[Edu-sig] False alarms?

[Sergio Rojas]

>  here's a blog post raising the alarm
> that Python (among others) is "completely incompatible with mathematics".
>
>
> https://blogs.ams.org/matheducation/2017/01/09/integrating-computer-science-in-math-the-potential-is-great-but-so-are-the-risks/
 
 

I get lost reading the referred blog post. I was
under the impression that the ideas presented in the
post were already fully discussed back in the 90's,
when Mathematica was getting its way into the
classroom at US schools. That things like "x = x + x"
were already familiar to teachers.

In fact, I was thinking of an open source alternative to Mathematica
when writing the book on Prealgebra via Python Programming
(https://www.researchgate.net/publication/325473565), with the
advantage that Python can be used for intensive computing task as
well as for symbolic (algebraic) computations (like mathematica)
via SymPy.

I was under the idea that the Mathematica team has already shaped and 
polished the road. I can see that I was wrong. It is still very, very 
rough (much more than the first draft of my book).

Sergio



>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2018 10:57:05 -0700
> From: kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
> To: "edu-sig at python.org" <edu-sig at python.org>
> Subject: [Edu-sig] false alarms?
> Message-ID:
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> CAPJgG3T3MFbL5AABOhzGm9P5fA49H72+vh+FrokO5Z3mqCpjpA at mail.gmail.com>
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>
> Apropos of earlier discussions that
> ?assignment in ?
> Python is about giving names to objects,
> ?and ?
> not putting those objects in boxes, here's a blog post raising the alarm
> that Python (among others) is "completely incompatible with mathematics".
>
>
> https://blogs.ams.org/matheducation/2017/01/09/integrating-computer-science-in-math-the-potential-is-great-but-so-are-the-risks/
>
> Excerpt:
>
> ===
>
> Making matters worse, programming languages like Java, JavaScript, Python,
> Scratch and Alice all rely on the concept of assignment. Assignment means
> that a value is ?stored in a box?, and that the value in that box can be
> changed. Here?s a simple JavaScript program that demonstrates this:
>
> x = 10
>
> x = x + 2
>
> The first line of code assigns the value 10 into a box named ?x?. The
> second line reads the value back out, adds 2, and assigns the new value
> back into x. When the program finishes, x contains the value 12.
> Unfortunately, the semantics and syntax are completely incompatible with
> mathematics! In math, names are given to values, not boxes.
>
> ===
>
> Following Kenneth Iverson, I think pre-computer math notations (MN) could
> benefit a lot from an infusion of ideas from these newer executable
> languages.
>
> He turns around the criticism of x = x + 2 by pointing out the ambiguity on
> in conventional math notation (MN):
>
> ===
> MN uses the symbol = for a relation, but also uses it for assignment, as in
> the expression (Let) x=3. Again, to denote these two distinct notions
> without ambiguity, programming languages use distinct notation (that
> usually includes the symbol =), as in := (in ALGOL), and =: (in J).
> ===
>
> http://www.jsoftware.com/papers/camn.htm[http://www.jsoftware.com/papers/camn.htm]
>
> Drawing a line in the sand and saying "on this side is programming" whereas
> "on this other side is math notation", seems more a bureaucratic maneuver
> than anything.
>
> There's a protection racket going on where self-appointed authorities are
> planning to warn us against "doing it wrong" i.e. not their way. Many
> bogus certifications will follow. Not that we shouldn't have standards.
> The question is who's.
>
> math = math + cs
>
> Kirby
> ?
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