From sibteym at infotechsw.com  Wed Jan  7 10:40:11 2009
From: sibteym at infotechsw.com (Sibtey Mehdi)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 15:10:11 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Multiprocessing takes higher execution time
Message-ID: <001f01c970ab$ef7ee880$5fc513ac@pwit.com>

Hi,

 

I use multiprocessing to compare more then one set of files.

For comparison each set of files (i.e. Old file1 Vs New file1) I create a
process,

Process(target=compare, args=(oldFile, newFile)).start()

It takes 61 seconds execution time.

 

When I do the same comparison without implementing multiprocessing, it takes
52 seconds execution time.

 

The parallel processing time should be lesser. 

 

I am not able to get advantage of multiprocessing here.

 

Any suggestions can be very helpful.

 

Thanks,

Gopal

 

 

 

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From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Wed Jan  7 10:52:24 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 15:22:24 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Multiprocessing takes higher execution time
In-Reply-To: <001f01c970ab$ef7ee880$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
References: <001f01c970ab$ef7ee880$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901070152x2e8fb8f7sb39286af1901317@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 3:10 PM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
>
> I use multiprocessing to compare more then one set of files.
>
> For comparison each set of files (i.e. Old file1 Vs New file1) I create a
> process,
>
> Process(target=compare, args=(oldFile, newFile)).start()
>
> It takes 61 seconds execution time.
>
>
>
> When I do the same comparison without implementing multiprocessing, it takes
> 52 seconds execution time.
>
>
>
> The parallel processing time should be lesser.
>
>
>
> I am not able to get advantage of multiprocessing here.

Depends on the overheads of spawning multiple threads/processes v$
your actual processing. The same way, things are compared in old
school when they used to compare macros v$ functions in C/C++.

-Amit


>
>
>
> Any suggestions can be very helpful.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gopal
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
Skype: amitkumarsaha

From jeff at taupro.com  Wed Jan  7 11:02:00 2009
From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush)
Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2009 04:02:00 -0600
Subject: [BangPypers] Multiprocessing takes higher execution time
In-Reply-To: <547db2260901070152x2e8fb8f7sb39286af1901317@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001f01c970ab$ef7ee880$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
	<547db2260901070152x2e8fb8f7sb39286af1901317@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49647D98.6030303@taupro.com>

Amit k. Saha wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 3:10 PM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com> wrote:
>>
>> I use multiprocessing to compare more then one set of files.
>>
>> The parallel processing time should be lesser.
>>
>> I am not able to get advantage of multiprocessing here.
> 
> Depends on the overheads of spawning multiple threads/processes v$
> your actual processing. The same way, things are compared in old
> school when they used to compare macros v$ functions in C/C++.

Simple file comparison is limited more by disk I/O than CPU.  So by trying to
read more than one file at a time, you are causing the disk to seek back and
forth, losing time.

Try it again but this time place the files to be compared in a RAM disk, and
run both the multiprocess and single-process versions of your program.  I'll
best you see a difference then.  Or spread them across multiple physical (not
logical) disk drives.

-Jeff


From abpillai at gmail.com  Wed Jan  7 11:02:18 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 15:32:18 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Multiprocessing takes higher execution time
In-Reply-To: <547db2260901070152x2e8fb8f7sb39286af1901317@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001f01c970ab$ef7ee880$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
	<547db2260901070152x2e8fb8f7sb39286af1901317@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901070202q4c49de46t20541abd568e02cf@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 3:22 PM, Amit k. Saha <amitsaha.in at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 3:10 PM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> I use multiprocessing to compare more then one set of files.
>>
>> For comparison each set of files (i.e. Old file1 Vs New file1) I create a
>> process,
>>
>> Process(target=compare, args=(oldFile, newFile)).start()
>>
>> It takes 61 seconds execution time.
>>
>>
>>
>> When I do the same comparison without implementing multiprocessing, it takes
>> 52 seconds execution time.
>>
>>
>>
>> The parallel processing time should be lesser.
>>
>>
>>
>> I am not able to get advantage of multiprocessing here.

No surprise here. A process is a heavyweight entity. The design
of spawning a process per file comparison won't scale and as
the number of comparisons increase, will asymptotically
perform worse than doing all in a single process/thread.

The flaw is in the design. A parallel programming task as above
is about distributing m jobs onto n resources. There are two
trivial cases for it -> where n is 1 (m jobs in 1 resource, i.e a single
process/thread) and where m is 1 (i.e 1 job per resource - spawing
a resource for every job as you are doing).

These two trivial cases are two extremes and will always
yield poorer results when compared to choosing the right value
of m and n. In this case you should group your comparison tasks
and execute say for example 10 comparisons per thread/process.
Design a thread/process pool to scale your solution.

This is simply Concurrent/Parallel Programming 101...

>
> Depends on the overheads of spawning multiple threads/processes v$
> your actual processing. The same way, things are compared in old
> school when they used to compare macros v$ functions in C/C++.
>
> -Amit
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>> Any suggestions can be very helpful.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Gopal
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Amit Kumar Saha
> http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
> http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
> Skype: amitkumarsaha
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
-Anand

From ravi.uma at gmail.com  Thu Jan  8 02:14:24 2009
From: ravi.uma at gmail.com (Ravi Shankar-Uma Iyer)
Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 20:14:24 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] Commercial: Need help to support prototype web app dev
	with TG 2.0
Message-ID: <efccafae0901071714q191814f2xfed25a414ece90a3@mail.gmail.com>

Hi:
      I am looking for experienced and professional independent
consultants/small firms to support my internal software dev. team by
guiding, designing  and maybe even fully developing the first prototype of a
web app that aids product selection and configuration (we make pumps and
industrial valves). After much debate, our internal team has selected
TurboGears 2.0b1 over Rails for all such future development. We use only
FOSS technologies internally, so Flash devs. need not even try.

  We need to start work by end of next week and complete the prototyping by
end Mar 2009. I am looking for highly experienced individuals/firms with
good communication skills and a good track record. If you are interested and
available, please send me a brief summary of your capabilities along with
URLs to publicly available samples of your work if any. I also need
indicative rates on a daily/hourly basis. We are located at #2, First Floor,
Platinum City, Yeshwantpura, Bangalore 560003.

My email id: ravi.shankar
Email domain: weirminerals.com

     I apologize in advance if this email does not meet the posting
guidelines of Bangpypers in any way.


Regards
Ravi Shankar
Head - Shared Engineering Services
Weir Minerals India Ltd.
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From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Thu Jan  8 06:13:43 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2009 10:43:43 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Executing WxPython script in Windows without the
	command window
Message-ID: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>

Hi,

I had created a small GUI app in WxPython and got it made into a Windows 
executable using py2exe. But, when I execute the .exe by double clicking 
on it, it opens the command window (or the DOS window) along with the 
GUI. I actually do not want the command window to get displayed when the 
app is executed. Any way I can get this done?

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Thu Jan  8 06:20:54 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 10:50:54 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Executing WxPython script in Windows without the
	command window
In-Reply-To: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>
References: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901072120m7aee5c7xcb0e42dda5cdb68@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Parthan SR <parth.technofreak at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I had created a small GUI app in WxPython and got it made into a Windows
> executable using py2exe. But, when I execute the .exe by double clicking on
> it, it opens the command window (or the DOS window) along with the GUI. I
> actually do not want the command window to get displayed when the app is
> executed. Any way I can get this done?

I am just guessing. You may try this: rename your file from 'foo.py'
to 'foo.pyg'

-Amit

>
> --
> ---
> With Regards,
>
> Parthan "technofreak"
> <gpg>  2FF01026
> <blog> http://blog.technofreak.in
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
Skype: amitkumarsaha

From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Thu Jan  8 06:21:16 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 10:51:16 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Executing WxPython script in Windows without the
	command window
In-Reply-To: <547db2260901072120m7aee5c7xcb0e42dda5cdb68@mail.gmail.com>
References: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072120m7aee5c7xcb0e42dda5cdb68@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901072121g7cb3a025l20505385f5c07e1f@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 10:50 AM, Amit k. Saha <amitsaha.in at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Parthan SR <parth.technofreak at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I had created a small GUI app in WxPython and got it made into a Windows
>> executable using py2exe. But, when I execute the .exe by double clicking on
>> it, it opens the command window (or the DOS window) along with the GUI. I
>> actually do not want the command window to get displayed when the app is
>> executed. Any way I can get this done?
>
> I am just guessing. You may try this: rename your file from 'foo.py'
> to 'foo.pyg'

Sorry, that would be 'foo.pyw'

-Amit

>
> -Amit
>
>>
>> --
>> ---
>> With Regards,
>>
>> Parthan "technofreak"
>> <gpg>  2FF01026
>> <blog> http://blog.technofreak.in
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Amit Kumar Saha
> http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
> http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
> Skype: amitkumarsaha
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
Skype: amitkumarsaha

From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Thu Jan  8 06:45:41 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 11:15:41 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Executing WxPython script in Windows without the
	command window
In-Reply-To: <496592B3.1080507@gmail.com>
References: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072120m7aee5c7xcb0e42dda5cdb68@mail.gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072121g7cb3a025l20505385f5c07e1f@mail.gmail.com>
	<496592B3.1080507@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901072145s273ea662u51e0e4dc2b1dccbe@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 11:14 AM, Parthan SR <parth.technofreak at gmail.com> wrote:
> Amit k. Saha wrote:
>>>
>>> I am just guessing. You may try this: rename your file from 'foo.py'
>>> to 'foo.pyg'
>>>
>>
>> Sorry, that would be 'foo.pyw'
>>
>
> That worked, thanks :)

Cool. 'pyw' extension helps Windoze to use the 'pythonw.exe' instead
of 'python.exe' which suppresses the command window.

-Amit

>
> --
> ---
> With Regards,
>
> Parthan "technofreak"
> <gpg>  2FF01026
> <blog> http://blog.technofreak.in
>
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
Skype: amitkumarsaha

From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Fri Jan  9 14:03:25 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 18:33:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Fwd: Executing WxPython script in Windows without the
	command window
In-Reply-To: <4966EFB1.6050805@gmail.com>
References: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072120m7aee5c7xcb0e42dda5cdb68@mail.gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072121g7cb3a025l20505385f5c07e1f@mail.gmail.com>
	<496592B3.1080507@gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072145s273ea662u51e0e4dc2b1dccbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<4966EFB1.6050805@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901090503sa8e9455sbcc52d8f3a4daf8d@mail.gmail.com>

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Parthan SR <parth.technofreak at gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 12:03 PM
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Executing WxPython script in Windows without
the command window
To: "Amit k. Saha" <amitsaha.in at gmail.com>


Amit k. Saha wrote:
>
> Cool. 'pyw' extension helps Windoze to use the 'pythonw.exe' instead
> of 'python.exe' which suppresses the command window

Just to add to this point - when creating an exe for the above using
py2exe, in your setup.py script please use something like

windows = [
{
"script": "script.pyw"
}
],

If, in the above piece of code, you use "console" instead of
"windows", then even when you have pointed .pyw file you will still
happen to see a console window when you execute the exe.

--
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in




-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
Skype: amitkumarsaha

From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Fri Jan  9 14:20:07 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 18:50:07 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Executing WxPython script in Windows without the
 command window
In-Reply-To: <547db2260901072145s273ea662u51e0e4dc2b1dccbe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>	
	<547db2260901072120m7aee5c7xcb0e42dda5cdb68@mail.gmail.com>	
	<547db2260901072121g7cb3a025l20505385f5c07e1f@mail.gmail.com>	
	<496592B3.1080507@gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072145s273ea662u51e0e4dc2b1dccbe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49674F07.5030400@gmail.com>

Oops, I thought when I press the Reply button in replies back to the 
list rather than the person whose mail am replying to.
Can't we consider implementing Reply-To Munging in this mailing list?

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From sreebel at rediffmail.com  Fri Jan  9 14:49:28 2009
From: sreebel at rediffmail.com (sree vatsa)
Date: 9 Jan 2009 13:49:28 -0000
Subject: [BangPypers] python
Message-ID: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>

Hi Bangpypers,
      ?I have 2 years of experience in python . I am searching for the job. Plz can u provide the list of companies which work on PYTHON. Thanks in advance.


Thanks & Regards,

Sreevatsa.B.D
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From orsenthil at gmail.com  Fri Jan  9 15:23:36 2009
From: orsenthil at gmail.com (Senthil Kumaran)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 19:53:36 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c42eba10901090623sc06dcbfva38c3bb1499dd1d2@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Sree Vatsa,

Search the archives of this group. You will find post by a member who
listed the companies.

Good luck with your search (both in the group archives and with companies).

And I personally feel that is a bad practise to advertise yourself as
Job seeker in Group emails. Job sites are for that purpose.

And you can of course pursue the openings that are posted in the group.


-- 
Senthil


On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 7:19 PM, sree vatsa <sreebel at rediffmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Bangpypers,
>        I have 2 years of experience in python . I am searching for the job.
> Plz can u provide the list of companies which work on PYTHON. Thanks in
> advance.
>
> Thanks & Regards,
>
> Sreevatsa.B.D
>
>



-- 
-- 
Senthil

From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Fri Jan  9 18:26:29 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 22:56:29 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Executing WxPython script in Windows without the
	command window
In-Reply-To: <49674F07.5030400@gmail.com>
References: <49658B87.9050203@gmail.com>
	<547db2260901072145s273ea662u51e0e4dc2b1dccbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<49674F07.5030400@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901092256.29919.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Friday 09 Jan 2009 6:50:07 pm Parthan SR wrote:
> Oops, I thought when I press the Reply button in replies back to the
> list rather than the person whose mail am replying to.
> Can't we consider implementing Reply-To Munging in this mailing list?

+1

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Fri Jan  9 18:21:45 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 22:51:45 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Friday 09 Jan 2009 7:19:28 pm sree vatsa wrote:
>  Plz can u

if this is an example of how you write english, you have very poor chance of 
getting a job.

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From gnuyoga at gmail.com  Fri Jan  9 20:20:43 2009
From: gnuyoga at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?KOCktuCljeCksOClgCkgU3JlZWthbnRoIEI=?=)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 00:50:43 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>

hi kenneth,
what u said may not be really true.... there are thousands out there
in France and Germany who cannot even write a sentence in English;-)

its really sad that we cannot communicate in our mother tongue. some way
technology should bridge this gap.

English has become the standard to judge our quality.

perhaps some one will come out with a system where we can speak/write in our
mother tongue and generate any language out put that we want ... [?]

- sree

On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 10:51 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>wrote:

> On Friday 09 Jan 2009 7:19:28 pm sree vatsa wrote:
> >  Plz can u
>
> if this is an example of how you write english, you have very poor chance
> of
> getting a job.
>
> --
> regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Associate
> NRC-FOSS
> http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
http://picasaweb.google.com/gnuyoga

All things come through desire and every sincere prayer is answered !
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From pradeep at btbytes.com  Fri Jan  9 21:10:50 2009
From: pradeep at btbytes.com (Pradeep Gowda)
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 15:10:50 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3e3294b70901091210h7cf1aad6r3e47fa1e9efbf938@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 2:20 PM, (????) Sreekanth B <gnuyoga at gmail.com>wrote:

> hi kenneth,
> what u said may not be really true.... there are thousands out there
> in France and Germany who cannot even write a sentence in English;-)
>


That's because they study in French/German medium schools and not in English
medium schools like most of us. 16 years of using a language to learn
everything from math, science to engineering  should equip one with basic
skills, isn't it?

I'm not commenting on the original posters english ability.
Kenneth expressed what anybody in hiring  position would do -> "If this guy
cannot write a nice intro mail, how good can he be? etc. "

So, while Kenneth's mail can come across negatively, I think he has worked
enough youngsters to recognize that having good communication is as
important as programming skills to get a good job. especially in a bearish
job market.

My two paise...
FWIW,I studied in a Kannada medium school.

+PG
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From banibrata.dutta at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 02:30:45 2009
From: banibrata.dutta at gmail.com (Banibrata Dutta)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 07:00:45 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <3e3294b70901091210h7cf1aad6r3e47fa1e9efbf938@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
	<3e3294b70901091210h7cf1aad6r3e47fa1e9efbf938@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3de8e1f70901091730j5f22997ex5c22cf8b88c3b720@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 1:40 AM, Pradeep Gowda <pradeep at btbytes.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 2:20 PM, (????) Sreekanth B <gnuyoga at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> hi kenneth,
>> what u said may not be really true.... there are thousands out there
>> in France and Germany who cannot even write a sentence in English;-)
>>
>
>
> That's because they study in French/German medium schools and not in
> English medium schools like most of us. 16 years of using a language to
> learn everything from math, science to engineering  should equip one with
> basic skills, isn't it?
>

Beg to differ here. The no. of "english medium" schools is a high number
only in urban jungles, and more so in metros. Move a bit further from there,
to the rest of India, those "english public schools" are either missing or a
big fiasco.

I know a fairly large bunch of highly successful, well-established,
technocrats who do not have an excellent command over this language
(english). However, most of them confidently use the language anyhow. Point
is, for a person who did his schooling, largely in a vernacular language,
and took up english just for 1 or 2 years, as an "additional course", didn't
have a community and environmental setting which permitted one to use
english too much, chances are quite high that the person may not have an
excellent command. Also, the SMS-culture ('y r u lk ths'), has done a good
bit to weaken the language sense, as well.

So, IMHO, I'd not judge one's english speaking/writing abilities as a way to
judge one's capabilities as a technocrat. The person in question, did manage
to communicate his/her need anyhow.

>
> I'm not commenting on the original posters english ability.
> Kenneth expressed what anybody in hiring  position would do -> "If this guy
> cannot write a nice intro mail, how good can he be? etc. "
>

Point taken. I know that Kenneth is not alone in using english as a
yardstick of communication skills, nor is it completely incorrect. I'd
rather say that, give this person a chance, see how he fares overall, and
then use the knowledge of weakness in english as "parameter" in the 360deg
evaluation.

>
> So, while Kenneth's mail can come across negatively, I think he has worked
> enough youngsters to recognize that having good communication is as
> important as programming skills to get a good job. especially in a bearish
> job market.
>
>
In a Bearish market, any excuse is a good excuse, not to hire. It's
Caveat-Emptor for the employer, so they call the shots, get their standards
as high as they can imagine.


> My two paise...
> FWIW,I studied in a Kannada medium school.
>

And I'd say you are fortunate and definitely bright. :-)

-- 
regards,
Banibrata
http://www.linkedin.com/in/bdutta
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From srinivasaenergy at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 05:23:26 2009
From: srinivasaenergy at gmail.com (srinivasa rao)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 09:53:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Commercial: Need help to support prototype web app
	dev with TG 2.0
In-Reply-To: <efccafae0901071714q191814f2xfed25a414ece90a3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <efccafae0901071714q191814f2xfed25a414ece90a3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b072d7570901092023l541638d8re8549b446ed25976@mail.gmail.com>

Dear sir
I am a software engineer  as well as consultant with 2+ years exp and using
Python if you interested may i would like to work with you and hope to get
reply .
thanking you
yours truly
srinivasa rao m

On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 6:44 AM, Ravi Shankar-Uma Iyer <ravi.uma at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi:
>       I am looking for experienced and professional independent
> consultants/small firms to support my internal software dev. team by
> guiding, designing  and maybe even fully developing the first prototype of a
> web app that aids product selection and configuration (we make pumps and
> industrial valves). After much debate, our internal team has selected
> TurboGears 2.0b1 over Rails for all such future development. We use only
> FOSS technologies internally, so Flash devs. need not even try.
>
>   We need to start work by end of next week and complete the prototyping by
> end Mar 2009. I am looking for highly experienced individuals/firms with
> good communication skills and a good track record. If you are interested and
> available, please send me a brief summary of your capabilities along with
> URLs to publicly available samples of your work if any. I also need
> indicative rates on a daily/hourly basis. We are located at #2, First Floor,
> Platinum City, Yeshwantpura, Bangalore 560003.
>
> My email id: ravi.shankar
> Email domain: weirminerals.com
>
>      I apologize in advance if this email does not meet the posting
> guidelines of Bangpypers in any way.
>
>
> Regards
> Ravi Shankar
> Head - Shared Engineering Services
> Weir Minerals India Ltd.
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Sat Jan 10 05:27:44 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 09:57:44 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901100957.44619.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Saturday 10 Jan 2009 12:50:43 am Sreekanth B wrote:
> what u said may not be really true.... there are thousands out there
> in France and Germany who cannot even write a sentence in English;-)

but if they did, they would spell 'you' as 'you' and not as 'u'

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From sriramnrn at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 05:53:00 2009
From: sriramnrn at gmail.com (Sriram Narayanan)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 10:23:00 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <200901100957.44619.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901100957.44619.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 9:57 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org> wrote:
> On Saturday 10 Jan 2009 12:50:43 am Sreekanth B wrote:
>> what u said may not be really true.... there are thousands out there
>> in France and Germany who cannot even write a sentence in English;-)
>
> but if they did, they would spell 'you' as 'you' and not as 'u'

My +1 to SMS lingo not really being "cool" when it comes to communication.

Sreekanth, you may not know this, but though it's accepted culture to
use "plz" and "u" and "thx" in certain communities (e.g. amongst
friends), a lot of customers world wide as well as tech folks do not
really use such language. Even if you do use shortened words, it's not
 considered exciting or cool or acceptable.

Just imagine the following scenario : You write an informative mail to
your customer, and that person now needs to forward this mail to some
other people. These people would be his colleagues, other vendors, or
even his own customers. Given that SMS lingo is not actually accepted
worldwide and often considered unprofessional, your customer would be
hesitant to forward your email. This is because he would be aware that
other people's attention would be drawn to your SMS-style shortened
words, and you'd be considered unprofessional. Further, this will also
reflect on your customer. This is because others will now wonder about
how professional he is if he's dealing with a person who cannot even
write a proper email. Note: "proper" here is what they consider
proper.

I'm writing the above based on my own observations at work. I also
closely interact with the trainers at our company who receive inputs
from global management on what practices to inform our people about.

Your being non-english medium educated has no bearing on your using
shortened words. Lots of English-medium educated people us such words
too.

>
> --
> regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Associate
> NRC-FOSS
> http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From abpillai at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 07:37:05 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 12:07:05 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901100957.44619.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901092237j521e5b49k12454b61ac21c732@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 10:23 AM, Sriram Narayanan <sriramnrn at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 9:57 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org> wrote:
>> On Saturday 10 Jan 2009 12:50:43 am Sreekanth B wrote:
>>> what u said may not be really true.... there are thousands out there
>>> in France and Germany who cannot even write a sentence in English;-)
>>
>> but if they did, they would spell 'you' as 'you' and not as 'u'
>
> My +1 to SMS lingo not really being "cool" when it comes to communication.
>
> Sreekanth, you may not know this, but though it's accepted culture to
> use "plz" and "u" and "thx" in certain communities (e.g. amongst
> friends), a lot of customers world wide as well as tech folks do not
> really use such language. Even if you do use shortened words, it's not
>  considered exciting or cool or acceptable.
>
> Just imagine the following scenario : You write an informative mail to
> your customer, and that person now needs to forward this mail to some
> other people. These people would be his colleagues, other vendors, or
> even his own customers. Given that SMS lingo is not actually accepted
> worldwide and often considered unprofessional, your customer would be
> hesitant to forward your email. This is because he would be aware that
> other people's attention would be drawn to your SMS-style shortened
> words, and you'd be considered unprofessional. Further, this will also
> reflect on your customer. This is because others will now wonder about
> how professional he is if he's dealing with a person who cannot even
> write a proper email. Note: "proper" here is what they consider
> proper.
>
> I'm writing the above based on my own observations at work. I also
> closely interact with the trainers at our company who receive inputs
> from global management on what practices to inform our people about.

I agree with Kenneth 100%. Quick communication through SMS and chat
has made the use of abbreviations widespread. Unfortunately, there is
a tendency to use them in contexts where a more formal language is
preferred.

For example, if you are writing an internal company email to your manager,
and ending it with "thx, rgds", you are doing yourself a disfavor. It might be
okay to do so with colleagues occasionally, but it is good practice to
write in full, proper English without resorting to informal abbreviations when
writing professional emails and also within your company too.

The other downside of this, is that abuse of short-forms actually destroys
your writing skills. Once you get to IMHO, BTW, CU and the like, your
brain is wired to resort to the short-forms instead of typing out the words
in full.

IMHO (irony intended), this is a disservice to the language and is a not
a good practice to follow. Sure, stick to your abbreviations in SMS, chat
and /., but try to write good English without abusing short-forms in other
channels of Internet communication.


>
> Your being non-english medium educated has no bearing on your using
> shortened words. Lots of English-medium educated people us such words
> too.

I studied in an "English Medium" school throughout my 10 years of schooling.
However, apart from picking up formal English language lessons, it did
nothing to help me to use English as a daily medium of communication because
we always used to talk in the mother tongue at school.

Only after I went to college for my professional studies, did I pick up
the skills of speaking and writing good English. That too towards the end of
the course, when I was giving my GRE and also appearing for campus
interviews, when theses skills would actually decide your career and
the rest of your life.

>
>>
>> --
>> regards
>> Kenneth Gonsalves
>> Associate
>> NRC-FOSS
>> http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

Regards

-- 
-Anand

From biplab.biswas at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 07:43:49 2009
From: biplab.biswas at gmail.com (Biplab Biswas)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 12:13:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
Message-ID: <8b974cd80901092243q6a4e20f6y6ba197b807adbbd3@mail.gmail.com>

Hi SreeVatsa.Can u share your resume' with me.I am a consultant working with
a top MNC.
should be able to show some opportunity once you share your profile.

Regards,
Biplab

On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 7:19 PM, sree vatsa <sreebel at rediffmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Bangpypers,
>        I have 2 years of experience in python . I am searching for the job.
> Plz can u provide the list of companies which work on PYTHON. Thanks in
> advance.
>  Thanks & Regards,
>
> Sreevatsa.B.D
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Sat Jan 10 07:51:56 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 12:21:56 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901092237j521e5b49k12454b61ac21c732@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901092237j521e5b49k12454b61ac21c732@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901101221.56646.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Saturday 10 Jan 2009 12:07:05 pm Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote:
> > Your being non-english medium educated has no bearing on your using
> > shortened words. Lots of English-medium educated people us such words
> > too.
>
> I studied in an "English Medium" school throughout my 10 years of
> schooling. However, apart from picking up formal English language lessons,
> it did nothing to help me to use English as a daily medium of communication
> because we always used to talk in the mother tongue at school.

anyway, I have seen that people with poor communication skills in English have 
even poorer communication skills in their mother tongue. I once rejected a 
poorly written job application and asked the person to re present it with 
proper grammar and spelling and got a long missive basically saying that his 
language was Kannada and he was being forced to use an alien tongue - 
English. I replied in Kannada asking him to submit his application in 
Kannada - he was unable to read my reply!

I have lots of correspondence with people from non-english backgrounds. Their 
choice of words and grammatical constructions are sometimes very peculiar - 
but they *do* succeed in communicating. And communicating effectively.

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From gnuyoga at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 09:05:10 2009
From: gnuyoga at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?(=E0=A4=B6=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B0=E0=A5=80)_Sreekanth_B?=)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 13:35:10 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901100957.44619.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <db49484f0901100005y77f159b5l51444540467d833a@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 10:23 AM, Sriram Narayanan <sriramnrn at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 9:57 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>
> wrote:
> > On Saturday 10 Jan 2009 12:50:43 am Sreekanth B wrote:
> >> what u said may not be really true.... there are thousands out there
> >> in France and Germany who cannot even write a sentence in English;-)
> >
> > but if they did, they would spell 'you' as 'you' and not as 'u'
>
> My +1 to SMS lingo not really being "cool" when it comes to communication.
>
> Sreekanth, you may not know this, but though it's accepted culture to
> use "plz" and "u" and "thx" in certain communities (e.g. amongst
> friends), a lot of customers world wide as well as tech folks do not
> really use such language. Even if you do use shortened words, it's not
>  considered exciting or cool or acceptable.
>

kenneth,

i know my statement may not comply to the English standards but it has
communicated what i wanted to say ? as pradeep said, communication perhaps
is most important than language.

sreeram,
THIS MAKE ME THINK WHO DECIDES WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE AND WHAT IS NOT ?


- sree


-- 
http://picasaweb.google.com/gnuyoga

All things come through desire and every sincere prayer is answered !
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Sat Jan 10 09:17:55 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 13:47:55 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <db49484f0901100005y77f159b5l51444540467d833a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
	<db49484f0901100005y77f159b5l51444540467d833a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901101347.55306.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Saturday 10 Jan 2009 1:35:10 pm (????) Sreekanth B wrote:
> i know my statement may not comply to the English standards but it has
> communicated what i wanted to say ? as pradeep said, communication perhaps
> is most important than language.

if I get a communication in SMS speak or poorly spelt language, I get 
irritated and often ignore the communication - which results in a 
communication failure.

>
> sreeram,
> THIS MAKE ME THINK WHO DECIDES WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE AND WHAT IS NOT ?

shouting is unacceptable ;-)



-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From abpillai at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 09:35:39 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 14:05:39 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <200901101347.55306.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
	<db49484f0901100005y77f159b5l51444540467d833a@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901101347.55306.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901100035l222e7a97mff1dddee6ddf6591@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 1:47 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org> wrote:
> On Saturday 10 Jan 2009 1:35:10 pm (????) Sreekanth B wrote:
>> i know my statement may not comply to the English standards but it has
>> communicated what i wanted to say ? as pradeep said, communication perhaps
>> is most important than language.

srly u undstd wht i sy hr, but isn't it much better if you surely
understand what I say here ?


>
> if I get a communication in SMS speak or poorly spelt language, I get
> irritated and often ignore the communication - which results in a
> communication failure.
>
+1

>>
>> sreeram,
>> THIS MAKE ME THINK WHO DECIDES WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE AND WHAT IS NOT ?
>
> shouting is unacceptable ;-)
>
>
>
> --
> regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Associate
> NRC-FOSS
> http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
-Anand

From jeff at taupro.com  Sat Jan 10 13:03:42 2009
From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 06:03:42 -0600
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <db49484f0901100005y77f159b5l51444540467d833a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>	<200901100957.44619.lawgon@au-kbc.org>	<49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
	<db49484f0901100005y77f159b5l51444540467d833a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49688E9E.4050803@taupro.com>

(????) Sreekanth B wrote:
> 
> THIS MAKE ME THINK WHO DECIDES WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE AND WHAT IS NOT ? 

That's easy!  It's the customer/employer who decides, since they will or won't
hire you based on what they think is acceptable, whether you agree or not.

Sincerely, good luck in your job search.  I hope you find something soon.

-Jeff


From gnuyoga at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 13:10:59 2009
From: gnuyoga at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?(=E0=A4=B6=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B0=E0=A5=80)_Sreekanth_B?=)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 17:40:59 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] python
In-Reply-To: <49688E9E.4050803@taupro.com>
References: <20090109134928.11585.qmail@f4mail-235-136.rediffmail.com>
	<200901092251.45444.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<db49484f0901091120v5b738249x4cff2bef2e54a682@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901100957.44619.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<49977f270901092053w759b40e9lb17aeb766eaa2c4b@mail.gmail.com>
	<db49484f0901100005y77f159b5l51444540467d833a@mail.gmail.com>
	<49688E9E.4050803@taupro.com>
Message-ID: <db49484f0901100410w72976448iaf3a7974850899e9@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 5:33 PM, Jeff Rush <jeff at taupro.com> wrote:

> (????) Sreekanth B wrote:
> >
> > THIS MAKE ME THINK WHO DECIDES WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE AND WHAT IS NOT ?
>
> That's easy!  It's the customer/employer who decides, since they will or
> won't
> hire you based on what they think is acceptable, whether you agree or not.
>
> Sincerely, good luck in your job search.  I hope you find something soon.
>
> -Jeff


thanks jeff. sree who started this thread is not me !

let me pass on the good luck to him ;-)

- sree  aka gnuyoga [at] gmail dot com

>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
http://picasaweb.google.com/gnuyoga

All things come through desire and every sincere prayer is answered !
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From abpillai at gmail.com  Sat Jan 10 16:14:51 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 20:44:51 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>

Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
and other Python based web frameworks.

Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
in search, mobile etc.

The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
Services...)

If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and have
used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for other
people who look for jobs in this sector and have an exposure
to Python.

Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of this
thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is useful
for people searching for jobs...  :)


-- 

Regards,

-Anand

From iapain at yahoo.com  Sat Jan 10 22:43:11 2009
From: iapain at yahoo.com (Deepak Thukral)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 13:43:11 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <841925.4097.qm@web33108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Most of the top IT companies in India thinks thats "Python is for hippies" and less availability of workers stronger their reluctant to try hands on Python. Moreover they've clients in Suits and happy with Java and other Suits type Porgramming language and Frameworks.

BTW I'm not in any kind of IT industry but in reseach industry Python is cutting development and verification time.

*Suits - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suit_(clothing)

--
Deepak



--- On Sat, 1/10/09, Anand Balachandran Pillai <abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:

> From: Anand Balachandran Pillai <abpillai at gmail.com>
> Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
> To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
> Date: Saturday, January 10, 2009, 8:44 PM
> Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
> with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
> and other Python based web frameworks.
> 
> Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
> IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
> in search, mobile etc.
> 
> The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
> Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
> among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
> Services...)
> 
> If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and
> have
> used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
> with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for
> other
> people who look for jobs in this sector and have an
> exposure
> to Python.
> 
> Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of
> this
> thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is
> useful
> for people searching for jobs...  :)
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers


      

From srini at nanolets.in  Sun Jan 11 02:12:03 2009
From: srini at nanolets.in (Nanolets nanolets)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 06:42:03 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <841925.4097.qm@web33108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
	<841925.4097.qm@web33108.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <a5eab14c0901101712n37f2e56fybdbe42e19030877e@mail.gmail.com>

I have been in Corporate training for Python. The requests were as follows.

Wipro - were starting a new project in telecom testing with Python with a
team.
Techmahindra - Telecom testing. Entire framework was about 20 people.
MBT - Iron Python. As glue tool againg for testing.
NetApps - Build automation tool.
EMC - Jython based testing framework.
TataElxsi - Testing framework on windows platform.

In last two years some 20 freshers started learning python django plone with
us
and have moved to either Mahiti or Zeomega. All the real python careers for
freshers
that i  know of have started with these two companies.

More the merrier.

Regards
Srini.


On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 3:13 AM, Deepak Thukral <iapain at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Most of the top IT companies in India thinks thats "Python is for hippies"
> and less availability of workers stronger their reluctant to try hands on
> Python. Moreover they've clients in Suits and happy with Java and other
> Suits type Porgramming language and Frameworks.
>
> BTW I'm not in any kind of IT industry but in reseach industry Python is
> cutting development and verification time.
>
> *Suits - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suit_(clothing)<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suit_%28clothing%29>
>
> --
> Deepak
>
>
>
> --- On Sat, 1/10/09, Anand Balachandran Pillai <abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > From: Anand Balachandran Pillai <abpillai at gmail.com>
> > Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
> > To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
> > Date: Saturday, January 10, 2009, 8:44 PM
> > Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
> > with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
> > and other Python based web frameworks.
> >
> > Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
> > IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
> > in search, mobile etc.
> >
> > The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
> > Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
> > among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
> > Services...)
> >
> > If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and
> > have
> > used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
> > with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for
> > other
> > people who look for jobs in this sector and have an
> > exposure
> > to Python.
> >
> > Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of
> > this
> > thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is
> > useful
> > for people searching for jobs...  :)
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > -Anand
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
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From bharat_pathak at hotmail.com  Sun Jan 11 08:16:54 2009
From: bharat_pathak at hotmail.com (Bharat Pathak)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 12:46:54 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>

Dear All,

    My name is Bharat Pathak and I own the company named
    "Arithos Designs" www.Arithos.com, we started one year
    back and I have become a big fan of Python.

    My company is into DSP Design Consultancy and Tech Trainings,
    in the area of Digital Signal Processing, Digital Image Processing,
    and Front end VLSI space. For our kind of work Matlab is
    a good commercial s/w but it's once license would rip-us
    -off by 3 lakh Rs. Since mine is a self funded startup, we did
    not have money to invest so much. Hence I was looking for
    alternatives. 

    All my thanks and appreciation to originators of Python in
    inventing such a fantastic language. There is more to write....
    but I would like to close.

Regards
Bharat Pathak

Founder and CEO

Arithos Designs
www.Arithos.com

DSP Design Consultancy and Corporate/Student Training Company
    

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Anand Balachandran Pillai" <abpillai at gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 8:44 PM
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector

> Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
> with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
> and other Python based web frameworks.
> 
> Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
> IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
> in search, mobile etc.
> 
> The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
> Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
> among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
> Services...)
> 
> If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and have
> used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
> with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for other
> people who look for jobs in this sector and have an exposure
> to Python.
> 
> Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of this
> thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is useful
> for people searching for jobs...  :)
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> 

From ashim at stoke.com  Sun Jan 11 08:41:19 2009
From: ashim at stoke.com (Ashim Roy)
Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2009 23:41:19 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>

Hi Bharat,

When it comes to DSP design, Matlab is the defactor. Alternative is to
write C code and simulator yourself.

You can also try Scilab, which is an open source product -
http://www.scilab.org/

If you need discuss your ideas, feel free to contact me,

Cheers,

Ashim Roy
ashim at stoke.com
O: +91 80 3028 2380
M: +91 988 077 5520

-----Original Message-----
From: bangpypers-bounces+ashim=stoke.com at python.org
[mailto:bangpypers-bounces+ashim=stoke.com at python.org] On Behalf Of
Bharat Pathak
Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 12:47 PM
To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector

Dear All,

    My name is Bharat Pathak and I own the company named
    "Arithos Designs" www.Arithos.com, we started one year
    back and I have become a big fan of Python.

    My company is into DSP Design Consultancy and Tech Trainings,
    in the area of Digital Signal Processing, Digital Image Processing,
    and Front end VLSI space. For our kind of work Matlab is
    a good commercial s/w but it's once license would rip-us
    -off by 3 lakh Rs. Since mine is a self funded startup, we did
    not have money to invest so much. Hence I was looking for
    alternatives. 

    All my thanks and appreciation to originators of Python in
    inventing such a fantastic language. There is more to write....
    but I would like to close.

Regards
Bharat Pathak

Founder and CEO

Arithos Designs
www.Arithos.com

DSP Design Consultancy and Corporate/Student Training Company
    

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Anand Balachandran Pillai" <abpillai at gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 8:44 PM
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector

> Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
> with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
> and other Python based web frameworks.
> 
> Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
> IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
> in search, mobile etc.
> 
> The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
> Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
> among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
> Services...)
> 
> If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and have
> used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
> with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for other
> people who look for jobs in this sector and have an exposure
> to Python.
> 
> Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of this
> thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is useful
> for people searching for jobs...  :)
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> 
_______________________________________________
BangPypers mailing list
BangPypers at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers

From anandology at gmail.com  Sun Jan 11 09:07:36 2009
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 13:37:36 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <41139fcb0901110007m72fb41c1y4c992ec87fc73854@mail.gmail.com>

>   My company is into DSP Design Consultancy and Tech Trainings,
>   in the area of Digital Signal Processing, Digital Image Processing,
>   and Front end VLSI space. For our kind of work Matlab is
>   a good commercial s/w but it's once license would rip-us
>   -off by 3 lakh Rs. Since mine is a self funded startup, we did
>   not have money to invest so much. Hence I was looking for
>   alternatives.

Have you looked at scipy?

http://www.scipy.org/

It includes a lot of packages for scientific computing and visualization.

From bharat_pathak at hotmail.com  Sun Jan 11 09:48:22 2009
From: bharat_pathak at hotmail.com (Bharat Pathak)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 14:18:22 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
References: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
Message-ID: <BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>

Hi Ashim and All,

     I think I have hit the nail, and made my point.
     The idea is to promote python and find out
     where it is being used and what brings out
     it's powers.

     In  one of the bloggers and fan of python he
     had evaluated speed of Matlab, C++ and Python.
     The graph goes like this.

     Matlab -----------> C++ --------------> Python

     Python being fastest. Since I do not come from
     s/w community I still do not quite understand
     the true powers of this language. But it suffices
     our purpose and so I am happy about it. Just
     wanted to let know others.

     In the last mail chain I was irritated by the mud
     slinging happening due to "sms lingo" being
     used. I think people should refrain and control
     themselves, as to not use tech forums for 
     "useless talks". Do something useful and
     constructive. Else you would drive away good
     people out of this community.

Regards
Bharat Pathak

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Ashim Roy" <ashim at stoke.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:11 PM
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector

> Hi Bharat,
> 
> When it comes to DSP design, Matlab is the defactor. Alternative is to
> write C code and simulator yourself.
> 
> You can also try Scilab, which is an open source product -
> http://www.scilab.org/
> 
> If you need discuss your ideas, feel free to contact me,
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Ashim Roy
> ashim at stoke.com
> O: +91 80 3028 2380
> M: +91 988 077 5520
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bangpypers-bounces+ashim=stoke.com at python.org
> [mailto:bangpypers-bounces+ashim=stoke.com at python.org] On Behalf Of
> Bharat Pathak
> Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 12:47 PM
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
> 
> Dear All,
> 
>    My name is Bharat Pathak and I own the company named
>    "Arithos Designs" www.Arithos.com, we started one year
>    back and I have become a big fan of Python.
> 
>    My company is into DSP Design Consultancy and Tech Trainings,
>    in the area of Digital Signal Processing, Digital Image Processing,
>    and Front end VLSI space. For our kind of work Matlab is
>    a good commercial s/w but it's once license would rip-us
>    -off by 3 lakh Rs. Since mine is a self funded startup, we did
>    not have money to invest so much. Hence I was looking for
>    alternatives. 
> 
>    All my thanks and appreciation to originators of Python in
>    inventing such a fantastic language. There is more to write....
>    but I would like to close.
> 
> Regards
> Bharat Pathak
> 
> Founder and CEO
> 
> Arithos Designs
> www.Arithos.com
> 
> DSP Design Consultancy and Corporate/Student Training Company
>    
> 
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Anand Balachandran Pillai" <abpillai at gmail.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 8:44 PM
> To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
> 
>> Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
>> with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
>> and other Python based web frameworks.
>> 
>> Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
>> IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
>> in search, mobile etc.
>> 
>> The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
>> Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
>> among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
>> Services...)
>> 
>> If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and have
>> used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
>> with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for other
>> people who look for jobs in this sector and have an exposure
>> to Python.
>> 
>> Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of this
>> thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is useful
>> for people searching for jobs...  :)
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> -Anand
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> 

From bharat_pathak at hotmail.com  Sun Jan 11 09:49:56 2009
From: bharat_pathak at hotmail.com (Bharat Pathak)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 14:19:56 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com><BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>
	<41139fcb0901110007m72fb41c1y4c992ec87fc73854@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com><BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>
	<41139fcb0901110007m72fb41c1y4c992ec87fc73854@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU142-DS55ACBAEB3BBB901FDAAF79BDB0@phx.gbl>

Yes. I have.

Thanks For your suggestions. 

Regards
Bharat Pathak

Arithos Designs
www.Arithos.com

DSP Design Consultancy and Corporate/Student Training Company

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Anand Chitipothu" <anandology at gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:37 PM
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector

>>   My company is into DSP Design Consultancy and Tech Trainings,
>>   in the area of Digital Signal Processing, Digital Image Processing,
>>   and Front end VLSI space. For our kind of work Matlab is
>>   a good commercial s/w but it's once license would rip-us
>>   -off by 3 lakh Rs. Since mine is a self funded startup, we did
>>   not have money to invest so much. Hence I was looking for
>>   alternatives.
> 
> Have you looked at scipy?
> 
> http://www.scipy.org/
> 
> It includes a lot of packages for scientific computing and visualization.
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> 

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Sun Jan 11 11:12:15 2009
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 15:42:15 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
References: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
	<BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <a3b05e8b0901110212g54a1c61ak56e00a53dac992a0@mail.gmail.com>

On 1/11/09, Bharat Pathak <bharat_pathak at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>      In  one of the bloggers and fan of python he
>      had evaluated speed of Matlab, C++ and Python.
>      The graph goes like this.
>
>      Matlab -----------> C++ --------------> Python
>
>      Python being fastest.

I am not sure whether i understand this statement right - the
statement is flawed if you had taken either of the development times
or the running times as the basis.
But let me clarify it in my own terms :

'Good' C++ is the fastest above; if you write crappy c++ then the
binary is huge and also the running times are NOT as one would expect
from C++. C++ is a very tricky language, but once learnt, it is sheer
ecstacy.

The integration of Python and C/C++ is one of the most beautiful thing
that man has ever created :P One gets to harness the speed(runtime) of
c++ and the fast development time of Python.

-- 
-V-
Blog @ http://blizzardzblogs.blogspot.com

From anandology at gmail.com  Sun Jan 11 16:07:37 2009
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 20:37:37 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <a3b05e8b0901110212g54a1c61ak56e00a53dac992a0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
	<BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
	<a3b05e8b0901110212g54a1c61ak56e00a53dac992a0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <41139fcb0901110707k6c5a4838w16ae8285946714fb@mail.gmail.com>

> C++ is a very tricky language, but once learnt, it is sheer ecstacy.

You must be joking.

From ramdas at developeriq.com  Sun Jan 11 18:38:58 2009
From: ramdas at developeriq.com (Ramdas S)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 23:08:58 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <41139fcb0901110707k6c5a4838w16ae8285946714fb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
	<BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
	<a3b05e8b0901110212g54a1c61ak56e00a53dac992a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<41139fcb0901110707k6c5a4838w16ae8285946714fb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6e38f9f00901110938q7a7acf18i42c765f0b4efacfb@mail.gmail.com>

Ecstacy for whom the programmer, the debugger(tester) or the person
maintaining the code?

On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 8:37 PM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com>wrote:

> > C++ is a very tricky language, but once learnt, it is sheer ecstacy.
>
> You must be joking.
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Ramdas S
+91 9342 583 065
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From n.s.buttar at gmail.com  Sun Jan 11 18:46:49 2009
From: n.s.buttar at gmail.com (n.s.buttar at gmail.com)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 23:16:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1090e4100901110946k6c9833eaqe28755eca5934cf8@mail.gmail.com>

We use it internally in our team for various tasks, some day to day task
scripts, a tool with server/client arch. Server in C/Python and client in
IronPython. Many tools we use support python scipting.

On Sat, Jan 10, 2009 at 8:44 PM, Anand Balachandran Pillai <
abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:

> Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
> with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
> and other Python based web frameworks.
>
> Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
> IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
> in search, mobile etc.
>
> The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
> Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
> among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
> Services...)
>
> If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and have
> used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
> with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for other
> people who look for jobs in this sector and have an exposure
> to Python.
>
> Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of this
> thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is useful
> for people searching for jobs...  :)
>
>
> --
>
> Regards,
>
> -Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
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From rajeev.sebastian at gmail.com  Sun Jan 11 18:58:38 2009
From: rajeev.sebastian at gmail.com (Rajeev J Sebastian)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 23:28:38 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <6e38f9f00901110938q7a7acf18i42c765f0b4efacfb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
	<BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
	<a3b05e8b0901110212g54a1c61ak56e00a53dac992a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<41139fcb0901110707k6c5a4838w16ae8285946714fb@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e38f9f00901110938q7a7acf18i42c765f0b4efacfb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <79a035420901110958kf2bf67bod996ef2580935c8d@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 11:08 PM, Ramdas S <ramdas at developeriq.com> wrote:
> Ecstacy for whom the programmer, the debugger(tester) or the person
> maintaining the code?
>> > C++ is a very tricky language, but once learnt, it is sheer ecstacy.
>>
>> You must be joking.

If you're doing Qt C++ ... then it is more-or-less ecstasy ... despite
the dumb compile-run cycle

Regards
Rajeev J Sebastian

From a_n_lal at yahoo.com  Mon Jan 12 05:50:25 2009
From: a_n_lal at yahoo.com (Aditya Lal)
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 20:50:25 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <157745.32027.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

An open source alternate for MATLAB is R (http://www.r-project.org/). It also provide plugins to Java and Python.



________________________________
From: Bharat Pathak <bharat_pathak at hotmail.com>
To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 12:46:54 PM
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector

Dear All,

   My name is Bharat Pathak and I own the company named
   "Arithos Designs" www.Arithos.com, we started one year
   back and I have become a big fan of Python.

   My company is into DSP Design Consultancy and Tech Trainings,
   in the area of Digital Signal Processing, Digital Image Processing,
   and Front end VLSI space. For our kind of work Matlab is
   a good commercial s/w but it's once license would rip-us
   -off by 3 lakh Rs. Since mine is a self funded startup, we did
   not have money to invest so much. Hence I was looking for
   alternatives. 
   All my thanks and appreciation to originators of Python in
   inventing such a fantastic language. There is more to write....
   but I would like to close.

Regards
Bharat Pathak

Founder and CEO

Arithos Designs
www.Arithos.com

DSP Design Consultancy and Corporate/Student Training Company
  
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Anand Balachandran Pillai" <abpillai at gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 8:44 PM
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector

> Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
> with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
> and other Python based web frameworks.
> 
> Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
> IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
> in search, mobile etc.
> 
> The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
> Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
> among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
> Services...)
> 
> If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and have
> used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
> with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for other
> people who look for jobs in this sector and have an exposure
> to Python.
> 
> Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of this
> thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is useful
> for people searching for jobs...  :)
> 
> 
> -- 
> Regards,
> 
> -Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> 
_______________________________________________
BangPypers mailing list
BangPypers at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers



      
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From skpatel20 at hotmail.com  Mon Jan 12 06:37:25 2009
From: skpatel20 at hotmail.com (Sanjaya Kumar Patel)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 11:07:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <157745.32027.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl> 
	<157745.32027.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY121-W9B60B85CCEE99D90BB9F4B9D80@phx.gbl>


Hi All,

We use Python (TurboGears) extensively at our company, RAD Solutions Private Limited (www.radsolutions.co.in). We have the running project www.gcollab.com, and are also considering taking projects on contracts using OpenERP / TurboGears / Pylons.

Sanjay


_________________________________________________________________
Find a better job. We have plenty. Visit MSN Jobs
http://www.in.msn.com/jobs 
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From banibrata.dutta at gmail.com  Mon Jan 12 06:55:54 2009
From: banibrata.dutta at gmail.com (Banibrata Dutta)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 11:25:54 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <157745.32027.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <8548c5f30901100714i529b4ad3m20b994fae2a9cba8@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU142-DS192E55D5037F1609551419BDB0@phx.gbl>
	<157745.32027.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3de8e1f70901112155q78ab406ai2f6975325ff53b0c@mail.gmail.com>

Actually SciLab is also a fairly popular alternative, as I'm told. This blog
post describes the options for you:
http://www.morlok.net/ryan/2006/11/01/open-source-matlab-alternatives/

Note that, your mileage may vary !

On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 10:20 AM, Aditya Lal <a_n_lal at yahoo.com> wrote:

> An open source alternate for MATLAB is R (http://www.r-project.org/). It
> also provide plugins to Java and Python.
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Bharat Pathak <bharat_pathak at hotmail.com>
> *To:* Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> *Sent:* Sunday, January 11, 2009 12:46:54 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
>
> Dear All,
>
>   My name is Bharat Pathak and I own the company named
>   "Arithos Designs" www.Arithos.com, we started one year
>   back and I have become a big fan of Python.
>
>   My company is into DSP Design Consultancy and Tech Trainings,
>   in the area of Digital Signal Processing, Digital Image Processing,
>   and Front end VLSI space. For our kind of work Matlab is
>   a good commercial s/w but it's once license would rip-us
>   -off by 3 lakh Rs. Since mine is a self funded startup, we did
>   not have money to invest so much. Hence I was looking for
>   alternatives.
>   All my thanks and appreciation to originators of Python in
>   inventing such a fantastic language. There is more to write....
>   but I would like to close.
>
> Regards
> Bharat Pathak
>
> Founder and CEO
>
> Arithos Designs
> www.Arithos.com
>
> DSP Design Consultancy and Corporate/Student Training Company
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Anand Balachandran Pillai" <abpillai at gmail.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2009 8:44 PM
> To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
> Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
>
> > Typically Python is used in product/consulting companies
> > with niche software/consulting such as Django, Zope
> > and other Python based web frameworks.
> >
> > Python is otherwise used in places like Google, HP,
> > IBM. Startups also tend to use it a lot, especially those
> > in search, mobile etc.
> >
> > The purpose of this thread is to start a discussion among
> > Python usage among those in the IT service sector - say
> > among the big 5 (Infosys, TCS, Wirpo, Accenture, IBM Global
> > Services...)
> >
> > If you are working in the Indian IT service industry and have
> > used or currently use Python in your work, do write in
> > with your experiences. I think this will be helpful for other
> > people who look for jobs in this sector and have an exposure
> > to Python.
> >
> > Btw, I don't work in the service sector. The purpose of this
> > thread is purely academic, so that this discussion is useful
> > for people searching for jobs...  :)
> >
> >
> > --
> > Regards,
> >
> > -Anand
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>


-- 
regards,
Banibrata
http://www.linkedin.com/in/bdutta
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From abpillai at gmail.com  Mon Jan 12 14:17:49 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 18:47:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <a3b05e8b0901110212g54a1c61ak56e00a53dac992a0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
	<BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
	<a3b05e8b0901110212g54a1c61ak56e00a53dac992a0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901120517t190b5ffcl43f1a3cd052e8125@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 1/11/09, Bharat Pathak <bharat_pathak at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>      In  one of the bloggers and fan of python he
>>      had evaluated speed of Matlab, C++ and Python.
>>      The graph goes like this.
>>
>>      Matlab -----------> C++ --------------> Python
>>
>>      Python being fastest.
>
> I am not sure whether i understand this statement right - the
> statement is flawed if you had taken either of the development times
> or the running times as the basis.
> But let me clarify it in my own terms :
>
> 'Good' C++ is the fastest above; if you write crappy c++ then the
> binary is huge and also the running times are NOT as one would expect
> from C++. C++ is a very tricky language, but once learnt, it is sheer
> ecstacy.

I came to Python via the C/C++ route. Spent 5-6 years in C programming
and another 3-4 years in C++ (overlapping with C) and then discovered
Python.

I have found myself most productive in Python and C. C++ is one
language which takes a long time to get specialized in. C++ is ecstasy
only if you are a master with templates and can work magic with them.
Otherwise it is more like torture!

>
> The integration of Python and C/C++ is one of the most beautiful thing
> that man has ever created :P One gets to harness the speed(runtime) of
> c++ and the fast development time of Python.

+1. I have not written C++ extensions but have written C ones using the
swig wrapper. The C/Python API is really powerful.

>
> --
> -V-
> Blog @ http://blizzardzblogs.blogspot.com
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
-Anand

From abpillai at gmail.com  Mon Jan 12 15:07:48 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 19:37:48 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python use in IT service sector
In-Reply-To: <BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
References: <23EECEC9B06584478B1C9E38C253D35F014C8370@minsk.us.stoke.com>
	<BLU142-DS7DD0AF9058B8E4201DC7C9BDB0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901120607o556fa605gfe5e4dcc1b662962@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Bharath,

On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Bharat Pathak
<bharat_pathak at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Ashim and All,
>
>    I think I have hit the nail, and made my point.
>    The idea is to promote python and find out
>    where it is being used and what brings out
>    it's powers.
>
>    In  one of the bloggers and fan of python he
>    had evaluated speed of Matlab, C++ and Python.
>    The graph goes like this.
>
>    Matlab -----------> C++ --------------> Python
>
>    Python being fastest. Since I do not come from
>    s/w community I still do not quite understand
>    the true powers of this language. But it suffices
>    our purpose and so I am happy about it. Just
>    wanted to let know others.
>
>    In the last mail chain I was irritated by the mud
>    slinging happening due to "sms lingo" being
>    used. I think people should refrain and control
>    themselves, as to not use tech forums for    "useless talks". Do
> something useful and
>    constructive. Else you would drive away good
>    people out of this community.

Got your point.

However, do keep in mind that apart
from a forum for Python discussions, sometimes
people will get into discussions related to technology,
open source, netiquette etc i.e on topics which are
general to any technical forum.

These are often spontaneous and often end up
resulting in good discussions as off-topic threads
stemming from a Python discussion. I don't think
that such talks are completely "useless".

>
> Regards
> Bharat Pathak
>

Regards,

-- 
-Anand

From shridhar_c_k at yahoo.com  Mon Jan 12 16:18:54 2009
From: shridhar_c_k at yahoo.com (shridhar kyrlageri)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 07:18:54 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [BangPypers] hi all
In-Reply-To: <959452bf0811070635q4da49366oaf3c253240da16a2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

hi..
?i m an engineering student.. i want to be a very good programmer.. but i dont know where to start and what to do... can u please help me..


--- On Fri, 7/11/08, leela vadlamudi <leela.vadlamudi at gmail.com> wrote:

From: leela vadlamudi <leela.vadlamudi at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] hi all
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Date: Friday, 7 November, 2008, 8:05 PM

http://pythonprogramming.jottit.com/
_______________________________________________
BangPypers mailing list
BangPypers at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers



      Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Go to http://messenger.yahoo.com/invite/
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From abpillai at gmail.com  Mon Jan 12 16:42:25 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 21:12:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] hi all
In-Reply-To: <876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <959452bf0811070635q4da49366oaf3c253240da16a2@mail.gmail.com>
	<876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901120742p7c0ca3f5r1ec696dc1b590329@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 8:48 PM, shridhar kyrlageri
<shridhar_c_k at yahoo.com> wrote:
> hi..
>  i m an engineering student.. i want to be a very good programmer... but i
> dont know where to start and what to do... can u please help me.

You just need to relax and think what you want to do before
you ask for help. This is a technical forum in Python, we can help you
solve your Python related issues and also suggest Python related
jobs.

But it is up to you to first decide what you want to do
as a programmer, Python or not. To do that first think about
which area you want to work in, what technologies you
might be comfortable in etc.

Once you make up your mind, please post specific questions
here. All the best.

>
> --- On Fri, 7/11/08, leela vadlamudi <leela.vadlamudi at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: leela vadlamudi <leela.vadlamudi at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] hi all
> To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
> Date: Friday, 7 November, 2008, 8:05 PM
>
> http://pythonprogramming.jottit.com/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
> ________________________________
> Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now.
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>

Regards

-- 
-Anand

From rajeev.sebastian at gmail.com  Mon Jan 12 17:26:32 2009
From: rajeev.sebastian at gmail.com (Rajeev J Sebastian)
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 21:56:32 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] hi all
In-Reply-To: <876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <959452bf0811070635q4da49366oaf3c253240da16a2@mail.gmail.com>
	<876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <79a035420901120826v15191a88h84842b84faa618e7@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 8:48 PM, shridhar kyrlageri
<shridhar_c_k at yahoo.com> wrote:
> hi..
>  i m an engineering student.. i want to be a very good programmer... but i
> dont know where to start and what to do... can u please help me..

Practice, Practice, Practice!

Join an open source project (e.g., KDE, Django, etc) and get a mentor
(ask on their developers mailing list).

Regards
Rajeev J Sebastian

From dlilani at google.com  Wed Jan 14 07:02:54 2009
From: dlilani at google.com (Dhaval Lilani)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:32:54 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] need help in trying to create a python web bot
Message-ID: <54d8899b0901132202o4b5c5e18m813f4346bdcedee7@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I am trying to create a webrobot in python that does the following.
Send a post query to google.com and print the result.
I have not had any luck with pydocs and online code examples.
I keep on getting a 405 method not allowed.

Regards,
Dhaval
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From abpillai at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 07:21:11 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:51:11 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] need help in trying to create a python web bot
In-Reply-To: <54d8899b0901132202o4b5c5e18m813f4346bdcedee7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <54d8899b0901132202o4b5c5e18m813f4346bdcedee7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901132221g1ffe2992rfaee44380ffff2d6@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 11:32 AM, Dhaval Lilani <dlilani at google.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I am trying to create a webrobot in python that does the following.
> Send a post query to google.com and print the result.
> I have not had any luck with pydocs and online code examples.
> I keep on getting a 405 method not allowed.

Are you trying to call the search API ?  If so, the default urllib/urllib2
actions won't help you, since all these result in GET requests.
If you try to  use HTTP GET you will get "405 - Method not allowed".

You need to POST to this API. It is not directly possible using urllib/urllib2.
You can use httplib for this.

Also take a look at this recipe

http://code.activestate.com/recipes/146306/



>
> Regards,
> Dhaval
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>



-- 
-Anand

From orsenthil at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 07:29:14 2009
From: orsenthil at gmail.com (Senthil Kumaran)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:59:14 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] need help in trying to create a python web bot
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901132221g1ffe2992rfaee44380ffff2d6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <54d8899b0901132202o4b5c5e18m813f4346bdcedee7@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901132221g1ffe2992rfaee44380ffff2d6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c42eba10901132229s4bffc8f4g631d72c58e58ac7a@mail.gmail.com>

> Anand Balachandran Pillai  wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
> Are you trying to call the search API ?  If so, the default urllib/urllib2
> actions won't help you, since all these result in GET requests.
> If you try to  use HTTP GET you will get "405 - Method not allowed".
>
> You need to POST to this API. It is not directly possible using urllib/urllib2.
> You can use httplib for this.
>
> Also take a look at this recipe
>
> http://code.activestate.com/recipes/146306/

That would be good if you are trying with just the search and learning things.

For serious purposes, I would suggest you to look at pygoogle.sf.net,
the python wrapper around google SOAP APIs. Google search, spelling
suggestions comes at the call of a method. Mark Pilgirms book "Dive
into Python" has a section on Web Services where he gives a bare bones
introduction.

-- 
Senthil

From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 10:21:22 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 14:51:22 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Building Python Eggs
Message-ID: <547db2260901140121k2324e546pedf02ae0284a062f@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

I am just learning the basics of building Python eggs using
'setuptools'. What I have is the following code structure in a
top-down fashion:


- demo1.py
- __init.py__
- setup.py
-subpackage1
--__init.py/__


When I execute 'python setup.py bdist_egg' from the top-level
directory which has the 'setup.py' file:

__author__="amit"
__date__ ="$14 Jan, 2009 2:37:34 PM$"

from setuptools import setup,find_packages

setup (
 name = 'EggDemo',
 version = '0.1',
 Summary = 'Just another Python package for the cheese shop',
 author = 'amit',
 author_email = '',
 url = '',
 license = '',
 description= 'Long description of the package',
 platform= '',
 packages = find_packages(),
)

In the resulting, SOURCES.txt file, I have:

setup.py
EggDemo.egg-info/PKG-INFO
EggDemo.egg-info/SOURCES.txt
EggDemo.egg-info/dependency_links.txt
EggDemo.egg-info/top_level.txt
subpackage1/__init__.py


As you can see, the top-level 'demo1.py' is missing, even though I
have a '__init.py__' file there.

The manual at http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/setuptools#using-find-packages
makes me believe, this should work. Where am I going wrong?

Best,
Amit

-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
*Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in

From abpillai at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 10:44:11 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:14:11 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] from __past__ import PyHistory
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901140144l1e929f93yd86d53914a976f73@mail.gmail.com>

Guido has started a new blog where he will
recount the history of Python in a series of posts.

He has already made two posts so far.

http://python-history.blogspot.com/


Regards,
-- 
-Anand

From orsenthil at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 10:52:14 2009
From: orsenthil at gmail.com (Senthil Kumaran)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:22:14 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] from __past__ import PyHistory
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901140144l1e929f93yd86d53914a976f73@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8548c5f30901140144l1e929f93yd86d53914a976f73@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c42eba10901140152n773daf0cqb2a7200d4e9fb677@mail.gmail.com>

> Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote:
> Guido has started a new blog where he will
> recount the history of Python in a series of posts.
>
> He has already made two posts so far.
>
> http://python-history.blogspot.com/
>

I just thought, if he has added " from __past__ import PyHistory"
also. Hahaha. :-)

Have you read this discussion at Stackoverflow? Gives example for
every line in the zen of python.

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/228181/zen-of-python



-- 
Senthil

From abpillai at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 11:20:26 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:50:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] from __past__ import PyHistory
In-Reply-To: <7c42eba10901140152n773daf0cqb2a7200d4e9fb677@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8548c5f30901140144l1e929f93yd86d53914a976f73@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c42eba10901140152n773daf0cqb2a7200d4e9fb677@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901140220w4ffd30eaj56a0ba2245f79908@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 3:22 PM, Senthil Kumaran <orsenthil at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote:
>> Guido has started a new blog where he will
>> recount the history of Python in a series of posts.
>>
>> He has already made two posts so far.
>>
>> http://python-history.blogspot.com/
>>
>
> I just thought, if he has added " from __past__ import PyHistory"
> also. Hahaha. :-)
>
> Have you read this discussion at Stackoverflow? Gives example for
> every line in the zen of python.
>
> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/228181/zen-of-python
>

This is a good one and perhaps a good way of starting an exercise
right here. Can members reply with good, clean and lucid examples
for each of the "philosophy" in the Zen of Python ?

Here is one from me.

"Beautiful is better than Ugly"

1. Python arrays (lists)

one_two_three = [1,2,3]
for x in len(one_two_three):
       print one_two_three[x]

2. Perl arrays

@one_two_three = (1, 2, 3)
foreach $x (@one_two_three)
{
 print $x;
}

I think this is also an example for "Readability counts"...

Btw, in case it was not obvious 1 is beautiful and 2 is ugly :)

>
>
> --
> Senthil
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>


Regards
-- 
-Anand

From noufal at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 11:41:36 2009
From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:11:36 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] from __past__ import PyHistory
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901140220w4ffd30eaj56a0ba2245f79908@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8548c5f30901140144l1e929f93yd86d53914a976f73@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c42eba10901140152n773daf0cqb2a7200d4e9fb677@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901140220w4ffd30eaj56a0ba2245f79908@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9963e56e0901140241h1eb69ca5ha189d5ba1488555a@mail.gmail.com>

>
>
> one_two_three = [1,2,3]
> for x in len(one_two_three):
>       print one_two_three[x]
>

Surely, you meant

for x in one_two_three:
   print x

?




-- 
~noufal
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From orsenthil at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 12:04:09 2009
From: orsenthil at gmail.com (Senthil Kumaran)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:34:09 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] from __past__ import PyHistory
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901140220w4ffd30eaj56a0ba2245f79908@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8548c5f30901140144l1e929f93yd86d53914a976f73@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c42eba10901140152n773daf0cqb2a7200d4e9fb677@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901140220w4ffd30eaj56a0ba2245f79908@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c42eba10901140304u49f201co28a0a1ad5e2dfe1@mail.gmail.com>

> "Beautiful is better than Ugly"
>

ZEN: Special cases aren't special enough to break the rules.

1) Character being a string datatype of length 1 illustrates that.
There is no character datatype.

This is opposite way of thinking that string is an array of
characters, making character as the special case of string.  I think
this is influenced from a VHLL perspective that strings will be more
often used.

>>> name = "String"
>>> type(name)
<type 'str'>
>>> type(name[0])
<type 'str'>
>>>

In C,
you explicitly define an array of characters for a string and deal
with them as a array.

2) Iteration through string like lists illustrates this point again.

for char in "String":
      print char

I dont know any other VHLL, so some one can provide an example.

And just while writing this, I think comparing C and Python is wrong.
They are from different generations.  Python should be compared with
any other dynamic programming language.




-- 
Senthil

From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Wed Jan 14 12:46:23 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2009 17:16:23 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Building Python Eggs
In-Reply-To: <547db2260901140121k2324e546pedf02ae0284a062f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <547db2260901140121k2324e546pedf02ae0284a062f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901140346g6a1689aerdfc594910a73c1f1@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 2:51 PM, Amit k. Saha <amitsaha.in at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am just learning the basics of building Python eggs using
> 'setuptools'. What I have is the following code structure in a
> top-down fashion:
>
>
> - demo1.py
> - __init.py__
> - setup.py
> -subpackage1
> --__init.py/__
>
>
> When I execute 'python setup.py bdist_egg' from the top-level
> directory which has the 'setup.py' file:
>
> __author__="amit"
> __date__ ="$14 Jan, 2009 2:37:34 PM$"
>
> from setuptools import setup,find_packages
>
> setup (
>  name = 'EggDemo',
>  version = '0.1',
>  Summary = 'Just another Python package for the cheese shop',
>  author = 'amit',
>  author_email = '',
>  url = '',
>  license = '',
>  description= 'Long description of the package',
>  platform= '',
>  packages = find_packages(),
> )
>
> In the resulting, SOURCES.txt file, I have:
>
> setup.py
> EggDemo.egg-info/PKG-INFO
> EggDemo.egg-info/SOURCES.txt
> EggDemo.egg-info/dependency_links.txt
> EggDemo.egg-info/top_level.txt
> subpackage1/__init__.py
>
>
> As you can see, the top-level 'demo1.py' is missing, even though I
> have a '__init.py__' file there.
>
> The manual at http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/setuptools#using-find-packages
> makes me believe, this should work. Where am I going wrong?

I have solved this.

-Amit


>
> Best,
> Amit
>
> --
> Amit Kumar Saha
> http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
> http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
> *Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
*Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in

From sibteym at infotechsw.com  Thu Jan 15 06:41:57 2009
From: sibteym at infotechsw.com (Sibtey Mehdi)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 11:11:57 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing  multiprocessing
Message-ID: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>

I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
advantage of multiple cores. I have created two

Separate process something like this.

que = Queue 

Process(target = geDataFromMdbFile, args=(que , section, MdbFile,)).start()
#2 times

 

In geDataFromMdbFile function I create the object and add in to queue
(que.put (object)).

After that I fetch the object using que.get () and use in my application.
but it takes more time

To get the data.

Any one can help me out this problem.

 

 

Thanks,

Sibtey Mehdi 

 

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From venkat83 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 07:32:51 2009
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:02:51 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
Message-ID: <a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com>wrote:

>  I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
> advantage of multiple cores.
>
How is this possible? Elucidate plz.

-V-
http://twitter.com/venkat83
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From venkat83 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 07:32:51 2009
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:02:51 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
Message-ID: <a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com>wrote:

>  I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
> advantage of multiple cores.
>
How is this possible? Elucidate plz.

-V-
http://twitter.com/venkat83
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From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 07:42:01 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:12:01 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901142242v291063d5saaa09f0f4427c1a9@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
>> advantage of multiple cores.
>
> How is this possible? Elucidate plz.

I am not sure, if there is a way to tell: Process1 -> core1 and
Process2 -> Core2

I am interested to know, more though.

-Amit

>
> -V-
> http://twitter.com/venkat83
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
*Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in

From abpillai at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 07:42:46 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:12:46 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901142242k44724190x16bf730a38c02d49@mail.gmail.com>

The new multiprocessing module in py3k allows you
to do just that.

In short, this module allows you to do processor based
threading without getting blocked by the GIL.

--Anand

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
>> advantage of multiple cores.
>
> How is this possible? Elucidate plz.
>
> -V-
> http://twitter.com/venkat83
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>



-- 
-Anand

From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 07:44:44 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:14:44 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901142242k44724190x16bf730a38c02d49@mail.gmail.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901142242k44724190x16bf730a38c02d49@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901142244p6ddb8c4as2cf6df42802de971@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Anand Balachandran Pillai
<abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:
> The new multiprocessing module in py3k allows you
> to do just that.

Looks like it is there in 2.6:
http://docs.python.org/library/multiprocessing.html

>
> In short, this module allows you to do processor based
> threading without getting blocked by the GIL.

On GIL: http://smoothspan.wordpress.com/2007/09/14/guido-is-right-to-leave-the-gil-in-python-not-for-multicore-but-for-utility-computing/

-Amit


>
> --Anand
>
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
>>> advantage of multiple cores.
>>
>> How is this possible? Elucidate plz.
>>
>> -V-
>> http://twitter.com/venkat83
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> -Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
*Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in

From abpillai at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 07:47:43 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:17:43 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <547db2260901142244p6ddb8c4as2cf6df42802de971@mail.gmail.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901142242k44724190x16bf730a38c02d49@mail.gmail.com>
	<547db2260901142244p6ddb8c4as2cf6df42802de971@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901142247x207fa597h206ed93b9b0675a0@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:14 PM, Amit k. Saha <amitsaha.in at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Anand Balachandran Pillai
> <abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:
>> The new multiprocessing module in py3k allows you
>> to do just that.
>
> Looks like it is there in 2.6:
> http://docs.python.org/library/multiprocessing.html

Yes, it was pepped for 2.6/3.0.

http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0371/

The original project from which this module came is here,
http://pyprocessing.berlios.de/

>
>>
>> In short, this module allows you to do processor based
>> threading without getting blocked by the GIL.
>
> On GIL: http://smoothspan.wordpress.com/2007/09/14/guido-is-right-to-leave-the-gil-in-python-not-for-multicore-but-for-utility-computing/
>
> -Amit
>
>
>>
>> --Anand
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
>>>> advantage of multiple cores.
>>>
>>> How is this possible? Elucidate plz.
>>>
>>> -V-
>>> http://twitter.com/venkat83
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BangPypers mailing list
>>> BangPypers at python.org
>>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -Anand
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Amit Kumar Saha
> http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
> http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
> *Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
-Anand

From sibteym at infotechsw.com  Thu Jan 15 08:01:49 2009
From: sibteym at infotechsw.com (Sibtey Mehdi)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:31:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901142242k44724190x16bf730a38c02d49@mail.gmail.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com><a3b05e8b0901142232l2da1fd30mb8d3c888bc2c0194@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901142242k44724190x16bf730a38c02d49@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <018e01c976df$2320b360$5fc513ac@pwit.com>

If the created object in the process is not heavy then it seems to be
working fine. How I will communicate with the process if the object is
heavy. I have ported my application to python 2.6.1 to implement the
multiprocessing.

Thanks,
Sibtey

Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote:

The new multiprocessing module in py3k allows you
to do just that.

In short, this module allows you to do processor based
threading without getting blocked by the GIL.

--Anand

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
>> advantage of multiple cores.
>
> How is this possible? Elucidate plz.
>
> -V-
> http://twitter.com/venkat83
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>



-- 
-Anand
_______________________________________________
BangPypers mailing list
BangPypers at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers


From abpillai at gmail.com  Thu Jan 15 08:02:12 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:32:12 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem in implementing multiprocessing
In-Reply-To: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
References: <015801c976d3$fad80d50$5fc513ac@pwit.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901142302y64f007abm761d18813559bfa6@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Sibtey Mehdi <sibteym at infotechsw.com> wrote:
> I am trying to implement the multiprocessing in my application to take
> advantage of multiple cores. I have created two
>
> Separate process something like this.
>
> que = Queue
>
> Process(target = geDataFromMdbFile, args=(que , section, MdbFile,)).start()
> #2 times
>
>
>
> In geDataFromMdbFile function I create the object and add in to queue
> (que.put (object)).
>
> After that I fetch the object using que.get () and use in my application.
> but it takes more time

Since this is a new module I don't think many people here will
be able to help you out. Like, I was just reading the module documentation
and trying out some sample code when I saw your email...

The multiprocessing module provides a bunch of features like
Queue, Pool, worker processes, shared memory etc. But, it is not
very clear which feature to select for a particular class of problem.
The module documentation does not help much in this.

Btw, here is a presentation from Jesse Noller on multiprocessing.
I think it might be useful.

http://jessenoller.com/code/pyworks.pdf

This is question for c.l.py. Post your code there.

>
> To get the data.
>
> Any one can help me out this problem.
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Sibtey Mehdi
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>


Regards,

-- 
-Anand

From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 15:20:08 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 19:50:08 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Why is my app not faster with Multi-processing?
Message-ID: <547db2260901160620o8b17184k2c48c87d427eab74@mail.gmail.com>

Recent postings on the list has been on Multi-processing, which makes
this link: http://jessenoller.com/2009/01/16/why-is-my-app-not-faster-with-multiprocessing/
pretty relevant!

Best
-Amit

-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
*Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in

From sridhar.ratna at gmail.com  Fri Jan 16 19:21:42 2009
From: sridhar.ratna at gmail.com (Sridhar Ratnakumar)
Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 10:21:42 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] hi all
In-Reply-To: <876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <959452bf0811070635q4da49366oaf3c253240da16a2@mail.gmail.com>
	<876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7c73a13a0901161021qdcf6021h1b1bf39144fe5ab@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 7:18 AM, shridhar kyrlageri
<shridhar_c_k at yahoo.com> wrote:
> hi..
>  i m an engineering student.. i want to be a very good programmer... but i
> dont know where to start and what to do... can u please help me..

Hi Shridhar,

The best way for me to get started was by *writing* programs. I
started with computers by learning C - I remember completing every
exercise problems in the C book I picked up for learning no matter how
long it took for me. For example, I spent about 2 hours in writing a
program to print the multiplication table from 1x1 to 10x10. It was
the fascination at seeing a program do what one intended it to do that
drove me to complete any program.

Practice coupled with the fascination makes you a good programmer.

As for getting started with Python, you can peruse this page -
http://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide

From jeff at taupro.com  Sat Jan 17 07:48:21 2009
From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush)
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 00:48:21 -0600
Subject: [BangPypers] hi all
In-Reply-To: <7c73a13a0901161021qdcf6021h1b1bf39144fe5ab@mail.gmail.com>
References: <959452bf0811070635q4da49366oaf3c253240da16a2@mail.gmail.com>	<876848.12851.qm@web45414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
	<7c73a13a0901161021qdcf6021h1b1bf39144fe5ab@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <49717F35.8090202@taupro.com>

Sridhar Ratnakumar wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 7:18 AM, shridhar kyrlageri
> <shridhar_c_k at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>  i m an engineering student.. i want to be a very good programmer... but i
>> dont know where to start and what to do... can u please help me..
> 
> The best way for me to get started was by *writing* programs. I
> started with computers by learning C - I remember completing every
> exercise problems in the C book I picked up for learning no matter how
> long it took for me. For example, I spent about 2 hours in writing a
> program to print the multiplication table from 1x1 to 10x10. It was
> the fascination at seeing a program do what one intended it to do that
> drove me to complete any program.
> 
> Practice coupled with the fascination makes you a good programmer.

Good advice but I would add "reading" a lot of programs as well.  You'll never
by yourself come up with all the various approaches to a problem so go read
how other people do it and add those to your set of techniques.  And with the
rise of Open Source there are plenty of programs to study the internals of.
Heck, just reading the source of the Twisted framework will teach you some
really cool things about Python programming (those guys were *smart*!).

I suggest learning to read C source even if you don't program in it, because
the underlying infrastructure of the software world uses it so much.  I've
studied the C code of the Python interpreter and certain modules to gain an
appreciation of how it works and its limits.  Sometimes you need to read the C
source of a library before wrapping it in Python or maybe the docs are for the
C API.

In a career of programming, you'll read far more source then you'll ever
write. ;-)

-Jeff


From abpillai at gmail.com  Sat Jan 17 09:46:08 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 14:16:08 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Python Companies Info
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901170046x441c3212jee82b4f673d8a6b1@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

     If your company is using Python, please add its
name in this wiki.

http://wiki.python.org/moin/BangPypers/PythonCompaniesInIndia

I see only ZeOmega in there. Please try to add India
specific companies. I mean don't add Google there,
for example :)

Thanks

-- 
-Anand

From chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com  Sat Jan 17 12:34:07 2009
From: chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com (Chetan Nichkawde)
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 17:04:07 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
Message-ID: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

  The only way to learn programming is to program. I learnt C++ when I was
in high school and I remember getting intimidated by some of the problems
posed. I thought I cannot do it. But when I gave it a try it happened and a
whole new world of programming opened to me. One of the problem posed by my
teacher was to place 8 queens on a chess board so that no queen is able to
cancel any other queen. During those days (1997) there was no internet and I
hail from small town called Dhanbad. I went after the problem and cracked
it. For many years, I thought I was the only person who can solve the
problem in that way. When I came to software industry I came to know that
kind of algorithm is known as backtracking algorithm. Was I a computer wiz
or something? Imagining backtracking algorithm in class XI in high school. I
don't think so. You just have to apply yourself and be creative. Python is
great language to start learning programming although certain concepts like
pointers is also a must know for a programmer.

Chetan

-- 
Senior Analyst
Outdu MediaTech Pvt Ltd
Mobile: 9900262140
linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/chetan/nichkawde
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Sat Jan 17 13:06:30 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 17:36:30 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901171736.31194.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Saturday 17 Jan 2009 5:04:07 pm Chetan Nichkawde wrote:
> ? The only way to learn programming is to program.

I have been writing code since 1986, but never considered myself a programmer. 
My code does what is needed and doesn't crash, but most of it is cut and 
paste and repair without really knowing what I was doing. This year I decided 
to do something about it. I remember reading somewhere about setting oneself 
small problems and incrementally increasing the complexity. Rather like going 
to the driving range of a golf course now and then to shore up the 
fundamentals. At the same time I am too busy (and not the type) to take a 
book and work at it from beginning to end.

At the same time I have to keep to deadlines and produce working 
applications - so what I do now is: Every day open the Python cookbook at 
random and work on whatever recipe it opens at. Try to customise it. Often it 
is stuff that I know (or think I know). I do it anyway - one recipe. 
Thorough. The first one happened to be writing a class to convert 
temperatures from any scale to any other - that took me three days exploring 
all the highways and byways it opened up.

Coding against deadlines does not really help one improve one's skills - the 
deadline is there, so one repeats what one already knows and resorts to ugly 
hacks and compromises. Also workarounds since there is no time to learn 
something new.


-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Mon Jan 19 08:04:16 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 12:34:16 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
Message-ID: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

hi,

after a long gap, am setting up a plone site. I wanted it served through 
apache, and have this in my apache conf:

<VirtualHost *:80>
    ServerName foo.org.in
    ServerAlias www.k-dialogue.org.in
    ServerAdmin webmaster at nrcfosshelpline.in
    ProxyPass / 
http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/foo.org.in:80/foo/VirtualHostRoot/
    ProxyPassReverse / 
http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/foo.org.in:80/foo/VirtualHostRoot/

<Directory />
        Options FollowSymLinks
        AllowOverride None
        Order deny,allow
        allow from all
</Directory>
</VirtualHost>

Now I get 'forbidden you cannot access / on this server'. Any clues?

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From sree at mahiti.org  Mon Jan 19 08:37:17 2009
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 13:07:17 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
In-Reply-To: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <313529610901182337n1a973574n359db21245b337a9@mail.gmail.com>

in proxy.conf you will have to allow traffic from localhost.
- sree

2009/1/19 Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>

> hi,
>
> after a long gap, am setting up a plone site. I wanted it served through
> apache, and have this in my apache conf:
>
> <VirtualHost *:80>
>    ServerName foo.org.in
>    ServerAlias www.k-dialogue.org.in
>    ServerAdmin webmaster at nrcfosshelpline.in
>    ProxyPass /
>
> http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/foo.org.in:80/foo/VirtualHostRoot/
>    ProxyPassReverse /
>
> http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/foo.org.in:80/foo/VirtualHostRoot/
>
> <Directory />
>        Options FollowSymLinks
>        AllowOverride None
>        Order deny,allow
>        allow from all
> </Directory>
> </VirtualHost>
>
> Now I get 'forbidden you cannot access / on this server'. Any clues?
>
> --
> regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Associate
> NRC-FOSS
> http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Sreekanth S Rameshaiah
Executive Director
Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
# 33-34, 2nd Floor,
Hennur Cross, Hennur Road,
Bangalore, India - 560043
Phone:  +91 80 4115 0580/1
Mobile:  +91 98455 12611
www.mahiti.org
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Mon Jan 19 08:53:38 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 13:23:38 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
In-Reply-To: <313529610901182337n1a973574n359db21245b337a9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<313529610901182337n1a973574n359db21245b337a9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901191323.39262.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Monday 19 Jan 2009 1:07:17 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> in proxy.conf you will have to allow traffic from localhost.

I put 'Allow from localhost' in proxy.conf - still same error

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From sree at mahiti.org  Mon Jan 19 09:02:46 2009
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 13:32:46 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
In-Reply-To: <200901191323.39262.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<313529610901182337n1a973574n359db21245b337a9@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901191323.39262.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <313529610901190002i55d21330o9536d96a49db36b1@mail.gmail.com>

2009/1/19 Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>

> On Monday 19 Jan 2009 1:07:17 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> > in proxy.conf you will have to allow traffic from localhost.
>
> I put 'Allow from localhost' in proxy.conf - still same error


What does error log say?
- sree
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Mon Jan 19 09:11:00 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 13:41:00 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
In-Reply-To: <313529610901190002i55d21330o9536d96a49db36b1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<200901191323.39262.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<313529610901190002i55d21330o9536d96a49db36b1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901191341.01297.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Monday 19 Jan 2009 1:32:46 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> 2009/1/19 Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>
>
> > On Monday 19 Jan 2009 1:07:17 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> > > in proxy.conf you will have to allow traffic from localhost.
> >
> > I put 'Allow from localhost' in proxy.conf - still same error
>
> What does error log say?

[Mon Jan 19 09:09:07 2009] [error] [client 219.64.73.33] client denied by 
server configuration: 
proxy:http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/k-dialogueindia.org.in:80/kdialogue/VirtualHostRoot/
[Mon Jan 19 09:09:07 2009] [error] [client 219.64.73.33] client denied by 
server configuration: 
proxy:http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/k-dialogueindia.org.in:80/kdialogue/VirtualHostRoot/error/HTTP_FORBIDDEN.html.var

actual unedited log so that any typo can be seen


-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Mon Jan 19 10:45:32 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 15:15:32 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
In-Reply-To: <313529610901190056i6b855298ld36a28461c87443e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<200901191341.01297.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<313529610901190056i6b855298ld36a28461c87443e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901191515.32824.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Monday 19 Jan 2009 2:26:21 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> > http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/k-dialogueindia.org.in:80/kdia
> >logue/VirtualHostRoot/error/HTTP_FORBIDDEN.html.var
> >
> > actual unedited log so that any typo can be seen
>
> Traffic is not from loaclhost. Ifs from 219.x.x.x
> I suggest that you look in to it.

that is my IP - anyway I put 'allow from all' in proxy.conf and it worked. But 
that looks dangerous.

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From sree at mahiti.org  Mon Jan 19 11:01:50 2009
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 15:31:50 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
In-Reply-To: <200901191515.32824.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<200901191341.01297.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<313529610901190056i6b855298ld36a28461c87443e@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901191515.32824.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <313529610901190201j57d48e16h2b2eafac51fcc5ff@mail.gmail.com>

2009/1/19 Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>

> On Monday 19 Jan 2009 2:26:21 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> > >
> http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/k-dialogueindia.org.in:80/kdia
> > >logue/VirtualHostRoot/error/HTTP_FORBIDDEN.html.var
> > >
> > > actual unedited log so that any typo can be seen
> >
> > Traffic is not from loaclhost. Ifs from 219.x.x.x
> > I suggest that you look in to it.
>
> that is my IP - anyway I put 'allow from all' in proxy.conf and it worked.
> But
> that looks dangerous.
>
> --
> regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Associate
> NRC-FOSS
> http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/
>



-- 
Sreekanth S Rameshaiah
Executive Director
Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
# 33-34, 2nd Floor,
Hennur Cross, Hennur Road,
Bangalore, India - 560043
Phone:  +91 80 4115 0580/1
Mobile:  +91 98455 12611
www.mahiti.org
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Mon Jan 19 11:21:17 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 15:51:17 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] problem accessing a plone site
In-Reply-To: <313529610901190201j57d48e16h2b2eafac51fcc5ff@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200901191234.16857.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<200901191515.32824.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<313529610901190201j57d48e16h2b2eafac51fcc5ff@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901191551.17690.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

blank mail?

On Monday 19 Jan 2009 3:31:50 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> 2009/1/19 Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>
>
> > On Monday 19 Jan 2009 2:26:21 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> >
> > http://localhost:8081/VirtualHostBase/http/k-dialogueindia.org.in:80/kdia
> >
> > > >logue/VirtualHostRoot/error/HTTP_FORBIDDEN.html.var
> > > >
> > > > actual unedited log so that any typo can be seen
> > >
> > > Traffic is not from loaclhost. Ifs from 219.x.x.x
> > > I suggest that you look in to it.
> >
> > that is my IP - anyway I put 'allow from all' in proxy.conf and it
> > worked. But
> > that looks dangerous.
> >
> > --
> > regards
> > Kenneth Gonsalves
> > Associate
> > NRC-FOSS
> > http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/



-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From pdiwadkar at yahoo.com  Wed Jan 21 05:56:38 2009
From: pdiwadkar at yahoo.com (prasanna diwadkar)
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 20:56:38 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

?
Hi,
I think Chetan is right. Algorithms play important role.I am not biased towards specific language but I have found those how have programmed? in C/C++ are generally better(in problem solving)?than who program in other languages.This is not to say Python/Java etc ?are bad but C/C++ forces ?you to learn(without copy paste!) unlike java/Python where JDK provides all methods in API.Ofcourse this has happened because software apps have grown big in size and complexities than in 80s/90s where C/C++ were predominant.
Thanks
PD
?
?
--- On Sat, 1/17/09, Chetan Nichkawde <chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Chetan Nichkawde <chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com>
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
To: bangpypers at python.org
Date: Saturday, January 17, 2009, 3:34 AM


Hi,

? The only way to learn programming is to program. I learnt C++ when I was in high school and I remember getting intimidated by some of the problems posed. I thought I cannot do it. But when I gave it a try it happened and a whole new world of programming opened to me. One of the problem posed by my teacher was to place 8 queens on a chess board so that no queen is able to cancel any other queen. During those days (1997) there was no internet and I hail from small town called Dhanbad. I went after the problem and cracked it. For many years, I thought I was the only person who can solve the problem in that way. When I came to software industry I came to know that kind of algorithm is known as backtracking algorithm. Was I a computer wiz or something? Imagining backtracking algorithm in class XI in high school. I don't think so. You just have to apply yourself and be creative. Python is great language to start learning programming although certain
 concepts like pointers is also a must know for a programmer.

Chetan 

-- 
Senior Analyst
Outdu MediaTech Pvt Ltd
Mobile: 9900262140
linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/chetan/nichkawde
_______________________________________________
BangPypers mailing list
BangPypers at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers



      
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From anandology at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 06:15:30 2009
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 10:45:30 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <41139fcb0901202115m6705240dsbb4b58c9d9543a3a@mail.gmail.com>

> Algorithms play important role.I am not biased
> towards specific language but I have found those how have programmed  in
> C/C++ are generally better(in problem solving) than who program in other
> languages.

I completely disagree.

If you want to learn algorithms, then you better work with a
higher-level language that let you work without getting into lower
level details of bit and bytes.

Here is an article by a computer science prof saying why Python is the
best language for learning algorithms.

http://www.ece.uci.edu/~chou/py02/python.html

> This is not to say Python/Java etc  are bad but C/C++ forces  you
> to learn(without copy paste!) unlike java/Python where JDK provides all
> methods in API.Ofcourse this has happened because software apps have grown
> big in size and complexities than in 80s/90s where C/C++ were predominant.

The standard library of c/c++ is not powerful enough that you have to
keep carrying or copy-paste your favorite utilities in every program.

"Greenspun's Tenth Rule of Programming: any sufficiently complicated C
or Fortran program contains an ad hoc informally-specified bug-ridden
slow implementation of half of Common Lisp."

From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 06:18:51 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 10:48:51 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [commercial] Python Programmer Consultants
Message-ID: <4976B03B.4040505@gmail.com>

Hi,
Our company is looking for Python Programmers as Consultants to take up 
certain development work (new projects and maintenance/improvement), 
especially having experience with Plone. Please drop me a mail off the 
list if you are interested and available to know more information.

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Wed Jan 21 06:21:21 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 10:51:21 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <200901211051.22975.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Wednesday 21 Jan 2009 10:26:38 am prasanna diwadkar wrote:
> languages.This is not to say Python/Java etc ?are bad but C/C++ forces ?you
> to learn(without copy paste!)

how does it force you to learn without copy/paste? Can you not copy/paste in 
C/C++?

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From srini at nanolets.in  Wed Jan 21 06:26:37 2009
From: srini at nanolets.in (Nanolets nanolets)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 10:56:37 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [commercial] Python Programmer Consultants
In-Reply-To: <4976B03B.4040505@gmail.com>
References: <4976B03B.4040505@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a5eab14c0901202126v23228fb8v65e6c3612165214e@mail.gmail.com>

We have some experience with Plone. We are basically a HR shop training
freshers
for placement. We have place people into Mahiti/Zeomega.

We can build a team for your project.

I have about 15 years of Industry exprience in building product development
teams.

Regards,
Srini.
9844635800.

On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Parthan SR <parth.technofreak at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi,
> Our company is looking for Python Programmers as Consultants to take up
> certain development work (new projects and maintenance/improvement),
> especially having experience with Plone. Please drop me a mail off the list
> if you are interested and available to know more information.
>
> --
> ---
> With Regards,
>
> Parthan "technofreak"
> <gpg>  2FF01026
> <blog> http://blog.technofreak.in
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
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From srini at nanolets.in  Wed Jan 21 06:28:39 2009
From: srini at nanolets.in (Nanolets nanolets)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 10:58:39 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [commercial] Python Programmer Consultants
In-Reply-To: <4976B03B.4040505@gmail.com>
References: <4976B03B.4040505@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a5eab14c0901202128i446d20f1j73b9a6fe47266982@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Bangpypers,

I apologise. The reply was meant to go to parthan. Unfortunately It got
posted into Bangpypers.

Regards
Srini.


On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Parthan SR <parth.technofreak at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hi,
> Our company is looking for Python Programmers as Consultants to take up
> certain development work (new projects and maintenance/improvement),
> especially having experience with Plone. Please drop me a mail off the list
> if you are interested and available to know more information.
>
> --
> ---
> With Regards,
>
> Parthan "technofreak"
> <gpg>  2FF01026
> <blog> http://blog.technofreak.in
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
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From amitsaha.in at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 06:44:36 2009
From: amitsaha.in at gmail.com (Amit k. Saha)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 11:14:36 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <41139fcb0901202115m6705240dsbb4b58c9d9543a3a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<41139fcb0901202115m6705240dsbb4b58c9d9543a3a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <547db2260901202144q5feadf52n3f4f502842f0ffe1@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:45 AM, Anand Chitipothu <anandology at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Algorithms play important role.I am not biased
>> towards specific language but I have found those how have programmed  in
>> C/C++ are generally better(in problem solving) than who program in other
>> languages.
>
> I completely disagree.
>
> If you want to learn algorithms, then you better work with a
> higher-level language that let you work without getting into lower
> level details of bit and bytes.
>
> Here is an article by a computer science prof saying why Python is the
> best language for learning algorithms.
>
> http://www.ece.uci.edu/~chou/py02/python.html

<This is a good read >

-Amit

>
>> This is not to say Python/Java etc  are bad but C/C++ forces  you
>> to learn(without copy paste!) unlike java/Python where JDK provides all
>> methods in API.Ofcourse this has happened because software apps have grown
>> big in size and complexities than in 80s/90s where C/C++ were predominant.
>
> The standard library of c/c++ is not powerful enough that you have to
> keep carrying or copy-paste your favorite utilities in every program.
>
> "Greenspun's Tenth Rule of Programming: any sufficiently complicated C
> or Fortran program contains an ad hoc informally-specified bug-ridden
> slow implementation of half of Common Lisp."
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Amit Kumar Saha
http://amitksaha.blogspot.com
http://amitsaha.in.googlepages.com/
*Bangalore Open Java Users Group*:http:www.bojug.in

From noufal at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 07:11:05 2009
From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 11:41:05 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9963e56e0901202211p5d4c3b93n175a416babac5bc8@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:26 AM, prasanna diwadkar <pdiwadkar at yahoo.com>wrote:

>
> Hi,
> I think Chetan is right. Algorithms play important role.I am not biased
> towards specific language but I have found those how have programmed  in
> C/C++ are generally better(in problem solving) than who program in other
> languages.
>

Algorithms are definitely important but more often than not, C (I'm not sure
about C++) programmers. Atleast the newbies spend more time debugging memory
corruption issues and edge conditions rather than focussing on algorithms.

-- 
~noufal
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From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 07:20:20 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 11:50:20 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [commercial] Python Programmer Consultants
In-Reply-To: <a5eab14c0901202126v23228fb8v65e6c3612165214e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4976B03B.4040505@gmail.com>
	<a5eab14c0901202126v23228fb8v65e6c3612165214e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4976BEA4.60806@gmail.com>


>
> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Parthan SR 
> <parth.technofreak at gmail.com <mailto:parth.technofreak at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     Hi,
>     Our company is looking for Python Programmers as Consultants to
>     take up certain development work (new projects and
>     maintenance/improvement), especially having experience with Plone.
>     Please drop me a mail off the list if you are interested and
>     available to know more information.
>
>
Errr. Sorry, it's Pylons (with PostgreSQL as backend) and not Plone. 
Indulging in discussions when writing a mail can make you error prone :D

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 07:36:23 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 12:06:23 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] [commercial] Python Programmer Consultants
Message-ID: <4976C267.3010303@gmail.com>

Hi,
Our company is looking for Python Programmers as Consultants to take up
certain development work (new projects and maintenance/improvement),
especially having experience with Pylons (with PostgreSQL as DB backend).

*Note* Please drop me a mail __off the list__ if you are interested and 
available, to know more information.

(Reposting as suggested by Anand)

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in



From venkat83 at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 07:37:23 2009
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 12:07:23 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <9963e56e0901202211p5d4c3b93n175a416babac5bc8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<9963e56e0901202211p5d4c3b93n175a416babac5bc8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a3b05e8b0901202237h62eae5f0uf4ed2321fbe6c4b2@mail.gmail.com>

A language is a tool to solve a problem. Each of the problem(s) has its own
characteristics, which makes us to choose one among the many languages
around - and hence the choice of the best tool to solve that problem.

Language/OS wars are to stay. Lets either participate and yap, or stay put
with our wisdom and chip in when false claims are made.

IMHO, C/C++, Java and Python(along with DB stuff) are a good set to start
off and learn more advanced stuff. Each of the these languages has its own
set of good and bad things, which is beautiful when one understands them.

Learning numerous languages which have their own paradigm also helps in
understanding the nuances of the 'tools' and better appreciate/criticize the
so called 'language features'.

-V-
http://twitter.com/venkat83
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Wed Jan 21 09:07:28 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 13:37:28 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] plone through apache giving trouble
Message-ID: <200901211337.28834.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

hi,
I have a plone site. I can access it directly through the foo.com:8081 link 
and it runs fine. When accessing the same site through apache, it often times 
out. What could be the problem?

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From sree at mahiti.org  Wed Jan 21 09:30:34 2009
From: sree at mahiti.org (Sreekanth S Rameshaiah)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 14:00:34 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] plone through apache giving trouble
In-Reply-To: <200901211337.28834.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <200901211337.28834.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <313529610901210030r1f18e13cuda34e848543956d0@mail.gmail.com>

2009/1/21 Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org>

> hi,
> I have a plone site. I can access it directly through the foo.com:8081link
> and it runs fine. When accessing the same site through apache, it often
> times
> out. What could be the problem?


If you are using the rewrite rule, enable rewrite log. You will be bale to
analyse the problem better. But it looks like the request is not reaching
Zope.
- sree


>
>
> --
> regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Associate
> NRC-FOSS
> http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Sreekanth S Rameshaiah
Executive Director
Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
# 33-34, 2nd Floor,
Hennur Cross, Hennur Road,
Bangalore, India - 560043
Phone:  +91 80 4115 0580/1
Mobile:  +91 98455 12611
www.mahiti.org
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Wed Jan 21 10:56:45 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:26:45 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] plone through apache giving trouble
In-Reply-To: <313529610901210030r1f18e13cuda34e848543956d0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200901211337.28834.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<313529610901210030r1f18e13cuda34e848543956d0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901211526.46109.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Wednesday 21 Jan 2009 2:00:34 pm Sreekanth S Rameshaiah wrote:
> > I have a plone site. I can access it directly through the
> > foo.com:8081link and it runs fine. When accessing the same site through
> > apache, it often times
> > out. What could be the problem?
>
> If you are using the rewrite rule, enable rewrite log. You will be bale to
> analyse the problem better. But it looks like the request is not reaching
> Zope.

am using proxy pass - when I use that, at times apache freezes also. I have 
now disabled using zope through apache, and everything is fine. I will leave 
the production server as it is and experiment on a local box.

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From sridhar.ratna at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 19:19:19 2009
From: sridhar.ratna at gmail.com (Sridhar Ratnakumar)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 10:19:19 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <a3b05e8b0901202237h62eae5f0uf4ed2321fbe6c4b2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<9963e56e0901202211p5d4c3b93n175a416babac5bc8@mail.gmail.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901202237h62eae5f0uf4ed2321fbe6c4b2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c73a13a0901211019l738b0d62r4ff0c38660db0e36@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 10:37 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
> A language is a tool to solve a problem. Each of the problem(s) has its own
> characteristics, which makes us to choose one among the many languages
> around - and hence the choice of the best tool to solve that problem.

I'd add that practically the best tool depends on not just technical
criteria but also the tool familiarity and willingness of the
developers to learn a new tool.

Also, while languages can be /just/ tools to solve problems, the
choice of a programming language during the learning phase greatly
affects your programming skills. For example, programming abstractions
are best studied by using, say, any of the Lisp family of languages
but not C or C++.

"Programs must be written for people to read, and only incidentally
for machines to execute." - Abelson & Sussman

From orsenthil at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 19:33:17 2009
From: orsenthil at gmail.com (Senthil Kumaran)
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 00:03:17 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Woonerf and Python - Article by Ian Bicking
Message-ID: <7c42eba10901211033n5f9e5711md7f857371f5fb5a6@mail.gmail.com>

Ian Bicking has written a nice article titled "Woonerf and Python".
http://blog.ianbicking.org/2009/01/16/woonerf-and-python/

Makes an important statement at the end, that as the Python gains
popularity will be able to sustain the high traffic needs of users
with various different objectives.



-- 
Senthil

From abpillai at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 22:04:41 2009
From: abpillai at gmail.com (Anand Balachandran Pillai)
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 02:34:41 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <7c73a13a0901211019l738b0d62r4ff0c38660db0e36@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<9963e56e0901202211p5d4c3b93n175a416babac5bc8@mail.gmail.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901202237h62eae5f0uf4ed2321fbe6c4b2@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c73a13a0901211019l738b0d62r4ff0c38660db0e36@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>

Algorithms are mathematical descriptions of solving
a problem. Algorithms can be illustrated in pseudo code
and proved using algebra and discrete mathematics.

It is important not to confuse between an algorithm
and its implementation in a programming language.
It is true that some languages are more suited to
solving problems in a certain way, than others. Due
to the language elements supported by different
languages, solutions might vary.

For example, many things can be done in C++ templates,
for which you may not be able draw parallels in other languages.
A lisp algorithm might look more "elegant" in the eyes
of a Lisper than anything else. A Pythonista might swear
for the beauty of his code over similar C/C++ code.
These are just variations in viewpoint and don't
illustrate anything fundamentally different between the
languages.

Programming languages are tools to solve problems.

Most often, a language might be more suitable to the
problem at hand than other ones. This is often determined
by things like time & cost constraints, skill availability,
freely available software in that language, performance
considerations etc than any perceived superiority of
the language.

I never understood language wars. Got a programming
language you love, good. But such comparisons are frankly
a waste of time...

--Anand

On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 11:49 PM, Sridhar Ratnakumar
<sridhar.ratna at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 10:37 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> A language is a tool to solve a problem. Each of the problem(s) has its own
>> characteristics, which makes us to choose one among the many languages
>> around - and hence the choice of the best tool to solve that problem.
>
> I'd add that practically the best tool depends on not just technical
> criteria but also the tool familiarity and willingness of the
> developers to learn a new tool.
>
> Also, while languages can be /just/ tools to solve problems, the
> choice of a programming language during the learning phase greatly
> affects your programming skills. For example, programming abstractions
> are best studied by using, say, any of the Lisp family of languages
> but not C or C++.
>
> "Programs must be written for people to read, and only incidentally
> for machines to execute." - Abelson & Sussman
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
-Anand

From venkatasubramanian at gmail.com  Wed Jan 21 23:12:49 2009
From: venkatasubramanian at gmail.com (venkata subramanian)
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 17:12:49 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<9963e56e0901202211p5d4c3b93n175a416babac5bc8@mail.gmail.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901202237h62eae5f0uf4ed2321fbe6c4b2@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c73a13a0901211019l738b0d62r4ff0c38660db0e36@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <acf1defa0901211412w22097051i60bf7390269139ba@mail.gmail.com>

There is a distance between an algorithm (its pseudocode) and implementation.
This distance is lesser for (a class of or many classes of) algorithms
in one language
than the other due to the language level abstractions offered by the language.
This reduced distance greatly helps a new algorithms student who want to try
out ideas and see them work.

The trade-off might be that you might great a better performing implementation
with the language with lesser abstraction. But, that does not matter
for the student who
is learning algorithms and data structures.

But, once she gets the hang of it, she might proceed to learning about
optimizing it.


Regards,
Venkat


On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 4:04 PM, Anand Balachandran Pillai
<abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:
> Algorithms are mathematical descriptions of solving
> a problem. Algorithms can be illustrated in pseudo code
> and proved using algebra and discrete mathematics.
>
> It is important not to confuse between an algorithm
> and its implementation in a programming language.
> It is true that some languages are more suited to
> solving problems in a certain way, than others. Due
> to the language elements supported by different
> languages, solutions might vary.
>
> For example, many things can be done in C++ templates,
> for which you may not be able draw parallels in other languages.
> A lisp algorithm might look more "elegant" in the eyes
> of a Lisper than anything else. A Pythonista might swear
> for the beauty of his code over similar C/C++ code.
> These are just variations in viewpoint and don't
> illustrate anything fundamentally different between the
> languages.
>
> Programming languages are tools to solve problems.
>
> Most often, a language might be more suitable to the
> problem at hand than other ones. This is often determined
> by things like time & cost constraints, skill availability,
> freely available software in that language, performance
> considerations etc than any perceived superiority of
> the language.
>
> I never understood language wars. Got a programming
> language you love, good. But such comparisons are frankly
> a waste of time...
>
> --Anand
>
> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 11:49 PM, Sridhar Ratnakumar
> <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 10:37 PM, Venkatraman S <venkat83 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> A language is a tool to solve a problem. Each of the problem(s) has its own
>>> characteristics, which makes us to choose one among the many languages
>>> around - and hence the choice of the best tool to solve that problem.
>>
>> I'd add that practically the best tool depends on not just technical
>> criteria but also the tool familiarity and willingness of the
>> developers to learn a new tool.
>>
>> Also, while languages can be /just/ tools to solve problems, the
>> choice of a programming language during the learning phase greatly
>> affects your programming skills. For example, programming abstractions
>> are best studied by using, say, any of the Lisp family of languages
>> but not C or C++.
>>
>> "Programs must be written for people to read, and only incidentally
>> for machines to execute." - Abelson & Sussman
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>
>
>
> --
> -Anand
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>

From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Thu Jan 22 05:57:32 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 10:27:32 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c73a13a0901211019l738b0d62r4ff0c38660db0e36@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901221027.32250.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Thursday 22 Jan 2009 2:34:41 am Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote:
> I never understood language wars. Got a programming
> language you love, good. But such comparisons are frankly
> a waste of time...

wars are fun

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From sridhar.ratna at gmail.com  Fri Jan 23 05:26:32 2009
From: sridhar.ratna at gmail.com (Sridhar Ratnakumar)
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 20:26:32 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<9963e56e0901202211p5d4c3b93n175a416babac5bc8@mail.gmail.com>
	<a3b05e8b0901202237h62eae5f0uf4ed2321fbe6c4b2@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c73a13a0901211019l738b0d62r4ff0c38660db0e36@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c73a13a0901222026s539bde48rf2a82d632d52f674@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Anand Balachandran Pillai
<abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:
> I never understood language wars. Got a programming
> language you love, good. But such comparisons are frankly
> a waste of time...

I think it is related to instinctually defending one's identity.

  http://www.units.muohio.edu/psybersite/fans/sit.shtml

Replace 'sports' with 'programming languages'.

From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Fri Jan 23 05:35:03 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 10:05:03 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <7c73a13a0901222026s539bde48rf2a82d632d52f674@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901170334q514125aah3292b9a39dde19e9@mail.gmail.com>
	<8548c5f30901211304q64926fceq86bcf238cee099b9@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c73a13a0901222026s539bde48rf2a82d632d52f674@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901231005.04067.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Friday 23 Jan 2009 9:56:32 am Sridhar Ratnakumar wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Anand Balachandran Pillai
>
> <abpillai at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I never understood language wars. Got a programming
> > language you love, good. But such comparisons are frankly
> > a waste of time...
>
> I think it is related to instinctually defending one's identity.
>
> ? http://www.units.muohio.edu/psybersite/fans/sit.shtml
>
> Replace 'sports' with 'programming languages'.

or golf clubs or cars or motorbikes or sarees ...

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From lorddaemon at gmail.com  Fri Jan 23 08:29:21 2009
From: lorddaemon at gmail.com (Darkseid)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 12:59:21 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <497971D1.9000305@gmail.com>

Context is everything. When implementing Google search, efficiency of 
algorithms matter. When modeling a business process, effective 
encapsulation matters. I've never understood the obsession with 
algorithms to the exclusion of all else. They certainly matter, but to 
make them the sole yardstick is a very bad idea.

To put it another way, I don't particularly care what language someone 
programs in so long as he has understood and absorbed basic CS concepts. 
Stuff that is covered from different angles in 'The Pragmatic 
Programmer', 'Code Complete', and 'The Structure and Interpretation of 
Computer Programs' just to name a few.

> have found those how have programmed  in C/C++ are generally better(in 
> problem solving) than who program in other languages.
I would disagree quite strongly based on my experience. I don't thing 
C/C++ programmers are any worse, but they certainly aren't any better on 
average. What I have observed in my particular area of work (which has 
an emphasis on OO) is that C/C++ programmers are least likely to respect 
good OO practices, followed closely by Java/C# folks.

My 2p,
Sidu.
http://blog.sidu.in

prasanna diwadkar wrote:
>  
> Hi,
> I think Chetan is right. Algorithms play important role.I am not 
> biased towards specific language but I have found those how have 
> programmed  in C/C++ are generally better(in problem solving) than who 
> program in other languages.This is not to say Python/Java etc  are bad 
> but C/C++ forces  you to learn(without copy paste!) unlike java/Python 
> where JDK provides all methods in API.Ofcourse this has happened 
> because software apps have grown big in size and complexities than in 
> 80s/90s where C/C++ were predominant.
> Thanks
> PD
>  
>  
> --- On *Sat, 1/17/09, Chetan Nichkawde /<chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com>/* 
> wrote:
>
>     From: Chetan Nichkawde <chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com>
>     Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
>     To: bangpypers at python.org
>     Date: Saturday, January 17, 2009, 3:34 AM
>
>     Hi,
>
>       The only way to learn programming is to program. I learnt C++
>     when I was in high school and I remember getting intimidated by
>     some of the problems posed. I thought I cannot do it. But when I
>     gave it a try it happened and a whole new world of programming
>     opened to me. One of the problem posed by my teacher was to place
>     8 queens on a chess board so that no queen is able to cancel any
>     other queen. During those days (1997) there was no internet and I
>     hail from small town called Dhanbad. I went after the problem and
>     cracked it. For many years, I thought I was the only person who
>     can solve the problem in that way. When I came to software
>     industry I came to know that kind of algorithm is known as
>     backtracking algorithm. Was I a computer wiz or something?
>     Imagining backtracking algorithm in class XI in high school. I
>     don't think so. You just have to apply yourself and be creative.
>     Python is great language to start learning programming although
>     certain concepts like pointers is also a must know for a programmer.
>
>     Chetan
>
>     -- 
>     Senior Analyst
>     Outdu MediaTech Pvt Ltd
>     Mobile: 9900262140
>     linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/chetan/nichkawde
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     BangPypers mailing list
>     BangPypers at python.org
>     http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>               
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>   

From praveen at mahiti.org  Fri Jan 23 08:46:49 2009
From: praveen at mahiti.org (Praveen Kumar)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 13:16:49 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <497971D1.9000305@gmail.com>
References: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<497971D1.9000305@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6f7fd6e90901222346l4e092945o42aeab01a773a1a0@mail.gmail.com>

Try to find someone you know that knows how to program. Online tutorials are
nice, but they can be frustrating at times if you can't get answers to
specific questions.

Keep at it. Programming can be the most frustrating thing in the world, but
it can also be the most satisfying thing. Don't get down if you don't get a
concept--programming can be a very abstract thing to learn, and if you can't
figure out something, take a break and come back later.

Go beyond boring textbook examples. Try to find problems that really
interest you. Try to solve them in small steps. Don't be afraid to read help
files to learn what is possible in solving your problem.

When writing a program, start small and then add options and features
gradually.

When you learn something new, it is very helpful to try it out, and then
change some things to make sure you have the concept down.

When choosing a programming language, it is important to consider what
you'll be learning it for. For example, if you want to go into website
development, try out Python (Django is very fun!), PHP, Java or Javascript
(note that these are not the same though they have similar names). If you
want to become a professional programmer, either C#, C++ or Java are a must.

If you take a break from programming, be sure to practice every now and
then. After all, it is a programming language, and as it is with any
language, you will forget it if you don't use it.

Join the Association for Computing Machinery http://www.acm.org/ and make
serious use of their Professional Development Center. It has hundreds of
free, step-by-step tutorials, though you must be a member to use them.
Student and discounted rates are available.

For most people, programming something that interests them or that they can
use will be much more interesting. Using a search engine, you can find a
tutorial or a source code for almost any project in any language.

Don't fear open sources. Open sources were put in place for a reason, to
learn. Why re-invent the wheel when you can make it better? Just make sure
you understand what you're programming.

References are there to help you. Don't be ashamed if you don't remember
everything by heart, that comes with time. The important thing is knowing
the various possibilities of functions within a language and knowing where
to go to find out exactly how to use them.

I do follow same and assure if any one follow will never be failure.



On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 12:59 PM, Darkseid <lorddaemon at gmail.com> wrote:

> Context is everything. When implementing Google search, efficiency of
> algorithms matter. When modeling a business process, effective encapsulation
> matters. I've never understood the obsession with algorithms to the
> exclusion of all else. They certainly matter, but to make them the sole
> yardstick is a very bad idea.
>
> To put it another way, I don't particularly care what language someone
> programs in so long as he has understood and absorbed basic CS concepts.
> Stuff that is covered from different angles in 'The Pragmatic Programmer',
> 'Code Complete', and 'The Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs'
> just to name a few.
>
>  have found those how have programmed  in C/C++ are generally better(in
>> problem solving) than who program in other languages.
>>
> I would disagree quite strongly based on my experience. I don't thing C/C++
> programmers are any worse, but they certainly aren't any better on average.
> What I have observed in my particular area of work (which has an emphasis on
> OO) is that C/C++ programmers are least likely to respect good OO practices,
> followed closely by Java/C# folks.
>
> My 2p,
> Sidu.
> http://blog.sidu.in
>
> prasanna diwadkar wrote:
>
>>  Hi,
>> I think Chetan is right. Algorithms play important role.I am not biased
>> towards specific language but I have found those how have programmed  in
>> C/C++ are generally better(in problem solving) than who program in other
>> languages.This is not to say Python/Java etc  are bad but C/C++ forces  you
>> to learn(without copy paste!) unlike java/Python where JDK provides all
>> methods in API.Ofcourse this has happened because software apps have grown
>> big in size and complexities than in 80s/90s where C/C++ were predominant.
>> Thanks
>> PD
>>   --- On *Sat, 1/17/09, Chetan Nichkawde /<chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com>/*
>> wrote:
>>
>>    From: Chetan Nichkawde <chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com>
>>    Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
>>    To: bangpypers at python.org
>>    Date: Saturday, January 17, 2009, 3:34 AM
>>
>>    Hi,
>>
>>      The only way to learn programming is to program. I learnt C++
>>    when I was in high school and I remember getting intimidated by
>>    some of the problems posed. I thought I cannot do it. But when I
>>    gave it a try it happened and a whole new world of programming
>>    opened to me. One of the problem posed by my teacher was to place
>>    8 queens on a chess board so that no queen is able to cancel any
>>    other queen. During those days (1997) there was no internet and I
>>    hail from small town called Dhanbad. I went after the problem and
>>    cracked it. For many years, I thought I was the only person who
>>    can solve the problem in that way. When I came to software
>>    industry I came to know that kind of algorithm is known as
>>    backtracking algorithm. Was I a computer wiz or something?
>>    Imagining backtracking algorithm in class XI in high school. I
>>    don't think so. You just have to apply yourself and be creative.
>>    Python is great language to start learning programming although
>>    certain concepts like pointers is also a must know for a programmer.
>>
>>    Chetan
>>
>>    --    Senior Analyst
>>    Outdu MediaTech Pvt Ltd
>>    Mobile: 9900262140
>>    linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/chetan/nichkawde
>>
>>    _______________________________________________
>>    BangPypers mailing list
>>    BangPypers at python.org
>>    http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BangPypers mailing list
>> BangPypers at python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>



-- 
Praveen Kumar
Software Engineer
Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
# 33-34, Hennur Cross
Hennur Main Road
Bangalore, India - 560043
Mobile:  +91 9343297314
            +91 9739854134
http://www.mahiti.org
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From sridhar.ratna at gmail.com  Fri Jan 23 08:50:31 2009
From: sridhar.ratna at gmail.com (Sridhar Ratnakumar)
Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 23:50:31 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <497971D1.9000305@gmail.com>
References: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<497971D1.9000305@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c73a13a0901222350q143f02cfjb00ee129b5afbe77@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 11:29 PM, Darkseid <lorddaemon at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> have found those how have programmed  in C/C++ are generally better(in
>> problem solving) than who program in other languages.
>
> I would disagree quite strongly based on my experience. I don't thing C/C++
> programmers are any worse, but they certainly aren't any better on average.
> What I have observed in my particular area of work (which has an emphasis on
> OO) is that C/C++ programmers are least likely to respect good OO practices,
> followed closely by Java/C# folks.

I'm guessing that Prasanna was thinking of ACM ICPC kind of problems
when he claimed that C/C++ is better in problem solving. These kind of
problems require the contestant to write code so that they run within
a given time limit.. a restriction which forces one to write it on
C/C++ than a high-level language.

BTW, if one is just starting to learn programming.. I hear HtDP is
pretty good - http://htdp.org/

From vinayakh at gmail.com  Fri Jan 23 11:15:26 2009
From: vinayakh at gmail.com (Vinayak Hegde)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 15:45:26 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <6f7fd6e90901222346l4e092945o42aeab01a773a1a0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <695766.31892.qm@web30807.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<497971D1.9000305@gmail.com>
	<6f7fd6e90901222346l4e092945o42aeab01a773a1a0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <38940f3c0901230215t25e7da50ocd40eef2b7dda9ef@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:16 PM, Praveen Kumar <praveen at mahiti.org> wrote:
> Join the Association for Computing Machinery http://www.acm.org/ and make
> serious use of their Professional Development Center. It has hundreds of
> free, step-by-step tutorials, though you must be a member to use them.
> Student and discounted rates are available.

BTW just thought that I should mention that we have a local chapter of
ACM in Bangalore, which is fairly active. It could be a way to connect
with other programmers and learn from them You can visit the website
at http://acmbangalore.org

We recently had a conference called Compute 2009 where we had
tutorials on cloud computing and social networks. If you are
interested in the ACM Tech Talks
(http://acmbangalore.org/events/monthly-talk/) that we hold regularly,
you can signup for the ACM Bangalore mailing list at
http://groups.google.com/group/acm-bangalore-chapter/about?hl=en We
have recorded the tutorials and they will be put up shortly.

If you want to volunteer for ACM event we have a volunteer mailing
list at http://groups.google.com/group/acm-blr-volunteers/ We are
having a meeting this Sunday at ICH, 10.30am.

-- Vinayak

From pdiwadkar at yahoo.com  Fri Jan 23 16:22:04 2009
From: pdiwadkar at yahoo.com (prasanna diwadkar)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 07:22:04 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <7c73a13a0901222350q143f02cfjb00ee129b5afbe77@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <605573.5105.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


I was talking in general.I am not saying python/java programmers are lesser quality than C/C++ .Ultimately programming is a programming is a programming.
Since 80s to late 90s?many Indian/foreign(US etc) have been teaching programming in C/C++.When I talked to 2 ex-professors in India,they observed that the rigor when?students go through using c/++ is higher than java/python.For.e.g.manipulation of linked list,hash table.IMO better programming is not just understaning the layers of abstraction but understanding some intracacies,what goes below the hood.
?
Regards
PD

--- On Thu, 1/22/09, Sridhar Ratnakumar <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Sridhar Ratnakumar <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Date: Thursday, January 22, 2009, 11:50 PM

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 11:29 PM, Darkseid <lorddaemon at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> have found those how have programmed  in C/C++ are generally better(in
>> problem solving) than who program in other languages.
>
> I would disagree quite strongly based on my experience. I don't thing
C/C++
> programmers are any worse, but they certainly aren't any better on
average.
> What I have observed in my particular area of work (which has an emphasis
on
> OO) is that C/C++ programmers are least likely to respect good OO
practices,
> followed closely by Java/C# folks.

I'm guessing that Prasanna was thinking of ACM ICPC kind of problems
when he claimed that C/C++ is better in problem solving. These kind of
problems require the contestant to write code so that they run within
a given time limit.. a restriction which forces one to write it on
C/C++ than a high-level language.

BTW, if one is just starting to learn programming.. I hear HtDP is
pretty good - http://htdp.org/
_______________________________________________
BangPypers mailing list
BangPypers at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers



      
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From noufal at gmail.com  Fri Jan 23 17:18:21 2009
From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 21:48:21 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <605573.5105.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901222350q143f02cfjb00ee129b5afbe77@mail.gmail.com>
	<605573.5105.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <9963e56e0901230818y44ad111eg72ca6ddc29af80fc@mail.gmail.com>

> Since 80s to late 90s many Indian/foreign(US etc) have been teaching
> programming in C/C++.When I talked to 2 ex-professors in India,they observed
> that the rigor when students go through using c/++ is higher than
> java/python.For.e.g.manipulation of linked list,hash table.
>

Can you define 'rigor'? If you mean, number of hours spent, I agree with you
but that's not a very good metric.

IMO better programming is not just understaning the layers of abstraction
> but understanding some intracacies,what goes below the hood.


Yes and this is served better by actually studying the intricacies rather
than language implementation details. Worrying about things like memory
allocation/deallocation, corrupt pointers etc. are fine if that's what you
want to do but if you're trying to implement a complex data structure and
spend your time hunting for a bad pointer, it's a waste of time.


-- 
~noufal
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From pradeep at btbytes.com  Fri Jan 23 19:09:14 2009
From: pradeep at btbytes.com (Pradeep Gowda)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 13:09:14 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <605573.5105.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901222350q143f02cfjb00ee129b5afbe77@mail.gmail.com>
	<605573.5105.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3e3294b70901231009x26fb916j23288527d122fa97@mail.gmail.com>

Learning programming via C will force you to understand data structures like
lists, queues and hash tables better purely for the reason that C does not
provide them in the standard library.

C++/Java/Python do via STL and standard libraries respectively. Generalizing
C++ with C shows how misunderstood C++ is. C++ is not C with stuff bolted
on.

Teaching C in the first year of engineering compared to a language like
Python, Lua or Ruby is a sure way of turning off students to the joys of
programming.  Not everybody needs to know how to implement a linked list and
a queue.

A vast majority of technical graduates go on to do programming either as
software developers and/or engineers in other streams do NOT have to do low
level programming. If they were taught to solve problems using a dynamic
language like Python/Lua/Ruby instead of twiddling bits, we would see newer
applications being built by non-CS graduates in their domains.

Oh well, why would CS professors be concerned about productivity.

A lot of my mechanical engineering classmates(who were bright students)
where scared to death of FORTRAN and C, because C made it so difficult to do
simple things like Computer Graphics (which is what they wanted to
accomplish in the CAD lab).
A library like Pygame would have allowed them to write CG apps and CAD
programs without racking brains about C  and pointers.

+PG

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 10:22 AM, prasanna diwadkar <pdiwadkar at yahoo.com>wrote:

>
> I was talking in general.I am not saying python/java programmers are lesser
> quality than C/C++ .Ultimately programming is a programming is a
> programming.
> Since 80s to late 90s many Indian/foreign(US etc) have been teaching
> programming in C/C++.When I talked to 2 ex-professors in India,they observed
> that the rigor when students go through using c/++ is higher than
> java/python.For.e.g.manipulation of linked list,hash table.IMO better
> programming is not just understaning the layers of abstraction but
> understanding some intracacies,what goes below the hood.
>
> Regards
> PD
>
> --- On *Thu, 1/22/09, Sridhar Ratnakumar <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com>* wrote:
>
> From: Sridhar Ratnakumar <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
> To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
> Date: Thursday, January 22, 2009, 11:50 PM
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 11:29 PM, Darkseid <lorddaemon at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> have found those how have programmed  in C/C++ are generally better(in
> >> problem solving) than who program in other languages.
> >
> > I would disagree quite strongly based on my experience. I don't thing
> C/C++
> > programmers are any worse, but they certainly aren't any better on
> average.
> > What I have observed in my particular area of work (which has an emphasis
> on
> > OO) is that C/C++ programmers are least likely to respect good OO
> practices,
> > followed closely by Java/C# folks.
>
> I'm guessing that Prasanna was thinking of ACM ICPC kind of problems
> when he claimed that C/C++ is better in problem solving. These kind of
> problems require the contestant to write code so that they run within
> a given time limit.. a restriction which forces one to write it on
> C/C++ than a high-level language.
>
> BTW, if one is just starting to learn programming.. I hear HtDP is
> pretty good - http://htdp.org/
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing listBangPypers at python.orghttp://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
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From sridhar.ratna at gmail.com  Fri Jan 23 20:38:05 2009
From: sridhar.ratna at gmail.com (Sridhar Ratnakumar)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 11:38:05 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <605573.5105.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901222350q143f02cfjb00ee129b5afbe77@mail.gmail.com>
	<605573.5105.qm@web30802.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 7:22 AM, prasanna diwadkar <pdiwadkar at yahoo.com> wrote:
> I was talking in general.I am not saying python/java programmers are lesser
> quality than C/C++ .Ultimately programming is a programming is a
> programming.
> Since 80s to late 90s many Indian/foreign(US etc) have been teaching
> programming in C/C++.When I talked to 2 ex-professors in India,they observed
> that the rigor when students go through using c/++ is higher than
> java/python.For.e.g.manipulation of linked list,hash table.IMO better
> programming is not just understaning the layers of abstraction but
> understanding some intracacies,what goes below the hood.

Are you suggesting that because a programmer is adept in manipulating
memory, pointers, arrays and structures like lists, hash table, stack,
queue he becomes better in problem solving (from solving an
algorithmic problem to a real-world problem) than a programmer who is
not?

From chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com  Sat Jan 24 06:20:42 2009
From: chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com (Chetan Nichkawde)
Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 10:50:42 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
Message-ID: <c6b653c60901232120k4432f5des704912586ccd3de6@mail.gmail.com>

Dynamic typing and memory management eases a lot of thing for Python
programmers. However, I think for a newbie these concepts a must to know.
Therefore, I think a fresher to should begin with C/C++ and then graduate to
Python.
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From pdiwadkar at yahoo.com  Sat Jan 24 07:13:09 2009
From: pdiwadkar at yahoo.com (prasanna diwadkar)
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 22:13:09 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


That? was the observation made by professors.I won't say C/c++ will make better programmer than say java/Python but c\c++ programming will make one aware of many things you mentioned than working in Python/java.
PD
--- On Fri, 1/23/09, Sridhar Ratnakumar <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Sridhar Ratnakumar <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
To: "Bangalore Python Users Group - India" <bangpypers at python.org>
Date: Friday, January 23, 2009, 11:38 AM

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 7:22 AM, prasanna diwadkar <pdiwadkar at yahoo.com>
wrote:
> I was talking in general.I am not saying python/java programmers are
lesser
> quality than C/C++ .Ultimately programming is a programming is a
> programming.
> Since 80s to late 90s many Indian/foreign(US etc) have been teaching
> programming in C/C++.When I talked to 2 ex-professors in India,they
observed
> that the rigor when students go through using c/++ is higher than
> java/python.For.e.g.manipulation of linked list,hash table.IMO better
> programming is not just understaning the layers of abstraction but
> understanding some intracacies,what goes below the hood.

Are you suggesting that because a programmer is adept in manipulating
memory, pointers, arrays and structures like lists, hash table, stack,
queue he becomes better in problem solving (from solving an
algorithmic problem to a real-world problem) than a programmer who is
not?
_______________________________________________
BangPypers mailing list
BangPypers at python.org
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers



      
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From anandology at gmail.com  Sat Jan 24 08:35:00 2009
From: anandology at gmail.com (Anand Chitipothu)
Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 13:05:00 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <c6b653c60901232120k4432f5des704912586ccd3de6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c6b653c60901232120k4432f5des704912586ccd3de6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <41139fcb0901232335hb6fdf52s26f9d48776c43161@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 24, 2009 at 10:50 AM, Chetan Nichkawde
<chetan.nichkawde at gmail.com> wrote:
> Dynamic typing and memory management eases a lot of thing for Python
> programmers.

Agreed.

> However, I think for a newbie these concepts a must to know.

Agreed.

> Therefore, I think a fresher to should begin with C/C++ and then graduate to
> Python.

No. It means a fresher should begin with a higher-level language like
Python and master C/C++ once he feels comfortable with programming.

From sridhar.ratna at gmail.com  Sat Jan 24 12:39:29 2009
From: sridhar.ratna at gmail.com (Sridhar Ratnakumar)
Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 03:39:29 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>
	<830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7c73a13a0901240339w11de8664s2305e9e3d0a8268@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 10:13 PM, prasanna diwadkar <pdiwadkar at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> That  was the observation made by professors.I won't say C/c++ will make
> better programmer than say java/Python

But you already said that:

   "I have found those how have programmed  in C/C++ are generally
better(in problem solving) than who program in other languages."

> but c\c++ programming will make one
> aware of many things you mentioned than working in Python/java.

Learning low-level programming constructs are certainly useful
especially in systems programming and writing high performance code.
What is puzzling me is the claim that these constructs will make one a
better programmer.

From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Sat Jan 24 14:42:38 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 19:12:38 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <7c73a13a0901240339w11de8664s2305e9e3d0a8268@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>
	<830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<7c73a13a0901240339w11de8664s2305e9e3d0a8268@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901241912.38285.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Saturday 24 Jan 2009 5:09:29 pm Sridhar Ratnakumar wrote:
> Learning low-level programming constructs are certainly useful
> especially in systems programming and writing high performance code.
> What is puzzling me is the claim that these constructs will make one a
> better programmer.

what is the difference between a programmer and a person who writes code? Is 
there a difference? I was told that learning to write code can be done in a 
few weeks, but to become a programmer will take at least 10 years. I was also 
told that learning to play golf takes a few months - but becoming a golfer 
would take at least 10 years. As far as golf is concerned, there is a clear 
distinction between technical ability and an overall integration into the 
spirit of the game. I wonder if the same applies to the concept of a 
programmer. Especially an open source programmer where success implies 
technical skills + the ability to work in a collaborative environment, not 
get angry with criticism, ability to mobilise the end user as a developmental 
partner, write code that anyone can maintain - etc etc., comment and document 
the code you write, respect RFCs and PEPs.

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From rmathews at gmail.com  Sat Jan 24 16:46:25 2009
From: rmathews at gmail.com (Roshan Mathews)
Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 21:16:25 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <200901241912.38285.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
References: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>
	<830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<7c73a13a0901240339w11de8664s2305e9e3d0a8268@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901241912.38285.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
Message-ID: <1c4dc2780901240746y6a834534ve5072c00373d1fb5@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 24, 2009 at 7:12 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves <lawgon at au-kbc.org> wrote:
> what is the difference between a programmer and a person who writes code? Is
> there a difference? I was told that learning to write code can be done in a
> few weeks, but to become a programmer will take at least 10 years. I was also
> told that learning to play golf takes a few months - but becoming a golfer
> would take at least 10 years. As far as golf is concerned, there is a clear

Obligatory link:  http://norvig.com/21-days.html  A good read even
otherwise.  The 'knowing the rules' vs. 'being proficient' argument is
also made in SICP
<http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book-Z-H-11.html#%_sec_1.2>
... another good read, (Indian version of the dead trees version
available from University Press.)

> distinction between technical ability and an overall integration into the
> spirit of the game. I wonder if the same applies to the concept of a
> programmer. Especially an open source programmer where success implies
> technical skills + the ability to work in a collaborative environment, not
> get angry with criticism, ability to mobilise the end user as a developmental
> partner, write code that anyone can maintain - etc etc., comment and document
> the code you write, respect RFCs and PEPs.
>

Yes, social skills and the ability to work with others matter.  Just
like anyplace else, but maybe less so than in other professions.

About the high level vs. low level argument, it can be argued both
ways.  Many things are clarified when you look at it from a different
perspective.  I've understood C better after I did some assembly, and
my C++ improved after I worked in Python, and vice versa.

But I think less people would be scared away if they start off with a
HLL language like Python, compared to C, or even C++.  C++ isn't C
with stuff bolted on, like someone here mentioned, but those parts
that aren't that are pretty complicated to get your head around even
if you have been using C++ for years.

Anand Chitipothu had given a link to a article earlier in this thread,
which makes a very good argument.  I hadn't noticed the similarities
between Python and pseudo-code before.  :)

~Roshan

From sridhar.ratna at gmail.com  Sat Jan 24 22:26:24 2009
From: sridhar.ratna at gmail.com (Sridhar Ratnakumar)
Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 13:26:24 -0800
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <1c4dc2780901240746y6a834534ve5072c00373d1fb5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>
	<830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<7c73a13a0901240339w11de8664s2305e9e3d0a8268@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901241912.38285.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<1c4dc2780901240746y6a834534ve5072c00373d1fb5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c73a13a0901241326s4debaecbkd3f72cc7ebf64a58@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 24, 2009 at 7:46 AM, Roshan Mathews <rmathews at gmail.com> wrote:
> The 'knowing the rules' vs. 'being proficient' argument is
> also made in SICP
> <http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book-Z-H-11.html#%_sec_1.2>
> ... another good read, (Indian version of the dead trees version
> available from University Press.)

Are you referring to this argument?

"""
Like the novice chess player, we don't yet know the common patterns of
usage in the [programming] domain. We lack the knowledge of which
moves are worth making (which procedures are worth defining). We lack
the experience to predict the consequences of making a move (executing
a procedure).

The ability to visualize the consequences of the actions under
consideration is crucial to becoming an expert programmer, just as it
is in any synthetic, creative activity. In becoming an expert
photographer, for example, one must learn how to look at a scene and
know how dark each region will appear on a print for each possible
choice of exposure and development conditions. Only then can one
reason backward, planning framing, lighting, exposure, and development
to obtain the desired effects. So it is with programming, where we are
planning the course of action to be taken by a process and where we
control the process by means of a program. To become experts, we must
learn to visualize the processes generated by various types of
procedures. Only after we have developed such a skill can we learn to
reliably construct programs that exhibit the desired behavior.
"""

Speaking of SICP,
http://eli.thegreenplace.net/2008/04/18/sicp-conclusion/ (must have
been quite a feeling of achievement!)

From pradeep at btbytes.com  Sun Jan 25 03:48:26 2009
From: pradeep at btbytes.com (Pradeep Gowda)
Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2009 21:48:26 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] Announcing PyOFC2
Message-ID: <3e3294b70901241848u5d397bf6w8569facf3cb909e@mail.gmail.com>

I've written a python library to generate data files used by the excellent
open Flash chart 2.
The project page: http://btbytes.github.com/pyofc2/

Click on the links on the left to see the resulting charts.

There are a couple of advantages PyOFC2 has over the one distributed with
OFC2.

 1. Complete. I've implemented python wrapper classes for all chart types
and elements.
 2. Pythonic. The original PHP library uses setters and getters for
properties etc.,
 3. Demo charts. Each chart type has a `test_ foo` function which shows the
usage.
 4. Test coverage.
 5. No dependency on any python framework. The default distribution uses
Cherrypy.

Programming notes:
This is also the first time I used python meta classes.
The test cases are also used to generate the demo files you see on the
website.
I wouldn't call it literate programming but is self documenting.

I've been using this code in a django based app for over a month.

+PG

[1] http://teethgrinder.co.uk/open-flash-chart-2/
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From rmathews at gmail.com  Sun Jan 25 04:07:07 2009
From: rmathews at gmail.com (Roshan Mathews)
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 08:37:07 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <7c73a13a0901241326s4debaecbkd3f72cc7ebf64a58@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>
	<830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<7c73a13a0901240339w11de8664s2305e9e3d0a8268@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901241912.38285.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<1c4dc2780901240746y6a834534ve5072c00373d1fb5@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c73a13a0901241326s4debaecbkd3f72cc7ebf64a58@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1c4dc2780901241907x2ec1233are30cbdc3907eb566@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 2:56 AM, Sridhar Ratnakumar
<sridhar.ratna at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Jan 24, 2009 at 7:46 AM, Roshan Mathews <rmathews at gmail.com> wrote:
>> The 'knowing the rules' vs. 'being proficient' argument is
>> also made in SICP
>> <http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book-Z-H-11.html#%_sec_1.2>
>> ... another good read, (Indian version of the dead trees version
>> available from University Press.)
>
> Are you referring to this argument?
>
Yes.  KG was making a similar point about golf, I think.

>
> Speaking of SICP,
> http://eli.thegreenplace.net/2008/04/18/sicp-conclusion/ (must have
> been quite a feeling of achievement!)
>
Indeed.  http://eli.thegreenplace.net/2008/06/06/signed-copy-of-sicp/ :)

~Roshan

From ramdas at developeriq.com  Sun Jan 25 17:21:30 2009
From: ramdas at developeriq.com (Ramdas S)
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 21:51:30 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Squirrelmail replacement in Python
Message-ID: <6e38f9f00901250821vcd02781q91382f9384f5609d@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Anyone is aware of any squirrel-mail replacement written in Python?




-- 
Ramdas S
+91 9342 583 065
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From noufal at gmail.com  Sun Jan 25 18:18:18 2009
From: noufal at gmail.com (Noufal Ibrahim)
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 22:48:18 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Squirrelmail replacement in Python
In-Reply-To: <6e38f9f00901250821vcd02781q91382f9384f5609d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <6e38f9f00901250821vcd02781q91382f9384f5609d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9963e56e0901250918r276f844ag2fff56da1d417403@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 9:51 PM, Ramdas S <ramdas at developeriq.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Anyone is aware of any squirrel-mail replacement written in Python?
>
>
Try Posterity. It's from the creators of trac.
http://posterity.edgewall.org/

-- 
~noufal
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From pradeep at btbytes.com  Sun Jan 25 23:38:18 2009
From: pradeep at btbytes.com (Pradeep Gowda)
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 17:38:18 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] how to learn programming
In-Reply-To: <1c4dc2780901241907x2ec1233are30cbdc3907eb566@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7c73a13a0901231138h4c4f093gfb248f941c6ec804@mail.gmail.com>
	<830083.39519.qm@web30801.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<7c73a13a0901240339w11de8664s2305e9e3d0a8268@mail.gmail.com>
	<200901241912.38285.lawgon@au-kbc.org>
	<1c4dc2780901240746y6a834534ve5072c00373d1fb5@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c73a13a0901241326s4debaecbkd3f72cc7ebf64a58@mail.gmail.com>
	<1c4dc2780901241907x2ec1233are30cbdc3907eb566@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3e3294b70901251438m5f216e66g544f97f6c8934e1d@mail.gmail.com>

Hopefully this scientific study with hard numbers conveys what I was
saying in my earlier mail about Python being a better choice for
learning vocational programming.

This is the summary of a talk accepted for PyCon 2009.
http://us.pycon.org/2009/conference/talks/

Python for CS1 Not Harmful to CS Majors (and good for everyone)

Dr. Bill Punch (Michigan State University) bio; Dr. Richard J Enbody
(Michigan State University)
30min Intermediate
education
At Michigan State Computer Science Dept. we have recently converted
our CS1 course (200 students/semester, about 60% non-CS majors) to
Python, previously taught in C++. Follow on courses for CS majors
(CS2, etc.) still use and teach C/C++. Right around the conversion
point, we had two groups of students taking the C++ CS2 course: those
that took CS1 in Python and those that took CS1 in C++. We examined
the performance of those two groups of students in the CS2-C++ course
(covering the same topics as previously), looking for any significant
differences as measured by t-test with respect to: final exam grade,
overall programming project scores and final course grade. No
significant differences between CS1-Python and CS1-C++ were found.
Further, multiple regression analysis showed that only GPA was a good
predictor of the three outcomes. Neither CS-1 Python nor CS1-C++ was a
predictor. Our conclusion is that a CS1-Python course was as good a
preparation for a CS2-C++ course as was a CS1-C++ course. Furthermore,
CS1-Python was a far better terminal course for non-majors than
CS1-C++, and both majors and non-majors were could address a wider
range of practical STEM problem than previously. We have written a
CS1-Python book for others who wish to teach a Python-CS1 course that
emphasizes teaching Python to CS1 students with a theme of data
manipulation.

+PG

On Sat, Jan 24, 2009 at 10:07 PM, Roshan Mathews <rmathews at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 2:56 AM, Sridhar Ratnakumar
> <sridhar.ratna at gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Sat, Jan 24, 2009 at 7:46 AM, Roshan Mathews <rmathews at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> The 'knowing the rules' vs. 'being proficient' argument is
> >> also made in SICP
> >> <http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book-Z-H-11.html#%_sec_1.2>
> >> ... another good read, (Indian version of the dead trees version
> >> available from University Press.)
> >
> > Are you referring to this argument?
> >
> Yes.  KG was making a similar point about golf, I think.
>
> >
> > Speaking of SICP,
> > http://eli.thegreenplace.net/2008/04/18/sicp-conclusion/ (must have
> > been quite a feeling of achievement!)
> >
> Indeed.  http://eli.thegreenplace.net/2008/06/06/signed-copy-of-sicp/ :)
>
> ~Roshan
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers

From gagan.shrestha at gmail.com  Mon Jan 26 04:29:23 2009
From: gagan.shrestha at gmail.com (Gagan Shrestha)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 08:59:23 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] PyXML deprecated?
Message-ID: <aa70f0870901251929n77576ecja1ac4e2c53fb0e58@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I am new user of Python and using Python 2.5.1. I noticed that PyXML package
is not included by default. Is PyXML deprecated and no more supported ?

Thanks,
Gagan
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From orsenthil at gmail.com  Mon Jan 26 04:48:31 2009
From: orsenthil at gmail.com (Senthil Kumaran)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 09:18:31 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] PyXML deprecated?
In-Reply-To: <aa70f0870901251929n77576ecja1ac4e2c53fb0e58@mail.gmail.com>
References: <aa70f0870901251929n77576ecja1ac4e2c53fb0e58@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c42eba10901251948l4047cf7ej8c7d9319d566234a@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Gagan,

> I am new user of Python and using Python 2.5.1. I noticed that PyXML package
> is not included by default. Is PyXML deprecated and no more supported ?
>

What are you using PyXML for? It is not a part of the standard library.

If you require XML Parsing, the elementtree out there is a pretty good
parsing library and its included by default in Python 2.5.

http://docs.python.org/library/xml.etree.elementtree.html
http://effbot.org/zone/element-index.htm

And for HTML and general XML parsing, Beautiful Soup library which is
a separate package seems an easy to use and preferred one as well.

http://www.crummy.com/software/BeautifulSoup/

If any specific usage/questions with PyXML, just pose it and lets try
to find a way out.

Thanks,
Senthil

From gagan.shrestha at gmail.com  Mon Jan 26 08:08:51 2009
From: gagan.shrestha at gmail.com (Gagan Shrestha)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 12:38:51 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] PyXML deprecated?
In-Reply-To: <7c42eba10901251948l4047cf7ej8c7d9319d566234a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <aa70f0870901251929n77576ecja1ac4e2c53fb0e58@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c42eba10901251948l4047cf7ej8c7d9319d566234a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <aa70f0870901252308l2e158df1ya9d19565dd1dafa0@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Senthil,

Requirement was to traverse through XML and extract value. Thought of using
earlier knowledge of PyXML. I think, as per your suggestion, will use
elementtree.

Thanks,
Gagan

On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 9:18 AM, Senthil Kumaran <orsenthil at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hello Gagan,
>
> > I am new user of Python and using Python 2.5.1. I noticed that PyXML
> package
> > is not included by default. Is PyXML deprecated and no more supported ?
> >
>
> What are you using PyXML for? It is not a part of the standard library.
>
> If you require XML Parsing, the elementtree out there is a pretty good
> parsing library and its included by default in Python 2.5.
>
> http://docs.python.org/library/xml.etree.elementtree.html
> http://effbot.org/zone/element-index.htm
>
> And for HTML and general XML parsing, Beautiful Soup library which is
> a separate package seems an easy to use and preferred one as well.
>
> http://www.crummy.com/software/BeautifulSoup/
>
> If any specific usage/questions with PyXML, just pose it and lets try
> to find a way out.
>
> Thanks,
> Senthil
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
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From oommenkm at gmail.com  Mon Jan 26 17:28:31 2009
From: oommenkm at gmail.com (OOMMEN KM)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 11:28:31 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
Message-ID: <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,
I am a beginner in Django Development.
I have installed Django.

 As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
django-admin.py  command I got the following error.

----------------
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/usr/bin/django-admin.py", line 2, in <module>
    from django.core import management
  File
"/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/__init__.py", line
7, in <module>
    from django.core.management.base import BaseCommand, CommandError,
handle_default_options
  File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/base.py",
line 3, in <module>
    from optparse import make_option, OptionParser
ImportError: cannot import name make_option
-----------------

Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.

Thanking you in advance.


-- 
-------
Mr. Oommen Mathew
Python Software Analyst
rKc Media Group Inc.

Mob - +91 9446917322
----------------------
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From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Mon Jan 26 18:06:10 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 22:36:10 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
In-Reply-To: <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <497DED82.8050408@gmail.com>

OOMMEN KM wrote:
>
>     from optparse import make_option, OptionParser
> ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> -----------------
>
> Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
What version of Python are you using? As far as I can see, optparse 
module comes in-built with python since v2.3.
Can you try `from optparse import name_option` in a python shell opened 
in a terminal/command promt?

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From orsenthil at gmail.com  Mon Jan 26 19:15:24 2009
From: orsenthil at gmail.com (Senthil Kumaran)
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 23:45:24 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
In-Reply-To: <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c42eba10901261015p54d12fc4p2c7a5080e0ce3452@mail.gmail.com>

> OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>  As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
> django-admin.py  command I got the following error.
>
> ----------------
> Traceback (most recent call last):

Seems to be a problem either with your installation of Django or
incompatibility issue.

Couple of things to do.
1) Version of python: Do python -V
>From your traceback it seems you are using Python 2.5. But still it is
required to list the version and make sure you are using the latest.
2) How are you installing django? Just mention the steps.

And try Parthan SR's suggestion also.


-- 
Senthil

From praveen at mahiti.org  Tue Jan 27 05:58:44 2009
From: praveen at mahiti.org (Praveen Kumar)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 10:28:44 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
In-Reply-To: <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6f7fd6e90901262058g1f5a3881ocfe1201212f761e3@mail.gmail.com>

Hi OOmen

If you are really beginner of Django

please go through
http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-django/to understand
the installation and configuration.

you are trying to import

code.djangoproject.com/browser/django/trunk/django/contrib/gis/management/commands/ogrinspect.py?rev=8219&f

On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 9:58 PM, OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi All,
> I am a beginner in Django Development.
> I have installed Django.
>
>  As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
> django-admin.py  command I got the following error.
>
> ----------------
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "/usr/bin/django-admin.py", line 2, in <module>
>     from django.core import management
>   File
> "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/__init__.py", line
> 7, in <module>
>     from django.core.management.base import BaseCommand, CommandError,
> handle_default_options
>   File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/base.py",
> line 3, in <module>
>     from optparse import make_option, OptionParser
> ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> -----------------
>
> Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
> Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.
>
> Thanking you in advance.
>
>
> --
> -------
> Mr. Oommen Mathew
> Python Software Analyst
> rKc Media Group Inc.
>
> Mob - +91 9446917322
> ----------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>


-- 
Praveen Kumar
Software Engineer
Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
# 33-34, Hennur Cross
Hennur Main Road
Bangalore, India - 560043
Mobile:  +91 9343297314
            +91 9739854134
http://www.mahiti.org
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From oommenkm at gmail.com  Tue Jan 27 12:25:41 2009
From: oommenkm at gmail.com (OOMMEN KM)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 06:25:41 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] BangPypers Digest, Vol 17, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <mailman.65.1233054019.20903.bangpypers@python.org>
References: <mailman.65.1233054019.20903.bangpypers@python.org>
Message-ID: <7114437c0901270325q6bfc64b6o6d9e203df1b773f1@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you all for responding to my doubt.

Yeah i tried to import it in the interactive shell of python, as parthan
suggested, but it shows an error
"Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
ImportError: cannot import name name_option"

But I can import 'optparse'


I checked my python version, its Python 2.5.1.

I have installed the django through the following steps

   - downloded   Django-1.0.tar.gz
   - tar -zxvf Django-1.0.tar.gz
   - cd Django-1.0
   - python setup.py install (as given in the INSTALL file)

Thank You.




On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 6:00 AM, <bangpypers-request at python.org> wrote:

> Send BangPypers mailing list submissions to
>        bangpypers at python.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>        http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>        bangpypers-request at python.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>        bangpypers-owner at python.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of BangPypers digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. ImportError: cannot import name make_option (OOMMEN KM)
>   2. Re: ImportError: cannot import name make_option (Parthan SR)
>   3. Re: ImportError: cannot import name make_option (Senthil Kumaran)
>   4. Re: ImportError: cannot import name make_option (Praveen Kumar)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 11:28:31 -0500
> From: OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com>
> Subject: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> To: bangpypers at python.org
> Message-ID:
>        <7114437c0901260828h33728965tb6e7f6a43bcae9f7 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi All,
> I am a beginner in Django Development.
> I have installed Django.
>
>  As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
> django-admin.py  command I got the following error.
>
> ----------------
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/usr/bin/django-admin.py", line 2, in <module>
>    from django.core import management
>  File
> "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/__init__.py", line
> 7, in <module>
>    from django.core.management.base import BaseCommand, CommandError,
> handle_default_options
>  File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/base.py",
> line 3, in <module>
>    from optparse import make_option, OptionParser
> ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> -----------------
>
> Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
> Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.
>
> Thanking you in advance.
>
>
> --
> -------
> Mr. Oommen Mathew
> Python Software Analyst
> rKc Media Group Inc.
>
> Mob - +91 9446917322
> ----------------------
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/bangpypers/attachments/20090126/b0539e73/attachment-0001.htm
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 22:36:10 +0530
> From: Parthan SR <parth.technofreak at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Message-ID: <497DED82.8050408 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
> OOMMEN KM wrote:
> >
> >     from optparse import make_option, OptionParser
> > ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> > -----------------
> >
> > Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
> What version of Python are you using? As far as I can see, optparse
> module comes in-built with python since v2.3.
> Can you try `from optparse import name_option` in a python shell opened
> in a terminal/command promt?
>
> --
> ---
> With Regards,
>
> Parthan "technofreak"
> <gpg>  2FF01026
> <blog> http://blog.technofreak.in
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 23:45:24 +0530
> From: Senthil Kumaran <orsenthil at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Message-ID:
>        <7c42eba10901261015p54d12fc4p2c7a5080e0ce3452 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> > OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >  As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
> > django-admin.py  command I got the following error.
> >
> > ----------------
> > Traceback (most recent call last):
>
> Seems to be a problem either with your installation of Django or
> incompatibility issue.
>
> Couple of things to do.
> 1) Version of python: Do python -V
> >From your traceback it seems you are using Python 2.5. But still it is
> required to list the version and make sure you are using the latest.
> 2) How are you installing django? Just mention the steps.
>
> And try Parthan SR's suggestion also.
>
>
> --
> Senthil
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 10:28:44 +0530
> From: Praveen Kumar <praveen at mahiti.org>
> Subject: Re: [BangPypers] ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
> Message-ID:
>        <6f7fd6e90901262058g1f5a3881ocfe1201212f761e3 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi OOmen
>
> If you are really beginner of Django
>
> please go through
> http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-django/to understand
> the installation and configuration.
>
> you are trying to import
>
>
> code.djangoproject.com/browser/django/trunk/django/contrib/gis/management/commands/ogrinspect.py?rev=8219&f
>
> On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 9:58 PM, OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hi All,
> > I am a beginner in Django Development.
> > I have installed Django.
> >
> >  As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
> > django-admin.py  command I got the following error.
> >
> > ----------------
> > Traceback (most recent call last):
> >   File "/usr/bin/django-admin.py", line 2, in <module>
> >     from django.core import management
> >   File
> > "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/__init__.py",
> line
> > 7, in <module>
> >     from django.core.management.base import BaseCommand, CommandError,
> > handle_default_options
> >   File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/base.py",
> > line 3, in <module>
> >     from optparse import make_option, OptionParser
> > ImportError: cannot import name make_option
> > -----------------
> >
> > Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
> > Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.
> >
> > Thanking you in advance.
> >
> >
> > --
> > -------
> > Mr. Oommen Mathew
> > Python Software Analyst
> > rKc Media Group Inc.
> >
> > Mob - +91 9446917322
> > ----------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BangPypers mailing list
> > BangPypers at python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Praveen Kumar
> Software Engineer
> Mahiti Infotech Pvt. Ltd.
> # 33-34, Hennur Cross
> Hennur Main Road
> Bangalore, India - 560043
> Mobile:  +91 9343297314
>            +91 9739854134
> http://www.mahiti.org
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/bangpypers/attachments/20090127/8092fe21/attachment-0001.htm
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>
> End of BangPypers Digest, Vol 17, Issue 31
> ******************************************
>



-- 
-------
Mr. Oommen Mathew
Sr. Python Software Analyst
rKc Media Group Inc.

Mob - +91 9446917322
----------------------
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From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Tue Jan 27 12:39:02 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 17:09:02 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] BangPypers Digest, Vol 17, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <7114437c0901270325q6bfc64b6o6d9e203df1b773f1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.65.1233054019.20903.bangpypers@python.org>
	<7114437c0901270325q6bfc64b6o6d9e203df1b773f1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901271709.02833.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Tuesday 27 Jan 2009 4:55:41 pm OOMMEN KM wrote:
> Thank you all for responding to my doubt.

it is not a good idea to respond to digests - no one can find out what post 
you are responding to

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Tue Jan 27 12:44:45 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 17:14:45 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] django import error (was Re:  BangPypers Digest, Vol 17,
 Issue 31)
In-Reply-To: <7114437c0901270325q6bfc64b6o6d9e203df1b773f1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.65.1233054019.20903.bangpypers@python.org>
	<7114437c0901270325q6bfc64b6o6d9e203df1b773f1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <497EF3AD.5090509@gmail.com>

OOMMEN KM wrote:
> Thank you all for responding to my doubt.
>
> Yeah i tried to import it in the interactive shell of python, as 
> parthan suggested, but it shows an error
> "Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
> ImportError: cannot import name name_option"
Well, wasn't it "make_option" and not "name_option" ? :-/

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From caulagi at gmail.com  Tue Jan 27 18:08:28 2009
From: caulagi at gmail.com (Pradip P Caulagi)
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 22:38:28 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Barcamp Bangalore 8
Message-ID: <20090127170828.GA6035@bsnlbroadband.com>

Hi,

Barcamp Bangalore's 8th edition was recently announced: 7-8 March @
Yahoo!

    http://barcampbangalore.org/

Hope to meet fellow Pythoners and also have some Python centric discussions. 

From venkat83 at gmail.com  Wed Jan 28 07:31:01 2009
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2009 12:01:01 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] PyCon 2009 registration is now open!
In-Reply-To: <4335d2c40901271604j1d86cce0yb07ff8ac7e04f8f4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4335d2c40901271604j1d86cce0yb07ff8ac7e04f8f4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a3b05e8b0901272231j430909c9uc739f4bec4e31a01@mail.gmail.com>

Register here:
http://us.pycon.org/2009/register/

Information (rates etc.):
http://us.pycon.org/2009/registration/

Hotel information & reservations:
http://us.pycon.org/2009/about/hotel/

Early bird registration ends February 21, so don't delay!

-V-
http://twitter.com/venkat83
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From venkat83 at gmail.com  Wed Jan 28 07:39:06 2009
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2009 12:09:06 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Barcamp Bangalore 8
In-Reply-To: <20090127170828.GA6035@bsnlbroadband.com>
References: <20090127170828.GA6035@bsnlbroadband.com>
Message-ID: <a3b05e8b0901272239l29a579f7y7b4524fbb9d92d2e@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:38 PM, Pradip P Caulagi <caulagi at gmail.com>wrote:

>
> Hope to meet fellow Pythoners and also have some Python centric
> discussions.



We just _do_ things in the Python world - no discussions ;)

-V-
http://twitter.com/venkat83
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From urskarthiksp at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 09:52:58 2009
From: urskarthiksp at gmail.com (SP Karthik)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 14:22:58 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Job Openings
Message-ID: <e01a9a4a0901290052g33b0eb4cm44ca95c40288dfac@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Friends,

*Moog Inc* (Aircraft Group) is looking for Python professionals for their
test equipment team. Job Profile is as follows:

*Job Profile :*

Good knowledge of Python scripting ( 2- 8 years)
Exposure to validation and verification procedure.
Exposure to Aircraft concepts shall be an added advantage
Exposure to LabVIEW shall be an added advantage.
Exposure to Card Level Testing shall be an added advantage.

Interested people can send resumes to mail ID india_te_design at moog.com with
*TE* in the mail's subject

-- 
Karthik
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From venkat83 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 09:57:43 2009
From: venkat83 at gmail.com (Venkatraman S)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 14:27:43 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Job Openings
In-Reply-To: <e01a9a4a0901290052g33b0eb4cm44ca95c40288dfac@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e01a9a4a0901290052g33b0eb4cm44ca95c40288dfac@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a3b05e8b0901290057i7e73fea7ifa98198e58804a3c@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 2:22 PM, SP Karthik <urskarthiksp at gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> Good knowledge of Python scripting ( 2- 8 years)
>

Whoa! if you get hold of the guy with 8 yrs exp in Py in India - please let
us know.

-V-
http://twitter.com/venkat83
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From vsapre80 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 10:17:42 2009
From: vsapre80 at gmail.com (Vishal)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 14:47:42 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Job Openings
In-Reply-To: <e01a9a4a0901290052g33b0eb4cm44ca95c40288dfac@mail.gmail.com>
References: <e01a9a4a0901290052g33b0eb4cm44ca95c40288dfac@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a13a3b480901290117o6daa3a82nd7c9f8bafd2b6d7e@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Karthik,
I have sent my resume to the address you've given. Is there anything else I
should do to increase chances of an interview call.

Do you work at Moog?

Thanks and best regards,
Vishal Sapre

On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 2:22 PM, SP Karthik <urskarthiksp at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello Friends,
>
> *Moog Inc* (Aircraft Group) is looking for Python professionals for their
> test equipment team. Job Profile is as follows:
>
> *Job Profile :*
>
> Good knowledge of Python scripting ( 2- 8 years)
> Exposure to validation and verification procedure.
> Exposure to Aircraft concepts shall be an added advantage
> Exposure to LabVIEW shall be an added advantage.
> Exposure to Card Level Testing shall be an added advantage.
>
> Interested people can send resumes to mail ID india_te_design at moog.com with
> *TE* in the mail's subject
>
> --
> Karthik
>
> _______________________________________________
> BangPypers mailing list
> BangPypers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers
>
>


-- 
- "Day by day, in every way, I am getting better, better and better !!!"
- "A Strong and Positive attitude creates more miracles than anything else.
Because...Life is 10% how you make it, and 90% how you take it"
- "Diamond is another piece of coal that did well under pressure"

Visit, for some good music:
http://members.soundclick.com/mukulsapre
http://www.soundclick.com/gurusgrace
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From oommenkm at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 10:51:34 2009
From: oommenkm at gmail.com (OOMMEN KM)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 04:51:34 -0500
Subject: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django
Message-ID: <7114437c0901290151q2c7ae599i3839892b3a953f08@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,
I am a beginner in Django Development.
I have installed Django.

 As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
django-admin.py  command I got the following error.

----------------
Traceback (most recent call last):
 File "/usr/bin/django-admin.py", line 2, in <module>
   from django.core import management
 File
"/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/__init__.py", line
7, in <module>
   from django.core.management.base import BaseCommand, CommandError,
handle_default_options
 File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/django/core/management/base.py",
line 3, in <module>
   from optparse import make_option, OptionParser
ImportError: cannot import name make_option
-----------------

Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.

Thanking you in advance.


-- 
-------
Mr. Oommen Mathew
Sr. Python Software Analyst
rKc Media Group Inc.

Mob - +91 9446917322
----------------------
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From gnuyoga at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 11:28:44 2009
From: gnuyoga at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?KOCktuCljeCksOClgCkgU3JlZWthbnRoIEI=?=)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:58:44 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django
In-Reply-To: <7114437c0901290151q2c7ae599i3839892b3a953f08@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7114437c0901290151q2c7ae599i3839892b3a953f08@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <db49484f0901290228p237f2e58w70b31233694d58a8@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 3:21 PM, OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Hi All,
> I am a beginner in Django Development.
> I have installed Django.
>
>  As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
> django-admin.py  command I got the following error.
>
>
> Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
> Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.
>


http://www.webmonkey.com/tutorial/Install_Django_and_Build_Your_First_App
http://blog.haydon.id.au/2008/08/2-your-first-django-site-simple-cms.html


if u still dont get it write, i think u should write one


- sree

-- 
http://picasaweb.google.com/gnuyoga

All things come through desire and every sincere prayer is answered !
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From vnbang2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Jan 29 13:12:29 2009
From: vnbang2003 at yahoo.com (VIJAY KUMAR)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 17:42:29 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django
References: <7114437c0901290151q2c7ae599i3839892b3a953f08@mail.gmail.com>
	<db49484f0901290228p237f2e58w70b31233694d58a8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <193185.83725.qm@web94005.mail.in2.yahoo.com>



 Hi,
       This  problem  comes when django installation is not done properly on LINUX machine . I don't know about windows.
       You have have done installation with not root privileges then django installation fail and may be you may have not read the end message correctly. 
       This what happened with me .

with regard's
vijay







________________________________
From: (????) Sreekanth B <gnuyoga at gmail.com>
To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
Sent: Thursday, 29 January, 2009 3:58:44 PM
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django


On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 3:21 PM, OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com> wrote:


Hi All,
I am a beginner in Django Development.
I have installed Django.

 As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
django-admin.py  command I got the following error.



Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.


http://www.webmonkey.com/tutorial/Install_Django_and_Build_Your_First_Apphttp://blog.haydon.id.au/2008/08/2-your-first-django-site-simple-cms.html


if u still dont get it write, i think u should write one 


- sree

-- 
http://picasaweb.google.com/gnuyoga

All things come through desire and every sincere prayer is answered ! 



      Download prohibited? No problem. CHAT from any browser, without download. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/
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From vnbang2003 at yahoo.com  Thu Jan 29 13:14:52 2009
From: vnbang2003 at yahoo.com (VIJAY KUMAR)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 17:44:52 +0530 (IST)
Subject: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django
References: <7114437c0901290151q2c7ae599i3839892b3a953f08@mail.gmail.com>
	<db49484f0901290228p237f2e58w70b31233694d58a8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <794570.34019.qm@web94006.mail.in2.yahoo.com>



 Hi,
 This link can help you better.
        http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/intro/install/#intro-install


Cheers

vijay







________________________________
From: (????) Sreekanth B <gnuyoga at gmail.com>
To: Bangalore Python Users Group - India <bangpypers at python.org>
Sent: Thursday, 29 January, 2009 3:58:44 PM
Subject: Re: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django


On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 3:21 PM, OOMMEN KM <oommenkm at gmail.com> wrote:


Hi All,
I am a beginner in Django Development.
I have installed Django.

 As I was trying to build my first site in Django, I gave the
django-admin.py  command I got the following error.



Can anyone help me in solving this issue.
Or Can anyone guide me in building my first site.


http://www.webmonkey.com/tutorial/Install_Django_and_Build_Your_First_Apphttp://blog.haydon.id.au/2008/08/2-your-first-django-site-simple-cms.html


if u still dont get it write, i think u should write one 


- sree

-- 
http://picasaweb.google.com/gnuyoga

All things come through desire and every sincere prayer is answered ! 



      Download prohibited? No problem. CHAT from any browser, without download. Go to http://in.webmessenger.yahoo.com/
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From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 13:36:42 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 18:06:42 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django
In-Reply-To: <193185.83725.qm@web94005.mail.in2.yahoo.com>
References: <7114437c0901290151q2c7ae599i3839892b3a953f08@mail.gmail.com>	<db49484f0901290228p237f2e58w70b31233694d58a8@mail.gmail.com>
	<193185.83725.qm@web94005.mail.in2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4981A2DA.2020501@gmail.com>

VIJAY KUMAR wrote:
>
>        You have have done installation with not root privileges then 
> django installation fail and may be you may have not read the end 
> message correctly.
>
"root" as in the system root user or the django's root/super user?
I always run web applications on production from directories in my home 
directory and never had to use root privileges with django,
if you were meaning the system root user.

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From parth.technofreak at gmail.com  Thu Jan 29 13:38:30 2009
From: parth.technofreak at gmail.com (Parthan SR)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 18:08:30 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django
Message-ID: <4981A346.1010100@gmail.com>

VIJAY KUMAR wrote:
>
>        You have have done installation with not root privileges then 
> django installation fail and may be you may have not read the end 
> message correctly.
>

"root" as in the system root user or the django's root/super user?
I always run web applications on production from directories in my home 
directory and never had to use root privileges with django,
if you were meaning the system root user.

-- 
---
With Regards,

Parthan "technofreak"
<gpg>  2FF01026
<blog> http://blog.technofreak.in


From lawgon at au-kbc.org  Thu Jan 29 13:52:00 2009
From: lawgon at au-kbc.org (Kenneth Gonsalves)
Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 18:22:00 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] How to develop site using Django
In-Reply-To: <4981A2DA.2020501@gmail.com>
References: <7114437c0901290151q2c7ae599i3839892b3a953f08@mail.gmail.com>
	<193185.83725.qm@web94005.mail.in2.yahoo.com>
	<4981A2DA.2020501@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200901291822.00928.lawgon@au-kbc.org>

On Thursday 29 Jan 2009 6:06:42 pm Parthan SR wrote:
> VIJAY KUMAR wrote:
> > ? ? ? ?You have have done installation with not root privileges then
> > django installation fail and may be you may have not read the end
> > message correctly.
>
> "root" as in the system root user or the django's root/super user?
> I always run web applications on production from directories in my home
> directory and never had to use root privileges with django,

how do you configure apache without root?

-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

From mahesh at games2win.com  Fri Jan 30 05:47:31 2009
From: mahesh at games2win.com (Mahesh Khambadkone)
Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2009 10:17:31 +0530
Subject: [BangPypers] Job Opening at gamecurry.com
In-Reply-To: <mailman.38539.1233224928.3486.bangpypers@python.org>
References: <mailman.38539.1233224928.3486.bangpypers@python.org>
Message-ID: <004501c98295$dfb7c330$6500a8c0@C2WDOMAIN>

Hello Friends !

Games2win (Mumbai-based online gaming company) operates a Game Discovery
portal called gamecurry.com.  We are looking for a Python developer for our
Bangalore office to take technical ownership of the product.

The Job Profile is as follows :

Good knowledge of Python (2-3 years).  
Manage existing code base - enhancements, refactoring, functionality
addition
Design and implement new modules as per product roadmap
Past experience working at a software product company, or a dot-com
(e-commerce, consumer facing) company would be preferred.
Familiarity building search, gaming and / or crowd-sourcing applications
will be a added bonus.

The position is for the Bangalore office, and will require periodic travel
to Mumbai.

Interested people can please send their resumes to mahesh at games2win.com.

Thanks,

Mahesh Khambadkone