't even want to consider
this a democracy in the first place. A few people who took the time
and effort to do things early on naturally are perceived as leaders
of the community. They aren't democratically elected - but are
in this position by meritocracy. So I don't fully buy the democracy
argument. Meritocracy is never given on a platter - it is achieved
by virtue of hard work - Give respect to it.

The other pragmatic aspect is to run something like this in the
way that everyone is happy - would need a lot of dedication in terms
of time, space and human resources. Quite often decisions are made to
take the shortest path forward - not because we are autocrats but
because of lack of time or people to get things done in the most
pleasing way for all - it just never happens.

> All his mails have been totally unwelcoming, which is the reason
> for outburst. If you are calling yourself an organizer or what not
> for community you need to have guts to hear everyone & not
> stereotyping.
> 


No personal attacks please and no naming/shaming business. If you
can step up and contribute to running of the conference, perhaps
we would be more than willing to give a lot of time and mind space
to understand your views - the point of meritocracy in the first place.

So please do that and don't resort to unproductive paths such
as personal criticisms. Your ideas and suggestions are welcome,
your mud slinging ain't.



- -- 
Regards,

- --Anand

-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Architect/Consultant
anandpillai at letterboxes.org

Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
Kindly update your address books.

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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 13:51:17 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:21:17 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <8738orerjk.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAD=RLAiH1uwEit2ifkk4mUdar5TuKgeSVHHf-wQYD=_3Wiq+QA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3cXVpbZ2YYzc=KRjtifAsiwLhxS3Y9eWOFTeERRc3YNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <8738orerjk.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2HQs2nkhygV0Vvmapc-a0W+uoB1Tc0c_5fUZFW+0nLAg@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:

> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
> > I doubt everyone in team thinks same way otherwise this would not have
> > come this far.
> [...]
>
> This is getting pointlessly tiresome.
>
> Indeed.


> Most of the people *do* think this way and that's why PyCon India has
> been conducted for 5 years now and has grown into a big event. People
> pitch in when there's a call for volunteers and help out.
>
> If you're accusing me or someone else on the list about something, come
> clean and say exactly what the problem is.
>
> Read your previous mails & you will realize.

> If you think I and a few others run a secret cabal here that pulls
> strings and runs PyCon India while blackballing the general community,
> say so.
>
Its how you assumed.

>
> If you're dissatisfied with the way something is being organised, or see
> some kind of scope for improvement, specify exactly what and pitch in at
> any time. Knowing how short handed we always are, no one here refuses
> help.
>
> Is that what i was not doing in this mail thread?

> If you expect everyone to accept your (rather naive) recommendations
> without questioning them, I'm sorry, that's not going to happen. People
> who've been on this list for a while know who are doing all the work and
> whose suggestions are backed by action.
>
Well does that means if someone new coming to list with some ideas he is an
outsider? All your replies points same way.

>
> The bottom line is if you have something constructive to say, do so. If
> you have time to pitch in, do so. If you want to criticise something
> about the conference or PSSI work, do so. If, on the other hand, all
> you're interested in is hurling accusations at people and making a
> ruckus, just don't.
>
> Well now you are talking about PSSI. All this while it was <U>
Am happy something is changing.

 --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 13:53:43 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:23:43 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <52441F56.3080201@letterboxes.org>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM1bLNbmnRmm6-j-OGuzP+bEArhy72WbRxJhq3L8yCreOA@mail.gmail.com>
 <52441F56.3080201@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM08k08B2CMF4mYcLmgnG=z26rBFOnk2Cw3DH=J36y73WQ@mail.gmail.com>

Anand,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org
> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Thursday 26 September 2013 04:39 PM, atul jha wrote:
> > Sankarshan,
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:32 PM, sankarshan
> > <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com>wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 4:23 PM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
> >>> <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
> >>
> >>>> Because democracy, as has been repeatedly proved, is not the
> >>>> best way to make imporant functional decisions. We "argue"
> >>>> constructively and then come to a (semi) consensus. It isn't
> >>>> pollution, it's the purpose of the list.
> >>>>
> >>> </snip> Hmm. So you suggesting closed door discussion and then
> >>> throwing it out
> >> loud
> >>> & claiming it community wants it?
> >>
> >> No. I don't think he did mention that. And, your statement is an
> >> interpretation of what he wrote. I would like to default to
> >> believe that the event organization which constitutes members
> >> from PSSI (and, some how are members of PSF) have the best
> >> interests of the Python community in India in their hearts. I
> >> sense this thread calling that into question. I do not believe
> >> that is healthy.
> >>
> >> To be able to make changes one needs to participate. Atul,
> >> perhaps you need to explore how you can participate in the PyCon
> >> India process for the 2014 edition and, thereafter drive the
> >> changes you like to see.
> >>
> >> PSSI has a fiduciary duty to the Python community in India. I do
> >> not seem them shirking that role.
> >>
> >>> <snip>
> >>>>
> >>>> I don't want the opinion of someone who doesn't care about
> >>>> the conference to influence how we run it. Do you?
> >>>>
> >>> </snip> How welcoming are you for advise from someone who wants
> >>> to help?
> >>
> >> Creating a poll is one step to helping. The next step is to be
> >> able to devise means of assessing the outcome of the poll and,
> >> also being able to have ownership of the changes. Ownership and
> >> execution requires participation. I think Noufal has earlier
> >> alluded to the requirement of individuals stepping up to
> >> participate and contribute and not just stay at the first step.
> >>
> >>> As Kiran mentioned, its good idea we should conduct a poll &
> >>> have
> >> everyones
> >>> voice heard, instead of sitting inside a close door and
> >>> deciding what and how for all.
> >>>
> >>> If i/others was/were not part of past event are you doing
> >>> enough to let
> >> us
> >>> in so we can be there for next event?
> >>
> >> I think this is a dangerous assumption to make. I do not see
> >> Noufal or, the PSSI gating/preventing anyone to stand up and be
> >> counted. If you have specific instances where you feel that your
> >> contributions have been actively prevented by the organization
> >> or, individuals, I would suggest seeking redress within the PSSI.
> >> That would require to be addressed.
> >>
> >>
> >> Every single reply of Naufel was as if i have done something
> >> really bad by
> > letting my voice in here.
> >
>
> This kind of arguments are not productive. Let us stick to your
> original point and not digress.
>
> Noufal or me or anyone for that matter is not running the conference
> as a personal show or something. It is a community conference driven
> by a number of people, almost all equal. However as you know democracy
> is not flat but it is tiered. You do need people at different levels
> and hierarchies to drive things forward. Otherwise things just wouldn't
> work and democracy would becomes a very noisy and unproductive
> anarchy.
>
> To further qualify my point, you wouldn't even want to consider
> this a democracy in the first place. A few people who took the time
> and effort to do things early on naturally are perceived as leaders
> of the community. They aren't democratically elected - but are
> in this position by meritocracy. So I don't fully buy the democracy
> argument. Meritocracy is never given on a platter - it is achieved
> by virtue of hard work - Give respect to it.
>
> The other pragmatic aspect is to run something like this in the
> way that everyone is happy - would need a lot of dedication in terms
> of time, space and human resources. Quite often decisions are made to
> take the shortest path forward - not because we are autocrats but
> because of lack of time or people to get things done in the most
> pleasing way for all - it just never happens.
>
> > All his mails have been totally unwelcoming, which is the reason
> > for outburst. If you are calling yourself an organizer or what not
> > for community you need to have guts to hear everyone & not
> > stereotyping.
> >
>
>
> No personal attacks please and no naming/shaming business. If you
> can step up and contribute to running of the conference, perhaps
> we would be more than willing to give a lot of time and mind space
> to understand your views - the point of meritocracy in the first place.
>
> So please do that and don't resort to unproductive paths such
> as personal criticisms. Your ideas and suggestions are welcome,
> your mud slinging ain't.
>
>
> I had no intention in throwing muds on one another. If this team has
sensible bunch of guys open to listen to everyone then better they should
 act like that.


> - --
> Regards,
>
> - --Anand
>
> -
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Software Architect/Consultant
> anandpillai at letterboxes.org
>
> Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
> Kindly update your address books.
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/
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> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From anandpillai at letterboxes.org  Thu Sep 26 14:08:30 2013
From: anandpillai at letterboxes.org (Anand B Pillai)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:38:30 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2HQs2nkhygV0Vvmapc-a0W+uoB1Tc0c_5fUZFW+0nLAg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAD=RLAiH1uwEit2ifkk4mUdar5TuKgeSVHHf-wQYD=_3Wiq+QA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3cXVpbZ2YYzc=KRjtifAsiwLhxS3Y9eWOFTeERRc3YNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <8738orerjk.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2HQs2nkhygV0Vvmapc-a0W+uoB1Tc0c_5fUZFW+0nLAg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <524423BE.1020203@letterboxes.org>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thursday 26 September 2013 05:21 PM, atul jha wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
> <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
> 
>> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>> 
>> 
>> [...]
>>> I doubt everyone in team thinks same way otherwise this would
>>> not have come this far.
>> [...]
>> 
>> This is getting pointlessly tiresome.
>> 
>> Indeed.
> 
> 
>> Most of the people *do* think this way and that's why PyCon India
>> has been conducted for 5 years now and has grown into a big
>> event. People pitch in when there's a call for volunteers and
>> help out.
>> 
>> If you're accusing me or someone else on the list about
>> something, come clean and say exactly what the problem is.
>> 
>> Read your previous mails & you will realize.
> 
>> If you think I and a few others run a secret cabal here that
>> pulls strings and runs PyCon India while blackballing the general
>> community, say so.
>> 
> Its how you assumed.
> 
>> 
>> If you're dissatisfied with the way something is being organised,
>> or see some kind of scope for improvement, specify exactly what
>> and pitch in at any time. Knowing how short handed we always are,
>> no one here refuses help.
>> 
>> Is that what i was not doing in this mail thread?
> 
>> If you expect everyone to accept your (rather naive)
>> recommendations without questioning them, I'm sorry, that's not
>> going to happen. People who've been on this list for a while know
>> who are doing all the work and whose suggestions are backed by
>> action.
>> 
> Well does that means if someone new coming to list with some ideas
> he is an outsider? All your replies points same way.

Let me put it this way. E-mails are not the best medium for keeping up
a continuous conversation. Mailing lists are especially notorious for
fragmenting a line of discussion - because you tend to loose your
original line of thought as threads come in from the side etc.

Anway I am digressing.

The thing is, let us face it - People are reluctant to change. So
perhaps a good way to try and change the thinking or introduce new
ideas is a "gentle nudge" rather than a "forceful entry".
I hope I am making sense.

The most ideal way to build a productive conversation would be
to start presenting your idea using the approach of least resistance.

(Suffer me a bit more.)

If you look back to your first post, you started off by

"
Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?

Is it because sponsorship money not sufficient? Is there any blog/mail
provides description/info about the overall expenditure of the event?
"

Not very diplomatic I think.

> 
>> 
>> The bottom line is if you have something constructive to say, do
>> so. If you have time to pitch in, do so. If you want to criticise
>> something about the conference or PSSI work, do so. If, on the
>> other hand, all you're interested in is hurling accusations at
>> people and making a ruckus, just don't.
>> 
>> Well now you are talking about PSSI. All this while it was <U>
> Am happy something is changing.

Sure, maybe you are. We do need inputs, ideas and suggestions but
for the general good environment of the mailing list and to make sure
your ideas are recieved positively, may I suggest "gentle nudges"
and "incremental suggestions" than "in-your-face-questions" ?


Hope I was helpful.
> 
> --
>> Cordially, Noufal http://nibrahim.net.in
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Inpycon mailing
> list Inpycon at python.org 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
> 


- -- 
Regards,

- --Anand

-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Architect/Consultant
anandpillai at letterboxes.org

Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
Kindly update your address books.

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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 14:28:28 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:58:28 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <524423BE.1020203@letterboxes.org>
References: <CAJHdgASr3J83=C=YE30n5xwCAcwqt9bChX5-E9GJ3zyG0HKQNw@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2jev9y.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM3_5iq5aqQ69nXH_P0kSt7wZtr4BCX3B_F-HAK9y61r+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3wpAoJ7rVQMRjEDuSctKJcR6kPY_J_QBJZqbapVkd6Hvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAD=RLAiH1uwEit2ifkk4mUdar5TuKgeSVHHf-wQYD=_3Wiq+QA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM3cXVpbZ2YYzc=KRjtifAsiwLhxS3Y9eWOFTeERRc3YNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <8738orerjk.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2HQs2nkhygV0Vvmapc-a0W+uoB1Tc0c_5fUZFW+0nLAg@mail.gmail.com>
 <524423BE.1020203@letterboxes.org>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2rVHxxX3y5ZAJ10gbraM5eqbJknnj5=Ka4LAWodsEMww@mail.gmail.com>

Anand,


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 5:38 PM, Anand B Pillai <anandpillai at letterboxes.org
> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Thursday 26 September 2013 05:21 PM, atul jha wrote:
> > On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Noufal Ibrahim
> > <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
> >
> >> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
> >>
> >>
> >> [...]
> >>> I doubt everyone in team thinks same way otherwise this would
> >>> not have come this far.
> >> [...]
> >>
> >> This is getting pointlessly tiresome.
> >>
> >> Indeed.
> >
> >
> >> Most of the people *do* think this way and that's why PyCon India
> >> has been conducted for 5 years now and has grown into a big
> >> event. People pitch in when there's a call for volunteers and
> >> help out.
> >>
> >> If you're accusing me or someone else on the list about
> >> something, come clean and say exactly what the problem is.
> >>
> >> Read your previous mails & you will realize.
> >
> >> If you think I and a few others run a secret cabal here that
> >> pulls strings and runs PyCon India while blackballing the general
> >> community, say so.
> >>
> > Its how you assumed.
> >
> >>
> >> If you're dissatisfied with the way something is being organised,
> >> or see some kind of scope for improvement, specify exactly what
> >> and pitch in at any time. Knowing how short handed we always are,
> >> no one here refuses help.
> >>
> >> Is that what i was not doing in this mail thread?
> >
> >> If you expect everyone to accept your (rather naive)
> >> recommendations without questioning them, I'm sorry, that's not
> >> going to happen. People who've been on this list for a while know
> >> who are doing all the work and whose suggestions are backed by
> >> action.
> >>
> > Well does that means if someone new coming to list with some ideas
> > he is an outsider? All your replies points same way.
>
> Let me put it this way. E-mails are not the best medium for keeping up
> a continuous conversation. Mailing lists are especially notorious for
> fragmenting a line of discussion - because you tend to loose your
> original line of thought as threads come in from the side etc.
>
> Anway I am digressing.
>
> The thing is, let us face it - People are reluctant to change. So
> perhaps a good way to try and change the thinking or introduce new
> ideas is a "gentle nudge" rather than a "forceful entry".
> I hope I am making sense.
>
> The most ideal way to build a productive conversation would be
> to start presenting your idea using the approach of least resistance.
>
> (Suffer me a bit more.)
>
> If you look back to your first post, you started off by
>
> "
> Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?
>
> Is it because sponsorship money not sufficient? Is there any blog/mail
> provides description/info about the overall expenditure of the event?
> "
>
> Not very diplomatic I think.
>
> Am not sure if it requires to be diplomatic if its about a community where
everyone is welcome to ask/participate in loud/open.

>  >
> >>
> >> The bottom line is if you have something constructive to say, do
> >> so. If you have time to pitch in, do so. If you want to criticise
> >> something about the conference or PSSI work, do so. If, on the
> >> other hand, all you're interested in is hurling accusations at
> >> people and making a ruckus, just don't.
> >>
> >> Well now you are talking about PSSI. All this while it was <U>
> > Am happy something is changing.
>
> Sure, maybe you are. We do need inputs, ideas and suggestions but
> for the general good environment of the mailing list and to make sure
> your ideas are recieved positively, may I suggest "gentle nudges"
> and "incremental suggestions" than "in-your-face-questions" ?
>
> I am not sure but this works well most of the time if you are in a
community with OPEN participation.

>
> Hope I was helpful.
>
Thanks for letting me know how i should start my conversation in order to
be heard by the folks from this community & PCCI/Pycon organizers in
general. I am happy Kiran/You/Sankarshan addressed some of it.

I would hope all this conversation leads to some final conclusion.


>
> > --
> >> Cordially, Noufal http://nibrahim.net.in
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________ Inpycon mailing
> > list Inpycon at python.org
> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
> >
>
>
> - --
> Regards,
>
> - --Anand
>
> -
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Software Architect/Consultant
> anandpillai at letterboxes.org
>
> Please note my updated email address <anandpillai at letterboxes.org>.
> Kindly update your address books.
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/
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> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>



-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From vpuri.social at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 15:09:00 2013
From: vpuri.social at gmail.com (Vivek Puri)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 18:39:00 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <524431EC.2090500@gmail.com>

Hi,

I do agree with what kiran said.

One option as earlier suggested is to offer same price  as early bird to 
speakers and
volunteers, seems middle of road but good. Everybody pays but speakers 
and volunteer
do get special treatment.

rgds
vivek

From anandology at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 16:02:08 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:32:08 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:32 AM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
>
>> Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com> writes:
>>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> > HasGeek policy is free tickets for speakers and crew.
>>
>> I wasn't aware of that.
>>
>> > I bought a ticket because I knew it was PyCon policy -- I bought a
>> > ticket even last year despite volunteering.
>>
>> <snip>
>
>>  There's still gap in the communication. Anand told me about one or two
>> speakers who were annoyed that they had to pay even though their talks
>> were selected.
>>
> </snip>
>
>>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cordially,
>> Noufal
>> http://nibrahim.net.in
>> _______________________________________________
>> Inpycon mailing list
>> Inpycon at python.org
>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>>
>
>
> Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?
>

There was a discussion in this mailing list when we decided the fee and the
tiers. Where were you then?


> Is it because sponsorship money not sufficient? Is there any blog/mail
> provides description/info about the overall expenditure of the event?
>
> If money is real issue please get a new sponsorship model in place which
> handles entry fee payments for speakers and volunteers specifically.
>

I don't see the point. No volunteer has complained that he has a problem
with paying the fee. Some student volunteers have explicitly asked us and
we've made couple of exceptions.

Again, the problem with the speakers was not about paying the money, but
the lack of the communication about that. Some speakers were surprised at
the last minute because they weren't aware that they have to pay the fee.

I think we should respect the opinions of the people who have managed the
volunteers and handled the speakers than suggesting hypothetical issues
without any base. It is not very good use of the time on this mailing list.


> When most of the volunteers are students & some speakers as well. Some of
> them are coming from other part of country & planning stay/food on their
> own. Can we not do best by giving them entry to the event?
>

How do you know that most of the volunteers are students? I've worked very
closely with volunteers this year and I haven't heard any complaints from
them. There are even some volunteers who have just sit in the network room
all the three days of the conference, making sure the network/registration
desk working fine, and some of them were students. When they were very
happy to pay the fee themselves, I don't see an point of discussing about
it.

Comparing an Indian event with event in US  & following with same footprint
> does not go well here.
>
> An event with focus on Indian crowd should be handled in Indian way.
>

Well, I've started this thread not with the intention of blindly following
that model, but because that post has explained a model that *we have been*
following since beginning and I strongly believe that it very good model to
continue.

It would have been a lot more productive if you had come in couple of
months earlier and helped in shaping the event. Lot of these decisions have
come out of the collective wisdom of running PyCon India over years and
closely observing it grow. I'm sure you'll have a better understanding
about the whole thing once you see it closely. Hope to see you at PyCon
India 2014.

Anand
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From hiddenharmony at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 16:09:05 2013
From: hiddenharmony at gmail.com (Vivek Khurana)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:39:05 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <524431EC.2090500@gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>
 <524431EC.2090500@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpZEPpzu9QazdkkPgzToCr=G35NSBz8NNc86MX499AWJLY_DA@mail.gmail.com>

Charging Volunteers is not acceptable. Volunteers put in physical and
mental effort to run the conference, so charging volunteers will discourage
people from volunteering. If volunteers are being charged then either the
money should be refunded at the end of the event or Volunteers should be
paid for the effort they put in to run the event.

regards
Vivek


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 6:39 PM, Vivek Puri <vpuri.social at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I do agree with what kiran said.
>
> One option as earlier suggested is to offer same price  as early bird to
> speakers and
> volunteers, seems middle of road but good. Everybody pays but speakers and
> volunteer
> do get special treatment.
>
> rgds
> vivek
>
> ______________________________**_________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/**mailman/listinfo/inpycon<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon>
>



-- 
The hidden harmony is better than the obvious!!
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 16:10:39 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:40:39 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM1wQGQRqxaU9EgZXUFncakYLAm1Uvz67C3sXf9Ps24FJw@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 7:32 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:32 AM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in>wrote:
>>
>>> Kiran Jonnalagadda <jace at pobox.com> writes:
>>>
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>> > HasGeek policy is free tickets for speakers and crew.
>>>
>>> I wasn't aware of that.
>>>
>>> > I bought a ticket because I knew it was PyCon policy -- I bought a
>>> > ticket even last year despite volunteering.
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>
>>>  There's still gap in the communication. Anand told me about one or two
>>> speakers who were annoyed that they had to pay even though their talks
>>> were selected.
>>>
>> </snip>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Cordially,
>>> Noufal
>>> http://nibrahim.net.in
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Inpycon mailing list
>>> Inpycon at python.org
>>> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>>>
>>
>>
>> Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?
>>
>
> There was a discussion in this mailing list when we decided the fee and
> the tiers. Where were you then?
>
Well do you want to start it all again?

>
>
>> Is it because sponsorship money not sufficient? Is there any blog/mail
>> provides description/info about the overall expenditure of the event?
>>
>> If money is real issue please get a new sponsorship model in place which
>> handles entry fee payments for speakers and volunteers specifically.
>>
>
> I don't see the point. No volunteer has complained that he has a problem
> with paying the fee. Some student volunteers have explicitly asked us and
> we've made couple of exceptions.
>
> Well why can`t you make it loud and clear so more of such gets along.

>  Again, the problem with the speakers was not about paying the money, but
> the lack of the communication about that. Some speakers were surprised at
> the last minute because they weren't aware that they have to pay the fee.
>
> I was one of them too.

> I think we should respect the opinions of the people who have managed the
> volunteers and handled the speakers than suggesting hypothetical issues
> without any base. It is not very good use of the time on this mailing list.
>
>
Well its all your prospective of seeing things. I can`t help it.

>  When most of the volunteers are students & some speakers as well. Some
>> of them are coming from other part of country & planning stay/food on their
>> own. Can we not do best by giving them entry to the event?
>>
>
> How do you know that most of the volunteers are students? I've worked very
> closely with volunteers this year and I haven't heard any complaints from
> them. There are even some volunteers who have just sit in the network room
> all the three days of the conference, making sure the network/registration
> desk working fine, and some of them were students. When they were very
> happy to pay the fee themselves, I don't see an point of discussing about
> it.
>
> Well am waiting for Kiran`s blog as he mentioned before mentioning
everything about the event from expenditure to participation.

 Comparing an Indian event with event in US  & following with same
>> footprint does not go well here.
>>
>> An event with focus on Indian crowd should be handled in Indian way.
>>
>
> Well, I've started this thread not with the intention of blindly following
> that model, but because that post has explained a model that *we have been*
> following since beginning and I strongly believe that it very good model to
> continue.
>
> It would have been a lot more productive if you had come in couple of
> months earlier and helped in shaping the event. Lot of these decisions have
> come out of the collective wisdom of running PyCon India over years and
> closely observing it grow. I'm sure you'll have a better understanding
> about the whole thing once you see it closely. Hope to see you at PyCon
> India 2014.
>
> Well waiting for it before 2014 event not going to help.
Today its me that time some else come with same. Why can`t we fix it now?






> Anand
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>


-- 
Atul

www.atuljha.com

irc(freenode) : koolhead17
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From me at bibhas.in  Thu Sep 26 16:19:27 2013
From: me at bibhas.in (Bibhas)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:49:27 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAHpZEPpzu9QazdkkPgzToCr=G35NSBz8NNc86MX499AWJLY_DA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>
 <524431EC.2090500@gmail.com>
 <CAHpZEPpzu9QazdkkPgzToCr=G35NSBz8NNc86MX499AWJLY_DA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6b7d6819-c07e-4b8f-9aef-332917b0566d@email.android.com>

Because we volunteers pay for the tickets, we're even more dedicated towards helping the event. Like I mentioned before, Revoking the ticket charge for volunteers would just welcome more freeloaders. We do receive the appreciation of the community. This year the twitter timeline was flooded thanking the volunteers. Paying or not paying doesn't matter in front of that. Please read Kiran Jonnalagadda's mail. 

Vivek Khurana <hiddenharmony at gmail.com> wrote:
>Charging Volunteers is not acceptable. Volunteers put in physical and
>mental effort to run the conference, so charging volunteers will
>discourage
>people from volunteering. If volunteers are being charged then either
>the
>money should be refunded at the end of the event or Volunteers should
>be
>paid for the effort they put in to run the event.
>
>regards
>Vivek
>
>
>On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 6:39 PM, Vivek Puri <vpuri.social at gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I do agree with what kiran said.
>>
>> One option as earlier suggested is to offer same price  as early bird
>to
>> speakers and
>> volunteers, seems middle of road but good. Everybody pays but
>speakers and
>> volunteer
>> do get special treatment.
>>
>> rgds
>> vivek
>>
>> ______________________________**_________________
>> Inpycon mailing list
>> Inpycon at python.org
>>
>https://mail.python.org/**mailman/listinfo/inpycon<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon>
>>
>
>
>
>-- 
>The hidden harmony is better than the obvious!!
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>Inpycon mailing list
>Inpycon at python.org
>https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon

-- 
Thanks 
Bibhas 
http://bibhas.in

Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
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From anandology at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 16:20:14 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:50:14 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAHpZEPpzu9QazdkkPgzToCr=G35NSBz8NNc86MX499AWJLY_DA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyFRfBGC-GCsY4uxqDN_0is5qEN+HnF4b04A4BJqyYce+w@mail.gmail.com>
 <524431EC.2090500@gmail.com>
 <CAHpZEPpzu9QazdkkPgzToCr=G35NSBz8NNc86MX499AWJLY_DA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFwzJJZBbUQQTi1nnDu4LnLavG=oii39ooeSq_BMrRRHzw@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 7:39 PM, Vivek Khurana <hiddenharmony at gmail.com>wrote:

> Charging Volunteers is not acceptable. Volunteers put in physical and
> mental effort to run the conference, so charging volunteers will discourage
> people from volunteering. If volunteers are being charged then either the
> money should be refunded at the end of the event or Volunteers should be
> paid for the effort they put in to run the event.
>

I disagree. Creating privileges for some people is not good for a community
event. Even the lead-organizer of the event is paying, so volunteers will
be happy to pay and I've seen it working.

I think most important thing for volunteers is to make sure they are not
too stressed out. Couple of things that we tried this time to improve that
are booking cabs when people stay back in the night, order food to make
sure people have something to eat when they are doing the hard work etc.

Anand
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From anandology at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 16:25:51 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:55:51 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <CAKe6YvPUtY=DtUUa-9LKCgRfNm-doeS9KbotRMS91KNbQNoukw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKe6YvNZtCMc5X3cHWtmC5EZR63auuDmFJ-Q8d+bD8EgUixWzA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFzDXYL+mHiYbqL+ythZEs09rKno75DF4fWDQ8K5-RPVcw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKe6YvPUtY=DtUUa-9LKCgRfNm-doeS9KbotRMS91KNbQNoukw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFxm_7w1whQbBScKtAXmU6vTzCHZLsuUGYN=Hz-x56jgLw@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Sep 7, 2013 at 12:13 AM, Vinayak Hegde <vinayakh at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 5:32 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>  Thanks Anand (and other volunteers). Can these be put up on pyvideos.
>>> You can submit a conference here - http://pyvideo.org/suggestions/videos
>>>
>>> A lot more people will have access to that and the complete list can be
>>> imported as RSS using that.
>>>
>>
>> That was my plan too. But I don't think I'll be able to able to work on
>> it now. Already spent 3 days on processing videos. Can someone please take
>> care of this?
>>
>
> I can help with this. Can someone notify me when all the videos have been
> uploaded and added to a playlist. I will add the submission to the pyvideos
> site.
>

Hi Vinayak,

All the videos have been uploaded.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6GW05BfqWIdsaaV35jcHWPWTI-DAw6Yn

Can you please take care of adding these to pyvideo.org?

Anand
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From vinayakh at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 16:37:56 2013
From: vinayakh at gmail.com (Vinayak Hegde)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 20:07:56 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] PyCon India 2013 - Videos
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFxm_7w1whQbBScKtAXmU6vTzCHZLsuUGYN=Hz-x56jgLw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFzayzP2RvTdkNRehk2FXJu+XrVctSUS3wNLPPGJtvz9Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKe6YvNZtCMc5X3cHWtmC5EZR63auuDmFJ-Q8d+bD8EgUixWzA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFzDXYL+mHiYbqL+ythZEs09rKno75DF4fWDQ8K5-RPVcw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKe6YvPUtY=DtUUa-9LKCgRfNm-doeS9KbotRMS91KNbQNoukw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFxm_7w1whQbBScKtAXmU6vTzCHZLsuUGYN=Hz-x56jgLw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKe6YvOUfXQomy4qXErPeUpyjuAod9ZzEt86-V55QYXDwUCsiQ@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Anand. I have submitted it to Pyvideos for consideration with all
the information required. I will follow through and post back to the list
when it is up.

Regards
Vinayak


On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 7:55 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Sat, Sep 7, 2013 at 12:13 AM, Vinayak Hegde <vinayakh at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Sep 6, 2013 at 5:32 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>  Thanks Anand (and other volunteers). Can these be put up on pyvideos.
>>>> You can submit a conference here -
>>>> http://pyvideo.org/suggestions/videos
>>>>
>>>> A lot more people will have access to that and the complete list can be
>>>> imported as RSS using that.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That was my plan too. But I don't think I'll be able to able to work on
>>> it now. Already spent 3 days on processing videos. Can someone please take
>>> care of this?
>>>
>>
>> I can help with this. Can someone notify me when all the videos have been
>> uploaded and added to a playlist. I will add the submission to the pyvideos
>> site.
>>
>
> Hi Vinayak,
>
> All the videos have been uploaded.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL6GW05BfqWIdsaaV35jcHWPWTI-DAw6Yn
>
> Can you please take care of adding these to pyvideo.org?
>
> Anand
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Thu Sep 26 17:57:43 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 21:27:43 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 (Anand Chitipothu's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:32:08 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>


This thread is going nowhere. 

I think it's best we postpone this decision till active work starts on
the next years event. We'll have to revisit this then and by that time,
finances and other expenses will be more concrete.





-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From vnbang2003 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 19:08:36 2013
From: vnbang2003 at gmail.com (vijay kumar)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 22:38:36 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAHX9ajSrHxbAFNd5nqHTtPhRBmf-Btv-jxrsceeNchML=k_NhA@mail.gmail.com>

> This thread is going nowhere.
>
> +1
>
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 20:06:23 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 23:36:23 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>

On 26 Sep 2013 22:02, "Noufal Ibrahim" <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>
>
> This thread is going nowhere.
>
> I think it's best we postpone this decision till active work starts on
> the next years event. We'll have to revisit this then and by that time,
> finances and other expenses will be more concrete.
>
So in the end the whole thread went nowhere.

Reason we are close bunch of folks deciding things in OUR way rest can bw
mute spectators.


>
>
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 20:10:47 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 23:40:47 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM0j8PjVoS01xK=rW9cLo584muVkrYC1GgsK-StXgkV=tw@mail.gmail.com>

Also waiting for blog/mail from Kiran about overall event expenditure to
understand if money is one reason for everyone pays. I would expect the
organisers to be open enough in this regard.

Looking forward to pyconindia 2014 announcement

Cheers..

On 26 Sep 2013 23:36, "atul jha" <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> On 26 Sep 2013 22:02, "Noufal Ibrahim" <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
> >
> >
> > This thread is going nowhere.
> >
> > I think it's best we postpone this decision till active work starts on
> > the next years event. We'll have to revisit this then and by that time,
> > finances and other expenses will be more concrete.
> >
> So in the end the whole thread went nowhere.
>
> Reason we are close bunch of folks deciding things in OUR way rest can bw
mute spectators.
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Cordially,
> > Noufal
> > http://nibrahim.net.in
> > _______________________________________________
> > Inpycon mailing list
> > Inpycon at python.org
> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
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From jace at pobox.com  Thu Sep 26 20:17:40 2013
From: jace at pobox.com (Kiran Jonnalagadda)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 23:47:40 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM0j8PjVoS01xK=rW9cLo584muVkrYC1GgsK-StXgkV=tw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM0j8PjVoS01xK=rW9cLo584muVkrYC1GgsK-StXgkV=tw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FAB38EF63EC442AFB10487E66C60C307@gmail.com>

On Thursday, 26 September 2013 at 11:40 PM, atul jha wrote:
> Also waiting for blog/mail from Kiran about overall event expenditure to understand if money is one reason for everyone pays. I would expect the organisers to be open enough in this regard.
> Looking forward to pyconindia 2014 announcement
> 
> 


Not sure why you are expecting that from me. I'm not part of the PyCon organising team apart from hanging out on this mailing list, nor am I aware of PSSI's accounts.

I have written about HasGeek's event pricing on the HasGeek blog, but HasGeek is not affiliated with PyCon apart from loaning equipment and training on video. FWIW, here's my post on the HasGeek blog: https://blog.hasgeek.com/2013/why-prices-go-up-closer-to-an-event

Kiran
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From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 20:20:59 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 23:50:59 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <FAB38EF63EC442AFB10487E66C60C307@gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANwwdM0j8PjVoS01xK=rW9cLo584muVkrYC1GgsK-StXgkV=tw@mail.gmail.com>
 <FAB38EF63EC442AFB10487E66C60C307@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2T-M+inxZ-zWa23Z=hBFgiubCC0Aagt=L44QW1qWfdXg@mail.gmail.com>

Jace,

On 26 Sep 2013 23:47, "Kiran Jonnalagadda" <jace at pobox.com> wrote:
>
> On Thursday, 26 September 2013 at 11:40 PM, atul jha wrote:
>>
>> Also waiting for blog/mail from Kiran about overall event expenditure to
understand if money is one reason for everyone pays. I would expect the
organisers to be open enough in this regard.
>>
>> Looking forward to pyconindia 2014 announcement
>
>
> Not sure why you are expecting that from me. I'm not part of the PyCon
organising team apart from hanging out on this mailing list, nor am I aware
of PSSI's accounts.

It was for other kiran. :)
>
> I have written about HasGeek's event pricing on the HasGeek blog, but
HasGeek is not affiliated with PyCon apart from loaning equipment and
training on video. FWIW, here's my post on the HasGeek blog:
https://blog.hasgeek.com/2013/why-prices-go-up-closer-to-an-event
>

We known about it.

Cheers,

> Kiran
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
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From email at miteshashar.com  Thu Sep 26 20:58:32 2013
From: email at miteshashar.com (Mitesh Ashar)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 00:28:32 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABWJmvy28TxeDMj5hXaHycJ+tW9EfuscuniXK3dGM11KAR3aQw@mail.gmail.com>

> So in the end the whole thread went nowhere.
>
> Reason we are close bunch of folks deciding things in OUR way rest can bw
mute spectators.

Ok. All people who've been responsible for running and having brought the
conference to what it is today, have answered meticulously your questions
and responded to your constant kiddish reactions multiple times.

To me it seems, you're hell bent on garnering a response you like to the
outright and abruptly asked question, which you very confidently asked with
an i-know-it-all attitude.

After multiple attempts of answering you(which imho were pretty intentful
and openly provided), if this is what you've got to say, I really feel it
is you who's being close minded.
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From modi.konark at gmail.com  Thu Sep 26 23:01:05 2013
From: modi.konark at gmail.com (konark modi)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 02:31:05 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CABWJmvy28TxeDMj5hXaHycJ+tW9EfuscuniXK3dGM11KAR3aQw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CABWJmvy28TxeDMj5hXaHycJ+tW9EfuscuniXK3dGM11KAR3aQw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPhs5j9Fy2WrvYPk6RwxuTT6Z4y6zd1JJ-zr_DWHGeKHmBhThg@mail.gmail.com>

+1 Thread going nowhere.


This PyCon was a tremendous experience for me, not only as a speaker but as
a volunteer too. My +1 for everyone pays.

Given the conference fee, and all the fuss about who pays and how. Instead
of doing postmortem and dissection of processes/policies which are easy
enough to convey/measure/follow we have some very basic areas and with
larger scope of improvement, as a community those should be at the prime
focus .


Regards
Konark Modi



On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 12:28 AM, Mitesh Ashar <email at miteshashar.com>wrote:

> > So in the end the whole thread went nowhere.
> >
> > Reason we are close bunch of folks deciding things in OUR way rest can
> bw mute spectators.
>
> Ok. All people who've been responsible for running and having brought the
> conference to what it is today, have answered meticulously your questions
> and responded to your constant kiddish reactions multiple times.
>
> To me it seems, you're hell bent on garnering a response you like to the
> outright and abruptly asked question, which you very confidently asked with
> an i-know-it-all attitude.
>
> After multiple attempts of answering you(which imho were pretty intentful
> and openly provided), if this is what you've got to say, I really feel it
> is you who's being close minded.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
>
>
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Fri Sep 27 06:07:21 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 09:37:21 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] First steps for 2014 (was:  Everybody Pays Policy)
In-Reply-To: <CAPhs5j9Fy2WrvYPk6RwxuTT6Z4y6zd1JJ-zr_DWHGeKHmBhThg@mail.gmail.com>
 (konark modi's message of "Fri, 27 Sep 2013 02:31:05 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CABWJmvy28TxeDMj5hXaHycJ+tW9EfuscuniXK3dGM11KAR3aQw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAPhs5j9Fy2WrvYPk6RwxuTT6Z4y6zd1JJ-zr_DWHGeKHmBhThg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87ob7ec3gm.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>


I think the first thing to do is to get the branding right. Before
December is a good time. Then all the materials (brochure, website, swag
etc.) can all look the same and it gives a unified look to the entire
thing.

I can't think of anyting else that should be done before this is
settled. It's the public face of the event.

-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Fri Sep 27 06:09:52 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 09:39:52 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Thu, 26 Sep 2013 23:36:23 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87fvsqc3cf.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:


[...]

> So in the end the whole thread went nowhere.
>
> Reason we are close bunch of folks deciding things in OUR way rest can
> bw mute spectators.

Yes. If that's what it takes to keep the peanut gallery quiet.

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Fri Sep 27 06:18:05 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 09:48:05 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87fvsqc3cf.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvsqc3cf.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM2MTOHDFJKwM-KTeMUm7gUt0T0qGC2nS32zQ9gMx3jJpQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 27 Sep 2013 09:41, "Noufal Ibrahim" <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>
> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
> > So in the end the whole thread went nowhere.
> >
> > Reason we are close bunch of folks deciding things in OUR way rest can
> > bw mute spectators.
>
> Yes. If that's what it takes to keep the peanut gallery quiet.

You won't give up will you? :)

>
> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Fri Sep 27 06:45:04 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 10:15:04 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM2MTOHDFJKwM-KTeMUm7gUt0T0qGC2nS32zQ9gMx3jJpQ@mail.gmail.com>
 (atul jha's message of "Fri, 27 Sep 2013 09:48:05 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvsqc3cf.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2MTOHDFJKwM-KTeMUm7gUt0T0qGC2nS32zQ9gMx3jJpQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87a9iyc1pr.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:


[...]


>> Yes. If that's what it takes to keep the peanut gallery quiet.
>
> You won't give up will you? :)

Nope. If I did, the conference would not have taken place at all.

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Fri Sep 27 06:59:09 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 10:29:09 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <87a9iyc1pr.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87a9iyc1pr.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM1z-sCgANs8ngozLrEAEQPffQBi19XjduhNeX6PC30xDQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 27 Sep 2013 10:16, "Noufal Ibrahim" <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>
> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> [...]
>
>
> >> Yes. If that's what it takes to keep the peanut gallery quiet.
> >
> > You won't give up will you? :)
>
> Nope. If I did, the conference would not have taken place at all.

Hmm.
Good to know but that you did something incredible all youself.

You will get community peanut masala from me when we meet. :)

Having said all this, my questions still remains unanswered.

Although am hopeful in coming months it will get answered. Am not giving up
so easily. :)





>
> [...]
>
>
> --
> Cordially,
> Noufal
> http://nibrahim.net.in
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From baiju.m.mail at gmail.com  Fri Sep 27 07:35:13 2013
From: baiju.m.mail at gmail.com (Baiju M)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 11:05:13 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM1z-sCgANs8ngozLrEAEQPffQBi19XjduhNeX6PC30xDQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87fvsqc3cf.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2MTOHDFJKwM-KTeMUm7gUt0T0qGC2nS32zQ9gMx3jJpQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9iyc1pr.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1z-sCgANs8ngozLrEAEQPffQBi19XjduhNeX6PC30xDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN8ZCby8gQTEMeizJJ-bfhb5+TSQBammEkOqr0aHdUHo6_vzBA@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 10:29 AM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On 27 Sep 2013 10:16, "Noufal Ibrahim" <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>>
>> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> >> Yes. If that's what it takes to keep the peanut gallery quiet.
>> >
>> > You won't give up will you? :)
>>
>> Nope. If I did, the conference would not have taken place at all.
>
> Hmm.
> Good to know but that you did something incredible all youself.

Noufal has received an international award from PSF for organizing the
first PyCON India:
http://pyfound.blogspot.in/2009/10/third-quarter-community-service-awards.html

--
Baiju M

From koolhead17 at gmail.com  Fri Sep 27 07:46:01 2013
From: koolhead17 at gmail.com (atul jha)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 11:16:01 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAN8ZCby8gQTEMeizJJ-bfhb5+TSQBammEkOqr0aHdUHo6_vzBA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87fvsqc3cf.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2MTOHDFJKwM-KTeMUm7gUt0T0qGC2nS32zQ9gMx3jJpQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9iyc1pr.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1z-sCgANs8ngozLrEAEQPffQBi19XjduhNeX6PC30xDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAN8ZCby8gQTEMeizJJ-bfhb5+TSQBammEkOqr0aHdUHo6_vzBA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANwwdM1u48RjZHCaUaA40SJEiEUmSKdh4ZoXEETqJ7+DJnuV0A@mail.gmail.com>

Baiju,

On 27 Sep 2013 11:05, "Baiju M" <baiju.m.mail at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 10:29 AM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > On 27 Sep 2013 10:16, "Noufal Ibrahim" <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
> >>
> >> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
> >>
> >> [...]
> >>
> >>
> >> >> Yes. If that's what it takes to keep the peanut gallery quiet.
> >> >
> >> > You won't give up will you? :)
> >>
> >> Nope. If I did, the conference would not have taken place at all.
> >
> > Hmm.
> > Good to know but that you did something incredible all youself.
>
> Noufal has received an international award from PSF for organizing the
> first PyCON India:
>
http://pyfound.blogspot.in/2009/10/third-quarter-community-service-awards.html

I know him for long time and all his contribution. Am not a new born kid
here who needs reference for  his credibility. :)

Looking forward to planning on pyconindia next year.

<EOF>

>
> --
> Baiju M
> _______________________________________________
> Inpycon mailing list
> Inpycon at python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon
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From me at bibhas.in  Fri Sep 27 08:23:41 2013
From: me at bibhas.in (Bibhas)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 11:53:41 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] First steps for 2014 (was:  Everybody Pays Policy)
In-Reply-To: <87ob7ec3gm.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CABWJmvy28TxeDMj5hXaHycJ+tW9EfuscuniXK3dGM11KAR3aQw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAPhs5j9Fy2WrvYPk6RwxuTT6Z4y6zd1JJ-zr_DWHGeKHmBhThg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ob7ec3gm.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <95c0ae56-2530-4366-9144-37ea59d2fbe9@email.android.com>

We had a discussion about opening CFP early this year. Anything about that? 

Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>
>I think the first thing to do is to get the branding right. Before
>December is a good time. Then all the materials (brochure, website,
>swag
>etc.) can all look the same and it gives a unified look to the entire
>thing.
>
>I can't think of anyting else that should be done before this is
>settled. It's the public face of the event.

-- 
Thanks 
Bibhas 
http://bibhas.in

Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Fri Sep 27 08:26:02 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 11:56:02 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] First steps for 2014
In-Reply-To: <95c0ae56-2530-4366-9144-37ea59d2fbe9@email.android.com>
 (Bibhas's message of "Fri, 27 Sep 2013 11:53:41 +0530")
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
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 <CABWJmvy28TxeDMj5hXaHycJ+tW9EfuscuniXK3dGM11KAR3aQw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAPhs5j9Fy2WrvYPk6RwxuTT6Z4y6zd1JJ-zr_DWHGeKHmBhThg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ob7ec3gm.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <95c0ae56-2530-4366-9144-37ea59d2fbe9@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <87wqm2aih1.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Bibhas <me at bibhas.in> writes:

> We had a discussion about opening CFP early this year. Anything about
> that?

Don't know. 5 or 6 months should be enough for that no? That's March or
April.

We'd need the website before that though.

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From me at bibhas.in  Fri Sep 27 08:21:27 2013
From: me at bibhas.in (Bibhas)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 11:51:27 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM1z-sCgANs8ngozLrEAEQPffQBi19XjduhNeX6PC30xDQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvsqc3cf.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2MTOHDFJKwM-KTeMUm7gUt0T0qGC2nS32zQ9gMx3jJpQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87a9iyc1pr.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM1z-sCgANs8ngozLrEAEQPffQBi19XjduhNeX6PC30xDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <dc1407e3-6dc6-45e8-b55d-1c1aca1baf20@email.android.com>



atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>On 27 Sep 2013 10:16, "Noufal Ibrahim" <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>>
>> atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> >> Yes. If that's what it takes to keep the peanut gallery quiet.
>> >
>> > You won't give up will you? :)
>>
>> Nope. If I did, the conference would not have taken place at all.
>
>Hmm.
>Good to know but that you did something incredible all youself.
>
>You will get community peanut masala from me when we meet. :)
>
>Having said all this, my questions still remains unanswered.

Sorry I lost the context again. What was your questions? Just for the future reference, can you please note all your questions at one place and post? 

Was it why everybody pays? I think the very first post of this thread by AnandC and Kiran J's reply to your original question, that you never replied to, answers it all. 

Or was it something else? 

>
>Although am hopeful in coming months it will get answered. Am not
>giving up
>so easily. :)
>
>
>
>
>
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cordially,
>> Noufal
>> http://nibrahim.net.in
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>Inpycon mailing list
>Inpycon at python.org
>https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/inpycon

-- 
Thanks 
Bibhas 
http://bibhas.in

Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

From me at bibhas.in  Fri Sep 27 11:31:25 2013
From: me at bibhas.in (Bibhas)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 15:01:25 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] First steps for 2014
In-Reply-To: <87wqm2aih1.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFyD2Hu5Nj6vnccXcbEkZcmk1Y86gEURnLFOS17kAd71VQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ioxnd18o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM2YF1kgUBbkRj3o4u6dNQ1BhYF9yWQ=L=_r7tBJAS4ywg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CABWJmvy28TxeDMj5hXaHycJ+tW9EfuscuniXK3dGM11KAR3aQw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAPhs5j9Fy2WrvYPk6RwxuTT6Z4y6zd1JJ-zr_DWHGeKHmBhThg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87ob7ec3gm.fsf_-_@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <95c0ae56-2530-4366-9144-37ea59d2fbe9@email.android.com>
 <87wqm2aih1.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
Message-ID: <e896ba98-0724-4f83-b359-e18c0c793d9f@email.android.com>

Also, I think we have a better idea about the event now to put some effort to the pycon india handbook. 
https://github.com/pythonindia/pyconindia-handbook

Noufal Ibrahim <noufal at nibrahim.net.in> wrote:
>Bibhas <me at bibhas.in> writes:
>
>> We had a discussion about opening CFP early this year. Anything about
>> that?
>
>Don't know. 5 or 6 months should be enough for that no? That's March or
>April.
>
>We'd need the website before that though.
>
>[...]

-- 
Thanks 
Bibhas 
http://bibhas.in

Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

From benignbala at gmail.com  Fri Sep 27 15:30:29 2013
From: benignbala at gmail.com (Balachandran Sivakumar)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 19:00:29 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMbkTgJ7xyr=gCYQSSqh9O3H9CX4Qh7K_7PoUSNg-VDS+X_xVA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 11:32 AM, atul jha <koolhead17 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Who & why was it decided to charge fees for volunteers and speakers?
>

          A "volunteer" is defined as "A person who freely offers to
take part in an enterprise or undertake a task." So, the point that
volunteer should not be charged or should be refunded is incorrect.

> When most of the volunteers are students & some speakers as well. Some of
> them are coming from other part of country & planning stay/food on their
> own. Can we not do best by giving them entry to the event?
>

         People come here and do all that stuff that you have said,
*only* because they love  python. From my interaction with some of the
speakers - They were delighted to give a talk and had no problems
about paying to attend the conference. The conference doesn't comprise
of "just" their talk. Expecting a free entry just because some one is
a speaker seems strange to me. Thanks


-- 
Thank you
Balachandran Sivakumar

Arise Awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
                                                             - Swami Vivekananda

Mail: benignbala at gmail.com
Blog: http://benignbala.wordpress.com/

From vivekcherian at gmail.com  Fri Sep 27 21:36:39 2013
From: vivekcherian at gmail.com (Vivek Varghese Cherian)
Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2013 01:06:39 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAMbkTgJ7xyr=gCYQSSqh9O3H9CX4Qh7K_7PoUSNg-VDS+X_xVA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAC7wXFx6mkfMjeZBEgZXLB62nzBv87rVJXrz-HMzWeqNMz4+hA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFhXvyG+VhPoD+NEV0eYzB9fAHS9xn5fem50G-w24XZ-mBQSTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <87li2ki4i5.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CAFhXvyFb5fezsa01q8ZmBk5xPkhnsEUYHAGTRco9t1=Dz_zQ2g@mail.gmail.com>
 <87fvssi14o.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>
 <CANwwdM06Hja8iogfrJu+7NCSpteLLyJiXhug2AxHeTHexcYH3A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAMbkTgJ7xyr=gCYQSSqh9O3H9CX4Qh7K_7PoUSNg-VDS+X_xVA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAOVWD3v7xRs-R4U7md9cfkT5cqsL4DgX3ZC62r=2et-v9fkL-Q@mail.gmail.com>

>          People come here and do all that stuff that you have said,
> *only* because they love  python. From my interaction with some of the
> speakers - They were delighted to give a talk and had no problems
> about paying to attend the conference. The conference doesn't comprise
> of "just" their talk. Expecting a free entry just because some one is
> a speaker seems strange to me. Thanks
>
>
Pseudo community conferences (which are done to promote individuals like
Atul Chitnis) like FOSS.in had that model of giving speakers privileges
like a
special speakers cabin where speakers could only enter and all that apart
from free passes for them.

I had volunteered for FOSS.in once in 2006 and I had Mr Shreyas Srinivasan
one
of Mr. Atul Chitin?s chelas come to me at the end of the conference and
tell me that
inspite of me being a volunteer they saw me wear a 'organisers badge'. I
pretty knavishly
pointed to my badge telling him that I was just a volunteer. Later did I
realise he was telling
me "Don't try in act smart in Atul Chtinis's team's personal conference"

In Pycon 2013, I saw Konark Modi for example run around for multiple event
organisation stuff
and also gave a talk and he managed to do both with ease. Just pointing out
a name as an example
not trying to promote anyone.

Konark can you enlighten Atul Jha if you did pay the conference fee in full
?

This was my first Pycon and I thoroughly enjoyed every bit of it and this
is undoubtedly
the best FOSS community conference I have attended thus far my career
spanning 11+ years.

Btw, I was a volunteer for Pycon 2013, and I did not find any
speaker/volunteer/delegate divide.
I even shelled out an additional Rs 1500/- to attend one of the OpenStack
workshops and even helped
the speakers from ileanstack conduct the workshop better as I was already
an OpenStack expert.
Nobody needed to prompt me as a volunteer to help the speakers, it just
came out instinctively as I
found out an area where I could add value to the conference by what skills
I already had.

So the point I am making is how to volunteer and to what extend you need to
volunteer is open to
a delegate. All delegates should have equal privileges be them
delegates/speakers/organisers/volunteers
and every one should be charged the same fee.

So congratulations to the organisers of Pycon 2013 for a work well done and
also to you Mr Atul Jha for organising
those wonderful OpenStack meetups all over India along with other
volunteers :) . Let's not turn this into an OpenStack
Meetup Model vs Pycon model war.

PS: I forgot to add earlier that I also did the speaker announcement for
Konark Modi also as Radha who was in charge of
the hall had to leave early that day, and thanks also to Anand Pillai for
dropping me back at my hotel after the last day of
the conference  :-)

Regards,
-- 
Vivek Varghese Cherian (????? ?????? ???????)
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From ideamonk at gmail.com  Sun Sep 29 22:01:03 2013
From: ideamonk at gmail.com (Abhishek Mishra)
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 01:31:03 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
Message-ID: <CAMhy9xXTQswWxE4UKwfgg_bNE8GAn5Sd5pMTK5LaaN66PiPhWA@mail.gmail.com>

On Kiran's compasions -

Agile India is run by a training company, not by a community, most probably
also not by any kind of external volunteers.

UX-India - The 10k quote is for the last moment walk-ins and limited to 10.
So that is a misquote, and a wrong comparison. While taking the same, the
student discount is mere 2.5k, 1/4th the highest.

UX-India, quite a number of speakers are from NY, California, and other
parts of USA. UMO is mostly supported by design schools around India, so
the high price of the tiickets may be to cover for those.

Again, not so much of a open community, quite more like design schools'
community.

JSConf asia, quite an amazing venue. But as you try to find traces of
community, in their about section at the very bottom, you will find two
individuals. Even the communication of feedbacks is not open to all. Many
speakers are from sponsoring orgs.


It's very hard, or maybe wrong to compare community driven, controlled,
event like PyCon India with such examplers and then decide if the prices
should go north or what policy should be followed.

Abhishek
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From foss.mailinglists at gmail.com  Mon Sep 30 06:51:57 2013
From: foss.mailinglists at gmail.com (sankarshan)
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 10:21:57 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Suggestions for the next PyCon
In-Reply-To: <20130908083053.GA28353@gmail.com>
References: <20130908083053.GA28353@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKQ+-3z30SDXzxP-BZh6MogGvxO3aAGM_wpigr9nt_dg_6DFyg@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Sep 8, 2013 at 2:00 PM, Nigel Babu <nigelbabu at gmail.com> wrote:
> PyCon was great and congratulations to the organizers and volunteers. I want
> to bring up a few things I thought we should think of doing before I forget.
>
> * Actually conference being on Friday and Saturday.
> This is probably a bit debatable. We'd have people needing to take a day off
> from work or college on Friday to attend. But the advantage is that people get
> a day off to recover instead of heading back to work or college directly on
> Monday.
>
> * Schedule printed on a sheet small enough to carry.
> We had a large pouch for the ID card. If the schedule was printed small enough
> to fit in there, that'd have been incredibly useful. I know this is challenging
> enough with last minute changes, but just a thought.
>
> * Schedule stuck outside the halls and in the common areas.
> I only noticed the schedule outside the main auditorium. It'd have been nice to
> have it displayed near the second one as well.
>
> * A separate page on the website with a very lightweight schedule.
> I'm thinking on the lines of a text file. Conference internet can be a little
> unspectacular. It'd be nice to be able to see the schedule even on slow
> internet.

In the middle of the discussions over the other thread I noticed that
these suggestions were not part of a discussion. Nigel, I'd like to
thank you for putting them out. I do not know how the organizers would
like to keep track of these, but they will make the conference
experience better.

With regards to the day of the conference, I noticed that another
conference (Droidcon) has been discussing the same [a tweet exchange
between Kiran and Aravind]


-- 
sankarshan mukhopadhyay
<https://twitter.com/#!/sankarshan>

From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Mon Sep 30 07:27:21 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 10:57:21 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Suggestions for the next PyCon
In-Reply-To: <CAKQ+-3z30SDXzxP-BZh6MogGvxO3aAGM_wpigr9nt_dg_6DFyg@mail.gmail.com>
 (sankarshan's message of "Mon, 30 Sep 2013 10:21:57 +0530")
References: <20130908083053.GA28353@gmail.com>
 <CAKQ+-3z30SDXzxP-BZh6MogGvxO3aAGM_wpigr9nt_dg_6DFyg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <878uye98w6.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

sankarshan <foss.mailinglists at gmail.com> writes:


[...]

> In the middle of the discussions over the other thread I noticed that
> these suggestions were not part of a discussion. Nigel, I'd like to
> thank you for putting them out. I do not know how the organizers would
> like to keep track of these, but they will make the conference
> experience better.
>
> With regards to the day of the conference, I noticed that another
> conference (Droidcon) has been discussing the same [a tweet exchange
> between Kiran and Aravind]

We had a volunteers supper yesterday in B'lore. Vijay got some
additional feedback from some of the attendees and is keeping track of
it.

Vijay,
        Can you add these points (and the ones from Dhananjay's google
plus post[1]) to your notes? We should review them from time to time to
make sure that we don't miss out on anything. 

Let's make next years event even better. 


Footnotes: 
[1]  https://plus.google.com/112820434312193778084/posts/AsiHcAcPVZK

-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From anandology at gmail.com  Mon Sep 30 07:22:21 2013
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 10:52:21 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Suggestions for the next PyCon
In-Reply-To: <20130908083053.GA28353@gmail.com>
References: <20130908083053.GA28353@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC7wXFxtPgx5UhwpH-DXVAp_gqt3FOJRUEcvVJ8WcJdEn=Ez=Q@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Sep 8, 2013 at 2:00 PM, Nigel Babu <nigelbabu at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> PyCon was great and congratulations to the organizers and volunteers. I
> want
> to bring up a few things I thought we should think of doing before I
> forget.
>
> * Actually conference being on Friday and Saturday.
> This is probably a bit debatable. We'd have people needing to take a day
> off
> from work or college on Friday to attend. But the advantage is that people
> get
> a day off to recover instead of heading back to work or college directly on
> Monday.
>

We had workshops on Friday this year. If we move the main conference to
Friday/Saturday, then the workshops have to move Thursday, which means 2
days of leave for people attending the workshops.

I personally prefer having a day to recover, not sure if everyone will like
it.


> * Schedule printed on a sheet small enough to carry.
> We had a large pouch for the ID card. If the schedule was printed small
> enough
> to fit in there, that'd have been incredibly useful. I know this is
> challenging
> enough with last minute changes, but just a thought.
>

That came up even this year, but we didn't have time to work on it.
Possible option for next year.


> * Schedule stuck outside the halls and in the common areas.
> I only noticed the schedule outside the main auditorium. It'd have been
> nice to
> have it displayed near the second one as well.
>

We realized that too. We expected the designer to make 2 different
schedules one for each room, but he made one big one and we didn't have
enough time to iterate over it.

* A separate page on the website with a very lightweight schedule.
> I'm thinking on the lines of a text file. Conference internet can be a
> little
> unspectacular. It'd be nice to be able to see the schedule even on slow
> internet.
>

Good idea.

/schedule - html schedule
/schedule.txt - plaintext schedule

Anand
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From noufal at nibrahim.net.in  Mon Sep 30 07:32:37 2013
From: noufal at nibrahim.net.in (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 11:02:37 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Suggestions for the next PyCon
In-Reply-To: <CAC7wXFxtPgx5UhwpH-DXVAp_gqt3FOJRUEcvVJ8WcJdEn=Ez=Q@mail.gmail.com>
 (Anand Chitipothu's message of "Mon, 30 Sep 2013 10:52:21 +0530")
References: <20130908083053.GA28353@gmail.com>
 <CAC7wXFxtPgx5UhwpH-DXVAp_gqt3FOJRUEcvVJ8WcJdEn=Ez=Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8738om98ne.fsf@sanitarium.localdomain>

Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com> writes:


[...]

>> * Schedule printed on a sheet small enough to carry.  We had a large
>> pouch for the ID card. If the schedule was printed small enough to
>> fit in there, that'd have been incredibly useful. I know this is
>> challenging enough with last minute changes, but just a thought.
>>
>
> That came up even this year, but we didn't have time to work on it.
> Possible option for next year.

I like the idea of custom badges printed along with temporary visiting
cards and maybe a schedule per participant. It'll be expensive with
printer ink and what not but might be worth considering. 

[...]


-- 
Cordially,
Noufal
http://nibrahim.net.in

From jace at pobox.com  Mon Sep 30 09:15:14 2013
From: jace at pobox.com (Kiran Jonnalagadda)
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 12:45:14 +0530
Subject: [Inpycon] Everybody Pays Policy
In-Reply-To: <CAMhy9xXTQswWxE4UKwfgg_bNE8GAn5Sd5pMTK5LaaN66PiPhWA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAMhy9xXTQswWxE4UKwfgg_bNE8GAn5Sd5pMTK5LaaN66PiPhWA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFhXvyGEXzJqq+iOcOG7db1UvXChHc4CBN3vtBxsz7rqP8+DbA@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Sep 30, 2013 at 1:31 AM, Abhishek Mishra <ideamonk at gmail.com> wrote:

> It's very hard, or maybe wrong to compare community driven, controlled,
> event like PyCon India with such examplers and then decide if the prices
> should go north or what policy should be followed.
>


Abhishek, you may have missed the context -- it's not about whether these
conferences are worth the money (which I believe they are). It's about
whether a discount is justified given PyCon India's already low prices.

Kiran


-- 
Kiran Jonnalagadda
http://jace.zaiki.in
http://hasgeek.com
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