[Edu-sig] Editors/IDEs for teaching

Tue Jul 3 13:10:11 EDT 2018

Hi,

We recently had to pick a beginner-friendly python editor for our Invent to
Learn summer program. We also teach a lot of Raspberry Pi based Intro to
Python workshops for kids and adults alike. In addition to editor/IDE,
there’s another category to consider - specialized education platform - For
instance, EarSketch <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EarSketch> is a
programming environment made specifically to teach coding through sound
mixing.

Over the years we tried Trinket.io, PyCharm Edu, Visual Studio Code, Mu,
iPythonNotebooks, Earsketch, Processing in Python mode, Thonny, IDLE + some
I don’t remember.

For us, it’s about prioritizing specific goals for our students and our
program. For the summer program we are working with FabLab Houston to equip
students with both maker skills and programming skills. They will learn
Python with the Raspberry Pi with first the Minecraft Pi api, then sensor
stuffs with Circuit Python on Adafruit’s Circuit Playground Learning
Express, then Processing in Python mode to visualize some data with
neopixels. For Fab Lab our goal is also to 1. train FabLab staff members
with enough programming skills so they can deliver the Invent to Learn
program without us, 2. produce open source curriculum from this program for
other makerspaces.

Ultimately, I think it should be up to the specific teacher to pick out
features - as programmers we tend to look at specs and numbers, but we must
also prioritize setting up educators for success - they are the frontline
workers delivering the service. For instance, trinket.io is our go-to
because a lot of educator’s don’t have admin access to their computers, so
web-based editor that is easy to use and specifically made for education is
great. However we do recognize the value in exposing our students to tools
that developers use - like PyCharm.
This is our pro and cons list off of the top of my head for choosing an
editor for different partners and educators that we work with:

- *Platform* - can we do things in command line on the computer that is
available to us, whether that’s a raspberry pi, mac, or pc? Trinket.io is a
great web-based solution if that’s an issue.

- Existing *resources and community* - are there educator resources? Is
this random IDE made by one person as a marketing exercise? if open source,
when is the projects' last pull request? The Thonny Editor is awesome
because there are a lot of high quality curriculum from
https://projects.raspberrypi.org/ Same goes for Trinket.io.

- Learning Curve for *educator *- If a teacher is teaching this and not a
developer, are they able to successfully use this tool? Do we expect them
to learn to use the terminal? Again, Trinket.io is a great starting point.

- Learning Curve for *student *- Does the IDE/Editor have too many options?
Not enough? What is the cognitive load for the student.

*- Utility for student* - Do we want to provide a real world developer
experience for our students? Or is our goal to have them build something as
to inspire. Is this a long term program or a short term project? Do we want
learners to quickly go through turtles (trinket.io) or be exposed to
developer tools (pycharm)?

After much consideration, we chose Thonny and also Python mode in the
Processing IDE for our three week program.

Hope this helps.

Best,

Wanjun Zhang

codeparkhouston.org

On July 3, 2018 at 10:06:00 AM, edu-sig-request at python.org (
edu-sig-request at python.org) wrote:

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Today's Topics:

1. Re: turtle coordinates: Y increase downards - as in most
graphics API? (kirby urner)
2. Editors/IDEs for teaching (Andre Roberge)
3. Re: Editors/IDEs for teaching (Nicholas H.Tollervey)
4. Re: Editors/IDEs for teaching (Andre Roberge)

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Message: 1
Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2018 09:32:44 -0700
From: kirby urner <kirby.urner at gmail.com>
To: "edu-sig at python.org" <edu-sig at python.org>
Subject: Re: [Edu-sig] turtle coordinates: Y increase downards - as in
most graphics API?
Message-ID:
<CAPJgG3QfGJ4rf3BHP1AmZf+DMCo=oLwjcPPbnnUvSAEw5KaHVA at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Thanks for your persistence on this Andre. I agree with you that this is a
serious bug.

Curriculum writers down the road will steer clear of Python's turtle if
it's not up to responding sanely to left and right.

Our loyalty should be to teachers and teaching material developers in the
future, not as much to prior editions with unfortunate workarounds.

Kirby

On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 6:29 PM, Andre Roberge <andre.roberge at gmail.com>
wrote:

>
>
> On Mon, Jun 18, 2018 at 1:50 PM Jurgis Pralgauskis <
> jurgis.pralgauskis at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Ok, I could test it :)
>>
>>
>> Should I wait for some commit and comment results on the issues site or
>> how...?
>>
>
> ?Jurgis: Could you just apply the patch I submitted locally and test it?
>
> Or would anyone else volunteer to test it? Obviously, I can provide an
> independent test of my own contribution. :-)?
>
>
>
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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2018 11:27:05 -0300
From: Andre Roberge <andre.roberge at gmail.com>
To: "edu-sig at python.org" <edu-sig at python.org>
Subject: [Edu-sig] Editors/IDEs for teaching
Message-ID:
<CAGMu_=r25RQtagg8-MyqX4pc3Uhnihc27NemzeGbLim2QtYOCw at mail.gmail.com>
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Hi everyone,

I'm compiling a list of available editors for Python designed specifically
for teaching, with information about the primary targeted audiences and
would welcome your comments and/or suggestions for additions or
corrections. So far, I have

Target audience (my own draft definition; feel free to improve upon this):

* young learners (elementary and high school students)

* hobbyists - beginners of all ages learning on their own

* CS 100 course: elective course targeted at non CS (or even non STEM)
students. The focus is more on concepts, using Python as the practical tool
to learn these concepts, rather than learning the Pythonic idioms or
learning the effectiveness of various algorithms. For example, list
comprehensions would likely not be covered in such a course as it does not
add anything conceptually to an explicit for loop.

* CS 101 course: core course in CS meant as a requirement for future
courses. Some pythonic idioms and details about algorithms would likely be
covered.

Editors / IDEs :

* IDLE: included with Python. Intended for everyone.
* Mu (https://codewith.mu/). Primarily intended for young learners and
hobbyists.
* Thonny. (http://thonny.org/) I am guessing that it is primarily intended
for CS 101.
* Wing 101 (https://wingware.com/downloads/wingide-101) Primarily intended
for CS 101.
* PyCharm Edu (https://www.jetbrains.com/pycharm-edu/) Primarily intended
for CS 101.

I am not looking for web-based solutions [otherwise, I would have had
included Reeborg's World ;-)] and do not want to include obsolete or no
longer maintained software (like rur-ple, the precursor to Reeborg's
World.)

Best,

Andr?
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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2018 15:48:52 +0100
From: "Nicholas H.Tollervey" <ntoll at ntoll.org>
To: edu-sig at python.org
Subject: Re: [Edu-sig] Editors/IDEs for teaching
Message-ID: <1180cbb5-e461-84a6-f634-c0c5e288914e at ntoll.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed

On 03/07/18 15:27, Andre Roberge wrote:
> * Mu (https://codewith.mu/). Primarily intended for young learners and
> hobbyists.

Nope.

I'm the author of Mu. It's for beginner programmers of all levels (as it
says so on the website). Beginner programmer is a "stage" not an age. ;-)

The design reflects feedback given to the Raspberry Pi Foundation's
education team, extensive UX and feedback from both beginner programmers
and teachers.

Thanks,

N.

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2018 12:04:29 -0300
From: Andre Roberge <andre.roberge at gmail.com>
To: ntoll at ntoll.org
Cc: "edu-sig at python.org" <edu-sig at python.org>
Subject: Re: [Edu-sig] Editors/IDEs for teaching
Message-ID:
<CAGMu_=oFOi8hZkWjtzjJVAePRrzy9Hm38tHcA0iQGWbDG4XOLQ at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

On Tue, Jul 3, 2018 at 11:52 AM Nicholas H.Tollervey <ntoll at ntoll.org>
wrote:

> On 03/07/18 15:27, Andre Roberge wrote:
> > * Mu (https://codewith.mu/). Primarily intended for young learners and
> > hobbyists.
>
> Nope.
>
> ?Thanks!?

> I'm the author of Mu. It's for beginner programmers of all levels (as it
> says so on the website). Beginner programmer is a "stage" not an age. ;-)
>

?I do agree with what you write ... but, at the same time, I've been
struggling to define appropriate categories. Some software can be designed
for use by (young) adult beginners but not for young children. (For
example: anything that will rely heavily on word menus ... say, like
Microsoft Word.) I'm using the term hobbyists for this category. Other
software can be designed to be used by young children. I did not see Mu
being designed to be used in a CS 101 type of course. Perhaps I am wrong
and should simply think of the target audience as "everyone" like I did for
IDLE.... ?

Andr?

>
> The design reflects feedback given to the Raspberry Pi Foundation's
> education team, extensive UX and feedback from both beginner programmers
> and teachers.
>
> ?

> Thanks,
>
> N.
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