From bloggerman08 at yahoo.com Thu Jan 3 10:55:36 2008 From: bloggerman08 at yahoo.com (Blogger Man) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 01:55:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [python-advocacy] Nikolai Lyustiger, Computer Virus Message-ID: <845461.30641.qm@web45914.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Nikolai Lyustiger, Computer Virus Who can forget the way the world was frozen with the threat of the "Millennium Bug"? While people around the globe should have been counting down to a phenomenal celebration, we were too busy preparing for certain doom and gloom beset by a computer virus. Of course, the clock struck twelve on January 1, 2000 and a new millennium quietly began, bug-free. Those unfortunate enough to have had to deal with a computer virus knows all too well the damage that can be done. From taking on annoying quirks, to erasing files, to completely obliterating computers or entire systems, the powerful effect of a computer virus is nothing to sneeze at. Computer viruses pose real threats that can be minimal, or can cause worldwide destruction. In computer security technology circles, the definition of a computer virus is a "self-replicating program that spreads by inserting copies of itself into other executable code or documents". A computer virus behaves in a manner similar to a biological virus, which spreads by inserting itself into living cells. Extending the analogy, the insertion of a computer virus into a program is termed as an "infection" and the infected file (or executable code that is not part of a file) is called a "host". Viruses are one of several types of malicious software, also known as "malware". The term "virus" is often extended to refer to worms, Trojan horses and other sorts of malware. These are less common than they used to be, however, so the inclusion of these types of malware can be confusing to computer users. This confusion can have serious implications, as it can lead to a focus on preventing one genre of malware over another, potentially leaving computers vulnerable to future damage. The basic rule holds that computer viruses can only damage software, not hardware. Viruses have targeted in the following types of hosts: * Boot sectors of floppy disks; hard disk partitions. * Master boot record of a hard disk. * Binary executable files (.COM-files and .EXE-files in MS-DOS; portable executable files in Microsoft Windows; ELF files in Linux). * General-purpose script files (batch files in MS-DOS and Microsoft Windows; shell script files on Unix-like platforms). * Application-specific script files (Telix scripts). * Documents containing macros (Microsoft Word documents). A computer virus by nature is destructive, but others are created solely for the annoyance factor. Some viruses pester computer users with a delayed payload, also known as a "bomb". For example, a bomb virus might display a message on a specific day, or wait until it has infected a certain number of hosts. A time bomb occurs on a particular date or time, and a logic bomb occurs when the computer user takes an action that triggers the bomb. However, the predominant negative effect of viruses continues to be their uncontrolled self-reproduction, which wastes or overwhelms computer resources. To hinder the continuous spread of computer viruses, programmers have created anti-virus software. However, a fast infector can infect every potential host file that it's able to access. This presents a special problem to anti-virus software. A virus scanner will perform a system-wide scan, accessing every potential host file on the computer. If the virus scanner fails to notice that a virus exists in the computer's memory, the virus can "piggy-back" on the virus scanner, and infect every file that is scanned. Fast infectors rely on their incredible spreading rate. To combat the problem, certain anti-virus software programs, like the well-known Spyware, are expanding to cover worms and other threats. Like the potential devastation of the Millennium Bug in 2000, computer viruses continue to present a real threat to single users and corporate networks alike. Lisa Moore writes articles for several web magazines, including and --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/advocacy/attachments/20080103/29351235/attachment.htm From bloggerman08 at yahoo.com Thu Jan 3 14:00:11 2008 From: bloggerman08 at yahoo.com (Blogger Man) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 05:00:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [python-advocacy] Carlos Hank Rhon, Amending Procedural Laws for Collection of E-taxation Message-ID: <14106.32163.qm@web45914.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Carlos Hank Rhon, Amending Procedural Laws for Collection of E-taxation The electronic transaction ordinance defines the certificated copies in which are to be presented for adjudication. Where any law requires or permits the production of certified copies of any records, such requirement or permission shall extend to print outs or other forms of display of electronic documents where, in addition to fulfillment of the requirements as may be specified in such law relating to certification, it is verified in the manner laid down by the appropriate authority. The code of civil procedure should be amended to oblige the court to accept the endorsement rule as enunciated in the rule 4 and 5 Order XI of the Code of Civil Procedure Act 1908 as defined in section 12 of Electronic Transaction Ordinance 2002. The power to summon as defined in subsection (1) of section 94 of Cr.P.C (Act V of 1898) should be extended so as to add the power of police to summon all persons who has committed offence under electronic transaction ordinance 2002. My recommendations are that amendments should be made in section 95 of the Cr.P.C.( Act V of 1898) in manner as to add wordings of 'electronic document' and power of certification services provider defined in electronic transaction ordinance 2002, parallel with the power of possession of documents held by postal and telegraphic authorities and the similar types of amendments are recommended in subsection (1) of section 96 and in clause (a) to (e) of subsection (1) of section 99. The section 510 of Cr.P.C. (Act V of 1898) should be amended for acceptance of the report of Certification council issued under section 21 of electronic transaction ordinance 2002. The writer is an advocate of High Court and practicing immigration and corporate laws in Pakistan since September 2001. He is a self employed and pioneer in research on electronic commerce taxation in Pakistan. His articles were published widely in the critical areas of cyber crimes, electronic commerce, e-taxation and various other topics. He wrote LL.M thesis on titled "Legislation of electronic commerce taxation in Pakistan" in which he provided comprehensive legal proposals for statutory reconstruction of tax laws for purpose of imposition of taxation on e-business in Pakistan. Currently he is conducting is research on topic 'Electronic commerce taxation: emerging legal issues of digital evidence'.Author can be contacted by adil.waseem at lawyer.com --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/advocacy/attachments/20080103/2cc3924a/attachment.htm From lac at openend.se Thu Jan 3 14:06:55 2008 From: lac at openend.se (Laura Creighton) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 14:06:55 +0100 Subject: [python-advocacy] Did somebody ask for these messages from bloggerman, or are we being spammed? Message-ID: <200801031306.m03D6tj7010910@theraft.openend.se> I think somebody thinks this is a general list for political activism in the USA or something. Maybe its time to block posts from the sender? Laura From andre.roberge at gmail.com Thu Jan 3 14:14:27 2008 From: andre.roberge at gmail.com (Andre Roberge) Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 09:14:27 -0400 Subject: [python-advocacy] Did somebody ask for these messages from bloggerman, or are we being spammed? In-Reply-To: <200801031306.m03D6tj7010910@theraft.openend.se> References: <200801031306.m03D6tj7010910@theraft.openend.se> Message-ID: <7528bcdd0801030514o30632210p3352a8cc546e6dd1@mail.gmail.com> Happy New Year Laura, and all! If you look at the messages from http://mail.python.org/pipermail/advocacy/2008-January/date.html you will notice that some html attachments have been scrubbed. So, I suspect what we see is simply some text inserted in an attempt to defeat spam filters. Andr? On Jan 3, 2008 9:06 AM, Laura Creighton wrote: > I think somebody thinks this is a general list for political activism in the > USA or something. Maybe its time to block posts from the sender? > > Laura > _______________________________________________ > Advocacy mailing list > Advocacy at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy > From candyshop999 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 11:15:07 2008 From: candyshop999 at gmail.com (Super Star) Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 12:15:07 +0200 Subject: [python-advocacy] Martin Pelmore, How to get a higher limit on your credit card Message-ID: Martin Pelmore, How to get a higher limit on your credit card Nearly everyone who has a credit card always has the goal of a higher line of credit. A higher credit card limit will enable you to make much higher purchases, normally purchases that you are unable to get with your current line of credit. There are ways that you can get a higher credit limit. Below, are some tips that will help you raise the limit of your credit. The most important thing to do when improving your credit limit is to improve your overall level of credit worthiness. This tells banks and lenders that you can be trusted with credit, and that you are little to no risk for them. When lenders and banks look at your credit report, this is the first thing that they look for. You can attract a lot of positive attention with a credit card company or bank with your finance purchases. You should pay them every once in a while, although you shouldn?t go out of your way to make a habit of it. Normally, this should be done as a last resort when all else fails to increase your overall chances of raising your line of credit. Once you prove to a bank or credit card company that you can be trusted to borrow money, they may raise your line of credit. You should be careful with this strategy however, as this could only apply to your bank or current credit card company. Having a higher credit line may allow you to have more purchasing power, although it can also leave you with more fees and even an increase in your current interest and APR charges. Another great way to increase your credit limit is to use your credit card every chance you get. When you have a credit card, don?t use it just for emergency purposes. If you save your credit card for emergency purposes only, you?ll rarely use it. When this happens, your company will begin to wonder about your spending behavior and ability to pay it back, therefore they will start to think twice about giving you a higher line of credit. When you send in your payment, always try to pay more than just the minimum amount. If you can afford to, you should try to pay the whole outstanding amount. Doing so shows credit card companies and banks that you are striving for better credit. This way, you?ll show them that you deserve to have a higher line of credit. If you follow the above tips, you?ll get your credit limit higher in no time at all. Once you get your limit raised, you should protect it at all costs. If you continue to strive for perfection - you?ll get a higher line of credit than you ever thought possible. You can find the best choice of credit cards and pre-paid cards at () Matthew Meyer. For more information about credit cards see the credit card section of TheFreeAdForum.com directory at: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/advocacy/attachments/20080104/049fdc9c/attachment.htm From candyshop999 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 14:42:43 2008 From: candyshop999 at gmail.com (Super Star) Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 15:42:43 +0200 Subject: [python-advocacy] Douglas Della Toffalo, How Much Is Your Popcorn Worth? Powerful Lessons In Marketing & The Psychology Of Selling - Part 2 Message-ID: Douglas Della Toffalo, How Much Is Your Popcorn Worth? Powerful Lessons In Marketing & The Psychology Of Selling - Part 2 NB: You can read part one here: Could buying popcorn in a theatre be a 'conditioned' response? Could it be that people are 'trained' to believe that movies and popcorn go 'hand in hand' - and that one without the other is...."incomplete?" And, therefore, price is just not an issue at all? What a powerful place to be as a marketer, wouldn't you agree? Of course, there are some customers who fall in the above group yet still aren't completely happy with the experience. They still end up buying the popcorn because the desire to have popcorn with their movie outweighs the pain of having to pay the higher price. Here are more answers that I received... "It is marketed as all part of the movie going experience! And they've got a captive audience - you can't get it in there unless you buy it from them. So if you want to experience the movie it it's fullest extent, you need to get the popcorn, and it needs to be their popcorn." And another... "First off may I say it is the conditioning that the movie theatres, producers etc have done. Movies and popcorn go hand in hand. The movie goer has been conditioned all throughout life, so that is what is on their minds when going to a movie. Once at the movies the smell of popcorn cooking, the power of the senses reinforces the thought of movies and popcorn. Once at the movies you are a captive audience." Yep. As, you can see, there's more than one marketing principle at work here. Stacked on top of each other, these strategies produce the overall result that's very powerful and very effective. I'll go over each one below. And...I'll also cover one big mistake movie theatres are making. Let's discuss the various marketing principles that are involved in "popcorn marketing": *1. Conditioning and Programmed Responses* Since childhood, people have been 'conditioned' to associate popcorn with movies. Growing up, many of us enjoyed popcorn with our favourite movies, and we now see a bag of popcorn as an addition to the "overall" movie-enjoying experience. Some of us even see it as a 'requirement' to watching a movie. Here's how one of my smart subscribers explained it... "I think cinemas are relying on a very strong emotion -- nostalgia. Many of our happiest memories from childhood probably involve experiencing wonderful movies, maybe Bambi or Mary Poppins. It is likely that popcorn accompanied these life-changing events. Whenever we go to see a movie, popcorn will be linked with some of our happiest memories. I'm surprise they can't get away with charging more!" Bingo! We have been conditioned and 'trained' to believe that movies and popcorn go hand in hand. Watching a movie without having popcorn somehow doesn't seem 'complete.' Eating popcorn by itself may or may not do anything for people. But, having popcorn while enjoying a movie is the "icing on the cake." It enhances the movie-going experience. Yet, others are conditioned to want to munch on 'something' while they're watching a movie, be it popcorn, a hotdog, or any other snack. Because of this conditioning, they will buy something from the concession stand, despite the high prices. But here's what's really interesting... movie theatres didn't create this demand or 'conditioned' response. They simply aligned with an 'existing' demand, an existing 'conditioning' and fulfilled it. What are the other demands and 'conditioning' mechanisms that exist around you which you could tap into and profit from? Look around. I'm sure you'll start to see many of them once you shift your focus towards that. To read the rest of this special report, you can download it here: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/advocacy/attachments/20080104/f9caf44d/attachment.htm From candyshop999 at gmail.com Fri Jan 4 13:18:30 2008 From: candyshop999 at gmail.com (Super Star) Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 14:18:30 +0200 Subject: [python-advocacy] John Rosatti, Weights Before Cardio: Stop Working Against Yourself Message-ID: John Rosatti, Weights Before Cardio: Stop Working Against Yourself Just because you're working hard, doesn't mean that you're working smart. I see it every day. People come into the gym and hop on a treadmill for 30-60 minutes and then head over to the weights to do their resistance training. Even though my initial reaction is to walk up and smack them in the back of the head, the reality in the matter is... How would they know any better? Which is why I thought this article was so appropriate. After all, for years I've heard people say that if you do your cardio first, you'll burn more fat during your weight training. Making your weight training an extension of your cardio. Let's look at why this isn't true and see if we can save some people a little wasted effort. We'll start out by looking at how your body uses the food you consume for fuel. You may have heard that you will burn more fat if you do your cardio on an empty stomach. The truth is that you will actually burn more fat during cardio if you have depleted your body of carbohydrates. You can eat proteins and dietary fats without affecting the way your body burns fat. In other words, you could eat some egg whites, chicken breast, or even a protein shake without any carbs in it, and still burn the same amount of fat during your cardio session as you would if you did it on an empty stomach. But if you ate an apple or a piece of bread before your cardio, you wouldn't. When you eat carbohydrates, your body stores them as glycogen in your liver and waits for your body to use them as fuel. When performing an aerobic activity, like walking or running on a treadmill, your body has the option of using glycogen stores or fat stores. The problem is that your body won't use any fat stores until your glycogen stores are used up. On the other hand, during anaerobic exercise, like weight lifting, your body can only use glycogen as fuel. So here's how it plays out. Studies have shown that it can take as much as 29 minutes of cardio to burn your glycogen stores. So if you start your workout off with 30 minutes of cardio, not only did you burn fat for a whopping one minute, but you also depleted your body of the fuel it needs (glycogen) to do your resistance training. Now, in order to manufacture glucose (glycogen) during your weight training session, your body may actually break down muscle tissue to use certain amino acids as your fuel. You could end up losing muscle instead of gaining. To make things simple, if you do your weight training first, you can use your glycogen stores as fuel. Then, when you move over to your cardio, you're right where you want to be... with depleted glycogen stores, giving your body the opportunity to burn fat as a fuel source. To learn more on how to use these facts for your "cardio only" days, read "Use Nutrition to Boost Your Cardio" here: You may reprint or publish this article freely as long as you include a visible, active link to Tony Hale is a certified personal trainer with 12 years of experience servicing clients in the entertainment industry throughout the Hollywood area. He is also the editor in chief for ShapeYou.com To train online with Tony visit -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/advocacy/attachments/20080104/83f76a62/attachment.htm From jeff at taupro.com Fri Jan 4 20:01:02 2008 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2008 13:01:02 -0600 Subject: [python-advocacy] Did somebody ask for these messages from bloggerman, or are we being spammed? In-Reply-To: <200801031306.m03D6tj7010910@theraft.openend.se> References: <200801031306.m03D6tj7010910@theraft.openend.se> Message-ID: <477E826E.3040504@taupro.com> Laura Creighton wrote: > I think somebody thinks this is a general list for political activism in the > USA or something. Maybe its time to block posts from the sender? Stephan Deibel wrote: > > There's been some spam on python-advocacy from candyshop999 at gmail.com > and yesterday from another email. Is it set up to allow anyone to > post or are these list members? The list is set to hold posts from non-members, but unfortunately these two spamming addresses actually registered for the list. I've set them to have their posts held for examination by me, but this may be a new escalation in the spam war where bots automatically register for lists. If it gets out of hand, I can set the list to require manual approval for anyone joining the list but it's a bit of work to verify someone's credentials and raises a barrier to legitimate participation. Hopefully this is a minor annoyance and will go away. -Jeff From sdeibel at wingware.com Fri Jan 4 20:24:13 2008 From: sdeibel at wingware.com (Stephan Deibel) Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2008 14:24:13 -0500 Subject: [python-advocacy] Did somebody ask for these messages from bloggerman, or are we being spammed? In-Reply-To: <477E826E.3040504@taupro.com> References: <200801031306.m03D6tj7010910@theraft.openend.se> <477E826E.3040504@taupro.com> Message-ID: <477E87DD.4000209@wingware.com> Jeff Rush wrote: > If it gets out of hand, I can set the list to require manual approval for > anyone joining the list but it's a bit of work to verify someone's credentials > and raises a barrier to legitimate participation. One way to do this is not to require approval to join but to ask mailman to set the moderator bit on for new members, so you would need to approve their first post and could at that time uncheck the moderator bit so you don't need to do any further approvals for them. Seeing the first email from them is usually a good way to check their credentials (it's either junk or not). - Stephan From fuzzyman at voidspace.org.uk Fri Jan 4 20:15:17 2008 From: fuzzyman at voidspace.org.uk (Michael Foord) Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2008 19:15:17 +0000 Subject: [python-advocacy] [python] Re: Did somebody ask for these messages from bloggerman, or are we being spammed? In-Reply-To: <477E826E.3040504@taupro.com> References: <200801031306.m03D6tj7010910@theraft.openend.se> <477E826E.3040504@taupro.com> Message-ID: <477E85C5.7070006@voidspace.org.uk> Jeff Rush wrote: > Laura Creighton wrote: > >> I think somebody thinks this is a general list for political activism in the >> USA or something. Maybe its time to block posts from the sender? >> > > Stephan Deibel wrote: > >> There's been some spam on python-advocacy from candyshop999 at gmail.com >> and yesterday from another email. Is it set up to allow anyone to >> post or are these list members? >> > > The list is set to hold posts from non-members, but unfortunately these two > spamming addresses actually registered for the list. I've set them to have > their posts held for examination by me, but this may be a new escalation in > the spam war where bots automatically register for lists. > I run a few google groups (and similar) and spammers sign up for membership to these groups. Banning them works of course. I suspect that the spammers are still signing up manually, but I may be wrong. It is less effort (and not much of a nuisance) to ban members after posting spam rather than approving each new member (IMHO). Michael http://www.manning.com/foord > If it gets out of hand, I can set the list to require manual approval for > anyone joining the list but it's a bit of work to verify someone's credentials > and raises a barrier to legitimate participation. > > Hopefully this is a minor annoyance and will go away. > > -Jeff > _______________________________________________ > Advocacy mailing list > Advocacy at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy > > From amk at amk.ca Wed Jan 9 01:23:52 2008 From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling) Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 19:23:52 -0500 Subject: [python-advocacy] 'Learning Python' a top-selling O'Reilly title Message-ID: <20080109002352.GA783@amk.local> >From http://radar.oreilly.com/archives/2008/01/a_year_in_oreilly_books.html: What's notably missing from the bestseller lists: books on programming languages (besides Javascript). The top programming language books in last week's bookscan report were Learning Python, followed closely by the just-released Head First C#. Books on Java, Perl, PHP, and yes, even Ruby, are well down the list. Books on Linux, MySQL, and security ditto. In the professional computer area, networking, software engineering, and database books that weren't specific to any particular database product were the overall winners --amk From amk at amk.ca Wed Jan 9 14:11:48 2008 From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 08:11:48 -0500 Subject: [python-advocacy] Coverity moves Python to rung 2 of scanning Message-ID: <20080109131148.GD6942@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> http://scan.coverity.com/: Today, Coverity is announcing the release of Coverity Scan, Rung 2. This new level on the Scan ladder includes upgraded analysis based on a more recent version of Coverity Prevent. Eleven diligent projects which had resolved all of the defects identified at Rung 1 are the first projects to be upgraded to Rung 2. Those projects are Amanda, NTP, OpenPAM, OpenVPN, Overdose, Perl, PHP, Postfix, Python, Samba, and TCL --amk From daniel at pageonepr.com Wed Jan 9 20:56:45 2008 From: daniel at pageonepr.com (Daniel Schneider) Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 11:56:45 -0800 Subject: [python-advocacy] Coverity moves Python to rung 2 of scanning In-Reply-To: <20080109131148.GD6942@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> References: <20080109131148.GD6942@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> Message-ID: <1B952504-3F5C-4356-8FC2-5B1881EEF334@pageonepr.com> Does anyone know who is the Python contact for the Coverity Open Source scan? If so, please pass along name and contact info. Trying to see if there is a potential PR plug here. On Jan 9, 2008, at 5:11 AM, A.M. Kuchling wrote: > http://scan.coverity.com/: > > Today, Coverity is announcing the release of Coverity Scan, > Rung 2. This new level on the Scan ladder includes upgraded > analysis based on a more recent version of Coverity Prevent. > > Eleven diligent projects which had resolved all of the defects > identified at Rung 1 are the first projects to be upgraded to > Rung 2. Those projects are Amanda, NTP, OpenPAM, OpenVPN, > Overdose, Perl, PHP, Postfix, Python, Samba, and TCL > > --amk > _______________________________________________ > Advocacy mailing list > Advocacy at python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/advocacy From amk at amk.ca Thu Jan 10 14:45:55 2008 From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling) Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 08:45:55 -0500 Subject: [python-advocacy] Coverity moves Python to rung 2 of scanning In-Reply-To: <1B952504-3F5C-4356-8FC2-5B1881EEF334@pageonepr.com> References: <20080109131148.GD6942@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> <1B952504-3F5C-4356-8FC2-5B1881EEF334@pageonepr.com> Message-ID: <20080110134555.GB6362@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> On Wed, Jan 09, 2008 at 11:56:45AM -0800, Daniel Schneider wrote: > Does anyone know who is the Python contact for the Coverity Open > Source scan? If so, please pass along name and contact info. Do you mean the Python developer who acts as the contact? I believe that's Neal Norwitz (nnorwitz at gmail). I don't know any contact names at Coverity. --amk From goodmansond at gmail.com Thu Jan 10 16:03:44 2008 From: goodmansond at gmail.com (DeanG) Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 09:03:44 -0600 Subject: [python-advocacy] Python Head First book (sort-of) Message-ID: It looks like Python will slither into the Head First series in 2008 as the language for their Structured Programming book "Head First Programming": "* Head First Programming: Take your first steps into structured programming, all within the context of the Python programming language. This is our bridge book for all of you who have wanted to get into Java or C#, and have been intimidated or put off by all the "formal" programming concepts." http://www.oreillynet.com/headfirst/blog/2007/12/presents_for_under_your_tree_f.html#more Another opportunity to recommend a subject http://www.oreillynet.com/headfirst/blog/2008/01/what_do_you_want_to_hear_from.html I've enjoyed the few Head First books I've read. If you liked Kathy Sierra's blog, you'll like the format. - Dean From Cameron at phaseit.net Thu Jan 10 15:37:37 2008 From: Cameron at phaseit.net (Cameron Laird) Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 14:37:37 +0000 Subject: [python-advocacy] Coverity moves Python to rung 2 of scanning In-Reply-To: <20080110134555.GB6362@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> References: <20080109131148.GD6942@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> <1B952504-3F5C-4356-8FC2-5B1881EEF334@pageonepr.com> <20080110134555.GB6362@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> Message-ID: <20080110143736.GA11361@lairds.us> On Thu, Jan 10, 2008 at 08:45:55AM -0500, A.M. Kuchling wrote: . . . > Do you mean the Python developer who acts as the contact? I believe > that's Neal Norwitz (nnorwitz at gmail). I don't know any contact > names at Coverity. . . . I have contacts at Coverity, if no one else can help. From mtobis at gmail.com Thu Jan 10 19:56:46 2008 From: mtobis at gmail.com (Michael Tobis) Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 12:56:46 -0600 Subject: [python-advocacy] Python Head First book (sort-of) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Jan 10, 2008 9:03 AM, DeanG wrote: > It looks like Python will slither into the Head First series in 2008 > as the language for their Structured Programming book "Head First > Programming": > > "* Head First Programming: Take your first steps into structured > programming, all within the context of the Python programming > language. That is great news! Python really should be the first language for the self-motivated and this will be a great tool. > This is our bridge book for all of you who have wanted to > get into Java or C#, I do not understand. What are these Java and C# of which you speak? mt From zeevb.public at gmail.com Tue Jan 15 16:48:02 2008 From: zeevb.public at gmail.com (Zeev B) Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 17:48:02 +0200 Subject: [python-advocacy] The TIOBE Programming Community Index Declares Python the Programming Language of 2007 Message-ID: <4ea013420801150748t1e8342c5h3a61383cff7524ff@mail.gmail.com> http://www.tiobe.com/tpci.htm "Python has been declared as programming language of 2007. It was a close finish, but in the end Python appeared to have the largest increase in ratings in one year time (2.04%). There is no clear reason why Python made this huge jump in 2007. Last month Python surpassed Perl for the first time in history, which is an indication that Python has become the "de facto" glue language at system level. It is especially beloved by system administrators and build managers. Chances are high that Python's star will rise further in 2008, thanks to the upcoming release of Python 3." Slashdot: http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/01/09/1819221 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/advocacy/attachments/20080115/ce5df9f4/attachment.htm From jeff at taupro.com Thu Jan 24 09:59:09 2008 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 02:59:09 -0600 Subject: [python-advocacy] Python Training Classes in Houston/Austin? Message-ID: <4798535D.2000703@taupro.com> I've been contacted by someone who is seeking Python training classes in either the Houston or Austin area, for individuals, i.e. they lack the budget to fly in a professional trainer for a corporate training session. While there are the list of trainers on the page at: http://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonTraining it can be hard to see whether they are in Houston or Austin. The person says they have found a few classes but they focus heavily on C++ in their Python classes and they do not want C++. Wierd that. -Jeff From amk at amk.ca Thu Jan 24 15:10:38 2008 From: amk at amk.ca (A.M. Kuchling) Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 09:10:38 -0500 Subject: [python-advocacy] Python Training Classes in Houston/Austin? In-Reply-To: <4798535D.2000703@taupro.com> References: <4798535D.2000703@taupro.com> Message-ID: <20080124141038.GA6522@amk-desktop.matrixgroup.net> On Thu, Jan 24, 2008 at 02:59:09AM -0600, Jeff Rush wrote: > it can be hard to see whether they are in Houston or Austin. The person says > they have found a few classes but they focus heavily on C++ in their Python > classes and they do not want C++. Wierd that. Aren't most trainers mobile, though? For example, Mark Lutz and Martin Blais will teach anywhere you like, as long as you pay for their flight. --amk From cbc at unc.edu Thu Jan 24 17:12:19 2008 From: cbc at unc.edu (Chris Calloway) Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 11:12:19 -0500 Subject: [python-advocacy] [group-organizers] Python Training Classes in Houston/Austin? In-Reply-To: <4798535D.2000703@taupro.com> References: <4798535D.2000703@taupro.com> Message-ID: <4798B8E3.5060704@unc.edu> Jeff Rush wrote: > I've been contacted by someone who is seeking Python training classes in > either the Houston or Austin area, for individuals, i.e. they lack the budget > to fly in a professional trainer for a corporate training session. > > While there are the list of trainers on the page at: > > http://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonTraining > > it can be hard to see whether they are in Houston or Austin. The person says > they have found a few classes but they focus heavily on C++ in their Python > classes and they do not want C++. Wierd that. I was notified today that University of Houston and Enfold Systems are working again to bring me back to Houston to instruct another PyCamp in September. The PyCamp events are ultra-low cost (around $300 for an intensive one week class) because they are run as community events rather than corporate training. Beginning PyCamp is also pure Python for people who don't know C++. :) -- Sincerely, Chris Calloway http://www.seacoos.org office: 332 Chapman Hall phone: (919) 962-4323 mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599 From lac at openend.se Sun Jan 27 01:06:08 2008 From: lac at openend.se (Laura Creighton) Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2008 01:06:08 +0100 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? Message-ID: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> I need a figure for a report. Anybody got anything that is recent and quotable? Python users europe-wide and world-wide are most useful, but if you happen to have a very accurate one for some place else, I can use that too. (Hmmm. its late. I phrased that wrongly. 300 of you will all say that you have the most accurate figure that python is used by 'one person at my house'. I am too tired to rewrite the above. You knew what I meant. :-) ) Laura From aahz at pythoncraft.com Sun Jan 27 01:14:38 2008 From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz) Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2008 16:14:38 -0800 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? In-Reply-To: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> References: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> Message-ID: <20080127001438.GB26735@panix.com> On Sun, Jan 27, 2008, Laura Creighton wrote: > > I need a figure for a report. Anybody got anything that is recent > and quotable? Python users europe-wide and world-wide are most useful, > but if you happen to have a very accurate one for some place else, > I can use that too. When Stef and I wrote our proposal for _Python for Dummies_, we used this as our source for about 700K Python programmers: http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2004-December/050412.html Given recent growth trends, I think one million users is a reasonable number. I can't find any more-recent authoritative figures with a quick Google. -- Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/ "All problems in computer science can be solved by another level of indirection." --Butler Lampson From carl at personnelware.com Sun Jan 27 02:19:08 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2008 19:19:08 -0600 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? In-Reply-To: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> References: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> Message-ID: <479BDC0C.3020108@personnelware.com> Laura Creighton wrote: > I need a figure for a report. Anybody got anything that is recent > and quotable? Python users europe-wide and world-wide are most useful, > but if you happen to have a very accurate one for some place else, > I can use that too. > not what you asked for, but may help: http://www.tiobe.com/index.htm?tiobe_index Your question got me thinking: How could such a number be derived? First we have to understand that realistically, it can't. but we can come up with some interesting numbers that will at least put things in perspective. Keep in mind that MS doesn't even have good numbers. for something like VB (or maybe now vs.net) it has "copies sold" and "copies registered" - which doesn't include the copies bundled with their MSDN pile of disk deals. and just because someone registers does not really make them a user. I think what might be useful: number of python related e-mail addresses. as to not alarm anyone about harvesting email addresses, change that to number of hashs of addresses. >>> hash('carl at personnelware.com') 1785525014 Or if we want to reduce the risk of dupes: >>> hashlib.md5('carl at personnelware.com').hexdigest() 'a9f693639892c6b39ba3e14dbb78e1fb' So we setup a little web page that lets people who have access to list's of python related e-mails upload lists of hashes. server side stuffs them into a db, ignoring dupes. add a date field or 2, vola! statistics! yeah, this is totally un-scientific and un-verifiable, and subject to someone uploading total crap just to inflate the number. so maybe we have to have some screening process for who we allow to upload. I bet 95% of the emails are within the reach of about 20 people, and I bet Goodger or someone would be able name/approve those people in about 5 minutes. each of them would have a small task of scraping together the 100,000+ addresses... yes, many people use more than one. yes, some people have never posted anywhere, yes yes... but it would still be a telling number. and if this was updated each month, we could see how many new items come come up. Carl K From jeff at taupro.com Sun Jan 27 06:00:00 2008 From: jeff at taupro.com (Jeff Rush) Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2008 23:00:00 -0600 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? In-Reply-To: <479BDC0C.3020108@personnelware.com> References: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> <479BDC0C.3020108@personnelware.com> Message-ID: <479C0FD0.1010801@taupro.com> Carl Karsten wrote: > > I think what might be useful: number of python related e-mail addresses. > yes, many people use more than one. yes, some people have never posted > anywhere, yes yes... but it would still be a telling number. 1. Very very few people ever post to a mailing list, compared to the lurkers. A fact of social behavior. 2. There are a great many Python folks who do not belong to mailing lists. It's just not part of their IT culture. -Jeff From sdeibel at wingware.com Mon Jan 28 16:23:08 2008 From: sdeibel at wingware.com (Stephan Deibel) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:23:08 -0500 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? In-Reply-To: <20080127001438.GB26735@panix.com> References: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> <20080127001438.GB26735@panix.com> Message-ID: <479DF35C.7000708@wingware.com> Aahz wrote: > On Sun, Jan 27, 2008, Laura Creighton wrote: >> I need a figure for a report. Anybody got anything that is recent >> and quotable? Python users europe-wide and world-wide are most useful, >> but if you happen to have a very accurate one for some place else, >> I can use that too. > > When Stef and I wrote our proposal for _Python for Dummies_, we used > this as our source for about 700K Python programmers: > > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2004-December/050412.html > > Given recent growth trends, I think one million users is a reasonable > number. I can't find any more-recent authoritative figures with a quick > Google. My general sense of the growth is that if my original guestimate in the referenced link was correct then it's probably around 1M now. Of course multiplying a guess times another guess doesn't tend to be too reliable. ;-) Still, I'd give it pretty good odds of being somewhere between 700K and 1.4M, with very many of the users utterly silent and uncountable. It's really only hobbyists, sole proprietors and some startups that tend to actually show up in the Python community in some way. And relatively few of those, percentage-wise. BTW, it's dangerous to assume selling something Python-related means you have a global market size of 1M. You can't reach them easily, they are hugely diverse, and many of them don't have any money. It's a decent market for some things, but I wouldn't expect to sell anywhere near 1M books or IDE licenses for that matter. ;-) - Stephan From carl at personnelware.com Mon Jan 28 16:39:40 2008 From: carl at personnelware.com (Carl Karsten) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:39:40 -0600 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? In-Reply-To: <479DF35C.7000708@wingware.com> References: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> <20080127001438.GB26735@panix.com> <479DF35C.7000708@wingware.com> Message-ID: <479DF73C.2070001@personnelware.com> Stephan Deibel wrote: > Aahz wrote: >> On Sun, Jan 27, 2008, Laura Creighton wrote: >>> I need a figure for a report. Anybody got anything that is recent >>> and quotable? Python users europe-wide and world-wide are most useful, >>> but if you happen to have a very accurate one for some place else, >>> I can use that too. >> When Stef and I wrote our proposal for _Python for Dummies_, we used >> this as our source for about 700K Python programmers: >> >> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2004-December/050412.html >> >> Given recent growth trends, I think one million users is a reasonable >> number. I can't find any more-recent authoritative figures with a quick >> Google. > > My general sense of the growth is that if my original guestimate in the > referenced link was correct then it's probably around 1M now. Of course > multiplying a guess times another guess doesn't tend to be too reliable. ;-) > > Still, I'd give it pretty good odds of being somewhere between 700K and > 1.4M, with very many of the users utterly silent and uncountable. It's > really only hobbyists, sole proprietors and some startups that tend to > actually show up in the Python community in some way. And relatively > few of those, percentage-wise. > > BTW, it's dangerous to assume selling something Python-related means > you have a global market size of 1M. You can't reach them easily, > they are hugely diverse, and many of them don't have any money. It's > a decent market for some things, but I wouldn't expect to sell anywhere > near 1M books or IDE licenses for that matter. ;-) That's why we need to know both the total that have ever typed at a >>> prompt, and the number of uncountables. Lets Make Some Charts, and you can see the the % of the total that you have a chance to contact. then with some math in your head, you can figure out estimated head count. Which is more impressive than just counting up the countables :) Carl K From aahz at pythoncraft.com Mon Jan 28 16:52:57 2008 From: aahz at pythoncraft.com (Aahz) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:52:57 -0800 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? In-Reply-To: <479DF35C.7000708@wingware.com> References: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> <20080127001438.GB26735@panix.com> <479DF35C.7000708@wingware.com> Message-ID: <20080128155257.GA29958@panix.com> On Mon, Jan 28, 2008, Stephan Deibel wrote: > > BTW, it's dangerous to assume selling something Python-related means > you have a global market size of 1M. You can't reach them easily, > they are hugely diverse, and many of them don't have any money. It's > a decent market for some things, but I wouldn't expect to sell anywhere > near 1M books or IDE licenses for that matter. ;-) I'm pretty sure Laura wants this for something related to PyPy getting more EU grant money, which is why I skipped this disclaimer. If I'm wrong, I'm especially curious about why Laura wanted it. ;-) -- Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/ "All problems in computer science can be solved by another level of indirection." --Butler Lampson From lac at openend.se Mon Jan 28 17:51:10 2008 From: lac at openend.se (Laura Creighton) Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 17:51:10 +0100 Subject: [python-advocacy] how many python users are there? In-Reply-To: Message from Aahz of "Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:52:57 PST." <20080128155257.GA29958@panix.com> References: <200801270006.m0R068oB015943@theraft.openend.se> <20080127001438.GB26735@panix.com> <479DF35C.7000708@wingware.com> <20080128155257.GA29958@panix.com> Message-ID: <200801281651.m0SGpA0F014406@theraft.openend.se> In a message of Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:52:57 PST, Aahz writes: >On Mon, Jan 28, 2008, Stephan Deibel wrote: >> >> BTW, it's dangerous to assume selling something Python-related means >> you have a global market size of 1M. You can't reach them easily, >> they are hugely diverse, and many of them don't have any money. It's >> a decent market for some things, but I wouldn't expect to sell anywhere >> near 1M books or IDE licenses for that matter. ;-) > >I'm pretty sure Laura wants this for something related to PyPy getting >more EU grant money, which is why I skipped this disclaimer. If I'm >wrong, I'm especially curious about why Laura wanted it. ;-) >-- >Aahz (aahz at pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft. >com/ Aahz is perfectly correct. Laura